I eagerly bought eight sheets of 0.010" evergreen styrene. "Perfect!" I thought. Well... yes and no. I am having trouble cutting straight or (in the case of curves or other lines) keeping the blade on course. I am using a brand new X-acto knife and blade, but it will still shoot off of course, even with a ruler! Even the ruler will slip sometimes, regardless of the amount of pressure I put on it with my non cutting hand. I really want to get a scratchbuilding project under my belt before trying something bigger, but so far its been a big bummer. Can anyone help?
I'm beginning to realize that Windows 10 and sound decoders have a lot in common. There are so many things you have to change in order to get them to work the way you want.
you ---probably--- have too much pressure ...
try gently running the blade down the ruler, multiple cuts, just part of the way is the idea ...
nice and light, multiple passes
The straight edge I have has a thin cork backing, it keeps it from slipping off. But yes, the key to getting smooth cuts with styrene is to make many LIGHT passes, don;t try to cut through a sheet with just one or two cuts. For long, straight cuts, you don;t even have to go all the way though, just part way, then snap - called score and snap.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Yeah. What they said.
Nobody gets it right, at first.
You'll do fine!
Ed
Ooooohh, ok. Thats probably it. I'll try that.
You can also score thicker styrene with a few light passes of a fresh #11 X-acto blade then snap it clean along the scored line.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
I use clamps to hold the straight edge in place, and I cut with the blade angled into the straight edge. And, as others have said, light, multiple cuts.
Rich
Alton Junction
Sounds like you're putting too much pressure on the blade, causing it to flex. And when it flexes, it cuts a curved path, like a ski. Lighter pressure would certainly help. You could also try a heavier blade, such as a #2, or a blade with a less acute angle of attack.
Styrene, especially the thin sheets you're using, only needs to be barely scratched. Then the sheet will snap cleanly like a pane of glass. You don't need to cut all the way through as if the material was paper, wood, or cardboard.
Good luck. You've already done the hard part. Picking up a knife and a straightedge is a very big step.
Robert
LINK to SNSR Blog
I've found that it's very easy, especially on long cuts (4'x8' sheets) to unconciously roll/twist the X-Acto knife handle within your grip whilst making the cut, causing it to not track along the straightedge. To correct that tendency, I use a utility knife, like the red one shown below...
...it's fairly old, I think, and weighs about half a pound. The shape of the handle makes it easy to keep it perpendicular to the cutting surface. The blades are also less prone to flex, cheaper than X-Acto blades, and easier to to re-sharpen, especially than the X-Acto stainless steel ones. The only location I have to cut 4'x8' sheets is on the floor of the layout room, and I use a carpenter's framing square, a machinist's square, and a long metal straightedge, each as is appropriate. My free hand and one or both feet hold the big square or the straightedge in place while the knife is being used.As others have mentioned, there's no need to cut through the sheet: on .010" material, 2 or 3 light passes will suffice, then simply flex the sheet along the cut to snap it apart. For the large .060" thick sheets, 4 or 5 fairly firm passes with the knife will yield similar results.Depending on what you're building, you may want to use thicker sheet material and/or strip material for bracing - Evergreen has a wide selection of both....and I keep most of what they offer on-hand...
...most of those plastic sleeves contain several packages-worth of similar-sized material, and likewise with small sheets from .005' -.040" thickness. I also have various types of car and structure siding, structural shapes, and styrene rod and tubing.Scratchbuilding is one of those slippery-slope sorta things - the more you get into it, the deeper it draws you in. Enjoy the ride!
Wayne
This suggestion might sound a little odd, especially since you have so many good replies already.
.
I say that for right now, don't worry about it too much. If your first scratchbuilding project is less than good, that is OK. Just keep moving forward and get it done.
You will learn a lot, and your next one will be better.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
As others are saying; too mutch pressure,slow lite strokes. When I started, I would actullay break #11 blades,,a learning curve.
Walking straght edge ? I use the blade part of a tri-square, alittle thicker then a scale rule, I also glued a strip of very fine wet/dry sand paper tothe bottom.
Its a learn as you go thing, don't toss your mistakes,they will be useful at some point
Yeah something on the ruler -- cork or sandpaper or even just some duct tape -- to keep it from sliding is helpful. Clamping is ideal if the work area permits it.
I also found that I was doing better cutting styrene when I did the work on my rather high benchwork (bare wood no track or scenery yet) rather than on the workbench. Being too high above the work perhaps made me push the blade into the work, with the results being as described above from forcing the blade too much. Working at something closer to chest height made me draw the blade over the plastic - a lighter touch. This might be a purely personal thing.
