Trains.com

Pre War American Flyer Pictures - An Invitation

42776654 views
2560 replies
1 rating 2 rating 3 rating 4 rating 5 rating
  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, May 14, 2016 11:51 AM

104 Station Variations

Ok another 104 station variation.  Specifically, late 104 stations.

This is the most common variation

Note it has a gray base, which is very common.

The 1st variation, which I have previously posted here, has an orange base on top, which has been overpainted at the factory, as evidenced by a gray underside on the base.

 

Yet another variation came up, this time at a local auction.  I picked this station up this morning.  It came with its original box.  The base is the same color both on the underside and on the top, with only one coat of paint that is somewhat light in places on the bottom.

The green base and roof is most unusual on the 104.  I have seen both on variations of the late freight station set, as shown below.

 

NWL

 

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Sunday, May 15, 2016 2:45 PM

NWL,

Nice auction find.  The dark green combination is a very attractive looking piece.  I am going to have to start watching for one.  That is one variation I don't have....yet.  Wink

 

Trivia Quiz #15

Where will you find this?  What is the number of the item where you will find it?  Extra credit: What year(s) will you find it in the catalog(s)?

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Sunday, May 15, 2016 4:40 PM

OK that is a 92 Watchman's Tower.  Too lazy to look up when it was cataloged, my guess is 1928-1931, with it becoming the 214 New Lighted Watchman's Tower in 1932, but that is a guess.

Here are some variations.

 

 

 

Northwoods, a Question for you (and others).  What other accessory was also numbered 92 and what years was it cataloged?

NWL

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Wednesday, May 18, 2016 2:33 PM

Since nobody answered my question,

The other item that Flyer numbered 92, was the Billboard, cataloged in 1923 and 1924.

These are quite rare and I have only seen a handful of them over the years.  Just sold an extra at York in April.

NWL

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Wednesday, May 18, 2016 9:11 PM

Nationwidelines

OK that is a 92 Watchman's Tower.  Too lazy to look up when it was cataloged, my guess is 1928-1931, with it becoming the 214 New Lighted Watchman's Tower in 1932, but that is a guess. 

Nationwidelines,

You are right.  The bell is on one of my #92 Watchman's Tower.

The #92 was cataloged from 1929 thru 1933.

The #214 was cataloged from 1934 thru 1938. The #214 was illuminated.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Wednesday, May 18, 2016 9:19 PM

Nationwidelines

The other item that Flyer numbered 92, was the Billboard, cataloged in 1923 and 1924.

NWL

 

I thought I would let someone else take a few guesses.  I didn't have a photo to post either.  Your 92 billboard is in great shape.

Greenberg lists another item numbered 92.  Its a turntable that was made in Germany but sold by American Flyer. Its circa 1910 - 1917.  Its also called the M92.  I've never seen one but there is a sketch of an example in the book.

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • 913 posts
Posted by mersenne6 on Friday, May 20, 2016 10:49 AM

Here's two more additions to the unusual 96/104 station base colors

Blue

 

 

...and yellow

 

In addition to the yellow base 104 I have a tan base #96.  NWL- Question - is the green base green roof a 104 (internal light) or is it a #96 (no light)?

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Friday, May 20, 2016 1:52 PM

Mersenne,

Thanks for posting the variations of the early stations.  I do have one with a tan base that is an early station.  Have not found a nice one with a blue base, but I was aware of that variation.

As for the green base/green roof late version, it does have an interior light and came with a box indicating it was a 104 station with interior light.

NWL

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Friday, May 20, 2016 1:59 PM

Mersenne,

my early 104 with tan base is a slight variation from yours.  It has a red roof on it.

 

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • 913 posts
Posted by mersenne6 on Saturday, May 21, 2016 6:52 PM

Between the Flyer catalog cuts and my observations over time I think the plan was to put various shades of green roofs on the #96 stations and maroon or red roofs on the #104.  I also think this pattern was adhered to as long as there were ample supplies of both on the assembly line...and when there wasn't they would use whatever color was available.  This is why I was asking about the 104 with the green base. If it had been a #96 with the later clapboard litho treatment it would have increased my count of those stations by 100% since I've only seen one other #96 with the later litho sides.

