I'm jumping back into the hobby as a runner and not a collector, I have too much stuff. As I drag out the Life Like 4 axle units most of them run a foot and lock up with the dreaded cracked axle problem. Remember when the BL2 came out guaranteed for life? Walthers bought LL and doesn't honor it? I know I'm being cheap and am junking out old Blue Box wide bodies to get axles. To me the P2k units were not cheap when I bought them and everybody pitched a fit about fuel tanks on Alco's and that was fixed. Anybody else with me? Should wathers pony up?
I don't think so. Walthers continued to support those issues for some time, but I don't think that it's fair to expect them to do so in perpetuity. I don't own any Proto diesels, but have repaired many of them for friends - the parts are readily available and not especially expensive. I'd guess that those locos still having the split gear problems have been languishing on modellers' shelves for some time and are eventually popping up on ebay - probably not run for years. If you're getting them at bargain prices, there should be sufficient funds left to make the repairs.
Wayne
What he said.Seriously, I paid $35 to $50 for most of my older LL P2K diesels. Now that non-DCC diesels are up to about $150, springing a few bucks for new gears doesn't seem out of line, even taking inflation into account.
I'm also old enough to remember cutting your own flywheels, disassembling motors and rewinding and balancing the armatures, and other methods just to get the engines to run reliably, or sometimes even at all.A decent beer is four bucks, a Big Mac is four bucks, coffee is a buck and a quarter, hamburger is up to five bucks a pound for the cheap stuff around here. Having to spend a few bucks on new gears is peanuts. That's why nobody else is bothered.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
A lot of people did complain from having the same problem that you are now. Life-Like/Walthers listened, and fixed the cracked gear problem years ago. Walthers even offered replacement axles for a long time, but since these older drives have been out of production for so long, it's possible they don't even make the gears anymore. If you have a bunch of old P2K diesels that need new gears, Athearn's new replacement geared axles with nickel-silver wheels are about the best fix you can get, and they're only around $10 for a pack of 6 axles!
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By now, all of those old Life-Like diesels should have had those cracked gears replaced. And, for those locos yet to have their cracked gears replaced, replacement gears should be on hand. That's what we all have done.
I have a whole bunch of P2K locos, and I have replaced cracked gears on several. And, I have a supply of replacement gears on hand for those locos that have yet to exhibit the problem.
After Walhers bought LL and stopped providing free replacements, I bought several bags of Athearn gears, six to a package. You should do the same. Forget about Walthers honoring LL's lifetime warranty. Ain't gonna happen.
Rich
Alton Junction
Athearn drive axle Gear. #ATH 60024-six per pack.
Take Care!
Frank
I once swore off LL P2K locomotives around 12 years ago because of the crack gear problem..Fast forward today and I have two P2K SCL GP9s and several SCL/Seabord System GP38-2s.These was bought used and the gears had been replaced but,I have several Athearn gears on hand just in case my luck buying used P2K engines runs out..
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Walthers probably has the cost under $2 for these axles, maybe less. I would call them up and explain the situation. If they have good customer service, they'll send you the replacement parts. In business the customer is always right* (*within reason). When a company has good customer service, you will be more likely to buy from that company again. If Walthers is smart they will send you the replacement parts which they will make up when you buy another product from them. If they try to avoid sending replacement parts, then I would say something like, "I'll just go to Athearn and buy parts from them.". The fear of losing business should fix any problems regarding the warranty.
If they still don't send you replacement parts, I would recommend Athearn parts.
Fitter Roger:
Congratulations on getting back into the hobby.
I'm sorry but I have to agree with the others that expecting Walthers to pony up for equipment that is that old is unreasonable. Things wear out, dry up, break down...however you want to put it. If we expected the manufacturers to pay every time something broke for as long as you owned it they would have to be charging some pretty hefty prices up front to cover future losses. Just look at what current household appliance extended warranties cost.
I think Walthers deserves cudos for supporting the product for as long as they did considering the fact that they didn't create the problem.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Appears everyone agrees (Hard to believe here on the MR Forums!!!) that it's not out of line, this late in the game, that Walthers would expect you to pay for these replacement parts.
NP 2626 "Northern Pacific, really terrific"
Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association: http://www.nprha.org/
Kyle Walthers probably has the cost under $2 for these axles, maybe less. I would call them up and explain the situation. If they have good customer service, they'll send you the replacement parts. In business the customer is always right* (*within reason). When a company has good customer service, you will be more likely to buy from that company again. If Walthers is smart they will send you the replacement parts.
Walthers probably has the cost under $2 for these axles, maybe less. I would call them up and explain the situation. If they have good customer service, they'll send you the replacement parts. In business the customer is always right* (*within reason). When a company has good customer service, you will be more likely to buy from that company again. If Walthers is smart they will send you the replacement parts.
People have even posted here that they requested replacements even though they didn't even have a P2K loco - to get plated wheels to replace Athearn Blue Box sintered wheels (instead of ponying up for NWSL wheels). Waltehrs seemed to always want proof of purchase, Life Like didn't seem to care and just handed them out. I just use the Athearn gears now - I buy most of my locos on ebay or at train shows, generally for $40 or less, and I just replace the gears as I put them in service, I don;t wait for them to crack (or not, if they had previous been replaced).
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Darth Santa FeAthearn's new replacement geared axles with nickel-silver wheels
Got a link where I can buy these?
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
carl425 Got a link where I can buy these?
