Hi to all! I'm in the process of re-writing my will as my last one is somewhat ineffective (done right as my wife and I got together). So I'm asking all of you out there that have thought of such things for ideas regarding model train things.
my wife and I have briefly discussed these things. She has no idea about trains and such, and while I think it's nice to leave everything to her, I don't like the idea of creating any headaches. She says she might try to find somebody to "finish the layout" or "get use out of it", meaning something with as much enthusiasm, passion and drive shouldn't go undone/unenjoyed. While I understand her thoughts, I've also told her from a practicality standpoint, it's not a very good layout. Inclines, bad trackwork, no pre-thought, etc,... it was done before I had any idearegarding such things, many of which I have learned here and am "compensating" for now.
Anyway, I'm looking for ideas in a Last Will that may simplify things for her. I am already kicking the idea around of some sort of inventory or cards, one for each piece, stating what it is and modifications done to it, with the idea of resale info, thinking if she were to try to sell this stuff she would have an idea what everything is. I started that a while ago with some rolling stock but am only about 35-40% done.
Any other ideas you, the model RR community, can advise of is welcome; I'm at a point in life that thinking of one's mortality can not be taken for granted, and I want to do right by her! Please, offer help or ideas!
Thank you all in advance, and as always, happy RR'ing (even if I put a damper on things!)
Duane
Her hobbies are not your hobbies, and your hobbies are not her hobbies. I wouldn't put anything in the Will about them.
However, the card inventory sounds OK.
The best I would expect to happen when I go, is my wife will get a hold of someone at the model RR club and a few guys will come in and rip out the layout for her for the price of keeping the Tortoise switch machines. They can take the other stuff and sell at the consignment tables at train show(s) and keep some percentage for their work and effort. Otherwise it will all get dumped in the trash after some period of time. Once you are gone, you won't care what happens to it.
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
I believe that you and your wife both agree that she doesn't want the actual trains (except perhaps for a favorite to remember you by). So, they are just other bits of property that she inherits that needs to be disposed of. I see no reason to put this in the will. Allow her and the executor the flexibility to do as they see fit.
What might be really good is to supply her with suggestions, in writing, on how to deal with them. And suggestions don't go in a will. And you can modify them at any time with no legal input. Just tell her where to find what you wrote when you pass on to that big layout in the sky, and she can use your advice to her best advantage.
Depending on how you and she feel about it, you might first go over the document in case she has questions that you can answer while you're still here. That conversation can make some people kinda sad, so that would be up to you if you did or didn't.
Ed
Duane...While it does happen, we as modelers can not expect our spouses or children to have the same level of enthusiasm for the hobby as we do. In my view we need to make this transition as easy as possible. In order to make it easier this to be dealt with, my desires as expressed in my will are simple: Keep what you want, but sell the remaining tools, models, etc and donate the proceeds to a specified historical society. Of the books, videos, photo and other like collections again keep what you want, but directly donate the remainder directly to a specified historical society.
Charles
singletrack100I'm in the process of re-writing my will as my last one is somewhat ineffective (done right as my wife and I got together). So I'm asking all of you out there that have thought of such things for ideas regarding model train things.
LION has standard monsatic will and durable power of attorney. Not my problem : Let the Abbot worry about it.
Abbot Brian said when I die the whole thing gets thrown out anyway.
I will make a list of what is of value and could be salvaged and what is not and should be tossed.
Beyond that... The Big HO layout in the sky will certainly do.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
Going back to the inventory idea, I operate with car cards and waybills. Every piece of rolling stock has a card, and each card has that item's complete pedigree and history on the back. Any purchaser would get the card with the car (locomotive, EMU, DMU.)
If you have suggestions as to how to dispose of what, they can be 'included' as a non-binding attachment to the formal will. The main body of the will can leave everything to your wife, "To dispose of as she sees fit (See attachment #whatever,) The same can deal with any other special items or collections.
As for me, I have a grandson and three great grandsons, all train crazy and all mechanically competent. I doubt that my rolling stock will get to E-bay. As for the layout, the recycling center accepts steel studs...
