What's with model railroaders....are most of them "loners"?

[ClinchValleySD40]

I guess I'm just really lucky. I'm in a round robin group with about 20 layouts. Ops somewhere almost every Thursday night. Of course, you're not expected (and we don't have room) for everyone to participate every week. You just pick the weeks you'd like to attend and contact the layout owner. Works great.

I feel sorry for lone wolves. Sharing the hobby is by far the best part. Building a layout is great, but if you want to see it come alive, have some people over to operate. And it does NOT take a major time commitment. One night a month for a couple of hours (or a weekend afternoon). Best way to get started and meet people, join the NMRA, the OpSig and the local Division. You'll be shocked at how many model railroaders there are in your area.

And don't worry about what others think of your layout. As long as it runs well, they'll enjoy it. And if someone is critical, kick them out.

If anyone is ever in SE Michigan, let me know. Plenty of layouts to operate.

[cmrproducts]

It all comes down to what is important in life.

Model Railroading
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. . Any thing else!

As you get older and find yourself looking at retirement, you also find yourself looking back at what you have done in the past. I wanted to spend time with my 2 sons, something my dad did not do when I was young.

Luckily both my boys were interested in trains. We went everywhere Railfanning, Shows, joined a club and built a home layout.

I didn’t go fishing, boating, sports and all that other junk. I also did not live at work either! Work is not my life! My family is!

Now that I am getting ready to retire and the medical conditions are starting to show up I think back and am glad I did what I did. No I did not make lots of money but I had a good time with my family and that is what counts. I also met a lot of friend through my modeling and going to shows.

Now that I have a large home layout I get to invite modelers from all over (some as far as 80 to 100 miles away). When I go to the shows lots of people know me. And I get to meet more modelers. It is great! And I get invited to go operate other layouts and I have them in to operate mine.

But the big thing is the modelers from the small town do not have a problem traveling 2 hours plus to go play trains! But the modelers that live in the big cities (Pittsburgh) seem to have a problem moving outside the city limits (but its OK for us to go down there!).

It’s all in what you want to do. If work is more important then don’t waste your time complaining just go to work. Some day you will be ready to retire and I hope that you are able to enjoy it (most never do as they drop over the day after they retire or have a medical condition that stops them). I may have not done a lot of things I should have but I don’t think that I will ever say that I wished that I had spent less time with my kids!

BOB H – Clarion, PA

[Anonymous]

Mondo,

I have to agree with Texas Zephyr. Check out the NMRA. Go to the layout tours and meet other trainnuts. Find out who the operators in your area are......See if you can wangle some invites.

I was a lone wolf for years, but made a concerted effort a few years ago to become more involved in the modeling community. I was lucky to find a great bunch of guys, but I think it could be done anywhere. It did take some work, and was not always smooth sailing, but it was worth it.

I think that with the exception of clubs, most guys work on their layouts alone or maybe with one close friend. I find hanging out with other train guy when we are not at operating/work sessions, we are almost always shooting the breeze-BSing about stuff.

In my experience, I have noticed a few things about Model Railroaders and the social aspect of the hobby:

1. Everyone likes to talk about their layout. It may seem as if guys are only interested their own layouts...True enough. But pay attention closely to how much you talk about your own layout and you will probably find yourself drifting in the same direction. My rule is to be a rapt listener when visiting another’s layout. When visiting layouts, I try to talk about my own layout when asked and only when it is relevant to the conversation. I try not dominate the discussion with stuff about my railroad. If the whole night is about the host layout, so be it.

2. I try to find activities I can share with someone else help break the ice. Meets, layout tours, operating sessions, visits to the train stores etc. I try to have meals be part of the deal. Meet for lunch and go see the progress on the layout...this type of stuff. I always serve food at my place if appropriate. Train guys love to eat.

3. I leave politics, religion and philosophy out of the discussion. It is too easy to for people to be offended and take stuff personally. I have let stuff roll off of my back lots of times rather than start a heated argument when we are supposed to be enjoying ourselves…Some guys can’t do this. I avoid these types.

4. I have found that if I take it slow, but am persistent, it yields better results. It may take many months or years to cultivate a group of train friends. I find people in the hobby have known each other for many decades. It is hard to compete with that type of long term relationship. I find that I often won’t see modeling friends for weeks, some not for months. This is OK. I was part of group that met once a week, and that was too much of a time commitment for me and my family to deal with, so I now attend infrequently. We still have a great time.

