RR Car Ferry Project

["JaBear"]

Well I’ve been threatening a catch up and here it is. Those of you who have a look at WPF will have seen these before, so sorry nothing new.

Putting the ladders to use......

 

 

...after attaching the crows’ nests......

 

 

....a coat of paint and a trial fit....

 

 

... starting one of the rear superstructures...

 

 

...another trial fit and have you spotted my mistake????

 

 

The things we do for fun, 180 + stanchions later....

 

 

....more superstructure and trial fits....

 

 

....... and even more superstructure and another trial fit.

 

 

So what was my mistake? Well when I was setting up the track and funnel superstructure, I used a 40’ Athearn BB box car as my clearance test car. Stupid especially as I had accessed photos that clearly showed 50 footers, and TOFC cars on board. So I had to chamfer the front corners of the forward funnel support, and reposition the ladder to get the required clearance.

Of course if I had had this photo.....

http://rockontrains.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/cnr-depot-and-ferry-dock-windsor-ont.jpg

.......I would have narrowed everything up, I did consider it but then I would have to relay the track and to gain 3/32” extra clearance, no thanks.

One of the many good things about that photo is that, if the accepted date is 1953, I don’t have to model the “hydraulic ram on the weighted arm of the apron counterweight mechanism.

The use of the passenger cars to test clearance was brought about by gmpullmans reminisce on his 1973 experience of crossing the Detroit River on a GWT ferry in a C&O private car. Though 1973 is far in advance of my modelled era, I wondered if the Lachlan River RR ferry had the clearance to cope with such a request. It can but do not go sticking yer head outa the window!!

Thanks for looking,

Cheers, the Bear.

[Marc_Magnus]

Gidday Marc, your kind remark is appreciated. I must applaud you not only for your prize winning ferry, but also your innovative use of Lego. Thanks for sharing.

Cheers, the Bear.

 

Thank you for your answer, after some research I have found this more close picture of the Anabel Ferry, I will do some others in the coming days, showing the Lego hull and more close details to share them.

Cheers, Marc

 

["JaBear"]

Gidday Marc, your kind remark is appreciated. I must applaud you not only for your prize winning ferry, but also your innovative use of Lego. Thanks for sharing.

Cheers, the Bear.

[Marc_Magnus]

Nice work and nice scratchbuilding.

I did the same years ago in Nscale, a copy of the car ferry Anabel of the late John Allen.

It started by clothing a Legoship whith wood and details and a modified hull,the result wa a price winning model in Nscale.

The picture below show it.

 

["JaBear"]

I see it’s been 9 months since I last posted here and while the pace has been glacial, I have achieved just enough to warrant an update.

The counter weight mechanisms have progressed. As you can see I’ve guesstimated the scale from the available photos, and Google maps.

 

 

I got to this stage of construction when I happened to find on Google Street View a side on view of the counter weights on the Windsor side, complete with people in the foreground to help as a reference, where upon I reckoned that my dimensions are a bit on the small side and that’s when work ceased on that part of the project while I contemplated a starting again.

 

 

I guess I’m allowed to nitpick my own work, but I should really harden up and get over it as it would appear that there is no standard design as every railroad seemed to have at least one design of their own, and while similar, even the two survivors at Windsor are different. As already noted, the pace has been slow, I don’t need to make excuses to procrastinate further.

 

 

I made these hatch covers for the coal bunkers and access to the boiler room, while I have photos of the Detroit, and a small plan for the Pere Marquette # 10 and 14, it is not really clear on which hatch is used for what or the construction of the hatch covers, so I’ve guessed again using the logic (???) that the coal bunkers would be amidships to minimise any changes to the ferry’s trim as the coal was consumed. I started playing with the funnel and supporting structure at the same time.

Does anyone have an idea on coal consumption, and was the ash taken off in a gondola or just dumped overboard? While my idea for the ferry was as a form of interchange, I hadn’t considered that servicing the boat would require operational movements in its own right.

 

 

I dithered over how to make the cowl ventilators, in fact I went completely off the boil, so to speak, and started on the truss rod idler flats, but having had some encouragement to think outside the box I am quite pleased with the result which has had the bonus of renewing my enthusiasm for the ferry itself again, so have recently completed the ladders I require for the funnels and supporting superstructure.

 

 

Thanks for looking,

 Cheers, the Bear.   

PS. I hope Karle has made better progress.

