Train kills man painting graffiti on boxcar

[davekelly]

Hmmmm. Very interesting topic here. Passions are running on both sides. I'm not sure where I stand on this one though. On one hand a person was killed. On the other hand we are not talking about an 8 year old girl like graybeard had to witness, we are talking about an 18 year old. An adult. The same age as thousands of young men and women who are serving honorably in our armed services or as volunteers in various community groups or are working hard to make a living for themselves. I think of the single 18 year old mom's I know that not only are good mothers, but work to support their child and attend school so that they can have a better life. This person has no regard for the property of others (as opposed to a person that was not thinking and was merely walking along the track). How much of a step is that to becoming a thief or robber or worse? I don't know. Am I glad that he got killed? NO. Am I more sympathetic to others of his age that are getting killed in Iraq, or are victims of drive bys when returning from school or get killed at the hands of an abusive spouse or significant other? Yup. Perhaps the penalty for graffitti needs to be stiffer so that folks will be persuaded not to do it and thus put themselves in a dangerous position. I don't think anyone knows the answer. Hopefully we'll discover it.

[vsmith]

Personally I have no sympathy for this kid because to quote Super Chicken..

"You knew the job was dangerous when you took it!"

These kids know what they are doing is dangerous, why do you think they do it? Its a case of whoever gets there tag onto the ludicrous place, wins the respect of other taggers. Hence every year we get a couple shovel jobs on the freeway. Do I feel for the kids families, yes, to a point. that point is determined by haow hard they tried to keep this kid straight and out of gangs like this. You would be surprised at how few try. This is LA were gang affiliation is often passed on from generation to generation.

This kid chose to walk into that yard , he chose which car he was going to deface, and in doing so created the circumstances for his own demise. If you skydive and intentionally wait until the last possible second to pull the chute cord so you can scare your friends on the ground, take too long and hit the ground, should I have ANY sympathy for an act of chosen irresponsibility?

[Anonymous]

Some of you guys are evil about this kids death. The kid is dead. It is just bad thats all. Not natual selection, or deserving in anyway. The family should come pick up their relitives body parts and clean up? No one responds to that ignorant comment? Gang member or not is not the issue here. It is a young man that dies while doing something wrong yet not harmful to others. He should have dies for that? Wow. One other stupid comment said "At least , if he was a gang member, we won't have to support him in jail for the rest of his life" by Gtirr. That was wrong dawg. Who are you really supporting? NOt any jail guys because you would still have to pay the same amount of taxes if they released all the guys from jail. You honestly think your taxes will be lowered if that happened? Wrong, they will find an alternate fill in for the reason to keep it the same.

[Leon Silverman]

I feel sorry that grayfox had to witness that child being killed, but we raised our daughters on a one-way residential street where idiot drivers sometimes raced up the street. As soon as our daughters were able to walk across the street they were taught never to cross the street without an adult's ok. They would stand on the curb and yell "Cross me!" and no move until an adult said "OK".
Granted, children do lack the "life's experiences" to always make an intelligent decision. This is why the parents have to educate them to respect property and protect themselves. Children need to be taught more than not talking to strangers.

[Anonymous]

Only person who I feel conpassion here for is the engineer who hit him. Most of railfans do not know what an engineer would go thru after hitting someone.

[grayfox1119]

That is a terrible price to pay for young, misguided, foolishness. Several months ago near Boston, Ma., a young high school girl was struck and killed as she tried to beat the train across a walkway. Young people do not have enough "life experiences" yet in some cases to make intelligent choices. They act first and think second....hopefully they get a second chance if they do something as foolish as this poor lad.
I feel for his parents and friends, and the engineer. I saw a young girl about 8, run out onto a busy hihway at rush hour to get a ball, I saw it coming as I waited at a traffic light. There was no time to warn her other than blow my horn. I looked away so as not to see that horrible sight that was impending. I could not bear to have that sight in my mind the rest of my life. She was struck and killed. I cried on the way home, thinking of my own children and how fragile life is.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: It was only paint and some of the graffics are quite admirable. Also don't lay any guilt on anyone replying , a life was lost. Think of what you would feel if it was your son.

He got what he deserved. Nothing else. His Own fault.