5. As another poster pointed out, there are lots of different types of modelers in the hobby. I find that I have take them for what they are. Some guys never run, some guys lecture you all the time (I avoid these guys), some guys run and have no scenery, some guys are prototype nuts, some guys just build cars, collectors etc. I can have a good time with all of them as long as I can adapt to the situation and not expect these people to be something they aren’t.

6. I find that other guys don’t care too much about your opinion in modeling related matters until they get to know you. I won’t offer unsolicited opinions on layouts and modeling. I find that once people get to know me and have seen my stuff, they eventually began to ask my opinion about stuff.

7. I try to not be too serious and over the top. I am over the top by nature so I really have to work on this to keep it in check. A sense of humor appears to be appreciated.

Not sure if this helps. I have run across all of the types you described meeting in your post. Keep looking around and you will run into guys that you want to hangout and run trains with.

[Anonymous]

I'ts not just model railroaders. I am a musician and play in 2/3 different bands. The reason I put 2/3 is because one of them is almost non-exsistant. It's because no one has the time to get together and play music. Families, work - the modern world eats time like a hungry man at a buffet. After the normal time issues then comes peoples lack of commitment to help other people realize their goals. People have their different ideas about almost everything. Don't worry someday you will meet someone that will help with your railroad. Heck, if I lived in your area I would love to help. But I live in Vancouver, Canada.

[jacon12]

I used to think that I like doing things alone because I grew up as an only child and I had to entertain myself if there was to be any entertainment. So, I got used to it. I'm not saying it was the better or the worse way, it was just THE only way for me.
At one point in my life I was very deep into photography, even to the point of becoming the president of the local camera club. This club had about 50 people on it's rolls, there would be about 15 come to each meeting. Of that 15 about 4 or 5 carried the load of doing everything in the club. I learned then that a lot of people join clubs just for the social part of it, to be entertained so to speak. They did not want to commit to anything. I've noticed from the 2 or 3 MRRing club meetings I've been to that taking up time with new people is not high on the list. Oh, they're polite... not rude, but it's just not the same atmosphere that you have when two really good friends get together to work on layouts, or anything else for that matter.
As for me, I spent over 40 years being to commited to this or that. The job, some club or other. Now, I find that I'm very reluctant to commit.
Maybe it's an age thing?
Oh! The over enthusiastic part... yes.. that does make a lot of people uncomfortable. It gets a bit intense after awhile.
Thank God for this forum.
Jarrell

[Anonymous]

I fall into IronRoosters builder/scale train operator categories. I am NOT an operator. I tried the local RR club scene for two years and found out, as others have pointed out, that I wasn't interested in playing politics or running many many laps on glorified ovals. I strongly support the view point that this is a hobby and an escape. The "sharing" part for me has come about because my pre-teen has acquired the internet service and one "selling point" was I would be able to "talk" to other RR Modelers even at the weird hours I have to keep. From all the Operations oriented articles in MR I thought there were a lot more operators out there. Keep Looking there must be some near you! Cheers!

[Pruitt]

I'll be surprised if I'm not in the same boat when my layout gets far enough along to have operating sessions.

I have one friend who comes over and helps out occasionally, but I don't know if he is into operations or not - his layout is not really set up for any sort of operation other than running trains, so I guess I'll see.

But when completed, the layout will take ten or twelve people to operate a full schedule, I estimate, and I'm just hoping I can find them a few at a time as the operational trackage allows for more and more complete sessions.

I guess I'll see how hard it is to find operators.....

