First of all,let me point out on my trainroom door I have a sign that says ( no nitpicking allowed) Now this sign deters most but not all nitpickers. When clubs visit my layout theres always some guy who says something like,Look he has no berm around his chemical tank or how can you run those freight cars behind that engine? Now I dont pull freight cars behind my pacific (although I would like to sometimes) but I dont let oversize couplers,modern autos on the layout when Im running steam, oversize rails,steam engines that dont puff smoke, trees too big or too small, comments like actually your trains just goes around in a elongated circle,why dont you light up your buildings(all 70 of them),bother me & I have learned to please me not others,when it comes to my trains. I realize I have a limited budget,so I will never have say a layout like Rod Stewart has & so many others I have seen but I do have a layout where I can run my trains & enjoy the fruits of my labors. I think its a good idea to take a picture of your first layout, I did,it had one dummy engine,a circle of track,no trees no buildings & no power pack,that was the lean years, then as years go by look at those pictures & see how things have improved. It will help put things in perspective. When you learn to be satisfied with what you can afford & with what you have,then you have learned one of the secrets of happiness.
It depends on what, as to how nitpicky I am. I model the 50's. Not a specific day, month, or even year, just a range. So a car with data 1950-1959 is close enough for me (though I tend to stick to 1957 and earlier). A 60's or 70's reweigh date? That car is out of here - I picked up an Athearn 6 car set, 4 of the 6 all had 50's dates, two had 1971. I donated the two to the club layour after I built them.
You won;t see turn of the century steamers running on my layout, what you will see are first gen diesels and a couple of steamers that were around pretty much until the end of steam and slightly beyond.
I don't run any fantasy scheme rolling stock, even if it is era appropriate. But i don't count rivets and discard a car lettered properly even though the model is somewhat generic and the real one on my prototype was 6" shorter or something silly and unoticeable like that.
All in all, not much of a nitpicker as long as it's plausible. But not like the trains of my childhood where anything and everything ran together - such as a NYC streamlined Hudson pulling shorty Santa Fe modern passenger cars.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
My made up world of nonsense is set in August, 1954. I paint and decal every piece of equipment on the railroad, so I am in full control of all the details. The equipment is all built to what many would consider very high standards, but it is just what I want. Nothing is lettered for a real railroad. The layout is set in the town of Springfield, in the same state the Springfield on the Simpsons is located in.
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You might think that would all stop the nitpickers, but it does not.
The only way to keep nitpickers away is just to ban all model railroaders from the layout room. That might sound ridiculous, but it works.
Anyway... the question was what kind of a nitpicker am I... I am not a nitpicker. I encourage everyone I meet to keep on railroading in whatever level of detail they want.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
My " nitpicky" revolves around believability as far as era appropriate which is pretty strict even for my close enough/good enough modeling style.
In short you won't see any IPD boxcars when I change eras from 77/78 to 94/95. You will see C&NW,N&W,Southern,CR,WC,CHTT,WE etc cars but,nary a Rock Island or Milwaukee car.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
I am not nitpicky as to quality of modeling or construction and certainly understand that compromise is essential if you are to get anywhere, but I'm somewhat nitpicky as to anachronisms of era and such. I judge, but don't remark.
Dave Nelson
Well, I basically have my Western Maryland Ry layout set in Fall 1954. I try to only run cars and equipment appropriate for that period with correct weigh dates and paint schemes. However, there are some paint schemes I really like that were a few years later and since I like them they are there. I do draw the line at anything post 1959 with one exception....I happen to love GP-30's so there are a few that find their way onto the rails.
I enjoy accuracy and always try to get as close as possible to a prototypically accurate model but if the manufacturer put a double row rather than a single row of rivets on the tender then I'm ok with it. Life's too short for all that stuff.
As to visitors we just have to accept that the vast majority of those picking nits probably:
1.don't have a layout
2.don't have the talent to do what they speak
3.don't matter
4.have just got to be accepted as paying our dues for allowing strangers into our world
5.also....can be asked to leave and not return if they push too much.
My 2¢,
Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works
the old train man When you learn to be satisfied with what you can afford & with what you have,then you have learned one of the secrets of happiness.
