Upgrading Conventional Locos with Sound

[lionelsoni]

Actually to 70 percent, not half.  That's a good way to drop voltage without making heat somewhere else.  However, it does draw some DC current, which may be hard on a small transformer.  I do it all the time with my Zs, but they're pretty big.  I added a full-wave option to my half-wave-rectifier-equipped locomotives so that they wouldn't shut down modern "transformers" on other folks' layouts.

[BobbyDing]

Thanks for the correction Bob. I had a feeling it was wrong when I was typing it. Figured somebody would correct me if it was.

Bobby

[Anonymous]

very nice, I just went to the website and ordered a steam sound unit for my berk. can't wait to install it.

[norseman47]

The big secret is to really take your time. Plan every step like the old measure-twice-cut-once rule of thumb.

A client asked me to switch a MTH Doodlebug, with Proto 1, to an ERR setup. I chose the AC/DC Commander & Alco sound. Things went fine until I tested it it. All the MTH marker lights blew out in a flash! Jon suggested I use higher voltage LEDs. I got both grain-of-wheat & grain-of-rice bulbs. Of course neither would fit correctly without modifying the shell, which I wouldn't do. I found out that MTH makes their own constant volte boards, so I ordered exact fit MTH 6v LEDs, $6, a MTH 6v constant voltage board, $10 & was still able to fit the ERR commander, sound & voltage board in the same space as the original Proto setup. The MTH voltage board input is the programable strobe output from Jon's board. Works fine!

The nicest thing about the ERR setup, is it's hard to tell from full Protosound, unless you see the controller being used.

Rick

[Anonymous]

I just received  the kit I ordered the other day. Put on my glasses and found all the parts. had to drill a 3/16 hole in the tender wheel(bar end truck) for clearance to set the magnet into. otherwise installation is going smooth. the instructions say to use "Zap-A-Gap" adhesive or similar. never heard of it, what kind of adhesive is it?

[BobbyDing]

Not sure about zap-a-gap. I'll have to look into that. Here are more details on my sound upgrade to the Docksider. I'll post a PE tender picture too, ASAP. May be a couple days.

I've left these pics at 640x480 so that details can be seen better. So they may take time to download for some. I'm hoping the pics won't load automatically, as they are all big.

First, the Docksider assembled (minus a couple details and the engineers).

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/Docksider.jpg

 

Here are closer views of the cab and the only exposed part of the Sound Commander.

The main capacitors can be seen inside the cab. Some flat black paint should help them disappear.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/RightSideCab.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/LeftSideCab.jpg

 

Here is a view with the shell off. The area that I had to trim off can be seen (silver metal inside the shell).

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/Openedunit.jpg

 

A closer view of the trimmed area, and the piece that was trimmer off so the Sound Commander would fit. This peice is normally not visible anyway.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/RemovedShellArea.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/RemovedChunk.jpg

 

Three views of the Sound Commander mounted on the back.

IMPORTANT: Notice that there is a plastic board (brown) siliconed (silicone rubber) to the bottom of the Sound Commander to insulate the Sound Commander from the frame of the Docksider. Also, all the pins on the board have been bent inwards, and have silicon rubber added over them (after the connectors are installed) to keep them from toucking the installed shell.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/SCRightSideView.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/SCRearView.jpg

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/SCLeftSideView.jpg

 

A close up of the motor with two diode pairs (under the clear heat shrink) added to up the voltage so the Sound Commander stays running, even when the Docksider is still. Only one pair was needed for this, but it helps increase the smoke too, so I added two pairs (HOO-HAAAA!!!). Diodes are Mouser part# 512-1N4004.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/AddedDiodeView.jpg

 

The underside showing the two reed switches used to trigger the chuffs. If you don't care about the chuffs, these can be left off. Or if you only want two chuffs per revolution, only one switch is needed. I mounted the two brass channels that the reed switches fit into, to avoid glueing the switches directly to the frame. In case one needs replacing in the future. Note that two holes were drilled to run the wires up into the loco. Also, contact Jon in advance and inquire about the cost for extra reed switches and magnets. Get one more of each than you need.... Just in case. You can always use them in a later project.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/ViewofReedSwitches.jpg

 

And here is a shot showing one of the magnets (little moon rock looking thing) mounted inside a back wheel. I did have to file the magnets JUST A BIT so that they cleared the frame of the Docksider when the wheel turned.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/Magnet.jpg

 

