The saga of my ever shrinking railroad

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

A few of you know the saga of my ever shrinking layout...I have gone from a planned outdoor layout to a smaller 8' x 20' layout in my garage, well....

Two weeks ago, right before going to the BTS, I had to face the fact that my 8' x 20' indoor layout was eating up way too much of my garage and that I was going to have to reduce my scope yet again, by half! Yep, I can only keep 10 feet of my layout, I desperately need the other 10 feet back for workbench and storage space. So now my layout will be 8 feet by...... 10 feet....[V]

After first going from a planned outdoor layout to a much reduced indoor layout to a now even farther reduced layout I was so discouraged that I considered chucking the whole thing and switching to On30. [:(!]

But after working and reworking and reworking what I hade, plus the already substantial investment in G stuff, I now have a pretty viable layout in a very very tight space. It will be done alla my hero Malcomn Furlow, Much Detail in a small space, a series of mini scene to mini scene is what I am now planning. Using buildings and scenery to stack up behind the track to create a bigger impression visually.

When I was at the BTS this last weekend I had brought along a copy of the plan so I could use it as a reference for buildings, detail items, etc. I had several very positive comments (including from GR editor Marc Horowitz, thanks Marc [:D])on the layout and that encouraged me to press on, and just as I was about to leave I came upon a Bachmann Saddletanker for sale for $60! Cant walk away from that! This is THE one engine I have wanted for a while now, so I took it as a positve sign to press on and I am now ready to continue , truncated layout and all, full speed ahead! [8D]

Vic,

Hold the line! I nearly skipped a beat when I read the part about you dumping the whole thing. That would only cause you heartbreak that you would regret.

I am facing major issues with the fact that I have to erect that fence I talk about so much. It's a little more than a year and a half away from completion. I have descided to concentrate on my shop scene for now. It will allow me to practice my stills and accomplish someting for the duration.

I look forward to seeing the "mini scene to mini scene" concept in action. In many ways my shop scene is just that.

[bman36]

Hey Vic,
Hang in there!!! You need to see what OLD DAD stuffed into his yard with a shoehorn. Don't be discouraged. You never know what the future will hold. Bet it was neat to have Marc see what you are doing. Look forward to seeing what you create. Later eh...Brian.

[Anonymous]

Vic, would love to see a drawing of your old and new track plan. I totally understand the need for storage space. I'm biding my time until some Kids leave home so I someday, I dare to say can have a train room of my very own! That was a large part of the apeal to garden railroading for me with a small house on an 1acre lot. For now I'll keep working on my indoor "S" scale layout around the walls of my home office. Good Luck!

[Anonymous]

Vic
Watch them boilers!!! Them old timers tried to get there trains to the station before time and BOOM, boiler blew.
Heck, I am in my 3rd year of "research" with no track plan but have bought off a buddy in FL 2 wood sided box cars.
Just hang in there, we will alll get there [:)]

[grandpopswalt]

Vic,

Don't give up! Have you looked at the indoor layout featured in this months GR? He's working with a 15'X15' building and it includes his shop as well. Can you poke a couple holes in the wall and complete a loop outside somehow? This scale is just too special to give up on. Even a switching layout would be a worthy project.

Grandpopswalt

[vsmith]

Thanks to all for the support.[:D]

Yes, i am going to stick to it. i am currently resetting the track and have to rewire a couple of blocks and modify some benchwork, not a lot of work, mostly removing what I had already put down, then start messing with the rest of it.

Yes I have followed the Run Down & Poor RR since its first incarnation in the Narrow Guage gazette. I was planning more of a small town desert layout but that layout is in Cadillac space compared to mine now, so I have to be really creative with the planning and execution. I guess theres where the challenge lies!

[Anonymous]

Hey Vic,
How about building a part of your layout on a drop-down "leaf" hinged to the side or end of the layout table.

OLD DAD

[Anonymous]

Vic have you thought of going verticle I have seen plans from LGB Germany of a climbing loop that goes up over a metre (40"), could you have one layer over the other.

I have a lot more room than you but not enough for what i want, so im going to put in an elevated track; going off my planned viaduct back through an elevated tunnel behing the pumphouse, past the pool (main and best viewing area) and thence sloping down to the middle of my reversing loop. This track will be 400 mm (10") above my base and will run right along my side and back fences. I am a bit concerned about the electrics involved regarding entering a reversing loop in the middle, this is a complaex matter as it is.

I have also been on the verge of giving it away, due to ongoing troubles with LGB MTS
. The locos are just great but everything to do with MTS has to be done at least twice.

My brand new toy the LGB track cleaning loco has no lights and im not sure if the Phoenix sound is working right, all to do with MTS. As a track cleaning loco its fantastic as a general little engine it is also fantastic but its MTS is as usual just too finicky like my first wife and I left her.

Rgs ian Kawana Island etc.

[vsmith]

Sorry Ian, I cant go verticle as I am also wedged under a storage loft I have about 30" from benchtop to underside of the loft supports.

I finally have some photos of the new layout vs the original layout if anyone is interested at seeing just what kind of a G layout can be crammed into 80 sq ft.

Just e-mail me and I'll send them along.

The more I look at the current situation the more I think it will be a good think for me (at least thats what I keep telling myself). I can focus on smaller areas and I can get more detailed than I might on a larger outdoor layout. IOW using a 2 foot rule vs the 10 foot rule...

[Anonymous]

Vic, is there anyway to maybe get more creative with the storage space rather than change the layout? I have often built shelving for storage bins etc. in the space above the garage door. The nice thing about this is the neighbors and passer bys can't see our stuff. Unfortunately you need almost a 10' ceiling with a 7' garage door for this to work.

[Anonymous]

Matt, great idea you have there, building storage over the garage doors. We have 10' ceilings and 7' doors. This will make a nice winter project but I NEED to play trains right now, summers are short in Minnesota as they are in Ohio.

OLD DAD

[Anonymous]

Old Dad, My newest, yet to be built is going to be 4 ft deep and 30ft long. my house does not have a basement so my garage is it. Xmas stuff and car parts will be stored there.

[Anonymous]

Hey Vic, By the way, I've seen you mention Malcomn Furlow's name and also saw the name in G.R. Is there any links to pics of his stuff or could you just give me a bio on him? He sounds very interesting.

[vsmith]

Hey Matt

No can do for overheads. My 8 x 10 cage is the limit of my universe. I have to deal with that area.

Malcomn Furlow has been in several Magazines over the years. He started in HOn3 years ago, built several large HOn3 layouts and wrote a book for Model Railraoder "Building the San Juan Central" which became an introductory for many to Colorado type model RRing. He switched to large scale a few years ago,but hes an indoor modeler. He has recently been in MR, and the Gazette recently with his newest layout.

[Anonymous]

Vic, I guess I will have to look at back issues of MR and pay closer attention to who's layout I 'm exactly looking at. Thanks.

[vsmith]

Furlow's latest work was in Model Railroader last year, with an article of his Mexican Hat Canyon section of his latest layout. You couldnt miss it if you saw the issue. Large scale narrow gauge. He stacked the line so that it crosses itself 5 times over the same area. Then he details the JuJuBees out of it. Mind boggling workmanship. It caused quite a fuss over on the MR forum, we had e-fist fights and e-brawls over that issue! Some stiff-necked lot saw it as "whimsicle" and therefore of "no value" others saw it for the outstanding craftsmanship that it is.

[Anonymous]

Hi vsmith
Isuie dates please that sounds interesting havn't seen it..
nothing wimsicle about it something like that has been done somewhere
to gain hight to cross a mountain barrier.
Sounds to me like you better find plans for V&T 4wh Ore cars or similar and get on with it.
if you cannot go out wards why not up wards and down wards to floor level if you have too to get a decent run
regards John

[Anonymous]

[#ditto]

John Busby Posted: Today, 11:09:20
Hi vsmith
Issue dates please that sounds interesting havn't seen it..

Vic, was the MR issue recent? I perused my collection breifly but I'm affraid
I don't have the issue[:(]. Did he write it? Or was he just featured?

[vsmith]

It was in the September 2003 issue under the title "Wild West Masterpiece" and in the gazette around the same time but i cant find the issue. Will update.