I think that you just answered one of the big questions when it comes to measuring our happiness with our own layouts. We all have to live within our means. I think most of us recognize what we can afford to invest in our layouts, both in terms of money, time and skill. However, there is no reason to limit yourself by being satisfied with what you have. If you have any spare change in your modelling budget then you owe yourself the opportunity to explore what possibilities might lie ahead. In theory at least, they are limitless!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
oldline11.don't have a layout
Roger,Not having a layout doesn't mean a modeler isn't knowledgeable. I suspect they have more time to research and study since they have the free time.
Years ago I had a small box that contain a magnifying glass and tweezers which I would hand to anybody that started nitpicking..You would be surprise how fast they got a case of lock jaw.
I know that I am nitpicky. I research freight cars that companies are making and I look to see if theirs a picture for it. If it looks right and correct paint schemes, I although look at gondola rib panels.
I model the somewhat modern 1987-2007 and watching videos and picture taken helps me what freight cars to get and what not to get.
If I knew I was going to stop in 2007 I would paid attention more to detail. Because in mid year Union Pacific changed their red sill to yellow.
Amtrak America, 1971-Present.
BRAKIEBRAKIE wrote the following post an hour ago: oldline1 1.don't have a layout Roger,Not having a layout doesn't mean a modeler isn't knowledgeable. I suspect they have more time to research and study since they have the free time.
Brakie,
What I meant by that comment was many who don't have a layout or have never built a layout find it easy to criticize someone because they haven't walked in those shoes. They fail to understand how much work, money, time and skill it takes to construct a nice layout.
I guess I've been nitpicked!
I mostly keep everything to early 50's - fall 1953. Dates on cars after that are okay as long as the car could have been built 1953 or earlier (if I ever get everything else done, I'll reletter the dates). Fantasy roads like Gorre & Daphetid are okay also, but you won't find NFL teams.
I don't usually add detail to rolling stock or engines, but use what came on it. Most of it is fairly detailed, but some is not. As long as it looks good at 3-4 ft, I'm fine with it.
Paul
I forgot to add in my post, when someone asks what era I model I tell them from 1954-2000.
I do not understand the need to find fault with the efforts of another person's labor.
To me, anyone who does this demonstrates a lack of manners, obviously not taught at an early age.
I have had clients I guided duck hunting that had British made shotguns that cost well north of $100,000. While I appreciated the craftmanship of the weapons they were not anything I wished for--my first thought was of a Cheasapeake Bay Retriever, weighing over 110 pounds tap dancing on it as it lay in the bottom of the boat.
To go to anothers house, and criticise their effors is beyond my ken. It just shows a lack of common decency and manners.
If I observed the decoys another had carved, even if it was obvious they were not of my standards, I would find something positive to pass to the person. (I would also check my spread to make sure I had not done the same thing) Knowing the person hunted, obviously their decoys worked, they shot ducks over them. I never told the person their spread looked like crap because the head and neck positions were all wrong, or the bodies were too fat, or the paint job looked horrible.
Because of geography, all the projects I have going on, and not having a desire to belong to a club, I only leave the Island when I absolutely have to. There was a time when I had a very good income, luxury vehicles, traveled extensively, stayed in the Amelia Erhart in Weisbaden Germany, Chateau Frontenac in Quebec, Peachtree in Atlanta, then my wife died, and I found that things that I percieved to be important, really weren't.
That is not to say a person should not strive to improve, but I learned that to enjoy what I had was just as important. Like some who take part in this site I have known poverty, as well as prosperity.
I just have a problem with those who feel they must look down on others to feed something lacking in their character, or ego. Everyone in this life needs an "Atta-Boy"
Off the soap box, some of what I read struck a chord that hadn't been plucked for some time. Yes, I have a layout, and yes, it looks like Miss Robins 1st. grade class put it together as a school project on a Friday afternoon, just before summer vacation.
herrinchoker
I agree with what you said Brakie and others.I have always tried to give nothing but compliments when I visit someones layout,whether it deserves it or not. The only time I said anything to anyone that found fault with my layout was years ago when this particular guy was in a club & they were looking at one of my earlier layouts & he said something about the scenery as I recall & I said well guys when we leave here we are all going to blanks house & admire his scenery. Well I had seen his layout & it had zero scenery just plywood unpainted. Since that incident I have regretted doing that & we became friends. Remember guys even a hound dog likes to be petted on the head once and a while.