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - for the forseeable future)
My trains and layout along with my many modules are listed in my will to go to my train club. Two of my nephews work on a railroad and are not interested in them.
Thank you all so far for your input. I agree, this hobby is not hers, and she makes no bones about that. She does, however, want to see it go to some sort of use by others that will enjoy it, not in the trash. There are no model RR's that I know of within about a 200 mile radius. I don't expect her nor wish her to keep it all, especially the layout intact. She has indicated some sentimental value, though what that is is up to her to decide I agree.
Would leaving a list of websites, such as this one, Tycoforums.com, others, with the will be appropriate, or just cards with each piece and leave it ot her and Ebay to figure out? Leaving "values" of everything seems like such a revolving issue...
I know she gets it all. I'm just looking for some type of advice for her as to how to "dispose" of it accordingly, without her being taken or ripped off. If I knew some model RR'rs in the area, I would talk to them, but alas, none around here- FWI Sip code 85938, Springerville, AZ,.... in case someone out there is lurking that I don't know about!
Thanks, Duane
Tomikawa TT, I like that, something like that works... keep sending the ideas guys, I appreciate it a bunch!
If you donate items to a tax exempt club, your wife could get tax credit for the value of the items donated. If you make up a list to go with the donation, they can acknowledge receipt and she gets to assign the value. If your list contains the value, she can use that. Obviously claiming full purchase price (unless it's a collectable item) probably would not fly well with the IRS, but a reasonably discounted amount should be accepted.
I have donated some excess items and ones that don't fit my current plans to a club and was able to claim a reasonable value for them.
Hope you have to revise your list many times before she or your children have to use it.
Good luck,
Richard
Thank yo cowman for the kind words, and thank you Lion as well for sounding off. Though your situation may be slightly different than mine, I really do appreciate your input as well. Thank you all!
When it comes to the Last Will and Testament, there are several ways to dispose of property including hobby supplies and equipment.
Absent any special valuation as a "collectible", and most model railroad layouts are not considered collectibles, the usual way of disposing of such items is through the use of a "personal property clause" in which items of tangible personal property, including hobby supplies and equipment, are left to the surviving spouse, or to children in equal shares.
Another way to handle special items, perhaps such as layout and related items, is to make a "specific bequest" in the will in which the layout and related items are to be distributed to the named person or persons.
A third way would be to make a charitable bequest, say to a historical society or not-for-profit club or museum or the like.
Beyond that, as others have mentioned, detailed instructions and notations, etc. should not be included in the will. The best way to deal with details is to set out in writing, in a separate written instrument, your wishes and your directions for the disposition of your layout, hobby supplies and equipment, and other related items.
Moving away from the legalistic to the pragmatic, be realistic. No one wants your layout, and even the structures are difficult to deal with. Items of value are the electronics, locomotives, rolling stock, some specialty track work, books, etc. Keep the boxes that these items came in, because they include descriptions of these items.
Rich
Alton Junction
I added mine to my will they will go to my Grandson since he is a modeler..
If my Grandson wasn't a modeler I would have still added them to my will with instructions to sell them and split the money evenly between my son and daughter.
Sorry,but,I seen to many kids fuss and fight over things that wasn't include in their parent's will.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Selling piece-meal on e-Bay is a lot of work, especially if you do not have the knowledge to accurately describe items or value them. Tracking the auctions and packing and shipping items adds to the work - work that an older woman not particularly interested in the hobby necessarily wants to deal with. However that is the tried and proven way to get maximum value for your stuff. What is not worth selling or doesn't sell on eBay goes in the dumpster.
Selling everything in one lot to a dealer or buyer will likely bring in around 20-25% of value. And she will probably have to have the layout taken apart and thrown in the dumpster.
I would take an honest look at what you have, and what it might be worth. Then sit down with her and decide what route you want to take. The two of you need to very open and honest about how much work she is going to be expected to do, and what her return on her time is going to be. If she wants to go the eBay route, a detailed inventory with enough information to put the item up for sale will be worth its weight in gold. Similarly, a good inventory will add value to a single lot sale because the buyer will have a better idea of what he is getting.
