rolleiman wrote: 4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:help help helpJust wanting to sumerize this (for my own mind).. 1. Once we get to the fish tank, we stop. Cannot go beyond that point and the fish tank is not movable (for easier access into the aisle area). 2. Layout Must be free standing, cannot attach the walls. 3. Your interest is primarily a large yard and engine terminal. I may have missed it but, Can you build above the cabinets? (I'm guessing not because without some fancy carpentry, it'd be difficult to accomplish without attaching to the walls). If not, would your parents buy the idea of having to use a lift or swing gate of some sort to get To the cabinets? Actually, it would probably require two of them, one on each end of the layout. If so, you could expand your layout 3 feet to the left based on the current working drawing. I'm sure duckunders are out of the question for them..
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:help help help
Just wanting to sumerize this (for my own mind)..
1. Once we get to the fish tank, we stop. Cannot go beyond that point and the fish tank is not movable (for easier access into the aisle area).
2. Layout Must be free standing, cannot attach the walls.
3. Your interest is primarily a large yard and engine terminal.
I may have missed it but, Can you build above the cabinets? (I'm guessing not because without some fancy carpentry, it'd be difficult to accomplish without attaching to the walls). If not, would your parents buy the idea of having to use a lift or swing gate of some sort to get To the cabinets? Actually, it would probably require two of them, one on each end of the layout. If so, you could expand your layout 3 feet to the left based on the current working drawing. I'm sure duckunders are out of the question for them..
Yes, your summary is correct. I can't build near the cabinets and the duckunder is out of the question for them. Yes I just want a yard and an engin terminal.
Model Railroader June 2008 - track plan Montreal Harbor Railway
Model Railroader May 2008 - track plan Junction City locomotive terminal
Former is 9x11 feet - should fit into your 8 1/2 by 12 feet if you squeeze it a little at one end.
Latter is 12' 6" by 3'8", of which staging is 4' - and should fit neatly into an I or L-shaped layout in your room.
Smile, Stein
The capnets are 2ft deep and area at the bottom of your drawing is off limits. I may be able to do some sweet talking to my parents and see if I can get 1-2ft to have it stick out that way. I did talk to them about the room above the garage and they said NO.
Correction. Of course you have a computer. What I meant to say and didn't complete the sentence (old man syndrome) is you should have access to a computer you are not liklely to get kicked off of, since once you start this process, you will be amazed at how much info there is out there. You won't want to shut it down. Try this for starters:
Evanston Wyoming Roundhouse
To see an aerial shot of the complex today, use Google Earth or Microsoft's TerraServer and type in the location you want to see. Try also Historic Aerials. Their selection of areas is limited, but the images go back to the 30's and 40's.
If you have access to a computer, then you need to perform one the basics of model railroading: research. If you type "union pacific" (or any other railroad you are interested in) in to your browser, you can obtain a wealth of information relative to the road you selected, including its smaller engine terminals. Further, in order to run Big Boys into North Platte, you would have to modify history since the 4000's rarely, if ever ran to North Platte. The UP's position was to let the Big Boys handle Sherman Hill, then turn the eastbounds over to the Challengers for the flatland running. The 4000's were generally restricted to Salt Lake-Cheyenne.
There were literally thousands of smaller engine terminals on each railroad in the country during the 40's and 50's, so you shouldn't have a problem finding a good UP terminal to model.
Also, DonZ and others are correct: just because one wants the turntable to look a certain way doesn't mean it will end up that way without serious modification as the geometry imposed by the table's length will determine correct track spacing and distance from table to building.
I hadn't read everything in complete detail so admittedly, I missed a few details. I do remember shape discussion early on however. Didn't know that continuous run was something Kyle was willing to give up, only that he wanted a large engine terminal and yard.
I was hoping to point him toward an O shaped layout possibly with an extension (with his parent's permission) along the top of that cabinet row. IT, would be the perfect place for a rather large stub ended yard, having the ladder run basically on the right side near where the alcove is. The area suggested previously for the turntable would then work if it were flipped 180 degrees and with sime fitting, a 90 degree or so roundhouse is workable. From there, a continuous couple loops around the remaining space in the "O" would provide some railfanning type operation on the layout space, complete with Nebraska's towering mountains () or at least rolling hills on the western end. Could be the best of all 3 worlds and not too daunting to build.
