I am somewhat confused about two issues regarding this engine.
1. Why would a company decide to invest valuable capital to provide a locomotive of which ten were made all for the Milwaukee Road. Doesn't this have limited appeal to (guessing) 95% of the market and limit sales? Isn't there something better to bring to the market with broader appeal?
2. Does Kalmbach realize that those 95% of modelers could care less about a two page report gushing over this locomotive in the June issue of MR.
There were only 25 real big boys and how many models were produced.
ndbprrWhy would a company decide to invest valuable capital to provide a locomotive of which ten were made all for the Milwaukee Road.
I'm after the same company to produce a C32-8, of which only ten were made, all for Conrail.
Compared to the numbers of GP7s and F7s, the Milwaukee had very few Bi-Polars and Little Joes, but MTH still saw fit to manufacture both of these somewhat obscure engines. I might have bought one, if they came without DCS decoders.
I'm sure they did their market research. Not every modeler is road specific, and many buy an engine because they just like the colors. My guess is Scale Trains saw a niche, and a model no one else made, and took a bit of a gamble.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
It's a good model for smaller home layouts, and a unique product helps make the company stand out in a sea of GEVO-builders and EMD reruns. Not everyone buys a Corvette or a Ford GT but they have a nice 'halo' effect on other products.
The SDL39's were something unique. A 6 axle road diesel with a short frame and body that is closer to a GP38.
MILW did this for the lighter short line tracks that were on many branch lines.
After the SOO and the WC used them, most, if not all are in duty in Chile, still working.
Mike.
My You Tube
Certain roads attract very loyal modelers. Milwaukee Road is one of them. C&NW is another. The C&NW only had 30 high hood C-628s, yet Stewart Models did two runs before being bought by Bowser, and Bowser has done either two or three runs since.The SDL39 has already sold out, so I guess Scale Trains knows what they're doing. Yes, I bought one.Also, any review of a company gives information. Do you think they won't ever do another "Museum Quality" locomotive?
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
I keep hoping that Scale Trains or Rapido will do the DM&IR SDm rebuild SD9's with the low nose and correct roof details. That would be another niche model that would probably sell well as many carry on for other railroads. Prior to the Scale Trains model, the SDL39 was only made in brass by Overland Models, and it super high priced, like over 1K for just a single engine if factory painted, and that is without sound or DCC. Makes the plastic version a real bargain.
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
rrebell There were only 25 real big boys and how many models were produced.
And, what, less than 60 Union Pacific turbines or DDA40Xs? How many Zephyrs, M-1000s, or Acela trainsets were there?
ndprr,1). MTH had designed the SDL39 but never released it. When ScaleTrains bought out MTH's HO (and S-scale) product lines, lo and behold the SDL39 was just sitting there in the MTH collection, ready to go. If I had to guess, I'd say ST probably wouldn't have run the SDL39 at this time in their history if MTH hadn't already done the design work. All ST had to do was remove the MTH features like operating couplers, DCS, etc.2). Yes, 95% of modelers won't care about this loco. But then 95% of modelers don't care about any one loco. 95% of modelers don't have a Big Boy, an FL9, or AC6000CW. However, that's okay. We are long past the point where manufacturers had to make only the most popular prototypes in order to make money. In yon olden days, you spent a fortune on tooling that would last forever that you crank out decade after decade with no changes (see: Globe/Athearn F7A). In order to make money, you had to crank out the same product over and over again. Today, you can inexpensively make CNC tooling that can turn a profit with just one production run. And so we get the Bachmann EF-4 (E-33 to the heathen hordes) with just 12 made in real life, the Rapido EP-5 (just 10 made), the Bowser C-430 (just 16 made), and so on.
MisterBeasleymany buy an engine because they just like the colors
Count me... I hate myself on this but just love the color -Jerry
emdmikeI keep hoping that Scale Trains or Rapido will do the DM&IR SDm rebuild SD9's with the low nose and correct roof details
Are you a member of the DM&IR Society? Many such groups make a deal with a manufacturer that if they can get X number orders the manufacturer will make them (plus some extra for the late comers). That gives the Society something to boast about when attracting new members, "Our members got an exclusive deal on X piece of roliing stock from Z models". If you are a member, see how many people would be willing to pony up money for a "limited edition, once they're gone there ain't gonna be no more" model (And ask what price they are willing to pay)
Paul3 Bachmann EF-4 (E-33 to the heathen hordes)
INFIDEL! How dare you profane the Sacred Name of the EL-C's?!