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Saturday, May 21, 2016 7:49 PM

Mersenne,

I know you mentioned the late litho as an un-lighted 96 station and I honestly have never came across one (not that I have been looking).  Could you post more details about it? and photos of the inside and outside of the building/base.  I am curious to see it.

I have seen very few variations in the late 104 stations, which is why I went to the local auction and bought the green base one (as I knew it was at the auction and previewed it prior to the auction).  The orange base and green base are the only variations of this station that I have observed.  I also have a very late 104 station in a Gilbert box, with a Gilbert label on the base. 

NWL

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • 913 posts
Posted by mersenne6 on Sunday, May 22, 2016 12:23 PM

NWL here you go

Station and shipping box

Inside station

 

Underside

 

   Assuming my sample count of this station is something other than personal sampling bias (I can't go to every train show in the U.S.), I would guess that the difficulty in finding this version of the #96 may be due to nothing more than price differentials.  My impression is that Flyer made the transition to the new litho treatment in 1935. For that year the prices of the two stations were #96 - $1.00 and #104 - $1.50 - basically you were paying $.50 for a light. This was also the last year Flyer mentioned #96 in the catalog.  In 1936 #104 was selling for $1.00 - the same price as the #96 the year before (by the way - the pencil price marking on the box label in the picture is 98 cents).

  It is also worth noting that the description of the #96 in the 1935 catalog states "Same as above but without light or frosted windows."  This, of course, raises another interesting question. My version has punched and frosted windows - are there any #96 stations with the late lithograhic treatment with unpunched windows?

  One last item - I edited my earlier post above - the #104 base is yellow not tan, however, I do have a #96 with the same litho treatment with a tan base.

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Monday, May 30, 2016 3:39 PM

Something to Ponder - Is yours a Righty or Lefty?

So while in the train archives this afternoon, I noted that there are variations of the 234 Suburban Station that have the building on the Right and variations that have the building on the Left.  I had never noted this before.  I say on the right or left, because there is a clear front and back to this station, as the back has no platform area behind the station, but the front has about 1 to 1.5 inches of platform area.  Here are some variations I have. 

 

I note that both of my 234 suburban stations with the building on the left are punched for some other station, either a small passenger or small freight station, as evidenced by extra holes for a larger building.  Not sure if this is the only way to have the building on the left, or not.

 

NWL

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Wednesday, June 8, 2016 6:18 PM

So this came in the mail yesterday.

NWL

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Saturday, June 11, 2016 8:01 PM

NWL,

That is a great example of an 1109 sand car.  For an American Flyer collector its even better than getting a letter from  Publishers Clearing House.  Wink

Your earlier posting about the #234 station and its variations of "lefty" and "righty" got me thinking about my examples of that station.  I have 7 variations in my collection but I have never paid attention to the difference between right and left orientation.  I finally had some time to go and look at mine.  I have them scattered around the layout and on shelves.  Here is what I discovered.

Lefty #1

Lefty #2

Lefty #3

Lefty #4

Righty #1

Righty #2

Righty #3

Of course now this means that I am going to have to be on the watch for other variations of the ones that I already have so I can have mirror image stations.  Confused

Thanks a lot NationWideLines

 

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • 913 posts
Posted by mersenne6 on Monday, June 13, 2016 6:58 PM

  I guess it just goes to show how easy it is to overlook the obvious (and yes, I have the small station in left and right handed versions as well).  Until NWL posted his pictures I thought the only stations that had the metal for their base plates fed into the bending machine upside down were the long base #97 freight stations. The end result is the crane on either the left or right side of the building.

  It would appear that at some point Flyer was either trying to turn out a universal base for the various small stations or they had a lot of leftover bases which they used in any way they could.  The same base with all of the extra holes NWL mentioned can also be found as the base for the crane on the long base #97.

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Tuesday, June 14, 2016 6:29 PM

Tenders, Tenders, Variations of Tenders

So I just acquired another variation of these little tenders and thought I would post some photos of the variations I have.

