Bachmann: Quality of accuracy/operation

[ATLANTIC CENTRAL]

Tom, the point is simply this. 

If Bachmann or anyone makes a model that is correct for roadname "A", than that is NOT a "generic" model. Even if they then letter it for roadnames B, C, D, E and F - correct or not.

Or in Bachmann's case often the model is correct for roadnames A, B and C, and roadnmaes D and E are stand ins, sometimes close, sometimes not, then again, the term "generic" does not apply in my mind. 

It may be considered incorrectly lettered for D and E, but it is not generic if it is correct for A, B and C.

And maybe that is symantics to some of you, but a "generic" model would be something like a Model Power/Mantua Classic 4-6-2 - not truely an accurate model of any Pacific, but rather a combination of features and demensions from several different locos.

Honestly my armchair comment was directed at riogrande who has often turned up his nose at lessor priced/detailed models yet admits he does not have a layout at present.

Sheldon

[tstage]

ATLANTIC CENTRAL

If Bachmann or anyone makes a model that is correct for roadname "A", than that is NOT a "generic" model. Even if they then letter it for roadnames B, C, D, E and F - correct or not. Or in Bachmann's case often the model is correct for roadnames A, B and C, and roadnmaes D and E are stand ins, sometimes close, sometimes not, then again, the term "generic" does not apply in my mind. It may be considered incorrectly lettered for D and E, but it is not generic if it is correct for A, B and C. And maybe that is symantics to some of you, but a "generic" model would be something like a Model Power/Mantua Classic 4-6-2 - not truely an accurate model of any Pacific, but rather a combination of features and demensions from several different locos.

I see your point, Sheldon.  While the overall term "generic" would be more appropriately coined to a Mantua locomotive as you outlined, I would still have no problem stating that a certain model was a "generic stand-in" for another RR's locomotive because they are so very different.

As far as the arm chair comment, since you didn't specify a whom, I could only assume you were saying it to both me and rio.

Tom

[mlehman]

ATLANTIC CENTRAL

Honestly my armchair comment was directed at riogrande who has often turned up his nose at lessor priced/detailed models yet admits he does not have a layout at present.

I don't think one has to have a layout to gain the right to comment. Lots of folks are between layouts, operate at a club, or simply collect models.  riogrande is building right now, so his will be back soon enough, if you need that particular credential.

It's true some of the crustier denizens of the foums don't have layouts and that may explain why we never see any pics of anything they do, despite their claim to expertise on just about anything that ever turned a flanged wheel in 1:1 or any other scale.

But that sorts itself out. riogrande isn't impressed by Bachmann, fair enough. Some days are like that for me....then I think of the ones that do run good. When you're cheap you gotta take yer chances.

[BPoi]

ATLANTIC CENTRAL

Your definition of "reasonable" and someone else's definition of "reasonable" may actually be an "unreasonable" assumption. Given that Bachmann's 2-8-0 Consolidated is "generic" by your own admission and should be the same - no matter which railroad line is represented - in my eyes the Bachmann Durango & Silverton & UP 2-8-0 Consolidateds pictured below is NOT a "reasonable" stand in for an NYC 2-8-0 Consolidated and, therefore, NOT for "all the roadnames offered".

 

Considering the fact that former D&RGW 493 was a K-37 class narrow gauge Mikado, which never would've operated on the now Durango & Silverton segment of the former D&RGW due to bridge limits, I'd agree with your assessment that it's not a reasonable stand-in for ANY Consolidation.

 

Pedantic Bruce

[alexstan]

For a sub$150 locomotive, the Bachmann Berkshire I would have to say, is among the best running loco in my fleet.

[riogrande5761]

DavidMBedard...  I didn't mean to feed Sheldon's insecurities but apparently did by accident.  But, you said it better than anyone could have ... 

Disclaimer for Sheldon:  My comments about Bachman are limited only to the diesel line - NOT at Bachman steam - going forward, please remember I am not talking about Bachman steam when I comment on Bachman.

Everyone else, please try to ignore those treadmarks on my back where I was just "stepped on" by the no-layout put-down.

Bachmann has made substantial improvements in the past 8 years or so in both chassis quality and paint jobs.  There is a segment of the hobby community which will be quite happy with them but they aren't for everyone.  I believe thats a fair generalization.

[Thommo]

My only Bachmann diesel was Spectrum GE 44-tonner, "cute" model of the very interesting prototype. Only Bachmann made those in HO. It is a good runner, not DCC ready in a simple way, but without question in my "line" to be digitalized.

