SunsetLimited wrote:Actually i just called Bob and bought the last one, i know i said it was an impluse but for the price and the fact that i have always wanted one, i just had to buy it. IM sure its going to be a great engine, even if it sits in a display case.
Glad to see that it turned out for both of you. I have a Niagara and a PRR J1 from Outlet Direct. The Niagara had to be returned after a few months due to a faulty decoder, which they replaced. All it cost me was US$7.00 for return postage. As far as I am concerned, buying returns from them is the way to go. Both engines look perfect and perform flawlessly, and for 2/3 the MSRP.
Hey Ed! Thanks for the Tip! Mine is scheduled to arrive on the 31'st in Arkansas. It did not move on sunday probably because UPS actually took the day off in that part of Florida.
Have a great week!
cazephyr,
Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests.
I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine.
He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions)
I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI.
Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations:
BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders.
We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive.
This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner.
Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items?
I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth.
Jon
I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time.
jondrd wrote: cazephyr, Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests. I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine. He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions) I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI. Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations: BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders. We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive. This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner. Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time.
Wow!
That is not questioning, that is grilling. =)
If you did not ask them, I probably would.
Look, I knew squat about BLI until One Track Mind demonstrated a new Hudson 4-6-4 several years ago. I think back then the asking price was 200- for this engine but hesitant because memory is not certain. I saw this product moving back and forth on the track with sounds that were VERY VERY good. Loud too. I did express a concern with steam pulling power and purchased a Athearn Genesis Mike instead. (With no sound)
My expectations were not met with the Athearn Genesis Mike and decided to replace it with the new BLI Heavy Mike with sound which was not that much more expensive after I sold off the Athearn Mike on ebay for about what I paid for it. That for me was the beginning of a GREAT journey back into HO steam when I saw for myself just how well this engine performed with a bunch of cars.
Virtually all of my engines but two are BLI one is a little upstart 4-4-0 from MRC and Roundhouse. Every time I deal with the company they are everything a company should be.
enough of this. Now on to Tooling etc.
As I understand it, we have these engines made overseas. China or Korea or some place. In my very simple mind I worry that a Chinese Worker making 2 dollars a day assembling these engines by the dozen for us American Buyers who dont know how to live on less than 100 dollars a day.
What happens 10 years from now when this same Chinese Worker experiences what we Americans experienced in the late 50's and started moving into modern living and requires a 100 dollar a day salary to work at the choo choo factory?? Huh? Answer me that.
Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products for customers like us.
I say build factories right here in the USA with our own tooling and keep the costs down. Sell these engines at a reasonable price to the hobby shops and dump the old stuff onto the FDT in case the customer was not able to secure a copy before seeing it all sold out.
While we are at it, why not just close out engine sales to hobby shops totally and have the john q public buy engines off the internet only? We
selector wrote:This thread has taken on a new theme, but I'll go along for a bit. The real issue is that at some point, all the manufacturing countries will begin to insist that they be paid in their own currency. When this happens, the USD will drop in value like a used condom. That is when the proverbial poo will make successive impacts with a rotating airmoving device.
Hear Hear!
Am so deserving of the splatter if this thread got derailed by my ill-though out rant. =)
Eddie_walters wrote:An interesting point, I thought, was that there was a 20th Century Limited set mentioned - I assume that if this is so, there's a good possibility that a PRR Broadway Limited set might come as well (given that the cars are very similiar - a different window arrangement there, a heavyweight diner here...)!
The 20th Century will be interesting, but they have not addressed the Broadway Limited, even though they call their company the Broadway Limited. After the K4 and the T1, I would have guessed the Broadway was next.
Then they announce the Streamlined Hudson and cars both coming next year. Go figure.
We also need the Broadway cars if we are to stage that famous race leaving Chicago at 8:00 AM every day during the late thirties and forties era.
Many of the Rivarossi cars are correct or very close for the Broadway Limited and you can make that train up for a lot less money.
Thanks for asking the questions that we were asking about BLI/ PCM at the show.
Some of our questions were out of curiosity and some out of concern where their market is going in the future. I like their products overall and have way too many of them to continue without future support from their company.
The story about why the original pardner and CEO is nice and I wish it to be true, but it is not what insiders in this market said what really happened. Yes he had been around for many years and was probably ready to go.
I have never questioned anyone at a show since they have a spin on the story, but I do appreciate your asking. I would think they are concerned about future reservations since many dealers are not so happy at this time about the blow outs and loss of business locally.
I got the impression from their annoucement that the Hudson was going to be produced, but if I read it correctly, that depends on reservations. The $400k figure seems expensive, but is that is the cost today of a complete project in China or does it include the cost here and production there also??
Did they mention the absolute minimum reservations for any project to continue??
Thanks again for posting.
jondrd wrote: Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time.
I noticed the question about Factory Direct Trains. Their new list on line is more in line with Hobby shops than the first list. I wonder if all that complaining from dealers had anything to do with FDT's prices going up.
I still like the price I paid for my second PM Big Boy at FDT.
Thanks again for asking.
