TO FORUM MODERATOR - How about closing inappropriate topics?

[Pruitt]

Isn't there some sort of rule against posting non-model railroading topics on the forum?

If not, let me suggest that you create one, and then immediately close all threads that violate that rule.

More and more, it seems I have to wade through a bunch of silly, useless topics that are at best only marginally related to model railroading.

A prime example of what I would consider an inappropriate topic is "Who are you voting for?" That's this one: http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22791

Another example of an inappropriate topic is "Call of Nature" - http://www.trains.com/community/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22562

There are many others that could be classified as inapproriate as well, such as "Who here is a firefighter?" and "Screen name meaning?."

If this is a forum about model railroading, how about keeping to that subject? PLEASE??

And while I'm whining, here's one more: Are the post counts and stars with each post really necessary? All they do is encourage pointless posts, and contribute even more to the already somewhat puerile feel of this board.

Thanks,

[Anonymous]

This is not the first time this topic has come up. Although I somewhat agree, I wonder whom would be the brain-cops doing the weeding!?! Some of the posts are "puerile" as some of the posters are young folks! I find it fairly easy to avoid these posts by reading the SUBJECT and passing by those which appear "puerile"!

Thanks for giving me the word "PUERILE"! Now, if I could only figure out how to pronounce it?

[Fergmiester]

The question I would pose to you is: Where do we draw the line? This has come up on several occasions, as you probably already know. And the answer that comes back is that this is a general discussion forum for Model Railroader related stuff. If the moderators come down hard then it would be seen as a form of censorship. Yes they are well within there right but at the same time this forum is attempting to foster camaraderie and a sense of fellowship within the hobby. This to many of us is our virtual club as most of us are either too busy or too distant to be part of a real club.

Yes some topics are not directly MR related but if they bring us together for the common good of the hobby then have they not earned a right to be part of this forum? And maybe this is where the answer lies. Those topics, which could erode the fellowship, should be deemed inappropriate and dropped.

For instance The Coffee Shop though not always MR related has given me the opportunity to meet people I wouldn't have other wise met. I've met two to date, one from the area and the other from Texas. This to me has earned the merits of being appropriate as it "fosters the fellowship within the hobby".

Hopefully a compromise can be reached so that we can all partake in "The Worlds Greatest Hobby".

Regards
Fergus Francey

[Junctionfan]

Some of the off topic stuff is very informative because than I know how people think and respect them more for it. I like to get to know people; that's how we make friends.

The forum would be a boring and unsuccessful place if we all talked formal and purely stuck to the topics. We would run out of things to say and in time end up just doing something else.

I like the forum and for the most part, what people have to say.

Andrew Little

[Pruitt]

"Puerile," in its most common usage, implies childishness or immaturity, while NOT particularly referring to young people.

The "brain cops doing the weeding...." would be the forum moderator, of course! And I believe that person has on occasion posted requesting that people stop posting non-model railroad topics.

As far as "fosters the fellowship...." and "common good..." - Folks have posted here that they were leaving the forum permanently because of the non-model railroading posts, the sometimes childish banter, and the obvious count-enhancement posts are out of control. How does alienating folks with this stuff foster fellowship? I doubt seriously that putting a political poll on this site foster's anyone's fellowship regarding model railroading, in the long run.

Sounds like some folks have more need of a general chat room than a model railroading forum.

[Anonymous]

Posts that are innappropriate are virtually always policed by the members. The voting post, if you read the replies, has been roundly rebuked as something not wanted here by the vast majority of members, so there's no need for the moderator to do what the membership is already doing. If profanity or offensive material is posted, then the moderator usually deals with it, as he should. I don't care for some stuff that posted, but I'd rather deal with it through a reply than getting a third party involved. If that doesn't work then yes, it's time to bring the moderator in. Until then, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[twhite]

