TA462 I think everyone should get retested every couple years to have their license renewed. I drive 120 KMs back and forth to work and I see stupidity everyday. The amount of people that don't know the rules of the road is crazy. The amount of people that drive in the left lane or center lane at 100 kms per hour(the speed limit) on a three lane highway is huge and they are morons. What ever happened to keep right except to pass? Sometimes I really feel for the truck and bus drivers that have these morons clogging up their passing lane.
I think everyone should get retested every couple years to have their license renewed. I drive 120 KMs back and forth to work and I see stupidity everyday. The amount of people that don't know the rules of the road is crazy. The amount of people that drive in the left lane or center lane at 100 kms per hour(the speed limit) on a three lane highway is huge and they are morons. What ever happened to keep right except to pass? Sometimes I really feel for the truck and bus drivers that have these morons clogging up their passing lane.
The last I heard, your driver's license is good for 25 years in Arizona. Just imagine if you were 60 when you got it.
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
I agree there are a lot of inept drivers out there, however here in the States, "keep right" laws vary widely from place to place.
Many large US cities have freeway systems with some left hand exits, or "Y" diverging routes, making "slower traffic keep right" regulations totaly impractical.
And, multi lane highways actually handle more traffic better without people trying to stay in the right lane or lanes. And they handle more traffic better if all traffic is traveling at about the same speed. Extensive studies in the US have shown that speed is not the danger factor - the speed differential between the fastest and slowest cars is the danger factor.
Agreed, slower traffic should let faster traffic pass when practical - but making it law is largely out moded. For this reason most US States have made it only law where posted.
Here in the Baltimore area, you can be going 80 mph in the 65 mph zone, go right thru the police radar, and not get a ticket, if everyone around you is going that fast. Police on the freeways here are looking for the agressive drivers going 10-20 mph faster than the "pack", not just for people going over the speed limit.
Sheldon
Some years ago, there was a plane crash, an Ethiopian Airways plane leaving Beirut, Lebanon. The usual investigation was done, but it was never released. As it turns out, the release of these final reports is the responsibility of the country in which the accident occurred, and they chose not to release it for some unknown political reason. This sort of thing hurts us all, as the information contained in the report could have been used to improve safety for all air travelers.
We are fortunate to live in an open society where we know that the truth will come out.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Here in the Baltimore area, you can be going 80 mph in the 65 mph zone, go right thru the police radar, and not get a ticket, if everyone around you is going that fast. Police on the freeways here are looking for the agressive drivers going 10-20 mph faster than the "pack", not just for people going over the speed limit.
It's the way police radar works. It only picks out the fastest car on the road. So, if there are half a dozen cars all going over the limit, the radar will beep, but the officer can't tell which car it is unless one is obviously going faster than the others. Case dismissed. (Oh, I've been in the same situation. After we all passed through the trap, we looked at each other and grinned.)
Dang, my heart to those greiving. But what really is a wake-up for me, I watched the Zephyrs roll through Galesburg without knowing tghis story on Saturday. To think one of those should have been that train...
-Morgan
The written report states that the truck hit the train, and hit it the 4th car.
The video also states that the truck hit the train.
It's a very sad situation for those involved with this terrible accident, as well as their families.
-Ed
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." -Aristotle
MisterBeasley It's the way police radar works. It only picks out the fastest car on the road. So, if there are half a dozen cars all going over the limit, the radar will beep, but the officer can't tell which car it is unless one is obviously going faster than the others.
It's the way police radar works. It only picks out the fastest car on the road. So, if there are half a dozen cars all going over the limit, the radar will beep, but the officer can't tell which car it is unless one is obviously going faster than the others.
As a certified Radar instructor I can assure you that except for one particular brand, that is not true. Radar reads the strongest return. That is usually the closest vehicle, but in some limited cases can be the largest vehicle.
