Hello Tom
I'll have a light breakfast - as I'll be back for Pizza night later with luck.
I see Lars has been in from the Keys - all that humidity though has helped him to set hares running on the nomenclature - for ‘Dave' is not on my berth certificate! (sorry to disappoint West Coast Dave - who clearly was on the lookout for a second Dave at the bar - and why not indeed!
Tom - "Hmmmmm, so let's say I'm travelling coach, that portion of the train is going at a different speed"
Could well be Tom, could well be!! Is that like the ‘how do we really know the light in the refrigerator has gone off when we close the door' type question? - here's a puzzler though - if you are in coach and you have to walk down to the buffet - are you travelling faster than the train if you have to walk forwards to get to the buffet car? How fast are you going if you have to walk backwards?
Pete - yes - I wanted to check out the Leader picture but actually found the article - which made rather interesting reading - it seemed a surprise that BR Chief Engineer Riddles was prepared to indulge the project for so long. I wonder if things had been different it would have had a future - the real problem seemed to be the situation the fireman found himself in - which looked pretty unpleasant to me!
On a related matter tot the scrapping of steam engines I'm reading the book by Paul Theroux at the moment called Kingdom by the Sea - for those unfamiliar he is an American author who decides to circumnavigate the coast of the UK by a combination of walking coastal paths and hopping on and off trains (apart from one section where he has to go by bus - much to his frustration - during the 1982 railway staff strike). It's a fascinating book and of course includes much reflection on his attitudes towards the Brits he encounters and the British way of life he observes.
Many of the rail lines he travels on are lightly used rural branch lines etc - and writing in 1983 he is convinced that they are not long for this world and soon to close - it is nice to report that in every case they are still open in 2007 - not that they have had much investment in that time period though - what struck me though is the extent to which the world of 1983 that he observes now seems like ‘another world' - yet it don't seem that long ago to me. The book is worth a read.
Anyway, the point I was going to make is that he obviously walks along the south Wales coast for a section and walks past Barry Scrap yard where there are still rows of rusting steam locos awaiting scrapping or rescue quite some time after the end of steam in 1968. He remarks on this in the book.
Doug - I enjoyed that story - and a welcome rtn of the jokes!
Regards to all
D (I'm not Dave) L
PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #43
Here's something to enjoy regarding the Santa Fe (ATSF) in a 1949 advertisement from my private collection:
<A form of this was initially Posted on Page 192 of the Original Thread>
always "at Ease" on El Capitan
Easy dress * Easy Comfort * Easy cost
"Come as you are!" on this famous Santa Fe all-chair streamliner.
Just 39 ¾ easy hours between Chicago and California.
Restful club lounge car "just for fun!"
Fred Harvey meals . . .
Coach fare plus a small extra fare . . .
Same route as The Chief And Super Chief!Enjoy!
Tom
siberianmo wrote: Can you?
Can you?
Upper left "Toronto" missing
Lower right duck missing
Additional shoulder strap on Queen Victoria
Bottom left "20" inverted
Right number 03855 becomes 03585
M636C
<w/permission: http://www.scenic-railroads.com/>
G'day Gents!
The end of the work week <for many> ‘n we call it Friday! Check out The Mentor Village Bakery case - our Menu Board for <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts - and of course our freshly ground ‘n brewed coffee <unleaded> ‘n <regular>!!
Yesterday was one of those days <daze> we surely won't forget ‘round here for some time. For a simple monthly anniversary day, the turnout was terrific! Appears that we had a convergence of interests - those who checked in BECAUSE of the day along with those who passed through our doors simply to enjoy the place. Either way, many THANX to all for helping to make the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place one for the ages!
SPECIAL RECOGNITION to Manager Lars for going that extra mile. My guess is that without his efforts, we wouldn't have had such a grand event! Five Salute to the Larsman!
Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):
Pete at 5:05 PM Thursday - July 12th: Nearly a 2-hour phone call from my mid-Missouri Brit friend! Man of a few words, eh <grin> Always good hearing from you ‘n we covered quite a bit of ground . . .
Our monthly celebration wouldn't have been complete without a visit from the Wolfman ‘n Bar Chandler - glad you didn't let us down! Must say that mention of ANOTHER bar is a bit on the tacky side, especially when we PAY YOU to work here!! <grimace>
Dave (West Coast S) at 7:25 PM Thursday - July 12th: Our Resident Left Coast Connection ‘n Super Sleuth Man of Mystery made it in for our special event! You had us wonderin' IF you were readin' what's been Posted along with those Emails that are piling up! Thanx for putting our worst thoughts to rest . . . RIP! <grin>
As you go WAY BACK with this place - actually you ‘n CM3 Shane are ‘tied' for "oldest continuing bar fly." However, I must give the "nod" to Shane, as he's piled up far more visits without loooooooooooong breaks in between (not counting Iraq of course!). Anyway, you ‘n our Coalminer friend are the "grey beards" ‘round here . . .
Doug at 9:25 PM Thursday - July 12th: Been a loooooooong time since we've seen our Barn Weevil ‘round here TWICE on one day! And with a two-part story at that! Great seeing ya, Mate!
Glad to know you REMEMBERED about cats - after about 15 minutes or so inside a house with ‘em, I break out in all sorts of "itches." Just the way it is. Happened first time back in the 80s when I "house sat" a friends ranch up in San Pedro mountain for a weekend. He had two horses, two dogs ‘n two cats. After that weekend, I have never been the same insofar as allergies are concerned - especially cats. The Doc's have all said I picked up enough "animal dander" to make a significant change to my immune system. However THAT happens! <ugh> Funny, dogs ‘n horses don't seem to "get me," but cats surely do.
Doug at 5:49 AM today - July 13th: Amazin' - simply amazin' - we start the day with Doug! Just like old times . . . gotta "save" the story ending for later on - just a bit too early for heavy readin'
Groan-o-Meter is back in fine form! <ugh>
Reminder: Ruth has the bar from 9 AM until Leon the Night Man comes in at 5 PM ‘til closing.
Thursday is Fish ‘ Chips Nite!
Friday is Pizza ‘n Beer Nite! - and - Steak ‘n Fries Nite!
Saturday is Steak ‘n All The Trimmings Nite!
Dinner begins at 5 PM so come early ‘n often!
Cindy is now our Saturday bartender!
Boris, serve ‘em all of the "spiked" OJ they can handle!
Good morning Tom and gents! I'll have a light breakfast please. Many fine posts yesterday, to be sure, with some familiar faces, and some new! Great to see Allan, and I noticed Eric defying doctor orders to take it easy. JanOlov is a new face to me. Welcome! Glad you liked the poem Pers. I don't know if there was a write-up in the local paper on the prior evening's train-related problems. No one here has time to read the paper, so I just get a Sunday edition anymore. I see the captain was at the helm a few times yesterday as well. Yes, yesterday was inoculation and deworming day for all the critters, and Boris too, of course. The latter was also administered his monthly hosing/delousing by the Mentor Fire Department, who really do a great job with the equipment they still have on hand. We still need to return the ladders "borrowed" by the Second Class Saloon guys to play pranks on us. The FD is getting complaints about using the hoses to remove treed cats. The chief says it's nearly impossible to figure out where to place the net when using this method of cat removal, but since the net is missing too, it hasn't been an issue.
Whoops! Must be running to work. I will return later. In the meantime, here's my Part II:
Fire in Tunnel 9 by Peter Josserland, May 1954 Railroad Magazine
Trouble came to a head on a Wednesday morning, August 13th. I looked up to greet dispatcher Bill Clements, who worked the district up through Feather River Canyon, as he entered the chief's office.
"Second 62 is overdue at Pulga," said he.
"Agitated spindle, maybe?" I asked, meaning a hotbox.
"Could be"
Of the many possible things that may delay a train, relatively few are hazardous, so we seldom start worrying until we know for sure we've been hurt. Feather River Canyon is tough on a railroad in winter, but this was summertime, the dry season, when Nature usually behaves.
So a Santa Fe train had run a few minutes ahead of Second 62! Well, I doubted that either one had met with real trouble. Besides, I was far too occupied with bigger problems - getting tonnage organized into trains and then finding crews and power to wheel them - to think much about one train being delayed for a few minutes. If there was anything in the situation to worry about, the time to wrinkle one's brows would come soon enough - and it did. Fifteen minutes later Dispatcher Clements barged into my office to report"
:The head end of Second 62 is at Pulga. A car in about the middle of the train jumped the rails just west of Tunnel 9 and the next five cars followed. All of them piled up in the tunnel!"
I hurried into the Third Subdivision office to check up. With all the available data at hand, it seemed to me that we would be shut down for at least two days. And the district was fairly bristling with trains!
The first move was to order out the derricks - the Portola equipment to work at the east portal of the tunnel and the Oroville big hook to go into action at the west end. Meanwhile, my wife was routing out the officials by phone and telling them the bad news.
We ran the head end of Second 62 as far as Portola to get it out of the way. Then we got together a crew at Oroville to go ahead of the derrick and bring the rear of Second 62 back to Oroville Yard. This only left the derailed cars in Tunnel 9.
Perishable shipments en route but now blocked by the derailment had to be detoured and livestock gotten to the nearest pens for unloading. Trains were spotted at strategic points, calls cancelled on freight not already out of the yards. Yes, stopping a railroad involves a lot of gray matter and hard work.
Phoning the Santa Fe at Fresno, I broke the bad news that they'd have to hold their tonnage, and moaned with the man at the other end of the wire for thirty seconds. Then I hung up and got busy with a thousand and one operating problems. Happily, the Southern Pacific consented to detour our Zephyrs over their line for the next couple days.
I endured barely an hour and a half of this mess before turning it over to my relief. When the wife and I came back on duty at eleven P.M. I learned that the estimate of time required to clear the derailment was somewhat less than the two days I had guessed. However, they had gotten only two cars out of the tunnel and I would have bet even money that I had come closer to the time than they did. No one will ever know, for ten days elapsed before we could run another train through the tunnel, because of a second mishap. Mishap? It came near being a catastrophe.
The massive big hooks were creaking inside the tunnel, trying to wrestle out the derailed cars, when the Oroville derrick started a fire in the top of the wooden-lined tunnel. The company had launched a program for concreting the tunnels but the slow work had not yet reached Number 9.
At this point the track is about three hundred feet above the white=foamed water of the Feather River, lying on a niche carved out of the mountain side. The tunnel had been drilled through an outcropping of rock, this formation extending out beyond the tracks and dropping off sharply to the river.
As you probably know, there is always a draft through a tunnel, the air current's direction depending on weather conditions. The wooden linings accumulate a fuzzy substance which is highly inflammable, and such a fire is most difficult to control.
A man had been stationed on the Oroville derrick with a fire extinguisher, ready for emergencies, and he quickly put out the blaze - or so it was thought. But the flames had gotten in above the smoke boards, spread, and shortly broke out in a new spot. No sooner was this blaze doused than tongues of flame broke out somewhere else. It didn't take much of this to exhaust the fire extinguishers.
In the meantime, the derrick had to be backed out to safety. This left the men with nothing to stand on while getting at the heavy boards in the top of the tunnel to pull them down and reach the fire. Two men would grab a third by the legs and hold him up. The third fellow tried to pull down the planking with such tools as he had.
The futility of this soon became apparent, and at this point we at Sacramento first learned of the fire. There came a frantic appeal for water - hose - pumps - fire-fighters!
We phoned the Forest Service at Oroville and Quincy, telling them of our plight and asking for help. They, in turn, notified their stations in that vicinity. Pretty soon a parade of equipment started for Pulga, where the highway crosses the Western Pacific tracks. From there it had to be taken to the tunnel be rail. The Forest Servicemen said they'd had no experience in fighting a fire such as this but would gladly do what they could.
A work-train crew then on duty at Oroville Yard was given a tank of water and started to Tunnel 9.
On the east side of the tunnel, the nearest water was at Pulga, a tank car loaded with commercial spring water destined for Sacramento to be sold in bottles. There was no time to quibble over this water being high-priced. The tank was confiscated and taken down to Tunnel 9 by the work train.
The crew of that train was ordered to put their derrick away at Pulga, get the car of water ahead of the engine and bring to the tunnel such other fire-fighting equipment as had arrived. This took precious time. When the work train coupled onto the car of water, the Forest Service arrived with pumps and some hose. The car was shoved into the east end of the tunnel and the hose was strung along-side the wrecked equipment to get at the red demon in the west end.
Meanwhile, fire had blocked the only route by which a pump could be gotten to the wate
Evening Tom and gents! I'll buy the next few rounds so ya'll can wet your whistle. I promised reading material, and I've been given just 9 minutes to post, shower and hit the sack! Some reward for working a long day and then cutting grass and trimming just 'cuz the neighbors decided to do it today! Speaking of which .. ya'll won't recognize the place once you see new pictures. All landscaping is done, we have zuchini the size of my arm, and I even put in a drippy fountain. I'm considering a pond with a waterfall around the patio though. Gotta give Tom a place to hang out since the air in the house is polluted with a cat, and Tom can't come inside. Here's the reading material as promised. Part I style!
Hell broke loose on the Western Pacific just after my wife and I returned from a summer vacation in 1952. I was holding down the night chief dispatcher's desk at Sacramento and she served as a stenographer. The usual procedure is to turn a steno into a wife, but I had reversed the tradition some years before by turning Mrs. Josserland into a steno. At the time of our marriage she was just a telegrapher while I dispatched trains. All she had to do to get the job was to take a refresher course in shorthand.
This story concerns the area around Tehachapi, California. The Southern Pacific and the Santa Fe have a joint track over Tehachapi, the spot being famous for its "loop" which engineers built to control the gradient. Ess Pee men dispatch trains over this district. The Santa Fe dispatcher's circuit also is cut in at Tehachapi, but their DS at Needles cannot direct train movements through Tehachapi, although the phone there serves other useful purpouses.
On the day I refer to, an earthquake wrecked the town of Tehachapi and put both the Southern Pacific and Santa Fe temporarily out of business down that way. This is the SP's north-south route through the valley. However, they still had a Coast line running north and south to fall back on, and their trackage to the east from Sacramento and Los Angeles was not affected.
Both the SP and the Santa Fe were bottled up north of Tehachapi, being shut off from the south and east. To make matters worse, the quake came in a season when all the roads were normally snowed under with perishable traffic, most of it moving eastward. In a rash moment, the SP agreed to handle the Santa Fe's north-south stuff over their Coast line - which proved to be a sad mistake. The triple load placed on the Coast line brought so much congestion that they had to drop Santa Fe movements.
At the same time, the Western Pacific generously offered to handle a couple of Santa Fe trains daily each way between Stockton and Salt Lake City. I dop not know what the SP took off the Santa Fe's hands, but judging from what happened, I'd say it wasn't much. No sooner had we highballed two trains of perishable loads out of Stockton than the Santa Fe had two more waiting for us, and the heat was on. The AT&SF shoved over trains as fast as we could clear the transfer track for them and yelled bloody murder because we didn't "hurry up more faster."
We had to dig all our faithful steam engines out of mothballs to wheel freight between Oakland and Oroville, since every available diesel was burnishing the rails between Oroville and Salt Lake. Within forty-eight hours we simply did not have enough power to keep merchandise rolling, so the Santa Fe had to lend us some of their powerful 6000-horsepower diesels.
Pretty soon we ran out of crews to handle the extra burden. Officials were frantically shaking the bushes in search of talent to keep the wheels spinning. At this point the SP shut off the Santa Fe's north-south business from their Coast line and thus put the bee on us to move it. Talk about going around the world to get in the back door! The Santa Fe gave us solid trains of freight for California points north of Tehachapi. We took it as far as Salt Lake City and there turned it over to the Union Pacific, which hauled it to Barstow and then handed it back to the Santa Fe for delivery. Next, there came the northbound California traffic via the reverse route.
At first our construction engineers were unduly optimistic as to when they would restore service on the line over Tehachapi. The earthquake had curled up track in spots like a pretzel; two small tunnels were wrecked and would have to be "day-lighted" - that is, the entire outcropping blasted from the mountain side. If I remember rightly, they figured on doing the job in ten days.
A big tunnel was blocked off at both ends by slides, but they did not regard the damage as serious. Later, when they penetrated the tunnel, they found its walls pushed together and a chasm yawning where the bottom had been. The hole would have to be filled with rock and the tunnel rebored. So plans were made to build a shoo-fly, a temporary track, around the scene.
Contractors brought in every piece of machinery they could beg, borrow or steal for what turned out to be one of the biggest dirt-moving jobs since the Panama Canal. Our estimate of the time required for reopening the track was extended to one month. Meanwhile, the Santa Fe boys at Fresno were calling frequently. When would we take the next train? The next half-dozen?
Our dispatcher's office at Sacramento was very busy. We were handling the heaviest traffic in Western Pacific history, more tonnage by far than we'd moved during World War II. Of course, the road's capacity had been increased greatly since the war by the installation of centralized traffic control, plus the replacement of time-honored steam power with less glamorous but more efficient diesels.
There was little confusion but plenty of work. After a time we almost grew accustomed to the tension; it became more or less routine. Still, we looked forward to the reopening of the Tehachapi line, which, I remember well, was to have been on a Saturday, when the man-killing grind would end. We fondly believed that as soon as the Santa Fe shut off their deliveries of trains, it would be only a few days until the WP got back to normal. But before Saturday came, our problem became worse. Much worse.
More to follow ..... and acknowledgments too!
Happy third to the gang and the continued Success of "Our place. Hip-Hip horray for our estemed manager Sir Lars and Sir Tom on this most auspecious occasion.
PWolf: Set me up for some fish & chips and course the proper libations.
DL: At last, a second Dave at the bar, best of all to you and welcome to the bar...
Top of the day Allen to you also, Most interesting post, thanks..
Ps Tom: I'm not ignoring you, I do owe you a message, with over 900 unviewd it is proving most laborious!!! I shall attend to at the earliest oppertunity
Eric..Good to see you about, I see youv'e been tasked with restraining Boris while Doug admisters his rabies injection, best of luck in this endever. Speaking of Doug, good to see you again, been quite a while.
I'd be beside myself I didn't pay proper respect to "Our Place" and all who frequent, sad to say i'm under cruch time today time wise and must be other places doing other task. until free time, keep well all and "Our Place"
Dave, the Left coaster
Hi Tom and all.
27th Anniversary to Our Place, so A round for all please RUTH, it is good to see you so busy I will make sure the bar is well stocked and hopefully there should be plenty of takers for H&H's Fish ‘N' Chips later.
ALLAN Many thanks for the info on the settling on 3' 6" for the railway gauge in NZ. It sounds as though they was a great deal of locomotive variety there. Where were the modern diesels built that are in use today. The main line freight diesel locomotives in the UK are from GM in Canada. The last British built freight locos built new were the class 60s introduced in 1989.
Were any of those locomotives that were dumped in the Oreti river stopbanks able to be salvaged as museum pieces.
ERIC Is the photo at Chicago Union Station. I see the X2000 is getting some admiring looks from the guys on the left.
Make sure you get plenty of rest and take care.
JAN Another one from GB. I am from England and now living in the U.S.
I hope you will join us at Our Place; the beer is always on top form. Thanks for the round.
DOUG That does sound a sympathetic conductor on your train. I'm glad the police was able to stop that guy.
