Normally I don't ever consider putting a model company on blast, especially online like this, but I had an experience with a Bachmann Repair Center employee that I think needs to be made known.
I've got a Bachmann 45 tonner that I have had since December, and have been having serious issues with the performance.
Yesterday one of the trucks fell off when I took it out of the box. I rolled the truck on the table to see if it was binding. it was so I tested the other truck and it ran well. Popping the panel off of the bottom of the truck I figured out that if I can get the truck apart to access the gearing I can fix it, as I've done similar jobs on other models. But the trucks on the 45 tonner are oddly constructed and I don't know how to get them apart, so I called Bachmann to see if I could order a new truck or if they could tell me how to take it apart and the guy basically said:
"Let me explain something to you. Let me tell you what you should have done. You should have put it in the box and sent it back to us before you went in and started messing around and playing around inside the engine. So find your sales receipt, put it in the box and send it back. Have a nice day."
I was appalled. I barely told him anything beyond "the truck fell off and I think it's binding, is there a way to disassemble it to clean the gears." I never even went into detail about specifically what I had done or if I had disassembled it or not. I didn't even get to ask if I could order another truck, which is what I figured I'd end up doing, thinking if I ordered it by phone they could make sure that the replacement worked properly. This is the rudest, most inconsiderate condescending representative I've ever spoken to. I understand that disassembly of the locomotive voids the warranty, and wouldn't have if I didn't think I could fix the problem, however this isn't the point. If a company of any kind, let alone a model train manufacturer thinks that this kind of behavior to customers is acceptable they are sorely wrong. With Bachmann's spotty at best quality control I'm not sure if I'll ever trust their products, but I'm totally sure I now want nothing to do with them on a customer service level. I'd rather deal with a third party repair company or anyone else really that's willing to speak to a customer in a decent manner.
So what do you all think should be my next plan of action? At this point I'd like to order another truck from their parts department, but I'd like to do it over the phone to ensure whatever they send me will actually work.
I have never dealt with the Bachmann folks in the customer service department over the phone, but I exchanged a number of emails and found them friendly, responsive, helpful and fast. They even sent me a spare part - free of charge and shipping (to Germany!).
Bachmann's policy always has been, "Send it to us for repair or replacement." I think that is even in writing on the warranty card that comes with the item, and is stated on their web site.
I understand that this is Bachmann's policy and it's completely understandable for them to request for me to send it back, however doing so in such an unneccesary and condescending tone is completely uncalled for and out of line. The Sales representative was the rudest person I've ever dealt with as a customer and even though he was explaining company policy he did it in a way that was so rude and inconsiderate that I will no longer be dealing with them on any level
cacole Bachmann's policy always has been, "Send it to us for repair or replacement." I think that is even in writing on the warranty card that comes with the item, and is stated on their web site.
I do not think the OP is calling into question the policy, but how this representative went about explaining it. Customer Service is supposed to be just that, "service". I do not mean Bachmann should bend over backwards, or adopt a "give the customer anything they want" approach, but the explanation of what they can or will do for a customer with a problem should always be handled politely and professionally.
Manners, however, are not a one way street. Whenever I am dissatisfied with a product and have to interact with a companies employees, I always start with "I need to vent a little about the problems I am having with your product. Please understand that I am not mad at or blame you, but I am quite frustrated with the situation." This has almost always met with understanding between the representative and me, and the ensuing conversation remains civil, even if the resolution offered is not what I had hoped.
In the rare circumstance that I do meet with "attitude" (we all have bad days), I politely request that I be allowed to speak to a manager. If the representative is still resistant, I politely end the conversation, hang up, and call back and ask for a manager immediately (but still politely).
That would be my suggestion for the OP's next step.
Chris Ballinger
Modeling the Clementon Branch of the Pennsylvania-Reading Seashore Lines in HO scale
Instead of blasting them here, I would have reported it to Bachmann. The company is not going to stand for such poor representation. I'm sure they'll take care of you.
Jay
C-415 Build: https://imageshack.com/a/tShC/1
Other builds: https://imageshack.com/my/albums
I've since sent an email to Bachmann citing the rudeness of the representative and requesting a replacement part so I may fix the issue myself
trainguy4466........Bachmann Repair Center........
trainguy4466, and wouldn't have if I didn't think I could fix the problem,
trainguy4466So what do you all think should be my next plan of action?
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
It's best to avoid Bachmann altogether, unless you really like toys.