Safety Valve wrote: jondrd wrote: cazephyr, Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests. I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine. He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions) I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI. Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations: BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders. We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive. This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner. Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time. Wow! That is not questioning, that is grilling. =)If you did not ask them, I probably would.Look, I knew squat about BLI until One Track Mind demonstrated a new Hudson 4-6-4 several years ago. I think back then the asking price was 200- for this engine but hesitant because memory is not certain. I saw this product moving back and forth on the track with sounds that were VERY VERY good. Loud too. I did express a concern with steam pulling power and purchased a Athearn Genesis Mike instead. (With no sound)My expectations were not met with the Athearn Genesis Mike and decided to replace it with the new BLI Heavy Mike with sound which was not that much more expensive after I sold off the Athearn Mike on ebay for about what I paid for it. That for me was the beginning of a GREAT journey back into HO steam when I saw for myself just how well this engine performed with a bunch of cars.Virtually all of my engines but two are BLI one is a little upstart 4-4-0 from MRC and Roundhouse. Every time I deal with the company they are everything a company should be.enough of this. Now on to Tooling etc.As I understand it, we have these engines made overseas. China or Korea or some place. In my very simple mind I worry that a Chinese Worker making 2 dollars a day assembling these engines by the dozen for us American Buyers who dont know how to live on less than 100 dollars a day.What happens 10 years from now when this same Chinese Worker experiences what we Americans experienced in the late 50's and started moving into modern living and requires a 100 dollar a day salary to work at the choo choo factory?? Huh? Answer me that.Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products for customers like us.I say build factories right here in the USA with our own tooling and keep the costs down. Sell these engines at a reasonable price to the hobby shops and dump the old stuff onto the FDT in ca "We have met the enemy and he is us" Pogo via the art of Walt Kelly Reply SunsetLimited Member sinceJuly 2006 134 posts Posted by SunsetLimited on Monday, January 29, 2007 7:26 PM Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?) Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 29, 2007 8:04 PM jondrd wrote: Safety Valve wrote: jondrd wrote: cazephyr, Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests. I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine. He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions) I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI. Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations: BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders. We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive. This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner. Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time. Wow! That is not questioning, that is grilling. =)If you did not ask them, I probably would.Look, I knew squat about BLI until One Track Mind demonstrated a new Hudson 4-6-4 several years ago. I think back then the asking price was 200- for this engine but hesitant because memory is not certain. I saw this product moving back and forth on the track with sounds that were VERY VERY good. Loud too. I did express a concern with steam pulling power and purchased a Athearn Genesis Mike instead. (With no sound)My expectations were not met with the Athearn Genesis Mike and decided to replace it with the new BLI Heavy Mike with sound which was not that much more expensive after I sold off the Athearn Mike on ebay for about what I paid for it. That for me was the beginning of a GREAT journey back into HO steam when I saw for myself just how well this engine performed with a bunch of cars.Virtually all of my engines but two are BLI one is a little upstart 4-4-0 from MRC and Roundhouse. Every time I deal with the company they are everything a company should be.enough of this. Now on to Tooling etc.As I understand it, we have these engines made overseas. China or Korea or some place. In my very simple mind I worry that a Chinese Worker making 2 dollars a day assembling these engines by the dozen for us American Buyers who dont know how to live on less than 100 dollars a day.What happens 10 years from now when this same Chinese Worker experiences what we Americans experienced in the late 50's and started moving into modern living and requires a 100 dollar a day salary to work at the choo choo factory?? Huh? Answer me that.Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 29, 2007 8:06 PM SunsetLimited wrote: Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?) I am waiting patiently for UPS to arrive. It sat for 30 hours in Jacksonville before finally moving again. It should arrive sometime midweek. I would prefer that they fly it in instead of trucking it across, but am content to have a copy on the way after all this time trying to find one.I will try and see if I can find a copy of your Phase 4 car. There might be one around somewhere as some of the folks here are followers of Amtrack. Reply Edit jondrd Member sinceApril 2003 From: US 625 posts Posted by jondrd on Monday, January 29, 2007 11:00 PM Eddie_walters, BLI almost "owes" PRR modelers a passenger consist! BLI=Broadway Limited Imports. Hmm, PRR's premier varnish to Chicago was 'The Broadway Limited", seems to make sense they would produce a consist for same. BLI made a K4, T1, GG1; give these models the proper varnish to pull. You and your peer PRR modelers can make it happen, write BLI and if necessary make a reservation for PRR varnish. As far as "owing" PRR modelers, think about it. Organization calls itself Broadway Limited Imports and their first offering is a NYC Hudson. Make that a double Log that as a "you owe us PRR fans one"! Per my conversation with BLI owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA this past weekend BLI will gladly produce that which will sell. Per his conversation he and his peer manufactuers are moving to a business model which is driven by reservations and limited