[Anonymous]

Vic, I some how can't find that issue in my collection, all the others are in my bath... er reading room. The wife might have thrown it out[censored] I might just hit the LHS they carry alot of back issues and pickup that sept 2003 issue. On the same note can anyone tell me when Marty Cozad's RR was featured in GR?

[Anonymous]

Hi vsmith
Thanks for the referance.
By the way I was serious about starting at floor level and working up wards.
Not my idea though found it in Model Railroading with LGB By Robert Schleicher a Greenberg publication
But there has to be a better way to do it than the way it was done in the book
the timber work looked a bit lacking in stabilaty department.
regards John

[Anonymous]

Vic

This is my last attempt at finding a solution. If you cant go out and you cant go up, what about going down?

You could dig a huge pit in your garage and install an ungerground railway, similar to the London Tube or the Paris Metro.

You could have tunnels with see through sides and lower yourself and friends down into the pit and watch the trains stop at underground stations.

If you dig it dep enough you may come out obn the other side of the world near us.


Rgs


Ian.

[vsmith]

Ian you crack me up! LOL

Dont worry about my lack of space, like I said, what I cant to in scope i can make up for in detail. I think I have a couple of years of work to get even this small layout finished to the level i'm thinking of. I have alot of new skills to develop, and a whole lot of new detail parts to look for.

It being so small the level at which the viewer can focus on is going to be intense. Almost every building will need and interior and lighting. I picked up a copy of the "Manchaster & Franklin RR" a super detailed HO layout with tons of ideas, I will also be expanding my library to include everything I can find on Malcomn Furlow, and increasing my back issues of the Gazette.

So I think I will be busy enough with having to break out the pick-axe!


BTW if anyone is interested I have posted photos of the layout plan and latest progress shots over on the MLS forum under "Indoor Layouts" with the same topic heading as this one.

http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=23036

[Anonymous]

Vic, the pics looked good. The coaling tower that I had seen before turned out great.I have a feeling when it's all said and done you might end up being Malcum Furlows hero, with your clever use of space Glad to see you were able to keep a loop no matter how small it is, nothing like tossin back a cold one and watching it go round and round.[:D]

[Anonymous]

Hi vsmith
Followed the link as snoopy would say "good grief"
In large scale terms that is a small space.
It can be made to work.
But oh boy have you got your work cut out for you.
The unfinished corner store?? in the middle caught my attention
looks like it could be a scratch build and is very small are you working from a drawing or is if so can you E-mail me a copy or am I out of luck because its a kit ??
I hope you will be so kind as to keep us informed of progress
looks like your the man to talk too the next time any of us want to fit two gallons in a one pint bottle.
regards John

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by John Busby

Hi vsmith
Followed the link as snoopy would say "good grief"
In large scale terms that is a small space.
It can be made to work.
But oh boy have you got your work cut out for you.
The unfinished corner store?? in the middle caught my attention
looks like it could be a scratch build and is very small are you working from a drawing or is if so can you E-mail me a copy or am I out of luck because its a kit ??
I hope you will be so kind as to keep us informed of progress
looks like your the man to talk too the next time any of us want to fit two gallons in a one pint bottle.
regards John

Hi John, that building with the corner cut is a "Best Buns" Bakery from Railroad Ave. its a resin kit and is a long way from finished. I will try to document its progress and post a link to it.

[vsmith]

this is a test to see if I can post a photo here...If this works its the new revised shrunken head glorified Lionel layout of mine...[;)]

[vsmith]

KICK ***!!!![:D]

Here is the original 8 x 20 foot layout before it got downsized with a chainsaw..[;)]



Excellent! now I can add photo examples to the mindless blather I spew out here [8D]

[Anonymous]

Hey Vic, Glad you figured somewhere to post pics and link 'em to here. I myself vaguelly understand how. After seeing that article in GR on the RR in a tiny space I imediatly thought of you and your challange. Have you ever thought of using a sector plate? I myself previously to this article never knew they existed.
I really thought it was cool idea. I myself might use this on my indoor home office layout that might be S or HO. I'm still trying to figure out a clever way to cross a doorway in which the shelf(Plate shelf type) would look right at 50" of finish floor. I really want to be able to watch it while sitting down.

[Anonymous]

I am sending over to Graypower and he has offered to put photos up of an idea of my area 3 which is similar in size 7.2 m X 3 m (23' 7" X 9' 10") and i am utilising a double dogsbone straight out of "Garden railroading the hobby". It will have 65 m track (not too shabby) and pass over itself several times and be interlinked with the rest of my layout. It will have a climbing ramp and level circle as well as a deviathon and 4 m long viaduct, 2 m tunnel and several cliffs and a crossover track all of which I will do with as few switches as I can. But I must have 5 in the long run, to get into it to get out to area 4 to get into the reversing loop etc and to get from area 2 and 1.

I have not done all this in theory, I have hust worked my way through with a vague idea of what i hoped to achieve and it has changed dramatically along the way, for practical reasons.

photos and layout coming soon and you will see clearly how i am able to transfer plans on paper to a layout in the dirt.


Regards


ian

[Anonymous]

Cool [tup] Looking Great!

[vsmith]

I am going to use this thread as a progress log so I can keep track of changes and milestones.

Progress has been sloooow! too danged Hot and too busy with other house projects.

Updates:

Track:

I changed the plan yet again, this time flipping the brewery siding from the right side of the layout to the left side so that its closer to the access aisle. This frees up the back corner for town and scenery. I am thinking of adding a partial portable back drop over by where it is next to the new workbench area, removable, only up for visitors or photos, down most of the time. I have also reduced the total # of building on the layout and my eliminate even more. i am finding that "Less is More" in terms of clutter and visual perception of the layout. Need to replace last two AC switches to LGB.

Structures:

Repainting and adding corr metal roof to the coal tower.
Repainted the Yard Office, need to weather the corrigated metal roof.
House of Balsa station completed and placed.
HofB Saloon and Hotel will need small extensions built to the back sides to complete the structures.
Rebuilding LGB water tower into something more realistic
Completed some new facade buildings based on Piko cheepie structures.
Modifying recently aquired Korber Elmers Station for use as main RR station as the Piko Clear Creek I got proved too big fot the downsized layout. New station works much better.

Trains:

Recently completed kitbash of MDC hustler with two Mack hoods into a centercab, photos to follow in the MLS Modelmaking forum, also the kitbash of the Mack I got the hoods from into a M.A.C. inspired "flatbed" railcar.

Kitbash moving along nicely of LGB short island passenger car into railbus. Need NWSL Magic Carpet power drive and need to build operators seat and controls.

Thats enough for now, more to follow as progress continues.[8D]

[Anonymous]

Hey Vic, I understand the slow progress due to the heat thing. I finally brought all my precut boxcar parts into my home office for assembly in the AC. To make my garage/shop hotter and more humid I have yet to relocate the clothes dryer vent outside, the previous owner's [%-)][D)]located it there.

[vsmith]

Updated layout plan



not the greatest photo, sorry. Click on it and a bigger version pops up.[;)]

I have flipped the brewery and siding closer to the access aisle so I can operate couplers, I have also added sidings at the front and a mining siding at the right side mostly because I had the switches and wanted to maximize the operation of the layout.

I have also reduced the number of buildings to a bare minimum on the town. i wanted some open space between the fore buildings. On the yard side I added a turntable and a roundhouse facade, this is so I can turn engines around. All the track has been revised, i still have to build the turntable out of a lazy susan, winter is coming and when the days get shorter! Project building time![8D]

[bman36]

Hey Vic,
Reminds me of my early HO days. [:D] I had a 4x8 layout in my bedrooom as a kid. I was forever trying to pack more action into that space. You sure have a lot going on in that area! This is good. So I take it the roundhouse will only serve as a backdrop to the turntable? Ever thought of going out the wall to just along the outside? Then you would have an indoor / outdoor line without ever touching the ground. [;)][;)][;)] Build a planter on the outside wall so the missus can see how nice a train looks running outside with the vegetation. You never know where that could lead! Later eh...Brian.

