are high track prices keeping people from entering garden railroad

[Kiwi Down Under]

Ian,
so you came durring our summer!.
Tony.

[Anonymous]

I quite like New Zealand as well, i have been there many times but I did not get the same feeling about the South Island as i should have, didn't think much of it at all though many others think it is terrific. I like the Maoris and the scenery and Kiwis in general. I even think Auckland is like a little Sydney and i think that is the best city on the planet and I have been to many all over the world.

However I cannot hack the cold, it is just too cold. i remember one day in Wellington I had to give a technical lecture and at midday it was 3 deg and raining. Another time i was in Christchurch it was 2 degrees when i arrived and all fogged in and when i left three days later it was 3 deg and still fogged in.

Rgds ian

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TheBoiler

Can you buy direct from China?

Just a thought.

If not, must be just a question of time.

Most manufacturers will only allow you to buy from their distributors. There are some toy manufacturers in China that you may be able to buy from, but you'd still have to deal with high minimums.

I have a resale license and can attend and purchase at the local merchandise mart in the Twin Cities. I've talked to the local LGB distributor about placing an order. Only problem is the $1500+ USD minimum 1st time order. It wouldn't be a problem if I knew I could sell what I didn't want to keep for a profit. (Maybe we could form a buyers club?) Hmmmm....there's a thought.

[Anonymous]

Can you buy direct from China?

Just a thought.

If not, must be just a question of time.

[tangerine-jack]

Good one, Tony! As a matter of fact, I did like NZ very much for the all too short time I was there (2 days).
Iandor has a point, even with the price of postage, it's got to be cheaper to order from the States than buy local in your part of the world.


[oX)]

[Anonymous]

Tony; i only half underatnd how you feel, as thing are a lot less exxy in Oz but I have had enough and I do not buy anything much in Australia at all. These people will send stuff anywhere in the world, most of them anyway but the cost of freight is fairly high but certainly not insurmountable.

I get tankers from USA for about A$35.00 postage get them in a few days not much more than a week at the most.

Rgds Ian

[Kiwi Down Under]

Hi Tangerine-Jack,
Took two pills, but neither worked.
Your comment, " living in the greatest country on the planet", glad to see that you liked New Zealand. You should have called in while you were here.
Tony

[Anonymous]

I have found that high track costs are a great discouragement to potential new garden railroaders.

I bought 144 ft of track at a total cost of $615 + $55 shipping + $0 sales tax = $$670. That is about $4.65/ft. This is LGB track. If I had bought this at my local hobby shop, it would have cost $836 + $0 shipping + $73 sales tax = $909. This is $6.31/ft.

On-the-other-hand, I found a Bachman starter kit (engine, sound tender, and three cars) for $129 + tax at a discount store. This is very cheap, and it easily pulls everything and more up my 3 percent grades. Of course, it was only available for a short time, and I will have a merry Christmas all year.

A decent transformer will run another $70-100 (??).

Old hands have lots of ways to save money on these items, but beginners usually just go out and buy at a hobby shop or online. So, a beginner, who doesn't even know how he'll enjoy it, is facing quite an investment. (And we haven't started to talk about plants and buildings.)

I've often thought that manufacturers and hobby shops would be wise to sell track at the minimum possible. This would create a much larger market base for buildings, figurines, couplers, and lots of other accessories.

[tangerine-jack]

Hey Tony, take a pill! I see nothing wrong with taking advantage of selective shopping and buying cheap. Just one more benefit of living in the greatest country on the planet.[tup]

I've been dealing with Ridge Road for some time and I can't say enough about what an outstanding company it is. I usualy get my merchandise in the mail 3 to 5 days from the time I place my order. Top notch all the way.

[oX)]

[nalts]

QUOTE: Originally posted by iaviksfan

I have three kids and a tight budget. I looked into the cost of track and there was no way that I could tell my wonderful and understanding wife that I needed $$$$ for just track.
So, I made my own track from using Tony's method and is working quite well. It got me started and it was very affordable. If it weren't for Tony I'd still be dreaming about it. - thanks Greg

Hey all-

The short answer to the above question is probably, yes, the cost of track (power, rolling stock, etc) is most likely keeping people away. When ever I tell people my plans, their first reaction is, "Oh, that stuff is way too expensive."