production runs. This is a common sense business decision in that no one in the model train business is clairvoyent as to what will sell and in what quantities. Not using this type of model can result in a tremendously successful model followed by a disasterously unsuccessful one. You never know. What you and I passionately want produced may not be what everyone else wants. The manufacturer sells a model to you and me and everyone else buys some other manufacturer's offering. The BLI owner did mention that the competition is heating up and that places a premium on consistently good decisions on what to produce. Walthers/Proto 2K, Athearn Genesis, InterMountain and Bachmann Spectrum are now offering sound/DC/DCC locos to what used to be a premium non brass analog market. BLI opened up the dimensions of this market by being first to market locos to this market with QSI sound on board. Their singular position no longer exists in the market they redefined so pressure to do it right on what models to produce has increased. BLI's recently announced BlueLine with proprietary sound on board is another aspect of countering the competition. BLI says proprietary sound system eliminates expensive licensing fees to QSI and LokSound(PCM locos) for using their systems. Cost reductions in product should enable very competitive pricing relative to the competition. We shall see. Again, write and let BLI know what you would like to see made. Your input combined with others requesting such and such model may help fine tune the evolving business model of what should be produced. Jon "We have met the enemy and he is us" Pogo via the art of Walt Kelly Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 12:39 PM The T1 arrived today a little bit freezing cold from it's trip. The box was in good shape, Engine and Tender wrapped properly, foam intact. Nice fat manual, papers with big pictures showing how to lube it and....Aha! A Hex tool, spare bolts and screws, drive wheels with flanges, Volume control tab etcetera.Im going to let it warm up and adapt to room temp over night before workbench testing. It is a HEAVY engine, I wonder if this is a brute like it was in real life? Im going to have to seriously consider model bridges to carry this engine in the future. A quick inspection showed the front coupler is a dummy secured with a screw. I can probably drop a kaydee into it (With a insulated shank) or maybe leave it be once I clip that one molded plastic hose out of the way for it to swivel all the way. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:01 PM I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited. Reply CAZEPHYR Member sinceJuly 2006 3,264 posts Posted by CAZEPHYR on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:09 PM selector wrote: I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited.The T1 was a solid rigid frame engine, but the model has the # 2 and # 3 drivers blind, which allows it to run on most curves. The prototype did not use blind drivers. I have run my T1 on a large club layout and it ran flawless for several hours on a passenger train. It is a great model of a really interesting locomotive. Reply SunsetLimited Member sinceJuly 2006 134 posts Posted by SunsetLimited on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:44 PM Yeah i got mine Monday and i love it, its my new favorite steamer (i just got my AC6000 so that is top dog), it runs and sounds great, i to had a turnout that it did not like but that was the only issue spot and its where two tables meet so i can easily fix it. Its a great looking engine, now i need some more pennsy cars to pull :) Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 9:30 PM Well. We are going to need some passenger cars for it so that a recreation of the famous race with a NYC Steam Hudson can be recreated.I spent several happy hours today programming it. Then took it apart and lubed it. Those gear towers showed bone dry gears. Hit all the rods as well.At first glance the valve gear looks like it got mashed but I think they work ok but will definatly keep an eye on all of those bolts.She is a wee bit "Slippery" and there are no traction tires that I can see. So... I think the J1 might provide some helper service from time to time.I have purchased many engines with Broadway but this is the first engine that was disassembled to be lubed (Now on to the others) and one that behaves as if impatient to take a train out. Good think it's on DCC control I cannot imagine analog for this brute.While adjusting the volume of the bell I could pick out the clapper apparently making a bigger swing until the bell reaches it's full motion, I think that was a nice touch. The dynamo was a bit too loud, drove my cats nuts so I turned it down to a value of 10 out of 15 and it worked out well.It's a good thing I got into those gear towers and lubed them, she probably would have failed at some point down the road being so dry. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:40 PM Thank-you for letting us know. I have only ever lifted the boiler on my first loco, the Hudson, and don't recall noticing that the gear tower was dry. But, none of my locos have a lot of time on them, and all get lubed in the outer parts within an hour's break-in time. Now that you post this observation, I guess I will have to satisfy myself that everything is okay in their innards. It will be good for me to learn to take each of them apart anyway. I tend to be timid about such things. Apart from the sagging turnout centre that it found, there was one other place where it began to spin leaving the yard lead, a 8" section of flex between two opposing #7.5 curved turnouts. Come to think of it, sometimes others have paused a bit at that spot, but kept going. I placed a straightedge over it and shone a light into the rails to see if there was a gap. The closest rail to me was maybe 1/32" low, and the section had a slight sag in it generally. I used card stock and shimmed where needed, and everything is now peachy. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:54 PM Yeesh. I think we bought a track tester device.I am going over each of my engines this weekend, it's been a year since they were lubed anyhow. Reply Edit 12 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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I say build factories right here in the USA with our own tooling and keep the costs down. Sell these engines at a reasonable price to the hobby shops and dump the old stuff onto the FDT in ca
Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?)
