I think some people enjoy the tug of war.
Sometimes, when you step back and look at things in total, you can see that their replies and tone can suggest they are even cleverly disguising a cordial trolling for conflict.
Those threads tend to linger because the trolling goes undetected compared to those that are more direct and less cordial.
- Douglas
eaglescoutNow if they take the first answer they get they will have a 50/50 chance of it being right or at least solving the problem without doing major damage.
Or they can go to you tube and watch a video on how its done in less time it takes to do a topic and wait on the replies and the difference of opinions it brings.
The newbie has options that has never been available before and I think they may be a tad smarter then ever before.
I've had non modeling teenagers during the week of the fair ask about DCC and how sound works..
How did they find out?
When I ask that question I was told "I saw it on you tube".
So,you tube may be a ambassador for our hobby.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Doughless I think some people enjoy the tug of war. Sometimes, when you step back and look at things in total, you can see that their replies and tone can suggest they are even cleverly disguising a cordial trolling for conflict. Those threads tend to linger because the trolling goes undetected compared to those that are more direct and less cordial.
I always like to show the other side of the coin for consideration since there's always other possible ways of doing things..Nothing in this hobby is cut and dry since there's several correct answers to the same question..
I know of two right now..Your way and my way and both ways are correct.Now add 2 or more pages of opinions then you have the trigger for a discussion.
Things can be discussed without being called "trolling".
BRAKIE Doughless I think some people enjoy the tug of war. Sometimes, when you step back and look at things in total, you can see that their replies and tone can suggest they are even cleverly disguising a cordial trolling for conflict. Those threads tend to linger because the trolling goes undetected compared to those that are more direct and less cordial. I always like to show the other side of the coin for consideration since there's always other possible ways of doing things..Nothing in this hobby is cut and dry since there's several correct answers to the same question.. I know of two right now..Your way and my way and both ways are correct.Now add 2 or more pages of opinions then you have the trigger for a discussion. Things can be discussed without being called "trolling".
Larry, I understand that conflict and differences of opinion is not considered trolling.
But if a person posts a response with the intent of picking a fight, I consider that trolling. Sometimes in a discussion with differing opinions, you can tell the difference between a response that is sincere, and one that has a hidden purpose.
Doughless But if a person posts a response with the intent of picking a fight, I consider that trolling. Sometimes in a discussion with differing opinions, you can tell the difference between a response that is sincere, and one that has a hidden purpose.
Agreed..I've seen both types and have in times pass been accused of trolling only because my opinion was the other side of the coin that is seldom mention..Of course some of my thoughts goes against the grain but,I just happen to know they work and if it didn't I would never mention it.
I won't answer DCC or electrical questions because I know just enough about DCC to get what I need done..Electrial..Want advice on wiring a Atlas selector or Atlas switch controller? That's where my electrical knowledge bus stops and that's all I need to know.I can run a bus and drop feeders but,I prefer controllers for block wiring-1 wire to each block..Simple no?
My DCC wiring been 2 wires to the track .That works quite well for small ISLs and probably 4x8' layouts.
Larry,
Just for your records, I like ISL's, sectional track, and prefer DC control with few electrical complications. My ISL is about 35 feet long, with two loops at each end for continuous running for simple display. It may not look like the typical switching layout, but it operates the same. The size presents some issues that aren't typically found in layouts with such a simplistic operating scheme, so I have gotten use to needing to forge my own path to accomplish some things. Conventional solutions that are typically offered for a layout of my size end up being way overkill for my situation, because the operation is different than normal.
I have about 100 feet of track. Probably 25 percent is sectional for various reasons that suit me.
But that is for another thread..
BRAKIE Geared Steam It's because things has already been figured out, don't waste time or resources reinventing the wheel. I wonder where we would be today if the wheel wasn't reinvented by those that pushed old ideas? Take a close look there's nothing in the hobby that hasn't already been done. We already had freight and passenger cars and the locomotives to pull them. Somebody reinvented the wheel by adding spokes(details).. We already knew how to build mountains but,the wheel was reinvented using foam. We already had sectional track yet,it was reinvented with plastic roadbed.. Even DCC wouldn't be here if the wheel wasn't reinvented..We ran trains using block system and did quite well.