["JaBear"]

Well a bit more of an update, I’ve now got to the stage where I consider that the apron can now go into storage.  I’m reasonably happy how it’s turned out, may do some more weathering after final assembly.

 

 

 

 

 

But I do have a question, in George W. Hiltons The Great Lakes Car Ferries there is a picture of the attaching mechanism on both the Lake ferry Badger and the apron. Did the Detroit River car ferries use the same or similar mechanism Or did they just use mooring ropes

 

 

I’ve now started on the apron counter weights, not sure if that’s the right terminology, and of course I have another question. In the closer up photos I have found of, presumably the aprons on the Detroit side, there appears what I think looks like a hydraulic ram about half way down the weighted arm. Am I right, if so was it used to help raise and lower the apron, or as a shock absorber, or am I barking up the completely wrong tree

I am continuing on regardless, like I have said before, it’s highly unlikely anyone who’s actually seen the Detroit Car Ferris in action will see my layout, but I would like to do it reasonably right and am also curious.

 

Cheers, the Bear.

["JaBear"]

rws1225 , that cheers me up, I had wondered about car size, especially looking at that Shorpy photo I had linked to earlier in this thread.

Flynn, even though I believe that plans maybe obtainable, I am building a freelanced composite of the Windsor and Detroit (4 track version), partially because of time, but mainly because if I had plans, I would feel obliged to try for a museum quality model which I question my abilities to carry out.  It would be different if I was modelling the Wabash instead of a freelanced road.

Thanks again Gents,

Cheers, the Bear.

P.S. I did get some more done on the apron today.

[Flynn]

I might have a few photos of the PM aprons in Detroit and Windsor on another computer at home. If I can find them, I'll PM you.  It looks like you're modeling a Wabash river ferry though.  Any particular one?  

[rws1225]

Bear, keep in mind that the capacities shown in Hilton's book are "as built" often with much shorter cars than in later days.

["JaBear"]

Gidday rws1225 and Flynn, thank you both for your input.

The River Ferries Pere Marquette #14, 12, and 10 had three tracks, with a car capacity of 30 for #14, and 27 for both #12 and 10, where as the Wabash Manitowoc, Windsor and, Detroit, had four tracks, with a car capacity of 32, though the Detroit was originally built with three tracks.

Google maps still show the two “intact” 3 tracked Wabash apronsand the concrete remnants of, I presume, the Pere Marquette apron approximately 200 yards downstream.

 There are some reasonably good photos of the Wasbash Detroit aprons and yard, but not the Pere Marquette, or a  general over view. Still I should be grateful for what’s available.

Couldn't load more than 27,.

 

 Thanks again, Cheers, the Bear.

[Flynn]

Rs1225 is correct on the loading sequence for the Detroit river ferries.   They had three track decks with two track aprons if I recall correctly.   NO locomotives on the aprons or the ferry though. 

The Lake Michigan ferries had four track decks by and large.  Their loading sequence was very similar.  Half on one center track and then full on the other center.  Finish the first center half and repeat for the outer tracks.  Again, idler cars only on the apron or ferry.  Loading sequences did require some coordination of car weights too.  Hope that helps.

 

[rws1225]

Somewhere I have seen information regarding the balancing of the load.  On a 3 track ferry the sequence is half of one outside track; all of the center track; all of the other outside track; and finally the rest of the first outside track.  I watched the Pere Marquette ferry in Port Huron, MI in the 60s but the memory is dim.

I saw something similar on the 4 track lake Michigan ferries of AA and C&O in the 70s.  There are videos of loading/unloading Ann Arbor boats; I think I got one from AA Techincal & Historical Society.

[MisterBeasley]

I built 3 Tichy flatcars to use as "idler flats" on my carfloat scene:

I built the Walthers carfloat and apron kits.  You can see the flatcars beyond the tankers.  I found I needed 3 of them to reach the cars on the carfloat without letting the engine get on the apron.

In theory, if the engine never goes on the apron, then you don't need to power either the apron tracks or the carfloat tracks.  I did the apron anyway, as it was a small job, but the carfloat is not wired.  The Walthers kit actually comes with plastic rail, not metal.  I replaced that with metal rails, though, to reduce rolling friction and make the job of pulling the strings of cars easier.  I also took great care to keep the approach tracks, apron and carfloat dead level.

["JaBear"]

Gidday Fritz, your reply is much appreciated. Even though I’m freelancing the car ferry and operations, with the likely hood of anyone who served on or even saw a Detroit car ferry in operation visiting my layout is up there with similar odds to winning the lottery, I find the more I get into a project like this the more I find interesting and would like to know.

