siberianmo The station is great....is it from a kit? I like the subway in the mountains....looks like something I would do.
underworld
Even though "Our" Place is
CLOSED on SUNDAY's -
We do observe Sunday Photo Posting Day!!
An ENCORE! from Page 161 of the "old" Thread back on Nov 13th, 2005!
Here are some Pix of my newly arrived "Red Bird" subway cars that somehow wound up on the Can-Am Railroad! What's this at Union Station? Looks like subway cars! They ARE subway cars! Why are subway cars here? Subway cars at "Our" Place? Subway cars ARE at "Our" Place! Subway cars at Can-Am Gorge! Subway cars at Land-Between-the-Lakes! Subway cars in the mountains! That's it - Enjoy!
Grilled cheese is for Greenbay games ... for obvious reasons!
Glad you liked the pix and dopey joke
How's the grilled cheese here???
barndad Great station pics! I like the finger joke, a good old vaudville standby!!!
Hi again from snowy blowy Chicagoland. Great choices for our films at the Emporium Tom. Two fine films ... yesindeedy, and one in particular in the spirit of today's Bear playoff (kickoff in less than 2 hours). The Stooge short looks to be a good one too
Getting away from the B&O, here are some more pix from this area:
The Chicago & New Orleans Limited, when it was the pride of the Illinois Central's long-run fleet.
In 1911, when the Illinois Central renamed its Chicago & New Orleans Limited, the Panama Canal, like the Erie Canal before it, was still "The Work of the Age" and the railroad was quick to cash in on its prestige by naming its new train for it. In 1916 The Panama Limited became all-Pullman with a surcharge that was refunded if it was more than an hour late. So venerated was this varnish run that in Vaiden, Mississippi, court was recessed daily so everyone could see its passage through town. The new Orleans décor in the bar is, of course, from the streamlined Panama
In one of the Panama's rare operations double-headed, it approaches Chicago over the I.C.'s electrified suburban trackage in 1937.
The Panama Limited in the closing years of steam presented a fine appearance in the I.C. depot at Chicago against a background of Coca-Cola and Seagram's whiskey, neither of which, it may be imagined, were big sellers in its magnificently resourceful bars.
A carrier whose patrician antecedents and venerable age allowed its indulgence in mild eccentricities, the Illinois Central, until it was eliminated as part of the Lake Front Improvement Program, maintained in its Van Buren Street suburban depot in Chicago what may have been the only octagon railroad station in the record. The structure was built in 1879 and looked like this in 1896, a matchless tribute to architectural whimsy and defiance of conformity.
The I.C.'s trains at Browns, Illinois, all stopped at the Southern Railway crossover to open a gate before crossing the right of way of the competition.
A man goes to the doctor and says, "Doc, I ache all over. Everywhere I touch it hurts."
The doctor says, "OK. Touch your elbow."
The guy touches his elbow and winces in genuine pain. The doctor, surprised, says "Touch your head."
The guy touches his head and jumps in agony. The doctor asks him to touch his knee and the same thing happens. Everywhere the guy touches he hurts like hell. The doctor is stumped and orders a complete examination with X-rays, etc. and tells the guy to come back in two days.
Two days later the guy comes back and the doctor says "We've found your problem."
"Oh yeah? What is it?"
"You've broken your finger!"
Even though the bar at "Our" Place isCLOSED on Sundays - We do observe Sunday Photo Posting Day!Now playing at the Mentor Village Emporium Theatre!
. . . Sunday, January 21st thru 27th: The Longest Yard (1974) Starring: Burt Reynolds, Eddie Albert, Ed Lauter, Michael Conrad & James Hampton - and - Brian's Song (1971) Starring: James Caan, Billy Dee Williams, Jack Warden, Bernie Casey & Shelley Fabares. SHORT: The Three Stooges - We Want Our Mummy (1939).
The Longest Yard (1974)
PLOT SUMMARY:
A sadistic warden asks a former pro quarterback, now serving time in his prison, to put together a team of inmates to take on (and get pummeled by) the guards. His dilemma is that the warden asks him to throw the game in return for an early release, but he is also concerned about the inmates' lack of self-esteem.
from: amazon.com
Brian's Song (1971)
Based on the real-life relationship between teammates Brian Piccolo and Gale Sayers and the bond established when Piccolo discovers that he is dying. Gale Sayers joins the Chicago Bears and is befriended by Brian Piccolo, an over-achieving running back. Although they compete for the same spot on the team, and despite the fact that Sayers is black and Piccolo white, they become roommates on the road and very close friends, especially when Sayers is injured and Piccolo helps his recovery. Later, they and their wives must both deal with the harsh reality of Piccolo's cancer.
