G is for Gripers

[bman36]

Marty,
I see you also watched Bugs Bunny too. To quote Foghorn Leghorn on the original "griper"issue...."I say boy, your gums are flappin' but ain't nothin comin' outa' your head!". : ) See that one??? Still makes me laugh.
Some days we need to relax...and some days we need to speak up. I think it is all a matter of how it is done. No one likes to listen a raving loonie. Except maybe for the loonie. The issue of scale/guage, prototypical/non-prototypical will never be resolved. I recall visiting the Henry Ford museum and seeing a stationary steam engine under construction in the machine shop. When I asked "how much" I was calmly told $35,000 US. But remember folks this was "Fine Scale" not found in any hobby shop. Someone was buying it folks! For me it all boils down to having fun. Enjoy what you do and do what you enjoy. I'm no rivet counter and I don't scoff those who are. It is their choice. If rivet counting makes you happy...great. If running Playmobil and Lego works for you...great. The guy who scoffs someone else's layout is usually trying to hide his own flaws. Grumpy, grumpy, grumpy...no way to live. Nuff' said, I'm hungry again. Supposed to snow tonight too!!! 2 to 5 cm. Ever seen metric snowflakes? Easily divided by ten...melt quicker too. Well old Pierre Elliot T. thought so anyways. Have fun guys. Later eh...Brian.

[bman36]

Marty,
I see you also watched Bugs Bunny too. To quote Foghorn Leghorn on the original "griper"issue...."I say boy, your gums are flappin' but ain't nothin comin' outa' your head!". : ) See that one??? Still makes me laugh.
Some days we need to relax...and some days we need to speak up. I think it is all a matter of how it is done. No one likes to listen a raving loonie. Except maybe for the loonie. The issue of scale/guage, prototypical/non-prototypical will never be resolved. I recall visiting the Henry Ford museum and seeing a stationary steam engine under construction in the machine shop. When I asked "how much" I was calmly told $35,000 US. But remember folks this was "Fine Scale" not found in any hobby shop. Someone was buying it folks! For me it all boils down to having fun. Enjoy what you do and do what you enjoy. I'm no rivet counter and I don't scoff those who are. It is their choice. If rivet counting makes you happy...great. If running Playmobil and Lego works for you...great. The guy who scoffs someone else's layout is usually trying to hide his own flaws. Grumpy, grumpy, grumpy...no way to live. Nuff' said, I'm hungry again. Supposed to snow tonight too!!! 2 to 5 cm. Ever seen metric snowflakes? Easily divided by ten...melt quicker too. Well old Pierre Elliot T. thought so anyways. Have fun guys. Later eh...Brian.

[Marty Cozad]

Well I did not read all the replies because of the few gripers who replied and I try never to argue with folks who are wrong.[;)] Thats a joke son,,,I say A JOKE[:I] But it is hard to share an opinion that you feel strongly about w/o causing some difference in opionions from others. Speaking of videos, thats a fun way to travel your RR and see how realistic your hard work has paid off. I have one tape riding behind the Aristo pacific right after a fresh fallen snow and the sun was bright and the Phonix sound unit make it the icing on the cake. The smoker was not working at the time but most folks love it.
Personally I think focusing on what you can do for the hobby VS what you get for your money from it ;is the KEY.
I wonder if i send GRYs a digital winter snow ,run by, would they post it so others can see. I don't know how to make it happen on this end.?

[Marty Cozad]

Well I did not read all the replies because of the few gripers who replied and I try never to argue with folks who are wrong.[;)] Thats a joke son,,,I say A JOKE[:I] But it is hard to share an opinion that you feel strongly about w/o causing some difference in opionions from others. Speaking of videos, thats a fun way to travel your RR and see how realistic your hard work has paid off. I have one tape riding behind the Aristo pacific right after a fresh fallen snow and the sun was bright and the Phonix sound unit make it the icing on the cake. The smoker was not working at the time but most folks love it.
Personally I think focusing on what you can do for the hobby VS what you get for your money from it ;is the KEY.
I wonder if i send GRYs a digital winter snow ,run by, would they post it so others can see. I don't know how to make it happen on this end.?

[Anonymous]

Yes, I enjoy looking at the way these topics start out as one thing, and eventually they are not related to the origional topic. Quite interesting.

[Anonymous]

Yes, I enjoy looking at the way these topics start out as one thing, and eventually they are not related to the origional topic. Quite interesting.