[Anonymous]

i wish i could help the clubs in my town meet on wedensday night but i work so i cant go.
i have a friend that is into model trains and helps when ever he can we even buy the same road name the D&H.
but his is a over the road truck driver so his time home is little and when he is home he trys to split his time with his famely and helping me

[ole1]

I belong to a club with about 25 members of which about 10 are are fairly active. After reading the previous replys I've come to the conclusion that our club is a confederation of loners. Of the active members we have a wide range of interests within the group which probably explains why we have an HO, Three Rail, S(American Flyer), a U-Run-It Marx (for the kids) and sometimes N layouts at the club. Besides the variety of scales we have just as diverse a number of areas of interest from scratch builders, to collectors to electronic / high tech guys to a repair and restore guy, a historian,a NMRA region officer, a live steam/prototype guy and even one guy who wants to restore the old depot in town. With all this diversity its hard to imagine we ever get anything done but I guess it must be the common interest in the railroad and trains that makes it all work, that and the fact that there is a willingness to help even if its not ones main area of interest ( last weekend about eight of the guys were helping scrape paint at the old depot to get it ready for painting.) Cooperation isn't always easy but you never get a castle built if you fight in the sandbox. Ole

[Seamonster]

I'm a Lone Wolf too. I guess I don't play well with others. I do things on my layout my way and that makes me happy. Maybe I'm afraid of hearing critism on my way of doing things and "suggestions" on how to make it "better." Some of my non-RR friends have enjoyed looking at my layout and have even given me suggestions from time to time. My 12 y.o. granddaughter enjoys working on the layout with me, building scenery, laying track, building structures, but doesn't want to have anything to do with the electrical work. I can share my layout with her and that makes me happy. As someone mentioned in a previous posting, this forum is a great way to get together with others without commitment, and I've found the folks here a lot more friendly and helpful than those at the few model RR club meetings--or the club meetings of another hobby I'm involved in--which is why I don't join clubs.

[bikerraypa]

QUOTE: Originally posted by trainluver1

I'm a loner, and prefer it that way. People get in my way and distract me, so I'd rather not have anyone around me when I'm working on my layout or otherwise. I've always been that way since I was a little kid.

trainluver1

Sort of the same here. I've always had a loner streak (social ineptitude??), and I think that is why I gravitated towards model railroading, R/C planes, motorcycle touring, etc....they are all activities that, while OK with a group or club, are quite enjoyable by one lone operator.


Ray out

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Paul3

vsmith wrote:

QUOTE: Come on now, how many Conservitive Christian model RRers do you know who hang out with Socially Liberal model RRers or hard-core Repub's RRers with hard-core Democrat RRers? (Yes, they are ALL out there) This conflict ALWAYS arises in groups like clubs, its unavoidable, so I keep away to avoid the conflict.

I feel bad for you. At my club, we probably have all the above, but 99% of the time, we all check that nonsense at the door and enjoy our hobby together. Sure, there are some times when folks let their personal opinions about politics and even religion color their speech, but it's rare. We all just try to let it all roll off our back and get on with our lives. This may have something to do with the longevity of our club (67 years and counting).

Personally, I have a simple rule that I try to follow which I usually do: never talk religion or politics with family or friends (which also includes club members). I'm not going to change their minds, and they're not going to change mine, so what's the point?

Paul A. Cutler III
*****************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*****************

Paul, I wasn't the group one who brought it up, this goes back quite a while ago when i was interested in a group of HOn3 modelers, who initially were friendly if a little crusty, but when it was found out that I didnt share "thier" political views or share share a similar viewpoint about "thier" religion, I was not welcome anymore. It really pissed me off that I was being judged and excluded on things outside of the hobby but over the years I've come to almost expect it no matter where I go. I kept running into the attitude like if you arent of a certain persuasion your not allowed to be a model RRer, at least not to them, I've gotten this attitude at some (not all) hobby shops and at swap meets. I think it was a primary reason for my switch from HOn30 to indoor Large Scale, the people are far less judgemental in LS than in smaller scales. So now I' m Livin' Large and loving it. [8D]

[Leon Silverman]

Having friends over to build or operate a layout should be be more pleasurable than doing it alone. Right now my layout construction is at a standstill because I need help installing the the firecheck drywall on the ceiling and have not been able to to arrange a mutually convenient time for either of my two brawny son-in-laws to come over, even with the lure of a home cooked meal (by my wife, not me). I had contemplated constructing a complicated layout in that space but realized that I would have to maintain and operate it myself. As a result, I settled on a simpler plan to construct that would be impressive to visitors, but not require their help.

[Fergmiester]

I really liked what Bob just said as he made some very good points. Personally I am for the most part a Lone Wolf. Why? because that's just me. I've been part of one or two clubs and all it takes is someone to put foot in mouth and say something really offensive and I'm outta there, funny thing is that I can be a very tolerant person, most of the time, mostly.

