WOW!! Why do I feel,slighted,,I guess old old guys don't count,,62 yrs in the Hobby and still don't know nuttin, Gee!!
Cheers,
Frank
ATLANTIC CENTRAL Threads like this are exactly why I don't spend much time on here any more. And, the less time I spend on here, the fewer times David is likely to get banned. And I must admit, that the few times I did ask a question, or seek help or info on here, the results were not all that helpful. Not meaning to brag or sound arrogant, but that might have a little to do with the fact that I have been at this model train thing for about 46 years now - like david said - there really is not that much "new" stuff for me to see/learn.
Threads like this are exactly why I don't spend much time on here any more.
And, the less time I spend on here, the fewer times David is likely to get banned.
And I must admit, that the few times I did ask a question, or seek help or info on here, the results were not all that helpful. Not meaning to brag or sound arrogant, but that might have a little to do with the fact that I have been at this model train thing for about 46 years now - like david said - there really is not that much "new" stuff for me to see/learn.
I am beginning to realize more and more that there are at least three distinct classes of forum members, the oldbies like Sheldon and David, the newbies like Calvin and others, and the rest of us, the middle class of the forum so to speak.
What may be old news, or no news, for guys like Sheldon and David, is new news for newbies. And, for the rest of us, there is still plenty to learn, and a lot of good information is still available on this forum. And I, for one, am grateful that guys like rrinker and doctorwayne and a host of others stick around and answer questions that have been asked before.
I would rather that experienced pros like Sheldon and David stick around and answer all of those old questions once again. But if the sole purpose of participation is just to stick around for a laugh or two or just to make short, curt remarks, then what's the point of sticking around?
Rich
Alton Junction
And, on too many occassions when I have shared my 46 years of experiance building, running, selling and repairing model trains, some "expert" has told me how what I do could not possibly work, or it is foolish, or I am "backward" - usually some "expert" half my age with 1/4 of my experiance.
So now I just stop in now and then for a good laugh - again Bing is much better than google - or this forum.
The other truth is this hobby has splintered into so many different sub cultures that I am just not remotely interested in most of what many of you are doing - and it has become clear that most of you feel the same way about what I am doing in the hobby - so I have less to offer, and this forum offers me less and less.
I think I will stop by MB Klein tomorrow and buy some more train stuff - then bring it home and build it - so you may not hear from me for another week or so.
Sheldon
davidmbedard Anyways, at least my post count has gone up! A few more threads like this then I can be just like JW! David B
Anyways, at least my post count has gone up! A few more threads like this then I can be just like JW!
David B
LOL
David, rest assured, you and me combined will never catch JW.
He counts 'em as he posts 'em. Just check his profile for proof of that.
Gee whiz guys,
I apologize for interrupting this discussion....................
ENJOY,
Mobilman44
ENJOY !
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
Yes, a civil discussion. But hey, they can talk all they want in the "diner" about weather, health issues, the rent, etc all while talking to an imaginary waitress, so what's the big deal here?
Too bad the OP is gone, but odds are, looking at his post history, he will back shortly, asking about brass or nickel silver track....
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Good grief................
It never ceases to amaze me how a question - almost always by a newbie - can generate so much off subject discussion, misunderstanding, and disagreements. What's really "funny" is the OP is typically long gone early on in the thread.
Well, Kalmbach feels is is perfectly fine to ask questions, per their Q & A on the "Help" link.
Q. What is a forum?
A. A forum is a discussion area where you can ask a question, make an announcement, share your thoughts on a topic, etc.. Other community members can then respond to your posts from within the forums.
This forum is for modelers (new and old) to congregate, socialize, ask questions, trade modeling ideas, ask questions, seek advice and help, and, oh yes, ask questions.
I wish that folks would just (A) Answer the question (B) stay on topic, and lastly, (C) if you can't answer the question or assist, don't bother to post meaningless stuff that helps no one.
I also wish the OP would (A) give details (B) acknowledge the answers.
I won't hold my breathe
Would enjoy to hear from Kalmbach on what is the scope of the forums.
richhotrain Larry, the debate is not so much about the value of YouTube as it is about the value or usefulness of this forum. I think that you are missing the point. Rich
Larry, the debate is not so much about the value of YouTube as it is about the value or usefulness of this forum. I think that you are missing the point.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
richhotrainalthough I am not sure that I would totally agree with you on YouTube as a good source of information.
I suppose it depends on what one is looking for..