Doctor Wayne makes excellent points: it also matters how the knife handle feels and rests in the hand, and using a blade with some innate stiffness. I had bought a very tiny knife I think sold by Testors, thinking it would be perfect for precise work - handle is much skinnier than a pencil and the blade itself is tiny. It has its uses but it resists long precise strokes because of the "bear paw" way you have to hold the handle and the whippiness of the small but very sharp blade.
Dave Nelson
Something I want to try someday is cutting the thicker styrene (maybe .060" or so) with a table saw, rather than the typical sharp blade. The cut won't wander (if I do my part), and the cut edge will be square--that can be useful. And (again, if I do my part) it can be accurate.
I do have a "real" table saw, but I think it's much too coarse for the typical stuff I want to do. So I'll probably get a model maker's table saw.
For anyone who thinks it can't work to cut styrene with a table saw, I will say that I've cut it with a miniature chop saw, and I regularly machine it with a mill and a lathe. There have been no problems.
I'll add that I dislike cutting styrene with a blade. And the thicker it is, the more I dislike it.
I have cut styrene on a table saw,
What I learned; blade teeth can not be mutch above material, rate of feed is a learning curve by itself.I used a reg.combination blade, unsure if others may be better. plastic is hard to hold, slippery. I think a band saw would work better. You do not end up with aclean edge.
IMO for the few pieaces I needed,it was not worth the extra fooling around. But yes it can be done
I've also cut sheet styrene and ABS with a table saw and a chop saw; full size 10" Delta table, full size 12" Dewalt chop. I'd suggest sandwiching the plastic between two sheets of plywood. And using a high-tooth-count fine cut blade; Freud and Makita make such blades.
As with Dr. Wayne, I like using my utility knive when ever I can. Fits in my hand much better, and doesn't want to "wonder" as much as the Xacto.
I like the band saw idea, might be harder to keep a straight cut, and I don't have a band saw anyway. Utility knive it is.
Mike.
My You Tube
for thin styrene, don't apply a lot of pressure, all you want to do is mark the styrene on the first pass. A lot of times I don't even use the "blade" of the #11 blade, I turn it over and score (not cut) with the back of the blade . I make several passes. Once the score is cut you don't have to use the straight edge if you are careful.
I wouldn't use a table saw and stuff less than an 1/8" or so, even .060 I cut with a knife. Score and break.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
7j43k For anyone who thinks it can't work to cut styrene with a table saw, I will say that I've cut it with a miniature chop saw, and I regularly machine it with a mill and a lathe. There have been no problems. Ed
The key to a clean cut is a rigid & secured piece of stock and cutting tool. If either flexes then your cut will be uneven. The suggestion of placing the styrene sheet between two pieces of wood is a good one. This will eliminate tear-out and chatter; two things that plastics are prone to when cutting with a toothed blade.
I think the main cause of tear-out with plastics is using a blade with too few teeth per inch. There should always be at least two teeth in the cut. If not, the work can lunge forward into the gap between the teeth; and the next tooth takes a big old chomp out. With plastic, that chomp expands in size at the exit point.
UncleButch made the suggestion of having the blade project very little above the work. This serves to lengthen the cut distance so that there will be more teeth in the cut. There will be much less chance of tear-out, if any. This is where a band saw can fail, because the cut distance is the shortest possible, rather than the longest.
7j43kUncleButch made the suggestion of having the blade project very little above the work. This serves to lengthen the cut distance so that there will be more teeth in the cut. There will be much less chance of tear-out, if any. This is where a band saw can fail, because the cut distance is the shortest possible, rather than the longest.
That does sound logical, But what I though I was seeing, is on a 10in blade,too high, the back of the blade was causeing heat, and tended to want to grab the plastic and push it back toward me.And by moveing up would want raise the material off the table, causeing chatter.
I use a band saw on plexiglass,somewhat thicker then 060 styrene,with sucess.
I believ the narrow blade creates less heat,and no up movement
To the OP if your still here ; What are you building with 010 ? kinda thin for anything I do.
I have a trick for making perfectly straight and perfectly parallel cuts in styrene every time, and with very little effort.
I start with 'V' groove sheets. All you need to do is follow the grooves. As has been said several times, I use very little pressure and make several passes.
I keep a variety of V groove sheets with different spacings and different thicknesses on hand. By selecting a sheet with the appropriate spacing I can get parallel cuts that are within a few .000"s of the width of the piece I need. The grooved side of the piece goes to the inside of the model where it usually can't be seen.
Ninety degree cross cuts are made with a small square. Odd angles are made with a cork backed steel ruler. Nothing new there, but I always mark the cut lines with a fine tip Sharpie first, even the ones following the grooves. Makes for fewer mistakes. Note that the Sharpie will bleed through your paint if you are using solvent based paints without a primer. Since I light most of my structures I paint them black first to stop light leakage so the ink stains don't matter anyways.
I will admit that the edges of the V groove cuts are not quite square. One side of the V still shows. I don't recall that that has ever caused a problem if I am blocking the joints.