I putter around the layout and do some really deep thinking sometimes and that's something you really can't do in a group setting. This MR thing is my way of finding solace. I get most of my enjoyment from creating, learning and overcoming.

The other thing is I'm a busy person who lives on a ship half my life. Living with groups of people for more than eight hours a day can be taxing and I just need a break.

Fergie

[Anonymous]

A friend of mine has a basement filling layout that a bunch of us get to operate every third Wednesday. Some of the crew have their own home layouts, some like me do their modeling on modules, while others are perpetual armchair modelers.

I don't have a great interest like others in operating. If I run one through train an evening, it's enough for me. I'm there mostly for the socializing, talking about the latest toys, news, gossip, etc. There are up to 15-20 people at these sessions, so there are always some around waiting for their train time. When I'm not operating or yammering, I try to take some hand held digital photos without getting in the way of others.

To a few of the guys, like the owner, operating is their main passion in the hobby. They look at each train as a chore or puzzle they want to solve. I'm a model builder and photographer, and that's where I have my quality time.

Our modular club's meetings are pretty all business, so we don't get to do much other socializing otherwise. Some club members never come to these operating sessions, as they have no interest whatsoever. They mostly collect all the latest trains without having any way to operate them.

So just in our group we have operators, non operators, and the rest. If you build a decent layout and have a reasonable expectation of operators, the word will get around.

I know another modeler with a large layout, and he lives about a five hour drive from me. A few of the locals were going to go for a visit, and I was going to tag along. I mostly wanted to snap some digital photos of the layouts and see what they had been doing.

Prior to our visit, we were given the rules for visiting operators - NO photos during the session, NO talking during session as it slows things down, NO break until the session was over - about four hours.

They took their hobby of operating model trains way too seriously for me, the sessions sounded more like a work assignment rather than a hobby activity. I quickly lost interest and did not bother going. These guys were so immersed in the "job" of handling model trains that it turned me off. Life is too short to have to play under such restrictive rules for me.

Bob Boudreau

[ErnieC]

What is more interesting is the fact that the hobby press hasn't picked up on the number of "loners" and keeps publishing articles on what amount to "private clubs".
The basic advice to layout buiders should be, " Don't build something you can't operate by yourself if necessary". (Cheers for small layouts). A modeler in town here had a nice layout and couldn't find a stable operating crew. Everyone he contacted (me included) felt that If we use our spare time to operate on another's layout when are we going to build our own? There is also the aspect of building your own dream, it's not that you don't want to share it, it just isn't like anyone else's. (Cheers for short line steam).
Of course some of the reactions you describe are just plain discourteous. We should be able to appreciate and praise each other's work. This is a hobby, not a contest!
Perhaps you can find a friend that you can help who will also help you, this approach works for me. My friend models the contemporary scene in a prototype manner and operates like a railfan just to watch 'em roll. I do the steam era short line thing with single car operation. But we get along fine not expecting to share our vision just our enjoyment of working together.
Best of luck!
Ernie C

[Paul3]

vsmith wrote:

QUOTE: Come on now, how many Conservitive Christian model RRers do you know who hang out with Socially Liberal model RRers or hard-core Repub's RRers with hard-core Democrat RRers? (Yes, they are ALL out there) This conflict ALWAYS arises in groups like clubs, its unavoidable, so I keep away to avoid the conflict.

I feel bad for you. At my club, we probably have all the above, but 99% of the time, we all check that nonsense at the door and enjoy our hobby together. Sure, there are some times when folks let their personal opinions about politics and even religion color their speech, but it's rare. We all just try to let it all roll off our back and get on with our lives. This may have something to do with the longevity of our club (67 years and counting).

Personally, I have a simple rule that I try to follow which I usually do: never talk religion or politics with family or friends (which also includes club members). I'm not going to change their minds, and they're not going to change mine, so what's the point?

Paul A. Cutler III
*****************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*****************

[Anonymous]

I would love to find a club or some peoples to start one in the Philadelphia, Pa. area. please email me

[steveblackledge]

Hey Mondo, i would love to operate your layout but i am over the pond so commuting is an issue, i tend to work on my own as a way of relaxing away from the wife and kids's for an hour or so

[MAbruce]

I’ve found that people in our hobby tend to be introverted. So what happens when you fill a room full of introverts to operate a layout, participate in a club, or even build a layout?