I designed a layout for a freind several years back that offered tons of operation possiblilty, a smaller yard, no roundhouse (I know Kyle wants one) that would probably fit his space. With the additional space above the cabinets (if you ((Kyle)) can swing it), the engine facility could be worked in. IF anyone is interested in looking it over for ideas, I'll dig it up and post a screenshot of the drawing. May even still have a few photos of the layout.
rolleiman wrote: 4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:Thanks for all of the info so far. Does anyone know of good yard and engin terminals with a round house that would work great for a 12x8ft layout. I dont have to have a circit layout just a yard and engin terminal.Challenger, How are you planning to access the interior of this layout?? Even the lankiest kid (tall and thin) I've ever seen had at best about a 28" working reach. You have what I would call some pretty serious access problems especially on the right side of the layout 12x8 space.
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:Thanks for all of the info so far. Does anyone know of good yard and engin terminals with a round house that would work great for a 12x8ft layout. I dont have to have a circit layout just a yard and engin terminal.
Challenger, How are you planning to access the interior of this layout??
Even the lankiest kid (tall and thin) I've ever seen had at best about a 28" working reach. You have what I would call some pretty serious access problems especially on the right side of the layout 12x8 space.
U-shaped layout, L-shaped layout or O-shaped layout. Challenger is not proposing an island layout is 12x8 foot - he is saying that the layout has to be contained within a footprint that is maximum size 12x8 foot, with the right 8 foot side and the rightmost 4 feet of both the bottom and top sides up against walls.
Actually - according to the discussions earlier in this thread Kyle has about 8 1/2 x 13 feet available, see overview of room below: Overview of room:
I would encourage you to look at Corey's threadhttp://cs.trains.com/forums/1436789/ShowPost.aspx as his space is 10x8. I'm just suggesting that you consider the pains of reaching over (to work) as well as constantly crawling under the layout to get to something. Remember Murpy's golden train rule. It will NEVER derail or stall where you can easily reach it.
I would encourage you to look at Corey's thread
http://cs.trains.com/forums/1436789/ShowPost.aspx
as his space is 10x8. I'm just suggesting that you consider the pains of reaching over (to work) as well as constantly crawling under the layout to get to something. Remember Murpy's golden train rule. It will NEVER derail or stall where you can easily reach it.
It is good general advice But not particularily applicable here. Kyle (Challenger) wants an engine terminal/yard layout in H0 scale - he can live w/o continuous run.
So an U-shaped layout about 2 feet wide with an opening towards the left, possibly with a 2x2 peninsula on the inside of one of the two lefthand corner for a roundhouse might be a solution here. That would allow about 12+8 (top and right side) for a yard, about 12 feet (towards the rest of the basement/entrance for an engine terminal.
Possibly a divider down along the uppermost side, with a couple-three of staging/fiddle yard tracks on the 8 feet outside (towards the cabinets) - leaving room for a couple of train of maybe 12-13 40' cars, an engine and a caboose, drawers for cars below layout.
Something roughly along those lines perhaps. Anyone feel up to drawing up a possible yard and steam engine terminal for Kyle ?
Challenger, How are you planning to access the interior of this layout?? Even the lankiest kid (tall and thin) I've ever seen had at best about a 28" working reach. You have what I would call some pretty serious access problems especially on the right side of the layout 12x8 space. I would encourage you to look at Corey's thread
Don, That's why I said I THINK it's too close and encouraged a look at the templates. Couldn't swear to it from lack of experience with the walther's units. From a visual standpoint, it Is a little too close for my liking (personal preference here).. Here is a 1949 overhead of the one I plan to model (105' TT).
Byron,
My post was aimed more At scratching than a pre-indexed unit (like the walthers). Please see the final paragraph in my post above.
Jeff,
Yes, the Walthers turntable is pre-indexed on 10 degree spacings. Their roundhouse is also built on 10 degree stall spacings, so in order for the track to align from the roundhouse to the turntable, the building must be placed as close as I previously stated. Here is a photo of a full size template for the turntable with rays spaced at 10 degrees. You will notice the rays align with the roundhouse floor sections as planned.
