CNW 6000If you smoked (ex-smokers might have more insight, maybe?) and your club asked you not to is that the kind of thing that makes you walk away from the club?
I'd either step out the back door, or go sit in my car for a few minutes. Then again, I'm used to having to "go do a weather check." More to the point, no, that in and of itself would not make me quit a club.
Chris
The Cedar cRapids Industrial Branch: Proudly Shipping Yesterday's CrunchBerries Tomorrow!
AmanaMedic -Agreed. I don't think it's that big a deal these days for folks to just expect to have to step outside for a butt. Now I will say that I tend not to patronize restaurants that don't at least have a smoking section.
loatharNow I will say that I tend not to patronize restaurants that don't at least have a smoking section.
Going off topic here for a moment, please indulge me. You'll hate Iowa as last year the state legislature outlawed indoor smoking state-wide. All restaraunts, bars, businesses...smoke free. Even if you own your own business, you can't smoke in it anymore. I think the only places it's legal are: your house, your car, and the gaming floor of a casino (but the employees can't go smoke in their break room).
And yeah, "these days" it isn't a big deal to have to step out. Almost everyplace I've worked, you had to step outside. It wasn't law, just the decree of the man who's name was on the property title. Now, it's law...
Ontario has recently started towards not allowing smoking inside cars that are occupied by children as well as not allowing smoking in company vehicles. There was also a recent change that said if you were smoking you did this outside of a 30 foot radius of an entrance----this directly influenced a number of clubs into just saying forget about smoking------period.
Any argument carried far enough will end up in Semantics--Hartz's law of rhetoric Emerald. Leemer and Southern The route of the Sceptre Express Barry
I just started my blog site...more stuff to come...
http://modeltrainswithmusic.blogspot.ca/
pastorbob I am not a club, but have a large layout with operators who come regularily. Mine is strickly NO SMOKING, and I include dipping and chewing in that. Visitors who come, or tours who come are given the same information. Scenery can burn, carpet will burn, curtains along the layout can burn, the nicotine will cause problems with pick up and electrical items, plus someone can get burned. NO SMOKING Bob
I am not a club, but have a large layout with operators who come regularily. Mine is strickly NO SMOKING, and I include dipping and chewing in that. Visitors who come, or tours who come are given the same information. Scenery can burn, carpet will burn, curtains along the layout can burn, the nicotine will cause problems with pick up and electrical items, plus someone can get burned.
NO SMOKING
Bob
Naptown rule: If there's smoking anywhere in the building that is not a gimmic of an engine, it means you d*** well better rip your engine off the layout before you fry more than the decoder. No exceptions.
-Morgan
CNW 6000Would any of you join, theoretically, knowing smokers are already "in"?
No, I'd go elsewhere.
Now I'm a fella with a heart of gold;
And the ways of a gentleman I've been told;
The kind of a guy that wouldn't even harm a flea.
But if me and a certain character met;
The guy that invented the cigarette;
I'd murder that son-of-a-gun in the first degree.
It ain't that I don't smoke myself;
And I don't reckon it'll harm my health;
I been smokin'em all my life and I ain't dead yet.
But nicotine slaves are all the same;
At a pettin' party or a poker game;
Everything's gotta stop while they smoke that cigarette!
I quit smoking on 14 April, 2004; spending 27 days in the hospital with a ruptured appendix will do that to you.
The club I joined in Mass in '65--that's 1965; it just seems like 1865--had a strict rule about smoking in the layout room; this policy had less to do with health--it was within 18 months of the famous Surgeon General's report on the effect of smoking and health--and more to do with mess. They had only recently adopted this rule and had been brought about because a decade long rule against smoking at trackside had reached the point of total disobedience--again prompted by mess--and so they had banned smoking all together except in the crew lounge. No one reallyseemed too awfully upset by it.
I suppose there are health issues to be considered but if nothing else smoking tends to be smelly and messy.