I would be more inclined to believe that the officer could not stop everyone in the pack and felt it would be unfair to arbitrarily pick just one.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
jasperofzeal Geared Steam: Truck: jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. I do not think Hamltnblue was being racist, there have been rumors that trains may be attacked in retaliation to Osama Bin Laden's death, or other reasons. And after 9/11 people tend to take these threats seriosly. Truck. Agreed, nowhere do I read any "racism" in that post, and there are rumors that have been reported by our government found on OBL's hard drives. I know exactly what Hamltnblue meant by that post. Stop being hypersensitive, it makes you look foolish. Ok, I get it. Hamltnblue is your friend and you will support his comment regardless of what he meant. I believe he was being racist, what other reason would make him type such a statement? If he was expressing concern about the "threats" that ensued after OBL's death or 9/11 then Hamltnblue should have expressed his thought with more clarity. Perhaps saying something to the effect of hoping this incident wasn't related to any terrorist threats or anything other than what he wrote. Instead he chose not to express any other details to his thought and made a genealistic expression that to me sounds like racism. If you think I'm a fool for being hypersensitive then you're the bigger fool for believing what you see in the news and not knowing what racism is.
Geared Steam: Truck: jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. I do not think Hamltnblue was being racist, there have been rumors that trains may be attacked in retaliation to Osama Bin Laden's death, or other reasons. And after 9/11 people tend to take these threats seriosly. Truck. Agreed, nowhere do I read any "racism" in that post, and there are rumors that have been reported by our government found on OBL's hard drives. I know exactly what Hamltnblue meant by that post. Stop being hypersensitive, it makes you look foolish.
Truck: jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. I do not think Hamltnblue was being racist, there have been rumors that trains may be attacked in retaliation to Osama Bin Laden's death, or other reasons. And after 9/11 people tend to take these threats seriosly. Truck.
jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself.
Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name.
Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name.
Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself.
I do not think Hamltnblue was being racist, there have been rumors that trains may be attacked in retaliation to Osama Bin Laden's death, or other reasons. And after 9/11 people tend to take these threats seriosly.
Truck.
Agreed, nowhere do I read any "racism" in that post, and there are rumors that have been reported by our government found on OBL's hard drives.
I know exactly what Hamltnblue meant by that post. Stop being hypersensitive, it makes you look foolish.
Ok, I get it. Hamltnblue is your friend and you will support his comment regardless of what he meant. I believe he was being racist, what other reason would make him type such a statement? If he was expressing concern about the "threats" that ensued after OBL's death or 9/11 then Hamltnblue should have expressed his thought with more clarity. Perhaps saying something to the effect of hoping this incident wasn't related to any terrorist threats or anything other than what he wrote. Instead he chose not to express any other details to his thought and made a genealistic expression that to me sounds like racism. If you think I'm a fool for being hypersensitive then you're the bigger fool for believing what you see in the news and not knowing what racism is.
The other's read it right. I hope it wasn't terrorism.
I don't personally know anyone on the forums but it doesn't matter. The problem aside from this incident isn't about race. It's about an idealogy that want's to destroy anyone who doesn't believe in their way of life. They constantly spout off their intention to do harm to us and recently included trains on their list.
If you're one of them, try focusing your attention on the one's creating the air of terror and not on those pointing it out.
Springfield PA
wabash2800 Killed on the train was Amtrak Conductor Laurette Lee. According to what I've heard, she'll be sorely missed. She was an older woman who started her career as a clerk but wanted to be a conductor. She really liked her job but really ran a tight ship from what I understand. She handled herself well and did a great job. I suspect the trucker was trying to outrun the train and then when he figured out he goofed, hit the brakes and swerved but it was too late. Or perhaps he was distracted with a cell phone? What a waste.
Killed on the train was Amtrak Conductor Laurette Lee. According to what I've heard, she'll be sorely missed. She was an older woman who started her career as a clerk but wanted to be a conductor. She really liked her job but really ran a tight ship from what I understand. She handled herself well and did a great job.
I suspect the trucker was trying to outrun the train and then when he figured out he goofed, hit the brakes and swerved but it was too late. Or perhaps he was distracted with a cell phone? What a waste.
From the reported numerous citations on this trucking outfit, it's more likely that the truck lost it's brakes.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
An excerpt from the reply by Hamltnblue:
"The other's read it right. I hope it wasn't terrorism. I don't personally know anyone on the forums but it doesn't matter. The problem aside from this incident isn't about race. It's about an idealogy that want's to destroy anyone who doesn't believe in their way of life. They constantly spout off their intention to do harm to us and recently included trains on their list".