I for one don't mind most of the topics presented, but let's call the police off, okay? For instance, Mark mentioned "Is anyone here a firefighter" as an inappropriate topic, but did you read the posts, Mark? It was basically about incorporating that honorable profession somehow into a model railroad scene. My own post was about incorporating the US Forest Service into a Sierra Nevada-based railroad with a Ranger Station, lookout tower, equipment, etc. This means I have to MODEL it--largely from scratch. This also means I have to experiment with techniques to re-create a small forest fire at one spot on the layout. It's part of my model railroad--so how can that topic be considered "off-topic?" And as far as the younger set posting "peurile" comments--they're just getting INTO the hobby and for the most part, feeling their way around, just like we did at their age. Our job is to encourage them, not put them down because their comments may not seem as mature as ours.
Ease up, Mark. This is a good forum.
Tom

[Jetrock]

Having spent quite a bit of time in hobby shops, while most discussions are about trains, occasionally the topic will shift to anecdotes, jokes, or even politics sometimes. I don't see how the forums here are that much different.

I don't bother participating in threads that don't pique my interests, and generally don't participate in non-train-related threads, but sometimes I find them worthwhile. If the signal-to-noise ratio got so bad that there were very few model railroading related posts I might think it was a real problem, but as it is, it doesn't seem like that big a deal.

The "nature's call" thread, while definitely a silly post, was model railroading related--it related an anecdote that occurred while the poster was working on a model railroad, with inconveniencing results. The post could have easily been offensive or obscene, but the poster didn't use profanity or graphic detail, and maintained a light-hearted tone. The end result was a post that wouldn't be out of place on daytime TV, and I'm sure at least a few of us could relate--it is, after all, something we all do.

And it should also be noted that, since the early days of Usenet, posts complaining about off-topic posts are in fact off-topic posts themselves, and therefore part of the problem, not the solution.

[bcammack]

I think appropriateness is entirely subjective. Additionally, inappropriate topics usually fall off the active pages pretty quickly. If they don't then they mustn't have been that inappropriate.

[Anonymous]

Brunton wrote : "How does alienating folks with this stuff foster fellowship?"


Why should you feel alienated? Are you a social outcast?

I say the moderators pull THIS thread.

Jim

[BRAKIE]

Speaking as a moderator on three forums I found you just can't please everybody.Those that get upset and leaves a forum over petty things to my mind needs to grow up and understand they can't always have things their way or perhaps need to learn to weed out want they don't want to read.Of course some is just looking for any excuse to quit a forum instead of just leaving if they are not happy..Of course you have those that want to hear "Please don't leave yada,yada yada." A ego trip perhaps? I don't know the reason.
A forum is for everybody's enjoyment and not just the whiners or complainers.
Now,if it was up to me that one political topic would be locked and then deleted as it has nothing to do with model or real trains or the hobby in general.
As far as the screen names that has shown up on other forums including the old Atlas forum so its no big deal.Stars and post counts? Again no big deal.People will post anyway..
As for this topic it would be locked and then deleted.Reason? It is up to the moderators to decide what is or is not acceptable according to the forum rules of conduct ..And that is the way it should be.

[n2mopac]

I would contend that this "General" forum is not so much a model railroading forum as it is a forum for model railroaders. Some of the posts you mention (screen name meaning, who is a firefighter, etc.) actually gives us a chance to get to know something about other model railroaders, who they are, what motivates them, etc. While I myself have complained, even railed, about the large number of these posts compared to the small amount of responses to substantive modeling topics, I still believe that these topics are relevant and should not be "censored." (Yes, I used the "c" word.)

I have to agree that some topics are beyond my taste and view of what is appropriate. I had a problem with the call of nature thread. But, as stated by someone above, the membership here tends to shut these down pretty quickly. If you look at the voting thread, you will see that no political arguments have broken out there (thankd goodness) but it has turned into something of a joke. Is it model related? No. Does it help us get to know other model railroaders? Maybe. My suggestion is, if you don't like th topic, don't open it.

Ron

[Big_Boy_4005]

My question to you Mark is, what makes this topic any different from those about which you complain? It seems to me that you haven't spent enough time here to really get a feel for how this forum is moderated. This forum simply isn't run that way. The pure model railroading content you suggest would become rather dry and in-human after a while.