[Anonymous]

Old Dad
I thought this topic was dead, and it probably is!! It is a good post for your comment. You are right on. Just go about half way into any post and you will see the same thing, they change like the weather in New England. Which, by the way, is quite unseasonal today. Would have been a nice day to get things going on the rails. Unfortunately the honey dew list took priority today!!!
Peter

[Anonymous]

Old Dad
I thought this topic was dead, and it probably is!! It is a good post for your comment. You are right on. Just go about half way into any post and you will see the same thing, they change like the weather in New England. Which, by the way, is quite unseasonal today. Would have been a nice day to get things going on the rails. Unfortunately the honey dew list took priority today!!!
Peter

[Anonymous]

I think its fun to watch the way topics mutate over time.

OLD DAD

[Anonymous]

I think its fun to watch the way topics mutate over time.

OLD DAD

[Anonymous]

Oh, and by the way, my Spouse DID blink when I bought the C&S. Twice even. But she smiles every time she see's what they go for now, and smiles even WIDER every time I run it.

I turn 62 in about 2 weeks and she knows I want the Sandy River. I'm going to pretend these IS a tooth fairy...

I'll shut up and go to bed now.

LDH

[Anonymous]

Oh, and by the way, my Spouse DID blink when I bought the C&S. Twice even. But she smiles every time she see's what they go for now, and smiles even WIDER every time I run it.

I turn 62 in about 2 weeks and she knows I want the Sandy River. I'm going to pretend these IS a tooth fairy...

I'll shut up and go to bed now.

LDH

[Anonymous]

OOPS! Please excuse the double post. I didn't notice the page change, but it's almost midnight as I write this.

LDH

[Anonymous]

OOPS! Please excuse the double post. I didn't notice the page change, but it's almost midnight as I write this.

LDH

[Anonymous]

P.S. YES, I agree that good plastic electric models of these and other fine pieces SHOULD be available in order to help proliferate the look of a by-gone era in human history. The steam locomotive is true a cultural heirloom. The more it's history is kept alive, the better. In ANY way possible. The more they can be displayed, played with and demonstrated the better.

Steam lives on in the U.S. Navy, but the piston steam locomotive is a work of art that will probably never again be a practical means of transportation. It may very well be one of the most magnificant pieces of PURE mechanical machinery man has devised.

Peace,

LDH

[Anonymous]

P.S. YES, I agree that good plastic electric models of these and other fine pieces SHOULD be available in order to help proliferate the look of a by-gone era in human history. The steam locomotive is true a cultural heirloom. The more it's history is kept alive, the better. In ANY way possible. The more they can be displayed, played with and demonstrated the better.

Steam lives on in the U.S. Navy, but the piston steam locomotive is a work of art that will probably never again be a practical means of transportation. It may very well be one of the most magnificant pieces of PURE mechanical machinery man has devised.

Peace,

LDH

[Anonymous]

P.S. - Yes I'd LOVE to see someone build these in plastic for a reasonable price. Aster does the C&S as a Sparkie but it's as pricey as the Steamer.

I Agree that it's time to bring well detailed prototype models to the electric world so many more can enjoy the look of these art-forms-gone-by that will never be built again. Steam power is alive and well in the U.S Navy, but the steam loco is cultural heirloom never to be revived as a practical means of transportation.

Peace.

LDH

[Anonymous]

P.S. - Yes I'd LOVE to see someone build these in plastic for a reasonable price. Aster does the C&S as a Sparkie but it's as pricey as the Steamer.

I Agree that it's time to bring well detailed prototype models to the electric world so many more can enjoy the look of these art-forms-gone-by that will never be built again. Steam power is alive and well in the U.S Navy, but the steam loco is cultural heirloom never to be revived as a practical means of transportation.

Peace.

LDH

[Anonymous]

vsmith: You've hit on the essence of one of my favorite points. Here's the thing I've been saying all along. It's not so much that I'm an ADVOCATE of steam as I am a fan.

The way I see it, folks who are fussy about having an authentic looking loco that are into electrics, (sparkies-again, affection & no offense) will spend 1to 2 k for a GOOD one and THEN more $$$ on a transformer, digital equip, sound systems, and the hassle of wired track to keep it running.

Truth is, I don't have any money left over for high buck perfect looking layouts. Anything I can get for cheap in THAT area that looks "close enough for Rock n Roll" is good enough for me. It's a matter of priority. Perhaps I'm not a "true" train modeler as much as I am a loco modeler.

There is ONE other issue worth noting that we've discussed elsewhere. High end Steam Locos (and Asters are among the best as well as Roundhouse) are solid financial investments. The C&S at $6900 Aussie translates to about 4k American. I paid $2800 for mine 3.5 years ago. I predict the Sandy River will go for 5-6 k within the same amount of time.

One can easily tie up 10k in a garden layout. My layout may look like crap but my locos are a source of pride in that I actually build these guys with my own two hands and when I'm done, they run just like real steam locos do. Because that's what they are. Major Credit to the kit builders WAY before any credit to me. The folks that build these things from SCRATCH are the REAL artisans.