Looking forward to ‘Fire in Tunnel' and enjoyed the great Redball Freight poem.
PER That is an impressive list of trains that used LAUPT in 1950, thanks for sharing.
On BR the old steam locomotives were usually scrapped at the railways own workshops, but such was the haste and the number of steam locos that was cut up in the 1960s the workshops could not cope so many thousand were sold to private scrapyards to be cut up. I will have to try to see if I can find how many there were cut up in the 1960s
Thanks for the links to the Southern Hogshead cars, they were large. I see they only had the one set of doors per side; it must have taken a while to load and unload the cars.
Many thanks for those kind words about British steam locos. I too am gaining a growing knowledge and appreciation of American locomotives and trains. I really would have loved to have traveled those great trains in the 1940s 50s and 60s over here. Reading the great ads Tom puts on at the bar with the different companies in competition with each other to provide the fastest and most comfortable trains.
DL Yes the Leader project was an interesting one, probably the last attempt to build some thing other than a convention steam loco on BR. I wonder if it would have been different if the railways had not been nationalized in 1948. You would have thought though they would have built just one of such an experimental design and thoroughly tested it before building any more.
Many thanks for the link and the info on the Central Trains offer, I will pass it on to Alan.
DDI Good to see you in the bar again. Thanks for the info to get to know you better. I am sure you will fit in with us here very well.
LARS. It seems the day is a great success, and it is keeping me very busy stocking the bar, which I know pleases the Manager.
Great idea of the first two of your posts from the old Our Place, great book covers as well.
TOM It was great to talk to you today and it is great to see the bar busy.
I see in today's paper there is to be more discussions on the KC Light Rail scheme. I am sure I read somewhere that the rider ship of a lot of light rail is well up lately. I wonder if any light rail schemes are making a profit.
Well Tom I have got to finish up a bit quick as I am due out at 5 PM. I hope I can call back in but as we are meeting at Pat's Place it could be in doubt.
Time for a swift pint and a round for all please Ruth.
Pete.
Happy 27th Month Anniversary to "Our" Place!
Here's an ENCORE! from way back on Page one of the ORIGINAL THREAD, Posted on 13 April 2005 . . . just as things were getting going for "Our" Place. You may check out this Page 'n site by clicking this link:
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/1/991587/ShowPost.aspx#991587
Good Morning! Things have been rather slow in this new place of ours - well it is new and a bit of time has to pass before it catches on. Appreciate those of you who took the time to drop a word or two ...... we've had quite a few people poke their heads in, look around, and leave ........ maybe when we draw a crowd, some of them will try again. QUOTE: passengerfan Posted: 12 Apr 2005, 18:33:43 I'm not prepared to knock the new Via Renaissance cars until after I give them a chance. I too still like the Budd cars. At least Via fianlly purchased some new equipment even if it had been stored for awhile. If this is to be about Classic trains than I shall mention my two favorites from the past the GN Empire Builder and Santa Fe Super Chief. I rode the new 1947 Empire Builders days after their inaugural the first of many trips on this and the subsequent Empire Builders up to and including Amtrak.Couldn't agree with you more - one should only voice an opinion when one has knowledge of the subject. Makes sense to me ....... I've traveled the "Ocean" aboard the "Euro" Renaissance cars. I'm obviously biased (for those who have read my thoughts on other threads) when it comes to the Budd stainless steal "beauties" still operating on VIA Rai's "Canadian" - a remaining "classic" - and one day per week each way between Montreal and Halifax on the "Ocean." So, since the Renaissance stuff isn't "classic" - yet, no need for me to expound on it other than to say, I really didn't enjoy the trip as much as those taken aboard Budd's fine stuff ....... Feel free to tell us all about your experiences on "classic" trains - your submissions are indeed "classic" and many on this thread will undoubtedly enjoy them ....... Thanx for stopping in and your first "one" is on me! (Oh yeah - you didn't vote .......) QUOTE: bjdukertPosted: 12 Apr 2005, 19:22:23 Hi Siberanmo thought I would come on over and see how things were going and it looks like you have a good start How about a hot tea while sit in the corner for awhile. I'll look in from time to time and I think you will have some other vistors as well. GOOD LUCK Duke Thanx for stopping by, Duke - good to "see" you again. Hot tea -you bet! How hot is hot?! By the way, your vote counts too ....... which will it be? See ya! QUOTE: trolleyboyPosted: 12 Apr 2005, 23:22:09 Hi Tom put me down for place #1 as well. Reminds me of a little restaurant along highway 11near Bracebridge. My favrorite "classics" are the Montreal & Southern Counties the NS&T and the CP electric lines in ontario. Back soon. RobHey Rob! Good seeing you again and thanx for stopping in. What's your pleasure? First "one" is on me ....... Appreciate your vote - by the way, let me tell you guys about this particular model featured in #1. The HO kit is made by American Model Builders (152-145) and is called "Nine Mile House & Tavern." This structure still exists and I have lunch there (and a beer or two ......) from time to time. It's about a 15 minute drive from me and is called "The Trainwreck Saloon." Over the years, several modifications have been made to the appearance - but it still retains enough of it for me to "relate" ....... Kinda nice having a structure on my layout that has a real life counterpart close to home. A "classic" for sure! Feel free to tell us all about your "classic" experiences ..... that's the kinda place this is ...... for those of us who like this stuff, "tell" away. See ya! ==================================================== So, that's the way I'd like to keep the conversations going ...... you "talk" and I'll reply along with providing some "order" to it all. Oh yes - pictures are really welcome and please feel free to post away ........ Belly up, boys ..... light breakfast menu - hot coffee, tea and hot chocolate! The day is just beginning! See ya! Tom in Chesterfield, MO, USA (Siberianmo)
QUOTE: passengerfan Posted: 12 Apr 2005, 18:33:43 I'm not prepared to knock the new Via Renaissance cars until after I give them a chance. I too still like the Budd cars. At least Via fianlly purchased some new equipment even if it had been stored for awhile. If this is to be about Classic trains than I shall mention my two favorites from the past the GN Empire Builder and Santa Fe Super Chief. I rode the new 1947 Empire Builders days after their inaugural the first of many trips on this and the subsequent Empire Builders up to and including Amtrak.
QUOTE: bjdukertPosted: 12 Apr 2005, 19:22:23 Hi Siberanmo thought I would come on over and see how things were going and it looks like you have a good start How about a hot tea while sit in the corner for awhile. I'll look in from time to time and I think you will have some other vistors as well. GOOD LUCK Duke
QUOTE: trolleyboyPosted: 12 Apr 2005, 23:22:09 Hi Tom put me down for place #1 as well. Reminds me of a little restaurant along highway 11near Bracebridge. My favrorite "classics" are the Montreal & Southern Counties the NS&T and the CP electric lines in ontario. Back soon. Rob
Hey Rob! Good seeing you again and thanx for stopping in. What's your pleasure? First "one" is on me ....... Appreciate your vote - by the way, let me tell you guys about this particular model featured in #1. The HO kit is made by American Model Builders (152-145) and is called "Nine Mile House & Tavern." This structure still exists and I have lunch there (and a beer or two ......) from time to time. It's about a 15 minute drive from me and is called "The Trainwreck Saloon." Over the years, several modifications have been made to the appearance - but it still retains enough of it for me to "relate" ....... Kinda nice having a structure on my layout that has a real life counterpart close to home. A "classic" for sure! Feel free to tell us all about your "classic" experiences ..... that's the kinda place this is ...... for those of us who like this stuff, "tell" away. See ya! ==================================================== So, that's the way I'd like to keep the conversations going ...... you "talk" and I'll reply along with providing some "order" to it all. Oh yes - pictures are really welcome and please feel free to post away ........ Belly up, boys ..... light breakfast menu - hot coffee, tea and hot chocolate! The day is just beginning! See ya! Tom in Chesterfield, MO, USA (Siberianmo)
A little something from our past . . . and note that none of those guys are customers any longer. Rob 'n Al are UTBs (used-to-be) 'n Duke was really never a regular, but a friend from the "Coffee Shop" early days.
Enjoy the day!
Today is the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place!
An adult eating ‘n drinking establishment for the discussion of Classic Trains ‘n stuff!
<opened 12 April 2005>
"Our" Place interior
Mentor Village Chorale 'n Philharmonic background singers!
Manager Lars' Bar in the Penthouse Suite
A throwback to days gone by . . . busy enough for another round of acknowledgments and it's only mid-day!
Looks like Lars did a commendable job in getting guys to turn out for this Anniversary day!
Jan at 8:39 AM ‘n 9:39 AM today - July 12th: Your OH-FISH-UL Aboard comes with a free drink! Hope that you'll find this place to your liking ‘n join in on the fun. Suggestions abound regarding how to get started with us. However, I'm sure you've spent sufficient time on our Pages to figure it out. Just try to remember that we're a simple lot ‘round here - we greet one another - we are inclusive - we acknowledge the other guy's efforts and we refrain from "hit ‘n miss" Posts. Simple enough, eh Youbetcha!
Dan (DL) at 9:35 AM today - July 12th: Great to see your continuing interest in this joint and of course the fine material presented!
That EuroStar train must be something else! According to what I read from you
. . . on Eurostar trains you can dine at 185 mph if you travel First Class . . .
Now I KNOW why VIA Rail embraced the "no Chef" concept - they're H-bent on going Euro in Canada with their trains. Makes sense. But alas, the traveling public isn't filling those dining cars aboard Renaissance and there's a reason! That abominable food preparation method isn't worth the prices charged much less consuming. <ugh> <double ugh>
VIA Rail's Ocean tried out the buffet approach to dining several years ago. I never experienced it, but it was short lived as it turned "off" MORE than it turned "on."
What a difference aboard the Chaleur on our round trip to Gaspe. A real Chef ‘n fine meals. You'd think "they" would figure it out, eh I'm a believer in VIA Rail's ONLY interest is in CUTTING corners which equates to a lessening of what used to be the best of north American passenger rail travel (not speaking of those excursion trains!)
Way back in 1947 when my father put me aboard that gleaming Santa Fe streamliner, I do recall being led down a passageway to a ‘secret room' - which is what the attendant called it. It was to be "home" for the trip to Chicago. I doubt that I made "demands" other than perhaps some extra ice cream at dinner time! <grin> But perhaps that was indeed my inculcation of attitudes to follow . . .
The Church in North America, yes - a most imposing element that shaped and shapes society to this day. The edifices are impressive ‘n I wonder aloud whether we have the artisans available today to construct such structures.
Glad that you were able to make it in for our 27th Month Anniversary!
Ron (DD1) at 9:48 AM today - July 12th: It's OH-FISH-UL - you have "qualified" for that free drink! Back!
Don't have very much to add to what Manager Lars had to say regarding the problem you're experiencing with your Posts. They do look somewhat adrift from the norm ‘n it appears to me that you may be "cutting ‘n pasting" OR perhaps using a reply feature that isn't quite compatible with what the rest of us use. Honestly don't know. HOWEVER, keep it simple and try the "reply" button method that Lars mentioned. Just select ANY post on the last Page - and once you get the "box" for the reply, go for it!
Also - You mentioned that you included a quote from one of your Emails. Did you mean that, or did you mean a quote from a Post on the Thread (site). Not at all sure how you wound up getting Doug's text in an Email???? Very confusing. You may wish to go back to your settings to check out why you're receiving Emails about replies and so forth.
Tell me about the "values" of living in places other than the northeast or California. I've reaped more than a few positive benefits being here in mid-continent USA - quality of life being right at the top. Still a far better place to raise a family - which is long, long past for me <thank the Good Lawd!>
Thanx for the elaboration
Happy 27th Month ANNIVERSARY to "Our" Place!
Ahoy Cap'n Tom ‘n fellow travelers at the bar!
Ruth my deAH, keep the tankards full for those who have taken it upon themselves to celebrate this fine day at Cap'n Tom's Tavern by the Tracks! 5- Salute to the guyz who keep this place rollin'!
A hearty aboard to two guyz - DD1 (Ron) down in Mississippi & Jan over in Scotland! I'm the Manager of this bar 'n hope that you'll find the conversations, photos 'n goings on to your liking!
Page one of this thread is very important in order to fully appreciate how Cap'n Tom wants to run this joint. We are NOT a "hit 'n run" establishment and do everything we can to ignore those who practice that kinda thing here. Just a word to the 'wise' as Cap'n Tom has a TWEETER which will sound a most painful shrill sound should he find anyone in violation of the "rules"! <grin> He's "big" on recognition of the barkeep upon entering AND ordering a drink, food, etc. So, now you know.
There's so much more to this bar of ours, but you'll figure it out in no time. again, and Ruth, give them a drink on me! Oh what the heck - Boris - ring that bell twice - and let's have a round for all!
For Ron: Your post looks like something surely got screwed up as it appears you've gottent the text from Doug's post somehow intertwined with yours. Don't have a clue what the stuff in blue is either. May I suggest that you review the way you are setting up your posts?
I use the "reply" button for ANY post on the thread - doesn't really matter. In other words, you can take the last post on the page and use "reply" or any other. Once you get the "box" for typing - then off you go. I'm hardly an expert at this and perhaps our Mentor will have something to add.
Great to see the return of Per, the emergence of Doug 'n the continuing good stuff from our friend in the UK - DL (Dave).
Should also make note of Pete 'n Eric, our two stalwarts, who pretty much anchor the late afternoon 'n early, early morning hours. Thank you for answering the call!
For Pete: Thanks, but I really cannot take credit for getting DD1 over here. Tom invited all of us to do that in his morning summary. He also extended the invitation first. It PAYS to visit that thread from time to time . . .
Thanks to all for helping to make this 27th month Anniversary something really special - it's been a long, long time since we've had this kinda turnout!
Thought I'd depart from whatever the "norm" is for me <grin> and provide a few glimpses into my past here at the bar . . . My first two posts at the bar! Seems just like yesterday . . .