[vsmith]

Hey Brain,

I'm trying thru subversivly subliminal messaging to get her to go to a Garden RR open house out here in a couple of weeks, but she's a hard sell. I still think if she saw one up close she'd come around, but the way our yard space is laying out it doesnt look good for a GR at the Smith residence.

[bman36]

Vic,
I know the feeling. My wife was not terribly crazy of a train layout in our yard. Once she saw a few on our holidays she was gung ho. After we got home she was standing in the middle of our garden sizing things up. She enjoys the gardening end of it most. She commented on our choice of shrubs so far and started talking about changes for next year. If you can get your wife around other ladies in the hobby it will do wonders. All the best! Later eh...Brian.

[tangerine-jack]

Ever thought about an inter-urban theme? Trolleys don't take up much room and you could have as little as one stretch of track with a few buildings to set the scene. Much better than trying to cram too much into too little space and not having it look right. Way better than nothing. Also gives a good excuse to buy stuff you will need later. Just a thought.

[Anonymous]

Hey Vic I like it, however based on your past posts somewhere you mentioned you use link & pin couplers. I think I would switch to kadees with the magnetic uncouplers for me to get the most fun out this layout. Then you can sit out there with a shot glass waiting on a fresh batch out of tequilla plant switching out cars and locos.[:D]

[vsmith]

Posting a couple of links over to a bunch of photos I posted over on MLS for a bunch of new Critter projects and a new station I've been doing lately.

Critter-mania:
http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=25661

New Station:
http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=25659

Hope these links work. I love modeling more than running , and the critter photos show what my tastes in engines run towards. Later Vic.

[Anonymous]

Vic, as always love the pics! brought a few over here for easier viewing. I like the antlers on the Falk[:D]

[bman36]

Hey Vic,
Neat stuff. Thanks for posting them Matt. I like to see the other end of the spectrum where everything is kept compact. Great job! Later eh...Brian.

[vsmith]

Thanks guys, Matt thanks for reposting them, sometimes my home computer is as slow as molasas in January and it takes too long to repost photos from MLS storage site. Heres one I didnt post with that bunch, my first LS purchase. An LGB TOYTRAIN Porter repainted, detailed, and weathered. It now looks like a real 8-10 ton Porter from the 1890's, it even has a complete backhead.
[:D]

[bman36]

Hey Vic,
Just goes to show what a little paint and a lot of detail can do to any loco. Great job. Later eh...Brian.

[Anonymous]

Vic, I like the fact this one is weathered, It looks great! Any plans on weathering the others? Let me know and I'll post links to photo's in the future, I have broadband and a pretty fast computer[:)]

[Anonymous]

matt
I like your little engines and station , one day i will learn to post pictures, i hope. ben

[Anonymous]

Looking great Matt and Vic! Keep up the awsome work......[:)]

[Anonymous]

HEY GUYS! The pics are of what VIC BUILT! I just post them here from MLS to make easier for everyone to view. I only wish I had a locomotive as nice as theseor one period ![:(]

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by Bluebonnet - 71

Looking great Matt and Vic! Keep up the awsome work......[:)]

Looking great Matt and Vic! Keep up the awsome work......[:)]

[Anonymous]

Victor, you like the same sort of stuff that I do. Below is a video clip of my Lehmann Porter in action:



http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/BillC/Porter_Harmonica.wmv

Regards,
Bill C.
South Jersey

[vsmith]

Bill thanks for the clip.

I dig these little engine types, just wish we had more steam prototypes to choose from in LS. Looks like to get some of the engines I want I'll have to scratch them.

PS been following the Bachmann pre-release controversy of their new Vulcan engine? The threads on MLS and the Bachmann Website have been real interesting. Mostly negative. Makes me wonder just how the heck they are choosing their products.

[Anonymous]

Victor, I've been following every last word on MLS and the B'mann sites to the point where I'm about to suffer a Vulcan mind meld.

Personally I was hoping for a largescale version of the T-boiler Shay like the On30 guys have. That would have fit in more with my theme. Such a locomotive would have made a lot of people happy.

Regards,
Bill C.
South Jersey

[vsmith]

Finally got the revised cork bed glued down, the last of the new track layout screwed down, and everything wired up. I let the track get real oxidized though, now I need to find a better way to clean it. My Aristo track cleaner car is pretty worthless with all the sidings. Maybe a can of Brasso and a rag would be better.

At last, 3 years after starting in the garden, 18 months after going to the garage, 4 months after cutting up 50% of the previous larger layout , the trackwork of the New Downsized Glorified Lionel Like Shrunken Head Micro-Layout that Carl Arendt would be proud of a layout, is DONE!!!!!!!

[Anonymous]

Vic, More than ever I I understand your plite of the ever shrinking RR, building these boxcars in my home office has taken up a lot of space! Then I clean and start working on them again and it creeps off of the fold up work table I have and onto the officail "work " desk. Your perserverence in this scale now amazes me even more!

[vsmith]

Thanks Matt

Here's a PDF file of the Final layout, a couple of track pieces still need to be added but for all intents and purposes, I'm done with the trackwork. Maybe when I replace the last remaining Aristocraft switch I'll have a small "Golden Spike" (Brass Nail) ceremony. Finishing last night was more of a relieve to be done with it. Already been thru the "Wow I did it" phase with the last larger layout. Just glad to have this part completed and ready to move onto the next phase, finally, something different![8)]

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZE6%20Model.pdf

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

Thanks Matt

Here's a PDF file of the Final layout, a couple of track pieces still need to be added but for all intents and purposes, I'm done with the trackwork. Maybe when I replace the last remaining Aristocraft switch I'll have a small "Golden Spike" (Brass Nail) ceremony. Finishing last night was more of a relieve to be done with it. Already been thru the "Wow I did it" phase with the last larger layout. Just glad to have this part completed and ready to move onto the next phase, finally, something different![8)]

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZE6%20Model.pdf

Vic,

You can mean you are finished! A rail lineis never finished. You need to continue "fighting the good fight!" Never give up hope, one day you will have an outdoor layout that will know the socks off of all who view it.

Until then, I am still planning to name a curve of my layout after you and other parts after a few of the, to borrow one of the the more British/Aussie words, blokes.

In Corpus Christi, Texas there is a radio station which is benefited by a station manager named John Gifford who is originally from England. Between he and this forum I have actually, at first unconciously, been using more British English (English English?), ah, yes... Britanicspeak (to coin a new word) in my regualar speak.

[Anonymous]

Vic, Did you get the turntable in? And if so what did you end up doing?

[vsmith]

Matt

The turntable spur is one of the unfinished parts mostly because the roundhouse needs to be built around the turntable and Visa Versa. So I'm holding until I'm ready to start the roundhouse facade. I am going to use a 10" Lazy Susan from OSH and will build a wooden platform on top of and a second one around the exterior so it will be invisible. It already has a 12" track section cut to fit it. I'll post a log on that project but its still a little in the future. Next on the layout (After some vigorous track cleaning) is the foam mountains and the painted backdrop. Not to wild about the mess that comes with that [xx(]

Capt C I dont know about a curve? if so I hope that curve is the worst one on your layout that claims alot of derailed trains, hehehe, its the Gomez Addams in me. Call it "Poor Vics Curve" better yet how about a saloon called "Poor Vic's"[;)]

[grandpopswalt]

Vic,

Great job! What CAD program did you use to generate the PDFdrawing you posted?

Walt

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by vsmith

Matt

The turntable spur is one of the unfinished parts mostly because the roundhouse needs to be built around the turntable and Visa Versa. So I'm holding until I'm ready to start the roundhouse facade. I am going to use a 10" Lazy Susan from OSH and will build a wooden platform on top of and a second one around the exterior so it will be invisible. It already has a 12" track section cut to fit it. I'll post a log on that project but its still a little in the future. Next on the layout (After some vigorous track cleaning) is the foam mountains and the painted backdrop. Not to wild about the mess that comes with that [xx(]

Capt C I dont know about a curve? if so I hope that curve is the worst one on your layout that claims alot of derailed trains, hehehe, its the Gomez Addams in me. Call it "Poor Vics Curve" better yet how about a saloon called "Poor Vic's"[;)]

Ha! I was going to call it "Smith's Curve," but now that you mention it... "Poor Vic's" does sound a bit better. I plan to have an oblong "stretched" circle with four curves. There will be many turnouts, a few spurs and losts of sidetracks. On the West stretch will be Two Trees, Texas (of which you can read about at my webpage under "Communities"), The North Strech will find the town of Norma, Texas (of which I am finishing the depot). Micaela, Texas will be on the South Strech.

