I have been going toPA Dutch country with my wife for almost 25 years
We bike the backroads about 10-15 times a year
A lot of times we get down to Strasburg and the PA RR museum and the Strasburg RR
Love looking at the Nickle Plate Berk trough the fence
In addition PRR Mountain-Mikado-Consolidation-Pacific-Atlantic are out in the yard and can been seen close up
It is bad enough that they are really getting really weather beaten but a couple of years ago the EPA made them take out all the asbestos from the boiler areas .When they were put back together they used ugly huge rivets that make all the trains they have a bad case of hives --real monstrosities
Here is a close up
51% share holder in the ME&O ( Wife owns the other 49% )
ME&O
Here is a pic of the Mountain --SAD
A lot of rivets - very little love.
Dr. Frankendiesel aka Scott Running BearSpace Mouse for president!15 year veteran fire fighterCollector of Apple //e'sRunning Bear EnterprisesHistory Channel Club life member.beatus homo qui invenit sapientiam
Bob,
While I am in no way defending the state of these locos, the rivets on the boilers were ALWAYS there. The thing that is missing is the insulating jacket (made of asbestos) with the thin steel cladding over it. I understand that the paint used on the boilers is a very heavy duty paint, and I assume the cladding is in store somewhere for when the locos can be put under cover and restored. The E6s is supposed to be having a full restoration in the next few years, and I expect that is the long term goal for all the locos. I believe there is a long term plan to build a roundhouse for the locos.
Ed
Ed is correct..
What they need to do is make sheet metal jackets as replacements for the removed insulating jackets.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Eddie_waltersBob, While I am in no way defending the state of these locos, the rivets on the boilers were ALWAYS there. The thing that is missing is the insulating jacket (made of asbestos) with the thin steel cladding over it. I understand that the paint used on the boilers is a very heavy duty paint, and I assume the cladding is in store somewhere for when the locos can be put under cover and restored. The E6s is supposed to be having a full restoration in the next few years, and I expect that is the long term goal for all the locos. I believe there is a long term plan to build a roundhouse for the locos. Ed
I'm a contributing member of the Friends of the Railroad Museum of PA. Unfortunately the asbestos abatement had to be done at the Museum's expense, and so replacement of the boiler lagging is awaiting funding. Right now the big push is the restoration of the E6 Atlantic, also known as the "Lindburgh engine" (interesting story if you care to Google it). Restoration will include replacement of the boiler sheathing.
There are a lot of things going on at the Museum, including the recent construction of the new entrance necessitated by increased visitation over the past few years. Right now the challenge is balancing the long list of necessary stabilization and restoration work with the economy being what it is coupled with decreasing funding from Harrisburg.
It's a challenge, but with the ongoing popularity of the Strasburg RR across the street, the Museum is not in huge danger. That said, there will be much that will have to wait until better times, so I would expect the boiler sheathing to remain off on most of the pieces for a long time to come.
You may want to consider joining the Friends of the Railroad Museum of PA not only to keep in the loop on what's going on, but also to help. I don't know if this is in conflict with MR forum policy, but it goes to the heart of preserving what we all love.
Modeling the Rio Grande Southern First District circa 1938-1946 in HOn3.
Just for the record...
The big, ugly rivets are flexible staybolt caps. Kind of an acorn/hex shape and they had a copper gasket under them to hold boiler steam pressure.
Staybolts were needed to support the flat areas of the firebox as the steam pressure exerted on a flat surface would cause the sheets to bulge, then rupture if not "stayed" or reinforced. A common boiler explosion occured when the relatively flat "crown sheet" was overheated by lack of water and the staybolts would pull away from the sheet in a violent manner. Staybolts were usually drilled with a small weep hole to help the boilermaker find a broken one.
The "flexible" staybolt had a kind of ball-and-socket arrangement to allow the sheets to expand and contract due to temperature differences and the acorn nut covered this ball-joint and sealed in the boiler steam pressure.
Thanks... ED
yes, you are looking at the raw boiler minus jacket. The jacket and lagging insulate to keep heat in, coolness out so you can work around the boiler if needed. Still quite hot.
They more likely gave it the paint job to protect the engines, its actually better to do it like this than to have the jacket on as the jacket and lagging will just collect water and start to be a rust haven all over them. I would reccomend they not put the jackets on unless they plan to operate the engine sometime.