 The trouble is that in their day the Detroit car ferry operations were just a routine daily occurrence, and like so many other jobs, considered not worth recording by those carrying out the tasks, that is if they could be bothered after a hard days work, and who outside the job would be interested anyway?  I suspect that this problem would not be new to you considering your work with the Pere Marquette Historical Society.

Once again, any information received is greatly appreciated,

Thanks and Cheers, the Bear.

[fmilhaupt]

I can't answer the loading sequence question with anything other than speculation, but given how important it was that the boats maintain a more-or-less even keel so that they can match up with the apron at the far end, I'd have expected them to have been emptied, then re-loaded so they could keep an eye on the amount of list to either side.

Capt. Hannifan, one of the captains of one of the NS Detroit River ferries attended an operating session that my group held a couple of years ago.

He told of a trip he took from Windsor to Detroit back in the 1970s (when it was an N&W boat) when the load wasn't balanced very well laterally-- too many heavy cars were loaded on one side of the ferry. As a result, it had so severe a list to one side that they could not get the apron on the Detroit side to match up.

Their solution was to go back to Windsor and have the crew that loaded the ferry figure out how to fix the problem they caused. He said that it involved block and tackle and lots of cursing.

I'll see whether I can get hold of him (he's a friend of an friend) and ask.

As for keeping motive power off of the boats, they could definitely send locomotives across (as you've seen), they just had to be careful loading. The issue wasn't the amount of weight itself, but how concentrated the weight was, on a shorter wheelbase.

The Ann Arbor exchanged locomotives between the AA at Frankfort and the Manistique & Lake Superior at Manistique whenever the M&LS' power needed major servicing work that the M&LS couldn't handle itself.

The C&O and the GTW each kept a locomotive at Milwaukee to unload their ferries. When they needed major servicing, or just to be rotated out for other power, they'd go across the lake on one of the big boats.

If I remember correctly, the CP kept a couple of its CLC-built road switchers around longer than they might have because they had greater clearance beneath their traction motors than the GMD and MLW-built locomotives. This was useful for the ferry service on Kootenay Lake in British Columbia, where the diesel would ride the ferry to reach the trackage at the far end. Several published photos show an H16-44 (or similar locomotive) creeping across a partially-submerged apron to board the ferry for the ride up the lake.

This wouldn't have happened regularly at Detroit-Windsor, however, since the CN and CP switched the ferries on the Canadian side, while the GTW, C&O and N&W (or GTW, PM and Wabash, earlier) switched the ferries on the Detroit side. Each road provided its own locomotives.

 

["JaBear"]

fmilhaupt

......."Best Installation of a Peco Turnout".....

Gidday Fritz, in my last post I mentioned, “that every task takes at the very least 3 times longer than I initially think”. Well getting the filler to blend in, and  look neat and tidy without gumming up the works is taking longer.

Kyle, it’s well worth inserting this link again as it shows the use of idler cars   .... http://teamtrack.soforums.com/t625-CAR-FERRY-around-MICHIGAN-State.htm

I am still trying to find out the actual sequence of how the Detroit River Ferries were loaded and unloaded, was all the cars taken off and new cars loaded, or was one ferry track emptied and filled before moving to the next??? Anyhow “with Care” would have been the operative words as in The Great Lakes Car Ferries, by George W Hilton there are photos of the St. Ignace and the Ann Arbor No:4, both Lake Car Ferries, the former sunk at the slip and the latter capsized, as a result of incorrect loading of iron ore cars. 

 

During my research on ferry operations I have came across photos of locomotives on the car floats / ferries particularly in the New York region, though, and, of course I can’t find it again, a Geep 7 or 9 on a car float somewhere in, if my memory serves me correctly which it doesn’t all the time, the Pacific Northwest.

Thanks for your comments,

Cheers, the Bear.

 

[Kyle]

On the trains magizine website, they mention ferry operations, and if I remember correctly, some railroads prevented locomotives from going on to the ferries for safety reasons, and they would have several empty cars in between the locomotive and the cars going on the ferry, so the locomotive would not get on the ferry.

[fmilhaupt]

Bear, your ferry gets my vote for "Best Installation of a Peco Turnout" for 2014, even if the year is a bit young.