SHORT: We Want Our Mummy (1939)PLOT SUMMARY: Featuring Moe, Larry & Curly
The Stooges are detectives hired by a museum curator to find the kidnapped Professor Tuttle and the mummy of King Rutentuten. The boys hail a taxi at the cost of $2,198.55 to Cairo. When they find the tomb, the boys encounter crooks who are also after the mummy. The mummy they thought was Rutentuten was really his wife, Queen HotsyTotsy. It turns out King Rutentuten was a midget.
from: threestooges.net
Enjoy! Tom
Howdy again folks, and hope your day is going well. It's snowing in Chicagoland, and as Tom pointed-out, let's hope that gives the Bears an advantage. We'll take help from wherever we can get it!
Of course I have brats cooked in beer, and they're not just regular brats, they're Sheboygan brats. For those who don't know what I'm talking about:
brat-wurstPronunciation: brät' wûrst (also brat- also -vû(r)st sometimes - vusht) Function: nounEtymology (brat-): German, from Old High German bratwurst abbreviated to brat, from brat meat without waste + wurst sausage Date: circa 18881: Only the best fresh pork sausage ever tasted, made right in Sheboygan, WI, for frying, grilling, cooking, roasting, and many other tasty delights.
As we are playing the Saints today, we'll be having Cajun brats!
Just cook ‘em up and plunk one inside a warm and fresh-baked bun from the Mentor Village Bakery, and don't spare the condiments. You'll get a grin that doesn't know where to begin! No ketchup gentlemen. This is Chicago. Ketchup is for burgers and cheeseburgers only. And now ...let's move into the B&O Pullman diner for our feast!
Spotless summer whites for members of the staff characterized B&O diners circa 1910.
Elaborately carved mahogany breakfronts concealed the steward's stock of bottled goods.
The Baltimore & Ohio's all-Pullman Fort Hill on the Pittsburgh-Chicago overnight run, like the New Haven's Owl over the Shore Line between New York and Boston and several of the connecting trains between St. Louis and Chicago, ran the full distance under what amounted to slow orders in an effort to use up its carded time. Unlike The Owl, Night Diamond and Silent Knight, however, it carried a full compliment of luxury equipment. Almost surely it was the only overnight on an intermediate distance to boast a barber and lady's maid, showers for both sexes and a manicurist. The B&O had style and to spare in the twenties. The utilitarian properties of The Fort Pitt's lady's retiring room aboard its Pullman Standard sleepers were not sybaritic, but the travel attire of its passengers in the early 1920s make it a stunning period piece in the record of luxury transport.
The congealing cold on the Lake Michigan water-front can almost be sensed, together with the sounds and very smells of Chicago railroading in mid-winter of 1930 when Alfred W. Johnson took this stunning rear-end view of The Capitol Limited, double headed, from Roosevelt Road bridge as it headed eastbound out of Chicago yards. Ice amidst the pilings, snow on the guard rails and the frozen calm of the Chicago River set a mood of melancholy splendor for a great train operation in the golden age of Pullman.
In the Roaring Thirties when the national economy of boom and bust was reflected in railroad earnings and operations alike, the Baltimore & Ohio's fast daylight run between Washington and its New Jersey terminal, The Columbian, carried coaches, a diner and solarium lounge, all the amenities of a first class train on an intermediate run without de luxe overtones. The fast ride could be a rough one because of its numerous curves, but there were still loyal B&O partisans who preferred the inconvenience of a bus ride through Holland Tunnel to the impersonal Pennsylvania. The B&O right of way with occasional vine-clad signal towers suggested a more leisured day of transport.
In the fullest panoply of splendor, double shotted for a heavy consist and with the train name on the sidewalls of the Pullman combine Capitol Hill, the Baltimore & Ohio's Train No. 6, The Capitol Limited with locomotives No. 5331 and 5232 on the point forms a sparkling portrait of steam varnish operations in the year 1930. The tracks here cross the Chicago River at Roosevelt Road during a river straightening project and the disused pilings and stringers of an older trestle in the foreground and ice floes in the river give the scene a Christmas card chill.
Framed in a stately doorway of classic design and a ceiling freize of looped wreaths that would have been acceptable in the décor of any of the Adam restaurants of the world's Ritz hotels, this Baltimore & Ohio dining car steward on The Capitol Limited in white waistcoat of office and blue and gold livery jacket was the glass of fashion at a time when he represented the mobile amenities of life in their fullest dimension.
