I missed that discussion too.
Musta been betwixt a lamp shade and a fence post because if someone was to be asking me, who ever figured out how todays DCC works had to be one or the other!
Recap) in the late 70's the talk was hot about mixing electronics with trains/layouts. Sound and DC had already been mixed to a varying degree ands its success was in the ear of the beholder.
Even MR was publishing articles on how to fashion electronics into daughter boards to insert into a pc. Or other projects if not in article form, then could be found under the sub-section titled "Symposium on Electronics". I was ecstatic with anticipation!
(my first ever project with electrical componants can be attributed to MR - THANK YOU!)
The hardest problem being faced then, was super imposing signal over power. We didnt have the intel, nor the electronics (good enuf) to do the job. Time was needed.
I take a hiatus from the hobby and do the college thing, marriage thing, family thing, and once all that nonsense was over, i get back to the hobby.
Today) But what the heck? DCC isnt PC's controlling model railroads, its vcr remote paddles and cell phones. Who in the world thought this was the way it should be?
WOW! DCC really missed the mark there! Its my own sad fault for thinking this would have turned out correctly. I cant fathom, with the control and power available in a PC, why anyone would use anything else to control your model railroad.
Waybills, switching, forwarding, inventory, video monitoring, programming, automation, i mean the list goes on and on for what a PC could do..... compared to the puny lil paddles you have.... that only enter rudamentery numerical keystrokes.
I was really let down after waiting years for DCC and finding that what we have today, is dismally inadequate.
In the end, it didnt matter if i heard that 'discussion' or not, or even the pros and cons of DCC. The form of todays DCC made up my mind for me. Which would indicate that this post would be a view probably not heard before on this topic.
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PMR
Kevin wrote:
Again, where is this debate? Did I live in the only part of the world where we all agreed DCC was better, but if you were already "in" for DC it might be beneficial for you, as an individual, to stay there?
I never was part of any of these debates. Why was there any debate? DCC is better for a hundred reasons, and DC is only better for three or four.
I do not personally know any model railroader that feels differently.
Well Kevin, that whole thing had pretty much died down around here before you joined us.
I found your comment very interesting, because I see it as much more subjective than that.
I think it depends as much on your personal layout goals (and sometimes a lack of specific goals) as it does on the technical apects of either system.
And that said, DC is not just "one" system. It can be applied so many different ways as you know.
I have been following a few model train groups on facebook, now that I spend time there for the "GRAVELY garden tractor" hobby (insert tractor picture here).
One thing I have found interesting is there are a lot of guys, apparently younger from what I can see, with "medium" sized layouts that are DC powered. Once again supporting the anecdotal evidence that suggests DCC usage is about 60% in HO and N scales.
And while sales of newly manufactured DC locos are surely less than DCC/sound locos, a number of manufacturers are still offering them - for DC operators and DCC operators who prefer their choice of decoder.
Bachmann just announced a new run of USRA Light Pacfics - all DCC ready, not DCC/sound?
So why DCC?
If you want sound it is the only sensible path.
If you like no or minimal control panels, it is the best choice.
If you plan to just walk around with manual turnouts - again, best choice.
If your layout is small or medium sized but you still want multi train action - I would go DCC.
If you are new to the hobby, phone or computer tech savy, there is a built in simplicity to DCC, especially since as a new person you may not really know what your modeling goals will be. This and sound is why I tell new people to go DCC.
The "neutral" issues.
If you plan to control turnouts with switch motors, that wiring will be the same, more or less.
If you want detection, signals, and possibly CTC, you are in for a lot of wiring either way - DCC or DC. There is no big advantage on either side. If you say your constant track voltage is an advantage, I say my DC system has a simple add on for that, but now you need blocks I already have in my core infrastructure.
Locomotive performance - My Aristo wireless radio throttles use PWM speed control just like your decoder - so do a number of other DC throttles.
Why DC?
Well the first thing is you have to be happy with no onboard sound. Trust me I'm happy.
The rest of "why" depends on your goals - I could give lots of examples, but here are some of my key reasons.
I would rather build control panels and relay boards than install decoders.
For the few buttons that I need to push, I like the tactile feel of real buttons - controling a train on a smart phone is a non starter for me.
In my case, I already have the equipment, knowledge and skill - I know I am somewhat unique in that fact.
I did not start in this hobby in the last year, or even in the last two decades, try 1967. I'm not much for replacing things that are not broken just to have the "latest thing" (the garden tractor just turned 27, and if I posted a picture you might say it looks nearly new).
My "givens" and why DC is a fit for me.
No interest in "tinny" onboard sound - bought one tried it, ran a bunch of them on other peoples layouts - sometimes could not wait to leave the noise......
I have a layout design philosophy that says:
So my DC advanced cab control works very well within this criteria.
What do I give up by not having DCC?
Sound - something I don't want anyway.
Being able to move locomotives in close proximity to other moving or stopped locos. This feature has some value, but on a larger, spread out layout like mine, the engine terminal is the only place it would have noticable advantage - at a pretty high relative cost.
Being able to control locomotive lighting separately - not an interest or issue in my 1954 era. And my PWM throttles provide some pretty fantastic constant lighting as is.
Speed matching - never needed it so far, and I double head and MU lots of power.
Everybody approaches this hobby in a different way, different goals, different solutions.
I visited a layout once, a 1200 sq ft basement layout that was a point to point industrial switching layout - controlled by a single Aristo wireless DC throttle, all ground throw turnouts, toggles on sidings to park locomotives - convince that guy he "needs" DCC.
Comments and questions cheerfully welcomed, off topic rabbit holes allowed.
Sheldon