["JaBear"]

Gidday. Well I’ve made a bit of progress so it’s time to bore you all with an update. When I scaled up the small drawing of the Windsor I decided that the waterline at 21mm (.823 in) looked about right and would suit my purpose for three  reasons,  (1) as previously mentioned, the ferry is going on a modular layout and has to be transportable, (2) for operations the ferry will depart from the docking apron, and (3) though I’ve ventured into hand laying track, hand laying points is currently a no go area.

 

(I have been aware that hand laying points was commonplace in bygone years, and have been informed through this forum that there is FastTracks....  http://www.handlaidtrack.com/... but I consider I was very lucky being able to purchase track spikes locally and besides I like to physically see what I’m getting myself into before spending money, yeah I know I’mbasically whimping out.....)

 

So I am going to stick with what I know, Peco Code 100, .....http://www.peco-uk.com/.....and by inserting a SL-E98 Large Radius Y into a cut out in 3mm (.118in) MDF and then laminating it on to the “structural” part of the hull would achieve the “thickness” I desired and to that end I purchased a 18 x 300 x 1800mm (.708 x 11.81 x 70.86 in) laminated, finger jointed, clear pine panel, (made in, of all places Chile, heck the town I live in derives at least half its income from forestry!, so go figure??), to which I laminated my 3mm  MDF to. However when I joined up the apron to the hull it just didn’t look right so I laminated another layer of the 3mm MDF to the bottom.

Again, the size of the Y was just a guess but I figured that a Large is what I required so that I could change the direction using my big mitt without, hopefully, clobbering the superstructure. It also could have been an Insulfrog turnout as, for operational purposes, it is my intention that locos will not be allowed to go on to the loading apron, so any electrical contact is not necessary.

 

As with the lifeboats I used my sander/ belt linisher and MK1 eyeball to give me the hull form, though looking at the photos, it should be a lot more complex than I’ve made it.

A small ironing board or a large skate board ???

 

 

A Half track???

 

 

Work in progress (do I have enough spikes???!!!)

 

 

A carfloat on the "Red Sea".

 

Am I still enjoying myself?? Well yes, though I managed to wind myself up by thinking that I was going to possibly run out of track spikes, thinking that the amount that I had generally managed to mangle and or bend beyond redemption would be what I would need to finish, and then the hassles and Expense of sourcing a bag from the States, and the resultant time delays!!! I actually have ended up with some left over, no I haven’t counted how many, so was worrying about nothing.  Another thing, and I really should know better by now, is that every task takes at the very least 3 times longer than I initially think. 

 

Thanks for looking, Cheers, the Bear. 

[mlehman]

I’m not going to let that stop me though, at least this hobby allows me I to make things up as I go along. Off Topic

Dang straight. That's also why I love it. Some folks get all hung up on the prototype thing, which I love and practice, too, and forget to have fun with it

Sometimes they're so grim, it's like they need a hobby to distract 'em from the hobby that's eating them.

I greatly prefer a more relaxed approach, even when I'm simply replicating, rather than inventing something new and unique.

And, hey good luck with the new job

Lots of that around here, too. Gotta get this diss done and get out of the house more...it does lead to a lot of modeling, so it's not all bad.

["JaBear"]

mlehman

Do you have plans for using the ferry in operations?

Gidday Mike, most certainly, in fact I doubt very much if I’d build MY OWN layout if it was not for operations. I envisage that the layout will eventually comprise of several shelf switching layouts that happen to be joined together.                 

The ferry terminal is going to occupy 4 x 1500 mm (59.05512 inches), the joys of metrification , width, no more than arms length modules, built to conform with the AMG Guys and Gal,  http://modeltrains.kiwi.nz/  but to suit my purposes at home. So much for NO Compromises!!   I am building the ferry to be removable for transportation and, as currently planned, it will sit across two modules. I’m undecided whether I make the water detachable so I can use a separate rolling cassette system at home, I’m not going to let that stop me though, at least this hobby allows me I to make things up as I go along.

mlehman

That's a fine looking apron...just don't get caught wearing it

Just had a contract that I was supposed to start this week fall over at the last minute, so as her-in-doors is now the main bread winner, I'm now the house husband, at least I might get some extra modeling done. I don't wear an apron though.  

Cheers, the Bear.

"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."

• Reply

[mlehman]

Bear,

That's a fine looking apron...just don't get caught wearing it

Do you have plans for using the ferry in operations? A fellow NMRA member is building a layout where he plans to use ferries as a source of interchange at one end of his line. He's going to set up a cart where they can serve as cassettes, rolling in to "dock" at his apron. He's building his own ferries, but using the Walthers apron IIRC.