In the meantime, I get to have a WHOLE lot of fun, and most of my hobby dollars are soundly invested in my estate, what pittance it is. They are outperforming most investments one can make these days. If they go worthless in the future, I'll still die with a smile on my face.

Regards,

LDH

[Anonymous]

vsmith: You've hit on the essence of one of my favorite points. Here's the thing I've been saying all along. It's not so much that I'm an ADVOCATE of steam as I am a fan.

The way I see it, folks who are fussy about having an authentic looking loco that are into electrics, (sparkies-again, affection & no offense) will spend 1to 2 k for a GOOD one and THEN more $$$ on a transformer, digital equip, sound systems, and the hassle of wired track to keep it running.

Truth is, I don't have any money left over for high buck perfect looking layouts. Anything I can get for cheap in THAT area that looks "close enough for Rock n Roll" is good enough for me. It's a matter of priority. Perhaps I'm not a "true" train modeler as much as I am a loco modeler.

There is ONE other issue worth noting that we've discussed elsewhere. High end Steam Locos (and Asters are among the best as well as Roundhouse) are solid financial investments. The C&S at $6900 Aussie translates to about 4k American. I paid $2800 for mine 3.5 years ago. I predict the Sandy River will go for 5-6 k within the same amount of time.

One can easily tie up 10k in a garden layout. My layout may look like crap but my locos are a source of pride in that I actually build these guys with my own two hands and when I'm done, they run just like real steam locos do. Because that's what they are. Major Credit to the kit builders WAY before any credit to me. The folks that build these things from SCRATCH are the REAL artisans.

In the meantime, I get to have a WHOLE lot of fun, and most of my hobby dollars are soundly invested in my estate, what pittance it is. They are outperforming most investments one can make these days. If they go worthless in the future, I'll still die with a smile on my face.

Regards,

LDH

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vettbass

Scotty:

I appreciate the fact that a good steam sound goes with a steam loco.

If you do this one: http://roundhouse-eng.com/srrl24.htm

(which is my next project) you'll get the real thing. No sound system required.

I already have this one: http://www.argyleloco.com.au/a_cs22.html

which is notorious for it's great chuff. It was my first and I'm hooked. Hoplessly!

Regards,

LDH

Holy Cow those are Expensive!

Roundhouse Sandy River loco comes to over $3300 US !

The C & S mogul was over $6000 Australiobucks. Thats probably $4000 US !

Man, I dont know about you, but if I spent that kind of gold on a locomotive I would be in such deep$hit with the misses, I 'd have to leave the country if I wanted to live.
I think I speak for most of us modelers, but steamwise a Ruby or a Mimi is about the best we can hope for. If you can afford two of these pricey peices then your doing a whole lot better than me. It would that me at least five years to put aside that kind of money for that specific a purchase, too many other obligations.

Again, why cant we get things like this loco in plastic at a more reasonable price? Is it just that no one wants to deal with the tooling required to do something new?
or is it that the majority of manufacturers do not think our scale is "serious" enough to warrant such items?

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vettbass

Scotty:

I appreciate the fact that a good steam sound goes with a steam loco.

If you do this one: http://roundhouse-eng.com/srrl24.htm

(which is my next project) you'll get the real thing. No sound system required.

I already have this one: http://www.argyleloco.com.au/a_cs22.html

which is notorious for it's great chuff. It was my first and I'm hooked. Hoplessly!

Regards,

LDH

Holy Cow those are Expensive!

Roundhouse Sandy River loco comes to over $3300 US !

The C & S mogul was over $6000 Australiobucks. Thats probably $4000 US !

Man, I dont know about you, but if I spent that kind of gold on a locomotive I would be in such deep$hit with the misses, I 'd have to leave the country if I wanted to live.
I think I speak for most of us modelers, but steamwise a Ruby or a Mimi is about the best we can hope for. If you can afford two of these pricey peices then your doing a whole lot better than me. It would that me at least five years to put aside that kind of money for that specific a purchase, too many other obligations.

Again, why cant we get things like this loco in plastic at a more reasonable price? Is it just that no one wants to deal with the tooling required to do something new?
or is it that the majority of manufacturers do not think our scale is "serious" enough to warrant such items?

[Anonymous]

Scotty:

I appreciate the fact that a good steam sound goes with a steam loco.

If you do this one: http://roundhouse-eng.com/srrl24.htm

(which is my next project) you'll get the real thing. No sound system required.

I already have this one: http://www.argyleloco.com.au/a_cs22.html

which is notorious for it's great chuff. It was my first and I'm hooked. Hoplessly!

Regards,

LDH

[Anonymous]

Scotty:

I appreciate the fact that a good steam sound goes with a steam loco.

If you do this one: http://roundhouse-eng.com/srrl24.htm

(which is my next project) you'll get the real thing. No sound system required.