Between Two Trees and Norma I will place "Poor Vic's Curve." You never know, it could eventually spring up into a small village. It will be near the Northerly Plantation.

I can even throw up a bit of fiction 'bout an engineer, Ole Vic, who once lost a train (and his life) on this curve. Sounds like it could make a good song as well.

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by grandpopswalt

Vic,

Great job! What CAD program did you use to generate the PDFdrawing you posted?

Walt

Its drawn on Autocadd version 2000, then converted using a Cadd specific conversion program called Bluebeam thats a simple process. It uses the print command and its listed as one of the printer choices. Select and then its just like setting up a print and printing it, only it goes to the Desktop as a PDF. very simple. and saves a lot of headaches trying to photo the layout like the earlier postings showed.[;)]

[Anonymous]

Hello Vic
I've followed this ongoing thread for a while now and your perseverance has convinced me to make a 'hide from the family' layout in the shed that links up with the garden railway.My wife has already agreed that if she can't see it ,it does'nt bother her.
Keep up the good work.
Troy

[vsmith]

Hey Troy good to hear you'll have a rainy day room, so to speak. It will also give you a chance to try some more traditional HO layout building skills for the benchwork and scenery or are you thinking of something different. I'll be glad to offer any advice I can, also check out MLS they have an LS Indoor RR forum although participation there has been running very low lately. I'm getting better feedback here lately.

[Anonymous]

Vic, wait til the snow starts to fly, it will pick up! Or in you case Rain.

[vsmith]

What might have been..

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudy%20point2point%208x10.pdf

...a point to point variation of my layout.

I tried several varients of layouts when I downsized. This was perhaps the next most serious contender for the shrunken head layout, but I was concerned that without the ability for continous run I would get bored with it and lose interest. I thought I'd post it and see what others thought of it.

[Rastun]

Vic,
I like the layout but, I definately agree with you on the continous run idea.

Take care,

Jack

[Anonymous]

Vic,
I dunno about needing a continous run. You can have a shunting layout but it needs purpose to keep it interesing.

If I was doing it, I would slightly redesign it so I could fit a port at one yard with a working crane to lift loads from the boat to the wagons.
At the other yard I would put an industry or two. One would have some form of tower so you could shunt tipper/hopper wagons under and fill them with sand or coal or something. Then shunt them to the port and make a discharge area you can tip them out . I think the plan you have got could almost do that with a minor change.

But that all depends if you just want to watch the train go round, or you really want to have a good play with it[:D]

Glen Anthony.

[Anonymous]

Vic, I think I like the last one better, probably because of the continous run. To bad you couldn't conect the yard with Borracho and have a drop down bridge to allow you to get inside the loop. I thought you ahd settled on the last one, what made you change your mind?

[grandpopswalt]

Vic,
Is Bluebeam a readily available third party program? Any idea what the cost is?

Walt

[vsmith]

Glen,
Having a dock and port would be a bit problematic, as the layout is set in Arizona[;)] I just figured that without the ability to let the trains run i would quickly lose interest in the layout, i'm not a serious operator and I'm affraid i would get bored pushing cars from one siding to another.

Matt I didnt change my mind, i still have the layout described earlier in this thread, this point to point was a file I found cleaning up my computer from back when I was trying to figure out what to do when i realized i had to shrink the layout. I just posted it here to share and maybe give someone else with a limited space a possible idea.

Walt, i sent you an e-mail about the Bluebeam converter program, I'll follow up with my systems people at work.

Later Vic

[vsmith]

Hello all, here we go again!

After realizing that I could expand my "ever shrinking layout" a bit without affecting the function of my garage, and after reviewing several expansion schemes on the "opinions requested" thread (thanks again to all) I came up with this scheme:

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZE6A%20Model.pdf

But this scheme had a few issues that persisted in bugging me, like the fact that I had to back a train into the new right-hand yard. That got away from the "X" layout I was striving for and I resisted to urge to start rebuilding my layout to this plan. Fiddling around with the layout I remembered something that I belief it was CarpenterMatt said about pulling the oval forward a bit to gain some space. I occurred to me if i eliminated the passing siding and used a crossover maybe I could get back closer to the "X" layout I originally had. Several hours (and schemes) of my holiday break at the ol'Autocadd finally yeilded this layout which I am so far rather pleased with:

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZEnew%20studyA.pdf

It gets me away from the back up issue, trains can now go straigth from point A to point B, it moves a portion of the town farther closer to the viewer and gives me something to put (rails) inbetween the buildings and the scenery. I always disliked having the buildings having to be built right into the scenery in the earlier schemes. I still maintain the loop for continous running but if I chose I can "operate" on a point to point layout. The passing siding gets moved to the new yard. I'm not happy with the "S" curve before the crossover but given that no one makes a 60 degree crossing I'm stuck with a 90. I tried a few schemes with a 30 but it ends up with the crossing so far at the back of the layout I would have to lose the scenery and my mine. Given that I am using small 20' cars and tiny engines the S curve shouldnt be a problem.

The new 3 track spur at the center/right of the layout will be for a small smelter for the mines ore cars to be delivered to, the distillery siding moves centerstage in the town, I will add the facade building kits along the backdrop on the new right hand yard, with frieght stations now at each end point of the layout. I want to see if i can get my hands on some F-scale standard gauge track for an interchange idea at the new right-hand yard.

Anyway thats the update for now. Hopefully I will get the majority of the trackwork reset this weekend, a couple of new LGB switches will be offset until the future. I still wont use my old AC switches for anything other than temporary use. I just have to clear off all the junk that the junk-fairies always leave behind.

[vsmith]

update
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Almost finished with relaying the track. I have all the track left of the central wood post relayed and rewired including the small wing at the center. I revised the plan to allow for structures at two of the turnouts which gives me a final plan as so:

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZEnew%20studyB1-6-05.pdf

I have to scrounge together the last of the cork roadbed and add a small peice of plywood and a 1x to facilitate the angled extension at the right side, but I laid out all the track, it fits! and I have just exactly enough pieces of straight track to finish it. So now that the rains have ended and I can move stuff around, its back to finishing this pup! Should have new pics by this weekend.

[SandyR]

I just checked out the latest plan, mentally doing some switching on it. This is really a keeper! Can't wait to se some pictures! And I'm glad that the track and roadbed on hand matched your needs so well. Don't you love it when it works out like that?
SandyR

[Anonymous]

Vic, glad your happy with it! As Sandy said looking forward to pictures!

[Anonymous]

With all the rain we been having, I checked my track out side today and the ballast is sinking at some spots alittle, come spring i'll fill after again. Ben

[vsmith]

Update: trackwork finished, wired and operating. ready to start scenery.

Overall view of new loop area;


Close up of new north yard:


Close up of new loop area:


3 views of new north yard:




Close up of new siding off loop:


View of remaining south yard:


No other comments at this time..just an update on progress, looking to do some of the foam scenery next...[8D]

SMALL! ...Isnt It! [;)][:o)]

[SandyR]

Vic, I like it! The blue sky backdrop and building flats really make it a little world of its own. And your choice of equipment to run fits it to a tee. (Of course, I have similar tastes, but I wouldn't be prejudiced, now would I?)
SandyR

[Anonymous]

Glad to see ya making progress, really looking forward to the scenery to start taking shape!

We've all been staring at track plans and track for four pages....no pressure though![:D]

[van buren s l]

Vic
Nice railroad. It provides for operations(if thats your thing) and continous running. There are times when you want to revive your spirits and there is nothing more remedial than watching the choo-choos with your favorite beverage in hand. Keep that loop.
Bob

[vsmith]

Today is a small milestone..somehow between the Trains forum, Model RR, forum, Classic Trains and here, at Garden RR's ..