The Baltimore & Ohio's Cincinnatian, a much photographed varnish haul because of its timing on the mountain grades in Western Maryland and spectacular combination of steam and streamlining that characterized its consists, was a coach-only daylight train between Baltimore-Washington and the Cincinnati of its name. Placed in service immediately after the 1941 war, two President class Pacifics were streamlined for its motive power at the carrier's Mt. Clair shops.
A man walks into the psychiatrist's office with a pancake on his head, fried eggs on each shoulder, and a strip of bacon over each ear.
The shrink, humoring him, asks, "What seems to be the problem?"
The guy answers, "Doc, I'm worried about my brother."
foto credit: www.viarail.ca
Even though the bar at "Our" Place is
CLOSED on Sundays -
We do observe Sunday Photo Posting Day!
G'day Gents!
Yes, we are CLOSED at the bar, however, the traditional BREAKFAST - BRUNCH - LUNCH ‘til 2 PM continues. So give Boris your order and hope for the best! <grin>
And, you can still slip your messages and Pix through the mail slots on either set of front doors if you find them locked!
Arose to a snow covered wonderland ‘round these parts and Juneau is in his element fer sure, fer sure! Only picked up about 2 inches of it, as they had predicted far more. But as seems to be the "norm" here in mid-continent USA, these events skirt the area more times than not. Anyway, we're thankful for small favors and the 1 mile trek ‘round the wilds of the subdivision was a joyous time for the Husky from Hades! <grin>
A few acknowledgments, then I'll set about putting together my "stuff" for this day. Don't want to interfere with the NFL Playoffs!
Mike at 6:43 PM yesterday: In a listing that grew ‘n grew each time I looked at it, some mighty fine perusals via URLs. Always apprecicate PAs - FAs ‘n the "jet powered" RDC. Something for all . . .
Eric at 1:52 AM yesterday: Always look forward to viewing what our "resident desert Swede" has for us and this day was no disappointment! Good to see ya and yes, I was fast asleep. Not at the "wheel" though, would never let that happen, but Leon had all in good order. Ruth ‘n Lars Whowuddathunkit <grin>
You are so correct about baggage "handling" by the airlines folks. You DON'T wanna see it!! Unfortunately, the ones who don't give a Rat's Patoot about exercising care give a black eye to the majority of the people who do their jobs properly. Isn't that always the way Youbetcha!
We have some refineries not far from here over on the Illinois side of the mighty Mississippi, ergo lower prices I presume. Fluctuates like the wind and it's become a way of life throughout our country to fill ‘er up when the price is right, eh
Thanx for the confirmation on the 1700 series of baggage cars. "Somewhere" in my "think tank" I recalled them being former Heritage stock, maybe read it in association with the materials that came with my model. At any rate, they are fine looking cars and didn't look all that bad with the Superliners in spite of the height differential. At least Amtrak ensured the livery matched up.
Dave at 6:12 AM today: Back again, eh Well, that's a good sign. In time you'll get the routine figured out, it's not all that complex. We try to intersperse serious talk of Classic Trains with some levity (actually, lots of it!). Our "Cast of Characters" aren't that difficult to spot, as they'll find YOU!
Lars isn't expected back ‘til tomorrow, but I'm sure he'll pick up on your comments.
Doug at 7:27 AM today: Many thanx for kicking off the daylight Sunday Photo Posting Day! with yet another fine spate of vintage Pix and narratives! Joke Did you tell a joke Mustamissedit! <grin>
With snow in Chicago, perhaps the boyz from New Orleans may find things just a tad more difficult for them as they try to shackle Da Bears - GO BEARS!
Brats, did you mention BRATS Cooked in beer, of course, eh Sure, fire up the grill and let's party!
Baggage handlers and others who "handle" things not their own can really ruin someone else's day, eh I remember one time as we were taking on "stores" for a patrol of about 5 weeks at sea, some of the guys were throwing the boxes to one another as opposed to passing it. Made for an unhappy day for them when the cooks got ahold of ‘em. They worked off that "extra duty" in the galley during times when the ship was encountering the roughest of seas. Taught ‘em a lesson, fer sure, fer sure.
I'll be back later on with the Emporium movie slate for the week!
Reminder: Tomorrow, Ruth has the bar from 9 AM until Leon the Night Man comes in at 5 PM ‘til closing.
Boris, serve ‘em all of the OJ they can handle!
