bigboy what do you do when your neighbors have a good lawer and get off the hook and make fun of you everyday at least they did't touch my trains my kids were home at the time. rambo1... also the police nab them in the house but good lawyer ! rambo 1...
sorry if the conversation is of topic big boy I have enjoyed the conversation sounds like were in the same hole
i work in the aircraft industry 37 years help how about you or others? rambo1..
rambo1 bigboy what do you do when your neighbors have a good lawer and get off the hook and make fun of you everyday at least they did't touch my trains my kids were home at the time. rambo1... also the police nab them in the house but good lawyer ! rambo 1...
Don't know what to tell you. Some people with good lawyers get away with murder.
I'm trying to hold on to a community that is basically good. I don't live there any more where my neighbors were bad news. There are good areas of Los Angeles, but usually the lower cost areas attract gangs, illegals and criminals and their ilk spread onto the freeway system and the sprawling LA Area.
Maybe it's the sign of the times. Haven't you heard of the professional American football player who had gang ties and was charged with murder?
I have friends in the Eastern USA who cannot even relate to these events because of where they live.
Don't know what it is like in Canada but some areas of the USA are better than others.
Retired,not quite comfortable in the $ sense. Got an old mobile home FREE. 2/3 for the CEO's sewing and 1/3 for the layout. 14' x 64'. that gives me 14' x 22'. Hopefully will fit our budget. Lots of RR $ going into remodeling, but the light at the end off the tunnel IS A TRAIN! It's getting closer every day now. Buying mainly used equipment at fair prices and head scratching for the rest. BUT I'm having FUN!
God's Best & Happy Rails to You!
Bing (RIPRR The Route of the Buzzards)
The future: Dead Rail Society
big daydreamerIn response to the second part, you are right. Athearn makes the same Genesis models without DCC and they are generally $100 less than the ones with DCC+sound. Unfortunately they don't always the same models in the RTR line. RTR usually sees models that fit for many different railway names.
I would avoid the Athearn RTR GP40-2 since its not DCC ready and find a older released Atlas GP40-2 and go from there on the other hand I seen Genesis DCC ready GP40-2 for $99.00 (street) and that would be another good starting point..
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
i'm sorry big boy if i'm ventng on you i fell like i'm stuck i have herd about the player I don't know what it is like in LA again soory to vent on you.Rambo1...
bing&kathy Retired,not quite comfortable in the $ sense. Got an old mobile home FREE. 2/3 for the CEO's sewing and 1/3 for the layout. 14' x 64'. that gives me 14' x 22'. Hopefully will fit our budget. Lots of RR $ going into remodeling, but the light at the end off the tunnel IS A TRAIN! It's getting closer every day now. Buying mainly used equipment at fair prices and head scratching for the rest. BUT I'm having FUN!
I assume you have N-Scale in a mobile home? Unless you live by yourself.
Don't know where you live, but in Los Angeles you are required to live in a sardine can of a mobile home park, unless you live up in the mountains and there again you are confronted with the criminal element due to low cost housing and socialist policies.
In a mobile home park in LA, you have to pay rent to the property owners of the park, even if you own the home.
mobilman44I have absolutely no sympathy for those "young folks" crying over the high price of the hobby or their lack of room for a layout. If you want something, you have to work for it. And, you don't need the very best or the item "right now".
Amen...
I have no butt as I worked it off, and I am living my dream.
Excuses are just that, reasons not to try harder.
No pity to anyone that is healthy and can work.
BTW, don't get irritated at me for my attitude, remember it's people like me paying for welfare, food stamps and disability, I have a right to my opinion, as I pay for it.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Geared Steam mobilman44 I have absolutely no sympathy for those "young folks" crying over the high price of the hobby or their lack of room for a layout. If you want something, you have to work for it. And, you don't need the very best or the item "right now". Amen... I have no butt as I worked it off, and I am living my dream. Excuses are just that, reasons not to try harder. No pity to anyone that is healthy and can work. BTW, don't get irritated at me for my attitude, remember it's people like me paying for welfare, food stamps and disability, I have a right to my opinion, as I pay for it.
mobilman44 I have absolutely no sympathy for those "young folks" crying over the high price of the hobby or their lack of room for a layout. If you want something, you have to work for it. And, you don't need the very best or the item "right now".