I already have this one: http://www.argyleloco.com.au/a_cs22.html

which is notorious for it's great chuff. It was my first and I'm hooked. Hoplessly!

Regards,

LDH

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Nightingale

Congratulations, someone at last actualy says the hobbies fun. For all those that whine about costs, scales, you should try garden trains down under. Nothing is really available, tracks far too expensive to buy, locos are out of this world and to get anything on the net costs an arm and a leg to import. Shipping out of the US is incredibibly expensive. So what do you do, make your own. You need a house, church etc, none of these plastic things, you make your own.
Whats the results, a train around the back yard where most weekends the kids are asking to look at. and more importantly the grandkids are out with me hot glueing the lolly sticks on plywood to make weatherboards for a house. Not sticking a plastc model together, but doing it from scratch. Stop moaning about scale, do it to 1:25, and that leaves a little tolerence both ways, and at the end of the day your having fun and if that gives some else some enjoyment, what else can you ask for?

Hello New Zealand Nightengale,
I agree, the old-alligator-mouth chose 1:24 for his narrow gauge. Why? cuase I can get the most stuff at that scale. I am not going to worry if my Bachmann Indy "says" its 1:20.3 and that means that its cab is only 5' 6" high (?), all I know is that it looks great hauling my 1:24 Hartland shorty ore cars around. In reality, its really just a retooled 2-4-2 Columbia that was a whole lot closer to 1:24, but calling it 1:20.3 has more drool factor for narrow gaugers.

Have you looked for any DOLLHOUSE suppliers for building materials. I have found a hellavalot of supplies thru them (name it, they proabably got it in 1/2" scale). Try to find a supplier down your way, maybe Australia, that would make shipping easier. Makes doing buildings alot less painless.

P.S. Now that Lord of the Rings has finished film production, do you have a lot of unemployeed Orc's standing around on street corners bumming change?[:D]

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Nightingale

Congratulations, someone at last actualy says the hobbies fun. For all those that whine about costs, scales, you should try garden trains down under. Nothing is really available, tracks far too expensive to buy, locos are out of this world and to get anything on the net costs an arm and a leg to import. Shipping out of the US is incredibibly expensive. So what do you do, make your own. You need a house, church etc, none of these plastic things, you make your own.
Whats the results, a train around the back yard where most weekends the kids are asking to look at. and more importantly the grandkids are out with me hot glueing the lolly sticks on plywood to make weatherboards for a house. Not sticking a plastc model together, but doing it from scratch. Stop moaning about scale, do it to 1:25, and that leaves a little tolerence both ways, and at the end of the day your having fun and if that gives some else some enjoyment, what else can you ask for?

Hello New Zealand Nightengale,
I agree, the old-alligator-mouth chose 1:24 for his narrow gauge. Why? cuase I can get the most stuff at that scale. I am not going to worry if my Bachmann Indy "says" its 1:20.3 and that means that its cab is only 5' 6" high (?), all I know is that it looks great hauling my 1:24 Hartland shorty ore cars around. In reality, its really just a retooled 2-4-2 Columbia that was a whole lot closer to 1:24, but calling it 1:20.3 has more drool factor for narrow gaugers.

Have you looked for any DOLLHOUSE suppliers for building materials. I have found a hellavalot of supplies thru them (name it, they proabably got it in 1/2" scale). Try to find a supplier down your way, maybe Australia, that would make shipping easier. Makes doing buildings alot less painless.

P.S. Now that Lord of the Rings has finished film production, do you have a lot of unemployeed Orc's standing around on street corners bumming change?[:D]

[Anonymous]

Nightingale:
I like your reasoning for 1:25th. If someone wants to get down and measure, you should kick them out of your backyard, thats what I would do!!:) Thanks for your input, even if you are upside down!! Thanks.
Peter

[Anonymous]

Nightingale:
I like your reasoning for 1:25th. If someone wants to get down and measure, you should kick them out of your backyard, thats what I would do!!:) Thanks for your input, even if you are upside down!! Thanks.
Peter

[Anonymous]

Congratulations, someone at last actualy says the hobbies fun. For all those that whine about costs, scales, you should try garden trains down under. Nothing is really available, tracks far too expensive to buy, locos are out of this world and to get anything on the net costs an arm and a leg to import. Shipping out of the US is incredibibly expensive. So what do you do, make your own. You need a house, church etc, none of these plastic things, you make your own.
Whats the results, a train around the back yard where most weekends the kids are asking to look at. and more importantly the grandkids are out with me hot glueing the lolly sticks on plywood to make weatherboards for a house. Not sticking a plastc model together, but doing it from scratch. Stop moaning about scale, do it to 1:25, and that leaves a little tolerence both ways, and at the end of the day your having fun and if that gives some else some enjoyment, what else can you ask for?