There is excellent tutorials on you tube covering hand laid track to weathering,several test reviews, manufactures can be found there etc.There is tutorials on installing DCC and sound decoders.Want to learn basic CV settings? You tube can supply a video covering such topics..
Want to know what a MRC 645E sound decoder really sounds like? Look to you tube.
I also like the "vintage" super 8 videos covering fallen flag railroads.
BRAKIE richhotrain What if you are right about the forums being the last place you would EVER post, but also wrong about the quality of your own advice. In other words, if no one else on this forum is giving good advice, how do we know that you are either? Rich Rich,When I wanted to find out how Bachmans AlcoS4 with DCC/Sound was like I bypassed all forums and went to you tube for my answer. Why? I didn't want the normal good,bad and down right Bachman is junk replies that usually surfaces with the mere mention of Bachman and I mustn't overlook the "its not up to today's standards" comments.We both seen that. So,yes IMHO there is some questions that one should Google or use you tube to find the best unbiased answer-the proof is in the videos. If I have a specific question like the color of (say) HH&W coach seats in August 1933 I would use Google or a more prototypical based forum. The manufacturers web pages can also become your BFF as well for basic information..This is how I found out Bev-Bel/Athearn produced a Berlin Mills Ry 50 foot IPD boxcar.. So,IMHO there is times for asking on forums and when Google and you tube is your BFF.
richhotrain What if you are right about the forums being the last place you would EVER post, but also wrong about the quality of your own advice. In other words, if no one else on this forum is giving good advice, how do we know that you are either? Rich
What if you are right about the forums being the last place you would EVER post, but also wrong about the quality of your own advice. In other words, if no one else on this forum is giving good advice, how do we know that you are either?
Rich,When I wanted to find out how Bachmans AlcoS4 with DCC/Sound was like I bypassed all forums and went to you tube for my answer.
Why?
I didn't want the normal good,bad and down right Bachman is junk replies that usually surfaces with the mere mention of Bachman and I mustn't overlook the "its not up to today's standards" comments.We both seen that.
So,yes IMHO there is some questions that one should Google or use you tube to find the best unbiased answer-the proof is in the videos.
If I have a specific question like the color of (say) HH&W coach seats in August 1933 I would use Google or a more prototypical based forum.
The manufacturers web pages can also become your BFF as well for basic information..This is how I found out Bev-Bel/Athearn produced a Berlin Mills Ry 50 foot IPD boxcar..
So,IMHO there is times for asking on forums and when Google and you tube is your BFF.
Larry, I am not saying that this forum is the only place to get good advice, although I am not sure that I would totally agree with you on YouTube as a good source of information. Google, on the other hand, is simply a search engine finding both the best and the worst. I, too, rely on other sources for advice such as the Yahoo Groups, like NCE-DCC and Wiring for DCC.
I am also not saying that this forum is the best place for good information and valid advice. But it surely is not the worst place, although David seems to think so, or at least it is the last place in his view to come for advice.
Meant to be a Funny, nothing more..
As a Quote, from a line,in one of, Mel Brooks,movies, ''It's Good To Be The King''.
davidmbedard I answer questions. My questions are answered elsewhere. Are you suggesting that I don't add value to these forums? That I should move on? Really, I've been banned and suspended soo many times I've lost count. David B
I answer questions. My questions are answered elsewhere. Are you suggesting that I don't add value to these forums? That I should move on? Really, I've been banned and suspended soo many times I've lost count. David B
No, David, I am not suggesting that at all. I am aware of the fact that you do answer questions and comment on issues that arise in various threads.
But what surprised me on this thread was your comment that If you are looking for any info related to the hobby, these forums are the absolute last place you would EVER post. That is what prompts me to ask why you even bother to participate in the forum in that case.
So, now, I see your point. You are willing to comment on issues raise by others and answer questions that are posed, but you would never raise your own issues or ask your own questions on this forum.
Think about that a minute though. What you are saying is that you are the only guy on the forum who provides good advice. Alternatively, maybe you are suggesting that others are your equal and they provide good advice too. But, no one on this forum provides advice that can be useful or informative to you. After all, these forums are the absolute last place you would EVER post.
To the earlier post I'm Fine, and have moved on, and I assume most of U on this Forum would hope that
I would have done.
Some people never got the message from Bambi's mom!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
I never use Google - Bing is much better.
davidmbedard If I am looking for any info related to the hobby, these forums are the absolute last place I would EVER post.
If I am looking for any info related to the hobby, these forums are the absolute last place I would EVER post.