Geared Steam mobilman44 I have absolutely no sympathy for those "young folks" crying over the high price of the hobby or their lack of room for a layout. If you want something, you have to work for it. And, you don't need the very best or the item "right now". Amen... I have no butt as I worked it off, and I am living my dream. Excuses are just that, reasons not to try harder. No pity to anyone that is healthy and can work.
I have to disagree with these statements. It's harder for someone out of college and getting into the workforce to start a layout. I graduated college in 1984 with no debt and immediately got a job. I saved for a down payment for a house while accumulating some trains. I moved into my new townhouse in 1986 and started work on my layout. I was on a tight budget but by 1987 I bought my first brass steam locomotive on lay-away. In the late 80s and early 90s wages were on the increase so I was able to increase my savings for retirement and model train purchases.
How many people who graduated college in this decade have a job in their field waiting for them, no student debt, the ability to purchase a house and enjoy nice wage increases?
Those who live in glass houses, should not throw stones.
SP&S modeler, 1960's give or take a decade or two for some equipment.
http://www.youtube.com/user/SGTDUPREY?feature=guide
Gary DuPrey
N scale model railroader
rrebellI have a freind who is on diability for a back problem and diabetes , he knows how to fix them (lose a lot of weight) but will not. He struggles finantialy but will not fix that either, even though he easily could.
Speaking of back problems way back in '89 I had my back hurt while working-I got off my tow motor to straighten a box when I clipped by another motor..
After two years of fussing with my employer(they fought my union,attorney,workers comp and me) I had two operations and about ten months of rehab I returned to work so some times the fix isn't that easy..Today I can tell when its going to rain and have lower back pain during the change of seasons and have little feeling in my feet caused by nerve damage in my lower back.
I have diabetes and its under control and I still have a sugar treat every day to prevent sugar drops. My diabetes was caused by my near fatal heart attack in 2005 that ended my working career and left me with limited use of my right hand and a pace maker/defibrillator in my chest.Still if I fail to take my insulin my sugar would climb to unacceptable levels within a few days..
I suppose some of my "friends" may have thought I should had return to work instead of accepting my retirement at 57..They had no real clue.
russ_q4b I have to disagree with these statements. It's harder for someone out of college and getting into the workforce to start a layout. I graduated college in 1984 with no debt and immediately got a job. I saved for a down payment for a house while accumulating some trains. I moved into my new townhouse in 1986 and started work on my layout. I was on a tight budget but by 1987 I bought my first brass steam locomotive on lay-away. In the late 80s and early 90s wages were on the increase so I was able to increase my savings for retirement and model train purchases. How many people who graduated college in this decade have a job in their field waiting for them, no student debt, the ability to purchase a house and enjoy nice wage increases?
Not many. I would get into the reasons this is happenning but then I would be violating the no politics rule.
What I will say is that people with more money have more options, and people with less money have less options. And then there are those with special circumstances like the LION. What do you know? It's the story of life, and it's not any different for model railroading.
Unfortunately, economic circumstances and other "factors" cause there to be more people in the "less money" group. Many other posters have said/implied that working harder and saving your money will get you what you want, but this is not necessarily true. You can't just turn up the effort dial and start having a better life. Many poor people work 2 jobs to bring in all the money they can get and since these jobs are usually near minimum wage, all the money goes toward their day to day living expenses. How do you think these people break the cycle? Go to school? They dont have money for that and they may have to quit a job to make the time for school. Get another job? They may not have the education, skills, or experience to get one any better than they have now. Move to Alberta? Maybe they could do that if they have money to move.