In the last few months, I added two Alco S-4 switchers from the new Bachmann line, one PRR Sound Value equiped, and one ERIE, DCC ready. Both are great runners, smooth, with silent motors. Manny road specific details, even! (type of headlights, stack, lettering...)

As I payed less then $100 for sound one, and less then $50 for the silent one, i think they are GREAT value for the money.

True, they do not have all the delicate details present on more expensive models, but as I have 5-year old wanting to play with my trains, I do not find it big minus - less details to be in danger of breaking!

[BRAKIE]

riogrande5761

Bachmann has made substantial improvements in the past 8 years or so in both chassis quality and paint jobs. There is a segment of the hobby community which will be quite happy with them but they aren't for everyone. I believe thats a fair generalization.

Absolutely..I owned 2 Bachmann a GE70 tonner and a S4 with sound.

Here's my personal thoughts..Why buy(say) a Bachmann GP30  since a LL P2K GP30 can be had for a few bucks more? I've seen Bachmann GP7/9s on e-Bay for the same BIN price as a LL P2K GP7/9.Even some on line shops the price of the Bachmann Geeps is more then a LL P2K Geep on e-Bay or at train shows.

Don't overlook the older Atlas red and yellow box locomotives since those can be had for the same prices.

I do plan on buying a Bachmann DCC/Sound GP9 whenever they decide to release it.

[Paul3]

Sheldon,
You said, "The USRA 4-8-2 is very accurate in all the paint schemes it was offered in with the exception of the Southern Pacfic version."  Sorry, at least in regards to the New Haven, that's not an accurate statement.  The NH got the first 10 USRA Light Mountains (3300-3309 on the NH), and Bachmann released their USRA Light Mountain in 3301.  The Bachmann model is off in several ways.  The running boards on both sides of the boiler are wrong in shape, size, and location.  The dual air pump is in the wrong place by 5 feet or more.  The air tank on the fireman's side is supposed to be in front of the air pump, not behind it.  The air tank on the engineer's side is supposed to be over the rear driver and not the front driver.  Then there's the tender trucks.  The NH's used Commonwealth trucks instead of the Vulcan trucks on the model.  The Bachmann model isn't "very accurate" in my mind.

And as you know, I have a 25' x 50' layout that runs quite well (we just had an 8-man ops session last week).  Am I allowed to comment?

Paul A. Cutler III

[mobilman44]

I've owned a lot of HO Bachmanns over the past decades, and have two Spectrum 2-8-0s.   IMO, you really get what you pay for, especially in their higher end line (i.e. Spectrum).  Their locos and cars are a good value - but they are not on the same level as their higher priced "counterparts" like BLI and so forth.

If they have what you are looking for, I would not hesitate to get it.

 

[riogrande5761]

Paul3

Sheldon,

And as you know, I have a 25' x 50' layout that runs quite well (we just had an 8-man ops session last week).  Am I allowed to comment?

Paul A. Cutler III

Looks like yours is longer than his, er, I mean more square footage so you pass the test.  You are a real model railroader and can comment.

[Doughless]

Georgia Flash

A couple of adages: "You get what you pay for"; "Buyer beware; if it looks too good to be true, it is".

With that said, I have seen recent ads for Bachman-brand low-priced locos and rolling stock. Several items fit my current needs. Earlier (1980s) experiences with Bachmann were disappointing. Therefore, I am hesitant to purchase because I am not confident about the quality in terms of scale-accuracy and/or operation of Bachmann products. So...

Are there recent reviews and experiences with the current generation of Bachmann locos and rolling stock? Based on quality, why shouldn't I purchase?

Scale-accuracy?  Don't know what that means exactly.  Handrails and body shells are very scale-accurate in the new releases.

Apparently, some are concerned about getting road-name-fidelity from a non-preorder, mass produce, company. Hmmm...not sure I understand why anyone would expect to get it.

As far as operation, Bachmann has been upgrading their line-up and have improved their locos operations.  Most of the ones recommended by others are newer designs and models.

Some hold overs include the GE 70 and 44 tonners..I just bought another one, and they all seem to suffer from cracked axle gears.  Their GP30 and 35 are outclassed by the competition, and run poorly, IMO. 

I've had 2 GP38/40's and they run great.

As far as steam, i think anything that they advertise as having "smoke" is a hold over from the trainset days and tend to run poorly also.  Spectrum steam and the newer sound-value releases are very nice.

[trainnut1250]

 

About Spectrum steam:

Bachmann is it for small steam!!  If you are looking for small steam that runs well and has good detail, (With the exception of Mantua and MDC) Bachmann is pretty much the only game in town in HO right now other than brass.  Their 2-8-0, 4-6-0, 2-6-0 (standard line), 4-4-0 and 3 truck shays are all great values.  The detail certainly matches or surpasses early brass and they run great out of the box (unlike most early brass). 

