I loved putting those kits together the box cars tank cars but the parts like stirups or hand rails on the tank cars break very easily any replacement parts that are stronger available?
On the tank cars, there are curved tank end grab irons available from Details Associates that work very well.
.
For stirrups, I use replacements from Tichy if they become broken. They make one that is very close, but it is still fragile.
My problem with these kits continues to be the two small grab irons that go on the side of the domes. I have yet to find a tough replacement for these.
I also love these kits.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
The stirrups on my 50' Proto 2000 box cars (exhibit A in photo) are extremly fragile. I've broken them when trying to glue them on many times but managed to carefully piece them back together. But they are the most fragile stirrups I've experienced in HO.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
riogrande5761The stirrups on my 50' Proto 2000 box cars (exhibit A in photo) are extremly fragile.
Yes, they are SOOOoooooooo fragile! And they look great, and no one seems to make an exact replacement.
My UNION PACIFIC car recieved replacements from Details Associates that are not even close to correct.
Styrene is fine for shelf models but a poor choice of materials for an operating car or engine. I have formed replacements for the small dome grabs by bending .015" brass wire over the jaw of a needlenose plier.
The problem is not owned by P2K -- Branchline, Details West and Detail Associates cars also have delicate details. Probably others, too.
Besides A-Line I use these from Yarmouth Model Works:
http://www.yarmouthmodelworks.com/index.php/ModelDetailParts/Stirrups
Rick Jesionowski
Rule 1: This is my railroad.
Rule 2: I make the rules.
Rule 3: Illuminating discussion of prototype history, equipment and operating practices is always welcome, but in the event of visitor-perceived anacronisms, detail descrepancies or operating errors, consult RULE 1!
When the Proto kits first became available, I didn't have the money to afford them, but many partially-made kits eventually began appearing on the "used" table at my LHS, and at very decent prices.
The first one I bought (unwittingly, as it was an unbuilt and undecorated kit, on that table in a clear plastic bag with no instructions and no indication of the manufacturer). I asked the owner about its origin, and all he could, or would, tell me, was that it was a pre-production model. That shop, now gone, was one of the largest in Ontario.
The car had no weight included (I added one), and I quickly discarded the supplied plastic grab irons and steps, as I thought them to be too bulky. The grabirons shown are from Tichy, the sill steps from A-Line. No trucks were provided either, and the ones shown are, I think, from Lindberg...
The partially-built kits on that table were mostly failed attempts at building the car, and besides having missing or broken parts (mostly grabiron, steps, and brake rigging) many had a generous amount of ca on the body shells where the owner had attempted to add detail parts.When the r-t-r versions appeared, the kit versions languished on the shelves for some time, but it took a while before the owner finally discounted them, and quite severely, too - very surprising in that store. I just happened to be in the store soon after that occurred and bought quite a few of the finally affordable kits....a few stock cars, and lots of gondolas and tank cars. All were stripped of their factory paint and lettering, as I had already decided to redo all of those troublesome details. Many of the gondolas were destined for my freelanced home road, but many of the tankcars were re-lettered, in some cases, the same as their original paint job.Here's one such car, with metal grabirons, sill steps and tank handrail. The lettering is C-D-S dry transfers...
This Proto gondola, another orphan from a failed build, was stripped and re-detailed with grabirons custom-bent from Tichy .012" phophor-bronze wire, then re-painted and lettered with Champ decals. The lading damage was inflicted using a soldering iron to soften the plastic, which was then pushed with the handle of an X-Acto to create the bulges...
This is one of my home road gondolas. Most were bought as new kits (not previous attempts by someone else), but heavily discounted due to the preference of most for r-t-r and/or because the factory lettering was for roads not especially popular in this area...
This car was a gift from a friend. He bought it at a train show, mainly because he liked the end doors. However, his eyesight is not the best, and he later realised that the car was lettered for the '50s, while his layout is set in the late '20s. The car is typical of cars being built from the mid-'30s on, so he offered it to me. Upon receiving it, I discovered that the previous owner had attempted to assemble it, but used copious amounts of ca, and apparently his eyesight was as bad as that of my friend. It was a fair amount of work to remove the excess glue, but most scraped off using a chisel-type blade in my X-Acto. The doors were damaged somewhat during the clean-up, and the ladders were beyond rescue. I added new steps and grabs, repaired the visible damage, and added some scratchbuilt tack boards and other small details. For the new metal grabs, I simulated the bolts holding them in place by inserting short lengths of brass wire just above their ends - no hex-heads, but convincing enough once painted...
The underbody was in rough shape, with most of the piping and brake rigging broken or missing. I used the original components, but substituted wire where necessary. I also added the storage tubes (Evergreen styrene rod) for the tie-down chains used with the Evans Auto-Loaders. After changing the BLT date to better reflect my layout's era, it turned into a decent piece of rolling stock...