I’ll leave it to your imaginations, because introverts tend to be very creative.

[Eriediamond]

Hey, Mondo. After reading through the replies here, I can only answer that I'm basicly a loner and probabley fit a number of the the titles given modelers above. However, I do belong to a club and enjoy the company of the other members, but because of my work, I don't make many of the meetings. I'm an over the road trucker and when I do get home I may have only one day and I'd rather spend what time I do have with my family. Something to think about that nobody has mentioned yet is that as much as I like other modelers work and talents I would feel uncomfortable running another persons trains. It may sound silly but I think it's respect for anothers work. Another thing that may enter into it is that maybe some have never operated with others and are a little afraid of not measurung up to someone elses standards, so to speak. An operating session sounds technical and complicated where as helping to run a layout sounds more interesting, to me anyway. If someone wants to run their layout like a real railroad, thats fine, but I think the major portion of us modelers just love trains and love to see them run. By the way, how did your infra-red train dectors work out for you? Ken

[vsmith]

Lone Wolf

...but not for alot of the reasons listed here...some reasons like lack of time or ability to commit to a club are true for me, but my primary reason for being vary wary of socializing with other model railroaders has always been the more personal side of things..you see I kinda got burned, real bad, when my "politics" and my "religious outlook" didnt mesh with the majority. I am now very wary because I know its only a matter of time before these become issues.

Come on now, how many Conservitive Christian model RRers do you know who hang out with Socially Liberal model RRers or hard-core Repub's RRers with hard-core Democrat RRers? (Yes, they are ALL out there) This conflict ALWAYS arises in groups like clubs, its unavoidable, so I keep away to avoid the conflict. I like going to swap meets, shows, etc. but when it comes to my hobby, my layout, and my models I do tend to keep to myself and not get too familiar with anyone until i get to know there "other side" a little better.

I do prefer the webs abitilty to "nuetralize" oneself from alot of these issues, I can post questions, photos, ideas, without having to worry about these issues getting "in the way" and if they become an issue on a topic, I'm not confronted with the need to defend or attack anyone or myself, i can just click on to the next topic if I chose to.

[West Coast S]

I like being different, just ask my frustrated LHS owner who has been unable to persuade me to return to HO. I chose my scale to appeal to my craftsman side. There is a local S scale group, never met them or known them to have a show in the traditional form, they meet on a round robin schedule that often conflicts with my real life schedule, plus there are several variations to S scale each, with a fierce loyality following.

I've never had a postive experince in a club setting, too much "my modeling and prototype is better then yours". If I want politics, I can go to the office and get paid to partake in it.

I'm not anti-social or a loner , I hold no prejudices regarding scale, era, prototype or ones skill level. I think each of us has something that is of interest to fellow hobbyist. This forum is as vital to me as the S guage groups. [soapbox]

[Anonymous]

It's interesting you brought this up.

I enjoy trains wherever they may roam. At the trainshow, hobby shop, prototype or home layouts.

I spent some time helping to build a layout at the LHS when I could get away on early saturday mornings. The group we had meet were about 5-9 people at the most. There was more but life issues keeps them from showing up more than several times a year.

Everyone kind of sorted themselves into a order. I will not call it pecking but there were areas that was a good coverage. For example

One person enjoyed figures and assembling scenes that reflect life.

Another likes to tinker with the track and trains, nothing made today is perfect enough to run "right"

A third builds from peices of wood buildings and such and is a trove of tips and tricks on structures.

There are one or two that constantly ask questions prefaced with either "WOW!" or "How did you do that!?" we all answered every question cheerfully.

There are the strong silent types as well as the cheerful ones with piles of stories and everything in between.

What a crew.

We took a hour one time talking about trees in bulk for a hill and trying to get everyone on the right track. The next hour was assembling as a group assembly line fashion to actually make the trees. I think it was a few minutes work to have armfuls of trees.

I have not gone to these "seminars" because of life issues that require my time lately but can tell you that they still assemble as a group from time to time.

Me? I guess I get the "Big engine" out hook it up to a worthy train and get it over the railroad and every one needs to stand back because Im passing thru. I dont worry too much about the people themselves. If they cannot run trains and "Share" with others then I think there might be something that makes it difficult to do so.