This is my 3000th post, man, how long have I been here?

Seams like just yesterday I was still just learking without the Kahona's to dare a post..now I'm posting the big 3K...

I just wanted to thank everyone here for sharing there experiences, humor, and especially tips and advice. I have learned alot of stuff here. And I hope I'm not too much of a pain in the neck for everyone here, hehehe. In know somehere dont care to much for #'s, niether do I but I do notice the mileposts, 1000, 2000 and now the big 3K .

So heres to everyone here who has been following the ups and downs of my tiny tiny layout, I say...THANK YOU TO ALL!![:D]

So heres to another milepost...but honestly I'll be really celebrating when I get the mountains done on my layout!!!![:D]

[TurboOne]

Congrats on hitting 3000 Vic. How do you get the cowhead on the engine? Didn't think a cow would stand still long enough. [:)]

Tim

[Anonymous]

Congrats Vic, I myself couldn't care less either, all it does is confirm for my wife how much time I spend here...BUSTED AGAIN![:D]

[SandyR]

Tim, maybe he used the cowcatcher? (Sorry! I just HAD to say that!)
SandyR

[vsmith]

Hehehe Sandy your funny...

Its actually a steer horn I picked up at the BTS and CA'd to the numberplate of my Porter I think I got it from Bridgeworks. I also have Ozark Miniatures Deer antlers on my Stainz/Falk kitbash and I'm currently looking for Moose Antlers for another engine.

[vsmith]

Just a little something, I found this file from way way back, before I went into the great indoors.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/4x6%20firstlayout%20Model.pdf

Its a plan of the simple 4.5x6.5 foot indoor layout I was going to build as a test track and a bad weather alternate to the planned outdoor track. I got as far as track on boardwith the layout setting in the middle of the garage and a pulley system to lift the board out of the way. it rested on two sawhorse.

When the great expulsion from the garden occured, this layout became the basic building block of my current , um......empire?

Now that I've stopped laughing...I wanted to post this just to show that small is relative. and even in large scale you can get away with a lot in a little space. Later.

[Anonymous]

vsmith
I keep getting page not found ???????? BEN

[aljay]

[#ditto]

I get the same thing to....

[Rastun]

Copy the link and paste it into your browser it will work, the atuo link coding is confused with it.

Jack

[Anonymous]

Probably do to the fact it is a PDF instead of jpg. My computer trys to open it with image preview which will not enable it. needs to open with Adobe Acrobat.

[vsmith]

Try it again,

My bad, the original link included these (1) parenthesis that the conversion program automatically adds, it confuse the computer.[:I][:o)][%-)][D)][:-^]

[Anonymous]

Vic, i guess I'm a computer idiot, somewhere in my browser setting it's set for image preview instead of theat open with window, not sure how to change it.
I tried posting it as a pic but it won't read it.

[aljay]

[(-D][(-D][(-D][(-D]

Thanks, got it now. This is what happens when you don't read the link ...

[vsmith]

Some pics of some new buildings for the layout. Just had to fini***hese to clear off my workbench.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/Warehouse1.jpg

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/3%20new%20facades.jpg

[Anonymous]

Vic, as I said on MLS I can't wait to see them in place. Amazing they are architecturally correct![:D]

[vsmith]

Latest news from the Borracho RR construction reports.

Had to rework some trackwork YET AGAIN, but this time its for the better. The track plan on the south yard was simply not working, it was too forced and I had NO room to move anything bigger than a small Porter and an HLW minicar. Not good when I have some 20 footers. So after a lot of reworking on the Cadd I finally got a plan I liked , finished reworking the track last weekend, pretty easy change as it's much simpler but far more functional.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZEnew%20studyD_3-24-05%20Model.pdf

It now more resembles the yard on the north end and allows for a true passing siding to be built. After the wiring is completed I am locking the program layers containing the track plan ..NO MORE CHANGES!

I will say one thing, if your planning any kind of layout with operation in mind, use the track in that configuration for a while before you lock it in concrete. I learned a whole heckovalot about layout planning with this experience, and if you can have the patience, leave your benchtop bare for a while (or you garden)and determine if this layout truely works for you, if not - change it, get it right, then do the finish work. I made a kiester load of mistakes and dead ends on this over the last year, but each time it gets a little better. But now I'm pretty comfortable this will be the last change.


...at least for now! Later Vic

[Anonymous]

I found reading the saga of your railroad fascinating vsmith. I'm having to face the fact that my first 'G' layout is going to be in my bedroom which is 9ft x 11ft last time I checked. The garden is my Mum's domain and she is very protective of her garden, - so I figure having a bit of a practice for a start in my room so I can show her what I'm about would be a very good idea. Studying your plans as they have evolved has been useful for me too as trying to fit 'G' scale into a space I was using for '0' gauge previously requires some mental gear shifting along the way. I'm hoping to use multilevel techniques as I do want some grades for my logging locos to climb, but the biggest problem is whether or not I can get away with running a tunnel through my wardrobe. If not I'm going to have to run a removeable section across the front of the wardrobe door (sigh). I'm going to use Bachman indoor track and switches/points at least for a start because I've got them already and once the trackplan is properly firmed up I can make a change to something better if I want to.
My Mum builds dollshouses to 1" to the foot scale and I'm sure she's going to love it once I get to building structures. Again your building are wonderfully inspiring and give me a good guide as to what is possible. Most structures I'll be building will be based on the simple timber and corragated iron buildings common in New Zealand tramway practice. Unfortunately any representation of the mill buildings is going to have to be in the backscene fronted by a little low relief modelling (sigh), but I can live with that.

Thanks again for your inspiring saga.

Annie

[Anonymous]

Vic, psst! Turntable crank[:p][:D]

[vsmith]

Couple pics of my fuel tank, made from an HLW minicar tank, some LGB bridge piers left over from the Big Shrink, and some detail parts.
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/fuel%20tank%20front.jpg

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/fuel%20tank%20rear.jpg

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/fuel%20tank%20right.jpg

PS Matt , not quite ready yet for the turntable crank, hopefully this summer.

[John Busby]

Hi Vic
thats coming along very nicely will have to have a good read when i get a chance to see what i have missed.
Hi Annie
If your Mum makes dolls houses ask her where you can get the less common 1/2" parts
you will find them most usefull.
Do a web search on garden railways and find the ones that have been well done. and blend in well with the garden you may be able to convince her to allow you to do a small trial set up and if you get her to help with plant selection you could be on a winner
just a thought
regards John

[vsmith]

Well on a recent trip back east, the boys in the Borracho Railway front office got a sight of the shiny new ALCO FA-1 that are becoming very common on them East Coast lines, They resolved that they HAD to have one! Unfortunately someone told them that A: it was the wrong gauge, or B: that it was way way to large for the small industrial tramline. Well, not willing to be told No by anyone,the head office managed to get ahold of a set of plans with orders to the shop foreman "make it work or else!" Here's the proud final product of those industrius lads, the FA- 1/2!!!! Next stop, the paint shed, although there is some debate as to what colors to paint the future proud hauler of the Borracho Varnish !![:p][;)][8D][:D]

[nalts]

Vic-

I love your FA- ½! It reminds me of that car commercial where averyone is driving around town with ½ of a car. Very cool!

Chris

[Anonymous]

Vic, I'm impressed, that's one top diesel and ideal for the branch line RR. I'm slightly concerned how big the coaches are going to be, 3 or 4 passengers per coach?
Cheers,
Kim
[tup]

[Anonymous]

Kim, keep in mind Vic could ba***hem all out of one bachmann car![:0]

[vsmith]

Bump*
Not much progress on the layout, reason being that we may tear down the existing garage and build a new larger garage! No fear, If this happens it will be a good thing. For one I can get a space that can be insulated and A/C'd. If this happens, no changes to the layout, it will come out in sections and be put back in as same, however I should be able to correct a few things about my current set up that I really dislike.