Ya I think the issue isn't how many real engines there were, but how many can they sell? There weren't that many N&W Js, or UP challengers or Big Boys, but there have been plenty of models over the years.
I'm a member of the Missabe Road Hist. Soc., unfortunately we're such a small group compared to other groups (like the Milwaukee society - which unlike the real railroad, is VERY well funded). I don't know that we could come up with some deal like that; we tried with a DMIR passenger (executive observation) car but the deals always fell through. Really, I'm amazed at the products (MTH Yellowstone, Walthers DMIR caboose) that have been produced for the Missabe.
(p.s. - I also belong to the New York Central System Hist. Soc. A couple of years ago we tried to interest a manufacturer into making a non-brass model of an NYC Mikado. I forget the exact one chosen - NYC had many classes of Mikes - but it was the most common one, something like 800 made. Anyway, no one was interested - and that's for a society with like a couple thousand members. Missabe society is about 380 members I believe.)
I like to take credit for the high-nose C-628s. I bugged the Stewarts at a nation NMRA convention - they were producing the low-nose C-628, I said they had to do the high-nose too so I could get a couple of CNW ones to pull ore cars on my layout. They were skeptical, but later that year they announced the high-nose ones.
BEAUSABRE,Touché, sir!
In my opinion any engines ST mfgr's are worth consideration, if you like the model. I have 3 of their more recent issues and just pre-ordered two GP30's. perhaps i'm wrong but i don't know of any better constructed diesel engines on the market today including ATH Genesis, Intermountain, Rapido, with the exception of maybe Walthers Proto Series. With respect to the SLD39 a 6 axel switcher is quite unique by itself, notwithstanding the models details and LOK Sound 5 operating features together with built in duel power capacitors. Not too many people purchase Mercedes GT's or BMW M cars but they are still produced. Bayway Terminal NJ
I think one point of these product reviews is that, yes indeed, many folks might not need this particular ScaleTrains offering, but seeing an in depth review of a model such as this might familiarize them in such a way that the next model ST offers, which might be one they could use for their layout, will then be purchased. The real review, if you read between the lines, is more about what this manufacturer can do or is doing with their models, and not so much merely about this particular model at hand.
Not everybody loves ST, I get that, and I have been very critical of them in the past. However, the simple fact is that they do make some pretty darn good trains. Some models might be of comparable quality to those delivered by other brands (with minor issues), but other ST models may be far superior.
John
I cant wait to see what MTH/ST steam locomotives look like & i know the electronics will play nice with everything
wjstix I like to take credit for the high-nose C-628s. I bugged the Stewarts at a nation NMRA convention - they were producing the low-nose C-628, I said they had to do the high-nose too so I could get a couple of CNW ones to pull ore cars on my layout. They were skeptical, but later that year they announced the high-nose ones.
I ran into Mr. Stewart at the Amherst MA show just after the low nose C-628s came out, and I asked him when high-hood versions were coming. Note that I did NOT mention road names. He grinned and shook his head and said "Oh, you North Western guys."Even though we were in Massachusetts, he figured correctly I was interested in CNW, not N&W.
Bayway Terminal In my opinion any engines ST mfgr's are worth consideration, if you like the model. I have 3 of their more recent issues and just pre-ordered two GP30's. perhaps i'm wrong but i don't know of any better constructed diesel engines on the market today including ATH Genesis, Intermountain, Rapido, with the exception of maybe Walthers Proto Series. With respect to the SLD39 a 6 axel switcher is quite unique by itself, notwithstanding the models details and LOK Sound 5 operating features together with built in duel power capacitors. Not too many people purchase Mercedes GT's or BMW M cars but they are still produced. Bayway Terminal NJ
Based upon the video reviews, it looks like a great loco. But the turbo sound at idle is quite annoying to me, so I'll pass on buying one. Otherwise I would strongly consider it.
- Douglas
DoughlessBut the turbo sound at idle is quite annoying to me, so I'll pass on buying one.
Is that one of the noises, I mean "sounds", that has an individual volume control?
I hope they do it in N Scale
Some more examples of low production prototypes that sold big numbers as models:
B&O C-16 0-4-0 "dockside" or "little joe" - 4 prototypes, one railroad, likely millions of models sold by no less than 5 or 6 manufacturers over 8 decades.
USRA Heavy Mountain - only 15 original prototypes, a few copies later on, just a few railroads - likely tens of thousands sold by Bachmann in the last 25 years and others in the past. And the C&O versions sold by Bachmann represented 5 of those 15 and two of the later copies.