Tom
Good morning one and all, and are we ready for some football? I swear, the time before the big game is just like the day before Christmas, where you anticipate whether you'll be getting something good ... or not! Oh yeah, I'll have the tailgaters special, which I'll be cooking for ya'll today in honor of the Bears' homefield advantage. Too early for brats?
Quite a day here yesterday, I think. Glad you liked the Pickle Wreck series James. I surely enjoyed your Hiawatha submission. As you know, Union Station still runs Hiawathas today, but they, like most modern trains, have lost their distinctive appearance over the years. Nice 1933 UP ad from Tom yesterday. Low fares in tough times for a lot of people. My dad tells me that gas was 5 cents a gallon (we paid $1.98 yesterday), but who could afford it? Another story he tells is that my grandfather could only afford one shotgun shell a week, which he would use to hunt squirrels, and this was in Monticello Illinois!
Mighty good to see Pete yesterday, and he may be onto something with the coincidental absence of Lars and Ruth. Hmmm. Interesting comparison on time table between pre WWI schedules and those of today. I'll bet, that given the option between fast travel and slower travel with special services, that people would generally opt for faster travel. I sort of feel that way myself, when I compare the costs and time associated with rail travel to airline travel, rail takes more of both.
Glad ya'll liked the baggage smasher. Remember the commercial with the gorilla throwing a Samsonite bag around his cage? All baggage "handlers" are just like that. I've also seen employees at Menards and Home Depot who chuckle when they stupidly knock merchandise off a pallet or shelf. "Workers" like that make me grimace, but even more so the ones who destroy merchandise intentionally. I guess I'll have to take those thoughts to the punching bags in the Rats Patoot room.
Appreciate the support for the "good guys" today Eric! Hey Dave Klepper ... want some brats?
Since I missed the B&O theme day, these are my pix for today.
At the turn of the century if you were taking the night cars of the Baltimore & Ohio for Chicago or St. Louis or even New York which was then a short sleeper hop, you finished a leisurely dinner off diamond back terrapin in Maryland sauce and vintage Maderia at Harvey's Restaurant, climbed into a growler or hansom from the cab rank outside at the corner of Eleventh and Pennsylvania Avenue, and drove decorously through the twilight to the B&O's sedate and equally leisurely conducted Washington terminal. Much of history rode the blue Pullmans of the B&O to and from this almost pastoral setting in a less urgent Washington than the Federal City was ever to be again.
One of the celebrated railroad stations of the world, ranking in renown with Euston Station, London, scene of so many Sherlock Holmes' departures, the Gare du Nord in Paris, and the feudal fortress of the Pennsylvania at Broad Street, Philadelphia, the Baltimore & Ohio's Mount Royal Depot at Baltimore never moved out of the nineteenth century and nobody wanted it to. Derived from an age when horse cabs were the accepted agency of local transport and its primordial steam radiators, rocking chairs and folksy atmosphere generally maintained continuity with yesterday even as Diesel power snarled in the covered train outside.
In the year 1896 when F.W. Blauvelt took this photograph of this train with the caption: "The Royal Blue Line Limited at the Speed of Fifty-five Miles an Hour". The Royal Blue Line was a combination of the Baltimore & Ohio, The Philadelphia & Reading and The Central Railroad of New Jersey running six trains a day between New York and Washington. The fastest of these was on a five-hour schedule, which was uncommonly fast for the time. Known as The Royal Blue Trains, the best were No. 511 and 512 which carried Pullman cars, among them the truly eye-popping Countess from the Chicago World's Fair, and a diner and made an irreducible number of stops en route.
From Jersey City to Bound Brook they went over the Central of New Jersey and via the Reading from Bound Brook to Wayne Junction and thence to Washington on the Baltimore & Ohio's own iron. Reading engines usually took the flyers between Jersey City and Philadelphia and the high stepping camelback in the picture. No. 385 bear the initials "P&R" on its tender. All Pullman equipment bore on its nameboards the state seal of one of the commonwealths through which it operated. The picture below is a B&O traingate in Washington Union Station and its guard in 1905.
Down around the depot when the trains come in had its fascinations in any century, but the B&O classification yards at Baltimore in 1910 still had about them much the same atmosphere as when troop trains were being made up for Gettysburg. In the same year the interior of Tower K in the yards at Washington, although possessed of the latest thing in interlocking devices, was characterized by much of the rustic flavor of a country store where the rustics assembled to discuss the relative merits of James G. Blaine and Grover Cleveland on the basis of the Mulligan letters.
