Too much space yes,that can become a problem.
We all have that perfect dream layout we want to build.
However.
A basement filling Godzilla size layout takes years for one man to complete and to maintain once finished then there is always the possibility the layout will not be finished to to a unforeseen move, personal economic hard times or health issues..
Bigger is not better by a long sight..
Why not go for a smaller size layout you can easily build and leave room for a modest size work bench,storage space,paint booth,library etc?
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
Another alternative is to design a small layout and then selectively expand that simpler design to fill the space. For example, double the space between stations so that your longer trains are no longer occupying two or even three towns at once. A friend has a built large N-scale layout using this philosophy. The broader curves are particularly impressive. It looks far more like the real world than the densely packed tracks of the infamous "spaghetti bowl" where your eyes are constantly distracted by another main line mere inches away.
But it is all your choice, depending on your skills and personal priorities within the hobby.
John
I have never been in the situation of having a large space available for a layout. Here at my side of the Big Pond, houses and basements are much smaller. Most of the time in my 50+ years as a model railroader, I had to search for rather unusual solutions to make the best out of the small space where I could put up a layout.
To be honest, with that background I would not feel comfortable having a really large space (in my understanding anything above 10´ by 15´) available to be filled with a layout. I can´t picture myself working for years or even decades on one layout, before being able to run a train through something being at least semi-finished. The Plywood Pacific RR is not my thing, I´d rather go for detail, which is time consuming. I am also a scratchbuilder, more out of necessity than by own choice. There won´t be a single structure on my On30 layout that is either kit-built or RTR.
How much space is too much space? That question can only you answer. Biting a big chunk out of the apple is one thing, swallowing it another. When the fun leaves and building your layout becomes a chore, you know you went for something beyond your means.
I agree with rrebell....get something going within a reasonable amount of quickness. You can add elements to the layout later. You'll be using water based products or nails to attach the roadbed and track so they would come up easy if you want to adjust the track arrangment. After you ballast and do scenery work, making adjustments becomes a bigger deal.
The reason I would want to get something going relatively soon is that you can spend A LOT of time designing a layout to fill up a basement. Lots of paralysis by analysis.
You might get tired of building a lot of benchwork ( I would start with stringing some 2x6 sections along the wall to start) , but you'll be farther along than trying to draw out the perfect trackplan before you even start anything.
Those 2x6 strings of benchwork can be a switching layout that ends up being a switching disctrict on a larger layout, or a build classification yard to start. In other words, start with an "anchor" area of the trackplan. The around the walls part can be perfected later, or even as you go.
- Douglas
Tony Koester champions a process based on "layout design elements". Basically you design chunks of railroad, each of which represents a location you intend to model like a yard, a cool bridge, passenger station, an industry or a town... Once you have designed the LDE's you arrange them in your space in your desired sequence, then connect them together.
...and there is such a thing as too much space. How much were you thinking of spending? It's pretty easy to spend $50 to $100 per square foot of layout.
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
tomcatHow do the guys with massive rooms or basements in their houses figure out and design a layout that they are happy with.(or at least to start with anyway
the Pacific Southern club I joined is in a 90x45' basement, is a 2 and 1/2 time around terminal railway. It has 3 end points, 2 with reversing loops and a small terminal with a turntable (Harper's Ferry). it has hidden staging against a 45' wall. It's been a club since the early 60s, and an extention was added to the house to increase the size of the basement after it was bought by a club member when the original owner passed away. As you can see it is dense with trackwork. It started as an O gauge layout, was rebuilt as HO and extended with the basement addition. It runs passenger and freight.
It's been in construction/operation for close to 50 years and has a very dedicated collection of members. I think it is unique, but there are others just as unique such as Bruce Chubb's Sunset Valley layout.
But a large layout doesn't need to be crowded with trackwork, such as Pelle Soeborg's described in the March 2014 Model Railroader.
And you may also benefit from Frank Ellison's Art of Model Railroading
Even John Allen's Gorre & Dapheteid was his 3rd layout.
I have to think that most successful layouts evolved through some trial and error, and certainly didn't happen over night. Presumably they were planned and built in stages, allowing some operation while construction continued elsewhere. And there must have been a trade off between a focus on trackwork and scenery.