I will also mention that I rarely work with .010" sheets. The thin styrene is prone to melting if too much adhesive is applied. I usually work with .040" sheets. If I am using .020" sheets it is usually as a brick or roofing veneer.
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
UNCLEBUTCH 7j43k UncleButch made the suggestion of having the blade project very little above the work. This serves to lengthen the cut distance so that there will be more teeth in the cut. There will be much less chance of tear-out, if any. This is where a band saw can fail, because the cut distance is the shortest possible, rather than the longest. That does sound logical, But what I though I was seeing, is on a 10in blade,too high, the back of the blade was causeing heat, and tended to want to grab the plastic and push it back toward me.And by moveing up would want raise the material off the table, causeing chatter.
7j43k UncleButch made the suggestion of having the blade project very little above the work. This serves to lengthen the cut distance so that there will be more teeth in the cut. There will be much less chance of tear-out, if any. This is where a band saw can fail, because the cut distance is the shortest possible, rather than the longest.
The back of the blade shouldn't be touching the plastic, in theory. Sure, the edge of the tooth will touch coming up, just as it touches going down. But if there's heating, I think there's TOO MUCH touching. I think I've see some carbide blades where they leave a lot of the side of the insert to rub against the work. I gotta wonder about using plain steel teeth, where they bend the tooth for the kerf. There really shouldn't be much THERE to rub on the plastic.
And you likely would want a good amount of set.
(I once bought a hand saw with, I think, absolutely no set on the teeth at all. Really. Yikes, that thing would bind REAL SOON. Must have been some sort of specialty saw.)
I use a band saw on plexiglass,somewhat thicker then 060 styrene,with sucess. I believ the narrow blade creates less heat,and no up movement
Certainly there will be no pull-up with a band saw. I do suspect your band saw doesn't use carbide inserts on the teeth. Perhaps it's working like the blade I talked about above.
The tooling I use when I mill or turn styrene is either high speed steel or solid carbide. No inserts. There's really nothing there to rub on the plastic. I NEVER have melting problems when I work.
I do appreciate your point about the possibility of the circular blade possibly lifting the work. I'll have to keep a watch out for that.
Ed,
A circular blade shouldn't lift the work at all. The rotation of the spinning blade should force the stock against the surface of the saw's platform, yes?
I think maybe I should make myself a little chopper with straight square "fences" to butt sheets of styrene against. Then I can just push a little arm down like a paper guillotine to make cuts. I have been using a plastic ruler. Thats probably been part of the problem. This DIY chopper would make things fast, straight, square, and clean. And yes I know there are choppers out there already (Micro Mark) but I would rather spend my money on other things (more styrene).
Scores or slices with knives are an art. Not a difficult art. Some swear a dull knife does a better job. I could buy that for a dollar but argue with it as well.
When cutting stock against a straightedge the angle of your knife blade slightly into the straight edge keeps the cutting edge true.
When scoring sheet goods against a straightedge. One must keep in mind the angle of the knife blade angling into the straight edge must be slight but very important. If a slight angle of the blade is angled towards the straight edge, the cut will always follow true.
Choppers generally use a single-edge safety blade to make cuts and the width of the cut is limited to the width of the blade. With that being the case, cuts wider than 1.5" are prohibitive. You'll still need a good ruler to make long cuts in styrene sheeting.
And choppers don't always guarantee a perpendicular cut. The blade can still flex slightly on thicker stock. I've found it requires some minimum filing with thicknesses over 0.05".
hon30critter Ninety degree cross cuts are made with a small square. Odd angles are made with a cork backed steel ruler. Nothing new there, but I always mark the cut lines with a fine tip Sharpie first, even the ones following the grooves. Makes for fewer mistakes. Note that the Sharpie will bleed through your paint if you are using solvent based paints without a primer.
Ninety degree cross cuts are made with a small square. Odd angles are made with a cork backed steel ruler. Nothing new there, but I always mark the cut lines with a fine tip Sharpie first, even the ones following the grooves. Makes for fewer mistakes. Note that the Sharpie will bleed through your paint if you are using solvent based paints without a primer.
If possible, put down a strip of masking tape straddling the line of cut. Burnish it down hard and flat. Mark that with the Sharpie. Then cut through the tape and into the plastic.
Might help.
7j43k (I once bought a hand saw with, I think, absolutely no set on the teeth at all. Really. Yikes, that thing would bind REAL SOON. Must have been some sort of specialty saw.)
That was a rip saw and not a crosscut saw. Rip saws are made to cut parallel with the grain, and crosscut saws are made (oddly enough) to cut across the grain.
BNSF UP and others modelerbeen using a plastic ruler
A very good way to draw blood,,,
I have heard of using the older style paper cutters, with the long handle blade. But I don't know how thick of material