Before the present Union Depot in Washington absorbed the B&O, its own yards were permeated with the flavor of yesterday. The yard worker shown throwing a primeval switch on the main line.
A handsome young man and a beautiful girl met and it was love at first sight. They immediately got married and went on their honeymoon. On their wedding night, the bride went into the bathroom to freshen up.
Unfortunately, she had a case of bad breath so severe she had to take a powerful drug to control it. She was about to take the drug when she decided it would be best to let her husband in on her secret since they would be spending the rest of their lives together.
So she returned to bed without taking the drug.
Her husband then went into the bathroom to freshen up. He also had a problem with foot odor so offensive it required a special preparation to keep it under control. He was about to apply the preparation when he decided it would be better to let his wife know about his problem because she would find out about it sooner or later anyway.
He skipped applying the preparation, returned to bed, grabbed his wife and gave her a big kiss.
She said, "Honey, there's something I have to tell you."
"OK," he said, "but I already know what it is ... you ate my socks."
Hi Lars and everyone else!
Glad your son was waiting. Sounds like in all the trip came out on the plus, and I was relieved when your story got to the point where the wallet was found!
Didn't spend any time in Platsburg, but did spend some time in Scroon Lake. Once recorded some summer concerts in the "Boat House" which was setup as an informal concert hall. This was before Amtrak. Went up to Whitehall on the Laurentian, rented a car, and returned on the Montreal LImited in a roomette. Good service in those days!
A round for the house Tom
First main line diesel leaving London for test run January.15,1948
http://imageserver.ebscohost.com/embimages/imh/getty/full/3225682.jpg
Golden Spike Centennial Limited
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_ar4902a.jpg
Long Island Rail Road
http://arrts-arrchives.com/images3/35on635mt.jpg
http://arrts-arrchives.com/images3/113b.jpg
http://arrts-arrchives.com/images/qqgy1.jpg
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_liir603.jpg
Alco FA2
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/alco1602A.jpg
Freedom Train PA1
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_sf1776.jpg
Santa Fe PA2
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_sf74.jpg
Canadian National FPA4
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/cn9400.jpg
Rock Island DL109
http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/tr_ri621a.jpg
New York Central Rocket RDC
http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/nyc/nyc-m497bll.jpg
Hiawatha
http://image.mplib.org/images/M0409.jpg
http://image.mplib.org/images/M0454.jpg
C&O 2-6-6-6
http://photoswest.org/photos/00002876/00002963.jpg
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr4079_c&o_roundhouse_huntiington_wv.jpg
http://www.cvrma.org/pictures/MISC/dfrr5_021_c&o_2-6-6-6_allegheny_thurmond_wv_1955.jpg
George Armstrong Custer and veterans of the War of 1812. His father Emanuel Custer (wearing a white jacket) sits front and center. The 2 oldest men in the photo were born before the Declaration of Independence. June 15, 1871
http://www.michigan.gov/images/hal_mhc_sa_1812_123754_7.jpg
General Jackson, the first President to ride a train
http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3g00000/3g01000/3g01800/3g01807r.jpg
B&O in 1857
http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/Library/Images/Mellon%20Images/Z24access/z24-00494.jpg
http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/Library/Images/Mellon%20Images/Z24access/z24-00099.jpg
http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/Library/Images/Mellon%20Images/Z24access/z24-00032.jpg
http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/Library/Images/Mellon%20Images/Z24access/z24-00033.jpg
http://mdhsimage.mdhs.org/Library/Images/Mellon%20Images/Z24access/z24-00026.jpg
4-8-2 Washington 1932
http://photoswest.org/photos/00002501/00002590.jpg
Electromotive Chicago 1939
http://photoswest.org/photos/00002501/00002550.jpg
Great steam pic
http://railroad.union.rpi.edu/rolling-stock/Propst's-photos/B&O-4536-2-8-2-9-January-1958-sdm.jpg
Mike
A pleasant Saturday here at the Saloon by the Siding as we've had just a bit more activity than figured on. That's good! I'm hoping Ruth is enjoying here day off with pay while I "slave" here behind the bar. <grin> Offered the same to Leon, but as many of you know, he thinks of this place as "home" and prefers work to idle time. Anyway, Boris is much more manageable with Leon ‘round the place!
Am I the only one who spotted passengerfan Al on this Forum, but NOT here The more things change, the more the stay the same. Go figger. Guess he's a former customer, eh Too bad - life goes on.
So, where are we Ah yes, the acknowledgments!