["JaBear"]

Gidday, I have been contemplating starting my own thread, " How to build a Freelanced Detroit River Ferry and get it completely Wrong", but with the information already here, my extremely liberal interpretation of his invitation 

karle

 Thanks for the sources for life boats, Jabear I would be very interested in how you built yours.  

 and with the hope that karle will come back on board, so to speak, and show how he is doing things properly, (and so I can pinch his good ideas), I will carry on regardless. It will also put my stuff, and hopefully others comments, tips, and useful information in one place.

From WPF......

my ferry apron, scratch built from 3mm MDF, and dimensional guesstimations from Google maps  http://smallmr.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/nw_docks.jpg  though the slightly more detailed photos I have found are, I think, from the Windsor side. This is the first time that I have hand laid track, I really am in awe of those who have built whole layouts by this method. As you can see in my second photo I'm definitly not game enough to have a crack at hand laying points.

The second photo was more to con myself that it really isn't that big a project, ( well it's not like a basement empire is it!!)

 

 

well thats all ffolks,

 

Cheers, the Bear.

["JaBear"]

Sam and Fred, thank you both for your kind remarks, and also for your brief history of lifeboats Fred. I don't mind constructive criticism, but a "pat on the back" is even better, as long as I don't get big headed about it.I must admit that I am my own hardest critic and therefore my own worst enemy. The following is an example why.

Of course in the search for the "prefect" lifeboat I also needed to think about DAVITS. "Whats so hard about that", said I, " a davit ( and I can imagine Sam chuckling right about now) is a davit".Searching on Google and also books at the local library very smartly showed me just how Wrong!!! I was. So back to the photo I found with a forrard view of the Windsor to see what I could see. Well its a very good general photo but a get the detail I require It was getting rather pixilated. By going backward and forward from photo to davit images, i managed to convince myself that the Windsor was fitted with the Quadrantal type of davit. Note: Just because I am now able to write about different types of davits, I would hate anyone to get the impression I actually know what I'm on about!! The thought of scratch building three sets of quadrantal davits did not fill me with joy, not impossible, but a lot of work. To say that I agonized over what I was to do would be slightly melodramatic , but talk about being "as thick as a short plank   It took me long enough to think, "Idiot, I'm building a free lanced version . Common sense finally won out and I've now made enough of the Radial type Davit.

These are made from Tichy box car kit sprues, thank goodness, as I got a bit excited with the heat gun on my first attempt.

And just to prove how engrossed (obsessive???) I've become, blocks...

.... made from a Bowser kit sprue. I'll leave the final rigging until I fit them to the actual ferry.

Cheers, the Bear.

[fwright]

I have to agree with Sam - those lifeboats just look "right".  Very nice.

Just a little bit more lifeboat history, if I may.

Before the 20th Century, lifeboats were really multipurpose working small craft built to be used where the mother vessel could not go.  Powered by oars, they required sailors to power, navigate, and make use of them.  They would be used to ferry passengers in ports (or emergencies) but required some sailors who knew what they were doing to man them.  But there was never enough capacity in the boats to carry all the passengers, and often not even enough to carry all the crew.

When rafts for passengers first came into use, the operational theory was that the lifeboats would be manned by designated members of the ship's crew and tend to a group of rafts filled with passengers.  Ideally, each raft would also have a crew member assigned to lead the passengers in the raft.

Fred W

[ollevon]

Bear,

For me, being one who spent most of my life on the ocean, I have at first hand seen just about every type of sea going vessel afloat, and in my opinion, you have done an outstanding job on those lifeboats. As far as the rivet counters are concerned, I feel you have no worries.   your lifeboats look just about perfect. Great job.

  Sam

["JaBear"]

 Gidday Karle so you're building the 1888 Transfer, as built for the Michigan Central,or as in her Wabash form?? I didn't realize how altered they were during their time in service. Looking forward to your photos, no pressure though. 