Good Luck ... but start learning from your mistakes
greg - Philadelphia & Reading / Reading
Try designing in modules/phases. Draw your room, start in on area, draw in a bench work design in that are, add tracks, building, work on it until you like it, then move on to design the next module/phase. You can always go back and change pervious modules as you go. Then, you can build in phases/modules (like you did in planning) and test the track. Don't permantaly attach the track until you are happy.
First, I agree with Chuck. There ain't no such thing as too much space.
Second, you say you want "industry and passenger trains, staging and all the rest".
That is a good start. But, what kinds of industry? As for passenger trains, do you want a large downtown passenger station? Open country or urban environment? What kind of terrain? What era? Steam or diesel or transition?
Don't approach this backwards by looking at the space and trying to decide how to fill it.
Rather, think about the kind of layout that excites you. Then, free hand, draw some track plans.
You gotta start somewhere.
Rich
Alton Junction
TANSTATMS!!!
(Translation - there aint no such thing as too much space!)
Key and critical realization - you DON'T have to fill it all at once.
Second key factor. You DO have to stake a permanent claim to as much of it as you ever intend to use!
So, design some configuration of benchwork, with nice, wide aisleways and a 24 inch accessway along each wall, that will preclude preemption for some subsequent use (ping-pong, anyone) and then design a SIMPLE initial track plan. Someone suggested a dogbone. I suggest a giraffe foreleg bone (it's longer.) Using cookie-cut roadbed (to save plywood) run track over all that benchwork - single track with a couple of passing sidings. Maybe you'll want to add a simple stub end yard with an adequate lead - to add to one of those passing locations.
Note that the initial track is NOT meant to last for the ages. As your ideas and interests develop you can redesign, rebuild and relocate with wild abandon. DCC means that you can make radical changes in track pattern without having to concern yourself with electrical system modifications. Having a large space should mean that you can add beaucoup staging without having to burrow underground. Some things (like tall viaducts) may require benchwork surgery. Don't hesitate, once the location has been finalized.
Above all, remember that the only one you have to please is the cat under YOUR hat. If others like your results, that's just gravy.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - as I wish it had been)
Just build a very large dogbone layout. Once up and running you can cut in switches to meet your wants and needs.
tomcat How do the guys with massive rooms or basements in their houses figure out and design a layout that they are happy with.(or at least to start with anyway) Has anyone had so much space for their dream layout, that they have so much trouble designing a layout to go in that space?
How do the guys with massive rooms or basements in their houses figure out and design a layout that they are happy with.(or at least to start with anyway)
Has anyone had so much space for their dream layout, that they have so much trouble designing a layout to go in that space?
While quite a number of those that seem to have trouble designing their layouts usually are doing a Made UP (Factitious) Railroad.
This is a very hard thing to do as you have to build it from Scratch (so to speak).
My first couple of layouts were done on that idea but I usually tried to base the layout on a real part of the map!
Then trying to guess what a real railroad would look like, if it had ran through this town or part of the country side!
While it worked it ended up being a spaghetti bowl!
I joined a MRR Club and again this is what they had and the end product was another spaghetti bowl (but the Public really liked it)!
When the Club had to move, the next Layout we designed, we went for the OPERATIONS! Side of the project and modeled an actual operating Railroad in our area!
We were well along and then had a fire and wiped out everything! – we moved to another place (much smaller this time) and began again.
This time we also went for the Prototypical Shortline Layout as the laying out of the Trackwork was easy – Go Out and Look At It!
That was a no brainer as the Real Railroad already had everything laid out – We just had to compress things a bit but there it was!
When I finally was ready to Retire and was planning my Dream Layout – the first thing I did was build a LARGE Home to house the anticipated Layout in (where most Retirees go and sell off their BIG House – and therefore their DREAM Layout – I did just the opposite)!
Now that I knew how much room I would have, I began thinking of the Old Design our MRR Club was doing when we were burned out of that project!
Only this time instead of having a 22 x 44 – I had 103 x 46 area to build the same layout in!
I had the Conrail ZTS (Zone Spot Maps) from 1984 and they had all of the track layouts of each town along the route that I was going to model.
So easy to decide what tracks were needed all I had to do was decide the length and start building around the walls and down the peninsulas.
I did a rough drawing on some paper and scaled it close but not something I was going to go by exactly.
Remember I had 2500 sq ft to work with where the old Club Layout was less than 1000 sq ft. So I could fudge things if I had to!
I picked the 1975 to 1985 era – which allowed me to run the last or PRR/PC and the beginning of Conrail.
