Could big train companies like Union Pacific, etc. help manufacture American model trains?

[ANDREW WALSH III]

As I understand it, most current model train companies have foreign manufacturing of the products such as China and others. A lot of Americans have wondered why we can't find "made in America" models. What if, the real train guys (like Union Pacific, etc.)help out and build facitities that manufacture the model trains under their supervision and quality control and hire Americans? yes, it would take planning, lots of $$$$ and training of workers, but it would be worth it. Reasons: competition, quality, create jobs in America, education and common sense. How about it? I am 67 years old but would gladly go through training to work in such a place. Andy Walsh

[Bayfield Transfer Railway]

Most, possibly all, US railroads are publicly-traded corporations.

The CEO and directors of those corporations have a legal obligation to increase shareholder value.  If they do not, they are subject not only to removal from office, but in some cases can face potential legal action.

Model railroading is a thin margin business even for established companies.  There is no way a railroad would ever amortize its investment, and a nebulous building of "the public good" such as creating American jobs in an industry they know nothing about would never get past the stockholders.

The railroad would be far better off putting that planning, money, and training into its own business.

 

[NittanyLion]

You're also talking about an industry, of sorts, that would employ a few dozen people at most.  The railroads would be wiser to employ a few dozen railroad workers instead.

[mlehman]

Yes, you'll make a lot more as engine crew than most will ever making producing models.

Crafting scale models lies pretty far outside of the core competency of most RRs. Totally different business.

[Mark R.]

OR ....

Like in the case of VIA Rail Canada getting involved with Rapido to produce the new F40PH-2D engine. Without VIA's assistance, this engine would have been a lot further down the road - if at all ....

http://www.rapidotrains.com/f40.html

Mark.

[steemtrayn]

Big railroads make lotsa money transporting containers full of foreign made stuff.

[mlehman]

Mark R.

OR .... Like in the case of VIA Rail Canada getting involved with Rapido to produce the new F40PH-2D engine. Without VIA's assistance, this engine would have been a lot further down the road - if at all .... http://www.rapidotrains.com/f40.html

The exception proves the rule. If a RR company wants a model for whatever reason, they do what? Go to a model RR company.

But it's a good point, Mark. Amtrak has also worked to produce various models for special occassions and other marketing purposes. UP was kind enough to pretty much give up on the idea of producing finanicial gain from "licensing" models that it says "use" UP trademarks, nevermind that a model is a representation, not a "use" the way many model RRers see it. The D&S has workede with Blackstone and other companies to produce narrowgauge models. The list goes on, but in every case, the RR leaves the model building to the experts and sticks to transportation, what it knows best.

It's also fair to ask, "What about other types of business?" Well, diversification in business was a fad at one time. The Illinois Central also sold tacos for a time. But not any more. Some RRs are units of larger corps, but most RRs stick to railroading nowadays.

[ACY Tom]

It's great that Rapido got help from the big railroads, and that kind of cooperation between model manufacturers and the builders and operators or railroad equiment is certainly not unprecedented.  But the operation of a transportation company and the manufacturing of operating scale models are two entirely different industries, and it probably isn't likely to happen.  It's probably just as likely that Walthers or Athearn would open up a 12" = 1'0" railroad. 

[joe323]

In a sense the big RR companies and manufacturers do help by allowing the model manufacturers to come in protograph measure and copy the prototypes.

[wjstix]

There's a big difference between a railroad supplying data to a model railroad company to build a model, and having the railroad involved in actually making the dies and such to produce and distribute the model. It's not unusual for companies to have models or toys made with their company logo on it, to sell in their gift shops or to give to employees etc. but they don't actually make the items themselves.

p.s. given what the real railroads have done in the past re licensing of models, heralds, photographs etc I'd say it seems they'd just as soon model railroading didn't exist, rather than being in the mood to help the industry out.

[dknelson]

General Motors, the Santa Fe, and the New York Central did assist Lionel in producing its F-3 locomotive years ago -- and I suspect it was the advertising or PR departments of those companis that provided the assistance.   I believe the New York Central provided technical assistance, but not money, to help Lionel produce the famous scale Hudson in the 1930s.