If it was my son doing that, he would have been higly repimanded by me.

[Anonymous]

Is it safe to assume all of us are using perfectly legal software on your computer?

How many hundreds or thousands of dollars of pirated software does the average MRR forum member have on his or her computer? It ain't ZERO, I know that.

Should anyone die for it?

Just an example of a crime that probably shouldn't exactly be punished with death.

Is stupidity worse than stealing?

Have any of us ever made stupid moves on the road while talking on the cell phone? (or peaking at the new MR mag?).

Have any of us not committed crimes? (mind you, I'm very respectful of property and pretty conservative - guilt-tripped my Dad into picking up a cigarette butt that he threw on the ground in a public place once).

As for the Darwin theories - machines aren't exactly "natural", so I think you could throw out the whole "natural selection" theory these days. How many of us go find our own food? Come on...

We're living in a man-made world, and man-made things kill people all the time. It's not exactly natural selection.

It's a shame that this guy was vandalizing. But thinking his death is no big deal is sad.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by bruce22

I am dissapointed that there is very little compassion in most of the replies, It was only paint and some of the graffics are quite admirable. Also don't lay any guilt on anyone replying , a life was lost. Think of what you would feel if it was your son.

Until they got married and moved out I knew where my sons were and who they were with. If they didn't behave, they got paddled. Now at the ages of 39 and 42 they still rspect you and call you sir and ma'am. They paddle their kids too. Notice I said paddle and not beat.

One lady in NYC was upset because the police jailed her son for tagging a postal van and her comment was "At least he wasn't out holding someone up". WHAT KIND OF PARENT IS THAT?

QUOTE: This could very well have been a person with a bad start in life waiting to blossom into something great. It's a terrible tragedy. CARRFan

Our problem is we always want to think that people will change for the better - THEY DON'T. I have a friend that works for the sherrif's dept and he said he see the same people all the time because when they get out, they're going to come right back but usually for something bigger.

As the twig is bent, so grows the tree - I don't know who penned it, he was smarter then me.

Have a blessed day and remember SANTA FE ALL THE WAY
Bob

[pedromorgan]

"express his opinion"??? how can vandilism be expressing any opinion whatsoever. it is just pointless vandalism. there is no opinion there to express. people who do that ar not inteligent enough to have an opinion. london has been plagued these last few years buy a guy who goes around spraying "TOX04" (or what ever the year happens to be) how is that expressing any opinion.
the grafiti artists who have an opinion are intelligant enough to use permitted areas where they can spray to their harts content. and not on something that has to be seen buy everyone.

it is not art-it's an eyesaw.

Peter

[TBat55]

He DIED for a crime that didn't really hurt anybody. Visual garbage sometimes, but some people have houses, yards, maybe their own body that's just as bad on the eyes.

It's a free country, he was trying to express his opinion. Just like this forum. And this forum occasionally has it's own vandals who paint obnoxious replies to topics. But they don't die for it, and I can choose to ignore them.

[Anonymous]

Just nature's way of adding a little chlorine to the gene pool.

[Jetrock]

No, I really don't have a lot of sympathy. If this particular man's life was all that worth living, he probably would have had something better to do than vandalize a railroad car.

In times before the age when Americans decided we had to make the entire planet baby-safe, people were less insulated from the negative effects of their bad choices. Life was, and frankly, still is, dangerous, and trains are inherently dangerous objects. People get killed in their proximity due to accident or carelessness, and I cannot fathom why anyone would think that they are somehow immune to this danger.

In India, trains are so crowded that commuters sit on the roof or hang outside of the cars via the windows. A few fall off and die every single day. That's a tragedy--they are just folks trying to get to work, who even paid for their tickets. A dozen or so folks died on the Metra last week for the same reason--and that's a tragedy too. But is the Darwin Award candidate who got run over by a freight train because he was standing on the tracks with his cellphone on one ear and his finger in the other ear to block out the sound of the approaching train's horn a tragedy? Or is it Darwin at work?

In the natural world, animals die all the time. But one animal's tragedy is another's success--a deer brought down by wolves is a tragedy to the deer, a triumph to the wolves. A tagger killed by his stupidity is a tragedy to the tagger's family, and a triumph to a society where stupidity is not rewarded.