From the far, far reaches of the wild, wild west I am: rtpoteet
I'm sort of stuck in this too. I was a smoker for 8 years, albeit light smoker, but non the less. I recently quite and now I can't even stand it. My gf smokes and if I get to close I start coughing. Can't even stand the smell anymore. I scold her because she will smoke in the car or in the bathroom and then the smell just gets punctated because it was in an enclosed space. I'm even thinking of returning my car back to no-smoking. After all, it was for the first 10 years of it's existance when my parents owned it. Technically I'm the 3rd owner, but it was one of those deals where someone bought the car brand new and after a very short time (I think only a few months) was returned to the dealer where my parents bought it. So as far as I'm concerned I'm only the cars 2nd owner.
But back to the subjects, as mentioned I don't like smoking, and am at the point were I can't stand it. But, I was also a smoker for some years so I know how it is to be one. Being told where to smoke, when to smoke. I'm a non-smoker now but I still believe in smokers rights. This BS going around about banning smoking in bars is, well just what I said. So I came up with a compromise idea. If I am holding a session with smokers they can smoke before or after the session, and never in the train room. This will be easy for me to hold true though because I wouldn't have any more operators than needed, and only 1 man crews. The train room won't be big enough to hand 4 or 5 two-man crews once with layout is up. If they want a smoke they can go in the living room, or outside. I don't know I thought our apartment was going to switch to all non-smoking but I guess that was just for the public areas, not the actual apartments. This is all assuming I live with a smoker. If my gf quiets, like she should be doing, then it will switch to no smoking unless they go outside. And as long as everyone agrees, I see no problems with pausing in the middle of an operating session for a smoke break. Assuming of course everyone knows where they left off.
Our club is in a smoke free building, so we really don't have a choice in the matter. We sort of informally banned smoking about 20 years ago when we realized that nobody in the club was a smoker anyhow.
Check out some of the Old MRs from the 40s and 50s. A lot of photos show guys lit up and enjoying there railroad,be it club or at home. But,then of course none of those guys are around anymore. Kinda interesting how times have changed. I think though that its pretty well understood that theres no smoking inside. A lot of bars out this way and in WA state have gone to Beer Gardens on the premises so that patrons can smoke. BILL
Tin hat on.
I think I'm in a minority of one here as I smoke cigars and pipeweed.
At the club, smoking inside has been banned for over 10 years. Over here in England, it has also been banned in all public buildings and most outside public venues for nearly 2 years.
At home I still smoke my cigars in the train room (in the basement). I have an extractor fan down there. If I have a guest or guests over to operate the layout, we'll puff away merrily if we're all smokers. If one of the guests is a non-smoker, then it's 'no smoking' in the basement.
Regarding dirty rails, I know that rubber-based track cleaning blocks leave far more gunk on the rails than smoking ever did.
Jon
Sweethome Chicago is now on Facebook
Sweethome Alabama is now on Facebook
Hudson Road is now on Facebook
my videos
my Railimages
I started smoking again about a year ago. One of those dirty habits I wished I had never started years ago. We have been in our home for 18 years now, my wife does not smoke either. I don't or ever have smoked in my home ever. In Illinois here its a law now with bars and cafe's, and most or all public places. So I guess its a law in my home set by my wife and should be the same everywhere. I don't have a problem with smoker's but they can take their butt outside like everyone else.
reklein Check out some of the Old MRs from the 40s and 50s. A lot of photos show guys lit up and enjoying there railroad,be it club or at home. But,then of course none of those guys are around anymore. Kinda interesting how times have changed. I think though that its pretty well understood that theres no smoking inside. A lot of bars out this way and in WA state have gone to Beer Gardens on the premises so that patrons can smoke. BILL
There was an issue from about 1981 or so with UP turbines at a pair of tunnels (Sherman Hill?) on the cover with exhaust coming out of the one tunnel. In the Bull Session article, there were some pictures of the making of the cover. One of the photos showed a smoker blowing into a tube to blow the smoke into the tunnel for the exhaust.