I was taught to run trains in a time where people actually got together in the neighborhood several times a week as kids just to run trains and enjoy them. The one thing that I found bothersome is the few persons who may have a "lofty" view of life above the masses on top of a Brass handmade one-of-500 made 5,000 dollar engine.

They need to get down from up there and show us what that engine is made of.

That is all I need to say about that.

[Anonymous]

I am a loner I really don't have any need to be with other modelers.
I have a friend who is a MRR but we really dont do anything together.
We will chat about stuff and he is an electrical engineer so he can answer some DCC questions for me. He doesnt attack my railroad and I dont attck his.
I do have a fellow employee who loves BNSF and goes on about UP like its the evil empire. I usually tune him out. I am not interested in today's operation other than their heritage fleet and steam engines. Oh then you got the people who think you like Thomas give me a break with Thomas already.
I go out to my train room to get away from all of this. I am also a loner railfan
I refuse to be lumped in with the nuts who tie themselves to a car going 70 mph while they hold a video camera. I stay out of the way when the crew is refueling lubing or other maintenance is being done. I dont know how many times I have seen morons creating a problem cause they want that perfect shot.
I like my space
and I respect that of others

[tatans]

Probably the reason for my interest in MRR was to prevent the onset of boredom, I soon realised that NO one I knew had any interest in trains (or,really, no interest in anything) so I knew if I was to keep from chewing furniture I had better get something to do, and it seems, by myself. This forum is a godsend to communicate with other people and get slick answers to my mundane questions. Model Railroading is only a part of me keeping busy in order to retain the small bit of sanity I have left, I love nattering to other people about anything except their grandchildren and money and politics and religion and--and-- So I sort of keep busy by myself, but if it entails socializing with others, that's a nifty benefit. Maybe downsizing your layout to a one-man operation is the answer or revising your layout to meet YOUR needs. If you need any more encouragement, just go to a seniors complex and watch all those guys staring out the window all day long just waiting for someone to talk to, remember, they were just too busy for all that toy train foolishness. "Loners" may not be the exact term, maybe "individualist'' or such, but I do know some wonderful "Lone Wolves" --- Keep on trainin'

[mondotrains]

Well,
I've sure appreciated all the input I've received on my posting.

I especially like all the suggestions as to how to network with other modelers and I guess being retired, I've forgotten how busy people can get and how limited their time can be.

I really have to think about what Bob Boudreau said above.....that maybe I need to look in the mirror and think about whether my approach is turning people off. I am a very enthusiastic person; in fact, one of my buddies claims that I'm too intense. Maybe when I get a guy over here, I am too overbearing and my enthusiasm blows people away. Well, that's me and it's difficult to change at 57 years old.

Having heard some of the responses above from people who do enjoy trains alone and not in a group is real helpful. Maybe I've known all along that I'm a loner and also don't want criticism and "help" from others because it can be so intimidating. So just maybe, I think I need others to share the hobby with but deep down inside, I know it won't work.

I'll have to really think about what I want. As they often say..."be careful what you wish for". Maybe I'll just continue enjoying building my kits, tunigng up freight cars, adding scenery and watching the trains run and not worry about operating with a group of guys.

Thanks again guys for all the input.
Happy railroading.
Mondo

[Anonymous]

Late afternoons on weekdays I watch the "Dr. Phil" show while waiting for supper and checking out my Internet forums, e-mails, etc. Several times when guests on Dr. Phil's show have had problems with many others - multiple marriages, etc., Dr. Phil says what is the common denominator in all of these relatiionships? It's the person doing the complaining. Maybe it's their fault things don't work out.

So perhaps, just perhaps, it's not all of these other modelers who are "loners" and don't want to operate with you. Maybe it's you. Maybe it's the way you seem to force your needs on others. Could be anything. Just a thought - look in the mirror.

Bob Boudreau

[ukguy]

Ditto to what Crandell said.

However I will add that you should not give up hope, I would love an invite to a local layout, to learn, experience and develop my own layout.

I am a loner due to the few people i find who share my interests, inteligence or just plain have anything to offer I am interested in. I do keep an open mind however and will usually give someone a chance, if I can squeeze them in between , work, wife, son, house, honey do, family ties and ,,sleep.

Keep trying, have fun anyway
Karl.