Don Z.
Research; it's not just for geeks.
rolleiman wrote: Actually, Stein, You can put the roundhouse as close as you want to the turntable edge.
Actually, Stein, You can put the roundhouse as close as you want to the turntable edge.
That's not strictly true unless one is planning to scratchbuild or significantly kitbash the roundhouse. Walthers and other roundhouses are built for specific angles and distances from the center of the pit. As I noted on another thread, this is why the 90' Walthers turntable does not save quite as much space as one would hope vs. the 130' TT if one is using one of the Walthers roundhouses. The center point of the pit stays the same, so the roundhouse doors must be farther from the edge of the pit with the 90' TT to make the geometry line up.
Again, if one is willing to scratchbuild the roundhouse, it's much more flexible.
ByronModel RR Blog
Layout Design GalleryLayout Design Special Interest Group
steinjr wrote: Don Z wrote:Stein,Here's a jpeg of the Walthers 130' turntable and roundhouse that I created with XTrkCad.As you can see, it will consume a lot of area!Don Z. Yep. Plan shows same thing as the illustration I made further up in the thread - about 3 1/2 foot from the far edge of turntable pit to rear wall of roundhouse. Here is a closeup of the illustration I made of a minimum configuration with three round house stalls: I was advised to leave 9" (half the pit diameter) between the turntable and the roundhouse and to space the tracks into the roundhouse with 10 degrees between the tracks. Smile, Stein
Don Z wrote:Stein,Here's a jpeg of the Walthers 130' turntable and roundhouse that I created with XTrkCad.As you can see, it will consume a lot of area!Don Z.
Stein,
Here's a jpeg of the Walthers 130' turntable and roundhouse that I created with XTrkCad.
As you can see, it will consume a lot of area!
Yep.
Plan shows same thing as the illustration I made further up in the thread - about 3 1/2 foot from the far edge of turntable pit to rear wall of roundhouse.
Here is a closeup of the illustration I made of a minimum configuration with three round house stalls:
I was advised to leave 9" (half the pit diameter) between the turntable and the roundhouse and to space the tracks into the roundhouse with 10 degrees between the tracks.
Smile,
Stein
Actually, Stein, You can put the roundhouse as close as you want to the turntable edge. Half the pit length is a general rule of thumb I read years ago in the model press and I find it works pretty well when laying out a turntable and roundhouse. Especially when wanting to find the maximum space needed. What I really aim for is to have 2 inches center to center track distance at the roundhouse doors. Taking into account that the door frames are going to take some space, that should allow room for most locos to pass into the roundhouse. In my case, I generally don't worry about the track angles (10 degrees for instance) because any setup I've ever built to completion has had a manual (by eye) index. They should be consistant however.
Given that, the wider the angle, the shorter the distance to the roundhouse from the pit needs to be. I think Don's drawing is a little close and would require about another foot from what is shown (closer to 7' x 7' for the 3/4 roundhouse). Now, the Depth of the roundhouse and the length of the equipment will also affect the placements. If the roundhouse is Just 18" deep and it's full of 4-8-8-4s, then we will need that 2" center track spacing at the doors. But, if it's 18" deep and only will need to hold Pacifics (4-6-2) or even short diesels, then the spacing at the doors could be slightly less so we could move it closer to the turntable (with the same amount of tracks).
Pre-indexed turntables (like the Walthers) may (not certain on this one) have a preset stop for each track. If that's 10 degrees (I think they actually provide planning templates), then we're stuck with it. If it's adjustable however then, with the criteria I've tried to lay out above, we can put the roundhouse wherever we want. Just as long as the locomotives can get in and out without restrictions.
Don Z wrote:Stein,From the 2008 Walthers catalog, page 439: the front of the roundhouse is located 11 15/16" from the center of the turntable. Given that the turntable diameter is 20" outside the pit, the front of the roundhouse is located 1 15/16" from the lip of the turntable pit. I hope this helps.Don Z.
From the 2008 Walthers catalog, page 439: the front of the roundhouse is located 11 15/16" from the center of the turntable. Given that the turntable diameter is 20" outside the pit, the front of the roundhouse is located 1 15/16" from the lip of the turntable pit. I hope this helps.