My instructions to my wife are to solicit bids from the club and Craig's list for the entire display cabinet and contents, along with the train chest drawer contents. Even if she only gets $200-300 for the lot, that's easy money. The rest - pay a local teen or handyman $50-100 to remove and haul to the dumpster. Then get on with the rest of her life.
my thoughts, your choices
Fred W
In my will, I've asked that someone trustworthy be hired to come in and box up all of my engines and rolling stock and that all of it along with my layout be sold either on ebay or through an auction house. I also have over 350 high end Franklin Mint and Danbury Mint model model cars that are to be done the same way. It really bites that we can't take our cool stuff with us. If however I figure out a way I'll get back with you... :)>
Tracklayer It really bites that we can't take our cool stuff with us. If however I figure out a way I'll get back with you... :)>
It really bites that we can't take our cool stuff with us. If however I figure out a way I'll get back with you... :)>
Like the Pharaohs, I plan to take my worldly possessions with me to the after-life. So, the layout, will be buried with me. My main concern is that there my not be any LHS in the Great Layout in the Sky.
I would suggest looking into creating a Living Trust instead of a Will. Although Wills are generally easier and less expensive to draft, a Living Trust has features you can't get with a Will. One key feature is avoiding probate court.
However for your specific situation, without giving out personal and financial details, a Will may suffice.
So just a suggestion to read up online about Living Trusts and see if it is an option that may suit your needs.
Matt from Anaheim, CA and Bayfield, COClick Here for my model train photo website
Southwest Chief I would suggest looking into creating a Living Trust instead of a Will. Although Wills are generally easier and less expensive to draft, a Living Trust has features you can't get with a Will. One key feature is avoiding probate court. However for your specific situation, without giving out personal and financial details, a Will may suffice. So just a suggestion to read up online about Living Trusts and see if it is an option that may suit your needs.
For most model railroaders, a Will should suffice. A Living Trust is really not suitable vehicle for distributing tangible personal propery. A Living Trust and a Will are not mutually exclusive documents. They are used together in estate plans.
A Will is a practical necessity for distributing tangible personal property. Yes, property distributed under the Will is subject to probate, but probate is no longer a process to be avoided as it once was. Nowadays, most states have statutes providing for Small Estates Affidavits which minimize the cost and time delay typically associated with probate. Unless the layout and related items have some special value as collectibles, a Will with a personal property clause will suffice quite nicely.
richhotrainMy main concern is that there my not be any LHS in the Great Layout in the Sky.
Rich, just send me a list before I croak and I'll bring the stuff with me when I come.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
I left the specifics out of the will but I informed my wife and my executors that the trains could go to my wife's cousin Wayne or if he is deceased to him son Adam to do with as they see fit. They are both train collectors and will appreciate it. By not putting it in the will my wife and executors are free to do something better if they have an idea
Joe Staten Island West
Joe, if you have a will with a personal property clause (and almost all do), the executor has a fiduciary duty to distribute all of your model railroad stuff under that clause unless you specifically exclude the model railroad stuff.
Thank you all who have replied, even the joksters ! It's all appreciated very much. I may just sit down with my wife in the future and talk about it. She is in Germany right now spending time in her homeland and wont be back until just before mid-January. Many of you have indicated leaving trains out of the will and having a "plan/agreement" discussion; that might be the best case scenario.
In the small bit of research I've done, in Arizona, everything goes to a spouse first if there is no will in place. Wills do not have to be notarized, only witnessed by two. I don't have a lot of anything like real estate or big savings, retirement plans, investments or any of that stuff (unfortunately- all the money goes to feeding horses...and a race car once in a while if there is a little extra, been 3 years for that...), so the whole will affair should be pretty straightforward.
I again thank you all for your time and consideration in this matter. I really do appreciate it a bunch! Thanks!
Happy RR'ing! Duane