Aside from a few Amfleet I cars, My layout is Bachmann-free. Will never buy a Bachmann loco, not worth the trouble.
trainguy4466 ........Bachmann Repair Center........ It’s a Repair Centre not a “Dispensary for Free Advice”, there is nothing worse than trying to trouble shoot problems over the phone, especially to a customer whose ability to actually carry out a satisfactory repair is not only problematic, but a lot less than they think. trainguy4466 , and wouldn't have if I didn't think I could fix the problem, Well you haven’t! trainguy4466 So what do you all think should be my next plan of action? Get off your high horse and do what the “horrible” Bachmann rep told you to do, send it back and get it fixed or repaired, and be grateful that such a facility is readily available. I should add that that I have had nothing to do with the Bachmann Repair Centre or its employees, but know from experience how hard it is to be polite to even well meaning “experts”. The Bear.
trainguy4466 ........Bachmann Repair Center........
trainguy4466 , and wouldn't have if I didn't think I could fix the problem,
trainguy4466 So what do you all think should be my next plan of action?
JaBear, I apologize if I came off as being on any kind of a "high horse". I completely understand that the repair center's customer service isn't there to troubleshoot via phone. The point of my calling was to simply ask if disassembly of the one individual truck was possible, and if not, whether or not I could order a replacement from their parts service (which shows the part in stock, I wanted to order via phone to ensure the replacement would be functional and to protect my card a bit more).
I didn't go into the conversation as saying "Hey I think I know more than you but clearly don't so tell me how to fix this" it was more of "Hey I'm having a problem with this one part, is there a way to get to the problem or can I order a replacement." I'm not asking him to try and work out the problem via phone. I've located the problem and am only asking how to get to it. This isn't "troubleshooting" in the sense of talking me through finding the problem. It's one simple question about one specific part.
I totally respect that it can be taxing to deal with customers via phone, however calling to determine whether or not a part can be fixed/replaced on an otherwise flawless model and being talked to in the manner I was seems out of line.
I didn't realize that calling them knowing what the problem was and admitting I didn't know how to get to it made me seem like an amateurish self-certified "Expert" I'm not an expert and don't claim to be.
When the same company that has this repair center and service also has a parts department that will allow me to replace the specific part that is broken for less than the cost of what it would take to send the model back in (which as far as I can tell I will be charged at least $20 to send the model in as I don't have the receipt of sale) However I can save myself from spending anything if I can access the inside of the truck so my inquiry was more along the lines of asking them whether or not this part was designed to be disassembled without specialty tools.
Also, this whole thing is about the WAY he said it, not WHAT he said. I understand he's not there to dispense advice and I wasn't asking for it so I find it surprising that you seem to be so confident that he was justified in his tone. I've been taught through my time in customer service postitions to always be polite to even the most difficult of customers. Additionally I've learned to be as polite as possible to the people in this field as I know from experience how challenging it can be. And I was. And his response was rude and uncalled for. I NEVER report or blast anyone or any company publically or to their superiors unless I feel that my treatment as a customer warrented it. And this is the first time I have ever felt that way.
So what do you all think should be my next plan of action?
Seriously, while Bachmann is not my favorite manufacturer of locomotives, they do have a good reputation for Customer Service.
Give them another call and order the part.
Rich
Alton Junction
A friend works in the repair department of a large outfit the name of which all of you would recognize. All day long the calls and emails he gets relate to repairs and he enjoys his job, but often the requests and the people he deals with are bizarre and off putting. Many of them involve models that people have pretty clearly destroyed on their own and expect his area to fix for them. In some cases the models are decades old. Maybe you caught this particular person immediately after just such an experience. Or maybe something in the way the inquiry was phrased made it sound like you were expecting a free fix for something you caused. All of us have had bad days at work and reacted to things in ways we came to regret, I am sure. Still it is that person's job to be friendly and cheerful even when they feel anything but. There is nothing any of us can do -- only Bachmann can make it right.
Dave Nelson
Metro Red Line It's best to avoid Bachmann altogether, unless you really like toys. Aside from a few Amfleet I cars, My layout is Bachmann-free. Will never buy a Bachmann loco, not worth the trouble.
The old thinking of "Bachman Junk" and to be avoided is a thing of the past. They have made milestones in quality of their products. this is especially true of the Spectrum line of steam. I never was much of a fan of the diesel offerings, they are much better and for the price and overall running quality for fairly inexpensive pieces many will consider them for purchase. I have never had issue w/ their service and find it better than most competitors. I am thoughly pleased w/ the latest EM1, it is a remarkable piece in fine prototypical detail and quality of running.
