The other night, I was watching the Allen Keller video on Allen McClelland's legendary Virginian & Ohio railroad and I goth out thinking, how would the line be fairing today with the loss of coal traffic? My guess is the road would be in dire straights. What do you guys think?
Modeling the Pennsylvania Railroad in N Scale.
www.prr-nscale.blogspot.com
Probably not at all - the company would have gone belly up and the ROW turned into a cycle path.
I'm sure the "war on coal" would pose challenges to all three parts of the Appalachian Lines, including the V&O. It had traffic other than coal of course, but if it was largely loose car railroading, then things would likely look a bit bleak.
Dave Nelson
Sir Madog Probably not at all - the company would have gone belly up and the ROW turned into a cycle path.
Equally likely, it would have just become part of one of the mega railroads, probably NS.
Andre
Was it even a coal hauler? I thought it was mainly a bridge line.
Probably would have depended on its main shareholder. Devoured by CSX in the 90s seems reasonable.
More than likely, it would have been absorbed into CSX, and then abandoned this past year. The equipment sold to GATX and the like, with the rails rusting in place. Maybe a tourist train, but nothing like what it once was.
(My Model Railroad, My Rules)
These are the opinions of an under 35 , from the east end of, and modeling, the same section of the Wheeling and Lake Erie railway. As well as a freelanced road (Austinville and Dynamite City railroad).
Actually the V&O was doom from the start much like several regional railroads that graced a area with limited traffic growth.
However..
I suspect it would have been part of Family Lines then the short lived Seaboard System then CSX then by 2016 the busier parts may have become a short line and those sections with little or no traffic would become a county road,a rail to trail or reclaimed by nature.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Since the layout is no longer in existence, isn't it actually a fallen flag?
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Mike Kieran
Port Able Railway
I just do what the majority of the voices in my head vote on.
Speaking of McClellan's second version of the famous layout ...original house with the expanded basement....it could be modeled as a modern day short line serving one of the big coal mines, the glass plant and pulpwood loading off of the KC&B, Marshall Chemical, and add a few smaller stops along the way. An out and back operation starting from Afton. I'd eliminate all of the trackage beyond the water heater furnace area, meaning Jimtown et al.
By today, it would likely not be the bridge route that it was.
- Douglas
Actually, he moved and started building a whole new V&O.
Yes. I referred to the second iteration of the famous layout since the famous layout is more well known than his later layouts.
It would be fun to plan a totally new layout based upon the current situation of the V&O, whatever you believe it would be.
Mike,IMHO the top two freelance railroads are now fallen flags the AM and the V&O.
The lessons learn from Tony and Allen is invaluable for any modeler wishing to freelance a railroad.
My N Scale Cumberland,Dickensonville & Bristol RR was based on their lessons and my knowledge of the prototype.
Mike Kieran Actually, he moved and started building a whole new V&O.
In my younger days while I was still in Dayton, I had the pleasure of visiting the original V&O several times. Allen moved from West Carrolton to a smaller home in Miamisburg, IIRC in 2000. He started a new V&O at that time. He has since moved into a retirement community. So the first two versions of the V&O have been dismantled. Currently a 3rd version has been built on Gerry Albers Virginian Railway. So while the original ground breaking layout is gone, I don't think the V&O is quite a "fallen flag." Albers layout with the V&O section was featured in Graet Model Railroads 2014. As I understand, Allen has done a lot of the work on the current V&O. He is a true gentleman and a credit to the hobby.
There is no current v&o. Allens has forced him to move to a retirement community. His son and two of the longest operating.members have created thier versions. Of which allen has a part in. allen keller did a ivideo on the last operating session of the second layout.
A pessimist sees a dark tunnel
An optimist sees the light at the end of the tunnel
A realist sees a frieght train
An engineer sees three idiots standing on the tracks stairing blankly in space
I'm not a railroading expert by any means, only an avid fan. But I can't see the Virginian & Ohio surviving into today's environment as a Class 1, and probably not even a regional system.
I do, however, feel the V&O could've been cut back and reorganized into a prosperous shortline. I say shortline in a broad sense, as our local shortline Kiamichi Railroad covers around 250 miles. The modern V&O could serve a couple of remaining mines (and more effectively than a Class 1) and whatever other customers remained. The V&O would probably keep a well maintained fleet of GP38-2s and GP/SD40-2s, steadily upgrading them to Dash 3 specifications. As mentioned above, it would be interesting to see the railroad modeled in this form.
Again, a true expert may scoff at this, but it seems plausible to me.
Dakota
DDavidsonFarmsAgain, a true expert may scoff at this, but it seems plausible to me.
Nope..In fact I mention about the same thing in my reply.The part(s) that still have active customers would become a short line and those areas that doesn't the roadbed would become a county road,a hiking trail or nature would reclaim it.
I would not bet a short line's future on coal operations alone since coal mines can cease operations.
I made an error in my statement. A part of the original V&O does live on in the NMRA museum.
I can only see a small reagonal, maybe good sized short line, survivning today. Possibly still V&O . Or maybe long since reorganized and name changed operation.
NVSRRI can only see a small reagonal, maybe good sized short line, survivning today. Possibly still V&O . Or maybe long since reorganized and name changed operation.
The V&O would probably be one of GWI's 114 short lines. I wonder what that would look like? A Orange and Black striped locomotives with black Virginian & Ohio written in a circle with a large stripe with V&O through the center?
What I would like to think about is..... Did the V&O survive the Penn Central/Conrail deals? If so, how? Even if it did survive those mega mergers, it would have been absorbed when Conrail was split...or, Maybe the Wheeling and Lake Erie reigional got some of the rail?
Jimmy,Like most short lines it would not be included in any merger because the merged railroads would abandon or spin off any marginal track and branch line that the reason we have more short lines today then Class 1s and the majority of those short lines are profitable..
Yes,when the V&O decided to cease operations the W&LE could have bought the section that has active customers as long as it joined theirs. I don't think the WE operates any isolated sections of track like some short line and regional operators do.
But,more then likely the section of the V&O with active shippers would have been bought by a regional port authority then operated by a short line operator.