Geared Steam It's because things has already been figured out, don't waste time or resources reinventing the wheel.
It's because things has already been figured out, don't waste time or resources reinventing the wheel.
I wonder where we would be today if the wheel wasn't reinvented by those that pushed old ideas?
Take a close look there's nothing in the hobby that hasn't already been done.
We already had freight and passenger cars and the locomotives to pull them.
Somebody reinvented the wheel by adding spokes(details)..
We already knew how to build mountains but,the wheel was reinvented using foam.
We already had sectional track yet,it was reinvented with plastic roadbed..
Even DCC wouldn't be here if the wheel wasn't reinvented..We ran trains using block system and did quite well.
Uh yea, okay, interesting.
Let me use your angle if I may, Just because someone is doing something different than everyone else doesn't make it a good idea. There must be some knowledge and experience to >improve< on what there already is. Key word here.....>improve<
So I want go ahead and make square wheels because the round ones are just too darn expensive. Would you hop on board that build thread too?
(maybe I should put in disclaimer so no one can sue me first?)
Whatever Larry....whatever...
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Doughless Larry, Just for your records, I like ISL's, sectional track, and prefer DC control with few electrical complications. My ISL is about 35 feet long, with two loops at each end for continuous running for simple display. It may not look like the typical switching layout, but it operates the same. The size presents some issues that aren't typically found in layouts with such a simplistic operating scheme, so I have gotten use to needing to forge my own path to accomplish some things. Conventional solutions that are typically offered for a layout of my size end up being way overkill for my situation, because the operation is different than normal. I have about 100 feet of track. Probably 25 percent is sectional for various reasons that suit me. But that is for another thread..
And...DC is much less expensive to implement. I may have added way too many blocks in my 1x4 N-scale layout, but I wanted future flexibility. I have a companion 1x4 staging yard for later use.
Keeping with the spirit of this thread, is the trend to move everything towards DCC?
Tim
BRAKIEDSchmittTexas Zepher I am actually amused sometimes that after a question has been answered very well that people will still continue to answer.So am I, and often the additional answers are incorrect.Since our hobby has no hard set rules then by whose standards do we judge a answer by?.
DSchmittTexas Zepher I am actually amused sometimes that after a question has been answered very well that people will still continue to answer.So am I, and often the additional answers are incorrect.
Texas Zepher I am actually amused sometimes that after a question has been answered very well that people will still continue to answer.
Texas ZepherThe laws of mathematics and physics. There are many answers to the questions people ask that involves the simple application of Ohm's law, Watt's law, application of geometry, or trigonometry.
TZ, By golly I guess I missed the train because in my 55 plus years in the hobby I never had to use those laws..In fact I been out of school for so long I have long forgotten those laws since I never used them in life.
A MRC power pack and two wires is basically what I been using even with by old DCC on my past ISLs and few loop layouts..I'm now using a MRC Tech 6 and yup-two wires to the track..
When I do use blocks Atlas selectors gets the job done.Even wiring a Tortoise switch machine doesn't require a degree in electronics.
Complication or simplicity.
BRAKIE Texas ZepherThe laws of mathematics and physics. There are many answers to the questions people ask that involves the simple application of Ohm's law, Watt's law, application of geometry, or trigonometry. TZ, By golly I guess I missed the train because in my 55 plus years in the hobby I never had to use those laws..In fact I been out of school for so long I have long forgotten those laws since I never used them in life.
As a brakeman, you never used math? You never counted cars, divided added, multiplied?
Physics you say? I bet you knew how far a car would drift with a shove of the loco based on your past experiences of that empty vs loaded boxcar, on the incline/grade/ on certain sidings?
I bet you also used geometry, more than your cared to admit or realized.
No matter anyways, I heard that Elvis has left the building, to the tune of Frank Sinatra's "My Way" playing in the background.