Frank posted it up above - Athearn part #60024. I ordered several packs right from Athearn to have them on hand.
This is just the gears - you reuse the wheels as there is nothign wrong with them.
And you DO need an NMRA gauge - you do NOT push the stub axles on the wheels in as far as they go.
Kyle,
One of the 1st things Walthers did after buying the Life-Like line of diesels is standardize future production on a 14:1 gear ratio. They have sold out/warranty replaced the old 12:1 gears years ago. Life-Like seemed to change the gear ratio with every new model. Only the old GP's kept the 12:1 gear ratio.
The only way you are going to get gears is use the above mentioned Athearn parts. You are asking Walthers to produce parts they no longer carry? Even the automotive industry is not on the hook for parts if the car is over 10 years old - This is just model trains!
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
Very minor fix as you could do a repair in about the same time as composing a response
A bigger issue for Walthers is to support replacement parts like Atlas Kato Athearn etc does with actual parts listing. Every time I call the answer is they are not available. So l stopped buying Walthers engines. Not looking for freebies just want to be able to repair what I have.
Too bad that Athearn didn't buy Life-Like.
jrbernier Kyle, One of the 1st things Walthers did after buying the Life-Like line of diesels is standardize future production on a 14:1 gear ratio. They have sold out/warranty replaced the old 12:1 gears years ago. Life-Like seemed to change the gear ratio with every new model. Only the old GP's kept the 12:1 gear ratio. The only way you are going to get gears is use the above mentioned Athearn parts. You are asking Walthers to produce parts they no longer carry? Even the automotive industry is not on the hook for parts if the car is over 10 years old - This is just model trains! Jim
All the years working on these, I never did examine/ figure what made the gear ratio changes. If the axle gear is the same on 12:1 and 14:1 am I correct to assume the change is done w/ the idler gears. is the worm the same?
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
I have had 11 NIB Proto geeps and 4 Proto SD's which I bought new for the going street price which have been in storage since then. Gurantee'd I will need wheel sets replaced one most all of them. It ain't fair yes, but I got myself to blame for not getting the wheelsets when they were being offered by Walthers - I'll have to pony up just like everyone else.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
The Athearn sets that I have bought are always in the form of a 6 pack.You buy two packs and you can do 3 four axle locos.If you do it the way I do you can do 3 six axle units by only replacing two wheel sets and leaving the sintered set (I leave the center set) to help with pulling power.These wheel sets and gears will work in any Athearn clone chassis.
richhotrain Too bad that Athearn didn't buy Life-Like. Rich
Then all the Proto engines would have those cheap bulbs !
Mark.
¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ
My understanding is only the 4 axle gp units split. Has that changed to include the sd units?
Soo Line fan My understanding is only the 4 axle gp units split. Has that changed to include the sd units?
How about the sd 50/60s?
rrinkerFrank posted it up above - Athearn part #60024. I ordered several packs right from Athearn to have them on hand.
I've got several of those. The post I asked about mentioned geared axles with nickel silver wheels. I have not seen those on Ebay, the Athearn site, or anywhere else.
We are starting to see the cracked gear issue on some older blue box Athearns, GP38-2's and SD9's that run at the local club. Most of the SD's have high milage on them and its only the plastic side frame units doing it. The older diecast side frame units havent had any issues and they are even higher milage than the newer plastic side frame engines. We havent seen any issues with P2K E units or SD50/60 units, of which there are several on the layout. Just seen the issue on SD7/9's and the GP's. Parts are cheap and easy to come by, so its just a minor inconveince when one goes down for an axle gear issue. Just gets "shopped" on the next work night. Mike
Silly NT's, I have Asperger's Syndrome
Soo Line fanHow about the sd 50/60s?
Russell
I have a 2004 or so DCC E-6 (LifeLike P2K) that I acquired that had cracked gears. The Walthers tech fellow told me it was not a problem with the 6-axle diesels but it was with this one. I found the Athearn gears (different number of teeth) would not work right and NWSL did not have the right one. The solution was to buy two new front trucks to get the gears. I recently got another DC E6 that I think was an earlier run and I've converted it to DCC and it runs fine. I don't know if it's a different gear ratio (didn't check that out when it was open).
Paul
Modeling HO with a transition era UP bent
carl425 rrinker Frank posted it up above - Athearn part #60024. I ordered several packs right from Athearn to have them on hand. I've got several of those. The post I asked about mentioned geared axles with nickel silver wheels. I have not seen those on Ebay, the Athearn site, or anywhere else.
rrinker Frank posted it up above - Athearn part #60024. I ordered several packs right from Athearn to have them on hand.
Yes, no one has those. That was what Life Like, and then Walters, was giving as replacements for cracked gears. There was a thought that the axles were too big, or the gears too small, and that caused the cracking - but the original wheels in the Athearn gears are just fine. Before Walthers, all you had to do was call Life Liek and say you had cracked gears, they'd send you 4 sets of wheels and gears. Since they are Athearn clones, you could take the wheels and use them to replace the inferior sintered iron wheels on BB locos. Unless the posts were deleted, they might still be here - many years ago, I recall people posting, more or less boasting about how they got free wheels for Athearn locos. Any wonder Walthers started asking for proof of purchase? NWSL probably sells compatible gears, and I know they have the wheels, I used them on my old BB locos. Already assembled together? I doubt anyone has that. NWSL probbaly has gears with the proper number of teeth for the other drive ratios like the E units, as well. NWSL has like everything driveline related.