After seeing this posted by Sheldon it got me wondering.
100 locos (includes RDC's, doodlebugs, B units, motor cars for unit train streamliners, etc)
80-90 passenger cars
500 freight cars
For the intended operational plan I figure I still need about 200-300 more freight cars, maybe another 10-20 passenger cars, and about 10 more locos - when someone makes what I need.
Now I am not asking how many cars or engines you have! But how many complete trains and cars will your track hold and still be ran?
For this post lets call a train a engine and at minimum 6 cars.
On my layout I can hold 6 trains from 10 to 30 cars with out fouling any of the mains. I can run 2 trains each on the 2 mains with around 40 cars each.Counting the mining company and spurs I can hold another 60 cars.
As I type I have a pair of Eire's pulling 32 cars and Y6 B pulling 32 coal cars on the A line. On the B line I have 3 F 3's dragging 27 cars. Then the Hudson is sitting with a 7 car train. M1 A is holding with 11 cars. E-7 with 8 passenger cars, Heavy Mike with 10 cars. with the small yard and what I have posted I have.
6 engines running 11 sitting and 62 cars sitting and 91 rolling. Right now the bench is pretty open, I could add maybe another 60 cars. But right now with the engines I have 170 total on the bench ready to go.
So how many trains can you have on the layout at the same time and still not play bumper train?
And how big of a bench does one need to use 1011 like Sheldon is looking for? My bench is 174 square foot, but not laid for a big yard.
Cuda Ken
I hate Rust
By your rules, my layout can hold a maximum of 5 full length (8 to 10 car) trains and still be able to run trains from one end to the other. During normal operations however I'll have four sets of rolling stock - two manifests CDWJ and WJCD, (these two trains share power and crew but not rolling stock), an intermodal train going by the symbols NAWJ and WJNA (the train turns around in staging and goes back the other way), and a local, LE-2.
NOT following your rules for train length but still taking up siding space, I also have yard job and local LE-1, and someday I hope to have a commuter train that runs back and forth and perhaps a dinner train.
cudakenAnd how big of a bench does one need to use 1011 like Sheldon is looking for? My bench is 174 square foot, but not laid for a big yard. Cuda Ken
Why is your train layout in your garage? Do you not have a basement? Reason I ask is most midwest people use the basement or spare room because of our cold winters.
So I guess I'm the only person who's layout will hold 1/6 of the specified train...
HO and a spare folding table don't exactly go together, N might.
Vincent
Wants: 1. high-quality, sound equipped, SD40-2s, C636s, C30-7s, and F-units in BN. As for ones that don't cost an arm and a leg, that's out of the question....
2. An end to the limited-production and other crap that makes models harder to get and more expensive.
My current layout which is under construction is designed for three trains. I could probably squeeze in another one or two, but won't. This is a small temporary layout designed with sectional track for the purpose of allowing me to run trains and have a little operating fun. I expect to use about 24 freight and 2 passenger cars.
I expect to start the "big" one in a year or two after I finish the basement. My plans call for 2 freight trains, 2 passenger trains and 2 switchers to be operating at the same time. It will use about 8 locomotives (to allow the freights to be double headed), 100-120 freight cars, and 5-10 passenger cars. This layout will occupy about 950 sq ft of a 1300 sq ft basement.
Enjoy
Paul
If you mean running at the same time, about two. I'm a 'lone wolf' DC operator and that's about all I can handle--but, and this is a BIG "But--" , I run on regular, not scale time, and in an ops session, about the most trains that would be running on my trans-Sierra mainline layout would be about one or two an hour. In other words, not more than 24 trains in a given 'real' 24 hour period.
However, I can hold several other trains in my yard and on one long passing track. The 'house track' at the Deer Creek passenger station can hold about an 8-car passenger train (about the longest I use), while the passing track at Wagon Wheel Gap can hold a 14 or 15 car freight, plus a 6-car stock train (Wagon Wheel Gap has a stock-yard). The Deer Creek yard is a 6-track 'stub-end' yard, but it can hold enough rolling stock for making up about two pretty hefty freights.
Summer project, if I can get it going, is a staging yard on the other side of my "California Basement" (garage) to hold at least four or five fairly full-length trains, so that I can possibly increase the number of trains run on the layout in any given ops session. But they will still have to stop in Deer Creek for either locomotive change-overs, or the addition of helpers.