BRAKIEThings can be discussed without being called "trolling"
Isn`t that when you stick an electric motor on a bass boat to go fishing?
Dennis Blank Jr.
CEO,COO,CFO,CMO,Bossman,Slavedriver,Engineer,Trackforeman,Grunt. Birdsboro & Reading Railroad
Geared Steam BRAKIE Texas ZepherThe laws of mathematics and physics. There are many answers to the questions people ask that involves the simple application of Ohm's law, Watt's law, application of geometry, or trigonometry. TZ, By golly I guess I missed the train because in my 55 plus years in the hobby I never had to use those laws..In fact I been out of school for so long I have long forgotten those laws since I never used them in life. Larry As a brakeman, you never used math? You never counted cars, divided added, multiplied? Physics you say? I bet you knew how far a car would drift with a shove of the loco based on your past experiences of that empty vs loaded boxcar, on the incline/grade/ on certain sidings? I bet you also used geometry, more than your cared to admit or realized. No matter anyways, I heard that Elvis has left the building, to the tune of Frank Sinatra's "My Way" playing in the background.
Basic math like counting cars is child play.90% of the time there was no need since you know your cut will be between C&O 456320 and ATSF 765652..See how easy? You pulled the cars and stop to make the cut..Of course that was back in the day..
As far as kicking cars..No math needed at all..Shove 'em west for the kick 6133,that will do 6133! pull the pin and watch the car roll..Next car is ready for the kick..Take 'em east 6133 that will do..6133 Shove 'em west for the kick,that'll do 6133.If the car stop before the joint the next car will shove to the joint if not,we'll push the cars to the joint.
Doing it your way and you might switch 90 cars in 12 hours.
Doing it the way I was taught a heads up crew could flat switch 300-400 cars in 12 hours..
Simple as pie and twice as easy..
rdgk1se3019 BRAKIEThings can be discussed without being called "trolling" Isn`t that when you stick an electric motor on a bass boat to go fishing?
I guess I better take my trolling motor off my 14' jon boat..
eaglescoutHopefully newbies have enough common sense to evaluate the responses they get to their questions. As a newbie a couple of years ago I asked a question about using brass track that started a flame and I got many and numerous responses. I did more research and finally made my decision taking into account all the pros and cons.
Good lord, I'll second that. A few months back I asked a blazingly stupid question, got a well-reasoned and interesting response, and offered a viewpoint that was, without really meaning to be, powerfully offensive to the person trying to help me. He got mad (rightly, I see now in retrospect). Response received, evaluated, idiocy and blame fully mine, point taken, will endeavour to not repeat the mistake. RichHOtrain, If you're still irritated with me, I am sorry.
Streamlined steam, oh, what a dream!!
BRAKIE I always like to show the other side of the coin for consideration since there's always other possible ways of doing things..Nothing in this hobby is cut and dry since there's several correct answers to the same question.. I know of two right now..Your way and my way and both ways are correct.Now add 2 or more pages of opinions then you have the trigger for a discussion. Things can be discussed without being called "trolling".
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
hi gentlemen,
though earlier today i saw one of SUX's threads locked, they are all vanished by now.
Is some-one able to delete his (or her) own threads or is it done by an administrator?
BTW Byron Henderson's remarks about applauding machines came into my mind, as well as an other one:
"Don't ask me what I think about you
I might give an answer you don't want me to"
from a song by Fleetwood Mac
Smile
Paul
Not all the threads started by SUX are gone. Looks like just his How To's and the rant when he quit.
Threads are locked and removed by admintrators.
His using 3M Command Strips for temporary track placement appears to be a good idea, but the How To was too complicated.
Awhile back another member got mad and quit. He edited all his posts to remove the content.
One thread I started was removed. They sent me a notice and explantaton. I think the administrator was overzealous and disagreed with the reason, but accepted it and went on. Still enjoy this Forum.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
A user can only delete his posts if there are no replies. What SUX did was edit his posts to remove content and replaced it with a dash or period.