It sure does - thanks a lot!
I have no personal experience with modelling turntables and roundhouses - they eat up way too much space compared to what I have available for my own layout, and I am more fascinated by diesel engines than steam engines, anyways.
Are you saying that it isn't necessary to leave as much as 9 inches of space between the edge of the turntable pit and the roundhouse door for this roundhouse/turntable combo - that there isn't any interior stall dividers or anything like that which makes it necessary to have greater distance between the pit and the roundhous ?
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:K thanks for that. What were the mesurements that ur wanted me to do.
steinjr wrote:1) I am guestimating that the cabinets are about 4 feet high, 2 feet deep - could you measure them and see if that is about right ? 2) The ideal location for some of those cabinets would have been under the layout out towards that part of the room which is not going to be used for a layout - would greatly improve access to cabinets for your family and free up quite a bit of potensial layout space now used for walkways to access the cabinets. Are these cabinets in one piece (or have a one piece countertop), so they cannot easily be split into e.g. two or three smaller groups of cabinets tucked under the layout here and there, or do they come apart e.g in groups of two and two cabinets ? 3) Last thing to check to determine the limits of space potensially available - what does the area outside the opening of the room look like - like how close is the wall directly opposite the layout area - see figure below to see what I mean. Any chance of you making some measurements and posting a picture of this area ?
1) I am guestimating that the cabinets are about 4 feet high, 2 feet deep - could you measure them and see if that is about right ?
2) The ideal location for some of those cabinets would have been under the layout out towards that part of the room which is not going to be used for a layout - would greatly improve access to cabinets for your family and free up quite a bit of potensial layout space now used for walkways to access the cabinets.
Are these cabinets in one piece (or have a one piece countertop), so they cannot easily be split into e.g. two or three smaller groups of cabinets tucked under the layout here and there, or do they come apart e.g in groups of two and two cabinets ?
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote: The one thing I dont like is it is hard to find CB & Q isnt it?
The one thing I dont like is it is hard to find CB & Q isnt it?
Is it hard to find ? No harder than other engines. I checked walthers.com - they have both 0-8-0 switchers, 2-8-2 Mikados and 2-10-2 USRA heavies in C, B & Q colors.
It is easy enough to find Burlington freight cars too. Walthers list 85 different freight cars. Same on the passenger side - plenty of various kinds of cars.
And you have those cool Zephyr streamlined diesel motor units and gasoline powered doodlebugs.
Quite a few interesting things about the Burlington Route, whose slogan was "Everywhere West".
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote: I need to do more reseach on the round house and yard but I would like to model a little more modern that 1902.
I need to do more reseach on the round house and yard but I would like to model a little more modern that 1902.
Stuff I pointed out was 1915-1930 or so, not 1902. Some of the steam engines probably lasted past WW2.
Anyways - be that as it may - did you get those last couple of measurements of your room ?
steinjr wrote: R. T. POTEET wrote:Kyle, I examined your room-layout graphic for about an hour yesterday before I had to go attend to other business and I looked in on it again this AM. The best I can come up with is that your access requirements for those cabinets leaves you little option beyond a donut-shaped layout. You could potensially fit a dogbone, but the return loops would eat a lot of space and possibly need a popup in the middle for access. So a donut-shape is probably the best bet. Mmm - do we actually have a requirement that the layout must be a continuous run layout ? Kyle's newest vision, given and druthers said "yard w/large engine servicing area", not "continuous run". There are a few places where you could probably fit in 48 inch wide benchwork but most of your platform is going to be restricted to 24 inches. In HO-Scale you could - and that is a pretty big COULD - do a twice-around but only with considerable cramming; whether you like N-Scale or not it would fit better into your available space. Agreed - in N-scale he would have a decent amount of space for a largish yard/engine terminal layout with adequate staging - like the Ozark lines yard/terminal layout in Andy Sperandeo's "Guide to Freight Yards" - which fit in 6x12 feet with an extra 2x3 feet peninsula for the roundhouse area. I surmise that, since you did not include it in your layout-space drawing, that the area