Cheers, the Bear.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
herrinchokerI do not understand the need to find fault with the efforts of another person's labor.
I think you misread what I wrote..I very nitpicky when it comes to my layout and what I do use must be era specific and fully believable. I could care less what you do on your layout.
Now if the person doesn't have a layout he may still be quite knowledgeable in that field since some spend decades planing that some day layout.
oldline1 BRAKIE BRAKIE wrote the following post an hour ago: oldline1 1.don't have a layout Roger,Not having a layout doesn't mean a modeler isn't knowledgeable. I suspect they have more time to research and study since they have the free time. Brakie, What I meant by that comment was many who don't have a layout or have never built a layout find it easy to criticize someone because they haven't walked in those shoes. They fail to understand how much work, money, time and skill it takes to construct a nice layout. I guess I've been nitpicked! Roger Huber Deer Creek Locomotive Works
BRAKIE BRAKIE wrote the following post an hour ago: oldline1 1.don't have a layout Roger,Not having a layout doesn't mean a modeler isn't knowledgeable. I suspect they have more time to research and study since they have the free time.
Roger,You haven't been nitpicked. Like I mention in my above post some spend decades planing that some day layout and I will add some may have help build a club layout during that time.
I can tell you more about planing and building a small ISL far better then planing and building a basement filler but,I can give you ideas.
Yikes, this thread has all the makings of what I would consider contentious.
As for nitpicking, I don't worry about it. The only two layouts that I have ever visited were those of two of my brothers-in-laws. I lack the necessary knowledge to nitpick and those two layouts looked pretty darn good to me.
Only one other model railroader has personally visited my layout and he offered no nitpicking comments of any kind. However, if a fellow model railroader did visit my layout and offered nitpicking comments I would have to decide how to react to them....that is, accept them or ignore them.
I suppose that I would be offended if someone offered totally insulting or belittling comments about my layout, but I do realize that my efforts do not produce museum like quality, so it would take a lot to hurt my feelings.
Rich
Alton Junction
My nit picking is confined to my own layout..........
- No car/loco/auto built or maintained after 1960.
- Locos must reasonably represent the ATSF/IC. I.E., no USRA steamers with "ATSF" slapped on the side.
- Structures and such must be placed in a logical setting.
- No solar systems, dinosaurs, static models of "The General", or piles of "real rock/dirt" allowed.
That said, I have no desire to critique another's layout, unless asked - and then I would do it as positively as I could.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
The era that I model on my layout is "post war" 1946-1950. I use a lot of vehicles by CMW and so I do fudge a little bit by including a few of their 1953 Fords.
I model the New York Central railroad and fortunately today we have model manufactures like BLI, MTH and Trix that offer prototypically correct locomotives. But I have to chuckel every time I see a locomotive offered from a supplier like IHC or Mantua (for example) that are based on one railroad's prototype but lettered for another road....that never owned or ran anything like it! This biggest offender are 4-6-4 Hudsons lettered for the Pennsylvania.
When I visit someone's layout, I never criticize or nitpick their work. If they ask for advice, I'll gladly contribute.
Nitpicky you say.......... I used to be the biggest nitpicky picker of them all. All the way back to high school in wood shop class. I was so perfectionistic and nitpicky it wasn't even funny, almost like a disease. And then I carried it over into my carpentry business. I would see the tiniest little detail that wasn't right and would go seven steps backwards just to go ten steps forward again. It costed me money, Jobs are by bid. Slowly I realized that being so perfectionistic to a point of anal retentiveness was not a good thing. By my mid-thirties I got rid of all that. I realized the only one who saw the little imperfections and deficiencies was me.
So I carried that over to my model railroading. Do a quality job make it look good, then move on to something else much more productive, life is too short.
I will say that I kept my Nit Pickiness for radius easements and grades. I think that's a good place to be nitpicky.