What they did is actually protecting the engines better. They would need the original jackets stored as forms to make new jackets.
I was actually surprised they had not de-abestoseized the engines, it woulda had to happen sooner or later anyways so its a good thing they did.
765 first restoration had abestos lagging,,...off it went, and a non abestos insulation was found, but we had to cut it up, water it down into a mushy mud, then physically slap it onto the boiler like playdoh.
New jackets were made and looks good as new, and BTW, 765 has finished its 2nd restoration and is running some excursions this year and will be at the trainfest in michigan in July
UncBob Here is a pic of the Mountain --SAD
Number 6755 Is my Favorite loco of all time. When I first saw her, I fell in love. I really wish she could be restored. But *alas*.....
-G .
Just my thoughts, ideas, opinions and experiences. Others may vary.
HO and N Scale.
After long and careful thought, they have convinced me. I have come to the conclusion that they are right. The aliens did it.
Any how the ones accross the street are looking magnificent
And they run.
If I had a spare billion, I'd give it to some of these museums so they could make thes locos RUN, not just restore them cosmetically for display. They seem to have a much greater interest in England on having old preserved equipment actually run. And also enough people interested in running them so the art of operating a steam locomotive does not get lost as the old-timers pass on. Don't get me started on the overblown asbestos scare, that would lead to a not allowed here political discussion.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
rrinker And they run. If I had a spare billion, I'd give it to some of these museums so they could make thes locos RUN, not just restore them cosmetically for display. They seem to have a much greater interest in England on having old preserved equipment actually run. And also enough people interested in running them so the art of operating a steam locomotive does not get lost as the old-timers pass on. Don't get me started on the overblown asbestos scare, that would lead to a not allowed here political discussion. --Randy
Tracks Ahead just did a segment on the next generation of steam mechanics that are being trained now. Still seems to be a lot of interest. They probably caused more contamination by removing them than just leaving them alone. Way to go EPA!
Looks like the Prince got kissed back into a frog!Rivit! Rivit!
M.C. Fujiwara
My YouTube Channel (How-to's, Layout progress videos)
Silicon Valley Free-moN
I think it's better to see the engines in this state, where they are at least protected from the damage that can occur under a leaky jacket. Compare this to the shambles that is the outdoor collection at the B&O museum in Baltimore, and you'll dry your eyes pretty quickly. The B&O has a Mikado and a President series Pacific out in its yard just rotting away. I think they finally moved the C&O streamlined steamer into the back shop, but it too suffered some pretty heavy "weathering".
The B&O Museum does do a good job of preserving its 19th century antiquities, but some of the bigger 20th century stuff is pathetic.
Lee
Route of the Alpha Jets www.wmrywesternlines.net
Out here in Utah UP's 833 (844's sister) is under shelter, but without boiler jacket at the Ogden Railroad Museum. I had wondered the reason for displaying it like this. Now I know.
Phil, I'm not a rocket scientist; they are my students.
You are correct for the most part loathar. Asbestos is ralativly safe as long as it is sealed in place and not tampered with. The problems arise when someone who is not trained in the proper removal of asbestos breaks that seal while doing repairs or to remove some coated pipes and allows the fibres to float free for people to inhale. (Can you say Asbestosis). Once the sealing cover is removed, it's like opening a can of worms and finding a Pit Viper staring you in the face from close range. It is extremely hazardous to your health.
As a Gas Company Service Supervisor, I had to ensure that ALL the Servicemen under me AND myself had to take a training course on the dangers of asbestos and in the proper handling of it when you came across it. This included FULL body suits, shoe covers, gloves and full face respirator.
On a positive note, It is great to see Mr. Vollmer and his travelling door N Scale empire back on the Forums and here's hoping that the Museum finds the $$$ to bring these beauties back to life soon.
Blue Flamer.
Here is a picture of their Berk
I wonder why it wasn't touched
TjsingleIn 1996 the rivets were not noticeable look...
Because, as you'll see if you look closely, the lagging and cladding were still fitted in 1996. The rivets are still there, just hidden under the lagging. The risk from asbestos is present in several ways - one is, if the cladding corrodes and exposes the lagging, then asbestos particles can escape into the atmosphere. The other thing is, if these locos are to be restored and put under cover, they will require a lot of work on them, and it's simply not safe for people to work around without protective equipment. Like it or not, asbestos is really nasty stuff.