in front of that fish tank is in no-no land. If that is true then it is too bad because that space would be perfect for a double-sided peninsula and a balloon. I've asked Kyle about that too - being able to fit in a 2x4 or 3x4 foot extension in this area would make more stuff possible. Should you elect to go with a Challenger/Big Boy motif then you need to keep in mind that turning those locomotives is going to require an 18 inch turntable - AND THAT'S A LOT OF TURNTABLE!!! Yep - it would take about 68" of space to fit an 18" (130' in the prototype) turntable, turntable lead, roundhouse leads and a 125' roundhouse. One could, of course - chose to just model the front of the roundhouse, or park engines on tracks that are 90 degrees (or more) off the approach path, to swap linear space for extra width instead. Southern Nebraska was the province of the triple ts and MKs both of which survived into the mid-'50s; when Diesels bumped the 9000 Class (4-12-2) machines out of the Southern Wyoming deserts they finished their useful days speeding freights across the Nebraska and Kansas prairies. Mmmm - good point. The Big Boys and Challengers ran from Cheyenne, Wyoming to Ogden, Utah, didn't they ? West of Nebraska. Guess it kinda depends on what Kyle feels most attached to - staying close to the prototype or locating the layout in Nebraska, where he lives. Modeller's license and "what-if" can cover quite a bit of chronological and spatial inconsistency if needed or desired. I've poked around on the net to see what prototype photos I could find of steam in Nebraska. If Kyle should decide to move his time period back from the 1940s to the early 1920s or so, there are several possible interesting steam operations prototype locations: Website with digitized images of Old Nebraska photos: http://www.memories.ne.gov/index.php A couple of places that potensially look interesting: Omaha:South Omaha yard http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=261&CISOBOX=1&REC=4Union Stock Yards, South Omaha:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=155&CISOBOX=1&REC=8Unloading docks, Union Stock Yards, South Omaha:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=241&CISOBOX=1&REC=16C,B & Q Railroad yard at McCook, NE, 1902http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=30&CISOBOX=1&REC=6McCook roundhouse, ca 1920-1935http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=57&CISOBOX=1&REC=13A 2-10-2 (?) coaling in McCook, NE, ca 1918:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=14&CISOBOX=1&REC=2 I am sure there are more possible locations that would make great models for steam operations and servicing in Nebraska, if he looks for other sources of inspiration beyond the Bailey yards in North Platte, which came in fairly late (started around 1948 or so, according to a couple of web pages). Btw - the CB&Q photos from McCook is from somewhere called theHigh Plains Historical Society and Museum421 Norris AvenueMcCook, NE 69001308-345-3661hiplains@mccooknet.com It is quite likely that they may have more info on this prototype. It is not the UP, and it is not Challengers - but it likely would be a very interesting prototype to model. A 1939 Nebraska guide by John Richard Felton found on google books: http://tinyurl.com/42eagq described the town thus: "Railroad town and farmers trading center. The heavy loam soil of the Republican river valley produces great quantities of corn and alfalfa. Division point on the Burlington route between Omaha and Denver. Railroad employs 420 men in its shop, roundhouse and station. The town also has a meat packing plant" Also found another potensially interesting book on this prototype: Richard C. Kistler. The High Plains Route: a History of the McCook Division of the Chicago, Burlington and Quincy Railroad. David City, NE: South Platte Press, 3rd Edition, 1987 Anyways - food for thought. In the end, Kyle is the one that has to make the decisions on what he wants to model and how. Smile, Stein
R. T. POTEET wrote:Kyle, I examined your room-layout graphic for about an hour yesterday before I had to go attend to other business and I looked in on it again this AM. The best I can come up with is that your access requirements for those cabinets leaves you little option beyond a donut-shaped layout.
You could potensially fit a dogbone, but the return loops would eat a lot of space and possibly need a popup in the middle for access. So a donut-shape is probably the best bet.
Mmm - do we actually have a requirement that the layout must be a continuous run layout ? Kyle's newest vision, given and druthers said "yard w/large engine servicing area", not "continuous run".
There are a few places where you could probably fit in 48 inch wide benchwork but most of your platform is going to be restricted to 24 inches. In HO-Scale you could - and that is a pretty big COULD - do a twice-around but only with considerable cramming; whether you like N-Scale or not it would fit better into your available space.
