Fuel facility

[Guy Papillon]

The administrators of the Cannery want to equip the boiler house with an old tank car as a fuel tank.

Is it prototypical?

Is it too big a tank for such industry?

[G Paine]

One place I used to work had a couple of underground fuel tanks that were 3000 or 5000 gallons, so an old 10000 gallon tank car would not be out of the question for a cannery needing steam to process it's canning.

[John Busby]

Hi Guy Papillon

Is it prototypical my thought is no, I think a cannery would have a purpose built fuel tank.

Having just said that some one will now probably proceed to prove me wrong.

Is it too big? is I think the wrong question the question should be "is it big enough?"

It has to fuel the boilers etc 24 hours a day seven days a week.

Does it look good looks likely the answer to that will be yes when its finished,

and its something else that can be set out at the cannery perhaps the key is to make it look believable which I think is more important.

regards John

[jjdamnit]

Hello all,

Just a few thoughts...

•What are the boilers currently powered with? And what is the source of that fuel?

•What is the motivation of the administrators to build this facility?

•As has been suggested, would this amount of fuel be sufficient for continuous running?

•I would think that, if this installation meets all safety ordinances, it would be more appropriate as a backup fuel source in case of emergencies. Possibly in-line with the current fuel source.

•What was the cost difference between purchasing, installing and maintaining this facility versus having a fuel specific facility built new in the prototypical world? (As opposed to reproposing an old tanker car versus purchasing a kit or kitbashing a facility.)

I have seen pictures of track-side fueling facilities for diesel engines made of three tanker cars; two side-by-side and one stacked on top with a support framework, attached to a fueling rig. Again, this was used to fuel locomotives rather than an industry.

Hope this helps.

 

[JAMES MOON]

Guy, very prototypical.  I have been in old faciltities that used old tank cars for boiler fuel storage.  Tank car shells usually sat on concrete pier saddles.

[SouthPenn]

How are you going to refill that tank?

[superbe]

[quote user="Guy Papillon"]

Is it too big a tank for such industry?

The tank size isn't mentioned which is important for several reasons.

One of which is the tank has to be big enough to be able to be resupplied while still having enough to operate the plant. Most lilely it would be served by truck transport whose full load would be between 7,500 and 8,000 gallons. It would be unusual for a plant of this size to be served by a smaller truck and the delivered cost of the fuel would be much higher.

 Bob

EDIT: Quantity hauled by TT could be less depending on the time period modeled.

[dknelson]

I have seen old railroad tank cars used as fuel tanks at a chemical company, a large grain elevator/feed mill, and at a municipal maintenance facility (Rochelle IL in fact). Two of those uses remain current.  The cars were quite old, riveted bodies in fact.  

Dave Nelson

[7j43k]

About two thirds of the way down this page is an item of interest:

 

http://blog.sscsinc.com/ump-2-2/

 

Here's another view of the tank:

 

http://www.thehistorycompany.com/albums/tanks_essay/tanks_essay1.html

 

8,000 gallon uninsulated tank cars are available:

 

http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/920-100326

 

 

 

And Tangent makes a three dome 6,000 gallon that's pretty darn neat.  I'm sure you could think of a story about how the cannery decided on a three dome tank.

 

 

Ed

[steemtrayn]

Here's another tank dressed up as a submarine, complete with periscope and gun. Not visible in pic is the propeller, made from an old fan blade.

[mobilman44]

Hi!

The t/c looks fine to me.  The owners got a deal on an old tankcar body and put it too good use.  Is it "too big"?  Well it is bigger than a purposely built tank would likely be, but the owners got a good deal on it!   Also, it would only have to be filled occasionally, likely at a time when fuel oil prices are down (summer).

Filling it would of course be by tank truck, and again, filling during the usual summer downturn of fuel prices would save the owners big bucks.

I would add some ground cover, debris and weeds to cover the foundation bottom edges, but otherwise it is pretty much in order.

[dehusman]

Guy Papillon

The administrators of the Cannery want to equip the boiler house with an old tank car as a fuel tank. Is it prototypical? Is it too big a tank for such industry?

