The day the spit hit the fan!...

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1shado1

QUOTE: Originally posted by DrummingTrainfan

Here in Nebraska there is a fight to get light rail between Omaha and Lincoln. The naysayers are saying that there wouldn't be enough riders, but there is a projected "beltway" to go around the city that we supposedly need. If we build the light rail it at least has the chance to recoup costs...the highway can't do that unless they charge tolls or something. Plus, the light rail will put less exhuast in the atmosphere.

There was heated discussion about a light rail system being built here in Milwaukee. We already have city buses (with low ridership) that travel virtually ANYWHERE in the city, and other buses that regularly travel between cities. It makes no sense to build a light rail system with limited access points/routes. A waste of taxpayer money for a system that would be under utilized. And due to operating expenses, the money would NEVER be recouped anyway. You're dreaming if you think it ever would. Name ONE city where light rail has been cost-effective. The difference between the beltway and the light rail system is that the beltway would probably get SIGNIFICANT usage. Light rail would end up being a white elephant. Of course many railfans are unable to be objective. They see choo-choo, and automatically think "oh goody". Wake up and smell the coffee.[:D]

Jeff

Houston also has a light rail system - even though they had more than enough metro buses that were doing the people transport job just fine. The problem was, the upper class that work in down town didn't want to ride common buses with the lower class passengers... Since the line opened a couple of years ago, there have been over 100 vehicle and pedestrian collision incidents, and those that were behind the sytstem being installed admitted that it will take "many, many" years to pay for it, by which time the trains being used now will be outdated and have to be replaced... That's one choo choo line I feel we didn't need.

As for the high speed bullet train issue that started this thread. It would have been really neat to have such a transportation system here, but not if it were going to uproot thousands of people from their homes, farms and ranches in the way that those behind it had planned. Even some of those that were against it said if it were put up on an elivated platform that was out of the way and didn't disrupt their lives that they could deal with it crossing their land a whole lot better. The project has since been killed, so no one has to worry about it anymore. Now they have to worry about the great Texas Highway Project that has the federal government behind it that will run from Texarkana to Mexico. It will have four lanes of traffic on each side, rail lines, oil and gas pipe lines and electrical and communications lines running down it, and those behind it aren't taking no for an answer like they have on other issues. I'm afraid this one is going to be a much harder fight to stop than anything ever before!...

Tracklayer

[davekelly]

One of my favorite bumper stickers: "Coalition for an Idiot-Free America"

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by 1shado1


Are you still looking to support the proposed rail project? I hope so. Are there any other backers to the plan?

QUOTE:
Really? Because you know ALL the facts of the proposed rail line? Or simply because you are a rail fan? Just because it is a choo-choo, and you are a fan, that doesn't automatically mean that the proposed plan is a good idea (or a bad one, for that matter).

People blindly supporting such projects is just as silly as people blindly bashing them.[:D]

Jeff

Well Jeff, I guess I am "blindly" supporting the RR idea. If TrackLayer felt strong enough to support the line, I will take at face value his reasons, and support his effort, until shown otherwise. I guess I should have been more fanatical in my post and USED UPPER CASE TO YELL, all kinds of emoticons etc so I would blindly be as silly. [B)]

Also as I stated in my first post to the topic, I am personally experiencing a "railroading" of a railroad that the city here has been after from day one, the media, the "tree-hugger" crowd, which if you watched the council meetings would think the same, crying and chanting to remove the rails for a trail, you would also get a different slant on how some people are against rail.

[1shado1]

QUOTE: Originally posted by DrummingTrainfan

Here in Nebraska there is a fight to get light rail between Omaha and Lincoln. The naysayers are saying that there wouldn't be enough riders, but there is a projected "beltway" to go around the city that we supposedly need. If we build the light rail it at least has the chance to recoup costs...the highway can't do that unless they charge tolls or something. Plus, the light rail will put less exhuast in the atmosphere.