I just wanted to add my support for Hamltnblue. Apparently everyone, with one exception, knew what he meant when he said it. Terrorism was the first thing that I thought about when I heard about the accident on the news. I think that in this instance Hamltnblue was not the bad guy.
Rich
Alton Junction
Americans need to grow a spine. You stand a greater chance of being struck by lightning than being killed by a terrorist. In September 2001 more people died in traffic accidents than died at the WTC.
Americans hysterical response is way out of proportion to the actual threat.
This was a traffic accident. A truck hit a train. Nothing more.
And, if the reports are correct that the trucking company does have a poor service record on their trucks then see it as an industrial accident initiated by the trucking company itself.
I have driven that highway a few times way back when...it can be a test in how well you pay attention to things that is for darn sure...
Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry
I just started my blog site...more stuff to come...
http://modeltrainswithmusic.blogspot.ca/
blownout cylinder And, if the reports are correct that the trucking company does have a poor service record on their trucks then see it as an industrial accident initiated by the trucking company itself. I have driven that highway a few times way back when...it can be a test in how well you pay attention to things that is for darn sure...
I can tell you that when I'm driving, I pay attention to trains, semis and other 4-wheelers; in that order. As many of you know, people blame semis for most of the accidents between semis and cars. I've watched people speed up to prevent a semi from getting in front of them, change lanes right in front of a tractor trailer rig. And if you REALLY want to upset a driver, slow down and wave a semi over so it can change lanes and get in front of you. The drivers behind you will lay on the horn, big time! All so someone can get to their destination 2-3 minutes sooner.
I haven't posted in a long time. In fact, the last time was when my son, who is an Amtrak conductor, was in the cab-car of the Capitol going to Sacramento when a truck driver with a load of bleach tried to beat the train to the crossing and lost. His injuries weren't serious, but I read a number of comments here on the MR forum, and found many of them to be cogent, and lots of them to be made by clueless insensitive jerks. In this case, Ben's aunt, my sister, was the conductor killed in this horrific accident. Ben took it upon himself to call Laurette's daughters and son to inform them. And me. And I find the forum filled with a little bit of coherence, and lots of insensitive jerks. Maybe I'm taking this personally, but perhaps others should engage their minds BEFORE engaging their keyboards. I found certain of the comments to be especially coarse. If one hopes this wasn't a terrorist incident (which it most likely wasn't), please SAY that, rather than some cryptic comment like "I hope the truck driver wasn't a Muslim." Laurette's daughter's last name is Muhammed, after all.
I'm heartsick over the loss of my sister. I'm actually traveling to Sacramento for the National convention this week, but it'll be tough to enjoy my first National, and family arrangements will take precedence
I'll finish on this note - I was in Reno some years ago when Laurette was the conductor between Emeryville and Reno, and before the train arrived from the east, she made this announcement to the waiting passengers in the Reno Amtrak station: "Let me have the attention of all the passengers under 12 here. Please make sure you don't allow your parents to run up and down the aisles, and keep them in their seats unless they're actually going somewhere. Make sure the don't disturb the other passengers with yelling and screaming, and help them to enjoy the trip." That's a paraphrase, of course, but I found it to be entertaining and informative, and FUN for the kids by swapping their points of view and not condescending to them. And that was Laurette in a nutshell.
Paul Rankin
Paul, my sincere condolences. As I have followed this tragic event on the forum and via the many media outlets, it comes over very clearly that your Sister was superb at her job and a real credit to the company that she represented. She will be missed by many it seems. My prayers are with you and the rest of your family as you deal with this awful event, and say goodbye to your Sister.
Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum
Mr. Rankin:
Please accept my most heart felt sympathy. Society is made up of individuals, each contributing in his or her own way. The loss of one is a loss for all. Time will dull the pain you are feeling at this time, but the hole it leaves in your life is forever.
My condolences to you and your family..
paul_r I'm heartsick over the loss of my sister. I'm actually traveling to Sacramento for the National convention this week, but it'll be tough to enjoy my first National, and family arrangements will take precedence Paul Rankin
Paul, your family is in my prayers. It always hurts to lose a loved one, but it's especially painful when it's the result of someone else's actions. She sounded like a hoot to be around.