I plan on laying my own track this summer as I should be able to save a little $$ in the process.

Chris

Edited to say: Found out Tony was talking about [:D]

[Anonymous]

I've figured out how do deal with the price of track. COCRY 250 aluminimum track + spikes + ties runs out at just under $1.00 a foot. Ya handlaying track is hassel, but there's where the hobby side comes in. I figure I'll save money two ways. First it's less per foot, and the empire is sure to have less track if it's more effort than just doing snap together track.

I think (I'll know more this week) that I have found a viable way to do ladder style road bed for around $0.70 a foot. I hope to lay about 20feet this week. I'll know if my idea works.

The cost of locos is what scared me off. But i'll just go slow, and use some of what I safe on track to buy the locos and RS with.

[ICRRfanfortlife]

Does anyone have a source for SS rail ?

[Kiwi Down Under]

Have just read the Ridge Road Station above, and you lot make me sick!
$17.25 for a switch that , if I did not make my own, would cost me over $120. I hope it all rusts. May you be infested by a thousand fleas.
Now I have said that, I feel a lot better.
I will go away and sulk and throw my dummy in the dirt.

Tony

[Matt/Wisc]

QUOTE: Originally posted by underworld
Can you give us more information on Ridge Rd?????

Hello all,

For more information about Ridge Road Station and the products that they offer; use this link:

http://www.ridgeroadstation.com/

[TurboOne]

Great advice Matt. I have about 20 feet in my small loop. 1 cheap newbright engine. I like the USA idea AB for under $300. Will keep searching. Someday a full working cab forward with steam and all would be nice but not at $6500. Under 2k and maybe.

Tim

[underworld]

tangerine-jack Can you give us more information on Ridge Rd?????

underworld

Easter Easter Easter Easter Easter!!!!!

[:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]

[tangerine-jack]

I understand the prices down under are prohibitive, and I like the idea of making your own from dies. But in my part of the USA, I can go to the LHS and get brass track at $5.00 a foot. Now I can look at that one of two ways, one is that $5 is an investment in something that I want and will bring enjoyment, or I can say %#@$ and walk out the door. I would imagine most newbies take option two. I personaly prefer option three, which is probably only good in N America, bargan shop 'till you drop. I'm getting my track for around $2 a foot from Ridge Rd in NY. Good company, great service. At that price, I don't worry about it, I just get what I want. With lots of competition, option three is a good bet.

Anyway you look at it, rolling stock and locos are a slap in the face to someone used to paying $100 for a really great HO loco. $100 in the garden gets you maybe a box car and some Kadee couplers. A decent loco will set you back around $3-400 or so. Something very nice would be over a grand and then some. I think that scares away more people than track prices.

I'm sure most newbies don't know that you don't need a lot of track for the garden. I started with about 80ft of track, now I am adding on another 100ft and a few sidings. The garden grows as the budget allows.

Thats my 2p.

[oX)]

[Anonymous]

My outlook is just the opposite to Vic's I am looking for something better and am prepared to pay for it but, I do not buy very much. What i have is pretty good quality and standard but I don't have much as far s quantity is concerned ie quality beets quantity as far as i'm concerned.


rgds ian

[vsmith]

I would say not just high track prices , but high everything prices could easily scare away a newbie.

It wont help when a newbie comes into a hobby shop, sees the full retail price LGB stuff most LHS carry and then reels back at the $$$$ they ask for them. Most LHS also list bmann at full retail price also so that Annie is listed at $350 as well as a Bmann starter set is also +$350. Thats very sobering to anyone particularly if your coming from another gauge and are used to less expensive items. The track prices are just the final slap in the face.