There was heated discussion about a light rail system being built here in Milwaukee. We already have city buses (with low ridership) that travel virtually ANYWHERE in the city, and other buses that regularly travel between cities. It makes no sense to build a light rail system with limited access points/routes. A waste of taxpayer money for a system that would be under utilized. And due to operating expenses, the money would NEVER be recouped anyway. You're dreaming if you think it ever would. Name ONE city where light rail has been cost-effective. The difference between the beltway and the light rail system is that the beltway would probably get SIGNIFICANT usage. Light rail would end up being a white elephant. Of course many railfans are unable to be objective. They see choo-choo, and automatically think "oh goody". Wake up and smell the coffee.[:D]

Jeff

[1shado1]

[Anonymous]

One of the basics freedoms of this country is the right of free speach.
Sadly, that includes having to put up with the ranting, raving, foaming at the mouth, yelling, completely uninformed, idiots. It would be nice if people could set down and intelligently discuss something with out getting into a yelling match, or becoming violent.
As my mother used to say "You can only hear the the other person if you shut your own mouth ." There's the other one too, " Be silent, and be though a fool. Speak, and be known as fool." Too many now days prove those old saying as true. lol

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by dthurman

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

I'm pro-rail all the way!

That is something...The thing that really gets me is the woman saying that she would include you in her lawsuit. I guess she didn't realize how stupid she sounds there. Just because you build a model of the to use as a representation doesn't mean that you are truely influencing anyone. If anything, you are helping them make a better informed decision because they have something to look at. Unless she got a real good lawyer, or the judge isn't the sharpest lightbulb in the Pop-Tart box, I don't see how it would fly. And because you did it voluntarily backs you up more; you are in no way affiliated with the town.

They are probably complain now. They now have to pay out the butt for gas, when they could have easily commuted on the train. Tisk tisk tisk.

Do you have any pictures of the diorama?

You should have seen the diorama TrainFreak409. It included everything I could think of that I felt people would have questions about. The train itself was on an elivated right of way with openings in it every so often to allow cattle to cross over from pasture to pasture and for farmers to get their tractors and equipment through. There was an overpass going over the tracks for automobiles. I even included a little town with kids playing in a park. The woman that threatened to include me in the law suit said that I made it all look oh so simple as if it would fit right in and be accepted by everyone-except her... She was a real witch. One guy even told me that he thought about taking his foot and kicking the display off its pedistal, but was afraid that he might go to jail for it, which was his only reason for not doing so.

Tracklayer

You sure you weren't at the Dome in New Orleans, sounds like about the same fantical (sp) reaction. Are you still looking to support the proposed rail project? I hope so. Are there any other backers to the plan?

I'm always supportive of new and better ways of doing things, but I really don't want to see anyone lose their homes and/or properties in the process... If they had planned on putting the train up on an elivated system that would have been say 25 feet in the air, and business could have go on as usual, then that might have been okay, but the plan was to cut straight across what ever lay in its path... The whole thing finally came to a dead end, and was scrapped altogether. A while back, there was talk of using existing rail lines to run commuter trains from down town Houston out to the surrounding rural areas to help cut down on the city traffic problem, but I haven't heard anything about it since then.

Tracklayer

Someone wanted to kick your diorama?[:O]

Another women wanted to sue??[:0][:0]

Over a diorama inteded to help the community?????[:0][:0][:0]

Some people[}:)]

I am sorry that had to happen to you TRACKLAYER[:(]

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Darth Santa Fe

Next thing you know people will be running at UP and BNSF trains with torches, pitchforks and other dangerous tools.[:0] All it takes is one person to start a mob.

Defying the good of the community? A passenger train would HELP the community, not go against it. It would give people another way to be transported to where they want to go. That's like starting a McDonald's and being picketed out for some stupid reason about going against the community.[B)]

Brother railroader, you just can't imagine the politics and so forth that goes on around this backwards little area I live in. Most of the people around here are farmers and ranchers, and they intend on keeping it that way as long as they can. When I was a kid and use to come down and stay with my grandmother during the summer, I remember her talking about how all of the local business owners stuck together and wouldn't allow any chain businesses in the area. As time passed and those old goats began dying off, Walmart, McDonald's and other businesses started moving in. To sum it up. A lot of the people around here just don't like change, and would prefer to go on living in the 1960s and 70s if they could. You're right. A rail service would be of great benefit to this area due to the fact that we have "a lot" of people out this way that work in Houston, and like others have said, with gas at $3.00 a gallon, something's going to have to give...

Tracklayer

[jacon12]

When the price of gas in the U.S. hits ... oh... in the neighborhood of $5 per gallon, we may see a big change in the way people view travel by train. The Europeans are way ahead of us in this area and it's getting closer to the time we catch up.
Jarrell

[railroadyoshi]

Scott, I asume that ROW was right-of-way.
Personally, i think the intercity line would be very cool, I used to live in Houston, man was that one tiring drive from Houston to Dallas.