1. I can raise the (reduced) overhead storage loft area to 7' giving me headroom to walk under the layout (I have to stoop under now) and...
2. I will be able to add a bit of area for scenery at the rear instead of it being pushed right up to the backdrop.
3. I will be able to integrate workshop and layout together, in an area with A/C, TV, sofa, & a small fridge.
4. Best of all, maybe I wont have to do battle with big ugly spiders anymore

Even though I've been more productive in the workshop than on the layout, I havent forsaken it, I have begun to consider serious operations set ups for my layout. Now considering I have never done operations, I have a ways to go in my education, but, I have committed the current layout into a form that makes organizing said operations along realistic lines.

Here is the Borracho RR in a linear diagramic form, with each spot labeled and each siding and spur labeled with its capacity (Somewhere I read this was important).

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudy_OperationsStudy_LineDiagram.pdf

I will probably repost it in the operations forum at MLS and over in the MR forum after I do some more reading on the subject.
Later, Vic.

[Tom The Brat]

Sounds pretty nice!

[Anonymous]

Vic, sounds great! Are you the architect on this project?

[vsmith]

QUOTE: Originally posted by carpenter matt

Vic, sounds great! Are you the architect on this project?

Even though I'll end up doing most of the drawings and development, my wife would dissagree with that observation.[;)]

[Anonymous]

Sounds like your just working for another client then! LOL!

Maybe post some before and after construction photos of workshop area and layout area.

[vsmith]

I recieved a request to post the pics I use in my siganture so that it can be copied, althought I think it can be done straight from the signiture pic, I'll post it here as well as a second related pic. Both are from the long gone Mt Lowe Scenic RR from here in lovely Pasadena Ca. I hope you like them...


The circular bridge with Echo Mt Station in the left background, that "roadcut" is the ROW


An early trolley crossing a trestle at Los Flores Canyon, elev 3500'


The Incline RR from Rubio Canyon in Altadena to Echo Mt.

Some historic photos
http://www.aaaim.com/echo/v4n1/v4n1oldpwrcasa.jpg
Echo Mt circa 1930

http://www.aaaim.com/echo/v4n4/V4N4EMHPC.jpg
Incline RR at Echo Mt circa 1900 with the the original hotel resort

[vsmith]

Announcing a SAD day for the citizens of Borracho...

I, Victor Smith, as CEO of the Borracho RR CO, its my sad duty to report that after 3 years of planning, building, rebuilding, and yet rebuilding again, that the indoor Borracho Springs RR will be dismantled probably right after Christmas.[:(]

This is due to the eventual demolition of the RR current location, the garage.

However...[;)]

The new replacement garage will allow for a larger layout in a far more comfortable housing that will include insualted walls and AC.[:D]

Also I will be using track pulled up from the indoor layout to expand the outdoor Fubar & Snafu branch, so that something very positive! [:p]

I will post progress prints of the demo and rebuild and of the expansion to the outdoor layout.

Not an END, just a new beginning! the futures so bright, I gotta wear...[8D]

[Tom The Brat]

Progress must be made!

[vsmith]

With any luck and some clear weather lets see how much of this I can get done before New Years. Should go fast if I can keep SWMBAWS (She-Who-Must-Be-Accompanied-While-Shopping) at bay.

The "expanded" outdoor Fubar & Snafu branch line of the Borracho RR.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith//Outdoor%20Layout-2-Expansion%20Plan.pdf

The current tiny layout is shown on the right side. Still small, but at least its still there. To be built to the same low quality standards the citizens of Borracho have come to expect

[Anonymous]

Dare I ask, I do. Will the current track plan change or just be built with longer straights/runs inbetween the current configuratuion?

[Tom The Brat]

I think you'll have to change the title of your thread to:

"The Saga of my Suddenly Expanding Railroad."

[vsmith]

Matt

If your asking about the outdoor loop, I just extended the existing straight sections a bit and added the 1/2 dogbone into an area I was going to pave, but what the hey? I might as well use it for track as the only person who steps there is the dog.

If you were asking about the eventual reinstallation, same plan but deeper in depth so I can do more effective scenery. Right now everything is jambed up against the backdrop.

We'll see, I'll be pulling up some track inside this weekend[:(]

[bman36]

Vic,
Is your current outdoor layout along the garage? If so demolition and reconstruction can be havoc. You might want to wait until the garage is done so the guy on the Bobcat doesn't run it over! Later eh...Brian.

[FJ and G]

Vic,

Glad to hear things are going along good. Your signature photos remind me of a book I purchased from Howell-North Publishing back in the 1960s called "Crookedest RR in the world." It was about that RR.

I once drove up that mt back in 1979, but didn't see any remains of the line.

[vsmith]

Brian

If you look at the drawing link above, the garage would be in the upper left corner, we are going to rebuild against the back wall of the yard well away from the layout. But once the garage is finished, the outdorr line will come up as the house extension will be almost up to where the tracks currently are. I have space for another "permanent" outdoor loop between where the garage will be and where the house will end up.

Dave

I have that book too, it's on the Mt Tamapalis RR in San Francisco. The Mt Lowe RR was in Pasadena, right above where I live, and is chronicled in the book "Mt Lowe, the Railway in the Clouds"

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0870950754/qid=1134579969/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl14/102-9872484-5196965?n=507846&s=books&v=glance

They were both very similar RRs from the same time period, The difference being Mt Lowe had an incline and electric trolleys, where Mt Tam had steam Shay's and "Gravity Cars" on the way down, that had to be fun! I wish BOTH had managed to survive till today, cause I know I'd be a volunteer motorman on the Mt Lowe anyday they could use me!

I know the Library of Congress film archive has old Edison films of the Mt Tam Shays in action on their website.

[vsmith]

Well time for an update here, as of last weekend we rented a storage unit to clear out the garage. So over the next few weeks I'll be clearing out the garage of everything and reluctantly that includes the indoor branch of the Borracho RR. I'll be dismantling the benchwork once the stuff stored under it is packed away. It's not yet determined when and how long it will take to build the new garage as we have to dismantle the old one before they can start. Hopefully by mid-summer I'll be able to start rebuilding. Already considering a few changes I want to make when I reinstall it. So till then I'll have to be content with the smaller outdoor branch.

One real positive is that winter is nearly over (still getting rain this weekend) and the time has shifted, it will now be getting lighter and warmer in the evenings and begin to enjoy being outside after work.

[Anonymous]

VSMITH
You need to build it 3 times as big and a second story on it , good luck with your project
OH boy more room for trains. BEN[tup][2c]

[vsmith]

Update: I got some real estate for a permanent outdoor line!

After the new garage is built I will be adding a large planter area at the rear corner of the garage next to the property line, I'll have roughly a 10' x 30' are to work with, far bigger than my current temporary outdoor layout!

After some planning over on the "John Allen" thread on the Planning Forum I developed this plan, which will be the next incarnation of the Borracho RR.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith//Outdoor%20layout%20study%20CURRENT%204-27-06.pdf

It's a mix of 4' and 6.5' dia curves using a folded dogbone (my favorite plan) and R1 switches. Yes.... I know I should use larger, but all my stuff is currently R1 compatable shorties and unless something so absolutly amazingly cool that I absolutlel have to have it comes on the market , or I win a biggun' at the BTS raffle this June, I see no major new purchases in the future. Besides I'm having too much fun building my own stuff!

Now this current layout will cannibalis all of my current layouts (in and outdoor) track and switches. Which is no biggie as it would otherwise go into storage for the duration. I dont know If I'll be able to justify rebuilding the interior layout. (I'm thinking of a simpler switching layout, maybe a portable ?) Now I need to find some proper power control switches to wire it for blocks *before* I build it and find a source of Tenmille manual switch throws.

More updates as they come.

[Anonymous]

Vic, Sounds great! Even if your outdoors only you at least have the climate for it.

Check with TOC, he being a Llagas dealer, and they have the Tenmile ground throws[;)] [e-mail]

[Train 284]

Vic, sounds like a great plan!Can't wait for pictures!

[vsmith]

Realized I needed to add some pics as the thread never showed how the outdoor branch ended up looking...these were also posted on Capt C's "May 16th" post...


around the eastern loop


Snafu Junction, check out the white birdhouse, thats less than 6 months old!


Approaching Tincan Juntion

Its less than a year old and already many of the birdhouses are showing a lot of weather damage.