I think its fine, you probably want a pump house with a small electric pump to get oil in and out of the tank (might be in the boiler building) but you will want some piping to get oil in the tank, someplace to connect a truck.  They probably wouldn't recieve oil by rail because they would have to sit on the rail car for days or weeks to unload it into the tank.

Really the issue I would take with it is the description of it being an "old" tank.  You are modeling the 1950's.  How old is the tank?  If you were using an MDC "old time" tank car tank, I would agree you are using an "old" tank car.  If you are using a 10k gal tank that was probably built in the 1920's or 1930's, the rail car would have still been in its service life and not particularly "old". 

Since I model 1900-1905, I have to make that adjustment that something 125 years old to us now is "brand new" on my layout.  Stuff that seems like has been there "forever" turns out to be a lot newer than you think.

As far as size, if the plant uses 300 gal of oil a day, the tank will last them about a month.  Most places that depend on fuel will want weeks of supply or at least month or so of fuel.  Its the 1950's, the climate is more "just in case" than "just in time".  They just finished with fuel rationing from WW2 so they may have bought the tank just so they can have 30-60 days of fuel and won't run out because they remember how touch and go it was then fuel was in short supply.

[mbinsewi]

I agree with everyone, I think it would just fine.  Some detailing, piping, etc., it will make a great scene.  Given the time period this is set in, you wouldn't even need the containment wall, just the concrete stands that hold the tank.

Mike.

[Guy Papillon]

Thank you all. Lot of good comments. According to those comments, I will eliminate the containment walls and look for an older tank car. Of course, I will finish the scene with piping and ground cover.

[davidmurray]

mobilman44

The t/c looks fine to me. The owners got a deal on an old tankcar body and put it too good use. Is it "too big"? Well it is bigger than a purposely built tank would likely be, but the owners got a good deal on it! Also, it would only have to be filled occasionally, likely at a time when fuel oil prices are down (summer). Filling it would of course be by tank truck, and again, filling during the usual summer downturn of fuel prices would save the owners big bucks.

Any industrial storage sytem, oil, or chemical needs to be large enough to empty a shipment into without risking running out before the scheduled shipment arrives a few days late.

Of couse the boiler could have an immediate use tank inside that is good for three days firing, and pump trom the tank car as needed.

Dave

[theodorefisk]

There is a prototype for almost everything one can model. I would say look at your industry and see if it fits the scene. If it does, great. remember it is your railroad and whatever makes you happy is a good thing. 

 

Ted

[gmpullman]

G Paine

One place I used to work had a couple of underground fuel tanks that were 3000 or 5000 gallons, so an old 10000 gallon tank car would not be out of the question for a cannery needing steam to process it's canning.

 

The plant I work at has these buried tanks (20,000 gal. each!):

The boilers could be fired on natural gas or oil and these tanks held bunker B, #5 fuel oil which had to be heated for it to flow and atomize. There were also two 6,000 gal. propane tanks for backup as well. Industries didn't want to risk running out of fuel. The loss of steam in the middle of winter would be catastrophic. These storage tanks were filled by railroad tank car with steam heating coils built into the car.

In regards to your tank, I wonder if a cannery would also have a brine tank? Even process water for cleaning vats could be stored in tanks such as an old tank car.

Regards, Ed

[BRAKIE]

Sure,a old tank car would be a economical way to store bunker fuel for a boiler.

The only issue would be when to order fuel since the tank car would be limited to holding (say) 10,000 gallons and transportation time which could take several days.

My solution would be to have two 10,000 gallon tank cars side by side with a connecting pipe. When one tank hits 3/4 empty order fuel.

[Guy Papillon]

After consulting sone experts, the administrators decided to buy two 10,000 gallons modern tanks that were buried.

More grass in the next weeks. 

Thank you all.

[jjdamnit]

Hello all,

Nice solution!

Hope this helps.

[mbinsewi]

Come on Guy!   I was waiting to see some tanks, piping, ladders, railings, concrete tank saddles, all the works!. 

Oh well, permits for doing such probably didn't excist then.  I think it's a great approach!

Mike.