If you have ever been in a train club, you would understand that every conversation is not about trains. Posting this topic here and now is like walking into the club after being away for two years, and complaining about the way the layout was built or operated.

QUOTE: The "brain cops doing the weeding...." would be the forum moderator, of course! And I believe that person has on occasion posted requesting that people stop posting non-model railroad topics.

On this, I believe that you are mistaken. Perhaps you were on a different forum when you heard that message. Bergie has never said any such thing that I have heard. If you prefer your forum more censored, I suggest the OGR forum. I've heard good things about that there.

[Big_Boy_4005]

QUOTE: Originally posted by n2mopac

I would contend that this "General" forum is not so much a model railroading forum as it is a forum for model railroaders. Some of the posts you mention (screen name meaning, who is a firefighter, etc.) actually gives us a chance to get to know something about other model railroaders, who they are, what motivates them, etc. While I myself have complained, even railed, about the large number of these posts compared to the small amount of responses to substantive modeling topics, I still believe that these topics are relevant and should not be "censored." (Yes, I used the "c" word.)

I have to agree that some topics are beyond my taste and view of what is appropriate. I had a problem with the call of nature thread. But, as stated by someone above, the membership here tends to shut these down pretty quickly. If you look at the voting thread, you will see that no political arguments have broken out there (thankd goodness) but it has turned into something of a joke. Is it model related? No. Does it help us get to know other model railroaders? Maybe. My suggestion is, if you don't like th topic, don't open it.

Ron

I really like the distinction that you have made there Ron. When you get down to it, this really is more about the people than it is about the trains. The trains are what we have as a common starting point.[^]

[Javern]

i think this is a moot, if the above mentioned topics were inappropriate the mods would have locked or yanked them already. It's their webspace, their rules, if a posted topic doesn't look interesting to you don't read it.

[lupo]

QUOTE: Originally posted by deschane


Thanks for giving me the word "PUERILE"! Now, if I could only figure out how to pronounce it?

mark, maybe this will help:
try this link: http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/audio.pl?pueril01.wav=puerile
or if that does not work for you try ;
http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary?book=Dictionary&va=PUERILE&x=15&y=14 and click on the speaker. [(-D][(-D][(-D]

[Anonymous]

Yes, some of these topics are not directly train related, or are they? The Made In China topics, while starting off talking about modelrailroading manufacturers matured into a very intersting economic discussion. I personally think that this is very interesting as our hobby can be a microcosm of society as a whole, including economics. If where our trains are made induces one student to learn more about international trade and the like, then isn't it a good thing? The voting topic is interesting also. It is very obvious that upon reading the posts that our hobby is made up of a diverse group of people. I think that's good also (and our political leadership can determine where future mrr products come from - ie: 30 years ago dealing with China would not have been possible).

Are they off topic? Maybe. But when clubmembers sit around and shoot the bull - are they spending 100 percent of their time talking trains?

[Pruitt]

QUOTE: Originally posted by BRAKIE

As for this topic it would be locked and then deleted.Reason? It is up to the moderators to decide what is or is not acceptable according to the forum rules of conduct ..And that is the way it should be.

Hmmm... looks like Brakie wants the moderator to censor me for having the audacity to ask that they review the topics and close the ones that aren't related to model railroading. Sounds kind of like the pot and the kettle to me....

QUOTE: Originally posted by Big_Boy_4005
My question to you Mark is, what makes this topic any different from those about which you complain? It seems to me that you haven't spent enough time here to really get a feel for how this forum is moderated. This forum simply isn't run that way. The pure model railroading content you suggest would become rather dry and in-human after a while.

My answer to you Big_Boy_4005 is, This is about model railroad - related topics on this forum, therefore it is clearly related to model railroading. I'm simply asking that, on the Model Railroader forum, topics not relating to model railroading be closed.