[csmith9474]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474

The ROW would have been about 1/2 mile from my house. I believe the ROW was supposed to be 200 ft wide or something like that. I grew up in a rural area and the agricultural was up in arms about loosing acreage and accessibility to their fields. The railroad museum that I volunteered at did score a HO TGV set from that group. Really cool, but the traction tires dry rotted.

What is the ROW? Was that the proposed train service?

I would love to see the diorama Tracklayer. So you don't have a scanner or anything? Jeesh, get with the 21st century.[:p] I have an All-in-One printer/scanner/copier, $90 from Staples.[8D]

Sorry dude; ROW = Right of Way

[Darth Santa Fe]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

picket the store and see to it that he lost his job for taking up sides with the train organization and defying the good of the community

Next thing you know people will be running at UP and BNSF trains with torches, pitchforks and other dangerous tools.[:0] All it takes is one person to start a mob.

Defying the good of the community? A passenger train would HELP the community, not go against it. It would give people another way to be transported to where they want to go. That's like starting a McDonald's and being picketed out for some stupid reason about going against the community.[B)]

I remember one time a few years ago, a person sued McDonald's because the food that SHE bought for HER daughter made HER daughter fat.[%-)] If she were smarter, she would have bought food from Subway or some place that has healthier food.

[TrainFreak409]

Thanks TrackLayer, I get a better picture with that.

All is well.[:)]

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409



I would love to see the diorama Tracklayer. So you don't have a scanner or anything? Jeesh, get with the 21st century.[:p] I have an All-in-One printer/scanner/copier, $90 from Staples.[8D]

Jee***rainFreak409. You send me the $90.00 and I'll go buy the All-in-One printer/scanner/copier from Staples so you can see the pictures of the diorama... Otherwise, you'll just have to do like we did "back in the old days" and use your imagination.

Tracklayer

Well, as you can see, from SB Locomotives, my imagination is pretty strong. It's not like I don't use it. It's hard to imagine anything when one knows little information on it. I have been imagining what it would look like, although I think it is nothing close to what the real thing would be.

My imagination is quite active thank you. I enjoy using it and being as creative as possible.

I may be over reacting, use an emoticon next time, those are the only emotions we can show on this forum. With your comment, I interpret that as you saying that I have lack of imagination, thus comparing me with the stereotypical teenager, which always rubs me the wrong way.

I really hope you are joking with your comment, as I was with mine.

I've blown off my steam...[V]

Come on brother railroader. Don't ever let anything I say get under your skin. I was just having some fun with you. I hardly ever use the emoticons, but rather try and get my message across with words - though I'm not always successful and tick someone off every now and then...

Since you were insulted by what I said, I feel I owe you a better discription of the diorama. It was N scale, and about 3' X 3' and had a green grass matt covered base. The right of way ran across the back of it from left to right, and there was a typical small Texas town in the front with all of the basic businesses and so forth. The main street of the town went over an overpass that crossed over the right of way. Like I said earlier, there were openings under the right of way to allow cattle and farm equipment through. It had a blue sky back ground with white clouds and glass around it to protect it from little hands. I spent about a week building it at a cost of about $100.00 or more out of my own pocket.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Tracklayer

[TrainFreak409]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409



I would love to see the diorama Tracklayer. So you don't have a scanner or anything? Jeesh, get with the 21st century.[:p] I have an All-in-One printer/scanner/copier, $90 from Staples.[8D]

Jee***rainFreak409. You send me the $90.00 and I'll go buy the All-in-One printer/scanner/copier from Staples so you can see the pictures of the diorama... Otherwise, you'll just have to do like we did "back in the old days" and use your imagination.

Tracklayer

Well, as you can see, from SB Locomotives, my imagination is pretty strong. It's not like I don't use it. It's hard to imagine anything when one knows little information on it. I have been imagining what it would look like, although I think it is nothing close to what the real thing would be.

My imagination is quite active thank you. I enjoy using it and being as creative as possible.

I may be over reacting, use an emoticon next time, those are the only emotions we can show on this forum. With your comment, I interpret that as you saying that I have lack of imagination, thus comparing me with the stereotypical teenager, which always rubs me the wrong way.

I really hope you are joking with your comment, as I was with mine.

I've blown off my steam...[V]

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409



I would love to see the diorama Tracklayer. So you don't have a scanner or anything? Jeesh, get with the 21st century.[:p] I have an All-in-One printer/scanner/copier, $90 from Staples.[8D]

Jee***rainFreak409. You send me the $90.00 and I'll go buy the All-in-One printer/scanner/copier from Staples so you can see the pictures of the diorama... Otherwise, you'll just have to do like we did "back in the old days" and use your imagination.