I trolled ebay before I got my first Toytrain Porter. It took me a while of lurking before I found HLW's low cost lineup, I have since devoted myself to cheapness, so to speak, by not allowing myself to spend too much money on my layout. I had to educate myself where to look ,locally and internet, what shops there were and which were worth shopping at or ordering from. I bought my track one box at a time, sometimes only a few pieces at a time, until i had enough to fini***he layout, it took a long time, but patience is a virtue in model RRing.

I feel most modelers are unwilling/too lazy to do the research to find cheaper/inexpensive sources for their supplies. They want to get in, get it, and get out of the LHS in one trip, so they might get hosed by the high prices when a little research could have saved them big $. Yes I know we have to support our LHS, but my support, and my wallet, can only go so far. The competition is out there and the LHS does have a responsibilty to itself not to ignore that, the better shops I go to are primarily mail order shops, so they are able to meet or beat any ot the other LHS's that are full retail only.

[TurboOne]

Awesome layout Tony. Like the track making idea. Also your garden looks great.

Take care

Tim

[Anonymous]

I just wanted to say thankyou to Tony for sharing his track making methods. I remember a similar method being employed for 3 1/2 and 5 inch gauges with plain steel bar being used for the rail, but I never thought about using this method for the smaller garden scales.

[Anonymous]

No one seems interested in our Aussie answer; it is the best way to go for me and i agree that high prices are holding things back.

The price of rolling stock and locos is so prohibitive here in Oz , I just cant afford it.

I am buying normal rolling stock fro e bay and i am getting locos from USA or Europe.

The prices they are asking is quite incredible I think I saw A$ 4000 for a Mikado or something equally fantastic, who could afford it ?


Rgds Ian


Rgds ian

[Anonymous]

I have three kids and a tight budget. I looked into the cost of track and there was no way that I could tell my wonderful and understanding wife that I needed $$$$ for just track.
So, I made my own track from using Tony's method and is working quite well. It got me started and it was very affordable. If it weren't for Tony I'd still be dreaming about it. - thanks Greg

[Anonymous]

it has made me stay with my brass track. can't afford the SS stuff i cant spend that SS money with the brass down. my train's run fine on aristo brass 7 or 8 yrs.any hobbie you want to get into is high priced.
[2c]

[markperr]

The short answer is yes. But anyone who complains about the price of track, probably hasn't really done their research to find out the cost of the average G-Scale locomotive!

Mark

[Kiwi Down Under]

Unfortunately, in NZ, being a small country, as garden railways nuts are a very small bunch there is not the market and most people that i speak to dont even start because of the cost of the track and locos etc.

Also unfortunately this goes the same with all model train stuff and it seems less and less are doing it. Kids mightget a basic set for christmass but the cost of add ons is more than pocket money.

I suppose costs, and room available must be themain negative factor as whenever there is a model rail show it seems thousands attend, so you would think some would start.

I work on the principal, buy it or make it, but seems like most now want ready made and are not prepared to invest the time and effort to try and make it themselves. Its a shame really, that a generation of doing something with their hands is passing and now is seems there are more cheque book modelers.

No problem with that, but if the skills to do it yourself are not passed on, once there gone, there gone.

The grandsons visit and may spend 10 minutes or so on the trains then spend hours playing starwartype of games on the computer. Unfortunately, after they finish playing, exactly what have they got left?. Absolutely nothing, the only thing they may have gained is some dubous key board skills.

While prices are high, poeple wont start.
I found an alternative way, ( www.gscalechuffchuff.com ) but instead on money it takes time and effort.

Tony

[TurboOne]

I think the saying goes

"How do you eat an elephant ?"

One bite at a time.

Same with track. Got my little circle plus. It will grow. It rained this weekend, everything grows in the rain here, why not track ? [:)]

Tim

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Marty Cozad

Kevin, bigger is better, otherwise you'd be scratch building N gauge.

[(-D][(-D][(-D]

Marty, if their were deeds to Garden Railroads you could get a pretty nice loan with it as colateral[;)]

The only reason I want a big loop is so I can enjoy the RR from either the soon to be built front and rear porches. The little bit of track that would connect them isn't that much.

[Marty Cozad]

Kevin, bigger is better, otherwise you'd be scratch building N gauge.