Lastly....The stock Docksider speaker is 16 ohms (orange wires). While it works, it does cause the audio to be lower. I purchased two new 8 ohm speakers from Mouser Electronics (www.mouser.com). I got two because I will be doing another Docksider soon. The part# is 253-5363. I think they were less than $5 each. Also, Mouser sells tiny reed relays too if your interested, part# 816-RI-02A (also pictured). Though I ended up using Jon's reed switches for this project, as they seem to work best. If your ordering from Mouser, get 100 1N4004 diodes. They're always useful, and they're cheap. 100 for about $4. Part# 512-1N4004. In the picture you can see the stock speaker (orange wires) pulled away from the speaker baffle. I found that it sounds better in this case without THIS baffle (on most other projects, Jon's baffle is the best choice). Your choice, but if you do not use their, you must insulate the speaker from shorting out (more silicone rubber).

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/BobbyDing/Speakers.jpg

 

The most importand thing is to keep the Sound Commander insulated from all areas of the frame and shell. I cannot stress this enough, as a short can blow the Sound Commander and/or the Docksider circuit boards. I used clear silicone rubber (Home Depot) all around the board to assist with this goal. Also, if I muffed it up, the silicone rubber can be removed without too much difficulty. Oh, yeah, and you'll definetely be voiding the Docksiders warrenty. Bending the pins and gooping with silicone may also void the Sound Commanders warrenty (not sure).

Hope this helps!

Bobby

[USNRol]

...the instructions say to use "Zap-A-Gap" adhesive or similar. never heard of it, what kind of adhesive is it?

Zap a Gap is a well respected Cyanoacrylate (Super Glue) used very successfully throughout the R/C Airplane hobby...in which I've also been heavily involved!

Roland 

[anjdevil2]

My package arrived yesterday, and I installed the board and speaker.  Just like Bobby said, 15 minutes, tops.  What a difference!!  It has a horn and the bell works.  It does ramp up speed, but my layout is a little noisy, so you really can't hear it too well.  Works with th CW80 (horn only) and my KW (bell only...strange but true).  That's my only complaint.

Thanks, Bobby.  Works like you said and took just as long to install!!

[Anonymous]

Finished my install on 2046 tender. went well after I put on my glasses and found all the parts. sounds terrific. my unit is the steam with pensy whistle, but for some reason no bell. I am using a ZW. I wonder if I use my 1033 will the bell work?  when you blow your horn does it stay on as long as you hold the control? my whistle seems to have a programmed set of toots, won't stay on if I hold the control on.

[BobbyDing]

Hmmm. Sounds more like a Williams sound board if it has pre programmed toots. All the upgrades I've done thus far from ERR have full control of the toot duration. That is to say, while I hold the button, the toot plays, and only stops after I let go. The bell and whistle works if I use my 1033. Whistle only with the CW-80.

Bobby

 

[Anonymous]

hooked up my 1033 and got the bell but no whistle. still not the switch response I was looking for.  must be a slightly different frequency response.

[mpzpw3]

jmsiv,

I'm curious how you drilled into the wheel of the Williams berkshire. I ordered and installed a sound kit from Electric RR. about a year ago, and never did find a good way to attach the magnet. Also, no glue I tried would stick the reed switch to the Williams tender truck. It would be nice to read how others have done this, as adding the sound unit made my berk. run rather poorly, probably due to the magnet/glue problem. I sure could use some help with this!

[Anonymous]

I did the install on my post war 2046 tender which is hooked up to my 736 lionel berk. I removed a wheel from the tender and on my drill press I drilled a 5/32 hole 1/16 deep. that left the magnet just proud of the surface of the wheel giving me the clearance I needed for the bar end truck. I used a tiny speck of polyurethane glue (gorilla glue) in the hole and placed the magnet, this will never come out. for the reed switch I used a blob of black silicone, placed the reed switch in it and adjusted the position and let it cure. so far the install works well, but still having whistle problems. the chuffing sounds are great. I may get another reed switch and magnet and set it up tp the smoke piston so the puffs syncronize with chuffs. I emailed electric train with my problem and am waiting for a reply.

[BobbyDing]

JMSIV,

Sorry, I hadn't gone back and read this post after your last comments. Did you get your whistle working? It occured to me that the 1033 might be connected backwards if your getting a bell but no whistle. As the 1033 has no bell control (I don't think). Or maybe the sound commander wires are backwards???

Bobby

[Anonymous]

     I started using the lionel command remote and all of the features are working fine. I like the whistle better than the new lionel.