Kevin
http://chatanuga.org/RailPage.html
http://chatanuga.org/WLMR.html
AlienKingDan, I know you guys have quite a bit of workbench space in the basement there. Have you considered a combination smoking lounge and extra large paint booth with a generous amount of fans, filters, and venting?
That we do...but we can't put in a paint booth and/or other ventilation. There's some municipal code and the Fire Inspector had a fit that we had a paint booth at one pointm, even though it was equipped with fans and we only used it when we could vent to the outside. Our layout room is about 55x110 and the 'meeting' room is about 14x30. That back area (we call shops I guess) is maybe 12x15. I don't know what size ventilation/fans/ducts we'd have to have to vent the place better but it'd be pretty sizable! In my experience that also means expensive...and we're on a limited budget. Even with the paltry rent we're charged.
Dan
Here in Minnesota you basically can't smoke in any building anywhere except (maybe) your own house. If you wanna smoke - go out in the snow !!
Luckily I've never smoked so it's not a problem for me...though going up and down the stairs to the basement does leave me "puffing" some as I get older.
Well I brought the idea up tonight (briefly) as something we need to discuss on and come up with an answer to in the near future. There was much wailing about "we all have the right to smoke" and gnashing of teeth. I replied that those of us have rights too: to not breath that kind of air. I guanantee the actual meeting will be...spirited...in nature. One of the guys in the club actually walked out. Stopped his train, parked it and walked out mumbling about BS.
In response to CNW 6000 and what happened at the meeting….
I actually did this once and it truly got my point across.
A number of years ago I chewed a bit of plug and while at a staff party, I was seated at a round table with a smoker (spouse of a co-worker) that just “HAD to SMOKE” while eating! To say the least…It turned my stomach! I just couldn’t deal with the smell drifting across the table. After all, I was trying to enjoy a wonderful meal with wonderful friends /co-workers.
I asked nicely, if he would refrain from smoking until we had our meal (others at the table even nodded with approval of my request)...And he totally blew me off grumbling about his right to enjoy a smoke.
I quietly got up, walked to the lobby and “took” a chew! I walked back to the table and sat back down. With in a few minutes I got up, walked around to his side of the table and spit in his ash tray. OH My…you would have thought somebody had just assonated the Pope!
I just said “you’ve got your rights and I’ve got mine”. He didn’t smoke at the table for the rest of the evening!
No smoking is permitted in our home or the layout room. Likewise no smoking is permitted in the LK&R Ry. Clubhouse.
Cigarette smoke leads to discolouring scenery and the room itself. Most of our members don't smoke either. I think there are only two smokers out of 17 members.
colvinbackshop In response to CNW 6000 and what happened at the meeting…. I actually did this once and it truly got my point across. A number of years ago I chewed a bit of plug and while at a staff party, I was seated at a round table with a smoker (spouse of a co-worker) that just “HAD to SMOKE” while eating! To say the least…It turned my stomach! I just couldn’t deal with the smell drifting across the table. After all, I was trying to enjoy a wonderful meal with wonderful friends /co-workers. I asked nicely, if he would refrain from smoking until we had our meal (others at the table even nodded with approval of my request)...And he totally blew me off grumbling about his right to enjoy a smoke. I quietly got up, walked to the lobby and “took” a chew! I walked back to the table and sat back down. With in a few minutes I got up, walked around to his side of the table and spit in his ash tray. OH My…you would have thought somebody had just assonated the Pope! I just said “you’ve got your rights and I’ve got mine”. He didn’t smoke at the table for the rest of the evening!I guess that what I’m saying is that any change will ruffle some feathers…But the question is: Is it for the good and betterment of all.
Love your right to enjoy a chew and your response.
Our current club building is non-smoking. The smokers go outside. All of our clubhouses have been non-smoking.
I wish the people I live with were as considerate. No smoking in my basement, but it seems to finds its way down onto my track in the basement from upstairs.
I feel I have the right to breathe. If somebody wants to pollute themselves, that is their choice. If their polluting infringes on my ability to breathe, we have a problem.