Agreed - in N-scale he would have a decent amount of space for a largish yard/engine terminal layout with adequate staging - like the Ozark lines yard/terminal layout in Andy Sperandeo's "Guide to Freight Yards" - which fit in 6x12 feet with an extra 2x3 feet peninsula for the roundhouse area.
I surmise that, since you did not include it in your layout-space drawing, that the area in front of that fish tank is in no-no land. If that is true then it is too bad because that space would be perfect for a double-sided peninsula and a balloon.
I've asked Kyle about that too - being able to fit in a 2x4 or 3x4 foot extension in this area would make more stuff possible.
Should you elect to go with a Challenger/Big Boy motif then you need to keep in mind that turning those locomotives is going to require an 18 inch turntable - AND THAT'S A LOT OF TURNTABLE!!!
Yep - it would take about 68" of space to fit an 18" (130' in the prototype) turntable, turntable lead, roundhouse leads and a 125' roundhouse.
One could, of course - chose to just model the front of the roundhouse, or park engines on tracks that are 90 degrees (or more) off the approach path, to swap linear space for extra width instead.
Southern Nebraska was the province of the triple ts and MKs both of which survived into the mid-'50s; when Diesels bumped the 9000 Class (4-12-2) machines out of the Southern Wyoming deserts they finished their useful days speeding freights across the Nebraska and Kansas prairies.
Mmmm - good point. The Big Boys and Challengers ran from Cheyenne, Wyoming to Ogden, Utah, didn't they ? West of Nebraska.
Guess it kinda depends on what Kyle feels most attached to - staying close to the prototype or locating the layout in Nebraska, where he lives. Modeller's license and "what-if" can cover quite a bit of chronological and spatial inconsistency if needed or desired.
I've poked around on the net to see what prototype photos I could find of steam in Nebraska.
If Kyle should decide to move his time period back from the 1940s to the early 1920s or so, there are several possible interesting steam operations prototype locations:
Website with digitized images of Old Nebraska photos: http://www.memories.ne.gov/index.php
A couple of places that potensially look interesting:
Omaha:
South Omaha yard http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=261&CISOBOX=1&REC=4
Union Stock Yards, South Omaha:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=155&CISOBOX=1&REC=8Unloading docks, Union Stock Yards, South Omaha:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=241&CISOBOX=1&REC=16C,B & Q Railroad yard at McCook, NE, 1902http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=30&CISOBOX=1&REC=6McCook roundhouse, ca 1920-1935http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=57&CISOBOX=1&REC=13A 2-10-2 (?) coaling in McCook, NE, ca 1918:http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=14&CISOBOX=1&REC=2 I am sure there are more possible locations that would make great models for steam operations and servicing in Nebraska, if he looks for other sources of inspiration beyond the Bailey yards in North Platte, which came in fairly late (started around 1948 or so, according to a couple of web pages).
Btw - the CB&Q photos from McCook is from somewhere called the
High Plains Historical Society and Museum421 Norris AvenueMcCook, NE 69001308-345-3661hiplains@mccooknet.com
It is quite likely that they may have more info on this prototype. It is not the UP, and it is not Challengers - but it likely would be a very interesting prototype to model.
A 1939 Nebraska guide by John Richard Felton found on google books: http://tinyurl.com/42eagq
described the town thus: "Railroad town and farmers trading center. The heavy loam soil of the Republican river valley produces great quantities of corn and alfalfa. Division point on the Burlington route between Omaha and Denver. Railroad employs 420 men in its shop, roundhouse and station. The town also has a meat packing plant"
Also found another potensially interesting book on this prototype: Richard C. Kistler. The High Plains Route: a History of the McCook Division of the Chicago, Burlington and Quincy Railroad. David City, NE: South Platte Press, 3rd Edition, 1987
Anyways - food for thought. In the end, Kyle is the one that has to make the decisions on what he wants to model and how.