I could go on about why poor people are poor but I don't feel like writing an informal essay and this is making the discussion go off topic. I will just end this off with this: I am sure some readers will start loading their guns the moment I mention socialism but it is no secret that a better social safety net generally means less poor people (and less crime too).
Ok! Done! You can put your guns away!
Getting back to the original discussion, I would bet that about 1/4 or less of people who identify as a model railroader actually have a "basement empire". The space and money requirements are considerably large. I think small table top layouts are most common, especially in N scale, (people like to see trains go 'round) and then point-to-point layouts come in second. It is hard to make accurate guesses because most of the evidence we have is anecdotal.
To the OP: Do what you can to bring yourself enjoyment, because that is what the hobby is for. Don't worry about if your layout is big enough to get on the cover of a magazine. I am not judging and I don't think many others are either. To quote Red Green, "Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together."
BRAKIE rrebell I have a freind who is on diability for a back problem and diabetes , he knows how to fix them (lose a lot of weight) but will not. He struggles finantialy but will not fix that either, even though he easily could. Speaking of back problems way back in '89 I had my back hurt while working-I got off my tow motor to straighten a box when I clipped by another motor.. After two years of fussing with my employer(they fought my union,attorney,workers comp and me) I had two operations and about ten months of rehab I returned to work so some times the fix isn't that easy..Today I can tell when its going to rain and have lower back pain during the change of seasons and have little feeling in my feet caused by nerve damage in my lower back. I have diabetes and its under control and I still have a sugar treat every day to prevent sugar drops. My diabetes was caused by my near fatal heart attack in 2005 that ended my working career and left me with limited use of my right hand and a pace maker/defibrillator in my chest.Still if I fail to take my insulin my sugar would climb to unacceptable levels within a few days.. I suppose some of my "friends" may have thought I should had return to work instead of accepting my retirement at 57..They had no real clue.
rrebell I have a freind who is on diability for a back problem and diabetes , he knows how to fix them (lose a lot of weight) but will not. He struggles finantialy but will not fix that either, even though he easily could.
big daydreamer russ_q4b I have to disagree with these statements. It's harder for someone out of college and getting into the workforce to start a layout. I graduated college in 1984 with no debt and immediately got a job. I saved for a down payment for a house while accumulating some trains. I moved into my new townhouse in 1986 and started work on my layout. I was on a tight budget but by 1987 I bought my first brass steam locomotive on lay-away. In the late 80s and early 90s wages were on the increase so I was able to increase my savings for retirement and model train purchases. How many people who graduated college in this decade have a job in their field waiting for them, no student debt, the ability to purchase a house and enjoy nice wage increases? Not many. I would get into the reasons this is happenning but then I would be violating the no politics rule. What I will say is that people with more money have more options, and people with less money have less options. And then there are those with special circumstances like the LION. What do you know? It's the story of life, and it's not any different for model railroading. Unfortunately, economic circumstances and other "factors" cause there to be more people in the "less money" group. Many other posters have said/implied that working harder and saving your money will get you what you want, but this is not necessarily true. You can't just turn up the effort dial and start having a better life. Many poor people work 2 jobs to bring in all the money they can get and since these jobs are usually near minimum wage, all the money goes toward their day to day living expenses. How do you think these people break the cycle? Go to school? They dont have money for that and they may have to quit a job to make the time for school. Get another job? They may not have the education, skills, or experience to get one any better than they have now. Move to Alberta? Maybe they could do that if they have money to move. I could go on about why poor people are poor but I don't feel like writing an informal essay and this is making the discussion go off topic. I will just end this off with this: I am sure some readers will start loading their guns the moment I mention socialism but it is no secret that a better social safety net generally means less poor people (and less crime too). Ok! Done! You can put your guns away! Getting back to the original discussion, I would bet that about 1/4 or less of people who identify as a model railroader actually have a "basement empire". The space and money requirements are considerably large. I think small table top layouts are most common, especially in N scale, (people like to see trains go 'round) and then point-to-point layouts come in second. It is hard to make accurate guesses because most of the evidence we have is anecdotal. To the OP: Do what you can to bring yourself enjoyment, because that is what the hobby is for. Don't worry about if your layout is big enough to get on the cover of a magazine. I am not judging and I don't think many others are either. To quote Red Green, "Remember, I'm pulling for you. We're all in this together."