I am modeling the 1950s transitional era. Great Northern mountain region. I will not be nitpicky about the era I picked. I built all my bridges and tunnel portals to modern era height. I love the modern low well double stackers. And I love how BNSF color schemed the new locomotives like the old Great Northerns. There will be no need to stay prototypical. I take my 50s era Great Northern stuff off, put my new BNSF stuff on and I'm good to go no worries. And I can do that for the old 1800's stuff too it's all just scenery and buildings
Take it easy Don't sweat the small stuff
Track fiddlerI will say that I kept my Nit Pickiness for radius easements and grades. I think that's a good place to be nitpicky.
I agree. Getting the trackwork right is where I do get picky. I will take up and re-lay track and roadbed to get it right.
Now a question. I once saw a display diorama that was essentially 99% correct in all railroad details. To make it 100% would require repainting a couple of switchstand targets to show yellow and green (yard tracks) instead of red and green (a main track switch), quite easy to do. No idea if they actually operated, not important.
Obviously it was an innocent error on the part of a superb modeler who was trying to get everything as accurate as possible. Should I have mentioned it?
cx500Now a question. I once saw a display diorama that was essentially 99% correct in all railroad details. To make it 100% would require repainting a couple of switchstand targets to show yellow and green (yard tracks) instead of red and green (a main track switch), quite easy to do. No idea if they actually operated, not important. Obviously it was an innocent error on the part of a superb modeler who was trying to get everything as accurate as possible. Should I have mentioned it?
That depends on the relationship that you have with the modeller and how you approach the issue.
If you didn't know the modeller and you were to take the 'holier than thou' approach by declaring loudly to everyone within earshot that you had actually found a mistake, then I don't think most of us could agree with that methodology. In fact, if it were my diorama and you did that to me, I would likely ask you to leave immediately. I might even help you through the door.
On the other hand, if you knew the modeller fairly well and had a good rapport with them, and felt that they respected your opinion, then pointing out the minor issue would hopefully be appreciated as long as it was stated in polite terms. I think most of us would recognize whether or not making the observation was appropriate based on our relationship with the modeller. In other words, if you don't know them really well, silence is probably golden.
Ultimately the safest approach is to smile and comment on the good bits.
cx500Now a question. I once saw a display diorama that was essentially 99% correct in all railroad details. To make it 100% ............. Obviously it was an innocent error on the part of a superb modeler who was trying to get everything as accurate as possible. Should I have mentioned it?
Regarding my own layout, I am quite picky about the accuracy of details and accessories, but I am much more relaxed when it comes to looking at what other people have built. It took me a while to learn, that each and everyone has the right to his own mistakes and I don´t have to be the one to point them out, unless I am invited to do so. A friend is easier lost than won!
cx500 Now a question. I once saw a display diorama that was essentially 99% correct in all railroad details. To make it 100% would require repainting a couple of switchstand targets to show yellow and green (yard tracks) instead of red and green (a main track switch), quite easy to do. No idea if they actually operated, not important. Obviously it was an innocent error on the part of a superb modeler who was trying to get everything as accurate as possible. Should I have mentioned it?
No..I wouldn't since he was 99% correct and the majority of the people viewing the layout may not notice the error anyway.
I guess the next time I get called to work I'd better tell my employer they aren't being prototypic. All their switch targets in the yard are now red.
There are a lot of generalization and conventional wisdom in the model railroad world. Some things that are correct for some, even most, railroads may not be correct for all railroads. Something may be correct in one era but not in a different era on the same railroad.
Jeff
Brakie, while in the mid-1990s any Rock Island car would need different reporting marks, Milwaukee cars with MILW marks were still in use. Soo Line inherited the marks. There may even be a few still in service today, although it's been some years since I've seen one still marked MILW.
I'm very picky about era. If I run the railroad as if in the mid 2000's or in the early 1990's, the locomotives, rolling stock, and to a lesser extent the surrounding scenery items, need to be appropriate.
I'm picky about details on locos and rolling stock not being molded on, for the most part, and strongly prefer hand applied fine details.
I'm picky about locos and rolling stock being dimensionally correct with major items being in the correct place.
I'm NOT picky at all about prototype fidelity....roadname specific details. I model a free lance shortline and most of the locomotives would have been modified to some extent by the 1990s and 2000s, or the shortline can have its own back-story reasoning for details to be where they are. As for rolling stock, I simply don't care about proto specific details and "close enough" is good enough.
- Douglas