I take it from your remarks about not having spent enough time here that you equate constantly flapping your keyboard on the forum with spending time on it. Take a look at the date you joined, and the date I joined. I've been here since nearly the beginning. You joined just shy of a year ago. I've probably spent at least as much time here as you have, and I've also seen the forums evolve. I understand at least as well as you how the forum is moderated. Some of us simply prefer to say something only when we have something TO say.


To all who have replied:

Yes, I did read posts in the topics I mentioned. I didn't read all the posts.

In my original post I said "There are many others that could be classified as inapproriate [oops - inappropriate]..." I could have been clearer by saying "There are many others that could perhaps be classified as inappropriate..."

And there have been people who have left because of all the superfluous stuff here that isn't related to model railroading, or where the relationship is tenuous at best. I haven't left. I don't feel alienated (at least not yet). But some have because they did. When things reach that point, where is the vaunted "fellowship?"

So I asked the moderators to review the topics and close the ones THEY think are inappropriate (I only gave some examples of ones I thought might be). The moderators will do what they feel is appropriate.

And I don't think asking a moderator to review parts of a forum, for whatever reason, is ever inappropriate.

[Junctionfan]

I think you need to lighten up a little. Life is too short to establish protocol for something that is supposed to be fun. This is no question period at the Senate, just a bunch of folk being friendly and trying to have a good time.

If it is that bad, do what some of the folk on the magazine part of the forum have had to do, e-mail Bergie. We have had to do this because of swearing but this isn't really that major. As far as subject matter is concerned, the only thing that Bergie seems to take exception to is politics and religion discussion-that's understandable.

I hope you can learn to have fun with the rest of us, we may go off topic from time to time but we are really a bunch of good people trying to me friendly and social.

[vsmith]

I'm actually glad the "VOTING FOR" topic got nuked....Someone said something that after reading I dismissed as a bad joke then upon reflection got a bit offended and was going to post a reply to clean his clock! But now, its gone and good riddence. I have gotten in trouble here on this very forum when I someone asked me why I hated a certain public figure so much, I explained it to him and got the topic nuked faster than you can say "Jack Mack and the Heart Attacks!"

This is a Hobby forum and I understand how bringing something devisive as Politics in is just not a good idea. I try to keep my political, social, and religious views to myself. I resent others who insist of pushing there beliefs on me and would not push mine onto others. So I stay on topic now. I'll joke around but I dont want to get into any real mud-slinging events anymore.

The SINGLE biggest reason I am still a LONE WOLF modeler today and do not socialize much with others in the hobby is that eventually Politics or Religion get brought into the fray, and "Oh you didnt vote for the so-and-s0" or "You dont believe THAT religion" type issues get brought up and it just goes to Hell on a tobagon after that...Thats the danger here, it just gets people devisive, bitter, and creates the same social/political/religious cliche's that have in my opinion screwed up the country.

If you want to discuss Politics or Religion or Social Values there are hundreds of sites for just that. Cklick on any new network forum and you can type away all you want to say.

As for me...just to clear up my position.

Political Party - Monster Raving Loony Party ( Originally created in England, Mr. Graham Chapman and Mr John Cleese our first party nominies)

Social Viewpoint- Usually scoping the room looking Cool sipping a Gin and Tonic!

Religion - upstanding member, 24hr Drive-Thru Church of Elvis, Las Vegas, Nevada.

Thank'ya Ma'am....[8D]

[Anonymous]

Boy, I'm glad I don't live next door to a couple of the people here.

There's always that one house on the block where the people are always calling the police because they hate thier own lives, and they don't want anyone else having fun.

We are not perfoming brain surgery on children here ......we're playing with trains! This is not important. Lighten up!

And if "puerile" implies childishness or immaturity, why not use one of the the words that everyone is familiar with? You impress no one, but yourself.

Jim Lederer
NJ

[Pruitt]

Maybe you're right, Junctionfan, maybe I do need to lighten up. I've been trying for a few years now not to get too cynical, and maybe I haven't been as successful as I would have liked.