Don't be so harsh and rush to judgement, they have made remarkable improvements.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
as an update I called Bachmann back, this time their HR department. I explained the situation and stressed that I don't think the rep meant to come off the way he had and that I didn't want to see negative action taken against him personally for something that could have stemmed from either my poor wording of what I was wanting or any other possible cause. The woman I spoke to was extremely friendly, helpful and courtious and gave my information to the manager of the parts department to order the replacement via phone. She assured me the replacement would be thoroughly checked to make sure it performed satisfactorily. Overall this experience was absolutely lovely and much more in line with my previous experiences with the Bachmann people. I'm still a bit miffed about being spoken to the way I was but I accept that we all have our bad days and that maybe today was his. In future I'll be a bit weary of calling Bachmann's Repair/Parts number for fear of a similar experience but all in all I think the people I spoke to afterwards did an excellent job in helping solve my problem
HR? Overreact much?
I had a singular experience with Bachmann's service department myself. I bought one of their recently released GP7s in January. Out of the box it ran very erratically, sometimes refusing to move in one direction or refusing to reverse with the headlights cutting in and out. I sent it to the service deptment and about a month later received a replacement which exhibited virtually identical problems. I sent it back again and this time received a phone call stating that they had tested it and found nothing wrong so they were returning it to me. I got it back and found it still had the old problems which they attributed to my power pack and/or throttle. Point is, every other engine runs fine on my system including other Bachmann engines like the S2 switcher that I bought at the same time as the GP7. In the end I tore down the engine myself, stripped out the circuit board and wired the wheels directly to the motor. I lost the headlight function but now the engine runs fine.
I find Bachmann's decoders and circuit boards leave a lot to be desired. When the 45 tonner's up and running I plan on replacing the decoder with a tsunami or loksound product. Most of my other Bachmann stuff have had their decoders replaced.
I swear some people just love to Bachmann bash like it's their (other) hobby. And I don't understand all of the hate - even their trainset quality "junk" from the 80/90's is perfectly usable, and in fact I still have my first ever diesel from them. I got it when I was 7, and it's sitting next to the track right now, ready to run should I ever upgrade it to DCC.
Their newer tooled steam engines are some of the nicest sub $500 models you can buy, and I'm quite impressed with the quality of their GG1.
RR_MelIn 2006 I bought a shay....I didn’t learn a lesson from the Shay fiasco, I bought a pair of F7 Plus a year later. I really don’t want to get into the problems with the pair of F7s that ended up in a Dumpster headed to our local Waste Dump.
I don't have any Bachmann locomotives anymore i sold them off for better but they were not bad.
Russell
trainguy4466JaBear, I apologize if I came off as being on any kind of a "high horse"
Cheers, the Bear.
The trucks are a snap fit. This stuff is mass produced in China.
Below is the diagram from the Bachmann website which has forums with company reps.
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/dwg/dwgs/85201.pdf
If you ever fall over in public, pick yourself up and say “sorry it’s been a while since I inhabited a body.” And just walk away.
"Yawn" - here we go again.
First off, Bachmann customer service people are for the most part not model train experts.
Secondly, while I often defend Bachmann, and will in some ways before I am done here, I have had a few telephone exchanges with some of the "lower level" help where I had some "issues" trying to explain a somewhat complex parts issue. BUT, I understood the fact that these people do not all have every version of every product in the line memorized. Once I got to the Service Manager, my problem was sorted out and they sent me extra parts at no charge.
Bachman's policy is simple - your not happy, send it back. If we can't fix it we will give you a new one (or we might just give you a new one because it is the fastest/easiest way to resolve the problem).
They now have an online system for letting them know you are sending something in. And they have always been effective at letting me know that they received my item, and in communicating how they would handle the problem.
Now a word or two about Bachmann quality - or the quality of any of these model trains made in China.
ANYBODY who judges by the brand is foolish. EVERY company makes some winners and some loosers. BACHMANN makes products at various "levels" in the hobby that target different "levels" of modelers. And while Bachmann quality may have had issues in the past, they are now easily on a par with most everything out there.
BUT, not every product in thier line is aimed at the part of the market targeted by GENESIS, BLI, RAPIDO, etc, etc.
I have 31 Bachmann steamers, mostly Spectrum, and 10 diesels, GE44 tonner in question, doodlebugs and GE70 tonners - out of 41 locos I have only had to return 3 - which were replaced with perfect runners.
I only have 7 BLI locos, two had minor problems, two had major problems, BLI offered NO WARRANTY solution of any kind, and had no parts to fix the two with major problems - not a very good percentage experiance compared to my Bachmann experiances.
Will I still buy BLI locos - if the price is right - yes.
All that said, there are Bachmann items I will not buy - either because they are known "dogs" or because the detail or features don't satisfy my needs.
But the Bachmann stuff that is good, is really good in my view, especially for the prices I have paid - way better "value" than most brands.