I do have some Proto r-t-r, too, one of these purchased, and three received as gifts from a friend in Texas. They were too old for his layout's era...
Originally lettered for Santa Fe, I removed the lettering connected to that, but left most of the remaining lettering, altering dates where necessary, then added custom dry transfers, from C-D-S, to make them home road cars. No other alterations were required, as the metal grab irons were original equipment.
Another Proto offering, this time from LifeLike Canada, and in their Proto1000 series, were the r-t-r Dominion/Fowler boxcars. Surprisingly, these r-t-r cars came with free-standing grabirons, but were well beyond my budget at the time. Unfortunately (but luckily for me) LifeLike had mistakenly omitted the cars' dimensional data. To correct that oversight, they offered replacement body shells if buyers returned the incorrect ones to the point of purchase.I apparently missed out on the initial wave of returns, but the same hobbyshop was selling them for $2.00 apiece, and, over a period of time, I picked up about a dozen of them. Like the Proto2000 cars, the grabirons were plastic, and also too fat to look right. I fabricated new floors for the cars, and was able to purchase the Proto Simplex trucks which were generally common to these cars, but I wasn't at all pleased with the grabs, so decided to replace them - all 34/car, along with new sill steps, 6/car, new roofwalks (the originals were 6" short on each end) and new roofwalk corner grabirons...
The main issue with the grabirons (other than drilling 74 #79 holes for each car) is that the bolt heads were cast as an integral part of the plastic grabirons, and in some instances, it was necessary to enlarge the original holes in the body shell and then use styrene rod to plug the hole so that a new, smaller hole could be drilled for the metal part.Almost all of these cars were repainted, then re-lettered using C-D-S dry transfers...
If you want easier to use replacement grabirons for Proto (and some other brands), your best choice is probably to bend your own, using suitably-sized wire. For some applications, the original mounting holes may be too big for the newer wire ones. My preference in that case is to drill-out the existing hole to a size about .003" or .004" smaller than whatever size Evergreen styrene rod you have on-hand, then apply solvent-type cement (use a small, natural bristle brush) to both the rod and to the inside of the enlarged hole. Wait a few seconds for the plastic to soften, then re-apply solvent in both areas, then force the rod into the hole. Snip-off the excess, not too close to the car, then let the joint harden overnight before trimming-off the excess rod and smoothing the surface. Re-drill to the proper size, and then add the wire grabs.
Wayne
The suggestion was given to me to use a reamer in the holes to make it easier to put the small parts in place and reduce breakage. I haven't done much since I got them, but it certainly helped.
Good luck,
Richard
cowman The suggestion was given to me to use a reamer in the holes to make it easier to put the small parts in place and reduce breakage. I haven't done much since I got them, but it certainly helped. Good luck, Richard
I've found with Proto 2000 kits, little if any reaming is necessary for the parts to fit in the holes for gluing. Intermountain kits, which are very similar, usually need a little more. The Proto kits have been engineered quite well; the biggest rub are the very fragile stirrups.
While I have broken a few stirrups during assembly (thankful there are extras on the sprue), I've had very few Proto 2000 parts - even stirrups - break once assembled. Maybe it's the way I pack them in the storage boxes.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
I got a brand new P2K stock car kit off of ebay for $12 and free shipping, which I think is a steal. Best part is, it came with plenty of extra grab irons!
I'm beginning to realize that Windows 10 and sound decoders have a lot in common. There are so many things you have to change in order to get them to work the way you want.
doctorwayne This car was a gift from a friend. He bought it at a train show, mainly because he liked the end doors. However, his eyesight is not the best, and he later realised that the car was lettered for the '50s, while his layout is set in the late '20s. The car is typical of cars being built from the mid-'30s on, so he offered it to me. Upon receiving it, I discovered that the previous owner had attempted to assemble it, but used copious amounts of ca, and apparently his eyesight was as bad as that of my friend. It was a fair amount of work to remove the excess glue, but most scraped off using a chisel-type blade in my X-Acto. The doors were damaged somewhat during the clean-up, and the ladders were beyond rescue. I added new steps and grabs, repaired the visible damage, and added some scratchbuilt tack boards and other small details. For the new metal grabs, I simulated the bolts holding them in place by inserting short lengths of brass wire just above their ends - no hex-heads, but convincing enough once painted... The underbody was in rough shape, with most of the piping and brake rigging broken or missing. I used the original components, but substituted wire where necessary. I also added the storage tubes (Evergreen styrene rod) for the tie-down chains used with the Evans Auto-Loaders. After changing the BLT date to better reflect my layout's era, it turned into a decent piece of rolling stock...