From page 217 on the "old" thread on 11 Jan 2006: Greetings fellow classic train lovers! I bring to you some new blood at this establishment created for all who enjoy the love of Classic Trains and appreciate the interaction amongst those who have similar interests. First, let me give you some brief background: I am not a novice when it comes to the Kalmbach Forums. I have participated in the past and had several of those stars. I gave it all up awhile ago for an assortment of reasons. My return is under a new cyber handle and I am essentially starting over. You may check me out in my profile, but it is rather brief. I am John Larson and preferred to be called, Lars. As you can tell by my handle, I love domes! Just loved those pix provided by siberianmo Tom and the inputs by passengerfan Al. Heaven just cannot be as good as sitting in a dome car! I have checked out this thread from pretty much the onsest of its birth and have followed each of you through the months of its existence. I also visit the thread called, "If you like Classic PASSENGER trains, visit here!" although I have not "surfaced" there, yet. Why am I here and why have I come back to the forums? I miss the interaction and quite simply would like to know that there are some people still around who enjoy mature, adult conversation, without the absolutely nonsense appearing in so many other places. I give you fair warning, Gentlemen, I detest rude people and fall very heavily into the camp of BudKarr & Tom when it comes to tolerance for the ignorant and inconsiderate. Those who exploit the good intentions of others belong at the bottom of the sea. So, Mr. Barkeep - or Captain Tom - or Proprietor, or whatever else you may prefer to be called - hit me with a Jack Daniels, black label, on the rocks and I'll plunk down a twenty for a round on me! Let's roll, Gentlemen! L Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:48 AM Posted By: barndad in General Discussion (Classic Trains)Subject: Re: "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment!__________________________________Good morning Captain Tom and all, Too early for a Gunniness, maybe a Scotch. Join me. I've included a quote from one of my E-mails that contains nomenclature I don't understand. I've hightlighted the items in BLUE. Can you explain what they mean?Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this I've got some woodworking I have to do this morning so I can't linger for long except to say:thanks for all the good will extended to me. Until later. DD1(Ron)BTW Tom, I have to comment about coming from NYC via San Francisco(30 years)and ending up in Mississippi. I came here in 1992 because of job demands. I liked what I saw and one month later, the rest of my family joined me. It's a move I don't regret. It was culture shock to say the least, but I have more here than I could ever hope to have in SF or NYC. My 8 acre homestead here cost me $129K, 5 years ago. The same thing would be in the millions in the two last places mentioned. I was indeed fortunate. I moved from Ocean Springs which is on the coast inland to Vancleave before Katrina wiped out the coast. I sustained minor damage, but the house where I had previously lived, was swept away. I guess someone up there is looking out for me. Many of the people I know now are either ex Navy or Air Force. There is Northrop Grumman Ship Systems(where I retired from), Keesler Air Force Base and Pascagoula Naval Facility. Additionally, there is a Seabee base, an Army base, Coast Guard, NOAA and not too far away, Stennis aerospace. That just about sums up for now my snail trail from the big apple to my present abode. I watch the "Sopranos" to keep in touch with my roots. Later.P.S. I hope this narrative fits into the material outline of "Our Place". I'm sure, in the future, I'll have more interesting thoughts about trains to contribute. You know what happens when you're retired and have too much free time. You tend to ramble on line and frequently get off track. If this happens, just give me a whack the side of the head. Edit JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:39 AM Sure am DL. A Swede living in Sotland. My family is like dogfood, spread all over the place, US, Canada and here in the, well, sunny UK....So, do we have Sunday popquizes? All the best! Jan DL - UK Member sinceAugust 2006 280 posts Posted by DL - UK on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:33 AM Hello TomBeen nice and busy in our place the last day or so!I'll have a full breakfast - here at the bar - will make a change from last weeks 125 mph breakfast I guess. In fact on Eurostar trains you can dine at 185 mph if you travel First Class - but the food is not proper chef prepared - it is very much the same deal as the Renaissance dining car cooking technology - which as we both agree - does not match the 1st class fare! It is supposed to be acceptable however. TGV trains in France are not equipped with proper dining cars as I understand it (only buffet counter service) - but the ICE in Germany is advertised as having a proper Restaurant Car - I'm not sure if that is with proper chefs or not.Off topic but I agree about your comment on the size of churches in Quebec - I noticed this as soon as I got out of Montréal on the Quebec Train and saw small communities with massive churches - I think the church was very powerful in Quebec society for many years - and the British government tolerated this ‘alternative power base' because of the work the church did in welfare provision etc. Just going back to your comment about that Santa Fe trip you took as a child - so what you are saying is you had a private room, spent plenty of time in the Dome etc, got (demanded?) good service from the crew - well - anyone who has read any of your recent trip reports will know you started as you meant to go on!Per - I found the analysis of the LA UPT timetables very interesting - it gives some idea of the scale of long distance services and the sheer reduction in number of that form of transit from today. In Europe of course the numbers of long distance services would have increased in many areas (but the system is all government subsidised of course). In many ways the US is lucky to have the Amtrak service that it does.Eric - Black Pudding - I think it is similar to blood pudding you mentioned recently! Dave - it was interesting to read your comments on the Cab Forwards - and great to have Mike's pics so I could get a feel for what they looked like. Reminds me a loco type Pete will be aware of - the strange SR (UK that is) experimental Leader Class steam loco:See this link with pics and infohttp://www.semg.org.uk/steam/leader_01.htmlYou might find this of interest - if a little strange!Allan - interested to read your further comments about NZ rail - we need a 40 mile trucking limit here IMHO! I recall hearing that NZ rail then had real difficulties due to being exposed to the level of competition without he government support for protecting the levels for service. Is that the correct interpretation?Pete - yes Birmingham - Liverpool rtn for 10 pounds is indeed available - check this link which you can send to your pals:http://www.centraltrains.co.uk/templates/over50TrainRoutes.aspx?id=2274Select ‘Birmingham New Street' in the drop down box that appears and the destinations will appear - you then have to print off a voucher which you fill in and take to the ticket office when you buy your ticket - I presume you need some proof of age as you have to be over 50 (so no good for me, being more than 10 years off that!)Incidentally - there have been some big franchise changes on the network here with Virgin losing cross country this week and National Express losing Central Trains and Midland Main Line a few weeks before. I'm not sure what we will get instead will be mush better.Brake vans on nuclear flask trains - I'm not sure if they are still in use on nuclear flask trains - they may be - interesting question to which I don't know the answer.I see the steam magazines are commemorating the end of 40 years steam on SR this month, which you mentioned in your post. Welcome to DD1 - I enjoyed your post. This talk of Naval architecture reminds me to mention the news that was around a few weeks back that the Cunard QE2 was due to retire to some strange place in Saudi Arabia - very much a shame I thought. I think the ship is doing a return journey to the Clyde later this year - where it was built, I might try and go and see the ship in port. And indeed welcome Jan - we now have English, Welsh and Scottish participation if you are Glasgow based!Doug - called in too - but still no jokes? Interesting programme of events the 20th CC RR group has - I've checked their website in the past when researching a trip to Chicago - before I found this bar I should add - where people who know the answers to many questions drop in from time to time!DL JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 8:39 AM Jan will do just fine. Not much happening here in Glasgow as far as I know, trainwise anyway. May I raise a toast for many more happy months to come here at our place..... All the best! Jan siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Thursday, July 12, 2007 7:56 AM <w/permission: http://www.scenic-railroads.com/> Today is the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place!An adult eating ‘n drinking establishment for the discussion of Classic Trains ‘n stuff! <opened 12 April 2005>"Our" Place interior Mentor Village Chorale 'n Philharmonic background singers! Manager Lars' Bar in the Penthouse Suite G'day Gents! So what kind of a day will this be Just another Thursday OR something special Guess time will tell, eh Coffee's hot - pastries fresh and our <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts are ready for eatin' - so let's get it on! Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):Lars at 9:05 AM Wednesday - July 11th: Many thanx for picking up the slack during the morning - I wasn't particularly enthralled with checking the bar just to ‘see' what was going on, so your Post came at the right time! As always, your selections of book ‘n video covers really liven up things ‘round here. Unfortunately, we just aren't generating conversations - simply accolades. Guess "we takes what we gets," eh I watched the All Star baseball game, as previously mentioned ‘n thought it was an "okay" game for what it was. Those "spoiled" Prima Donnas coming out on a red carpet did very little for me, though! Rather not delve into the unhappy on our Anniversary Day - so let's just say that some déjà vu has crept into a few Posts ‘n contributors of late. Let's remember to be INCLUSIVE ‘n pay attention to the works ‘n efforts of others. Thought that's what the majority of us want ‘n are trying to maintain! Round appreciated! DD1 at 11:38 AM Wednesday- July 11th: A fine initial Post from the man who call's himself DD1. Some interesting material ‘n it's great to have a Mississippi Connection on board. Hopefully you'll make it permanent and we can add you to our Customer List! I like the origin of your "handle," truly unique in the Classic Trains sense! I'm in the "class of 1938," so we're not that far apart. Also a New Yawker and have vivid memories of my grandpa taking me to Grand Central Terminal along with Penn Station back when those palaces were "alive" with some fantastic trains. Stories ‘n references to those times have been repeated many times on this Thread and on our "original" Thread. Just some great, warm ‘n special memories, fer sure, fer sure! With over 30 years on the west coast, I'd say you're a "natural" for conversation with one of our guys who goes by the handle of West Coast S - Dave. He's into S-gauge, or at least was, and is very knowledgeable of all things Southern Pacific. Hope he catches this Post . . . My guess is that rural Mississippi must be a huge change of pace from city life - anywhere. I know settling in this part of the continent (St. Louis area) was an eye-opener for me, having spent the majority of my adult life smelling salt air. CHANGE is all around ‘n not always bad. But I do miss the salt air . . . Your reference to the Sacramento Rail Museum will open the eyes of one of our guys - Wolfman Pete - our Bar Chandler. While I cannot speak with authority regarding which rail museum is better than another, I will say this - the Expo Rail Canadian Railway Museum in Saint Constant, Quebec surely has to be ranked "up there" with the finest too. As with baseball and sports figures from the past - really hard to rank anyone of ‘em Number One. Should simply put ‘em into groups. Sounds like you had a very interesting ‘n challenging career. Funny you should mention naval architecture. Way back when, I was "guaranteed" an "A-school" of my choice upon enlisting in the USCG. So, when the time came ‘round in the 12th or 13th week of boot camp for those things to be attended to, I requested naval architecture. They sent me to radioman school! Why? Because I "aced" the Morse code test - having learned it as a Boy Scout! <geesh> I had limited studies in architecture courses and thought that would be a great field to get into. Oh well, things worked out the way things usually work out. I made it to Chief Petty Officer- then Warrant - then began all over again by going through OCS to be a "line officer" at the "tender age" of 32 . . . retiring with 32 years of active duty. Still wonder what kind of life I wudda had IF . . . <grin>Thanx again for your interesting ‘n insightful Post and we hope to see ya ‘round here again ‘n again! Pete at 5:47 PM W Happy Railroading! Siberianmo marthastrainyard Member sinceMarch 2006 From: Orange County, CA 98 posts Posted by marthastrainyard on Thursday, July 12, 2007 7:38 AM Good Morning everybody present and Happy Anniversary! Ruth, I am so sorry about the mix-up the other day. I really need to clean my glasses more often, don't I? Let me have a Tequila, make it a Reserva de Familia in honor of this day (not that Tijuana stuff Dave was talking about).I followed Tom's advice and went back a couple of pages to see what y'all had been up to while I was gone. I start with Tom, our Captain and the busiest poster of all. It was a really great collection of Canadian pictures. The interior shot from the vintage sleeper reminds me of a privately owned heavyweight that was on display at the Fullerton Railroad Days this year. The owner had built a sleeping compartment for his own use that looked just about the one in your picture. Of course my daughter had to ask why we couldn't have a room like that on our trip from Chicago! A very interesting picture of the GG1 it in the waiting room in Washington; somehow I don't think that was the intention with that room. Sturdy construction of the engine, though. I wish we could say the same for the floor.Thank you for the link to the Flexliner pictures. The first picture I looked at was from Fullerton. Interesting! And I missed all of that when it was there, too bad. Looking at those pictures it was like seeing the "Kustpilen" all over again. That's the similar train that runs through my home town in Sweden. Although the first class compartment isn't as fancy as that in the pictures. But as the accompanying article stated: The manufacturer added all the bells and whistles on this demo train.Yes, the LAUPT has seen a lot of changes over the year. My wife told me her Dad had to hold her with a firm hand so she didn't get separated in the tunnel and her little sister had to be carried. The tunnel was so packed with people that it would have been too easy for a child to be separated and lost. I finally got the train data up on my site: http://home.att.net/~pers_home/trains/cola/LAUPT.htm It was a very interesting post about the Milwaukee and its passenger trains. I have always liked the observation car on the Hiawatha with those windows all over the tail end. I hadn't seen any of the drumheads before, but some of those are real classic. Such a nice design.Pete, thanks for the welcome back greeting. There was (and maybe still is) a place in Sweden where most steam engines went for scrapping, Vislanda in the southern part of the country. I remember seeing some steamers when I rode the train through there, but I never had a chance to go there and try to get a look (and pictures). That would have been something to have these days when most of the steamers are gone.Eric, I hope you are feeling well, try to get some sleep and enough of this 1AM postings for a while, right? Thank you as well for the welcome back greeting. I saw a couple of your pictures and the turntable that's now at OERM caught my eye. That looks like it is one of the SP turntables from Owens Valley. The one in Laws is still there, so who knows where this came from? It looks like it is time for a new visit to OERM; it seems to have changed a LOT since I was there last. I feel sympathy for you in your heat wave, but as you have pointed out, it's a dry heat. I wish somebody would tell that to the turkey on Thanksgiving. And when you had your 113 I heard the forecast for Death Valley was 135! No wonder they close the place up in the summer.Thank you for the picture of LAUPT. I believe it has been recently renovated and it is sure a very nice building. I liked the link to the NASA site with the article about the ICE crash. Looking at those pictures it amazes me that anybody survived the crash. Trains have a better survivability than planes, that's fer sure.Do you have any idea if the service hours for a train engineer will be shortened? 432 per month is an awful lot.I wonder what UP used to make that MoW Dining Car. Was it a very big box car, or did they put a couple of the together. I know Southern had a "Hogshead" car (so called because it could hold 100 hogsheads of tobacco). That car was 92 feet long. Check it out here: http://southern.railfan.net/ties/1962/62-6/hog.htmland with some pictures here: http://southern.railfan.net/images/archive/southern/freight/tob/tob.htmlI think I remember seeing that you were looking for an SP video. Pentrex has two new ones right now, the cab forward and the beet train. Take a look at their web site.Lars, it was quite a Swedish menu you cooked up. I think I pass the palt (had too much of that in school) and the rotten herring (I still refuse to call it "fermented"), that's all bad smell and no taste, but for the rest I can come back for seconds. So I finally I got an explanation to the "eh" in Canadian English. And I always thought it was a way to spell Canada: C -eh- N -eh- D -eh-. And thanks for the hints on how to handle the flood of posts after a long absence; I've tried to follow that here.James, it was a really interesting web site about the Stockwood fill. What a story!Thank you, Pwolfe, for the pictures of the British steamers. That Lord Nelson sure is a nice looking loco! It's kind of strange how my appreciation for British steam engines has grown over the years; in my teens I didn't care for them at all, I felt they had the "wrong proportions" but now I find some of them being the most beautiful engines ever built.It seems like Dave and I may have seen each other once before. I was also at the LAUPT for that 50th anniversary, but so were a couple of thousand other people so we passed each other as ships in the night (isn't that what they say?). It was before the digital camera age so my pictures (and videos) are hidden somewhere. I went to the Cajon pass Home of the Ambroid history page and the up-and-coming City Of Los Angeles from 1950 http://www.trainweb.org/ambroidkits/ My pictures are here http://www.flickr.com/photos/8514678@N08/ Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, July 12, 2007 5:32 AM Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! Congratulations to Captain Tom and all who contribute to keep this great thread rolling. I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this individual was apprehended, or de-train. Fortunately for all, the individual was quickly caught, and our delay was only minutes. I was impressed that the Conductor, more than once referred to this individual as a "poor soul, who needed help."On another subject, I've put together a "little" story called Fire in Tunnel 9" for later in the day, but for now, here is an interesting poem called the REDBALL FREIGHT by H.L. KelsoThe JUDGE peered sharp at the man on trial,A hobo, old and gray;He sized him up from head to toe,Then bade him have his say,"Was passing through," the ‘bo spoke out,"On yonder streak of rust.This cinder dick who hauled me hereKnows naught of wanderlust."I had a job like yours and his‘Way back along the trail,Arresting tramps and thieves and suchAnd sending them to jail.And then one night from in the skyI heard the honking geese.They seemed to say, "Come follow usAnd you will find your peace.""A long long freight was leaving town;Her whistle sounded grand;And since that night I've plied the railsAcross our pretty land.Now, judge, a redball's making upAnd in my heart a song,And when she leaves this town of yoursI'd like to be along.""This case dismissed," the judge then said,"And court's adjourned this date.Now, hobo, you just lead the way,We'll nail that redball freight!"Have a great day guys. I am off to work! Edit JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 2:38 AM Good morning fellow train connoisseurs... May I join you? Could I have an extra cold Guinness please and top up whatever everybody else is drinking and something for you bartender....Only the second visit here, so I buy this and the next round.. All the best! Jan EricX2000 Member sinceDecember 2002 From: Phoenix, AZ 683 posts Posted by EricX2000 on Thursday, July 12, 2007 1:04 AM Good morning Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!Leon, old friend, just a cup of coffee! I have to leave in a few minutes!Just stopped by to wish a Happy 27th Anniversary!!! At the same time I want to say to DD1!! I am following my doctor's advice to get some extra sleep (due to some symptoms) so I am afraid I won't be back until Saturday with an inclusive post. It will be nice when I can go back to normal routines again. I think I have showed this one before, but where was it taken? See you soon!Eric Gunneral Member sinceSeptember 2002 From: NZ 242 posts Posted by Gunneral on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 9:43 PM Hi Tom and all, HAPPY 27th TO ALL!Leon set em up up all round, mines a Tui.Tom. Your Milwaukee Road coverage was 1st class, nostalgia is great food for the mind!Dave. You were correct about the NZ loco`s being used as "rip rap" , a huge number of engines were dumped in river stopbanks to help in flood protection, most of the Roger`s 2-4-2`s were found in the Oreti river stopbanks near Invercargill, NZ`s southernmost city.Eric. NZ railways used to operate long distance bus services as well, AKA "NZ Railways Road Services", they used to build their own bus bodies so this came in handy when they built the railcars. NZ railways was very protected up until the 1980`s, their was a 40 mile radius trucking restriction on freight delivery by road, so any mileage over that had to go via railPete. Rail in NZ was first started by each Provincial Council and was a real "Hotch Potch" of different gauges and equipment, their was even a "wooden rail" line from Invercargill to Makarewa at one stage. All this was standerdised by Julius Vogel the NZ Government Engineer of the day, he stipulated 3ft 6in gauge as the NZ standard. A lot of NZ loco`s were supplied by Badwin, Roger`s etc. because it was easier and cheaper to ship them over the Pacific from the West coast of the USA. The Otago Provincial Council were very much Double Fairlie minded because they did`nt need turntables to turn them around, a big cost saving as this province was settled by the canny Scots! The Wellington/Manawatu railway was virtually a mini RGS with it`s Baldwin loco`s and US style passenger coaches and freight cars, as well as all the UK loco`s and equipment from the other provinces.DL. You are so right about the taste of Vegemite and Marmite being an acquired one, as they say "one man`s meat is another man`s poison. Glad you liked the railcar site.DD1. Welcome to the fold. I am a "greenhorn" who has been made very welcome to this gathering of minds since I joined in.Lars. Your entries are great reading and I have done a lot of reasearch on your pointers.See ya all, Allan pwolfe Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: mid mo 1,054 posts Posted by pwolfe on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 5:47 PM Hi Tom and all. A pint of Bathams please RUTH.DAVE Yes it does sound as though if those locomotives were at that mill they no longer exist today. It is strange that no works plates have turned up, I wonder what price those chime whistles fetch if they change hands. Some of the nameplates off the steam locos in Britain, when they are auctioned today, cost more than what it cost to build the locomotive when it was built in the 1920s or 30s.Are there any Cab-forwards in museums today beside # 4294 shown in Dave's link. I don't blame you feeling like that about that mayor.MIKE Thanks for the links. It must have sounded great to be in the first car with a cab-forward working a passenger service.The cars in the Federal Express look to be made of very strong construction.Good photos of the prototypes and the youngsters are certainly enjoying the model versions.LARS Thanks for inviting DD1 to call in at the bar I am looking forward to some navy tales between DD1, TOM and yourself.Great set of Great Northern book and DVD covers. The electric and steam in color looks a great book.DD1 I do hope you will join us at Our Place, Tom gets the Guinness from Dublin.Another person who saw steam in regular use on the main line. I am from England but in the US now, although now in my mid 50s, I remember steam in everyday use as steam lasted a lot longer there on the main line(1968). In fact last weekend was the 40th anniversary of the end of regular everyday steam into a London Terminus (Waterloo).Thanks for the description of the Chilean trip. It must have been quite a sight to see those DD1s at speed; there could not have been many other electric locomotives with wheels as large as 72 inches.TOM That could be an opening for a business, fixing a permanent ladder to gas station price signs, the way the price seems to change almost daily.The vote was passed in KC for a light rail system and there are a lot of letters in the paper in favor of it but they are still arguing about the cost etc so whether it ever does get built we shall have to see, as you say the initial cost is huge.Many thanks for the Milwaukee Road Fallen Flag Encore. I see that they still had 588 passenger cars in 1963. If I ever can go back to the National Railroad Museum In Green Bay WIS I will have a much greater appreciation of the great Drumhead collection they have there.Good words for DD1.Great photos from the gallery at Exporail. I don't think I was very clear about the engine I asked you about (what is new says Tom), it was the engine in the rotary snow plow,it is in the 4th photo in today's photos, you can see the open engine covers on the plow and the engine when you enlarge the photo. Enjoying the ‘Twenty Dollar Bill spot the 10 changes', got 8 so far, will have to back and find the other two.An old car window at Green Bay.Well LEON another beer and a round please, I think Lars as fed the mascots their treatsPete. siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 3:10 PM G'day Gents!Thanx to our Manager, Lars for helping out this morning! Took a bit of the "strain" off the line for Moi! Also, a to DD1 - see separate SPECIAL Post . . . . More specifics to the both of you in tomorrow's acknowledgments . . . For Pete: Email received ‘n responded to - thanx! By the by, I misunderstood your question - NO, I do NOT have a foto of that loco in question . . . don't recall even walking back that way. Probably looking for YOU! <grin> Continuing on with Pix from Day Four: Sunday - May 27th, 2007 - ExpoRail Canadian Railway Museum at Delson/Saint-Constant, Quebec, CanadaFrom the balcony - Inside Building #1 (cont'd) <all previously identified> Can you?The balcony To be continued . . . Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts Welcome Aboard! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 12:36 PM SPECIAL for DD1 Aboard! Happy to see you made it over to the best cyber bar 'n grill this side of the Ether. And of course we have ALL major brews on Earth, right here! Sorry, but we shy away from micro-breweries as they are much to hard to ship 'n most difficult to keep in stock. <grin>Last things first: Not quite sure I understand what the problem might be regarding the scrolling reference to get to this Thread.Some basics: From the trains.com Forums main page - locate the Classic Trains (General Discussion) topic and click on it. Next - click on the General Discussion (Classic Trains) topic - then find "Our" Place and click on the LAST PAGE shown. That should bring you to the top of whatever Page # is shown. An alternative is to click on the little box shown after the cyber handle of the person who has last Posted here - that will bring you directly to that Post.Now - some "things" you may want to know about us:We are an inclusive place, quite unlike others found on sites like these. We try to acknowledge one another 'n engage in conversation.Highly recommend you go to Page One of this Thread and check out the "precepts" within the first Post (mine). Then read through that Page to get the "gist" of things.Then come back here to the final few Pages 'n familiarize yourself with what's going on. The best way to join us is to join in, however, it's far easier when you're up to speed <to to speak>!At this time we're experiencing some lulls in activity what with summer vacations and the like . . . so the Posts aren't as fast 'n furious as in the past. That's GOOD for trying to catch up . . . Really enjoyed your Posts here 'n over on "my other Thread." The latter was designed pretty much as a "feeder" for this place. It's been a long haul . . . .The information you've provided us tells quite a story - thanx! You'll be a bit suprised that there are three guys with New York ties - one on Staten Island - one on Long Island and Moi, a long-time ex-pat of NYC - Moi - (also Staten island) currently residing in the St. Louis area <haven't lived in NYC for over 40 years). Don't know the age of the LI guy <Mike> but Lars (Staten Island) and yours truly aren't that far from 70 in years. Lars comes from B&O "stock" - with grandfather 'n father as careerists. Lars is a retired "Merchie." I'm a retiree from the USCG (32 years active). Our Long Island Connection has "deep" ties to family railroading in the east, too.We are an international "lot" in that some of our crew are from places as far away as New Zealand, as close as Canada, and also Europe (Sweden, England & Wales). In time you'll easily figure out 'who's who' here at the bar and my bet is that you'll find yourself right at home amidst 'n amongst those with similar likes! First drink is on the house, which will be YOURS upon your next visit! We do have one set of "rules" that are absolutes! One must greet the barkeep upon entering 'n order a drink (or food or both!) You may note that in addition to cyber handles, we also use "names" or "initials" - just to make it a bit more like a bar 'n grill. Your choice - but fair warning - we assign names from time to time! <grin> Again, glad to have you 'n our hope is that you'll find this place AND our cast of characters <real & imagined> of interest! We've never had a Mississippi Connection here at the bar 'n I hope you'll be the first! By the by - we are "celebrating" the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place tomorrow - as we started "business" back on April 12th, 2005! C'mon in and join us! Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 12:01 PM The Passenger Railroad Fallen Flags of "Our" Place #16 The Milwaukee Road<A form of this was initially Posted on Page 128 of the Original Thread> Here's another Fallen Flag for the gang from Classic American Railroads:Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul & Pacific (CM&StPP) - The Milwaukee RoadCaveat: The information provided is NOT all inclusive and is reflective only of the periods mentioned. Headquarters: Chicago, IL Mileage: 1950: 10,664 Locomotives in 1963: Diesel: 803 Electric: 93 Rolling stock in 1963: Freight cars: 42.325 Passenger: 588 Principal routes in 1950: (not all)Chicago-Minneapolis via Milwaukee and Columbus, WI New Lisbon-Woodruff, WI Minneapolis-Seattle & Tacoma via Spokane, WA Minneapolis & St. Paul-Calmar, IA via Austin, MN La Crescent, MN-Wessington Springs, SD Rondout, IL (Chicago)-Madison, WI Watertown, WI-Rapid City, SD Chicago-Omaha Manilla, IA-Sioux Falls, SD Marion-Ottumwa, IA Sturtevant, WI-Kansas City La Crosse, WI-Sabula, IA Des Moines-Spencer, IA Chicago-Terre Haute, IN Milwaukee-Ontonagon, MI via Green Bay, WI Passenger Trains of note: (not all)Afternoon Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Arrow (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Chippewa-Hiawatha (Chicago-Channing, MI) Copper Country Limited (Chicago-Green Bay-Calumet, MI jointly with DSS&A railroad) Midwest Hiawatha (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Morning Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-Minneapolis) Olympian (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle & Tacoma) Olympian Hiawatha (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle U& Tacoma; replaced Olympian) Pioneer Limited (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Sioux (Chicago-Madison-Rapid City, SD) Southwest Limited (Milwaukee & Chicago-Kansas City Tomahawk (Chicago-Minocqua, WI) Varsity (Chicago-Madison) Of note: From 1955-1971, Milwaukee Road operated the Chicago-Omaha segment of UP's "Overland" streamliners including the City of Denver, City of Portland, City of Los Angeles, City of San Francisco and the Challenger. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Some drum heads of the Milwaukee Road Happy Railroading! Siberianmo Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Update on Chile rail trip by DD1 Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 11:38 AM The original post by DD1: "The year was 1969 and as we were pulling out of the railroad station in Santiago, Chile, the song "take the last train from Clarksville" by the Monkees was blareing from the platform PA system. We were headed south toward Concepcion on an overnight trip aboard a vintage passenger train pulled by an old Baldwin 4-6-0(I think). The passenger cars were old German built cars with lots of wood work. I made the mistake of sticking my head out the window and getting coal cinders in my eye. The train, by the way was in regular service, not rail fan. I have been back there since in 2002 and the train is no longer in service. They do have a very nice railroad museum there in Santiago and that's where I suspect the old engine ended up, I hope. Food service on the train was very good and served meats, fish and poultry cooked over charcoal. At night, the porter would pull down the berths. Of course much of the great Chilean wines were consummed during our trip. I can recall overnight trips on the NYC way back when the 20th century limited hauled by a Hudson would gently rock me to sleep. Those days are gone forever and never to be repeated. I'm fortunate to have been able to experience them. Diesels and railfan trips are no way close to the real thing. I'm 72 and lucky to have come on the scene before it all disappeared for ever."Tom and Lars, I hope you have Guinness draught on tap. I thank you for your invite to this forum. I wanted to update the above post while still fresh in my mind.The passenger equipment as I stated was German. I estimate there were built between WWI and WWII and were sold to Chile as the German railways system modernized. The track we were running on was metre gauge.I was only about 7 years of age when I rode the 20th century limited with my mother on a vacation trip. That's about all I can recall about that.You may wonder about my handle "DD1". I was fascinated with the DD1 box cab electrics that ran on the LIRR and Pennsylvania. I can still remember the smell of ozone and the snap of the contactors as the DD1's made their way into Penn Station. As a kid, I would stand alongside the LIRR tracks and watch the DD1 coming down the track, rocking from side to side at 60 mph. With those 72" drivers, they could run 80 mph. They were tough on the rails due to the pounding nature of the drive system, but they proved to be most economical when it came to maintenance.Living in and being raised in New York City, gave me opportunity to see train operations all around me. I could go to Penn Station, Grand Central or take a subway ride to the Lackawanna Terminal in Hoboken, N.J. There, I could see the Delaware and Lackawanna, Reading, Jersey Central and maybe a few others. I rode behind camelbacks on the Reading. As you may have noticed, I am a railroad nut and have been for the past 65 years. I was fortunate to be born at this time to be able to wittness railroading in it's glory days, at least on the East coast. I wish I could have seen the Challengers on the UP out west, but did see them when they resided later on in a museum.In 1964, I drove from the East coast to the West coast and stayed there for over 30 years before finally settling down in rural Mississippi. When arriving in Seattle, I saw the Great Northern Bi-polars in operation. I guess I made the transition from steam to electric during those early years. The silence and power of those huge engines was overwhelming to me. I have seen articulates under steam during the opening celebration of the Sacramento Railroad Museum, a museum 2nd to none IMHO. I always make it a point to visit a RR museum whenever I'm traveling in an area that may have one. I've visited RR museums in Tokyo, Santiago, Sacramento and a few small private tour lines.BTW, you asked if I was in the Navy. No; not as a serviceman, but as a naval architect. That was my profession for 50 years. During those years, I traveled all over the world involved in design and repair of navy ships, from the smallest navy tug to the largest carrier or battleship. I also had a lot to do with nuclear powered submarines and surface vessels. I was always in close contact with navy personnel and their ships, but not as a crew member. I had the best of both worlds. A civilian and officer treatment.One last thing. How do I get to this "our house" directly, without a lot of scrolling? Edit LoveDomes Member sinceJanuary 2006 From: northeast U.S. 1,225 posts Posted by LoveDomes on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 9:05 AM Ahoy Cap'n Tom ‘n fellow travelers at the bar!Ruth my deAH, set ‘em with all of the "jolts" they can handle in their OJ! I'm a bit early this day, but trying to take advantage of the time I've got . . . You're lookin' mighty fine little lady ‘n the old Larsman knows he's still alive when looking at you! <blush> A mugga joe with a BK splash will do me just fine, thank you! <grin>Tom, I'll drop off an "invite" to the visitor over on your other thread on my way back home . . . good idea! Boris, what's this I hear about a rabies shot?!?!? Thought we took care of that right after you got into it with Tex . . . my, my how time flies! <grin> Good to see ya Dave, even if you haven't seen me! Did watch the all star game last night ‘n was surprised at how the NL just couldn't get a run across the plate when needed. It isn't as if they didn't have chances. Thought it was a pretty good contest, except for the 9th inning for both sides. Surely don't like this idea of determining the home game advantage as a result of who wins an exhibition game. Good Grief Charlie Brown! That idea, along with most from the "Commish" belong in the round file. Wonderful continuing display of photos from your trip to Canada ‘n Expo Rail. I'm sounding like a broken record, but those shots are really fine! Another 5- Salute to our Cap'n for taking the time to put these on-line for those who care and of course those who could care less! Picked up on that comment you made to Per regarding having something to say for each ‘n every post at the bar. Doing something like that could surely ruin one's day if coming back from a prolonged absence. I know some guys really are good about inclusiveness ‘n make a point to say something in reference to each guy. That's kinda like what I try to do - rather than pick up on specifics for every post - just make mention of the guys who have been putting out the "good stuff," holding specifics for something really out of the ordinary - like what our Mentor does for us!No expanded comment regarding the "ignorance factor" that still exists ‘round here insofar as recognizing the works of others. Here's a few more book ‘n video covers from the Great Northern for your enjoyment!Until the next time! Lars siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 8:10 AM <w/permission: http://www.scenic-railroads.com/> Wednesday's WitticismNerves is just which end of a six-gun you happen to be looking at. G'day Gents! Mid-week in mid-continent USA where petrol is on the rise! Was at $2.90 (rounded) yesterday afternoon. However, there was a ladder up against the price sign, so ya know those numbers have changed. Was $2.72 just the day before! Coffee's ready - pastries fresh - ‘n breakfasts are ready for fixin'! C'mon . . . Noticed we had a "visitor" over on "my other Thread" - suggest those of you who give a Rat's Patoot, check it out ‘n invite the guy to stop by the bar! OBSERVATION: Still seeing "that" reluctance to use the RELOAD/REFRESH feature on the browser. It's the ONLY way to ensure that the MOST CURRENT POSTS get displayed. Given that we don't see many of the guys on a regular basis, it's most important to "get it right" the first time. Think about it! Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):Dave at 3:56 PM ‘n 6:59 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Great to see our Left Coast Connection ‘n Super Sleuth Man of Mystery about the decks during the week! Boris was in need of that rabies shot - good thinking! <grin>Didn't see any reference to the ExpoRail Pix since your last visit, so I'm guessing you didn't see em. <groan>Yes, I do recall the original Auto Train and it would be a treat if someone were to do a piece on it. Still NOT answering Emails, I note! <grin>Rounds appreciated - as always! Pete at 4:52 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Presume the trip to the dentist went well . . . also, 2nd mention: Email sent to you Monday . . .Juneau is a nervous wreck at this time of year with the fireworks but not thunderstorms. Firecrackers really bother him. He's okay in the house, but once outside - bad news. It's only the "direct hit" thunderboomers that make him "scurry" - but then, so do I! <uh oh>One airport in Miami proper worth a mention. Tri-Rail serves the airport, whereas it appears one has to transfer from Metrorail at the Tri-Rail station in order to get to the airport. I don't really know, as I've never traveled aboard either . . . KCity had several chances to vote "in" a light-rail system but didn't. Costs don't decrease and taxpayers are more reluctant these days to relent to more taxation. So, unless ‘n until there's a remarkable turnabout in KCity's economic health, I doubt we'll see that train to ‘n from the airport. Makes good sense, but . . . The Santa Fe train I traveled aboard was powered by at least two diesels that I can recall. Of course in that great war bonnet livery. But I can't remember any details and have asked for help on this a few times on this ‘n the original Thread - with no luck. I know the train had domes, because I sat in at least one. I had a roomette to myself and spent quite a bit of time in the observation car - waited on hand ‘n foot by the very attentive crew. Probably was the Super Chief, but again, I have nothing to back that up with. It was 1947 and I was 9 - say no more, eh Thanx for the visit ‘n round! Mike at 8:07 PM Tuesday - July 10th: URLs what else More real than Lionel, however all good! All Star pre-game ‘n game wasn't bad at all. Last time I saw Willie "for real" he was playing an exhibition game with the Mets against the Tidewater Tides in Norfolk, VA. He hit a homer and simply ran out of the park after touching home plate . . . The greateast! Don Mueller - a journeyman right fielder who "done good" at times for the Jints of New Yawk. <grin>No comments on any of those Pix from Canada? Not a one?? Hmmmmm.Round appreciated. Really different 'round here without our Resident Desert Swede - Eric - to kick things off in the wee hours! Reminder: Ruth has the bar from 9 AM until Leon the Night Man comes in at 5 PM ‘til closing. Thursday is Fish ‘ Chips Nite!Friday is Pizza ‘n Beer Nite! - and - Steak ‘n Fries Nite!Saturday is Steak ‘n All The Trimmings Nite!Dinner begins at 5 PM so come early ‘n often! Cindy is now our Saturday bartender! Boris, serve ‘em all of the "spiked" OJ they can handle! Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo wanswheel Member sinceNovember 2005 4,190 posts Posted by wanswheel on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 8:07 PM Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the houseDave you sound good.The television is on. What a joy to see Willie Mays! Willie and Don Mueller http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1068248.jpg?size=67&uid={d4097881-4e01-4021-b8e3-523b53492ee0}Southern Pacific 4-8-8-2 Cab Forward locomotives http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015935.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015925.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015940.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015943.jpgSurvivor 4294 is at Sacramento museumhttp://www.yesteryeardepot.com/SP4294.JPGhttp://www.railpictures.net/images/s/SP4294sacto17mar78.jpg.39177.jpgWreck of the Federal Expresshttp://pro.corbis.com/images/U1017765ACME.jpg?size=67&uid={7f32e261-1153-40f5-9384-0dbcd822426e}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215047INP.jpg?size=67&uid={12475df5-349a-4c5a-b8eb-16de8cfb210a}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1104872.jpg?size=67&uid={537e9e6b-d8e5-4c5e-8764-54efc5ff3806} http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215084INP.jpg?size=67&uid={06ce4a85-fab1-4231-a5d5-cd97c1e2cb3b}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215163INP.jpg?size=67&uid={7c001776-12a8-4f7e-bcdb-cb7ce576044b}http://pro.corbis.com/images/BE067434.jpg?size=67&uid={a01806e6-6b5c-4d3e-8ca8-900cdbf1441a} Lionel trainshttp://pro.corbis.com/images/HQ001382.jpg?size=67&uid={17a61ea5-b63c-46bc-b335-b8126a7a614e} http://pro.corbis.com/images/IH064536.jpg?size=67&uid={cfb4bc46-5eaa-4d94-8c65-5d6bb94d1b1a}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U293334ACME.jpg?size=67&uid={8e89a665-abea-486c-a750-25a4539e3dc8}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U733817INP.jpg?size=67&uid={d2523656-e4fb-499d-83bd-d75ae6353097}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U755340INP.jpg?size=67&uid={72584095-1ab5-459e-9300-418f29cc3e7e}Mike West Coast S Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Los Angeles 1,619 posts Posted by West Coast S on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 6:59 PM Where was I, oh yeh, the light just came on Round for all, no watered or cheap stuff, Boris, I am wise to that deal you got on questionable libations from Ce' Sinor's in Tijuana.Pwolf..Tragic indeed, If those engines defied the scrappers for a few more years it would be a fair bet to state they were probably scrapped when no longer needed for stationary use. I find it inconciveable that in this day and info age someone would not have rooted them out if the story rings with a grain of truth, though I have heard the mill was razed in the late sixties and all equiptment disposed of, according to legend the builder plates did survive, though no one has produced them, what is not in dispute was the mill obtained several chime whistles at a good price and these are now in the hands of collectors.. Odd, but the SP retained nothing larger then the 4-8-2 in the post 59 deadlines, perhaps not so odd when you consider these smaller engines were more verstile and cheaper to store or return to service if needed, also a great many were not too many years hence from complete rebuilds. Eleven Cab Forwards survived into 1959 before their fate was sealed...Eric, My last journey to LAUPT was the 50th anniversery in 1989, quite a shindig, with 4449, 844 in steam and the infamous F unit line up, UP E9-951, ATSF F7 trio-370 A,B,C and SP E9 6005. Of couse the highlight of the evening was the windbag mayor and his henchman who were present in a failed attempt to deflect inquisitive reporters seeking details of his latest scandal, cost me a good photo spot when his security goons ordered me to vacate...(do I hold a grudge or what?) It is truly a maganficient tribute to the classic age of railroading and is the among the last great one built. Soon it will lose its desigination as a stub end terminal, plans are afoot to extend the tracks so a balloon configuration exist, this is a major job as the terminal is pretty hemmed in, but construction is underway. Dave SP the way it was in S scale « First«78798081828384»Last » SUBSCRIBER & MEMBER LOGIN Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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Greetings fellow classic train lovers! I bring to you some new blood at this establishment created for all who enjoy the love of Classic Trains and appreciate the interaction amongst those who have similar interests. First, let me give you some brief background: I am not a novice when it comes to the Kalmbach Forums. I have participated in the past and had several of those stars. I gave it all up awhile ago for an assortment of reasons. My return is under a new cyber handle and I am essentially starting over. You may check me out in my profile, but it is rather brief. I am John Larson and preferred to be called, Lars. As you can tell by my handle, I love domes! Just loved those pix provided by siberianmo Tom and the inputs by passengerfan Al. Heaven just cannot be as good as sitting in a dome car! I have checked out this thread from pretty much the onsest of its birth and have followed each of you through the months of its existence. I also visit the thread called, "If you like Classic PASSENGER trains, visit here!" although I have not "surfaced" there, yet. Why am I here and why have I come back to the forums? I miss the interaction and quite simply would like to know that there are some people still around who enjoy mature, adult conversation, without the absolutely nonsense appearing in so many other places. I give you fair warning, Gentlemen, I detest rude people and fall very heavily into the camp of BudKarr & Tom when it comes to tolerance for the ignorant and inconsiderate. Those who exploit the good intentions of others belong at the bottom of the sea. So, Mr. Barkeep - or Captain Tom - or Proprietor, or whatever else you may prefer to be called - hit me with a Jack Daniels, black label, on the rocks and I'll plunk down a twenty for a round on me! Let's roll, Gentlemen! L Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:48 AM Posted By: barndad in General Discussion (Classic Trains)Subject: Re: "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment!__________________________________Good morning Captain Tom and all, Too early for a Gunniness, maybe a Scotch. Join me. I've included a quote from one of my E-mails that contains nomenclature I don't understand. I've hightlighted the items in BLUE. Can you explain what they mean?Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this I've got some woodworking I have to do this morning so I can't linger for long except to say:thanks for all the good will extended to me. Until later. DD1(Ron)BTW Tom, I have to comment about coming from NYC via San Francisco(30 years)and ending up in Mississippi. I came here in 1992 because of job demands. I liked what I saw and one month later, the rest of my family joined me. It's a move I don't regret. It was culture shock to say the least, but I have more here than I could ever hope to have in SF or NYC. My 8 acre homestead here cost me $129K, 5 years ago. The same thing would be in the millions in the two last places mentioned. I was indeed fortunate. I moved from Ocean Springs which is on the coast inland to Vancleave before Katrina wiped out the coast. I sustained minor damage, but the house where I had previously lived, was swept away. I guess someone up there is looking out for me. Many of the people I know now are either ex Navy or Air Force. There is Northrop Grumman Ship Systems(where I retired from), Keesler Air Force Base and Pascagoula Naval Facility. Additionally, there is a Seabee base, an Army base, Coast Guard, NOAA and not too far away, Stennis aerospace. That just about sums up for now my snail trail from the big apple to my present abode. I watch the "Sopranos" to keep in touch with my roots. Later.P.S. I hope this narrative fits into the material outline of "Our Place". I'm sure, in the future, I'll have more interesting thoughts about trains to contribute. You know what happens when you're retired and have too much free time. You tend to ramble on line and frequently get off track. If this happens, just give me a whack the side of the head. Edit JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:39 AM Sure am DL. A Swede living in Sotland. My family is like dogfood, spread all over the place, US, Canada and here in the, well, sunny UK....So, do we have Sunday popquizes? All the best! Jan DL - UK Member sinceAugust 2006 280 posts Posted by DL - UK on Thursday, July 12, 2007 9:33 AM Hello TomBeen nice and busy in our place the last day or so!I'll have a full breakfast - here at the bar - will make a change from last weeks 125 mph breakfast I guess. In fact on Eurostar trains you can dine at 185 mph if you travel First Class - but the food is not proper chef prepared - it is very much the same deal as the Renaissance dining car cooking technology - which as we both agree - does not match the 1st class fare! It is supposed to be acceptable however. TGV trains in France are not equipped with proper dining cars as I understand it (only buffet counter service) - but the ICE in Germany is advertised as having a proper Restaurant Car - I'm not sure if that is with proper chefs or not.Off topic but I agree about your comment on the size of churches in Quebec - I noticed this as soon as I got out of Montréal on the Quebec Train and saw small communities with massive churches - I think the church was very powerful in Quebec society for many years - and the British government tolerated this ‘alternative power base' because of the work the church did in welfare provision etc. Just going back to your comment about that Santa Fe trip you took as a child - so what you are saying is you had a private room, spent plenty of time in the Dome etc, got (demanded?) good service from the crew - well - anyone who has read any of your recent trip reports will know you started as you meant to go on!Per - I found the analysis of the LA UPT timetables very interesting - it gives some idea of the scale of long distance services and the sheer reduction in number of that form of transit from today. In Europe of course the numbers of long distance services would have increased in many areas (but the system is all government subsidised of course). In many ways the US is lucky to have the Amtrak service that it does.Eric - Black Pudding - I think it is similar to blood pudding you mentioned recently! Dave - it was interesting to read your comments on the Cab Forwards - and great to have Mike's pics so I could get a feel for what they looked like. Reminds me a loco type Pete will be aware of - the strange SR (UK that is) experimental Leader Class steam loco:See this link with pics and infohttp://www.semg.org.uk/steam/leader_01.htmlYou might find this of interest - if a little strange!Allan - interested to read your further comments about NZ rail - we need a 40 mile trucking limit here IMHO! I recall hearing that NZ rail then had real difficulties due to being exposed to the level of competition without he government support for protecting the levels for service. Is that the correct interpretation?Pete - yes Birmingham - Liverpool rtn for 10 pounds is indeed available - check this link which you can send to your pals:http://www.centraltrains.co.uk/templates/over50TrainRoutes.aspx?id=2274Select ‘Birmingham New Street' in the drop down box that appears and the destinations will appear - you then have to print off a voucher which you fill in and take to the ticket office when you buy your ticket - I presume you need some proof of age as you have to be over 50 (so no good for me, being more than 10 years off that!)Incidentally - there have been some big franchise changes on the network here with Virgin losing cross country this week and National Express losing Central Trains and Midland Main Line a few weeks before. I'm not sure what we will get instead will be mush better.Brake vans on nuclear flask trains - I'm not sure if they are still in use on nuclear flask trains - they may be - interesting question to which I don't know the answer.I see the steam magazines are commemorating the end of 40 years steam on SR this month, which you mentioned in your post. Welcome to DD1 - I enjoyed your post. This talk of Naval architecture reminds me to mention the news that was around a few weeks back that the Cunard QE2 was due to retire to some strange place in Saudi Arabia - very much a shame I thought. I think the ship is doing a return journey to the Clyde later this year - where it was built, I might try and go and see the ship in port. And indeed welcome Jan - we now have English, Welsh and Scottish participation if you are Glasgow based!Doug - called in too - but still no jokes? Interesting programme of events the 20th CC RR group has - I've checked their website in the past when researching a trip to Chicago - before I found this bar I should add - where people who know the answers to many questions drop in from time to time!DL JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 8:39 AM Jan will do just fine. Not much happening here in Glasgow as far as I know, trainwise anyway. May I raise a toast for many more happy months to come here at our place..... All the best! Jan siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Thursday, July 12, 2007 7:56 AM <w/permission: http://www.scenic-railroads.com/> Today is the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place!An adult eating ‘n drinking establishment for the discussion of Classic Trains ‘n stuff! <opened 12 April 2005>"Our" Place interior Mentor Village Chorale 'n Philharmonic background singers! Manager Lars' Bar in the Penthouse Suite G'day Gents! So what kind of a day will this be Just another Thursday OR something special Guess time will tell, eh Coffee's hot - pastries fresh and our <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts are ready for eatin' - so let's get it on! Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):Lars at 9:05 AM Wednesday - July 11th: Many thanx for picking up the slack during the morning - I wasn't particularly enthralled with checking the bar just to ‘see' what was going on, so your Post came at the right time! As always, your selections of book ‘n video covers really liven up things ‘round here. Unfortunately, we just aren't generating conversations - simply accolades. Guess "we takes what we gets," eh I watched the All Star baseball game, as previously mentioned ‘n thought it was an "okay" game for what it was. Those "spoiled" Prima Donnas coming out on a red carpet did very little for me, though! Rather not delve into the unhappy on our Anniversary Day - so let's just say that some déjà vu has crept into a few Posts ‘n contributors of late. Let's remember to be INCLUSIVE ‘n pay attention to the works ‘n efforts of others. Thought that's what the majority of us want ‘n are trying to maintain! Round appreciated! DD1 at 11:38 AM Wednesday- July 11th: A fine initial Post from the man who call's himself DD1. Some interesting material ‘n it's great to have a Mississippi Connection on board. Hopefully you'll make it permanent and we can add you to our Customer List! I like the origin of your "handle," truly unique in the Classic Trains sense! I'm in the "class of 1938," so we're not that far apart. Also a New Yawker and have vivid memories of my grandpa taking me to Grand Central Terminal along with Penn Station back when those palaces were "alive" with some fantastic trains. Stories ‘n references to those times have been repeated many times on this Thread and on our "original" Thread. Just some great, warm ‘n special memories, fer sure, fer sure! With over 30 years on the west coast, I'd say you're a "natural" for conversation with one of our guys who goes by the handle of West Coast S - Dave. He's into S-gauge, or at least was, and is very knowledgeable of all things Southern Pacific. Hope he catches this Post . . . My guess is that rural Mississippi must be a huge change of pace from city life - anywhere. I know settling in this part of the continent (St. Louis area) was an eye-opener for me, having spent the majority of my adult life smelling salt air. CHANGE is all around ‘n not always bad. But I do miss the salt air . . . Your reference to the Sacramento Rail Museum will open the eyes of one of our guys - Wolfman Pete - our Bar Chandler. While I cannot speak with authority regarding which rail museum is better than another, I will say this - the Expo Rail Canadian Railway Museum in Saint Constant, Quebec surely has to be ranked "up there" with the finest too. As with baseball and sports figures from the past - really hard to rank anyone of ‘em Number One. Should simply put ‘em into groups. Sounds like you had a very interesting ‘n challenging career. Funny you should mention naval architecture. Way back when, I was "guaranteed" an "A-school" of my choice upon enlisting in the USCG. So, when the time came ‘round in the 12th or 13th week of boot camp for those things to be attended to, I requested naval architecture. They sent me to radioman school! Why? Because I "aced" the Morse code test - having learned it as a Boy Scout! <geesh> I had limited studies in architecture courses and thought that would be a great field to get into. Oh well, things worked out the way things usually work out. I made it to Chief Petty Officer- then Warrant - then began all over again by going through OCS to be a "line officer" at the "tender age" of 32 . . . retiring with 32 years of active duty. Still wonder what kind of life I wudda had IF . . . <grin>Thanx again for your interesting ‘n insightful Post and we hope to see ya ‘round here again ‘n again! Pete at 5:47 PM W Happy Railroading! Siberianmo marthastrainyard Member sinceMarch 2006 From: Orange County, CA 98 posts Posted by marthastrainyard on Thursday, July 12, 2007 7:38 AM Good Morning everybody present and Happy Anniversary! Ruth, I am so sorry about the mix-up the other day. I really need to clean my glasses more often, don't I? Let me have a Tequila, make it a Reserva de Familia in honor of this day (not that Tijuana stuff Dave was talking about).I followed Tom's advice and went back a couple of pages to see what y'all had been up to while I was gone. I start with Tom, our Captain and the busiest poster of all. It was a really great collection of Canadian pictures. The interior shot from the vintage sleeper reminds me of a privately owned heavyweight that was on display at the Fullerton Railroad Days this year. The owner had built a sleeping compartment for his own use that looked just about the one in your picture. Of course my daughter had to ask why we couldn't have a room like that on our trip from Chicago! A very interesting picture of the GG1 it in the waiting room in Washington; somehow I don't think that was the intention with that room. Sturdy construction of the engine, though. I wish we could say the same for the floor.Thank you for the link to the Flexliner pictures. The first picture I looked at was from Fullerton. Interesting! And I missed all of that when it was there, too bad. Looking at those pictures it was like seeing the "Kustpilen" all over again. That's the similar train that runs through my home town in Sweden. Although the first class compartment isn't as fancy as that in the pictures. But as the accompanying article stated: The manufacturer added all the bells and whistles on this demo train.Yes, the LAUPT has seen a lot of changes over the year. My wife told me her Dad had to hold her with a firm hand so she didn't get separated in the tunnel and her little sister had to be carried. The tunnel was so packed with people that it would have been too easy for a child to be separated and lost. I finally got the train data up on my site: http://home.att.net/~pers_home/trains/cola/LAUPT.htm It was a very interesting post about the Milwaukee and its passenger trains. I have always liked the observation car on the Hiawatha with those windows all over the tail end. I hadn't seen any of the drumheads before, but some of those are real classic. Such a nice design.Pete, thanks for the welcome back greeting. There was (and maybe still is) a place in Sweden where most steam engines went for scrapping, Vislanda in the southern part of the country. I remember seeing some steamers when I rode the train through there, but I never had a chance to go there and try to get a look (and pictures). That would have been something to have these days when most of the steamers are gone.Eric, I hope you are feeling well, try to get some sleep and enough of this 1AM postings for a while, right? Thank you as well for the welcome back greeting. I saw a couple of your pictures and the turntable that's now at OERM caught my eye. That looks like it is one of the SP turntables from Owens Valley. The one in Laws is still there, so who knows where this came from? It looks like it is time for a new visit to OERM; it seems to have changed a LOT since I was there last. I feel sympathy for you in your heat wave, but as you have pointed out, it's a dry heat. I wish somebody would tell that to the turkey on Thanksgiving. And when you had your 113 I heard the forecast for Death Valley was 135! No wonder they close the place up in the summer.Thank you for the picture of LAUPT. I believe it has been recently renovated and it is sure a very nice building. I liked the link to the NASA site with the article about the ICE crash. Looking at those pictures it amazes me that anybody survived the crash. Trains have a better survivability than planes, that's fer sure.Do you have any idea if the service hours for a train engineer will be shortened? 432 per month is an awful lot.I wonder what UP used to make that MoW Dining Car. Was it a very big box car, or did they put a couple of the together. I know Southern had a "Hogshead" car (so called because it could hold 100 hogsheads of tobacco). That car was 92 feet long. Check it out here: http://southern.railfan.net/ties/1962/62-6/hog.htmland with some pictures here: http://southern.railfan.net/images/archive/southern/freight/tob/tob.htmlI think I remember seeing that you were looking for an SP video. Pentrex has two new ones right now, the cab forward and the beet train. Take a look at their web site.Lars, it was quite a Swedish menu you cooked up. I think I pass the palt (had too much of that in school) and the rotten herring (I still refuse to call it "fermented"), that's all bad smell and no taste, but for the rest I can come back for seconds. So I finally I got an explanation to the "eh" in Canadian English. And I always thought it was a way to spell Canada: C -eh- N -eh- D -eh-. And thanks for the hints on how to handle the flood of posts after a long absence; I've tried to follow that here.James, it was a really interesting web site about the Stockwood fill. What a story!Thank you, Pwolfe, for the pictures of the British steamers. That Lord Nelson sure is a nice looking loco! It's kind of strange how my appreciation for British steam engines has grown over the years; in my teens I didn't care for them at all, I felt they had the "wrong proportions" but now I find some of them being the most beautiful engines ever built.It seems like Dave and I may have seen each other once before. I was also at the LAUPT for that 50th anniversary, but so were a couple of thousand other people so we passed each other as ships in the night (isn't that what they say?). It was before the digital camera age so my pictures (and videos) are hidden somewhere. I went to the Cajon pass Home of the Ambroid history page and the up-and-coming City Of Los Angeles from 1950 http://www.trainweb.org/ambroidkits/ My pictures are here http://www.flickr.com/photos/8514678@N08/ Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, July 12, 2007 5:32 AM Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! Congratulations to Captain Tom and all who contribute to keep this great thread rolling. I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this individual was apprehended, or de-train. Fortunately for all, the individual was quickly caught, and our delay was only minutes. I was impressed that the Conductor, more than once referred to this individual as a "poor soul, who needed help."On another subject, I've put together a "little" story called Fire in Tunnel 9" for later in the day, but for now, here is an interesting poem called the REDBALL FREIGHT by H.L. KelsoThe JUDGE peered sharp at the man on trial,A hobo, old and gray;He sized him up from head to toe,Then bade him have his say,"Was passing through," the ‘bo spoke out,"On yonder streak of rust.This cinder dick who hauled me hereKnows naught of wanderlust."I had a job like yours and his‘Way back along the trail,Arresting tramps and thieves and suchAnd sending them to jail.And then one night from in the skyI heard the honking geese.They seemed to say, "Come follow usAnd you will find your peace.""A long long freight was leaving town;Her whistle sounded grand;And since that night I've plied the railsAcross our pretty land.Now, judge, a redball's making upAnd in my heart a song,And when she leaves this town of yoursI'd like to be along.""This case dismissed," the judge then said,"And court's adjourned this date.Now, hobo, you just lead the way,We'll nail that redball freight!"Have a great day guys. I am off to work! Edit JanOlov Member sinceDecember 2001 From: GB 376 posts Posted by JanOlov on Thursday, July 12, 2007 2:38 AM Good morning fellow train connoisseurs... May I join you? Could I have an extra cold Guinness please and top up whatever everybody else is drinking and something for you bartender....Only the second visit here, so I buy this and the next round.. All the best! Jan EricX2000 Member sinceDecember 2002 From: Phoenix, AZ 683 posts Posted by EricX2000 on Thursday, July 12, 2007 1:04 AM Good morning Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!Leon, old friend, just a cup of coffee! I have to leave in a few minutes!Just stopped by to wish a Happy 27th Anniversary!!! At the same time I want to say to DD1!! I am following my doctor's advice to get some extra sleep (due to some symptoms) so I am afraid I won't be back until Saturday with an inclusive post. It will be nice when I can go back to normal routines again. I think I have showed this one before, but where was it taken? See you soon!Eric Gunneral Member sinceSeptember 2002 From: NZ 242 posts Posted by Gunneral on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 9:43 PM Hi Tom and all, HAPPY 27th TO ALL!Leon set em up up all round, mines a Tui.Tom. Your Milwaukee Road coverage was 1st class, nostalgia is great food for the mind!Dave. You were correct about the NZ loco`s being used as "rip rap" , a huge number of engines were dumped in river stopbanks to help in flood protection, most of the Roger`s 2-4-2`s were found in the Oreti river stopbanks near Invercargill, NZ`s southernmost city.Eric. NZ railways used to operate long distance bus services as well, AKA "NZ Railways Road Services", they used to build their own bus bodies so this came in handy when they built the railcars. NZ railways was very protected up until the 1980`s, their was a 40 mile radius trucking restriction on freight delivery by road, so any mileage over that had to go via railPete. Rail in NZ was first started by each Provincial Council and was a real "Hotch Potch" of different gauges and equipment, their was even a "wooden rail" line from Invercargill to Makarewa at one stage. All this was standerdised by Julius Vogel the NZ Government Engineer of the day, he stipulated 3ft 6in gauge as the NZ standard. A lot of NZ loco`s were supplied by Badwin, Roger`s etc. because it was easier and cheaper to ship them over the Pacific from the West coast of the USA. The Otago Provincial Council were very much Double Fairlie minded because they did`nt need turntables to turn them around, a big cost saving as this province was settled by the canny Scots! The Wellington/Manawatu railway was virtually a mini RGS with it`s Baldwin loco`s and US style passenger coaches and freight cars, as well as all the UK loco`s and equipment from the other provinces.DL. You are so right about the taste of Vegemite and Marmite being an acquired one, as they say "one man`s meat is another man`s poison. Glad you liked the railcar site.DD1. Welcome to the fold. I am a "greenhorn" who has been made very welcome to this gathering of minds since I joined in.Lars. Your entries are great reading and I have done a lot of reasearch on your pointers.See ya all, Allan pwolfe Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: mid mo 1,054 posts Posted by pwolfe on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 5:47 PM Hi Tom and all. A pint of Bathams please RUTH.DAVE Yes it does sound as though if those locomotives were at that mill they no longer exist today. It is strange that no works plates have turned up, I wonder what price those chime whistles fetch if they change hands. Some of the nameplates off the steam locos in Britain, when they are auctioned today, cost more than what it cost to build the locomotive when it was built in the 1920s or 30s.Are there any Cab-forwards in museums today beside # 4294 shown in Dave's link. I don't blame you feeling like that about that mayor.MIKE Thanks for the links. It must have sounded great to be in the first car with a cab-forward working a passenger service.The cars in the Federal Express look to be made of very strong construction.Good photos of the prototypes and the youngsters are certainly enjoying the model versions.LARS Thanks for inviting DD1 to call in at the bar I am looking forward to some navy tales between DD1, TOM and yourself.Great set of Great Northern book and DVD covers. The electric and steam in color looks a great book.DD1 I do hope you will join us at Our Place, Tom gets the Guinness from Dublin.Another person who saw steam in regular use on the main line. I am from England but in the US now, although now in my mid 50s, I remember steam in everyday use as steam lasted a lot longer there on the main line(1968). In fact last weekend was the 40th anniversary of the end of regular everyday steam into a London Terminus (Waterloo).Thanks for the description of the Chilean trip. It must have been quite a sight to see those DD1s at speed; there could not have been many other electric locomotives with wheels as large as 72 inches.TOM That could be an opening for a business, fixing a permanent ladder to gas station price signs, the way the price seems to change almost daily.The vote was passed in KC for a light rail system and there are a lot of letters in the paper in favor of it but they are still arguing about the cost etc so whether it ever does get built we shall have to see, as you say the initial cost is huge.Many thanks for the Milwaukee Road Fallen Flag Encore. I see that they still had 588 passenger cars in 1963. If I ever can go back to the National Railroad Museum In Green Bay WIS I will have a much greater appreciation of the great Drumhead collection they have there.Good words for DD1.Great photos from the gallery at Exporail. I don't think I was very clear about the engine I asked you about (what is new says Tom), it was the engine in the rotary snow plow,it is in the 4th photo in today's photos, you can see the open engine covers on the plow and the engine when you enlarge the photo. Enjoying the ‘Twenty Dollar Bill spot the 10 changes', got 8 so far, will have to back and find the other two.An old car window at Green Bay.Well LEON another beer and a round please, I think Lars as fed the mascots their treatsPete. siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 3:10 PM G'day Gents!Thanx to our Manager, Lars for helping out this morning! Took a bit of the "strain" off the line for Moi! Also, a to DD1 - see separate SPECIAL Post . . . . More specifics to the both of you in tomorrow's acknowledgments . . . For Pete: Email received ‘n responded to - thanx! By the by, I misunderstood your question - NO, I do NOT have a foto of that loco in question . . . don't recall even walking back that way. Probably looking for YOU! <grin> Continuing on with Pix from Day Four: Sunday - May 27th, 2007 - ExpoRail Canadian Railway Museum at Delson/Saint-Constant, Quebec, CanadaFrom the balcony - Inside Building #1 (cont'd) <all previously identified> Can you?The balcony To be continued . . . Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts Welcome Aboard! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 12:36 PM SPECIAL for DD1 Aboard! Happy to see you made it over to the best cyber bar 'n grill this side of the Ether. And of course we have ALL major brews on Earth, right here! Sorry, but we shy away from micro-breweries as they are much to hard to ship 'n most difficult to keep in stock. <grin>Last things first: Not quite sure I understand what the problem might be regarding the scrolling reference to get to this Thread.Some basics: From the trains.com Forums main page - locate the Classic Trains (General Discussion) topic and click on it. Next - click on the General Discussion (Classic Trains) topic - then find "Our" Place and click on the LAST PAGE shown. That should bring you to the top of whatever Page # is shown. An alternative is to click on the little box shown after the cyber handle of the person who has last Posted here - that will bring you directly to that Post.Now - some "things" you may want to know about us:We are an inclusive place, quite unlike others found on sites like these. We try to acknowledge one another 'n engage in conversation.Highly recommend you go to Page One of this Thread and check out the "precepts" within the first Post (mine). Then read through that Page to get the "gist" of things.Then come back here to the final few Pages 'n familiarize yourself with what's going on. The best way to join us is to join in, however, it's far easier when you're up to speed <to to speak>!At this time we're experiencing some lulls in activity what with summer vacations and the like . . . so the Posts aren't as fast 'n furious as in the past. That's GOOD for trying to catch up . . . Really enjoyed your Posts here 'n over on "my other Thread." The latter was designed pretty much as a "feeder" for this place. It's been a long haul . . . .The information you've provided us tells quite a story - thanx! You'll be a bit suprised that there are three guys with New York ties - one on Staten Island - one on Long Island and Moi, a long-time ex-pat of NYC - Moi - (also Staten island) currently residing in the St. Louis area <haven't lived in NYC for over 40 years). Don't know the age of the LI guy <Mike> but Lars (Staten Island) and yours truly aren't that far from 70 in years. Lars comes from B&O "stock" - with grandfather 'n father as careerists. Lars is a retired "Merchie." I'm a retiree from the USCG (32 years active). Our Long Island Connection has "deep" ties to family railroading in the east, too.We are an international "lot" in that some of our crew are from places as far away as New Zealand, as close as Canada, and also Europe (Sweden, England & Wales). In time you'll easily figure out 'who's who' here at the bar and my bet is that you'll find yourself right at home amidst 'n amongst those with similar likes! First drink is on the house, which will be YOURS upon your next visit! We do have one set of "rules" that are absolutes! One must greet the barkeep upon entering 'n order a drink (or food or both!) You may note that in addition to cyber handles, we also use "names" or "initials" - just to make it a bit more like a bar 'n grill. Your choice - but fair warning - we assign names from time to time! <grin> Again, glad to have you 'n our hope is that you'll find this place AND our cast of characters <real & imagined> of interest! We've never had a Mississippi Connection here at the bar 'n I hope you'll be the first! By the by - we are "celebrating" the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place tomorrow - as we started "business" back on April 12th, 2005! C'mon in and join us! Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 12:01 PM The Passenger Railroad Fallen Flags of "Our" Place #16 The Milwaukee Road<A form of this was initially Posted on Page 128 of the Original Thread> Here's another Fallen Flag for the gang from Classic American Railroads:Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul & Pacific (CM&StPP) - The Milwaukee RoadCaveat: The information provided is NOT all inclusive and is reflective only of the periods mentioned. Headquarters: Chicago, IL Mileage: 1950: 10,664 Locomotives in 1963: Diesel: 803 Electric: 93 Rolling stock in 1963: Freight cars: 42.325 Passenger: 588 Principal routes in 1950: (not all)Chicago-Minneapolis via Milwaukee and Columbus, WI New Lisbon-Woodruff, WI Minneapolis-Seattle & Tacoma via Spokane, WA Minneapolis & St. Paul-Calmar, IA via Austin, MN La Crescent, MN-Wessington Springs, SD Rondout, IL (Chicago)-Madison, WI Watertown, WI-Rapid City, SD Chicago-Omaha Manilla, IA-Sioux Falls, SD Marion-Ottumwa, IA Sturtevant, WI-Kansas City La Crosse, WI-Sabula, IA Des Moines-Spencer, IA Chicago-Terre Haute, IN Milwaukee-Ontonagon, MI via Green Bay, WI Passenger Trains of note: (not all)Afternoon Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Arrow (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Chippewa-Hiawatha (Chicago-Channing, MI) Copper Country Limited (Chicago-Green Bay-Calumet, MI jointly with DSS&A railroad) Midwest Hiawatha (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Morning Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-Minneapolis) Olympian (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle & Tacoma) Olympian Hiawatha (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle U& Tacoma; replaced Olympian) Pioneer Limited (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Sioux (Chicago-Madison-Rapid City, SD) Southwest Limited (Milwaukee & Chicago-Kansas City Tomahawk (Chicago-Minocqua, WI) Varsity (Chicago-Madison) Of note: From 1955-1971, Milwaukee Road operated the Chicago-Omaha segment of UP's "Overland" streamliners including the City of Denver, City of Portland, City of Los Angeles, City of San Francisco and the Challenger. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *Some drum heads of the Milwaukee Road Happy Railroading! Siberianmo Anonymous Member sinceApril 2003 305,205 posts Update on Chile rail trip by DD1 Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 11:38 AM The original post by DD1: "The year was 1969 and as we were pulling out of the railroad station in Santiago, Chile, the song "take the last train from Clarksville" by the Monkees was blareing from the platform PA system. We were headed south toward Concepcion on an overnight trip aboard a vintage passenger train pulled by an old Baldwin 4-6-0(I think). The passenger cars were old German built cars with lots of wood work. I made the mistake of sticking my head out the window and getting coal cinders in my eye. The train, by the way was in regular service, not rail fan. I have been back there since in 2002 and the train is no longer in service. They do have a very nice railroad museum there in Santiago and that's where I suspect the old engine ended up, I hope. Food service on the train was very good and served meats, fish and poultry cooked over charcoal. At night, the porter would pull down the berths. Of course much of the great Chilean wines were consummed during our trip. I can recall overnight trips on the NYC way back when the 20th century limited hauled by a Hudson would gently rock me to sleep. Those days are gone forever and never to be repeated. I'm fortunate to have been able to experience them. Diesels and railfan trips are no way close to the real thing. I'm 72 and lucky to have come on the scene before it all disappeared for ever."Tom and Lars, I hope you have Guinness draught on tap. I thank you for your invite to this forum. I wanted to update the above post while still fresh in my mind.The passenger equipment as I stated was German. I estimate there were built between WWI and WWII and were sold to Chile as the German railways system modernized. The track we were running on was metre gauge.I was only about 7 years of age when I rode the 20th century limited with my mother on a vacation trip. That's about all I can recall about that.You may wonder about my handle "DD1". I was fascinated with the DD1 box cab electrics that ran on the LIRR and Pennsylvania. I can still remember the smell of ozone and the snap of the contactors as the DD1's made their way into Penn Station. As a kid, I would stand alongside the LIRR tracks and watch the DD1 coming down the track, rocking from side to side at 60 mph. With those 72" drivers, they could run 80 mph. They were tough on the rails due to the pounding nature of the drive system, but they proved to be most economical when it came to maintenance.Living in and being raised in New York City, gave me opportunity to see train operations all around me. I could go to Penn Station, Grand Central or take a subway ride to the Lackawanna Terminal in Hoboken, N.J. There, I could see the Delaware and Lackawanna, Reading, Jersey Central and maybe a few others. I rode behind camelbacks on the Reading. As you may have noticed, I am a railroad nut and have been for the past 65 years. I was fortunate to be born at this time to be able to wittness railroading in it's glory days, at least on the East coast. I wish I could have seen the Challengers on the UP out west, but did see them when they resided later on in a museum.In 1964, I drove from the East coast to the West coast and stayed there for over 30 years before finally settling down in rural Mississippi. When arriving in Seattle, I saw the Great Northern Bi-polars in operation. I guess I made the transition from steam to electric during those early years. The silence and power of those huge engines was overwhelming to me. I have seen articulates under steam during the opening celebration of the Sacramento Railroad Museum, a museum 2nd to none IMHO. I always make it a point to visit a RR museum whenever I'm traveling in an area that may have one. I've visited RR museums in Tokyo, Santiago, Sacramento and a few small private tour lines.BTW, you asked if I was in the Navy. No; not as a serviceman, but as a naval architect. That was my profession for 50 years. During those years, I traveled all over the world involved in design and repair of navy ships, from the smallest navy tug to the largest carrier or battleship. I also had a lot to do with nuclear powered submarines and surface vessels. I was always in close contact with navy personnel and their ships, but not as a crew member. I had the best of both worlds. A civilian and officer treatment.One last thing. How do I get to this "our house" directly, without a lot of scrolling? Edit LoveDomes Member sinceJanuary 2006 From: northeast U.S. 1,225 posts Posted by LoveDomes on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 9:05 AM Ahoy Cap'n Tom ‘n fellow travelers at the bar!Ruth my deAH, set ‘em with all of the "jolts" they can handle in their OJ! I'm a bit early this day, but trying to take advantage of the time I've got . . . You're lookin' mighty fine little lady ‘n the old Larsman knows he's still alive when looking at you! <blush> A mugga joe with a BK splash will do me just fine, thank you! <grin>Tom, I'll drop off an "invite" to the visitor over on your other thread on my way back home . . . good idea! Boris, what's this I hear about a rabies shot?!?!? Thought we took care of that right after you got into it with Tex . . . my, my how time flies! <grin> Good to see ya Dave, even if you haven't seen me! Did watch the all star game last night ‘n was surprised at how the NL just couldn't get a run across the plate when needed. It isn't as if they didn't have chances. Thought it was a pretty good contest, except for the 9th inning for both sides. Surely don't like this idea of determining the home game advantage as a result of who wins an exhibition game. Good Grief Charlie Brown! That idea, along with most from the "Commish" belong in the round file. Wonderful continuing display of photos from your trip to Canada ‘n Expo Rail. I'm sounding like a broken record, but those shots are really fine! Another 5- Salute to our Cap'n for taking the time to put these on-line for those who care and of course those who could care less! Picked up on that comment you made to Per regarding having something to say for each ‘n every post at the bar. Doing something like that could surely ruin one's day if coming back from a prolonged absence. I know some guys really are good about inclusiveness ‘n make a point to say something in reference to each guy. That's kinda like what I try to do - rather than pick up on specifics for every post - just make mention of the guys who have been putting out the "good stuff," holding specifics for something really out of the ordinary - like what our Mentor does for us!No expanded comment regarding the "ignorance factor" that still exists ‘round here insofar as recognizing the works of others. Here's a few more book ‘n video covers from the Great Northern for your enjoyment!Until the next time! Lars siberianmo Member sinceFebruary 2004 From: Chesterfield, Missouri, USA 7,214 posts "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment! Posted by siberianmo on Wednesday, July 11, 2007 8:10 AM <w/permission: http://www.scenic-railroads.com/> Wednesday's WitticismNerves is just which end of a six-gun you happen to be looking at. G'day Gents! Mid-week in mid-continent USA where petrol is on the rise! Was at $2.90 (rounded) yesterday afternoon. However, there was a ladder up against the price sign, so ya know those numbers have changed. Was $2.72 just the day before! Coffee's ready - pastries fresh - ‘n breakfasts are ready for fixin'! C'mon . . . Noticed we had a "visitor" over on "my other Thread" - suggest those of you who give a Rat's Patoot, check it out ‘n invite the guy to stop by the bar! OBSERVATION: Still seeing "that" reluctance to use the RELOAD/REFRESH feature on the browser. It's the ONLY way to ensure that the MOST CURRENT POSTS get displayed. Given that we don't see many of the guys on a regular basis, it's most important to "get it right" the first time. Think about it! Customer ACKNOWLEDGMENTS (since my last narrative):Dave at 3:56 PM ‘n 6:59 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Great to see our Left Coast Connection ‘n Super Sleuth Man of Mystery about the decks during the week! Boris was in need of that rabies shot - good thinking! <grin>Didn't see any reference to the ExpoRail Pix since your last visit, so I'm guessing you didn't see em. <groan>Yes, I do recall the original Auto Train and it would be a treat if someone were to do a piece on it. Still NOT answering Emails, I note! <grin>Rounds appreciated - as always! Pete at 4:52 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Presume the trip to the dentist went well . . . also, 2nd mention: Email sent to you Monday . . .Juneau is a nervous wreck at this time of year with the fireworks but not thunderstorms. Firecrackers really bother him. He's okay in the house, but once outside - bad news. It's only the "direct hit" thunderboomers that make him "scurry" - but then, so do I! <uh oh>One airport in Miami proper worth a mention. Tri-Rail serves the airport, whereas it appears one has to transfer from Metrorail at the Tri-Rail station in order to get to the airport. I don't really know, as I've never traveled aboard either . . . KCity had several chances to vote "in" a light-rail system but didn't. Costs don't decrease and taxpayers are more reluctant these days to relent to more taxation. So, unless ‘n until there's a remarkable turnabout in KCity's economic health, I doubt we'll see that train to ‘n from the airport. Makes good sense, but . . . The Santa Fe train I traveled aboard was powered by at least two diesels that I can recall. Of course in that great war bonnet livery. But I can't remember any details and have asked for help on this a few times on this ‘n the original Thread - with no luck. I know the train had domes, because I sat in at least one. I had a roomette to myself and spent quite a bit of time in the observation car - waited on hand ‘n foot by the very attentive crew. Probably was the Super Chief, but again, I have nothing to back that up with. It was 1947 and I was 9 - say no more, eh Thanx for the visit ‘n round! Mike at 8:07 PM Tuesday - July 10th: URLs what else More real than Lionel, however all good! All Star pre-game ‘n game wasn't bad at all. Last time I saw Willie "for real" he was playing an exhibition game with the Mets against the Tidewater Tides in Norfolk, VA. He hit a homer and simply ran out of the park after touching home plate . . . The greateast! Don Mueller - a journeyman right fielder who "done good" at times for the Jints of New Yawk. <grin>No comments on any of those Pix from Canada? Not a one?? Hmmmmm.Round appreciated. Really different 'round here without our Resident Desert Swede - Eric - to kick things off in the wee hours! Reminder: Ruth has the bar from 9 AM until Leon the Night Man comes in at 5 PM ‘til closing. Thursday is Fish ‘ Chips Nite!Friday is Pizza ‘n Beer Nite! - and - Steak ‘n Fries Nite!Saturday is Steak ‘n All The Trimmings Nite!Dinner begins at 5 PM so come early ‘n often! Cindy is now our Saturday bartender! Boris, serve ‘em all of the "spiked" OJ they can handle! Tom Happy Railroading! Siberianmo wanswheel Member sinceNovember 2005 4,190 posts Posted by wanswheel on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 8:07 PM Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the houseDave you sound good.The television is on. What a joy to see Willie Mays! Willie and Don Mueller http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1068248.jpg?size=67&uid={d4097881-4e01-4021-b8e3-523b53492ee0}Southern Pacific 4-8-8-2 Cab Forward locomotives http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015935.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015925.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015940.jpghttp://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015943.jpgSurvivor 4294 is at Sacramento museumhttp://www.yesteryeardepot.com/SP4294.JPGhttp://www.railpictures.net/images/s/SP4294sacto17mar78.jpg.39177.jpgWreck of the Federal Expresshttp://pro.corbis.com/images/U1017765ACME.jpg?size=67&uid={7f32e261-1153-40f5-9384-0dbcd822426e}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215047INP.jpg?size=67&uid={12475df5-349a-4c5a-b8eb-16de8cfb210a}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1104872.jpg?size=67&uid={537e9e6b-d8e5-4c5e-8764-54efc5ff3806} http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215084INP.jpg?size=67&uid={06ce4a85-fab1-4231-a5d5-cd97c1e2cb3b}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215163INP.jpg?size=67&uid={7c001776-12a8-4f7e-bcdb-cb7ce576044b}http://pro.corbis.com/images/BE067434.jpg?size=67&uid={a01806e6-6b5c-4d3e-8ca8-900cdbf1441a} Lionel trainshttp://pro.corbis.com/images/HQ001382.jpg?size=67&uid={17a61ea5-b63c-46bc-b335-b8126a7a614e} http://pro.corbis.com/images/IH064536.jpg?size=67&uid={cfb4bc46-5eaa-4d94-8c65-5d6bb94d1b1a}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U293334ACME.jpg?size=67&uid={8e89a665-abea-486c-a750-25a4539e3dc8}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U733817INP.jpg?size=67&uid={d2523656-e4fb-499d-83bd-d75ae6353097}http://pro.corbis.com/images/U755340INP.jpg?size=67&uid={72584095-1ab5-459e-9300-418f29cc3e7e}Mike West Coast S Member sinceFebruary 2005 From: Los Angeles 1,619 posts Posted by West Coast S on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 6:59 PM Where was I, oh yeh, the light just came on Round for all, no watered or cheap stuff, Boris, I am wise to that deal you got on questionable libations from Ce' Sinor's in Tijuana.Pwolf..Tragic indeed, If those engines defied the scrappers for a few more years it would be a fair bet to state they were probably scrapped when no longer needed for stationary use. I find it inconciveable that in this day and info age someone would not have rooted them out if the story rings with a grain of truth, though I have heard the mill was razed in the late sixties and all equiptment disposed of, according to legend the builder plates did survive, though no one has produced them, what is not in dispute was the mill obtained several chime whistles at a good price and these are now in the hands of collectors.. Odd, but the SP retained nothing larger then the 4-8-2 in the post 59 deadlines, perhaps not so odd when you consider these smaller engines were more verstile and cheaper to store or return to service if needed, also a great many were not too many years hence from complete rebuilds. Eleven Cab Forwards survived into 1959 before their fate was sealed...Eric, My last journey to LAUPT was the 50th anniversery in 1989, quite a shindig, with 4449, 844 in steam and the infamous F unit line up, UP E9-951, ATSF F7 trio-370 A,B,C and SP E9 6005. Of couse the highlight of the evening was the windbag mayor and his henchman who were present in a failed attempt to deflect inquisitive reporters seeking details of his latest scandal, cost me a good photo spot when his security goons ordered me to vacate...(do I hold a grudge or what?) It is truly a maganficient tribute to the classic age of railroading and is the among the last great one built. Soon it will lose its desigination as a stub end terminal, plans are afoot to extend the tracks so a balloon configuration exist, this is a major job as the terminal is pretty hemmed in, but construction is underway. Dave SP the way it was in S scale « First«78798081828384»Last » SUBSCRIBER & MEMBER LOGIN Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more! 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Posted By: barndad in General Discussion (Classic Trains)Subject: Re: "Our" Place reborn! 3rd Year of adults 'n REAL Classic Trains in a special environment!__________________________________Good morning Captain Tom and all, Too early for a Gunniness, maybe a Scotch. Join me. I've included a quote from one of my E-mails that contains nomenclature I don't understand. I've hightlighted the items in BLUE. Can you explain what they mean?Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this
I've got some woodworking I have to do this morning so I can't linger for long except to say:thanks for all the good will extended to me. Until later. DD1(Ron)
BTW Tom, I have to comment about coming from NYC via San Francisco(30 years)and ending up in Mississippi. I came here in 1992 because of job demands. I liked what I saw and one month later, the rest of my family joined me. It's a move I don't regret. It was culture shock to say the least, but I have more here than I could ever hope to have in SF or NYC. My 8 acre homestead here cost me $129K, 5 years ago. The same thing would be in the millions in the two last places mentioned. I was indeed fortunate. I moved from Ocean Springs which is on the coast inland to Vancleave before Katrina wiped out the coast. I sustained minor damage, but the house where I had previously lived, was swept away. I guess someone up there is looking out for me. Many of the people I know now are either ex Navy or Air Force. There is Northrop Grumman Ship Systems(where I retired from), Keesler Air Force Base and Pascagoula Naval Facility. Additionally, there is a Seabee base, an Army base, Coast Guard, NOAA and not too far away, Stennis aerospace. That just about sums up for now my snail trail from the big apple to my present abode. I watch the "Sopranos" to keep in touch with my roots. Later.