Paul, I am very sorry for your loss, and that you had to gird yourself to post your comment when your energy was needed elsewhere. Your sister sounds like what we in the military call 'a stand-up gal." We should all take some comfort knowing that her personality was so forceful that she left lasting impressions on many passengers over the years.
Finally, a lesson for all of us posting here, no matter what the subject; we have a large, and largely silent, membership who enjoy coming here for the most part and reading our exchanges. There must be some exchanges that make a lot of them shake their heads and vow to continue their silent readership rather than to get embroiled in the circus that those of us who are active can sometimes generate for them. When what we post hurts them personally, it is much worse...for all of us.
'Nuff said.
Paul, please accept my deepest condolences as well. As a relatively frequent AmTrak traveler I can appreciate the wonderful service and comfort that your sister gave to many travelers and a potential role model for kids on her train(s).
Please know that the very great majority of us here are more than aware of the railroader's life and the very special people they often are in their interactions with us. Kind, helpful, humorous and supportive when we are far from home.
I took Hamltblue's comment to mean that he hoped that innocent Muslim's wouldn't be blamed for this terrible incident IF the driver just HAPPENED to be of that faith or have a Muslim surname. In my willingness to think the best of folks (until I know differently) I felt that he was expressing concern that a political or terror situation would uncontrollably arise from such a situation.
I don't know him personally but that was my impression. It was a rather vague inference but that was what I hoped was meant by him. Without clarification it is hard to tell but from post exchanges with him I've always known him to be a helpful and giving person as most here are.
Once again, I'm so sorry that you have not only lost your sister so needlessly by a company that allegedly seems to have been repeatedly negligent and should have been stopped long before this tragedy,
If the family is supportive of your plans to attend the convention and you feel that your sister would have wanted you to celebrate your love of trains in this way, even in light of this event, I hope that you can and can find some enjoyment, relief and above all good fellowship to reaffirm your faith in (most of) humanity.
I shall be thinking of you and yours and will keep an eye out for your name tag should you be able to and feel up for attending.
Jim
Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.
Hi Paul,
I to wish to extend my sincere condolences in the loss of your Sister. This was such a tragic event.
My feeling are summed up in Capt. Grimek's reply so I wil not repreat them here.
May you have a Blessing of Peace and many wonderful happy memories of her.
Johnboy out.........................
from Saskatchewan, in the Great White North..
We have met the enemy, and he is us............ (Pogo)
Thanks for the expressions of sympathy - they really do help, if only as reminders that I'm not alone. My thoughts and prayers go out to the other victims of this terrible accident, and to their families. And Selector, thanks for the wonderfully cogent sentiments and wisdom you shared in your post.
Paul
Paul,
My sincere condolences on your loss. It's always the wonderful people who are taken from us too soon.
And, in a bit of redirection here -- yes, I know about all the requirements for inspections, and physicals, etc., but there are just too many cases of companies and drivers either flouting the regulations, or just deciding that it's easier to violate them and pay the price. It seems that too many folks either care more about the almighty dollar than they do about humanity, or they believe that driving is a right, not a privilege.
Connecticut Valley Railroad A Branch of the New York, New Haven, and Hartford
"If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right." -- Henry Ford
One thing bugs me about this situation, true it is very sad innocent people lost their lives but how can we be sure its the driver's fault and not his boss?
The man probably knew that the truck was not safe to drive and didn't want to drive it but the brass might of told him, "Here's the truck keys or there's the door." In this day and age, who can afford to loose a job? I'm not saying whose right and whose wrong but the media (although I will believe it when I see it) said that the rig failed a safety inspection a few months before. My own father's been on that side when he drove a truck. It could of been the truck driver's fault, could of been management. And if he's an owner operator maybe he had to pay the house payment so his kids and family have a roof over their heads?
I just don't think that there is enough material here to accuse the trucker and the train's got the right of way by default.
If you can read this... thank a teacher. If you are reading this in english... thank a veteran
When in doubt. grab a hammer.
If it moves and isn't supposed to, get a hammer
If it doesn't move and is supposed to, get a hammer
If it's broken, get a hammer
If it can't be fixed with a hammer... DUCK TAPE!
jasperofzeal Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself.
What's racist about that? In case you've had your head buried in terra firma for the past half century these people hang around street corners in Cairo hoping for some incident that will provoke anti-American riots.