Is this a P2K car? I didn't know that P2K made an end door boxcar kit.
It appears from the photo that the end doors can be modeled open or closed. Is that correct?
Do you happen to remember what the kit number was?
Thanks
Dick
maxman Is this a P2K car? I didn't know that P2K made an end door boxcar kit. It appears from the photo that the end doors can be modeled open or closed. Is that correct? Do you happen to remember what the kit number was? Thanks Dick
I don't know about Wayne of many photo's but the UP Proto 2000 box car I showed above has end doors; you just can't see them in the original photo:
The UP Auto box car with end doors is listed on my box as:
50' Automobile Box Car with end doors, UP #161357
There is no stock number on the box
It was some years ago when I built it and I don't recall if the end doors could be modeled separately. The instructions are in the box - I'll have to get them out and check when I get a chance.
riogrande5761I don't know about Wayne of many photo's
edit an attempt at humor takes an unwanted turn toward politics.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
BigDaddy riogrande5761 I don't know about Wayne of many photo's That's so Elizabeth Warren.
riogrande5761 I don't know about Wayne of many photo's
That's so Elizabeth Warren.
Huh?
deleted
Hello —
I have some of these L-L 50 footers. The end doors would require some careful surgery to make them posed open or operable:
LifeLike by Edmund, on Flickr
LifeLike_0001 by Edmund, on Flickr
The A end is molded as part of the body. It wouldn't be impossible but would take some time to carve out the door moldings. I don't see an actual stock number on my box, it has a small sticker with the reporting marks, SOU 40231 on the end of the box.
Good Luck, Ed
maxman doctorwayne Is this a P2K car? I didn't know that P2K made an end door boxcar kit. It appears from the photo that the end doors can be modeled open or closed. Is that correct? Do you happen to remember what the kit number was? Thanks Dick
doctorwayne
As far as I can tell, there is no kit number...the end of the box reads LV 8534 which is the car's number, and there's no number on the instructions, other than a stamp-applied 09796.I got the kit from a friend, who bought it, partially (mis)-built at a train show.
The end doors look as if they would work, but that's only because the latching bar is a separately-applied piece. I replaced all of the grabirons, roofwalk grabs, and stirrup steps with metal parts, and altered the BLT date to 6-37, so that the car would better-fit into my layout's era. I also replaced the stock roofwalk with a board-by-board one, using Evergreen HO scale 2"x6" strip styrene
The instructions also outline how to alter the sidesills, from the straight type, to the notched type for roads which had that feature. The Lehigh Valley cars had notched sidesills, so I altered the car accordingly.
I get, and don't mind, the "Wayne of many photos" moniker, but the reference to the sultry and seductive Elizabeth Warren escapes me completely.
I'd guess that there are some here who don't care for photos, but if somebody asks a question which can be answered with a photo, it makes sense to me to show 'em the picture. While a picture is supposedly worth a thousand words, I don't mind givin' the written-out version, too.
IIRC, the Proto 2000 end door Automobile Box cars were originally sold circa 1997, give or take. I bought mine at AA Hobbies in Warwick RI when I was working at a Superfund site for several months. I bought a number of models from that rather nice shop and still have some of them including this box car.
doctorwayneI get, and don't mind, the "Wayne of many photos" moniker, but the reference to the sultry and seductive Elizabeth Warren escapes me completely.
Now I'm confused...
Gary
I'm confused too. But, onward and upward.
Confused or not, we look forward to your pictures Wayne.
Keep them coming.
I'm still confused.
I was going to send you a pm, but there is no option to do that where it usually appears for others. I guess you will have to stay confused.
Then why do people post nonsense in topics that most don't get and apparently isn't allowed to be posted in public but only understood by a secret society? SMH
j. c.proto number is 21024. besides the LV i have CB&Q , UP , ERIE and GTW with end doors
Thank you.
I seem to remember an ad for these when Life-Like first brought them to market. These were the first cars in the Proto-2000 series.
The ad showed a drawing with the end doors open. That caused some dismay when the actual model made it to the store shelves, and the doors were cast into the body shell.
Oh well, I glue all my doors shut anyway.
The first P2K models I saw, and for around $8 at the time, were the double door auto box cars with dreadnaught ends. Amazingly cheap when first on the market for very well detail cars and you could read the micro print with a magnifier nice and clear. I think my wife game me two IIRC for Christmas 1997, Santa Fe and Southern. I picked up the UP box car with end doors a year later at AA Hobbies.
The box car kits IMO go together easier than the contemporary IMRC kits, which were very similar in detail. Back then, like many, I just got anything that was "shiny", but since I have settled on a late 1970's thru early 1980's modeling period, those P2k 50' box cars would have been rare by then. I think they had build dates in the 1940's.