jondrd wrote: Safety Valve wrote: jondrd wrote: cazephyr, Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests. I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine. He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions) I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI. Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations: BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders. We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive. This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner. Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time. Wow! That is not questioning, that is grilling. =)If you did not ask them, I probably would.Look, I knew squat about BLI until One Track Mind demonstrated a new Hudson 4-6-4 several years ago. I think back then the asking price was 200- for this engine but hesitant because memory is not certain. I saw this product moving back and forth on the track with sounds that were VERY VERY good. Loud too. I did express a concern with steam pulling power and purchased a Athearn Genesis Mike instead. (With no sound)My expectations were not met with the Athearn Genesis Mike and decided to replace it with the new BLI Heavy Mike with sound which was not that much more expensive after I sold off the Athearn Mike on ebay for about what I paid for it. That for me was the beginning of a GREAT journey back into HO steam when I saw for myself just how well this engine performed with a bunch of cars.Virtually all of my engines but two are BLI one is a little upstart 4-4-0 from MRC and Roundhouse. Every time I deal with the company they are everything a company should be.enough of this. Now on to Tooling etc.As I understand it, we have these engines made overseas. China or Korea or some place. In my very simple mind I worry that a Chinese Worker making 2 dollars a day assembling these engines by the dozen for us American Buyers who dont know how to live on less than 100 dollars a day.What happens 10 years from now when this same Chinese Worker experiences what we Americans experienced in the late 50's and started moving into modern living and requires a 100 dollar a day salary to work at the choo choo factory?? Huh? Answer me that.Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 29, 2007 8:06 PM SunsetLimited wrote: Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?) I am waiting patiently for UPS to arrive. It sat for 30 hours in Jacksonville before finally moving again. It should arrive sometime midweek. I would prefer that they fly it in instead of trucking it across, but am content to have a copy on the way after all this time trying to find one.I will try and see if I can find a copy of your Phase 4 car. There might be one around somewhere as some of the folks here are followers of Amtrack. Reply Edit jondrd Member sinceApril 2003 From: US 625 posts Posted by jondrd on Monday, January 29, 2007 11:00 PM Eddie_walters, BLI almost "owes" PRR modelers a passenger consist! BLI=Broadway Limited Imports. Hmm, PRR's premier varnish to Chicago was 'The Broadway Limited", seems to make sense they would produce a consist for same. BLI made a K4, T1, GG1; give these models the proper varnish to pull. You and your peer PRR modelers can make it happen, write BLI and if necessary make a reservation for PRR varnish. As far as "owing" PRR modelers, think about it. Organization calls itself Broadway Limited Imports and their first offering is a NYC Hudson. Make that a double Log that as a "you owe us PRR fans one"! Per my conversation with BLI owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA this past weekend BLI will gladly produce that which will sell. Per his conversation he and his peer manufactuers are moving to a business model which is driven by reservations and limited production runs. This is a common sense business decision in that no one in the model train business is clairvoyent as to what will sell and in what quantities. Not using this type of model can result in a tremendously successful model followed by a disasterously unsuccessful one. You never know. What you and I passionately want produced may not be what everyone else wants. The manufacturer sells a model to you and me and everyone else buys some other manufacturer's offering. The BLI owner did mention that the competition is heating up and that places a premium on consistently good decisions on what to produce. Walthers/Proto 2K, Athearn Genesis, InterMountain and Bachmann Spectrum are now offering sound/DC/DCC locos to what used to be a premium non brass analog market. BLI opened up the dimensions of this market by being first to market locos to this market with QSI sound on board. Their singular position no longer exists in the market they redefined so pressure to do it right on what models to produce has increased. BLI's recently announced BlueLine with proprietary sound on board is another aspect of countering the competition. BLI says proprietary sound system eliminates expensive licensing fees to QSI and LokSound(PCM locos) for using their systems. Cost reductions in product should enable very competitive pricing relative to the competition. We shall see. Again, write and let BLI know what you would like to see made. Your input combined with others requesting such and such model may help fine tune the evolving business model of what should be produced. Jon "We have met the enemy and he is us" Pogo via the art of Walt Kelly Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 12:39 PM The T1 arrived today a little bit freezing cold from it's trip. The box was in good shape, Engine and Tender wrapped properly, foam intact. Nice fat manual, papers with big pictures showing how to lube it and....Aha! A Hex tool, spare bolts and screws, drive wheels with flanges, Volume control tab etcetera.Im going to let it warm up and adapt to room temp over night before workbench testing. It is a HEAVY engine, I wonder if this is a brute like it was in real life? Im going to have to seriously consider model bridges to carry this engine in the future. A quick inspection showed the front coupler is a dummy secured with a screw. I can probably drop a kaydee into it (With a insulated shank) or maybe leave it be once I clip that one molded plastic hose out of the way for it to swivel all the way. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:01 PM I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited. Reply CAZEPHYR Member sinceJuly 2006 3,264 posts Posted by CAZEPHYR on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:09 PM selector wrote: I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited.The T1 was a solid rigid frame engine, but the model has the # 2 and # 3 drivers blind, which allows it to run on most curves. The prototype did not use blind drivers. I have run my T1 on a large club layout and it ran flawless for several hours on a passenger train. It is a great model of a really interesting locomotive. Reply SunsetLimited Member sinceJuly 2006 134 posts Posted by SunsetLimited on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:44 PM Yeah i got mine Monday and i love it, its my new favorite steamer (i just got my AC6000 so that is top dog), it runs and sounds great, i to had a turnout that it did not like but that was the only issue spot and its where two tables meet so i can easily fix it. Its a great looking engine, now i need some more pennsy cars to pull :) Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 9:30 PM Well. We are going to need some passenger cars for it so that a recreation of the famous race with a NYC Steam Hudson can be recreated.I spent several happy hours today programming it. Then took it apart and lubed it. Those gear towers showed bone dry gears. Hit all the rods as well.At first glance the valve gear looks like it got mashed but I think they work ok but will definatly keep an eye on all of those bolts.She is a wee bit "Slippery" and there are no traction tires that I can see. So... I think the J1 might provide some helper service from time to time.I have purchased many engines with Broadway but this is the first engine that was disassembled to be lubed (Now on to the others) and one that behaves as if impatient to take a train out. Good think it's on DCC control I cannot imagine analog for this brute.While adjusting the volume of the bell I could pick out the clapper apparently making a bigger swing until the bell reaches it's full motion, I think that was a nice touch. The dynamo was a bit too loud, drove my cats nuts so I turned it down to a value of 10 out of 15 and it worked out well.It's a good thing I got into those gear towers and lubed them, she probably would have failed at some point down the road being so dry. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:40 PM Thank-you for letting us know. I have only ever lifted the boiler on my first loco, the Hudson, and don't recall noticing that the gear tower was dry. But, none of my locos have a lot of time on them, and all get lubed in the outer parts within an hour's break-in time. Now that you post this observation, I guess I will have to satisfy myself that everything is okay in their innards. It will be good for me to learn to take each of them apart anyway. I tend to be timid about such things. Apart from the sagging turnout centre that it found, there was one other place where it began to spin leaving the yard lead, a 8" section of flex between two opposing #7.5 curved turnouts. Come to think of it, sometimes others have paused a bit at that spot, but kept going. I placed a straightedge over it and shone a light into the rails to see if there was a gap. The closest rail to me was maybe 1/32" low, and the section had a slight sag in it generally. I used card stock and shimmed where needed, and everything is now peachy. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:54 PM Yeesh. I think we bought a track tester device.I am going over each of my engines this weekend, it's been a year since they were lubed anyhow. Reply Edit 12 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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Safety Valve wrote: jondrd wrote: cazephyr, Spoke to remaining partner/owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA yesterday. I asked question about the organization re your posting. His scenario is that BLI was founded as a three partner enterprise. The partner who was former Oriental firm "CEO" importer of brass model railroad items(locos?) was not booted from founding partnership. This individual turned 75 and wanted to retire and did so. The other partner elected to be bought out to pursue other interests. I asked some questions pertaining to previously announced Dreyfus Hudson and he responded that BLI is waiting until sufficient reservations are in place before commiting to production. This response would seem to be a recognition on their part that they cannot continue a practice which would undercut their dealers/LHS. Re the Dreyfus Hudson: I asked if the streamlined Hudson was to go into production would BLI produce a passenger consist for it like the Zephyr and SP Daylight consists? He said that that was their intent. The caveat being sufficient consumer commitment to produce the engine. He mentioned that some of the large mail order houses want to buy locos for less than it costs to produce them. Talk about a bad business model for the manufacturer let alone its impact on LHS's. I can only surmise that to get BLI off the ground they may have pursued practices which in the main were not favorable to dealers/distributors but could be construed, at a minimum, to guarantee the short term survival of a new enterprise. Obviously if this were the case it could be argued with benefit of 20/20 hindsight that these short term practices could well imperil the long term viability of BLI. He mentioned that tooling for new models is in the neighborhood of $400K and if one makes too many production commitments without sufficient reservations one could be looking at a very large expense against a questionable revenue stream. If the tooling runs $400K, to that must be added other expenses of marketing the unit(transportation, advertising, warehousing, etc). As an analogy(stretched, I know), the late Sen. Everett Dirksen of Illinois once observed about federal spending, "A million here, a million there. Before you know it you're talking real money!"