P.S. I hope this narrative fits into the material outline of "Our Place". I'm sure, in the future, I'll have more interesting thoughts about trains to contribute. You know what happens when you're retired and have too much free time. You tend to ramble on line and frequently get off track. If this happens, just give me a whack the side of the head.
Sure am DL. A Swede living in Sotland. My family is like dogfood, spread all over the place, US, Canada and here in the, well, sunny UK....
So, do we have Sunday popquizes?
Been nice and busy in our place the last day or so!
I'll have a full breakfast - here at the bar - will make a change from last weeks 125 mph breakfast I guess. In fact on Eurostar trains you can dine at 185 mph if you travel First Class - but the food is not proper chef prepared - it is very much the same deal as the Renaissance dining car cooking technology - which as we both agree - does not match the 1st class fare! It is supposed to be acceptable however. TGV trains in France are not equipped with proper dining cars as I understand it (only buffet counter service) - but the ICE in Germany is advertised as having a proper Restaurant Car - I'm not sure if that is with proper chefs or not.
Off topic but I agree about your comment on the size of churches in Quebec - I noticed this as soon as I got out of Montréal on the Quebec Train and saw small communities with massive churches - I think the church was very powerful in Quebec society for many years - and the British government tolerated this ‘alternative power base' because of the work the church did in welfare provision etc.
Just going back to your comment about that Santa Fe trip you took as a child - so what you are saying is you had a private room, spent plenty of time in the Dome etc, got (demanded?) good service from the crew - well - anyone who has read any of your recent trip reports will know you started as you meant to go on!
Per - I found the analysis of the LA UPT timetables very interesting - it gives some idea of the scale of long distance services and the sheer reduction in number of that form of transit from today. In Europe of course the numbers of long distance services would have increased in many areas (but the system is all government subsidised of course). In many ways the US is lucky to have the Amtrak service that it does.
Eric - Black Pudding - I think it is similar to blood pudding you mentioned recently!
Dave - it was interesting to read your comments on the Cab Forwards - and great to have Mike's pics so I could get a feel for what they looked like. Reminds me a loco type Pete will be aware of - the strange SR (UK that is) experimental Leader Class steam loco:
See this link with pics and info
http://www.semg.org.uk/steam/leader_01.html
You might find this of interest - if a little strange!
Allan - interested to read your further comments about NZ rail - we need a 40 mile trucking limit here IMHO! I recall hearing that NZ rail then had real difficulties due to being exposed to the level of competition without he government support for protecting the levels for service. Is that the correct interpretation?
Pete - yes Birmingham - Liverpool rtn for 10 pounds is indeed available - check this link which you can send to your pals:
http://www.centraltrains.co.uk/templates/over50TrainRoutes.aspx?id=2274
Select ‘Birmingham New Street' in the drop down box that appears and the destinations will appear - you then have to print off a voucher which you fill in and take to the ticket office when you buy your ticket - I presume you need some proof of age as you have to be over 50 (so no good for me, being more than 10 years off that!)
Incidentally - there have been some big franchise changes on the network here with Virgin losing cross country this week and National Express losing Central Trains and Midland Main Line a few weeks before. I'm not sure what we will get instead will be mush better.
Brake vans on nuclear flask trains - I'm not sure if they are still in use on nuclear flask trains - they may be - interesting question to which I don't know the answer.
I see the steam magazines are commemorating the end of 40 years steam on SR this month, which you mentioned in your post.
Welcome to DD1 - I enjoyed your post. This talk of Naval architecture reminds me to mention the news that was around a few weeks back that the Cunard QE2 was due to retire to some strange place in Saudi Arabia - very much a shame I thought. I think the ship is doing a return journey to the Clyde later this year - where it was built, I might try and go and see the ship in port.
And indeed welcome Jan - we now have English, Welsh and Scottish participation if you are Glasgow based!
Doug - called in too - but still no jokes? Interesting programme of events the 20th CC RR group has - I've checked their website in the past when researching a trip to Chicago - before I found this bar I should add - where people who know the answers to many questions drop in from time to time!
DL
Jan will do just fine. Not much happening here in Glasgow as far as I know, trainwise anyway. May I raise a toast for many more happy months to come here at our place.....
So what kind of a day will this be Just another Thursday OR something special Guess time will tell, eh
Coffee's hot - pastries fresh and our <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts are ready for eatin' - so let's get it on!
Lars at 9:05 AM Wednesday - July 11th: Many thanx for picking up the slack during the morning - I wasn't particularly enthralled with checking the bar just to ‘see' what was going on, so your Post came at the right time!
As always, your selections of book ‘n video covers really liven up things ‘round here. Unfortunately, we just aren't generating conversations - simply accolades. Guess "we takes what we gets," eh
I watched the All Star baseball game, as previously mentioned ‘n thought it was an "okay" game for what it was. Those "spoiled" Prima Donnas coming out on a red carpet did very little for me, though!
Rather not delve into the unhappy on our Anniversary Day - so let's just say that some déjà vu has crept into a few Posts ‘n contributors of late. Let's remember to be INCLUSIVE ‘n pay attention to the works ‘n efforts of others. Thought that's what the majority of us want ‘n are trying to maintain!
Round appreciated!
DD1 at 11:38 AM Wednesday- July 11th: A fine initial Post from the man who call's himself DD1. Some interesting material ‘n it's great to have a Mississippi Connection on board. Hopefully you'll make it permanent and we can add you to our Customer List!
I like the origin of your "handle," truly unique in the Classic Trains sense!
I'm in the "class of 1938," so we're not that far apart. Also a New Yawker and have vivid memories of my grandpa taking me to Grand Central Terminal along with Penn Station back when those palaces were "alive" with some fantastic trains. Stories ‘n references to those times have been repeated many times on this Thread and on our "original" Thread. Just some great, warm ‘n special memories, fer sure, fer sure!
With over 30 years on the west coast, I'd say you're a "natural" for conversation with one of our guys who goes by the handle of West Coast S - Dave. He's into S-gauge, or at least was, and is very knowledgeable of all things Southern Pacific. Hope he catches this Post . . .
My guess is that rural Mississippi must be a huge change of pace from city life - anywhere. I know settling in this part of the continent (St. Louis area) was an eye-opener for me, having spent the majority of my adult life smelling salt air. CHANGE is all around ‘n not always bad. But I do miss the salt air . . .
Your reference to the Sacramento Rail Museum will open the eyes of one of our guys - Wolfman Pete - our Bar Chandler. While I cannot speak with authority regarding which rail museum is better than another, I will say this - the Expo Rail Canadian Railway Museum in Saint Constant, Quebec surely has to be ranked "up there" with the finest too. As with baseball and sports figures from the past - really hard to rank anyone of ‘em Number One. Should simply put ‘em into groups.
Sounds like you had a very interesting ‘n challenging career. Funny you should mention naval architecture.
Way back when, I was "guaranteed" an "A-school" of my choice upon enlisting in the USCG. So, when the time came ‘round in the 12th or 13th week of boot camp for those things to be attended to, I requested naval architecture. They sent me to radioman school! Why? Because I "aced" the Morse code test - having learned it as a Boy Scout! <geesh> I had limited studies in architecture courses and thought that would be a great field to get into. Oh well, things worked out the way things usually work out. I made it to Chief Petty Officer- then Warrant - then began all over again by going through OCS to be a "line officer" at the "tender age" of 32 . . . retiring with 32 years of active duty. Still wonder what kind of life I wudda had IF . . . <grin>
Thanx again for your interesting ‘n insightful Post and we hope to see ya ‘round here again ‘n again!
Pete at 5:47 PM W
Good Morning everybody present and
Happy Anniversary!
Ruth, I am so sorry about the mix-up the other day. I really need to clean my glasses more often, don't I? Let me have a Tequila, make it a Reserva de Familia in honor of this day (not that Tijuana stuff Dave was talking about).
I followed Tom's advice and went back a couple of pages to see what y'all had been up to while I was gone.
I start with Tom, our Captain and the busiest poster of all. It was a really great collection of Canadian pictures. The interior shot from the vintage sleeper reminds me of a privately owned heavyweight that was on display at the Fullerton Railroad Days this year. The owner had built a sleeping compartment for his own use that looked just about the one in your picture. Of course my daughter had to ask why we couldn't have a room like that on our trip from Chicago! A very interesting picture of the GG1 it in the waiting room in Washington; somehow I don't think that was the intention with that room. Sturdy construction of the engine, though. I wish we could say the same for the floor.Thank you for the link to the Flexliner pictures. The first picture I looked at was from Fullerton. Interesting! And I missed all of that when it was there, too bad. Looking at those pictures it was like seeing the "Kustpilen" all over again. That's the similar train that runs through my home town in Sweden. Although the first class compartment isn't as fancy as that in the pictures. But as the accompanying article stated: The manufacturer added all the bells and whistles on this demo train.Yes, the LAUPT has seen a lot of changes over the year. My wife told me her Dad had to hold her with a firm hand so she didn't get separated in the tunnel and her little sister had to be carried. The tunnel was so packed with people that it would have been too easy for a child to be separated and lost. I finally got the train data up on my site: http://home.att.net/~pers_home/trains/cola/LAUPT.htm It was a very interesting post about the Milwaukee and its passenger trains. I have always liked the observation car on the Hiawatha with those windows all over the tail end. I hadn't seen any of the drumheads before, but some of those are real classic. Such a nice design.
Pete, thanks for the welcome back greeting. There was (and maybe still is) a place in Sweden where most steam engines went for scrapping, Vislanda in the southern part of the country. I remember seeing some steamers when I rode the train through there, but I never had a chance to go there and try to get a look (and pictures). That would have been something to have these days when most of the steamers are gone.
Eric, I hope you are feeling well, try to get some sleep and enough of this 1AM postings for a while, right? Thank you as well for the welcome back greeting. I saw a couple of your pictures and the turntable that's now at OERM caught my eye. That looks like it is one of the SP turntables from Owens Valley. The one in Laws is still there, so who knows where this came from? It looks like it is time for a new visit to OERM; it seems to have changed a LOT since I was there last. I feel sympathy for you in your heat wave, but as you have pointed out, it's a dry heat. I wish somebody would tell that to the turkey on Thanksgiving. And when you had your 113 I heard the forecast for Death Valley was 135! No wonder they close the place up in the summer.Thank you for the picture of LAUPT. I believe it has been recently renovated and it is sure a very nice building. I liked the link to the NASA site with the article about the ICE crash. Looking at those pictures it amazes me that anybody survived the crash. Trains have a better survivability than planes, that's fer sure.Do you have any idea if the service hours for a train engineer will be shortened? 432 per month is an awful lot.I wonder what UP used to make that MoW Dining Car. Was it a very big box car, or did they put a couple of the together. I know Southern had a "Hogshead" car (so called because it could hold 100 hogsheads of tobacco). That car was 92 feet long. Check it out here: http://southern.railfan.net/ties/1962/62-6/hog.htmland with some pictures here: http://southern.railfan.net/images/archive/southern/freight/tob/tob.htmlI think I remember seeing that you were looking for an SP video. Pentrex has two new ones right now, the cab forward and the beet train. Take a look at their web site.
Lars, it was quite a Swedish menu you cooked up. I think I pass the palt (had too much of that in school) and the rotten herring (I still refuse to call it "fermented"), that's all bad smell and no taste, but for the rest I can come back for seconds. So I finally I got an explanation to the "eh" in Canadian English. And I always thought it was a way to spell Canada: C -eh- N -eh- D -eh-. And thanks for the hints on how to handle the flood of posts after a long absence; I've tried to follow that here.
James, it was a really interesting web site about the Stockwood fill. What a story!
Thank you, Pwolfe, for the pictures of the British steamers. That Lord Nelson sure is a nice looking loco! It's kind of strange how my appreciation for British steam engines has grown over the years; in my teens I didn't care for them at all, I felt they had the "wrong proportions" but now I find some of them being the most beautiful engines ever built.
It seems like Dave and I may have seen each other once before. I was also at the LAUPT for that 50th anniversary, but so were a couple of thousand other people so we passed each other as ships in the night (isn't that what they say?). It was before the digital camera age so my pictures (and videos) are hidden somewhere. I went to the Cajon pass
Good morning gents ... and a HAPPY ANNIVERSARY to my favorite bar by the tracks! Congratulations to Captain Tom and all who contribute to keep this great thread rolling. I'll have a light breakfast please and shake loose some Michigan quarters for Her Wurlitzer for later.
Went to a meeting of the 20th Century Railroad club in Chicago last night. I'll tell you about our speaker later. An interesting thing happened on the UP Northwest Metra line trip back to Crystal Lake last night that I'll share now. About the time we approached the Fox River Grove stop, the conductor announced that the police had informed the crew that an individual somewhere between Fox River Grove and Cary, was attempting to commit suicide by using the train. We were directed to pull to the side at Fox River Grove and either wait until this individual was apprehended, or de-train. Fortunately for all, the individual was quickly caught, and our delay was only minutes. I was impressed that the Conductor, more than once referred to this individual as a "poor soul, who needed help."
On another subject, I've put together a "little" story called Fire in Tunnel 9" for later in the day, but for now, here is an interesting poem called the REDBALL FREIGHT by H.L. Kelso
The JUDGE peered sharp at the man on trial,
A hobo, old and gray;
He sized him up from head to toe,
Then bade him have his say,
"Was passing through," the ‘bo spoke out,
"On yonder streak of rust.
This cinder dick who hauled me here
Knows naught of wanderlust.
"I had a job like yours and his
‘Way back along the trail,
Arresting tramps and thieves and such
And sending them to jail.
And then one night from in the sky
I heard the honking geese.
They seemed to say, "Come follow us
And you will find your peace."
"A long long freight was leaving town;
Her whistle sounded grand;
And since that night I've plied the rails
Across our pretty land.
Now, judge, a redball's making up
And in my heart a song,
And when she leaves this town of yours
I'd like to be along."
"This case dismissed," the judge then said,
"And court's adjourned this date.
Now, hobo, you just lead the way,
We'll nail that redball freight!"
Have a great day guys. I am off to work!
Good morning fellow train connoisseurs... May I join you? Could I have an extra cold Guinness please and top up whatever everybody else is drinking and something for you bartender....
Only the second visit here, so I buy this and the next round..
Good morning Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!
Leon, old friend, just a cup of coffee! I have to leave in a few minutes!
Just stopped by to wish a Happy 27th Anniversary!!!
At the same time I want to say to DD1!!
I am following my doctor's advice to get some extra sleep (due to some symptoms) so I am afraid I won't be back until Saturday with an inclusive post. It will be nice when I can go back to normal routines again.
I think I have showed this one before, but where was it taken?
See you soon!
Eric
Hi Tom and all,
HAPPY 27th TO ALL!
Leon set em up up all round, mines a Tui.
Tom. Your Milwaukee Road coverage was 1st class, nostalgia is great food for the mind!
Dave. You were correct about the NZ loco`s being used as "rip rap" , a huge number of engines were dumped in river stopbanks to help in flood protection, most of the Roger`s 2-4-2`s were found in the Oreti river stopbanks near Invercargill, NZ`s southernmost city.
Eric. NZ railways used to operate long distance bus services as well, AKA "NZ Railways Road Services", they used to build their own bus bodies so this came in handy when they built the railcars. NZ railways was very protected up until the 1980`s, their was a 40 mile radius trucking restriction on freight delivery by road, so any mileage over that had to go via rail
Pete. Rail in NZ was first started by each Provincial Council and was a real "Hotch Potch" of different gauges and equipment, their was even a "wooden rail" line from Invercargill to Makarewa at one stage. All this was standerdised by Julius Vogel the NZ Government Engineer of the day, he stipulated 3ft 6in gauge as the NZ standard. A lot of NZ loco`s were supplied by Badwin, Roger`s etc. because it was easier and cheaper to ship them over the Pacific from the West coast of the USA. The Otago Provincial Council were very much Double Fairlie minded because they did`nt need turntables to turn them around, a big cost saving as this province was settled by the canny Scots! The Wellington/Manawatu railway was virtually a mini RGS with it`s Baldwin loco`s and US style passenger coaches and freight cars, as well as all the UK loco`s and equipment from the other provinces.
DL. You are so right about the taste of Vegemite and Marmite being an acquired one, as they say "one man`s meat is another man`s poison. Glad you liked the railcar site.
DD1. Welcome to the fold. I am a "greenhorn" who has been made very welcome to this gathering of minds since I joined in.
Lars. Your entries are great reading and I have done a lot of reasearch on your pointers.
See ya all, Allan
A pint of Bathams please RUTH.
DAVE Yes it does sound as though if those locomotives were at that mill they no longer exist today. It is strange that no works plates have turned up, I wonder what price those chime whistles fetch if they change hands. Some of the nameplates off the steam locos in Britain, when they are auctioned today, cost more than what it cost to build the locomotive when it was built in the 1920s or 30s.
Are there any Cab-forwards in museums today beside # 4294 shown in Dave's link.
I don't blame you feeling like that about that mayor.
MIKE Thanks for the links. It must have sounded great to be in the first car with a cab-forward working a passenger service.
The cars in the Federal Express look to be made of very strong construction.
Good photos of the prototypes and the youngsters are certainly enjoying the model versions.