 

 

 

 

 

Some comments on these tenders.  Some have only a single named plate, with the plate on the other side of the tender reading "American Flyer"  My variations of Annapolis and West Point have only a single named plate, while the Madison and Hancock tenders have the named plates on both sides.

I seem to recall seeing an Army-Navy tender before.

These tenders are obviously a means of American Flyer using extra standard gague plates.  So any of the names that appeared below the windows on President Special and Flying Colonel cars are possibilities for these cars.  I do not recall all of the names that they used on the Standard gauge cars.

Happy Hunting!

NWL

 

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Sunday, June 26, 2016 10:41 AM

I think that it might not be bad to sort the contents of this thread sometime. I know that someone else made a site to document the production of the various OO gauge manufacturers here in the US (amercicanoo.blogspot.com), so would there be objection to my doing this with the information y'all have set forth here?

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Monday, June 27, 2016 6:19 AM

I took the silence for a yes, and started one

 

https://www.prewaraf.blogspot.com

 

for the purpose of organizing the information here.

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Monday, June 27, 2016 6:25 AM

I got a warning message when I followed your link.  I'm not sure that site is safe.

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Monday, June 27, 2016 6:47 AM

It mig just be because it's using a blog site. What are you viewing it on?

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Monday, June 27, 2016 6:52 AM

I'm using my laptop, Windows 10.  When I click on the link you  have posted above it gives me a warning message that the site is not private and it is vulnerable to attackers.

Northwoods Flyer 

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Monday, June 27, 2016 7:20 AM

Hmm. That's a new one for me. Don't think I have ever seen that warning for this batch of sites before.

 

 

EDIT: the warning only shows up here if you click the link. Since that's just to the home page of the site, just typing it in is fine apparently. No wanrings when I do that.

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Tuesday, June 28, 2016 6:53 AM

tinplatacis,

Good Luck with your task.  With almost 1800 postings to this thread you have a lot of information to summarize.  I've thought about doing a new index for the thread but I think it will have to wait until retirement.  It looks like you have a good start already.

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Tuesday, June 28, 2016 6:55 AM

Trivia Question #16

What is this and where will you find it?

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Tuesday, June 28, 2016 7:12 AM

tinplatacis

I think that it might not be bad to sort the contents of this thread sometime. I know that someone else made a site to document the production of the various OO gauge manufacturers here in the US (amercicanoo.blogspot.com), so would there be objection to my doing this with the information y'all have set forth here?

 

I like how the blog is able to sort the information to specific links, but the information you have posted is very general and to a collector is somewhat vauge on certain things.

A question for you, can pictures be posted along with the links? 

I think that could be very helpful in trying to explain things.  Otherwise, for instance you posting of the first american flyer set information is so general that it is not even very good.  To link the 1907 engine to the later engine from 1916 is just so vague due to the differences in motors, shapes of the castings, rivet detail, etc. that occured over this 9 year period of production. I purchased a 1907 engine this spring at York and can tell you I was unsure about it at first, because it did not match what I expected it to be.

 

NWL

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Tuesday, June 28, 2016 9:10 AM

To be honest, it is possible to post photos, I just a, having difficulty doing so.

  • Member since
    January 2008
  • From: Duluth, Minnesota
  • 1,967 posts
Posted by Northwoods Flyer on Wednesday, June 29, 2016 6:35 AM

Northwoods Flyer

Trivia Question #16

What is this and where will you find it?

Enjoying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

 

No guesses so far, so here is a hint.  But now you need to give the #of the item.

Hint #1

Have fun.

 

Enjolying the World's Greatest Hobby

Northwoods Flyer

The Northwoods Flyer Collection

of

American Flyer Trains

"The Toy For the Boy"

  • Member since
    November 2011
  • 429 posts
Posted by tinplatacis on Wednesday, June 29, 2016 10:08 AM

It's the rear of the 4963 tender would be my guess.

  • Member since
    August 2011
  • 635 posts
Posted by Nationwidelines on Wednesday, June 29, 2016 5:27 PM

Close, but that is the o gauge tender, the sheetmetal vanderbuilt tender I believe.

Join our Community!

Our community is FREE to join. To participate you must either login or register for an account.

Search the Community

FREE EMAIL NEWSLETTER

Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month