And the engine terminal at Deer Creek holds about 6-7 of my big steam locomotives at any given session.
Hey, it's fun!
Tom
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
2 running --one on the 22 and the other on the 24 radius
51% share holder in the ME&O ( Wife owns the other 49% )
ME&O
One. Single track mainline loop on a 4x8 doesnt allow for much (though I have triple headed some trains). I have 4 sidings that can hold about 5 cars each. Id be hesitant to call my piece of plywood with some track tacked down a layout... its really just a dcc proving ground and some place I can look at my models.
This summer I am going to try to build a slightly more interesting layout in sections so that it can be dismantled and stored when I am gone in the same (roughly) amount of space as the ole 4x8.
Cahrn
I really think that in answering this question that it be made absolutely clear whether the respondent is actually running the trains in some sort of meaningful "operations" fashion, or simple piling car/trains on to the layout to occupy space...there is a world of difference between the two situations and the number of cars and trains that can be usefully involved.
CNJ831
My layout is 32 sq. ft. (4x8 sheet o ply). If I really wanted to I could have one train running with 5 or 6 trains stored, depending on if there's one on the yard lead.
In terms of my operations though, one train at a time, three or four locos total, not sure how many cars; maybe 50-ish(?). all freight, though someday I hope to get a commuter train with one engine and two cars running.
Sawyer Berry
Clemson University c/o 2018
Building a protolanced industrial park layout
For THIS post, I'm using the Peter Josserand (Rights of Trains) definition:
Train: a locomotive (or locomotives) with or without cars, showing markers.
The reason is that I have an entire railroad where the average train will never have six cars, and quite a few schedules covered by 'trains' of two EMU or DMU. Each has its timetable slot and its allotted place in staging, requires a dedicated 'crew' and in all other ways fills the definition stated above.
That said, I can handle:
That does not include yard switchers or helpers drifting downgrade by themselves. Nor does it count the half-dozen or so locos at the engine change point awaiting assignment.
Specifically EXCLUDED are a dozen trains stored ready to operate in cassettes, held off the layout so the anhydrous ammonia car, the four-truck machinery flat and the string of super-high-speed cars behind the brand-new DE10 don't appear too often. Also cassetted off-layout are the snowplow and the wreck train.
So, which train runs when? Just consult the timetable.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - TTTO, 24/30)
CNJ831I really think that in answering this question that it be made absolutely clear whether the respondent is actually running the trains in some sort of meaningful "operations" fashion, or simple piling car/trains on to the layout to occupy space.
Coming from Ken, I gotta go with piling trains on the layout occupying space
Well, by your definition of locomotive and 6 cars, may layout can hold 0 trains. Operationally I run two -- passenger service is holding on by a gas-electric, while my daily except Sunday freight turn is 3-4 cars.
Well the standard answer is of course not enough or shall I say never enough. If you meaning running trains at one time When completed the basement layout will be able to run 4 trains at the same time with another 5 sitting in staging and 7 or 8 in hidden staging in another room. These are not including trains that could be made up by using various locomotives and rolling stock in various yards through out the layout. Being that I am not a big time operator and don't plan on having any op session until we build the big railroad in the out building some day when we hit the lottery. So operating mostly by myself I would say three trains running should keep me running around like a chicken with it's head cut off.
If you wanted to just fill yard spaces with trains and locomotives I don't own enough to fill all the space I will eventually have and thats ok with me. I'm starting to realize unless you have a really big layout less is more.
I can run two trains of about 10 cars at once. While these are running I can switch out two separate areas of just 2-4 cars. However, one of these areas will interfere with the running the mainline unconditionally. Something has to stop. I generally put one on the mainline and let it go. Then run the another one across it and through part of it while the first is on the other side. All DC right now so its pretty hands on button pushing.
I'm not sure how many trains my layout can hold, but as others have indicated, it is a more interesting question to ask how many trains can you run at one time.
I have a DCC powered double mainline and I operate it by myself. My limit is 4 trains, 2 per track, without creating total havoc.
Alton Junction
DrilineComing from Ken, I gotta go with piling trains on the layout occupying space
Actually Driline you are wrong about that assumption. I have around 100 cars off the bench so I can run the trains I mentioned. Which is one of the reasons I asked this question.
Couple of years ago my layout was clutter with rolling stock. I added 47 feet of track with the K-10 mining section being added to the A line. Plus in the last 2 months I added 30 feet to the main layout so I can park whole trains, throw a turnout and take them on to one of the mains.