LARS Thanks for inviting DD1 to call in at the bar I am looking forward to some navy tales between DD1, TOM and yourself.
Great set of Great Northern book and DVD covers. The electric and steam in color looks a great book.
DD1 I do hope you will join us at Our Place, Tom gets the Guinness from Dublin.
Another person who saw steam in regular use on the main line. I am from England but in the US now, although now in my mid 50s, I remember steam in everyday use as steam lasted a lot longer there on the main line(1968). In fact last weekend was the 40th anniversary of the end of regular everyday steam into a London Terminus (Waterloo).
Thanks for the description of the Chilean trip. It must have been quite a sight to see those DD1s at speed; there could not have been many other electric locomotives with wheels as large as 72 inches.
TOM That could be an opening for a business, fixing a permanent ladder to gas station price signs, the way the price seems to change almost daily.
The vote was passed in KC for a light rail system and there are a lot of letters in the paper in favor of it but they are still arguing about the cost etc so whether it ever does get built we shall have to see, as you say the initial cost is huge.
Many thanks for the Milwaukee Road Fallen Flag Encore. I see that they still had 588 passenger cars in 1963. If I ever can go back to the National Railroad Museum In Green Bay WIS I will have a much greater appreciation of the great Drumhead collection they have there.
Good words for DD1.
Great photos from the gallery at Exporail. I don't think I was very clear about the engine I asked you about (what is new says Tom), it was the engine in the rotary snow plow,it is in the 4th photo in today's photos, you can see the open engine covers on the plow and the engine when you enlarge the photo. Enjoying the ‘Twenty Dollar Bill spot the 10 changes', got 8 so far, will have to back and find the other two.
An old car window at Green Bay.
Well LEON another beer and a round please, I think Lars as fed the mascots their treats
Thanx to our Manager, Lars for helping out this morning! Took a bit of the "strain" off the line for Moi! Also, a to DD1 - see separate SPECIAL Post . . . . More specifics to the both of you in tomorrow's acknowledgments . . .
For Pete: Email received ‘n responded to - thanx! By the by, I misunderstood your question - NO, I do NOT have a foto of that loco in question . . . don't recall even walking back that way. Probably looking for YOU! <grin>
Continuing on with Pix from Day Four: Sunday - May 27th, 2007 - ExpoRail Canadian Railway Museum at Delson/Saint-Constant, Quebec, Canada
From the balcony - Inside Building #1 (cont'd) <all previously identified>
The balcony
To be continued . . .
SPECIAL for DD1
Aboard! Happy to see you made it over to the best cyber bar 'n grill this side of the Ether. And of course we have ALL major brews on Earth, right here! Sorry, but we shy away from micro-breweries as they are much to hard to ship 'n most difficult to keep in stock. <grin>
Last things first: Not quite sure I understand what the problem might be regarding the scrolling reference to get to this Thread.
Some basics:
From the trains.com Forums main page - locate the Classic Trains (General Discussion) topic and click on it.
Next - click on the General Discussion (Classic Trains) topic - then find "Our" Place and click on the LAST PAGE shown. That should bring you to the top of whatever Page # is shown.
An alternative is to click on the little box shown after the cyber handle of the person who has last Posted here - that will bring you directly to that Post.
Now - some "things" you may want to know about us:
We are an inclusive place, quite unlike others found on sites like these. We try to acknowledge one another 'n engage in conversation.
Highly recommend you go to Page One of this Thread and check out the "precepts" within the first Post (mine). Then read through that Page to get the "gist" of things.
Then come back here to the final few Pages 'n familiarize yourself with what's going on. The best way to join us is to join in, however, it's far easier when you're up to speed <to to speak>!
At this time we're experiencing some lulls in activity what with summer vacations and the like . . . so the Posts aren't as fast 'n furious as in the past. That's GOOD for trying to catch up . . .
Really enjoyed your Posts here 'n over on "my other Thread." The latter was designed pretty much as a "feeder" for this place. It's been a long haul . . . .
The information you've provided us tells quite a story - thanx! You'll be a bit suprised that there are three guys with New York ties - one on Staten Island - one on Long Island and Moi, a long-time ex-pat of NYC - Moi - (also Staten island) currently residing in the St. Louis area <haven't lived in NYC for over 40 years). Don't know the age of the LI guy <Mike> but Lars (Staten Island) and yours truly aren't that far from 70 in years. Lars comes from B&O "stock" - with grandfather 'n father as careerists. Lars is a retired "Merchie." I'm a retiree from the USCG (32 years active). Our Long Island Connection has "deep" ties to family railroading in the east, too.
We are an international "lot" in that some of our crew are from places as far away as New Zealand, as close as Canada, and also Europe (Sweden, England & Wales).
In time you'll easily figure out 'who's who' here at the bar and my bet is that you'll find yourself right at home amidst 'n amongst those with similar likes!
First drink is on the house, which will be YOURS upon your next visit!
We do have one set of "rules" that are absolutes! One must greet the barkeep upon entering 'n order a drink (or food or both!)
You may note that in addition to cyber handles, we also use "names" or "initials" - just to make it a bit more like a bar 'n grill. Your choice - but fair warning - we assign names from time to time! <grin>
Again, glad to have you 'n our hope is that you'll find this place AND our cast of characters <real & imagined> of interest!
We've never had a Mississippi Connection here at the bar 'n I hope you'll be the first!
By the by - we are "celebrating" the 27th Month Anniversary of "Our" Place tomorrow - as we started "business" back on April 12th, 2005! C'mon in and join us!
The Passenger Railroad Fallen Flags of "Our" Place #16
The Milwaukee Road
<A form of this was initially Posted on Page 128 of the Original Thread>
Here's another Fallen Flag for the gang from Classic American Railroads:Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul & Pacific (CM&StPP) - The Milwaukee Road
Caveat: The information provided is NOT all inclusive and is reflective only of the periods mentioned.
Headquarters: Chicago, IL Mileage: 1950: 10,664 Locomotives in 1963: Diesel: 803 Electric: 93 Rolling stock in 1963: Freight cars: 42.325 Passenger: 588 Principal routes in 1950: (not all)Chicago-Minneapolis via Milwaukee and Columbus, WI New Lisbon-Woodruff, WI Minneapolis-Seattle & Tacoma via Spokane, WA Minneapolis & St. Paul-Calmar, IA via Austin, MN La Crescent, MN-Wessington Springs, SD Rondout, IL (Chicago)-Madison, WI Watertown, WI-Rapid City, SD Chicago-Omaha Manilla, IA-Sioux Falls, SD Marion-Ottumwa, IA Sturtevant, WI-Kansas City La Crosse, WI-Sabula, IA Des Moines-Spencer, IA Chicago-Terre Haute, IN Milwaukee-Ontonagon, MI via Green Bay, WI
Passenger Trains of note: (not all)Afternoon Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Arrow (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Chippewa-Hiawatha (Chicago-Channing, MI) Copper Country Limited (Chicago-Green Bay-Calumet, MI jointly with DSS&A railroad) Midwest Hiawatha (Chicago-Omaha & Sioux Falls) Morning Hiawatha (Chicago-Milwaukee-Minneapolis) Olympian (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle & Tacoma) Olympian Hiawatha (Chicago-Twin Cities-Seattle U& Tacoma; replaced Olympian) Pioneer Limited (Chicago-Milwaukee-St. Paul & Minneapolis) Sioux (Chicago-Madison-Rapid City, SD) Southwest Limited (Milwaukee & Chicago-Kansas City Tomahawk (Chicago-Minocqua, WI) Varsity (Chicago-Madison) Of note: From 1955-1971, Milwaukee Road operated the Chicago-Omaha segment of UP's "Overland" streamliners including the City of Denver, City of Portland, City of Los Angeles, City of San Francisco and the Challenger.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Some drum heads of the Milwaukee Road
The original post by DD1:
"The year was 1969 and as we were pulling out of the railroad station in Santiago, Chile, the song "take the last train from Clarksville" by the Monkees was blareing from the platform PA system. We were headed south toward Concepcion on an overnight trip aboard a vintage passenger train pulled by an old Baldwin 4-6-0(I think). The passenger cars were old German built cars with lots of wood work. I made the mistake of sticking my head out the window and getting coal cinders in my eye. The train, by the way was in regular service, not rail fan. I have been back there since in 2002 and the train is no longer in service. They do have a very nice railroad museum there in Santiago and that's where I suspect the old engine ended up, I hope. Food service on the train was very good and served meats, fish and poultry cooked over charcoal. At night, the porter would pull down the berths. Of course much of the great Chilean wines were consummed during our trip. I can recall overnight trips on the NYC way back when the 20th century limited hauled by a Hudson would gently rock me to sleep. Those days are gone forever and never to be repeated. I'm fortunate to have been able to experience them. Diesels and railfan trips are no way close to the real thing. I'm 72 and lucky to have come on the scene before it all disappeared for ever."
Tom and Lars, I hope you have Guinness draught on tap. I thank you for your invite to this forum. I wanted to update the above post while still fresh in my mind.
The passenger equipment as I stated was German. I estimate there were built between WWI and WWII and were sold to Chile as the German railways system modernized. The track we were running on was metre gauge.
I was only about 7 years of age when I rode the 20th century limited with my mother on a vacation trip. That's about all I can recall about that.
You may wonder about my handle "DD1". I was fascinated with the DD1 box cab electrics that ran on the LIRR and Pennsylvania. I can still remember the smell of ozone and the snap of the contactors as the DD1's made their way into Penn Station. As a kid, I would stand alongside the LIRR tracks and watch the DD1 coming down the track, rocking from side to side at 60 mph. With those 72" drivers, they could run 80 mph. They were tough on the rails due to the pounding nature of the drive system, but they proved to be most economical when it came to maintenance.
Living in and being raised in New York City, gave me opportunity to see train operations all around me. I could go to Penn Station, Grand Central or take a subway ride to the Lackawanna Terminal in Hoboken, N.J. There, I could see the Delaware and Lackawanna, Reading, Jersey Central and maybe a few others. I rode behind camelbacks on the Reading. As you may have noticed, I am a railroad nut and have been for the past 65 years. I was fortunate to be born at this time to be able to wittness railroading in it's glory days, at least on the East coast. I wish I could have seen the Challengers on the UP out west, but did see them when they resided later on in a museum.
In 1964, I drove from the East coast to the West coast and stayed there for over 30 years before finally settling down in rural Mississippi. When arriving in Seattle, I saw the Great Northern Bi-polars in operation. I guess I made the transition from steam to electric during those early years. The silence and power of those huge engines was overwhelming to me. I have seen articulates under steam during the opening celebration of the Sacramento Railroad Museum, a museum 2nd to none IMHO. I always make it a point to visit a RR museum whenever I'm traveling in an area that may have one. I've visited RR museums in Tokyo, Santiago, Sacramento and a few small private tour lines.
BTW, you asked if I was in the Navy. No; not as a serviceman, but as a naval architect. That was my profession for 50 years. During those years, I traveled all over the world involved in design and repair of navy ships, from the smallest navy tug to the largest carrier or battleship. I also had a lot to do with nuclear powered submarines and surface vessels. I was always in close contact with navy personnel and their ships, but not as a crew member. I had the best of both worlds. A civilian and officer treatment.
One last thing. How do I get to this "our house" directly, without a lot of scrolling?
Ruth my deAH, set ‘em with all of the "jolts" they can handle in their OJ! I'm a bit early this day, but trying to take advantage of the time I've got . . . You're lookin' mighty fine little lady ‘n the old Larsman knows he's still alive when looking at you! <blush> A mugga joe with a BK splash will do me just fine, thank you! <grin>
Tom, I'll drop off an "invite" to the visitor over on your other thread on my way back home . . . good idea!
Boris, what's this I hear about a rabies shot?!?!? Thought we took care of that right after you got into it with Tex . . . my, my how time flies! <grin> Good to see ya Dave, even if you haven't seen me!
Did watch the all star game last night ‘n was surprised at how the NL just couldn't get a run across the plate when needed. It isn't as if they didn't have chances. Thought it was a pretty good contest, except for the 9th inning for both sides. Surely don't like this idea of determining the home game advantage as a result of who wins an exhibition game. Good Grief Charlie Brown! That idea, along with most from the "Commish" belong in the round file.
Wonderful continuing display of photos from your trip to Canada ‘n Expo Rail. I'm sounding like a broken record, but those shots are really fine! Another 5- Salute to our Cap'n for taking the time to put these on-line for those who care and of course those who could care less!
Picked up on that comment you made to Per regarding having something to say for each ‘n every post at the bar. Doing something like that could surely ruin one's day if coming back from a prolonged absence. I know some guys really are good about inclusiveness ‘n make a point to say something in reference to each guy. That's kinda like what I try to do - rather than pick up on specifics for every post - just make mention of the guys who have been putting out the "good stuff," holding specifics for something really out of the ordinary - like what our Mentor does for us!
No expanded comment regarding the "ignorance factor" that still exists ‘round here insofar as recognizing the works of others.
Here's a few more book ‘n video covers from the Great Northern for your enjoyment!
Until the next time!
Lars
Wednesday's Witticism
Nerves is just which end of a six-gun you happen to be looking at.
Mid-week in mid-continent USA where petrol is on the rise! Was at $2.90 (rounded) yesterday afternoon. However, there was a ladder up against the price sign, so ya know those numbers have changed. Was $2.72 just the day before!
Coffee's ready - pastries fresh - ‘n breakfasts are ready for fixin'! C'mon . . .
Noticed we had a "visitor" over on "my other Thread" - suggest those of you who give a Rat's Patoot, check it out ‘n invite the guy to stop by the bar!
OBSERVATION: Still seeing "that" reluctance to use the RELOAD/REFRESH feature on the browser. It's the ONLY way to ensure that the MOST CURRENT POSTS get displayed. Given that we don't see many of the guys on a regular basis, it's most important to "get it right" the first time. Think about it!
Dave at 3:56 PM ‘n 6:59 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Great to see our Left Coast Connection ‘n Super Sleuth Man of Mystery about the decks during the week!
Boris was in need of that rabies shot - good thinking! <grin>
Didn't see any reference to the ExpoRail Pix since your last visit, so I'm guessing you didn't see em. <groan>
Yes, I do recall the original Auto Train and it would be a treat if someone were to do a piece on it.
Still NOT answering Emails, I note! <grin>
Rounds appreciated - as always!
Pete at 4:52 PM Tuesday - July 10th: Presume the trip to the dentist went well . . . also, 2nd mention: Email sent to you Monday . . .
Juneau is a nervous wreck at this time of year with the fireworks but not thunderstorms. Firecrackers really bother him. He's okay in the house, but once outside - bad news. It's only the "direct hit" thunderboomers that make him "scurry" - but then, so do I! <uh oh>
One airport in Miami proper worth a mention. Tri-Rail serves the airport, whereas it appears one has to transfer from Metrorail at the Tri-Rail station in order to get to the airport. I don't really know, as I've never traveled aboard either . . .
KCity had several chances to vote "in" a light-rail system but didn't. Costs don't decrease and taxpayers are more reluctant these days to relent to more taxation. So, unless ‘n until there's a remarkable turnabout in KCity's economic health, I doubt we'll see that train to ‘n from the airport. Makes good sense, but . . .
The Santa Fe train I traveled aboard was powered by at least two diesels that I can recall. Of course in that great war bonnet livery. But I can't remember any details and have asked for help on this a few times on this ‘n the original Thread - with no luck. I know the train had domes, because I sat in at least one. I had a roomette to myself and spent quite a bit of time in the observation car - waited on hand ‘n foot by the very attentive crew. Probably was the Super Chief, but again, I have nothing to back that up with. It was 1947 and I was 9 - say no more, eh
Thanx for the visit ‘n round!
Mike at 8:07 PM Tuesday - July 10th: URLs what else More real than Lionel, however all good! All Star pre-game ‘n game wasn't bad at all. Last time I saw Willie "for real" he was playing an exhibition game with the Mets against the Tidewater Tides in Norfolk, VA. He hit a homer and simply ran out of the park after touching home plate . . . The greateast! Don Mueller - a journeyman right fielder who "done good" at times for the Jints of New Yawk. <grin>
No comments on any of those Pix from Canada? Not a one?? Hmmmmm.
Round appreciated.
Really different 'round here without our Resident Desert Swede - Eric - to kick things off in the wee hours!
Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house
Dave you sound good.
The television is on. What a joy to see Willie Mays!
Willie and Don Mueller
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1068248.jpg?size=67&uid={d4097881-4e01-4021-b8e3-523b53492ee0}
Southern Pacific 4-8-8-2 Cab Forward locomotives
http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015935.jpg
http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015925.jpg
http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015940.jpg
http://photoswest.org/photos/00015876/00015943.jpg
Survivor 4294 is at Sacramento museum
http://www.yesteryeardepot.com/SP4294.JPG
http://www.railpictures.net/images/s/SP4294sacto17mar78.jpg.39177.jpg
Wreck of the Federal Express
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1017765ACME.jpg?size=67&uid={7f32e261-1153-40f5-9384-0dbcd822426e}
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215047INP.jpg?size=67&uid={12475df5-349a-4c5a-b8eb-16de8cfb210a}
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1104872.jpg?size=67&uid={537e9e6b-d8e5-4c5e-8764-54efc5ff3806}
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215084INP.jpg?size=67&uid={06ce4a85-fab1-4231-a5d5-cd97c1e2cb3b}
http://pro.corbis.com/images/U1215163INP.jpg?size=67&uid={7c001776-12a8-4f7e-bcdb-cb7ce576044b}
http://pro.corbis.com/images/BE067434.jpg?size=67&uid={a01806e6-6b5c-4d3e-8ca8-900cdbf1441a}
Lionel trains
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Mike
Where was I, oh yeh, the light just came on Round for all, no watered or cheap stuff, Boris, I am wise to that deal you got on questionable libations from Ce' Sinor's in Tijuana.
Pwolf..Tragic indeed, If those engines defied the scrappers for a few more years it would be a fair bet to state they were probably scrapped when no longer needed for stationary use. I find it inconciveable that in this day and info age someone would not have rooted them out if the story rings with a grain of truth, though I have heard the mill was razed in the late sixties and all equiptment disposed of, according to legend the builder plates did survive, though no one has produced them, what is not in dispute was the mill obtained several chime whistles at a good price and these are now in the hands of collectors.. Odd, but the SP retained nothing larger then the 4-8-2 in the post 59 deadlines, perhaps not so odd when you consider these smaller engines were more verstile and cheaper to store or return to service if needed, also a great many were not too many years hence from complete rebuilds. Eleven Cab Forwards survived into 1959 before their fate was sealed...
Eric, My last journey to LAUPT was the 50th anniversery in 1989, quite a shindig, with 4449, 844 in steam and the infamous F unit line up, UP E9-951, ATSF F7 trio-370 A,B,C and SP E9 6005. Of couse the highlight of the evening was the windbag mayor and his henchman who were present in a failed attempt to deflect inquisitive reporters seeking details of his latest scandal, cost me a good photo spot when his security goons ordered me to vacate...(do I hold a grudge or what?) It is truly a maganficient tribute to the classic age of railroading and is the among the last great one built. Soon it will lose its desigination as a stub end terminal, plans are afoot to extend the tracks so a balloon configuration exist, this is a major job as the terminal is pretty hemmed in, but construction is underway.
Dave
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