Tracklayer

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dthurman

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

I'm pro-rail all the way!

That is something...The thing that really gets me is the woman saying that she would include you in her lawsuit. I guess she didn't realize how stupid she sounds there. Just because you build a model of the to use as a representation doesn't mean that you are truely influencing anyone. If anything, you are helping them make a better informed decision because they have something to look at. Unless she got a real good lawyer, or the judge isn't the sharpest lightbulb in the Pop-Tart box, I don't see how it would fly. And because you did it voluntarily backs you up more; you are in no way affiliated with the town.

They are probably complain now. They now have to pay out the butt for gas, when they could have easily commuted on the train. Tisk tisk tisk.

Do you have any pictures of the diorama?

You should have seen the diorama TrainFreak409. It included everything I could think of that I felt people would have questions about. The train itself was on an elivated right of way with openings in it every so often to allow cattle to cross over from pasture to pasture and for farmers to get their tractors and equipment through. There was an overpass going over the tracks for automobiles. I even included a little town with kids playing in a park. The woman that threatened to include me in the law suit said that I made it all look oh so simple as if it would fit right in and be accepted by everyone-except her... She was a real witch. One guy even told me that he thought about taking his foot and kicking the display off its pedistal, but was afraid that he might go to jail for it, which was his only reason for not doing so.

Tracklayer

You sure you weren't at the Dome in New Orleans, sounds like about the same fantical (sp) reaction. Are you still looking to support the proposed rail project? I hope so. Are there any other backers to the plan?

I'm always supportive of new and better ways of doing things, but I really don't want to see anyone lose their homes and/or properties in the process... If they had planned on putting the train up on an elivated system that would have been say 25 feet in the air, and business could have go on as usual, then that might have been okay, but the plan was to cut straight across what ever lay in its path... The whole thing finally came to a dead end, and was scrapped altogether. A while back, there was talk of using existing rail lines to run commuter trains from down town Houston out to the surrounding rural areas to help cut down on the city traffic problem, but I haven't heard anything about it since then.

Tracklayer

[DrummingTrainfan]

Here in Nebraska there is a fight to get light rail between Omaha and Lincoln. The naysayers are saying that there wouldn't be enough riders, but there is a projected "beltway" to go around the city that we supposedly need. If we build the light rail it at least has the chance to recoup costs...the highway can't do that unless they charge tolls or something. Plus, the light rail will put less exhuast in the atmosphere.

[DavidGSmith]

Its funny,here I thought that both our countries were based on freedom of speech and the right of a person to a point of view. Texans in particular. Guess its ok as long as its the same as theirs. We have the uninformed lunatic groups here in Canada to.

[TrainFreak409]

QUOTE: Originally posted by csmith9474

The ROW would have been about 1/2 mile from my house. I believe the ROW was supposed to be 200 ft wide or something like that. I grew up in a rural area and the agricultural was up in arms about loosing acreage and accessibility to their fields. The railroad museum that I volunteered at did score a HO TGV set from that group. Really cool, but the traction tires dry rotted.

What is the ROW? Was that the proposed train service?

I would love to see the diorama Tracklayer. So you don't have a scanner or anything? Jeesh, get with the 21st century.[:p] I have an All-in-One printer/scanner/copier, $90 from Staples.[8D]

[AntonioFP45]

Tracklayer,

Don't let that incident get you down. Since it looks like gasoline prices are going to stay near or above the $3 per gallon mark in the U.S, it's very likely that attitudes will be changing towards high speed rail, especially with the younger "20 something" generation moving up in economic influence.

Part of the reaction you witnessed likely tied in with the enormous amount of anger generated from the recent Supreme Court decision earlier this year in which the liberal judges actually voted to make it much easier for local governments to seize land for public use. Eminent Domain. The case in question was in Connecticut, I think. If you watched the news months back, people around the country (including me) were outraged. So now here comes this bullet train issue again in your community, people still have this case fresh in their minds!

Give it time. There's even more support for Amtrak from the general public than before. I think we will see at least one true bullet train system in the U.S before 2015.

[csmith9474]

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainboyH16-44

Wow, some people are really anti train![:O] I never knew that some people could be so violent towards someting as nice as a well modeled diorama.
Some people are just crazy, eh?
trainboy

I think this attitude was more prevelant in the ag community more than anywhere else. There was a lot of concern in regards to urban sprawl. There were even plans to build an international airport on the site where the New Braunfels Municipal Airport is pending the construction of the line. That really stirred up a stink in the area. Just think, having TGV that close to your house, and the greens and farmers blew it.