The moderators deleted the actual threads.
BRAKIETexas ZepherThe laws of mathematics and physics. There are many answers to the questions people ask that involves the simple application of Ohm's law, Watt's law, application of geometry, or trigonometry. TZ, By golly I guess I missed the train because in my 55 plus years in the hobby I never had to use those laws..In fact I been out of school for so long I have long forgotten those laws since I never used them in life. A MRC power pack and two wires is basically what I been using even with by old DCC on my past ISLs and few loop layouts..I'm now using a MRC Tech 6 and yup-two wires to the track.. When I do use blocks Atlas selectors gets the job done.Even wiring a Tortoise switch machine doesn't require a degree in electronics. Complication or simplicity.
Some questions people ask have real and correct answers which are not subject to judgement. Once someone has answered that question, there is no further need of other people to "continue" to answer it.
This thread should be renamed FORUMERS' Psychology.
Paulus Jas "Don't ask me what I think about you I might give an answer you don't want me to" from a song by Fleetwood Mac Smile Paul
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Texas Zepher ... Some questions people ask have real and correct answers which are not subject to judgement. Once someone has answered that question, there is no further need of other people to "continue" to answer it.
...
Yeah, but there are fewer of those than many people think.
Enjoy
Texas Zepher Some questions people ask have real and correct answers which are not subject to judgement. Once someone has answered that question, there is no further need of other people to "continue" to answer it.
Some questions may have other answers then those posted that may be a easier way to do things..
I agree that turning the other cheek is the best way to avoid conflict.
But these are not private conversations where someone can just walk away with no consequences.
This is a public forum with world-wide viewing and any viewer can get bad information, or a bad tutorial, that may lead them to think some cobbled together cork and track pieces will replace Atlas Tru-track.
Imagine someone considering the hobby and embarks on his method. Spends the money and gawd-awful time hacking away a perfectly good slab of cork, gluing up perfectly good track, and winds up walking away from the hobby disappointed, all the while blaming a tutorial that he found on a serious publishers website (or wondering if you need to wear a hat to play with trains)
Perhaps it a bit arrogant of us, but some of us were trying to do the viewers a favor by pinning him down to what he was trying to accomplish and to checkmate his evasive and insincere answers.
If I get 10 responses that laying track with caulk is the best way to do it even though it has already been stated 9 times I can feel more confident in going that route rather than reading one response with no other affirmations. Likewise, if I happen to accept one post that says laying track with CA is the best way to do it with no comments to the contrary I will end up with a big mess. Over time I have begun to develp a feel for what information is legitimate on the forum and what information is better forgotten about.
If one really wants a more certified "right way" to do something they would do well to purchase one of the books that cover that part of the hobby. Being cheap I don't want to purchase every book available at $20 a clip, though I have purchased a few. The more critical the process the more I take time and research to make sure I am getting good and reliable information.
eaglescout If I get 10 responses that laying track with caulk is the best way to do it even though it has already been stated 9 times I can feel more confident in going that route rather than reading one response with no other affirmations.
If I get 10 responses that laying track with caulk is the best way to do it even though it has already been stated 9 times I can feel more confident in going that route rather than reading one response with no other affirmations.
But what if the majority of the responses are from people that have never actually used caulk. I notice that there are a number of posters here that just agree for no other reason then to just add their comment. Some posters don't even have a layout but if you read their posts they know everything there is about building one.
ONR FAN Some posters don't even have a layout but if you read their posts they know everything there is about building one.
I currently don't have a layout but,you can bet the farm I know how to build one since I've built several over the years.I understand the basics of using caulk only because I seen it used.I've used white glue to hold the track in place on Woodland Scenics foam roadbed on my last layout and plan on using it on the next.
However..
I wonder if one never built or even help build a layout how do they get their experience?
From books? Magazines?
I suspect they do a lot of studying and can answer basic questions or design a layout.
But,having no hands on experience with caulk,glue etc then perhaps they shouldn't answer a topic covering such things?