I also could go out to the actual places (as I was smart enough to model someplace Local instead of across the country) and take pictures of the buildings and track as most of the lines were still in.
And besides nothing ever changes in the woods of Western PA – so the buildings looked the same as the day they were built in the ‘40s – ‘50s – ‘60s and so on!
So Modeling something that is a real Railroad – close to you and in an Era that isn’t been gone for 100 years sure makes it easier to Scale down and you are pretty sure that the Trackwork in the Yards and Industrial areas will be Prototypical as YOU are copying right from the REAL THING!
I have to hand it to those that try to wing a Fictitious Railroad (and I OPERATE! On a number of them) and they have done a good job in making them seem fairly real!
But when you are running the same equipment in Model form that your Operators saw at the same exact place in real life that you have scaled down – It sure brings back the MEMORIES!
BOB H – Clarion, PA
I have never had the luxury of "too much space" but I have had enough space to cause myself trouble :-) You need to ask yourself about your preferences, we all seem to want a "big yard", a "loco servicing area", etc, etc. But what do YOU really want versus what do you think you might need or what you "kinda want". Another consioderation besides space is (of course) money - can you afford the layout that you think you want? Another consideration is your available time - bench work and initial track laying go rather rapidly, but there are a million things to finish and fine tune. A big layout that has kinks, shorts, derailments and such will be no fun to run, while a more moderate layout with good, refined tracks work and wiring can be a joy to play with. Another consideration - is this a one-man operation or will you have friends over to build and run? Having extra help can ease up the time investment and can be fun. If you plan on having people come help with operations means that you need to allow more space for people to exist around the train. Wide aisles are helpful as many of us model railroaders border on the obese (just being honest). So there is a lot of consideration to be given to other items besides "how many tracks can I put over there?" I like one approach mentioned by John Armstrong where he starts with a list of "givens and druthers" - what physical requirements does the room present? Do you prefer building models (meaning more of a "display layout) or operating (need some challenges) or watching trains run (need to leave room for scenery). This list will be unique to you. My layout won't fill your needs and I may not like the next guys plan. Plus, remember that you can always tear the railroad down and start over again. You can also start with a modest plan and leave yourself room for growth as you find areas of the hobby that you really like. I hope you enjoy the process!
First decide what kind of layout you want.
Almost all large layouts built today are of the walk along with the train kind. The ends may be loops or points usually with staging. Occaisionally, the ends join to form a loop.
Other kinds have been built is the past that are of the operator sits in one place, usually elevated, and runs the train from there. These usually have multiple loops of track through the scenery. Or the multiple control panel where the trains are operated from 2 or more fixed points. With DCC, these are largely out of favor.
Next decide what features you want. Design a freight yard, industrial park, a mine siding, scenic effect, etc. Then string the features out in the order you want and add connecting track where needed.
You will probably have too much and have to condense or eliminate. When it all fits with room left over, you're ready to start building.
A more casual approach is to build a chunk of benchwork, say 8-16 feet and just build some stuff on it. When done add another chunk and build some more. Continue until you have enough layout or run out of basement.
Good luck
Paul
If you start by drawing track arrangements, I think it's easy for a large space to become overwhelming quickly. What comes next, how's it supposed to look, why is a particular feature there? I like to start by figuring out where the modeled line is on a map. You don't need much detail, just a general idea. Determine where yards, industries and so on should be if your line were part of the actual rail network. From there, arrange what you can into the available space. Anything you can't fit in could maybe become staging.
Visit as many high quality layouts as you can. Read up on layouts you like in the magazines, as well as publications like Great Model Railroads and Model Railroad Planning. See how designs work for their owners.
Rob Spangler
I think people forget how long it takes to build a layout. I really had no idea when I started.
I would first switch from paper and pencil to a layout design program. I used the Atlas RTS program, no longer officially available, and I've used XTrakCad, which is more capable but has a longer learning curve. I was originally designing a 5x12 foot layout in HO. It still took me a few months, but in the end I was happy with the results.
I'd start by designing a small section with plenty of options for expansion. You don't have to start with a room-filling design. You will change your mind about some of it anyway.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Heres one for all
My new house I have a great size for my layout (and yes it can always be bigger) but for the life of me I cant figure out a design I'm happy with . I know I want industry and passenger trains , staging and the rest but have no idea what design to go with , ive worn out 100 rubbers in my sketch book trying to figure it out!!!