As I see it, there are three resources that this hobby consumes: time, space, and money. Time and money can balance each other. For example, if a hobbyist has limited time and ample money, he/she can hire someone to build a layout for them. If money is tight, but time is plentiful a modeler can buy used and outdated equipment and invest the time to refurbish it (this is my approach).
Space is the resource that is toughest to manage. No matter how much time or money you have for train stuff, it can be really hard to find a few dozen square feet for a work space and a layout. There are limited creative solutions for this aspect of the hobby, too. However, as Tom Landry used to tell his players "There's always a way."
I knew a guy who loved this hobby, but he lived in a small apartment. He joined a modular club and built highly detailed modules - 18 X 48 inches. Once a month the club met at a public meeting room at the library and connected the modules and ran trains. It sustained him for years until his space situation improved (by the way, he still participates with the club).
My point is that thinking in terms of what you have, not what you lack, may lead to a way to overcome whatever obsticles stand between you and your goal. Use time and money to balance each other and think outside the box when it comes to space.
Phil, I'm not a rocket scientist; they are my students.
My financial situation is my own business and no one else`s...................this thread should have been deleted from the start.
Dennis Blank Jr.
CEO,COO,CFO,CMO,Bossman,Slavedriver,Engineer,Trackforeman,Grunt. Birdsboro & Reading Railroad
This thread is not about model railroading at all; it's about peronal finance. Many, if not most, personal finance problems result from a person's attitude and outlook on life. You have to learn to be happy with what you have and not covet your neighbor's goods, or some of the amazing layouts in MRR. Magazine subscriptions, pencil and paper, and a library card are pretty cheap. If you don't have money and space to dedicate to a MR now, save your money and plan for it later. Don't forget that a small bookshelf layout can be quite enjoyable and can keep you occupied for years. Use your time to build your career and earn money for that future big layout.
If you can find it, pick up a copy of MRR with John Allen. The thing that impacted me most about that book was John's financial habits. Per the book and the MR/RMC interviews with his friends, John was very frugal and always lived below his means. He scratchbuilt almost everything on his famous layouts. He received a modest inheritance ('roughly one year's income for a middle-class family') when he was a young adult. His brother, who was an accountant, invested it for him. By middle age, between his personal savings and investments, he was able to work part time and eventually retired early to completely to focus on his MR. John Allen was a bachelor and seems to have had few interests outside railroads and MR, which made it easier for him, but the lesson there still applies to everyone.
rrebell BRAKIE rrebell I have a freind who is on diability for a back problem and diabetes , he knows how to fix them (lose a lot of weight) but will not. He struggles finantialy but will not fix that either, even though he easily could. Speaking of back problems way back in '89 I had my back hurt while working-I got off my tow motor to straighten a box when I clipped by another motor.. After two years of fussing with my employer(they fought my union,attorney,workers comp and me) I had two operations and about ten months of rehab I returned to work so some times the fix isn't that easy..Today I can tell when its going to rain and have lower back pain during the change of seasons and have little feeling in my feet caused by nerve damage in my lower back. I have diabetes and its under control and I still have a sugar treat every day to prevent sugar drops. My diabetes was caused by my near fatal heart attack in 2005 that ended my working career and left me with limited use of my right hand and a pace maker/defibrillator in my chest.Still if I fail to take my insulin my sugar would climb to unacceptable levels within a few days.. I suppose some of my "friends" may have thought I should had return to work instead of accepting my retirement at 57..They had no real clue. No, not the same situation at all, his doctor told him all this, sure he might get a twing now and then on his back but it was caused by lifting the wrong thing and there is nothing major wrong with his back. He was always heavey but once hurt, gained alot!!!!!!!!! You on the otherhand were actually hurt. As far as his diabetes, doctor told him to lose weight!!!!!!!!