(of course if this observation were made today the base unit would probably be billions) I also asked about why BLI created Precision Craft Models instead of just keeping PCM's announced products under BLI via a sub catagory(ie Paragon, Powerhouse, Brass Museum Series, etc). To their thinking the inclusion of LokSound in lieu of QSI in the product line seemed to justify distinguishing PCM from BLI. Last question pertained to conflicting reactions(see forum postings herein) to announced BLI BlueLine. Specifically I asked, "If one is running DCC, all that one has to do to run BlueLine locos is to just add a decoder? Anyone's decoder with appropriate functionality capabilities?" The answer was, "Yes, that's it." It should be noted that the BlueLine handout that they were distributing at the show has the following notations: BlueLine products are built based on pre-orders. We request that you place a pre-order with your favorite hobby dealer for your BlueLine locomotive. This(pre-orders) help us to gauge production quantities and deliver the product in a more timely manner. Last question pertained to any BLI/Factory Direct Trains relationship. Since the BLI display stand included PCM and Factory Direct it was self evident a relationship existed. FDT is run by the owner's son. The question I would have liked to ask is the pricing on FDT website re issue of pricing affecting LHS. It does seem from a preliminary cross check of BLI's Direct Outlet re FDT that pricing is the same. Questions lead to questions: BLI's Direct Outlet states they are returns to BLI, FDT makes no such claim(that I noticed). Are they the same condition items? I felt I could not reasonably continue questioning BLI owner at the expense of other modelers access. So that's what I learned for what it's worth. Jon Jon I had additional questions I would have liked to ask but I felt it would be an imposition upon him and other attendees to monopolize his time. Wow! That is not questioning, that is grilling. =)If you did not ask them, I probably would.Look, I knew squat about BLI until One Track Mind demonstrated a new Hudson 4-6-4 several years ago. I think back then the asking price was 200- for this engine but hesitant because memory is not certain. I saw this product moving back and forth on the track with sounds that were VERY VERY good. Loud too. I did express a concern with steam pulling power and purchased a Athearn Genesis Mike instead. (With no sound)My expectations were not met with the Athearn Genesis Mike and decided to replace it with the new BLI Heavy Mike with sound which was not that much more expensive after I sold off the Athearn Mike on ebay for about what I paid for it. That for me was the beginning of a GREAT journey back into HO steam when I saw for myself just how well this engine performed with a bunch of cars.Virtually all of my engines but two are BLI one is a little upstart 4-4-0 from MRC and Roundhouse. Every time I deal with the company they are everything a company should be.enough of this. Now on to Tooling etc.As I understand it, we have these engines made overseas. China or Korea or some place. In my very simple mind I worry that a Chinese Worker making 2 dollars a day assembling these engines by the dozen for us American Buyers who dont know how to live on less than 100 dollars a day.What happens 10 years from now when this same Chinese Worker experiences what we Americans experienced in the late 50's and started moving into modern living and requires a 100 dollar a day salary to work at the choo choo factory?? Huh? Answer me that.Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products Reply Edit Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Monday, January 29, 2007 8:06 PM SunsetLimited wrote: Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?) I am waiting patiently for UPS to arrive. It sat for 30 hours in Jacksonville before finally moving again. It should arrive sometime midweek. I would prefer that they fly it in instead of trucking it across, but am content to have a copy on the way after all this time trying to find one.I will try and see if I can find a copy of your Phase 4 car. There might be one around somewhere as some of the folks here are followers of Amtrack. Reply Edit jondrd Member sinceApril 2003 From: US 625 posts Posted by jondrd on Monday, January 29, 2007 11:00 PM Eddie_walters, BLI almost "owes" PRR modelers a passenger consist! BLI=Broadway Limited Imports. Hmm, PRR's premier varnish to Chicago was 'The Broadway Limited", seems to make sense they would produce a consist for same. BLI made a K4, T1, GG1; give these models the proper varnish to pull. You and your peer PRR modelers can make it happen, write BLI and if necessary make a reservation for PRR varnish. As far as "owing" PRR modelers, think about it. Organization calls itself Broadway Limited Imports and their first offering is a NYC Hudson. Make that a double Log that as a "you owe us PRR fans one"! Per my conversation with BLI owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA this past weekend BLI will gladly produce that which will sell. Per his conversation he and his peer manufactuers are moving to a business model which is driven by reservations and limited production runs. This is a common sense business decision in that no one in the model train business is clairvoyent as to what will sell and in what quantities. Not using this type of model can result in a tremendously successful model followed by a disasterously unsuccessful one. You never know. What you and I passionately want produced may not be what everyone else wants. The manufacturer sells a model to you and me and everyone else buys some other manufacturer's offering. The BLI owner did mention that the competition is heating up and that places a premium on consistently good decisions on what to produce. Walthers/Proto 2K, Athearn Genesis, InterMountain and Bachmann Spectrum are now offering sound/DC/DCC locos to what used to be a premium non brass analog market. BLI opened up the dimensions of this market by being first to market locos to this market with QSI sound on board. Their singular position no longer exists in the market they redefined so pressure to do it right on what models to produce has increased. BLI's recently announced BlueLine with proprietary sound on board is another aspect of countering the competition. BLI says proprietary sound system eliminates expensive licensing fees to QSI and LokSound(PCM locos) for using their systems. Cost reductions in product should enable very competitive pricing relative to the competition. We shall see. Again, write and let BLI know what you would like to see made. Your input combined with others requesting such and such model may help fine tune the evolving business model of what should be produced. Jon "We have met the enemy and he is us" Pogo via the art of Walt Kelly Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 12:39 PM The T1 arrived today a little bit freezing cold from it's trip. The box was in good shape, Engine and Tender wrapped properly, foam intact. Nice fat manual, papers with big pictures showing how to lube it and....Aha! A Hex tool, spare bolts and screws, drive wheels with flanges, Volume control tab etcetera.Im going to let it warm up and adapt to room temp over night before workbench testing. It is a HEAVY engine, I wonder if this is a brute like it was in real life? Im going to have to seriously consider model bridges to carry this engine in the future. A quick inspection showed the front coupler is a dummy secured with a screw. I can probably drop a kaydee into it (With a insulated shank) or maybe leave it be once I clip that one molded plastic hose out of the way for it to swivel all the way. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:01 PM I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited. Reply CAZEPHYR Member sinceJuly 2006 3,264 posts Posted by CAZEPHYR on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:09 PM selector wrote: I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited.The T1 was a solid rigid frame engine, but the model has the # 2 and # 3 drivers blind, which allows it to run on most curves. The prototype did not use blind drivers. I have run my T1 on a large club layout and it ran flawless for several hours on a passenger train. It is a great model of a really interesting locomotive. Reply SunsetLimited Member sinceJuly 2006 134 posts Posted by SunsetLimited on Wednesday, January 31, 2007 1:44 PM Yeah i got mine Monday and i love it, its my new favorite steamer (i just got my AC6000 so that is top dog), it runs and sounds great, i to had a turnout that it did not like but that was the only issue spot and its where two tables meet so i can easily fix it. Its a great looking engine, now i need some more pennsy cars to pull :) Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 9:30 PM Well. We are going to need some passenger cars for it so that a recreation of the famous race with a NYC Steam Hudson can be recreated.I spent several happy hours today programming it. Then took it apart and lubed it. Those gear towers showed bone dry gears. Hit all the rods as well.At first glance the valve gear looks like it got mashed but I think they work ok but will definatly keep an eye on all of those bolts.She is a wee bit "Slippery" and there are no traction tires that I can see. So... I think the J1 might provide some helper service from time to time.I have purchased many engines with Broadway but this is the first engine that was disassembled to be lubed (Now on to the others) and one that behaves as if impatient to take a train out. Good think it's on DCC control I cannot imagine analog for this brute.While adjusting the volume of the bell I could pick out the clapper apparently making a bigger swing until the bell reaches it's full motion, I think that was a nice touch. The dynamo was a bit too loud, drove my cats nuts so I turned it down to a value of 10 out of 15 and it worked out well.It's a good thing I got into those gear towers and lubed them, she probably would have failed at some point down the road being so dry. Reply Edit selector Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Vancouver Island, BC 23,321 posts Posted by selector on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:40 PM Thank-you for letting us know. I have only ever lifted the boiler on my first loco, the Hudson, and don't recall noticing that the gear tower was dry. But, none of my locos have a lot of time on them, and all get lubed in the outer parts within an hour's break-in time. Now that you post this observation, I guess I will have to satisfy myself that everything is okay in their innards. It will be good for me to learn to take each of them apart anyway. I tend to be timid about such things. Apart from the sagging turnout centre that it found, there was one other place where it began to spin leaving the yard lead, a 8" section of flex between two opposing #7.5 curved turnouts. Come to think of it, sometimes others have paused a bit at that spot, but kept going. I placed a straightedge over it and shone a light into the rails to see if there was a gap. The closest rail to me was maybe 1/32" low, and the section had a slight sag in it generally. I used card stock and shimmed where needed, and everything is now peachy. Reply Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 1, 2007 10:54 PM Yeesh. I think we bought a track tester device.I am going over each of my engines this weekend, it's been a year since they were lubed anyhow. Reply Edit 12 Subscriber & Member Login Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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Yes, I say the great outsourcing of products overseas to save the American a dollar and a dime is going to bite us all in the *** at some point in the future. Especially when these Nations modernize and become the ONLY source of products
SunsetLimited wrote: Well my T-1 came this evening, got her programmed and running, she runs extremely well and looks even better. I have a new favorite steam engine! Now anyone know where i can get a walthers 1700 series baggage car Amtrak phase 4 (not the US mail one?)
I am waiting patiently for UPS to arrive. It sat for 30 hours in Jacksonville before finally moving again. It should arrive sometime midweek. I would prefer that they fly it in instead of trucking it across, but am content to have a copy on the way after all this time trying to find one.
I will try and see if I can find a copy of your Phase 4 car. There might be one around somewhere as some of the folks here are followers of Amtrack.
Eddie_walters,
BLI almost "owes" PRR modelers a passenger consist! BLI=Broadway Limited Imports. Hmm, PRR's premier varnish to Chicago was 'The Broadway Limited", seems to make sense they would produce a consist for same. BLI made a K4, T1, GG1; give these models the proper varnish to pull. You and your peer PRR modelers can make it happen, write BLI and if necessary make a reservation for PRR varnish.
As far as "owing" PRR modelers, think about it. Organization calls itself Broadway Limited Imports and their first offering is a NYC Hudson. Make that a double Log that as a "you owe us PRR fans one"!
Per my conversation with BLI owner at Big-E show in Springfield, MA this past weekend BLI will gladly produce that which will sell. Per his conversation he and his peer manufactuers are moving to a business model which is driven by reservations and limited production runs. This is a common sense business decision in that no one in the model train business is clairvoyent as to what will sell and in what quantities. Not using this type of model can result in a tremendously successful model followed by a disasterously unsuccessful one. You never know. What you and I passionately want produced may not be what everyone else wants. The manufacturer sells a model to you and me and everyone else buys some other manufacturer's offering.