Thanks for all that great info. I never knew about the round house in McCook but that is awsome I would love to model that. My thought is I could still one day get a 4-8-8-4 or 4-6-6-4 and run it on a layout just for fun. The one thing I dont like is it is hard to find CB & Q isnt it? I need to do more reseach on the round house and yard but I would like to model a little more modern that 1902.
steinjr wrote: Looks to me like a the least expensive H0 scale 4-8-8-4 Big Boys that are listed at Walthers are Broadway Limitied Import (BLI) engines - at about $450 per engine. The least expensive H0 scale 4-6-6-4 Challengers are from MTH, at about $700 per engine. Looks like there aren't all that many in stock - most of these say "sold out" or "back order". This doesn't mean that you cannot get a better deal elsewhere - but H0 scale 4-6-6-4 and 4-8-8-4s are seems likely to cost you on the order of $400+ per engine.
Looks to me like a the least expensive H0 scale 4-8-8-4 Big Boys that are listed at Walthers are Broadway Limitied Import (BLI) engines - at about $450 per engine.
The least expensive H0 scale 4-6-6-4 Challengers are from MTH, at about $700 per engine. Looks like there aren't all that many in stock - most of these say "sold out" or "back order".
This doesn't mean that you cannot get a better deal elsewhere - but H0 scale 4-6-6-4 and 4-8-8-4s are seems likely to cost you on the order of $400+ per engine.
If you go to ether one of these online hobby shops you will find thoughs engines and other for a lot cheeper than from the walthers website(I perfer Wholesale trains personaly but im shure there are alot others out there i dont know of).
Wholesaletrains.com
Trainworld.com
Hope that helps
Union Stock Yards, South Omaha: http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=155&CISOBOX=1&REC=8 Unloading docks, Union Stock Yards, South Omaha: http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/opl&CISOPTR=241&CISOBOX=1&REC=16 C,B & Q Railroad yard at McCook, NE, 1902 http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=30&CISOBOX=1&REC=6 McCook roundhouse, ca 1920-1935 http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=57&CISOBOX=1&REC=13 A 2-10-2 (?) coaling in McCook, NE, ca 1918: http://www.memories.ne.gov/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=/hphsm&CISOPTR=14&CISOBOX=1&REC=2 I am sure there are more possible locations that would make great models for steam operations and servicing in Nebraska, if he looks for other sources of inspiration beyond the Bailey yards in North Platte, which came in fairly late (started around 1948 or so, according to a couple of web pages).
High Plains Historical Society and Museum 421 Norris Avenue McCook, NE 69001 308-345-3661 hiplains@mccooknet.com
dehusman wrote: 4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote: The layout I really would like to do is have all 12ftx8ft be one HUGE yard with a HUGE steam service area on it.Many, many issues with this. 8 ft x12 feet is too large to reach across, so you will have to make a hole in the middle for access.
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote: The layout I really would like to do is have all 12ftx8ft be one HUGE yard with a HUGE steam service area on it.
Many, many issues with this. 8 ft x12 feet is too large to reach across, so you will have to make a hole in the middle for access.
That is the issue I was seeing. And an access hatch would be in the way of the roundhouse/turntable facility.
Around the room with a penninsula would be more practical.
Rotor
Jake: How often does the train go by? Elwood: So often you won't even notice ...
4-6-6-4 Challenger wrote:Here is the room I am working with.All the stuff there is going somewhere else.
Here is the room I am working with.
All the stuff there is going somewhere else.
Excellent - cabinets are low, not floor to ceiling stuff. Stuff could potensially go on top of the cabinets, with short legs set on top of some kind of protective material like felt to protect the top of the cabinets.
Let me add the space used by those cabinets to the available space drawing below - I am guestimating that the cabinets are about 4 feet high, 2 feet deep - could you measure them and see if that is about right ?
The ideal location for some of those cabinets would have been under the layout out towards that part of the room which is not going to be used for a layout - would greatly improve access to cabinets for your family and free up quite a bit of potensial layout space now used for walkways to access the cabinets.
Okay - last thing to check to determine the limits of space potensially available - what does the area outside the opening of the room look like - like how close is the wall directly opposite the layout area - see figure below to see what I mean. Any chance of you making some measurements and posting a picture of this area ?
rolleiman wrote:It's too bad you cannot attach to the walls anywhere.. The benchwork would fit very nicely over that row of cabinets, Greatly expanding your space.
If the stuff on top of the cabinets can relocate, build on top of the cabinets and expand your space as Jeff suggests. You could protect the cabinet top with felt, cork or similar and simply rest the layout on the cabinets.