A club especially should be non-smoking. A positive image of the club is not possible if smoking as allowed in the building.
Mike WSOR engineer | HO scale since 1988 | Visit our club www.WCGandyDancers.com
I'm really happy to see this topic has remained civil and unlocked! I never thought it would make it past the first page.
Colvin-Yep, nothing nastier than a plug of chew to turn somebody's stomach!
loathar Yep, nothing nastier than a plug of chew to turn somebody's stomach!
Yep, nothing nastier than a plug of chew to turn somebody's stomach!
I'll second that. At my last job, we weren't allowed to smoke in offices, even before the Ohio smoking ban. However, in my department, I had a couple coworkers who didn't smoke but chewed. Nothing made me nearly lose my stomach more than going to their cubicles, talking with them, and then they stop talking to spit.
Mr. SPCigarette smoke leads to discoloring scenery and the room itself.
Cigarette smoke leads to discoloring scenery and the room itself.
loatharI'm really happy to see this topic has remained civil and unlocked! I never thought it would make it past the first page.
My dad was a pack a day smoker (unfiltered) and he dropped dead from a heart attack at age 55. Several relatives on my wife's side of the family are smokers and I often wonder how they can afford to support their habit. It's no wonder they're always broke.
I still to this day can't figure out how the government can justify supporting the tobacco farmers with subsidies.
My dad was a pack a day smoker (unfiltered) and he dropped dead way too early in life from a heart attack at age 55. Several relatives on my wife's side of the family are smokers and I often wonder how they can afford to support their habit. It's no wonder they're always broke.
Left Coast RailIt might be because we haven't had any smokers trying to defend the habit.
There's nothing to "defend." I smoke. I made the conscious decision to start knowing full well the things will eventually lead to my demise. Then again, what in this day and age isn't working to shorten my life? The dirtly little secret, is we are ALL born with cancer cells in us. The question becomes if/when they will be activated. Plus, I could quit smoking tomorrow...I will still die. Nobody has ever gotten out of life alive. I'll say this also, if/when the smokes get me, I won't be crying for the govt. to squeeze more money out of the tabacco companies. Again, I made the choice. Joe Camel didn't put a hoof upside my head, The Marlboro Man didn't hog-tie me and stick a butt in my mouth. I made the choice, I live with the consequences.
I'm a firm defender of private property rights though, which means the owner of the building should be the one to decide if smoking is allowed or not. The Iowa legislature sees things differently. I smoke, but as owner of my house, I have decided I will smoke outside...mostly because of the discoloration and residue issues, but also to be considerate of my non-smoking wife and dog.
I said it before, I'll say it again. IF I were in a state that allowed indoor smoking...and the club said "no, you don't, not in here." Fine, I'll step outside. When the weather sucks, I can sit in my vehicle. NOT A BIG DEAL.
Left Coast RailI still to this day can't figure out how the government can justify supporting the tobacco farmers with subsidies.
That one is simple: the govt. subsidizes tobacco farmers because fewer people are smoking (due to the govt.), so to keep the farmers in business, the govt. helps them out. Plus, since the govt. (state and now federal) has become so dependent on us smokers to fund various initiatives, the govt. can't afford to have us no longer smoke...so they have to support the tobacco farmers to keep producing the product for us to smoke to thus put money back into the coffers. Some say "why don't they just ban smoking alltogether?" The govt. never will...too many social and health programs depend on it.
To quote Limbaugh: "always follow the money."
And, for what it's worth, I too never thought this thread would last this long. I expected a flame war and padlock long before now. It is refreshing to see adult, civil discussion here.
I've been to tobacco country and I know that the soil and climate is perfectly suitable for many other more worthwhile crops like food. The tobacco lobby is what is keeping the money flowing. The government can always find a new source of revenue once one dries up.
Thankfully this isn't an issue at my club's layout.
Left Coast Rail The government can always find a new source of revenue once one dries up.
I'll agree with you 100% on that...and it's sad that it's so true. So many "vices" to tax...so many behaviors to modify.
I'll stop here.