Back in the early 1960s the Illinois Central used to sell -- again as a public relations/advertising ploy -- a trainset featuring HO Illinois Central rolling stock, produced for them by Lindberg.  

And Hooker (the chemical company, not the questionable blonde standing on a street corner in iffy neighborhoods) used to mount Athearn Hooker tank cars on pieces of TruScale track as promotional items. 

Dave Nelson 

[BRAKIE]

wjstix

p.s. given what the real railroads have done in the past re licensing of models, heralds, photographs etc I'd say it seems they'd just as soon model railroading didn't exist, rather than being in the mood to help the industry out.

True and that goes for railfans too.

I'm surprise they even cooperate with manufacturers,museums and historical societies.

 

[up831]

As mentioned earlier, the only way a real railroad would or even could get involved with model railroad manufacturers is in the advertising budget, or in public relations promotions.  Even then, it would be almost a "loss leader" type of expense.

the railroads do understand the value of promoting the brand.  It is not out of the kindness of their hearts that railroads like UP go to the expense to transport and restore a locomotive like the big boy.

like Frank Zappa once said, "There is no such thing as bad publicity!"  If the restoration of an old beloved locomotive will cause someone to think of shipping through them rather than some other means, then it is worth the money.  Don't know if that can be said about scale models.

[mobilman44]

Could the RRs support USA model production?   Of course they could.

But, why?  There is nothing in it for them.

Back in the late 40s when the NYC and ATSF underwrote the tooling (50 percent I believe) for the Lionel NYC/SF F3s, it was about advertising their railroads for the train traveling public.  Well, that is now history........

[Paul D]

To Stix point specifically, and similar points by all, manufacturing replicas is best left to those in the business, but they're all not alike. There's Classic Metal Works who makes good truck models for our interest, but then there's Norscot to whom we're incidental. Norscot's business is making premiums and give-aways for large companies' salespeople to give to loyal customers and prospective customers to decorate their desk or take home to their kid. Anyone notice what's happened to the price of Norscot's UPS truck? Great model, well built, nice features. I bought one in 2011 when it listed for $29 discounted to $24. Bought another in 2012 for $20.68 with my 'happy birthday' Walthers discount. Now Norscot wants a whopping FIFTY THREE BUCKS for it! 'cause we ain't their target market.

[BRAKIE]

up831

like Frank Zappa once said, "There is no such thing as bad publicity!" If the restoration of an old beloved locomotive will cause someone to think of shipping through them rather than some other means, then it is worth the money.

Apparently he never talked to a disgruntle rail customer.

From what I read rail customers isn't what one would call happy campers and have voice their concerns time after time .No amount of advertising can change that or bring back former customers.

[Bob Schuknecht]

"Reasons: competition, quality, create jobs in America, education and common sense."

Don't see profit in that list of reasons.

[Geared Steam]

No reason what so ever to do so, they are in the freight biz, not the toy biz.

[gmcrail]

Real railroads, I suspect, feel that trains are a means to an end; to wit, making money. Do you know of any model railroading companies, even the "big" ones, that are (or ever have been) really on a par with the likes of Union Pacific, General Motors, or any other of the Fortune 500 companies? Why would the railroads invest in a product line that is at best a marginal business, with a relatively small customer base?

[Colorado Ray]

As I recall, didn't Union Pacific threaten model manufactures with lawsuits over trademark infringement a few years a go?  They didn't want their logo used on models without them getting a royalty.  Hardly think they'd embrace manufacturing with that type of attitude.

[NittanyLion]

The biggest model railroad related company would have to be RPM International, Testor's parent.  They're a mult-billion dollar company with a five digit workforce. 

 

Although the overwhelming part of their business is not little thimble sized glass jars of paint.  And I'm reasonably sure DAP and Rust-o-luem (which they also own) still only accounts for something around 20% of their business.