So, David, I gotta ask, why do you then bother to reply to others posts?
Why even be a member of this forum?
Before this gets out of hand, I was wondering if one of the moderators / staff could check the IP of mister CALVIN JR.
Just wondering if he is posting from, the NEW LONDON CONNECTICUT area perhaps?
Jim
Folks,
I'm absolutely amazed at how distorted this thread has gotten. The OP asked some legitimate questions, and we are all free to answer them or not.
As far as not taking the time/effort to "google" to get the answer ones self, well I would wager my RR that everyone on this Forum is "guilty" of that that - some wayyyyy more than others.
When I have an MR question, I want to pose it to real people - folks I can interact with and get their opinions as well as facts.
And frankly, when you really think about it, pretty much every question asked here could likely be answered by the results of a search engine. Of course, that would make this Forum unnecessary!
Let's move on to another thread.................
mlehmanThey say silence is golden and sometimes it is.
I agree but,self help is just as golden and in some cases superior to forum answers.
Took me around three minutes to find the difference between Bowser's "executive line" and "traditional line" on their web page.
As far as orneriness maybe its not that at all..
Post count means absolutely nothing to many of us.
Google can be your BFF for some specific answers..
As a example..
How many of us even heard of (say) the Hooton Hollow & Western Ry or the color their coach seats way back in August of 1933?
You fellows ever hear of librarians? They do this all day long as part of their job. Even get paid for it.
Now, all of us here, we're volunteers. You're under no obligation to help anyone, whether or not you actually can
And it's true these forums are a big fat target for new folks, hoping to shortcut their way to answers. Nothing wrong with that. That is part of what it's here for.
Now, I can understand the feeling, "Gee, isn't that the 100th time this month someone's asked a variation of that question?" That's true, in many cases as we all know...
But it does seem a little more than necessary to always be popping up to suggest someone Google something if they want the answer. Maybe they already tried. Maybe this is the first time they ever logged on a model rail site, heard you could get some good help there, then this...
They say silence is golden and sometimes it is. The "Google it" answer gets pretty old and, if you think about it, becomes even more degraded as a general retort than an at least semi-specific if rather naive question that can be answered with a quick search in a new browser tab in the blink of an eye. Give 'em a link is my philosophy, even if it is a situation where a suggestion to search is clearly called for -- because sometimes that exactly what I do. If that's too much trouble to do, then why bother with writing a reply to say you won't?
Post count or just orneryness? I can understand orneryness, but geez chill with it if it's just post count
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
davidmbedardIt all depends on how you define these forums. All too often it becomes a one-way idea suck fest with nary a thank you. I've answered a multitude of questions over the years, but I am a straight shooter. If I feel the op is an idea sucker, I will offer the Google answer. An op with a good attitude will usually result in a bit more of my time with a complete answer. David B
davidmbedardWe'll, mr op, have you ever heard the saying "give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you feed him for life"? You may not like it, but if someone tell you to GOOGLE IT, then he is teaching you how to fish, nothing more. Again, this is a reflection of our "I'm entitled" society. The op feels that it is his god given rite to demand the information that we have dug up....... LEARN TO FiSH MAN!!!!!! We are just telling you where to throw your line in! What is the issue here? David B
I don't want to join a grouch fest. Folks still wet behind the ear need a hand up, too.
I would make a request, though, C. Jr. Please chill with the all-caps Subject lines. That usually means you're shouting in internetiquette. Which is OK every once in awhile, but if it's every post? well...
You probably don't want to come off sounding like Chicken Little if you want to persuade people to help you out. That makes it a lot harder than it needs to be.
How do you know that the OP is feeling "entitled" and didn't even try to figure it out?
I think that you are jumping to conclusions.
My sense is that he saw the listings on a site other than Bowser for certain locos and rolling stock and did not lnow what the terms meant like EXEC, TRAD, HDL, DHL. So, he comes on the forum and asks for help.
Look at it another way. If Google was the answer to everything, you wouldn't even need the forum.
I will tell you this. When you Google stuff, a lot of sites that pop up are ask.com, answer.com, about.com. The "answers" on those sites are worse than useless. It is a bunch of morons throwing out guesses.
If I were the Forum Administrator, I would amend the policy section to ban the reply, "Go Google it".
Yeah, but if you know the answer and the OP doesn't, why not just tell him the answer?
davidmbedard LEARN TO FiSH MAN!!!!!! We are just telling you where to throw your line in! What is the issue here?
Yea but people like you put "No Trespassing" signs on your ponds.