Here's another idea - many boards have a forum specifically for personal, non-subject-related posts. Myabe there should be one here. Several folks have mentioned that the Model Railroader forums are like their "club." Why not a forum dedicated specifically to just that - conversations not necessarily related to model railroading. Call it "The Club," maybe. And limit this forum to more on-point (but still general) model railroading topics. That way, the folks for whom this forum is a social hour will one dedicated to precisely that function, and the curmudgeonly people like me won't have to wade through the "club" type posts.

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith



Religion - upstanding member, 24hr Drive-Thru Church of Elvis, Las Vegas, Nevada.

Thank'ya Ma'am....[8D]

Would that be Pair O' Dice by the the dashboard lights.........


thank you, thank you very much

[dharmon]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ironmine

And if "puerile" implies childishness or immaturity, why not use one of the the words that everyone is familiar with? You impress no one, but yourself.

I thought puerile was a setting on the blender......



Sorry..it's just my inner....stop that! .....put the scissors away!...sorry, inner child coming out again...

[Anonymous]

I thought that was what Viagra is for ......... puerile dysfunction.

Now don't freak out Mr Model Railroad Police Chief (and his deputies here), Viagra has become mainstream, during Major League Baseball, NFL, NHL, etc

[Anonymous]

I had a lady that lived across the street from me growing up that made it her mission to see how often she could get the cops called on me because I had a band that practiced in our attic. were we loud? YUP! Was it causing a disturbance in the neighborhood? Yeah, in all honesty it was. But did she get anywhere by being hostile and tattling on me to the cops? Nope. Actually, it made me worse! If she had been friendly about it and used a little diplomacy, I know things would have been different. Same thing here. Brunton, if you jump on people and come across as a grump, you'll get nowhere. I'm not trying to get in on a dogpile against ya, I'm just being honest. Are you right? Yeah, and since Bergie pulled the voting post I guess that verifies your concern. But there is such a thing as winning the battle and losing the war...
My wife taught me that [B)][:D]

[bcammack]

Forum readership and content are like water. They seek their own level based on the forum moderators and their actions. There are innumerable model railroading forums available and so people tend to gravitate to the ones that suit their personality and interests.

It's impractical to anticipate that you can somehow coerce a forum to suit your sensibilities. As the cartoonist/philosopher B.Kliban once wrote, "One man's mate is another man's person." [:)]

[Anonymous]

I bring nothing to this forum. I just got started in HO trians some months ago, and I found this place and learned much. Both of my sons play football, which is like a full time job, and things got delayed. After all this time, I'm just now buying a DCC system (we have been working things with and old MRC transformer).

So, I always read everything here, but I am in no position to help anyone, hardly. When an "off-topic" thread gets started, then I can sometimes say something. It makes me feel like I belong, a little.

There's nothing wrong with it. Its like a bunch of guys putting a roof on a house together, or out back shooting clay birds together, or building the benchwork for a train layout together. And some subject comes up, which has nothing to do with roofing, or shotgun loads, or trains. And you talk a little about it, crack a few jokes about it, and then its over.

What's the big deal?

Jim

[AntonioFP45]

QUOTE: Originally posted by yankeejwb

I had a lady that lived across the street from me growing up that made it her mission to see how often she could get the cops called on me because I had a band that practiced in our attic. were we loud? YUP! Was it causing a disturbance in the neighborhood? Yeah, in all honesty it was. But did she get anywhere by being hostile and tattling on me to the cops? Nope. Actually, it made me worse! If she had been friendly about it and used a little diplomacy, I know things would have been different. Same thing here. Brunton, if you jump on people and come across as a grump, you'll get nowhere. I'm not trying to get in on a dogpile against ya, I'm just being honest. Are you right? Yeah, and since Bergie pulled the voting post I guess that verifies your concern. But there is such a thing as winning the battle and losing the war...
My wife taught me that [B)][:D]

[#ditto]

[Anonymous]

well.. I am a long time member of the Atlas forums and spend a lot of time there but I have to say.. this forum, by far, has a very high concentration of valuable threads.
I have found it to be useful with little fluff.