From the far, far reaches of the wild, wild west I am: rtpoteet
Paul, if you're still following this thread, I would first like to address you and say that I'm so sorry for the loss you've suffered. There are no words that can be said that will ease the pain, our prayers are with you and your family.
R. T. POTEET jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. What's racist about that? In case you've had your head buried in terra firma for the past half century these people hang around street corners in Cairo hoping for some incident that will provoke anti-American riots.
If you don't know what racism is then its your head that's been buried in terra firma. I don't know if you people are dense or just turning a blind eye to the initial comment that Hamltnblue made and what was implied. The "explaination" that was given later about what he meant was a little too late, now I have a bad impression of the man. Maybe it doesn't matter to him one bit, but I did receive many PM's agreeing with me. I'm pretty much done with this and I don't want to take away the emotional support we're giving Paul. I'm not changing my opinion about Hamltnblue and I'm not trying to convince anyone to see things my way. Let's just agree to disagree and let it end here.
TONY
"If we never take the time, how can we ever have the time." - Merovingian (Matrix Reloaded)
Are we still going to continue the flame session over this?
As it is..he turned out not to be muslim...the guy turned out to be someone who worked for a trucking company that had some safety issues as well as a driver who apparently had some of his own...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2011/06/27/BA461K37NM.DTL&tsp=1
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/national_world&id=8215393&rss=rss-kgo-article-8215393
So, I think we can stop banging on the racism card here....
There's never time to do it right, but always time to do it over.....
teen steam fan One thing bugs me about this situation, true it is very sad innocent people lost their lives but how can we be sure its the driver's fault and not his boss? The man probably knew that the truck was not safe to drive and didn't want to drive it but the brass might of told him, "Here's the truck keys or there's the door." In this day and age, who can afford to loose a job? I'm not saying whose right and whose wrong but the media (although I will believe it when I see it) said that the rig failed a safety inspection a few months before. My own father's been on that side when he drove a truck. It could of been the truck driver's fault, could of been management. And if he's an owner operator maybe he had to pay the house payment so his kids and family have a roof over their heads? I just don't think that there is enough material here to accuse the trucker and the train's got the right of way by default.
I once worked for Waste Management (no, I'm not worried about being sued. It's hard to sue over facts), and we were sent out 3 days in a row with a front loader dumpster truck that had a broken U-bolt that held the rear axle to the springs. I reported it to management, who told us that they'd take care of it. On two consecutive days, I again reported it. On the third day, I took the "there's the door" approach. I then promptly called the Arizona Dept. of Transportation. So, yes, sometimes the company is at fault for constantly getting equipment violations. But, there were over 300 feet of skidmarks before the crash. It's obvious to me that the trucks brakes worked. It was the driver that was "malfunctioning".
jasperofzeal Paul, if you're still following this thread, I would first like to address you and say that I'm so sorry for the loss you've suffered. There are no words that can be said that will ease the pain, our prayers are with you and your family. R. T. POTEET: jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. What's racist about that? In case you've had your head buried in terra firma for the past half century these people hang around street corners in Cairo hoping for some incident that will provoke anti-American riots. If you don't know what racism is then its your head that's been buried in terra firma. I don't know if you people are dense or just turning a blind eye to the initial comment that Hamltnblue made and what was implied. The "explaination" that was given later about what he meant was a little too late, now I have a bad impression of the man. Maybe it doesn't matter to him one bit, but I did receive many PM's agreeing with me. I'm pretty much done with this and I don't want to take away the emotional support we're giving Paul. I'm not changing my opinion about Hamltnblue and I'm not trying to convince anyone to see things my way. Let's just agree to disagree and let it end here.
R. T. POTEET: jasperofzeal: Hamltnblue: Just hope that the truck driver doesn't have a muslim name. Can you please keep your racist remarks to yourself. What's racist about that? In case you've had your head buried in terra firma for the past half century these people hang around street corners in Cairo hoping for some incident that will provoke anti-American riots.
And my impression of this little man is much worse.
So will the Moderators please lock this before I stop biting my tongue on this nitwit.
I served my time in the service and don't have to answer to anyone and their liberal BS.
I'm not one to be silenced by those wacko's.