[ttrigg]

Vic

Got the same birdhouse (and its twin gazebo). Use them as ticketbooths for my carousel.

[Train 284]

Any new updates Vic?

[vsmith]

Garage demo begins next week

Plans are in the city, should get a permit by end of next week

All my track and interior buildings are boxed and in storage, all the trains are currently stored in my hobby room, much to my wifes chagrin!

I will likely have to pull up the entire outdoor line due to the proposed electrical line routing to the new garage going right undernieth it....it will get boxed this weekend.

Looks like I'll be stuck being a workbench large scaler for a while till all the comotion is done....even though my wife doesnt want we working in the shop now that we've moved the bed to the adjacent room till our bedroom is re-modeled, thats still 2 or 3 weeks away!

I wont be able to know exactly how much real estate I'll have for the next incarnation of my RR till the dust settles and I see what area I have left. I know where and how big I want to build it (outside next to the studio) But I dont know how the ongoing turf war its going to shake down. Theres a chance the area I want might get wife-jacked into patio space off the studio room, if that happens I'll be forced back into the garage for my main focus. But I refuse to not have an outdoor layout, even if it ends up being very small left over space inside to wife-jacked patio area.

[ttrigg]

Vic;

Keep us posted on the new garage. As far as the wife goes, after the construction is finished send her off on a "vacation" and throw the tracks on the ground while she is gone! When she gets back the deed will have been done and your real-estate claim will hold. (Unless she is a "claim jumper" like my wife.)

[vsmith]

I like to get things out in the open, so at dinner I discussed it with her. Indeed she said she wants a small sitting area/patio of some sort outside the studio, so I'll have to see what will work over there. I can fit something similar in size to my current outdoor layout without any difficulty, but I'm going to do a raised planter layout instead of a ground level layout. That and I want additional landscaping/scenery so I'll need to make it a bit bigger than that. We'll see what I can cook up.

So the current plan is....rebuild a raised outdoor layout simliar to my current one at the back of my property, and rebuild the indoor branch to the last incarnation plan. I'll use the larger engines on the outdoor layout and the smaller ones one the indoor, but I'm sure there'll be alot of mixing....

At least I know where I stand, now i can make concrete plans

[ttrigg]

Good to hear that she has granted ground to the GRR.

[vsmith]

Ok all links reactivated, updates to come...

[vsmith]

Ok all links reactivated, updates to come...

Update #1

 

Well, its official....I'm sans layout, indoor or outdoor, all I have left is the Xmas tree circle, and its 36" dia....

Pulled up the outdoor track last evening, boxed half the structures. Will break down and box all the rest of the track tonight, and will take pics of the smoking remains of both...discovered those "outdoor" birdhouses are complete crap, at least off the shelf they are. Extremely deteriorated after a year of exposure, so next incarnation are getting heavy duty outdoor-proof treatment.

Dam, after all the years of trying to get going outside, I learn why *being* outdoors is so different from being indoors...

The Bad...

Track exposure badly oxidatized in some places due to some lawn product exposure.

Leaves are a constant ongoing battle

Small weeds left for a week become trees!

Sunlight (UV) seams to be a bigger deteriorator of outdoor items (track,buildings) than rain, or wind.

LGB manual switch actuators are complete crap after a short time due to the weiniee springs inside, will be replaced with Tenmille groundthrows next time.

and the Good....

The initial idea behind the layout building, namely a simple wood header enclosure filled with gravel and stones as a dirt cheap, stupid easy way to get started in Garden Railroading, proved sound!

I found that even with oxidation issues on the track, I only needed one power connection and after a couple loops the train ran fine the rest of the day.

And finally...
Garden railroads, of any size are relaxing, just the perfect excuse to sit outside and watching the train run has a terrific relaxing effect on everyone who see them.

So planning for the next layout begins. I will post a couple ideas I have. This one will be elevated 12-18" and will incorporate more landscaping scenic ideas. I'm thinking of either rebuilding only a few of my exterior birhouse structures into more realistic (and tougher) buildings or getting new outdoor specific building. I'm thinking a minimum of buildings on the new layout.

The indoor layout will require even more planning so nothing yet on that, other than I plan to incorporate a foam base under the tracks to allow for scenery to be more 3D.
2 early studies :

This one is the simpliest, following the last outdoor layout plan:
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith//HOUSE-Garage%20Studio%20-Layout%20alternate%201.pdf

This one is a little bigger:
http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith//HOUSE-Garage%20Studio%20-Layout%20alternate%202.pdf

 

Update #2

 

Well its happening, the guys are here and after helping me clear out the last of the junk, its being torn down...

 

Here are the pics of the abandoned right of way, tis' a sad site for me...

 

Just so you can get idea of what we had ...before demo

 

and some of the reason why we'd have to do this anyway....

Rather nasty splits in the main roof framing[:0]

 

We definetly have too much JUNK

 

[vsmith]

Garage is half down, roof and both patios are gone....also gone is half the benchwork.

 

I debated whether to save the benchwork but I have to admit it was originally built pretty hap-hazardly. the next incarnation will use a more professional framing using 1xs and foam base so scenery can be carved into it.

 

Heres the latest revised plan for the new layout, its a foot deeper, that will allow me to add greater depth and give it a more scenery 3D look. Theres a connector to the work studio.I also pick up a new mine siding to boot!

 

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith//GarageStudy%20Proposed%20rebuilt%20indoor%20layout.pdf

 

[vsmith]

heres where we are today...

Here a sad pic for me, all thats left of the Borracho RR today

[vsmith]

Progress!

Footings trenched, thats SWMBO with her ferocious hellhound:

from the back corner, the left side is where the new layout goes:

Looking at the ensuing chaos that the yard is in:

Closer look at where the layout will go... about 12' x 25'

Why I had to pull up my outdoor layout

Where everything else ended up...

Should be able to pour concrete by next week, framing goes up the following week if not earlier...at least its getting there.

[Anonymous]

Vic, glad to see things are now getting underway! Not being familiar with CA building codes how deep does the footer need to be? Looks shallow, Ohio is minimum 36" deep. I guess I always asumed CA would have deeper footers do to earthquakes.

[bman36]

Hey all,

     Vic, glad to see the work is under way. I recall the Spring of  2000 very well. It all began with saying goodbye to a very sad looking 12 x 20 garage. After that came a 30 x 30 footer to replace it. The best came after. Looking at what I still had left for a yard my first dreams of a garden railway began. My wife said " A what?" The rest like thay say is history. Congradulations on a fresh start. After all is said and done it will be great. Later eh...Brian.

  

[vsmith]

OK foundation is complete, utility trenches filled, framers will be here Monday.

Man, they left a mess in the yard, theres dirt everywhere. Gonna be real busy this fall just putting the yard back in order. Gotta get some of it up before we get any rain or its going to get really messy out there.

Plus side, I actually measured the area out there and found I had the stupid tree in the wrong place. Been fiddling with a new layout for the back corner and finally have a viable plan for the outside layout.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/HOUSE-Garage%20Studio%20-Layout%20alternateXXYYZZx1.pdf

[ttrigg]

Plan looks good.  Can't say as much about your counting.  Which switch did you forget to count?

[Anonymous]

Vic,

Since I have seen it, looking cool man, very cool!

William

[vsmith]

Update

Monday there was just a slab...today:

Heres where the workbench will be

The indoor layout

Heres where the outdoor layout will go

[bman36]

Hey Vic,

Awesome...things are really coming along. Nice to know that there is still room for an outdoor line. Keep us posted. Later eh...Brian.

 

[Anonymous]

Vic,

Awwwwwwwwhhhh could not get .jpgs to open!!

William

[Anonymous]

VIC

Looking good ,i wish it was in my back yard , thanks for shareing the pictures .  BEN

[vsmith]

In a quandery lately, I can't seam to decide whether to rebuild the previous version of the indoor layout or go with a smaller more compact layout I devised...