Doug at 12:26 PM today: Twice in one day, haven't seen that from you in several days. Better watch it, you'll soon have us spoiled! <grin>
I'm really not that well versed regarding all that railroading was and is for the area I reside in. However, I'll surely have sufficient things lined up for us to do during the 2007 2nd Annual Rendezvous in St. Louis. Count on it! Chicago is hands down the bar better area for the experience of riding and watching passenger trains, which of course is what we emphasize ‘round here. Really looking beyond this year and hope we'll have the bar in operation ‘til then.
As Pete ‘n I traveled northward to the area just outside of Chicago's Union Station, we saw an Amtrak baggage car, one of those 1700 series that I believe were former Heritage fleet cars. Looked to be in poor shape though. My Can-Am RR has one of ‘em that I use with a consist of Superliners. Looks great!
Your entry for the baggage car was not only an appropriate submission, but enjoyable too!
James at 12:31 PM today: Better watch it young man - I'm not Ruth!! <grin> Been mistaken for all kinds of people and parts of anatomy, but never a great looking redheaded gal!
Pretty nice stuff from you today and thanx for the elaboration on that Milwaukee Road obs I asked about. Also good stuff on the Hiawathas!
Pete at 2:37 PM today: A rather rare Saturday afternoon visit from the Wolfman! Last week at this time we were assessing the damages ‘round here and walking "the beast" through the wilds of our sub-division! My oh my how time doth fly, eh
Perhaps one day the four of us will travel to Alaska for that marvelous rail adventure aboard the Alaska Railroad. It's indeed quite the treat and something that we shall always remember with nothing but positive thoughts. For me, the Alaska beer aboard the train in our below level "private" dining area was the "icing" on the cake, so to speak. You and I would definitely get into serious difficulty aboard that train! <grin>
Hmmmm, you just MAY be on to something there - Ruth AND Lars, both gone at the same time!! BUT, wait a sec - I gave her the day off without being asked. Hmmmmmm. Verrrrrrrrrrrrrrry interesting.
Regarding that ENCORE! - methinks I'd much prefer the 8 hours aboard the Glasgow bound train rather than one where the time was reduced. After all, isn't it all about being aboard Youbetcha!
I like those "ads" where timetables are included. Really gives a much deeper perspective to it all. And for you, remembrances as well, eh
Catch y'all later (maybe) - tomorrow fer sure, fer sure! Oh yes, heard from trolleyboy Rob via Email and he passes his regards to the gang. Especially liked that "report" from Shane, as I had Emailed it to him - trying to keep him "connected." His difficulties with getting onto the Forums continues. Totally unacceptable and ridiculous, dontchathink
Hi Tom and all.
A bit early but I will try a Winters please TOM. Is it a coincidence that RUTH has the day off the same time LARS is away.
ERIC Thanks for the info on the scanner I will have a look at some. I have loads of prints but it would be good to be able to share some of the old slides, but I will have to see the difference in price.
Good to see the pic of the Big Boy again.No 4006 is at the St Louis Transport Museum so we should be able to see her at the rendezvous.
DOUG Great to see you in . You certainly will be missed in the week. What are we going to do without the jokes to give us a .
Thanks for the last part of the Pickleworks Wreck and those Baggage Smashers could get a job with an airline at any time.
Although I was only in Chicago a short time there was plenty of railway interest in the city, hopefully next time I am there I can fit a ride on the Metro and the L.
JAMES I have managed to see 3 Big Boys so far at Green Bay, Denver and St Louis. I am hoping that I can see the others one day. As Eric says though, it really would be great if one of them could be put back in steam but the cost would be enormous, it would have to be done by a large company.
Enjoy the Hiawatha article . Those F7s look impressive locos I wonder what the size of the driving wheels are.By the engineer standing next to the loco in the second link they look to be about 6 feet 4 inches or so. Mallards drivers are 6 feet 8 inches.
A pic of Mallard.
TOM What a great exprience it must be to travel on the Denali Star drinking Alaska brews. I did not realise the Winters ale was that strong, still I guess when people start to understand what I am saying I have had too many.
I had to cut down my railway book collection to bring over, but the ones I have are in the bookcase I had made to hold them, and are in the room here by the puter. It will be good to get the basement better so I can set up my train. and put the photo albums.
There are a few turntables still operating on preserved sites in the UK and one as recently been installed for steam locos on the Fort William to Mallaig regular steam runs in the West Highlands of Scotland.
As you say we have some real good nostalgia at Our Place lately. Great .