[trainboyH16-44]

Wow, some people are really anti train![:O] I never knew that some people could be so violent towards someting as nice as a well modeled diorama.
Some people are just crazy, eh?
trainboy

[Anonymous]

Luckily we live on a rail line which has service to either Chicago or Toronto once a day. That should help my buddy who is house bound at $80. a tankful for his pickup. He probably would have supported the train then as much as he would be likely to now ( *** liberal!). Well let us hope that those providing the "blessings" then are now as focused on the oil companies and those vicious people who "made" them buy thuse SUVs. May their blessings come home to roost!
Will ... just another one of those *** unAmerican liberals!

[csmith9474]

Intercity rail travel in Texas is down, but not out. There is a new highway project that will connect Austin to Seguin with an I-10 interchange. Between the lanes will be a right of way for future rail service. From what I understand, all new highway construction will be like this. Hopefully somebody will do something with it. And BTW, don't cast stones Stuckarm.

[steveblackledge]

TRACKLAYER,,, those folks would still have us writing on slate with a rock if they could get there way, we have them over here, i think i work with most of them

[Anonymous]

Just another reason not to go to texas.

[csmith9474]

The ROW would have been about 1/2 mile from my house. I believe the ROW was supposed to be 200 ft wide or something like that. I grew up in a rural area and the agricultural was up in arms about loosing acreage and accessibility to their fields. The railroad museum that I volunteered at did score a HO TGV set from that group. Really cool, but the traction tires dry rotted.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Tracklayer

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

I'm pro-rail all the way!

That is something...The thing that really gets me is the woman saying that she would include you in her lawsuit. I guess she didn't realize how stupid she sounds there. Just because you build a model of the to use as a representation doesn't mean that you are truely influencing anyone. If anything, you are helping them make a better informed decision because they have something to look at. Unless she got a real good lawyer, or the judge isn't the sharpest lightbulb in the Pop-Tart box, I don't see how it would fly. And because you did it voluntarily backs you up more; you are in no way affiliated with the town.

They are probably complain now. They now have to pay out the butt for gas, when they could have easily commuted on the train. Tisk tisk tisk.

Do you have any pictures of the diorama?

You should have seen the diorama TrainFreak409. It included everything I could think of that I felt people would have questions about. The train itself was on an elivated right of way with openings in it every so often to allow cattle to cross over from pasture to pasture and for farmers to get their tractors and equipment through. There was an overpass going over the tracks for automobiles. I even included a little town with kids playing in a park. The woman that threatened to include me in the law suit said that I made it all look oh so simple as if it would fit right in and be accepted by everyone-except her... She was a real witch. One guy even told me that he thought about taking his foot and kicking the display off its pedistal, but was afraid that he might go to jail for it, which was his only reason for not doing so.

Tracklayer

You sure you weren't at the Dome in New Orleans, sounds like about the same fantical (sp) reaction. Are you still looking to support the proposed rail project? I hope so. Are there any other backers to the plan?

[Tracklayer]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TrainFreak409

I'm pro-rail all the way!

That is something...The thing that really gets me is the woman saying that she would include you in her lawsuit. I guess she didn't realize how stupid she sounds there. Just because you build a model of the to use as a representation doesn't mean that you are truely influencing anyone. If anything, you are helping them make a better informed decision because they have something to look at. Unless she got a real good lawyer, or the judge isn't the sharpest lightbulb in the Pop-Tart box, I don't see how it would fly. And because you did it voluntarily backs you up more; you are in no way affiliated with the town.

They are probably complain now. They now have to pay out the butt for gas, when they could have easily commuted on the train. Tisk tisk tisk.

Do you have any pictures of the diorama?

You should have seen the diorama TrainFreak409. It included everything I could think of that I felt people would have questions about. The train itself was on an elivated right of way with openings in it every so often to allow cattle to cross over from pasture to pasture and for farmers to get their tractors and equipment through. There was an overpass going over the tracks for automobiles. I even included a little town with kids playing in a park. The woman that threatened to include me in the law suit said that I made it all look oh so simple as if it would fit right in and be accepted by everyone-except her... She was a real witch. One guy even told me that he thought about taking his foot and kicking the display off its pedistal, but was afraid that he might go to jail for it, which was his only reason for not doing so.

And yes. I have several good pictures of the model, and also copies of the news paper articles. The only problem is I have no way to post them here on the forum... [V]

Tracklayer