Without going into the somewhat convoluted reasons behind why I'm building a Detroit River Car Ferry I should make it perfectly clear I'm only building a freelanced version based on the Windsor and her sister ship Manitowoc found, amongst other good stuff on this great site here.................

http://teamtrack.xooit.com/t625-CAR-FERRY-around-MICHIGAN-State.htm

 Working from a plan I found on the web which came from the book The Great Lakes Car Ferries by George.W.Hilton and some dimensional information found on the delightfully named Bowling Green State University site.........

http://greatlakes.bgsu.edu/vessel/view/007675

and working from other photos I found on the web I drew some scaled drawings and established that I needed some lifeboats about 20 feet in length. Warning !!! Rivet Counters should depart Now!!!!.   None of the photos were really clear about what sort of lifeboat was needed so figuring that I'd like to row one with a pointy end, that's what I scratch built though in hindsight I'd stick with the double ended version as it may have been more correct and would have also meant one less build step. 

I had been given some off cuts of kiln dried kauri, (a New Zealand native tree used for shipbuilding back in the day) and fashioned my boats from that.

I should point out I have at w**k a band saw and a disc and belt linisher. To get the curve of the hulls right I used the Mark l eyeball and worked on the principle of " if it looks right then it must be right" plus I have advantage that the three boats will be at different positions and it will need a keen eye to notice the small discrepancies.  

The keel is cut from some 0.050" gasket paper and glued on using white PVA glue, like wise the supports cut from popsicle sticks.

The whole lot was painted with a gloss white rattle can. I was tempted to get a very fine tipped black felt pen and draw on the clinker planking but doubted my abilities, and besides thought it may have looked a bit cluttered.

The supports were hand painted grey. Next I got down on some of my wife's black sewing cotton and with the use of some thickish CA glue applied the life lines. Now this is where I think that exaggeration works in a modelers favour. Looking at prototype photos the lifelines are more closely spaced and nor as loopy, but I think that if I had managed to do them correctly they wouldn't be noticeable. The canvas was made from kitchen tin foil, thanks again to my long suffering wife, painted with a green rattle can which I already had and then given a rattle can matte clear coat. I could have bought a matte green paint can but am a cheapskate. I then made a cardboard template, cut out the foil, folded it to suit,and again used the CA glue and some more black cotton as the attachment ropes.

You may ask why? when there are commercial alternatives, I do like some of the offerings that Chuck  alluded to., but one of the big problems of living "Down under" is the Tyranny of Distance, a prime example being that while I obtained a 2nd hand copy of  The Great Lakes Car Ferries , in very good order from Amazon for US$ 20, it cost another US$ 27 to get it here and like I say I'm a cheapskate. That said I do purchase stuff direct from the States if the savings are big enough to negate the shipping costs. If I was to model a Great Lakes Car Ferry or larger vessel, I think I would look at resin casting the lifeboats.

Besides I find a certain satisfaction in scratchbuilding, are there any psychiatrists in the house??

Cheers, the Bear.

[karle]

Hello Jabear and all.  FYI I am deep into building the car ferry Transfer (maybe 65% complete),  which did cross the Detroit river.  It was originally owned by the Michigan Central, later sold to the Wabash.  It had 5 life boats.  If I get the chance I'll post some photos.  Thanks for the sources for life boats, Jabear I would be very interested in how you built yours.  

["JaBear"]

Gidday Fred, What I find great about model railroading is the diversity of the subject. When I first got back into the hobby as an adult, (well  at least I got older, just not sure of the growing up bit) if someone had said I'd be researching lifeboats I would have laughed at them.

The Detroit , (I am paraphrasing from The Great Lakes Car Ferries by George.W.Hilton), built in 1904 had a requirement for a compliment of 34 officers and men in summer, and 55 in winter, and had the capacity for 24 freight cars or 12 passenger cars. Passenger trains were scheduled for about half an hour for the mile between Detroit and Windsor stations.

I am not sure when the practice of actually carrying passengers was discontinued.  In the book there is a drawing of the Transport another Michigan Central river ferry built in 1880, which does appear to have substantial passenger accommodations,  showing four life boats.

fwright

Sorry I don't have good dates about the requirements for and development of life rafts.

I wonder if the rules for life boats and rafts were tightened after the Titanic?

Apologies to Karle for hijacking his thread.

Cheers, the Bear

Edit. I see that Chuck has brought up the matter of the Titanic. The Shorpy photo I linked is "circa 1905".

[tomikawaTT]

I suspect the Shorpy photo is pre-Titanic.

The Titanic disaster was the catalyst for most of the mandatory lifeboat requirements, at least in the English-speaking countries.

That may not be a passenger compartment.  With four boilers, the stoker staff must have been large, and they (and the rest of the crew) may have lived aboard.  Narrow as the enclosed space was, it probably didn't have much floor space.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964)