By my self I can run 4 trains with 2 on each main. With another operator and throttle 2 more trains could be ran. Plus some switching could be done.
Reason my layout is in the garage? Not all Midwestern houses have basements. Besides, my garage has heat, A/C, computer, and stereo system, its my Man Cave.
CNJ831 I really think that in answering this question that it be made absolutely clear whether the respondent is actually running the trains in some sort of meaningful "operations" fashion, or simple piling car/trains on to the layout to occupy space...there is a world of difference between the two situations and the number of cars and trains that can be usefully involved. CNJ831
This is a fair comment, but CNJ831, you seem to make a lot of assumptions about what others do with their model trains.
I know many modelers who are very interested in prototype operation and have designed their layouts around VERY SPECIFIC operational goals, not just picked a plan out of a book or built a bench around the room.
In my case I have made no attempt to model the "beginning" or "end" of the "run" of each scheduled train. My layout is designed around several specific concepts:
Model each major element only once - at least visually - one big yard, one passenger terminal, one engine terminal, one (ok two) industrial areas, one coal mine, etc, etc.
Trains "appear" onto the scene, run through part of it, reach the "citiy", which is a division point with a big yard. Some end there, some just get power changes , some run through, some originate there. Than they proceed through the rest of the scenic portion and return to the "off stage" stagging areas.
In the stagging area the mainline is connected to allow continious running and to allow east bound trains to become west bound and vis versa. Trains can also be turned in the stagging to return from the way they left.
This may not be your idea of operation, but in my view it is the best way to simulate the operations of a large railroad with nearly prototype length trains - not Northerns pulling 12 cars - that looks silly to me (no offense to those of you who do that).
So being able to "park" 20 trains "off stage" is an important part of the track plan and my operational goals.
As he explained, Chuck has a similar view.
So - 20 trains x 35 cars = 700 freight cars.
I live near the ex PRR northeast corridor. In 1947, PRR timetables indicated that a train went through Perryville MD every 12 min. - that's the kind of operation I am modeling. Not this one or two trains wandering through the country side in the course of a day.
Still NEED the 100 locos and the 700 freight cars. Going shopping for the last 200 soon.
Sheldon
cudaken Now I am not asking how many cars or engines you have! But how many complete trains and cars will your track hold and still be ran?
I think that what you are trying to say is either:
a) How many trains will be on your visible layout (ie not in hidden staging) at the same time, during normal operations?
or
b) How many trains will you run in the course of an operating session - this includes trains in staging.
One way of comparing the operating potential of different layouts is using the statistics that Roy Dohn originally came up with, described by Joe Fugate on his Siskiyou layout web site:
http://siskiyou-railfan.net/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.32.1
(No, it won't work for all layouts - for some layouts the model used will break down).
Smile,Stein
I'm adding staging so there's going to be room for 16 trains of up to 30+ cars, I'm expanding my visible yard to a capacity of around 200 cars, with 4 A/D tracks, again at 30+ cars, I've added a branch line with it's own yard that has a capacity of about 50 cars. There are two long sidings out on the main line, and one on the branch, so there's three more trains... Then there's the industrial areas that can generate a train or two themselves during an operation session. At the end of the day, my ops plan has a schedule of 25 to 30 trains.
Now, that doesn't mean there's 900 cars on the layout... Trains moving in and out of staging "recycle" blocks of cars, trains in the visible yards are always being broken down and put back together based on routing of cars and waybills, and a local train will leave the yard with one consist, and come back from its switching duties with a completely different consist.
If you think of your layout as a transportation system, it's a lot harder to obliquely talk about how many trains it holds. It's more like how many trains can potentially be operated on your layout...
Lee
Route of the Alpha Jets www.wmrywesternlines.net
How meaningful is to state, how many "trains" a layout can hold? Regardless of the size the layout, I can run only one train at a time. That´s exactly what I want to do and to be, the engineer driving a train. DCC lets me do that, without going through a hassle of extensive wiring.
The question reminds me of my youth days, where we would ask our friends. A kid who answered "2" had at least a double track oval on his plywood tabletop. A "3" meant something bigger than those 2m by 1m, which were our equivalent to your 4 by 8´s. A "4" meant "My daddy is a rich guy!"
The fun in model railroading does not correlate to the size of a layout.