The BLI owner did mention that the competition is heating up and that places a premium on consistently good decisions on what to produce. Walthers/Proto 2K, Athearn Genesis, InterMountain and Bachmann Spectrum are now offering sound/DC/DCC locos to what used to be a premium non brass analog market. BLI opened up the dimensions of this market by being first to market locos to this market with QSI sound on board. Their singular position no longer exists in the market they redefined so pressure to do it right on what models to produce has increased. BLI's recently announced BlueLine with proprietary sound on board is another aspect of countering the competition. BLI says proprietary sound system eliminates expensive licensing fees to QSI and LokSound(PCM locos) for using their systems. Cost reductions in product should enable very competitive pricing relative to the competition. We shall see.
Again, write and let BLI know what you would like to see made. Your input combined with others requesting such and such model may help fine tune the evolving business model of what should be produced.
The T1 arrived today a little bit freezing cold from it's trip. The box was in good shape, Engine and Tender wrapped properly, foam intact. Nice fat manual, papers with big pictures showing how to lube it and....
Aha! A Hex tool, spare bolts and screws, drive wheels with flanges, Volume control tab etcetera.
Im going to let it warm up and adapt to room temp over night before workbench testing. It is a HEAVY engine, I wonder if this is a brute like it was in real life? Im going to have to seriously consider model bridges to carry this engine in the future. A quick inspection showed the front coupler is a dummy secured with a screw. I can probably drop a kaydee into it (With a insulated shank) or maybe leave it be once I clip that one molded plastic hose out of the way for it to swivel all the way.
I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.
As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.
As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.
I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited.
selector wrote: I got mine yesterday, too. As well, it was quite cold, so I let it acclimate for a couple of hours in my warm and dry train room. I visually inspected it and everything seems to be in order, no rods bent or bolts coming loose. I was surprised to find that both engines are fixed to the boiler (says as much about me as anything); I had thought it would have at least one engine articulated. So, it really is fashioned after the prototype.As I had come to anticipate, it showed me where a turnout was not properly supported when I first had it run around part of the main to see it run. This turnout is laid over a splice in the spline roadbed, and there is a slight cavity below the middle of the turnout. None of my other steamers, including the articulated Challenger, Niagara, or the J1 seemed to mind. Thanking myself yet again that I had not started to scenic the yard, I clambered up and took care of the turnout.As I stated in another thread, I think I may be falling in love with this model. My favourite has been the J1, but this honey has all the right curves, and has me hooked.I agree that it feels very heavy, gratifyingly so. I have a feeling it will do a good job pulling the Limited.
The T1 was a solid rigid frame engine, but the model has the # 2 and # 3 drivers blind, which allows it to run on most curves. The prototype did not use blind drivers.
I have run my T1 on a large club layout and it ran flawless for several hours on a passenger train. It is a great model of a really interesting locomotive.
Well. We are going to need some passenger cars for it so that a recreation of the famous race with a NYC Steam Hudson can be recreated.
I spent several happy hours today programming it. Then took it apart and lubed it. Those gear towers showed bone dry gears. Hit all the rods as well.
At first glance the valve gear looks like it got mashed but I think they work ok but will definatly keep an eye on all of those bolts.
She is a wee bit "Slippery" and there are no traction tires that I can see. So... I think the J1 might provide some helper service from time to time.
I have purchased many engines with Broadway but this is the first engine that was disassembled to be lubed (Now on to the others) and one that behaves as if impatient to take a train out. Good think it's on DCC control I cannot imagine analog for this brute.
While adjusting the volume of the bell I could pick out the clapper apparently making a bigger swing until the bell reaches it's full motion, I think that was a nice touch. The dynamo was a bit too loud, drove my cats nuts so I turned it down to a value of 10 out of 15 and it worked out well.
It's a good thing I got into those gear towers and lubed them, she probably would have failed at some point down the road being so dry.
Thank-you for letting us know. I have only ever lifted the boiler on my first loco, the Hudson, and don't recall noticing that the gear tower was dry. But, none of my locos have a lot of time on them, and all get lubed in the outer parts within an hour's break-in time. Now that you post this observation, I guess I will have to satisfy myself that everything is okay in their innards. It will be good for me to learn to take each of them apart anyway. I tend to be timid about such things.
Apart from the sagging turnout centre that it found, there was one other place where it began to spin leaving the yard lead, a 8" section of flex between two opposing #7.5 curved turnouts. Come to think of it, sometimes others have paused a bit at that spot, but kept going. I placed a straightedge over it and shone a light into the rails to see if there was a gap. The closest rail to me was maybe 1/32" low, and the section had a slight sag in it generally. I used card stock and shimmed where needed, and everything is now peachy.
Yeesh. I think we bought a track tester device.
I am going over each of my engines this weekend, it's been a year since they were lubed anyhow.