They are somewhat generic for most lines but that is going to be the case unless you go to brass because steam was so specific to the individual railroad.  Most of these locos were/are available for under $100.00 w/o DCC and under $200.00 sound equipped.  The 2-6-0 was under $100.00 with sound from some retailers when it first came out!!.   A great deal in my book. 

Quality can be spotty but I have only returned one loco out of 11 that I have purchased.  All of the others run very well.  Make sure that you purchase from a retailer that will let you return out of the box duds for a replacement and you’re covered.

One of the several 4-6-0s on the layout

Your mileage may vary,

Guy

[ATLANTIC CENTRAL]

Paul3

Sheldon,
You said, "The USRA 4-8-2 is very accurate in all the paint schemes it was offered in with the exception of the Southern Pacfic version."  Sorry, at least in regards to the New Haven, that's not an accurate statement.  The NH got the first 10 USRA Light Mountains (3300-3309 on the NH), and Bachmann released their USRA Light Mountain in 3301.  The Bachmann model is off in several ways.  The running boards on both sides of the boiler are wrong in shape, size, and location.  The dual air pump is in the wrong place by 5 feet or more.  The air tank on the fireman's side is supposed to be in front of the air pump, not behind it.  The air tank on the engineer's side is supposed to be over the rear driver and not the front driver.  Then there's the tender trucks.  The NH's used Commonwealth trucks instead of the Vulcan trucks on the model.  The Bachmann model isn't "very accurate" in my mind.

And as you know, I have a 25' x 50' layout that runs quite well (we just had an 8-man ops session last week).  Am I allowed to comment?

Paul A. Cutler III

 

I was refering to the USRA Heavy, admittedly I neather have nor know much about the accuracy or running qualities of the USRA light 4-8-2 from Bachmann, but I understandfrom others it is correct for the Southern Railway locos.

Once again this is why I object to generalizations by brand, they all make winners, they all make loosers. Better questions would be "I am interested in a Bachmann Spectrum C&O 4-8-2, is it an accurate and good running model?" - answer overwelmingly YES.

Similar question for the following Bachmann models:

C&O H-4 2-6-6-2 - the domes are not perfect, but other wise it is real good/real close, runs nice.

C&O/NKP/W&LE USRA 2-6-6-2 - very accurate and good running model.

C&O/NKP/PM Berkshire 2-8-4 - very well detailed for being in the regular line, could use a little weight, but weight is easily added, road specific details all very close to correct, correct domes, cabs, tenders, etc for each roadname, sound ready tender.

USRA HEAVY 4-8-2 N&W - very correct "as delivered" version, runs great, pulls very well.

B&O EM-1 2-8-8-4 - better and more accurate than any model ever made of this loco, and all the other models of it are brass - runs well and pulls well.

USRA LIGHT 2-10-2 (various roads) - correct or nearly correct tenders, air pump placements, running boards, driver types, and more for all the road names offered. The prototypes of these locos went through a lot of changes in details and ownership, so as produced by Bachmann some represent the locos as they appeared for only a brief moment in history, but I did some pretty extensive research on these before deciding to add them the ATLANTIC CENTRAL fleet, and they are all real close or perfect.

Ma & Pa 4-6-0 and 4-4-0 - both spot on perfect and run nice.

And the list could go on - and it could include those not so accruate ones as well.

But the point remains, the generalization of "generic" is patently false.

Sheldon

[richg1998]

Bachmann has come a long way since it went to China. lol

 A few geezers still remember the bad days for Bachmann. Iam one of them.

 My HO 44 ton and 70 ton with sound are excellent runners. The steamers are quite nice now.

 Just saw a good review of Bachmann products in the MRH forum

 Rich

[BRAKIE]

riogrande5761

I didn't mean to feed Sheldon's insecurities but apparently did by accident.

Jim,First I want to apologize..I left this out of my last reply.

 

I think that might be a two way street for some.

Ever notice how topics on the lessor models is always but,always interrupted by those saying  this or that not right,they're incorrect for blah,blah,blah etc when the topic at hand is dealing with generalities about a brand and not exactness to scale?

I wonder why that is?

On another forum I mention I collected the older Bev-Bel/Athearn,Athearn and MDC IPD short line boxcars and was immediately told my cars are either a foot to wide,incorrect boxcar style etc,etc and so on and there are correct cars available..

The reply did nothing to enhance the subject  of the topic since the topic was on the subject of collecting  and not fidelity to scale.