As for the OP, maybe the rep was having a bad day, maybe the OP did not realize how he came off to the rep, who knows?
But overall Bachmann works very hard to have happy customers, and I for one would not broadcast a complaint about any company without first giving them a chance to make it right.
I have:
9 Spectrum 2-8-0's
9 Spectrum Heavy 4-8-2's
4 Spectrum 2-6-6-2's
2 Spectrum 4-6-0's
3 Spectrum 2-10-2's
5 Regular Line 2-8-4's (converted to 2-8-2's)
4 GE 70 tonners
2 GE 44 tonners
4 Doodlebugs
They all run good and look good.
Sheldon
RR_Mel The Bachmann F7s may not have been Plus but they were new in the box and as I remember they cost $75 each, $150 worth of junk. I returned them to Bachmann four times for repair. They were new enough that they were a no charge repair. They never made a complete loop (90’) on my layout without one of them crapping out. I even tried fixing them, after taking them apart about 20 times there wasn’t much left after the impact on the concrete floor. A Bachmann tech called me after the fourth return and said I must have either a problem with my power supply or I need someone to help me fix my track. He was very polite even when I told him that I had 71 locomotives that work perfectly, including a couple of 50 year old Model Die Cast/Roundhouse 0-6-0s that never skip a beat. Mel
How long ago was this Mel?
10 years? 15 years? 20 years?
Did they ever just send you new ones?
Why not?
And one more question - why did you pay $75 each for them? The newest upgraded version can be bought all day long for about $55 and a few years ago they were seldon more than $40 on the street?
My list of Bachmann locos above, has a dollar cost average price of less than $90 each - for mostly Spectrum steam.
Yes, some runs of the shay had serious problems - yet I know other modelers who have Bachmann shays still running perfectly.
bogp40 Metro Red Line It's best to avoid Bachmann altogether, unless you really like toys. Aside from a few Amfleet I cars, My layout is Bachmann-free. Will never buy a Bachmann loco, not worth the trouble. The old thinking of "Bachman Junk" and to be avoided is a thing of the past. They have made milestones in quality of their products. this is especially true of the Spectrum line of steam. I never was much of a fan of the diesel offerings, they are much better and for the price and overall running quality for fairly inexpensive pieces many will consider them for purchase. I have never had issue w/ their service and find it better than most competitors. I am thoughly pleased w/ the latest EM1, it is a remarkable piece in fine prototypical detail and quality of running. Don't be so harsh and rush to judgement, they have made remarkable improvements.
Have to agree. Although I am still a diesel fan, their n scale steam now available have made me consider starting a new steam-era layout sometime.
Try and imagine the calls that Bachmann reps get each day.from hobby shops to kids,and the problems put in to them,from late, lost or damaged shipments to some guy that thinks that train set GP40 he got for his 11th birthday in 1976 should be replaced for free after it finally died.as suggested earlier,ask politely for a supervisor.and Bachmann quality has made tremendous strides over the last 25 years.remember that these days no matter the brand name, it all comes from Glorious Peoples revolution consolidated enterprise consumer Products factory
I find it interesting that Bachmann apparently treats each market differently. Bachmann (UK) products, marketed under the brands of Branchline (OO gauge) and Graham Farish (N scale) are premium products and so are Liliput products, Bachmann´s brand for the continental European markets. They don´t have to shun a comparison with the likes of Fleischmann, Roco or Bemo (narrow gauge). In the UK, Bachmann set quality standards, both in detail and engineering, making Hornby, the traditional UK brand, look rather old. I guess the European markets are more attractive to Bachmann, for reasons of economy of scale and margins.
Mel,
Respectfully, please understand a few facts:
Bachmann has never made a Spectrum grade F7, and the F7 they make now is an all new drive from 2006.
The GS4 back then was a problem child, that too has been completely re-tooled - drive and shell.
And yes, as I mentioned, several production runs of the shay had problems, many runs of the shay were fine.
I'm not defending those particular products that had problems - they did have problems.
I can't even begin to understand what the problem with those F7's was, but I don't doubt your word.
But listed above is my fleet of Bachmann, generally all very nice locos for the money, even if some people don't care for some of the design features, I have had very good luck with them, and I know lots of other modelers who have as well.
Again, judging every product today based on two or three products from a decade ago is hardly fair.
Buy or don't buy what you want, but I assure you most all of Bachmann's current products are very nice, and many have been for quite a while now.
If we use the "I had one bad experiance" or "they made one bad product" approach, no one would buy any Athearn based on the Mikados with the cracked gears - same would be true of Proto2000. But somehow we don't hear the same bashing of those two brands?