Thanks for the UP advertisement encore.
For my encore I have "borrowed" one of your posts from page 227 Tom
Here's something to ponder with regard to our appreciation and fascination with Classic Trains, this time from Great Britain! Check this pre-WWI poster out! LONDON & NORTHWESTERN and CALEDONIAN RAILWAYS London (Euston) .................. 8h. 0m. Birmingham ...... To ............ 6h. 45m. Liverpool .......... Glasgow ...... 5h. 10m. Manchester ..... (Central) ..... 5h. 5m. Bristol ............................... 9h. 35m. London (Euston) .................. 8h. 0m. Birmingham ...... To ............ 6h. 35m. Liverpool ......... Edinburgh ... 5h. 0m. Manchester .... (Prin. St.) .... 5h. 10m. Bristol ............................... 9h. 45m. London (Euston) .................. 9h. 55m. Birmingham ...... To ............ 9h. 25m. Liverpool ......... Dundee ...... 7h. 15m. Manchester .... (West) ........ 7h. 20m. Bristol .............................. 12h. 20m. London (Euston) .................. 11h. 15m. Birmingham ...... To ............ 11h. 0m. Liverpool ......... Aberdeen .... 8h. 20m. Manchester ........................ 8h. 15m. Bristol .............................. 14h. 20m. LUNCHEON and DINING CARS for the accommodation of FIRST and THIRD CLASS PASSENGERS are run on the undernoted Trains: .......... From London (Euston) To ............................... a.m. .... p.m. Glasgow (Central) .......... 10 0 .... 2 0 Edinburgh (Princes St.) ... 10 0 .... 2.0 ... Perth ........................ 10.0 ... 2*0 ... Aberdeen .................. 10.0 .... 2*0 *to Carstairs .......... From Liverpool To ............................... a. m. .... p.m. Glasgow (Central) .......... 9^50 .... 5 50 Edinburgh (Princes St.) ... 9^50 .... 5*50 ... Perth ....................... 9^50 .... 5*50 ... Aberdeen ................. 9^50 ..... 5*50 *to Carstairs; ^Luncheon Car, Manchester (Victoria) to Glasgow, Liverpool Passengers join at Preston. ........... From Manchester To .................
ENCORE! Saturday - ENCORE! Saturday
As has been the practice on this Thread ("old" 'n "new") we've set aside Saturday as the day for ENCORE! Posts. So here's one from a ways back to continue with this "tradition" . . .
PASSENGER TRAIN NOSTALGIA #61
first Posted on Page 226 of the "old" Thread . . . Here's something to enjoy regarding the Union Pacific (UP) in a 1933 advertisement from my private collection: The trail to "Wonderland" Union Pacific serves 15 of our National parks and more of the famous scenic wonderlands of the West than does any other railroad. Plan now to see the west this summer. We suggest: Zion-Bryce Canyon . . .Yellowstone-Grand Teton . . . . . .Rock Mountain-National Parks . . . . . . . . . Colorado California and Hawaii . . . Pacific Northwest and Alaska . . . . . .Western Dude Ranches . . . . . . . . .Hoover Dam All costs are down. Rail fares are the lowest ever offered. Sightseeing rates, hotels, meals - in fact, all expenses are reduced.
UNION PACIFIC RAILROAD OVERLAND
G-day Tom and all present!
Ruth- Could I get a sandwich, with the works, along with a coffee, Please.
CM3- Well the 2-6-6-6 is a smaller steamer with less weight. Plus it has a more drivers than a regular steamer. So my guess is that the H8 would beable to gain speed faster than the Big Boy. But I am thinking that the Big boy would beable to catch up to the H8 after giving it sometime. But You have to remember that the Big boy is ment to haul big trains. It wasn't ment to make record braking speeds. Even though it had a 80 mph top speed.
Pete- Glad you liked the article on the big boy. It was a really cool steam engine. And I'm surprised that some many are left. There were only a few and made and about half are still around.
Eric- Hmmm. Then what electric line was it that I saw. There were multiple tracks with catenary lines. They were all passenger trains. I will try to find some pictures of them.
BTW: The Big boy pic was really cool. The people standing next to that thing look like peas to that locomotive. It's cool.
Doug- It's good to know you can still visit us.
The pic with the Milwaukee road bed, I don't think you will find much for a town out there. Even Harletton, Montana, isn't much of a town anymore since the railroad was taken out in 1974. It's still there but things have changed drastically.
I also gave your article a read, and I have concluded that the 214 is not looking good. It was fun to read though. I can't imagine the size of the wreck though.