No, not the same situation at all, his doctor told him all this, sure he might get a twing now and then on his back but it was caused by lifting the wrong thing and there is nothing major wrong with his back. He was always heavey but once hurt, gained alot!!!!!!!!! You on the otherhand were actually hurt. As far as his diabetes, doctor told him to lose weight!!!!!!!!
Well, fighting diabetes is far more then losing weight..Its a constant fight against hidden sugar in foods that looks "healthy" but,checking the label one will find its high in sugar,cholesterol and trans fat..All three are bad.
It takes discipline to eat healthy and a lot of folks doesn't have that discipline.
I eat a lot of Healthy Choice and Weight Watchers "Smart One" meals..They are healthy,filling and you will lose weight with nothing more then a evening and morning walk..
Big Boy ForeverSince I am not in that comfortable position I want to know if there are Model Railroaders here who have limited "Time" and "Space"
Compared to many people in the US & Canada [not to mention the entire world] I guess I can consider myself quite fortunate. I'm 5 years away from retirement and have a not-too-shabby retirement portfolio, as long as I can stay with my current employer for these remaining five years. I still have kids in college and that gobbles up a significant chunk of my income, but I've been gradually building up my collection of mrr assets since my early thirties, and have a converted two-car garage to house my layout.
However, I live in central Maryland, which has one of the highest concentrations of wealthy families in the nation, plus a large number of Federal workers who were able to retire in their early fifties thanks to the generous Gov't pensions. So I'm ashamed to admit, I still do have an occasional envy attack when I go to op sessions with some of these guys. But I can be quite content with the modest "empire" I currently have if I avoid comparing myself to them.
-Ken in Maryland (B&O modeler, former CSX modeler)
CSX_road_slugCompared to many people in the US & Canada [not to mention the entire world] I guess I can consider myself quite fortunate.
I have told my kids many times that in Canada, a person on welfare still has a better life than a whole lot of the rest of the world. Anyone that does not agree has probably never had a passport and/or travelled much. Living in any developed country opens up endless oppourtunities for any healthy person. It is all about choices. You can either be a person that "lets things happen" or a person that "makes things happen".
I still am close with a hand full of friends that I have known since we were old enough to go outside and play. We are all retired or close to it. The chickens are really coming home to roost for some of these guys.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Not retired? Yes.
Financially cxomfortable? Yes.
David Parks I am the terror that flaps in the night!
BATMAN a person on welfare still has a better
Russell
To boil it all down, dedication will help you succeed, no matter what your persuit!
rdgk1se3019 My financial situation is my own business and no one else`s...................this thread should have been deleted from the start.
Obviously you are missing the main point here.
It's that model railroading is not restricted to those who are well off financially as has been demonstrated by the multitude of posts here.
You see all the equipment, technological gizmos, new products etc., that cost money, and are accessible to those financially set, yet you have the best salt of the earth model railroaders, some handicapped, creating ingenious layouts on a shoestring budget, just for the inner satisfaction that model railroading brings.
That is the heart of model railroading and what keeps it alive.
Big Boy Forever That is the heart of model railroading and what keeps it alive.
Are you referring to the first part or the second part? but seriously, don't answer that question here. I can already see a flame war starting.
I think we can be satisfied that this thread has fulfilled its original purpose. Let's not wreck a good thing.
Big Boy ForeverYou see all the equipment, technological gizmos, new products etc., that cost money, and are accessible to those financially set, yet you have the best salt of the earth model railroaders, some handicapped, creating ingenious layouts on a shoestring budget, just for the inner satisfaction that model railroading brings. That is the heart of model railroading and what keeps it alive.
Absolutely and will for the years to come.
Years ago I was a member of a club that had one member and his "collection" was was two Athearn BB B&O GP7s,1 B&O bay window caboose..He was highly skilled at scenery and was especially good at making trees..IIRC he was a baker at a large baking company (Kroger?) in Columbus,Oh.
We pooled equipment for community operation.