 

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyOverlay%20Model%2010-27-06.pdf

 

The PDF shows both, the top layout, which is a slightly enlarged reincarnation of the last layout, its longer, more spread out and looks more prototypical correct. The downside is that its more spread out, and does eat alot of real estate due it being esentially a point to point layout, and I can only run very short trains

 

The lower layout, is much more compact, still has a lot of operational aspects, has a longer loop, and fits better in the garage with all the other things that are going to be going on in here. The downside is that it looks very much like a glorified Lionel layout.

 

I have a few more things to consider as well, like rebuilding a car in the same garage space and the area that will require, and having a wife get fumed over having 2 layouts.

 

There IS a possibility of only being allowed one, which one will depend on certain variables, the outside one is next to the neighbors trash bins, so plus in my favor.

 

I still plan to have something inside that back corner of the garage, even if its just the 4x6 I started with 3 years ago

[Anonymous]

Vic I like the outdoor one but that is just what my gut is telln me. Plant a tree by the trash cans. 1/2 c.

William

[kimbrit]

Hi Vic,

Consider me updated, very nice indeed!

Cheers,

Kim

[vsmith]

Insulations is in, drywall tommorow.. Roll up garage dorr went in today...only wrong door, not the one we ordered...Grrrrrr will this ever end?

[Anonymous]

Ask Matt, because that is about normal in construction for something to screw up, leased I had it once a week.

William 

[vsmith]

OK update...before we head off to visit relatives for Turkey Day.

 

Garage is 95% done, right door now in place. Electrical done, drywall done, only got a few pick up items with the contractor and awaiting the sliding door, should be ready to start benchwork by Xmas. As for the layout....

 

...its shrunk again![:0]

 

Decided to go point to point, too much has to be accomodated in the garage so I'm keeping most of the old layout design but dropping the loop, which was really small to begin with.

 

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZEcurrent_Point2Point_11-19-06.pdf

 

It will also be higher, 40"-48" min, so I can store my bikes under the benchwork, and the last pooper is that I was planning to put my workbench into the new studio, I was told in no uncertain terms that it aint gonna happen. So I'll be putting a workbench in the garage area. I can still use the studio space for storage and display put no paint/thinner/airbrush/glue/burning plastic/burning wood/burning resin fumes will be tolerated in the new studio

 

Oh well, there was always a very good chance I would always end up in the garage, thats why I had it insulated in the first place. So...SWMBO gets most of the studio, and for me its time to start planning the *second* living room -aka- my workbench area.

 

Lets see, TV, radio, fridge, easy chair.....

 

See ya Friday

[ttrigg]

Vic;
Looks like there is plenty of potential for some good action in the limited space.

BTW, you forgot one item, the hide away bed, unless your easy chair is a full recliner.

[SandyR]

Vic, I like the new trackplan...it gives much scope for operation, and there's more room for scenery. Much better without the loop!

SandyR 

[John Busby]

Hi Vic

Don't forget the zebra striped train sized door so you can join the indoor and out door railways together

regards John

 

[vsmith]

Today recieved final approval from the building dept. -

Wheeewww! I was worried cause I already hung the OSB board on the walls. He could have hit me for nailing spacing but he was more interested in my Honda N600 than my OSB board...

Still have more work to do, almost done with the last of the attic insulation and I'm hoping to get the major shelves and cabinets done by next weekend. Studio still need the sliding door, but I'm not going to sweat it, thats her pet project.

Try to get some pics tommorrow.

[vsmith]

Finally.......finished insulation and building shelves, Contractor finished off the last of his contract and...

-

Started on the benchwork last night.

-

Got the south leg of the layout framed out. More lumber tonight to finish off the rest. Havent taken any pics, wanted to clean it up for better pictures. Will have pics by this weekend.

[vsmith]

Pics....finished garage

Benchwork started, basic 1x4 stringer construction

Benchwork finished, OSB topping.

Track test layout next.

[bman36]

Hey Vic,

Awesome! The garage looks terriffic! Nice job on the benchwork too. Was that a TV and a small fridge in the corner of that shop??? Thanks for sharing. Got a small project I need your help with....will email you ASAP. Later eh...Brian.

   

[vsmith]

Brian, will likely be a little busy till after christmas, after that, send me what your thinking about.

[ttrigg]

Vic;

Looks to me like you need to start a new thread since your RR is no longer shrinking but growing.  Something like  My shrunken Railroad expands.  Pics are good news, I'm eagarly awiting more progress reports, as many others are, I'm sure.

 

[vsmith]

Test laying track...it fits!

Track is VERY dirty, and needs to be cleaned. Then I'll start connecting all the track. Almost every connector need to be either cleaned, or changed.

[Anonymous]

Looks great Vic, wish I could have helped then we could play sooner

[vsmith]

Well I've been cleaning the track with an light abrasive pad. It works soooo much better know. All track is connected, so it fits right, and I hooked up the powerpack and from one terminal connection I can run an engine to all points of the layout. It should be even better once I connect all the block sections with their own power wires.

-

a few slight tweeks to the plan.

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyDOWNSIZEcurrent_Point2Point_01-07-07.pdf

[ttrigg]

Vic;
Like the looks of your plan, am anxiously awaiting more construction photos. The only thing I see that could possibly be considered an error is that it is inside! Seriously keep up the work, and the pictures!

[vsmith]

Bump (in the night)

I havent been updating this topic for a while now since there hasnt been any progress to update, nor will there be for the time being. Looks like the indoor branch will be shrinking ...yet again.

Its become very apparent that between the ongoing home renovations, yard reconstruction, and my wife order to get our micro car restoration project underway, that I have too many plates spinning in the air. So I have to cut a few things out for the perceivable future until I get alot of these other projects out of the way, the indoor layout is on hold, indefinatly.

But the outdoor layout is still a go, when I have spare time and good weather. I have decided that the outdoor layout will take precident for existing materials like track and that the existing indoor benchwork will be used to hold the power tools for the car restoration, but even the outdoor layout will be of secondary importance to getting alot of these other torns out of my side so outdoor layout construction will likely not begin till well after this summer if not early next year...I wont build in the summer here, too dam hot!

However...all is not lost:

Nevermind

In the meantime, I am planning to keep my skills going on the workbench and with a little something I'm hoping to have ready for the MLS booth at next years BTS (2008)

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/Large%20Scale%20Pizza%20layout_BTS_2008.pdf

A 3'-0" square micro-layout, a "pizza" layout by definition, utilizing the old xmas tree base layout I've had for a couple years now, The old one simply wont work with the wood floors as its very very loud where before the carpet acted as a sound deadener. Without the carpet its a noisy cuss. So I built a new one using a solid wood tabletop and some HLW snap track, its a better deal as it has a felt base and will have felt insulation under the track as well.

So the old base and hand bent track will become a portable Borracho RR display, with foam "mountains" and a small town of very detailed structures climbing the hill over the track. It will have detachable legs and felt pads so it can either be freestanding or set on a tabletop. If it comes out like I hope, it should be a nice draw next year.

This will give me the opportunity to focus in very fine on the interiors, exteriors and street scenes, and to model very small rolling stock and maybe a couple of engines specific for the tiny diameter trackage. I figure even if this is perhaps the smallest layout on the forum, the shear level of detail possible will more than offset any percieved size limitations. I still have plans very long term to resurrect the indoor layout in time.

So...Onward and Upward!

[vsmith]

Muhuhahaha!    Its alive... ITS ALIVE!

http://1stclass.mylargescale.com/vsmith/GarageStudyTRY%20AGAINx2.pdf

 

Translation: screw it! I'm building something anyway...

[Anonymous]

Go for it VIC , is this in the garage??? , you will be out of the weather if it rains .   Happy Thanksgiving .      ben

[Anonymous]

Hey..it's like giving birth!!! Congrats Vic, looking great yet again

Toad in da Swamp

[SandyR]

Vic, that is absolutely the best trackplan that you've ever done. Go for it, man!

SandyR

[vsmith]

Looking back at the pages here, theres too much none related stuff, so I prefer a fresh start, so new page it will be...a BIG Thanks to all who contributed, now lets see where the next phase takes us.

Here is a link to the new building log page, which will be located in the Railways Design and Construction forum. I prefer to have any discussions over thar' from here out.

http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/1291128/ShowPost.aspx#1291128

Please do not reply to this topic anymore

I prefer to let it RIP