I don't buy the whole "What if he was the next Mother Theresa?" argument at all--statistically speaking, the guy was just as likely to be the next Josef Stalin. I figure that of the folks who die due to accident, stupidity and other causes, the lost Stalins and lost Mother Theresas are probably going to be about equal, maintaining a balance of sorts.

[Anonymous]

I, too, was saddened by the lack of compassion in this thread.

Some paint on a piece of property Vs. a man's life.

This could very well have been a person with a bad start in life waiting to blossom into something great. It's a terrible tragedy.

[trolleyboy]

Ben10 they would likely lose most if not all mainline areas are fenced off and posted WARNING HIGH SPEED TRAINS most likely mom and dad will try however. It is unfortunate but things like this happen all to frequently.There would also be trespassing signs up in these areas as well and CN police do take a dim view of trespassers and taggers but having said that they are few and far between. Rob

[ben10ben]

As sad as this event is, I hope that it will serve as a future deterant for anyone considering vandalizing a train car if they see that this could happen. I'm sure that it won't happen, but there's always a possibity.

By the way, I hope that his parents don't turn around and sue the railroad for failing to improperly secure that stretch of track, or not making it known that it was an active track, or some other such stupid scenario. Without knowing much of anything about Canada's legal system(although I certainly don't know that much about the US), I don't know what the results of such a suit would be.

[bruce22]

I am dissapointed that there is very little compassion in most of the replies, It was only paint and some of the graffics are quite admirable. Also don't lay any guilt on anyone replying , a life was lost. Think of what you would feel if it was your son.

[mustanggt]

QUOTE: it would have been better if that worthless gang member had been decapitated by the train and his family had to come out and clean up his body parts, along with the graffiti

No.

[Anonymous]

There are laws on the books here in California that when a criminal is killed in the commission of a crime, his accomplices (sp?) are tried for manslaughter for their part in the commission of the crime. This is true for armed robbery, but I am not sure if this applies in cases where the crime is vandalism. If so, it could lead to a reduction in the amount of vandalism being committed if it were to receive enough publicity. I am not sure what the laws are in Canada, but there are places in SoCal where I would love to see some of these guys get locked up for what they do to public (and often private) property. There are places around L.A. where the sound walls along the freeways get repainted (by vandals) nightly. There is nothing artistic about vandalism. It is a crime, pure and simple. If it were art, it would be on canvas (or some similarly suitable medium). At least that's my opinion.

[Anonymous]

it would have been better if that worthless gang member had been decapitated by the train and his family had to come out and clean up his body parts, along with the graffiti.

but that's just my opinion.....

[espeefoamer]

Taggers should never step back onto an adjacent track to admire their work.

[Anonymous]

These forums are better than TV!

First a suicide Jeeper, now Taggers!

My namesake 4005 would not want to be in the gantlet ( or is it gaunlet ? ) between two trains.

[Anonymous]

At least , if he was a gang member, we won't have to support him in jail for the rest of his life.

[garr]

tatans,

Where's the parking decks the graffiti "artists" are using--my '96 Explorer needs some new paint in spots!

If there is a graffiti "artist" big enough to tag a 737 I'm not messing with him--those fuselages are rather high in the air compared to a boxcar.

Death seems like a severe punishment for tagging, but I guess the gene pool has been saved in some morbid way.

Jay

[tatans]

The main rule for mutilating railway equipment is: never step back to admire your work. I wonder why theses talented morons haven't targetted airports and started to sign 737's? Apparently now their new projects are entering parking structures and tagging indiviual automobiles, with vans being the ultimate target, my insurance agent has 3 claims on graffitti.

[mustanggt]

QUOTE: thats what you get for vandalism

[quoteNatural selection at work!]

[Train1725]

The tragedy is that the poor engineer has to live with the fact that he killed someone, even though it wasn't his fault. The punishment for grafitti shouldn't be death, but too often the punishment for stupidity is !

[Anonymous]

ohh my

[Jetrock]

Natural selection at work!

[vsmith]

Could be worse, out here we get these idiots dangling from there toes trying to scrawl there tag onto bridge overpasses, occasionally one falls onto the freeway, by the time the ambulance or the cops arrive, they need shovels to pick up the guy...