~G4
19 Years old, modeling the Cowlitz, Chehalis, and Cascade Railroad of Western Washington in 1927 in 6X6 feet.
Sir Madog How meaningful is to state, how many "trains" a layout can hold? Regardless of the size the layout, I can run only one train at a time. That´s exactly what I want to do and to be, the engineer driving a train. DCC lets me do that, without going through a hassle of extensive wiring.
But many of us have groups of friends who participate in "operating sessons" on our layouts. Five to eight operators, a dispatcher, a yard master and/or engine hostler, all "working" at the same time.
Each operator or crew takes another train after they "complete" the movements of one train. So "moving" 5, or 10, or even 20 trains through a "schedule" in a few hours is very easy.
Such large layouts are designed for this type of interactive "operation", just like in real life. This sort of thing goes on quite a bit here in the US WITHOUT it being on a club layout, but rather on private layouts.
Sir MadogThe fun in model railroading does not correlate to the size of a layout.
That's true in many ways, but it also depends on the modeling/operational goals of the individual.
CNJ831Quite honestly, Sheldon, there are pretty much only two acknowledged ways of running a layout. The first to run equipment on your pike with a very definite purpose and operating scheme, with staging, switching, train assignments, car cards, and way bills - the method long advocated by our host . The second method is simply to run one's equipment for "fun" without a real plan, round and round on multiple loops, perhaps combined with running from staging at one end to staging at the other, but without "doing" anything purposeful in between. Now there isn't anything wrong with either approach and I expect that most hobbyists actually fall into that second category. However, the two methods aren't directly comparable when it comes to the potential for trains run. In addition, when the latter approach is taken to its extreme, as one often finds in the case on tinplate layouts although I've seen plenty of examples in HO as well, it simply becomes a game of intentionally seeing just how many short trains can be run on the layout at a time, or in sequence, during a given interval. Few, if any, of these trains are actually under the full control of the operator at a given time, nor have a reason for being on the pike. Now the original question of, "How Many Trains Will Your Layout Hold?" to my mind leans far more toward purposeless staging and running of as many trains as possible in its wording, although I'm rather sure that this wasn't the OP's intent. Nevertheless, without clarification of the operator's approach nothing meaningful can come from any figures presented in the thread. CNJ831.
Agreed, to a point - but again you assume to know and a lot about what people you don't even know are doing.
Sheldon,
I could not agree more - the question should have been, how many trains can be operated on a layout and how many operators can join in the fun! Out of necessity and not by own choice I am "condemned" to be a lone wolf, but I cherish the moments, when I can see my "old gang" to operate our modular layout. It is a single track, 400 feet long (= 6 1/2 miles) narrow gauge branch line with 7 stations and about 5 - 6 trains operating with a timetable. Sharing is part of the fun!
I can't begin to answer your question, since my layout is run in operational mode by a group and the number of trains we dispatch can vary. In fact, since my railroad, though consuming three decks, is all point to point (staging to staging or yard) so the number moving over the mainlines is quite small at a given time. So while your question may be interesting, it is not one that is important or needs an answer for me.
Bob
CNJ831It really doesn't take any second sight to understand what folks here, on average, are doing on their layouts.
And again I will state I must really be the odd ball, my layout plan allows for both. In addition to the operational mode I previously discribed, the mainline and branchline easily redirected into 5 seperate deticated loops to allow for mindless display running.
And, virtually all my industrial switching is completely off the mainline allowing that work to be done with the mainline in either mode - display or serious operation.
Averages are meaningless, and limiting our discussion based on who we think is reading is a negative view in my opinion. New people will not learn about the more complex aspects of the hobby if they are not exposed to them. They may imbrace them, they may not, I'm sure they will have fun in any case.
Your view always seems so negative, "the hobby is dieing", "production runs are smaller", "few people really operate", "every buys more locos than they need", etc,etc. I have been at this for 40 years, and have worked in several hobby shops, I have seen things go up and down, and seen things change, but my outlook has never been so negative like yours.
You seem almost offended by those of us who are doing more, having fun, are happy with the products, and have a positive outlook - sorry if my happiness offends you. Or is just the size of my layout space that offends you? I'm just a little guy, I know lots of people with way more trains/layout than me.
CNJ831and now with DCC often more trains than they can actually fully control at one time.
I still don't know anyone who does this, DCC or otherwise unless the trains are on seperate loops or under some sort of automatic control.