The list goes on and on - Back in the day, or in modern times, getting a model of your favorite loco is mostly luck.
Sheldon
ndbprrDoes Kalmbach realize that those 95% of modelers could care less about a two page report gushing over this locomotive in the June issue of MR.
The point of reviews is not to appeal to as many model railroaders as possible. If that was the case, all reviews would be about DCC systems and scenery supplies.
The point of reviews is to inform readers of new products and let them know what to expect if they purchase the model.
I read all the reviews, and I wish there were more. Even for products I will never buy.
ATLANTIC CENTRALUSRA Heavy Mountain - only 15 original prototypes, a few copies later on, just a few railroads - likely tens of thousands sold by Bachmann in the last 25 years and others in the past.
Why they only made 15 of this perfectly beautiful locomotive is crazy to me.
-Photograph by Kevin Parson
Sunset made hundreds of them in brass, and finding one is pretty easy. I got lucky with mine, it is nearly flawless and runs like a Swiss watch.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SeeYou190 ndbprr Does Kalmbach realize that those 95% of modelers could care less about a two page report gushing over this locomotive in the June issue of MR. The point of reviews is not to appeal to as many model railroaders as possible. If that was the case, all reviews would be about DCC systems and scenery supplies. The point of reviews is to inform readers of new products and let them know what to expect if they purchase the model. I read all the reviews, and I wish there were more. Even for products I will never buy. ATLANTIC CENTRAL USRA Heavy Mountain - only 15 original prototypes, a few copies later on, just a few railroads - likely tens of thousands sold by Bachmann in the last 25 years and others in the past. Why they only made 15 of this perfectly beautiful locomotive is crazy to me. -Photograph by Kevin Parson Sunset made hundreds of them in brass, and finding one is pretty easy. I got lucky with mine, it is nearly flawless and runs like a Swiss watch. -Kevin
ndbprr Does Kalmbach realize that those 95% of modelers could care less about a two page report gushing over this locomotive in the June issue of MR.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL USRA Heavy Mountain - only 15 original prototypes, a few copies later on, just a few railroads - likely tens of thousands sold by Bachmann in the last 25 years and others in the past.
Agreed, they are beautiful locos. The ATLANTIC CENTRAL has fleet of 9 and a couple of the C&O versions also can be seen here.
SeeYou190Why they only made 15 of this perfectly beautiful locomotive is crazy to me.
Railroads aren't interested in how pretty a locomotive is, but in how well it meets their motive power needs. The 4-8-2 was a pretty new wheel arrangement in 1918 and the industry wasn't sure of where it fit in the pantheon of wheel arrangments. Was it an enlarged Pacific for use on passenger service in the mountains (C&O)? Or was it a Mikado with a 4 wheel lead truck for service as a fast freighter (NYC and NYNH&H)? As far as the later, remember that this was still the drag era, so speed wasn't necessarily important (and the USRA limited allowable speeds, anyway, to conserve fuel). NYC had the first big fleet (185 of the Class L1 of 1916) and they found the 54,000 lb tractive effort of a light Mountain to suit their needs just fine. This was just a hundred pounds more than the USRA light Mountain, which had 47 originals and 90 copies built. Most people just didn't need an extra 4300 pounds of tractive effort and didn't want to pay for it. The two railroads that did, C&O and N&W, had some heavy duty mountain railroading to perform, so it was worthwhile to them.
All very true and good info.
As a wheel arrangement, the Mountain proved over time to be very effective, as you point out about the NYC. The B&O also found them very useful and was building them right up to the end, as opposed to going the 4-8-4 route.
Interestingly it was both, a big Pacific and a fast Mikado, making it one of the first true dual service medium/large locomotives.
maxman Doughless But the turbo sound at idle is quite annoying to me, so I'll pass on buying one. Is that one of the noises, I mean "sounds", that has an individual volume control?
Doughless But the turbo sound at idle is quite annoying to me, so I'll pass on buying one.
I haven't checked with the Loksound V5, but the turbo is generally considered part of the prime mover sound function...its supposedly recorded from real locos...so its not something that can be separated out generally. I would have to have deeper knowledge than what I do.
QSI had a separate volume control for the turbo. and I would always set it very low or mute.
The reviews show that the ground lights and dashboard lights are generally effective with the room lights off...night effect...not in a normally lit room. While cool and impressive, its not something I would want to spend money for.