Tom- The Milwaukee road car you saw is called a Beavertail observation car. It was used on the 1935 Hiawatha streamlined Passenger train. It was, as you know, The end car. It was to give it the look of a beavertail, as part of the end of the train. There was a Passenger train called the beaver tail. It's a pretty cool car. None of them survive today unfortunately.
Here's a small article on the Hiawatha.
The Hiawathas were named passenger trains operated by the Chicago, Milwaukee, St. Paul and Pacific Railroad (also known as the Milwaukee Road), and traveled from Chicago to the Twin Cities in Minnesota. The first Hiawatha trains ran in 1935. By 1945, there were actually three routes carrying the Hiawatha name:
Early on, the Hiawatha trains were pulled by steam locomotives, though the trains were by no means slow. In fact, these locomotives (Milwaukee classes A and F7) were some of the fastest steam engines ever built, with schedule times on some routes requiring speeds of well over 100 miles per hour (160 km/h). Some believe that these trains may have broken the official steam locomotive speed record set by the Mallard, as the trains were said to exceed 120 miles per hour (193 km/h) on a regular basis.
The Twin Cities Hiawatha ran twice daily in each direction, with morning and afternoon trains. In 1947, the Olympian train from Chicago to the Pacific Northwest was renamed the
Good afternoon Tom and gang. It's about 3 degrees outside, so I'll be staying inside, drink some scotch, and enjoy the company. A round for the house please, and I'll drop a few Michigan quarters in the jukebox.
I know ... no mention was made as to why I'm not around these daze. I just didn't want to create speculation and unwarranted concern. Thanks for your kind words and welcome back! As for the places and activities ya'll want to attend in Chicgao, the guests can call the shots. I'll just make you aware of what is available. I'm sure it would take weeks in St. Louis to adequately cover the train-related territory there as well.
Lar's earlier mention of a baggage car on his trip reminded me of something I saw in The Trains We Rode by Lucius Beebe & Charles Clegg:
The baggage smasher entered the demonology of American folklore in the era antedating steel framed trunks and valises when the comparatively vulnerable wood and canvas luggage of the period disintegrated in transit to such a degree that railroad baggage masters were universally known as "baggage smashers." Far from being a term of opprobrium, a talent for wrecking luggage was a form of celebrity among railroaders and a source of admiration in the profession. A mock-heroic account of a contest for local supremacy appeared in 1877 in The Philadelphia Record, a community notably on the Baltimore & Ohio main line. "Traquier (one of the contestants for the championship) humped himself over a three story Saratoga trunk with a mansard roof and, bending his muscle to the work, sent the bulky article to the very rear of the baggage car. It was admirably done and would have taken hours to collect the splinters and wearing apparel he had scattered in one brief moment. This spurred Riter, his opponent, to greater efforts. He sprang lightly to a sewing machine and raising it upon his shoulder, winked confidentially to the boys and let her go. It was a beautiful feat. Pieces of fancy cast iron and woodwork lay all over the floor.
... The crowd enjoyed it most when handlers gathered up an ancient valise belonging to some rural citizen ... When the dry goods and two dollar shoes and tinware and groceries burst their bonds, enthusiasm was unbounded ... It was announced that Riter would challenge for the Baggage Smashing Championship of America and a $500 side." The B&O baggage master posing for his official portrait below is deceptively mild of appearance.
A blonde decides to try horseback riding, even though she has had no lessons or prior experience. She mounts the horse unassisted and the horse immediately springs into motion.It gallops along at a steady and rhythmic pace, but the blonde begins to slip from the saddle. In terror, she grabs for the horse's mane, but cannot seem to get a firm grip. She tries to throw her arms around the horse's neck, but she slides down the side of the horse anyway. The horse gallops along, seemingly ignorant of its slipping rider. Finally, giving up her frail grip, the blonde attempts to leap away from the horse and throw herself to safety.Unfortunately, her foot becomes entangled in the stirrup, and she is now at the mercy of the horse's pounding hooves as her head is struck against the ground over and over. As her head is battered against the ground, she is mere moments away from unconsciousness when to her great fortune, Bobby, the Wal-Mart greeter, sees her and unplugs the horse.
Saturday has arrived and all's well in the Village called Mentor! There's freshly baked pastries in The Mentor Village Bakery case, <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts on the Menu Board and the finest coffee this side of Majestic Mount Mentor!
Noted that petrol was at $1.97 (rounded) when my bride and I passed by "Collusion Corner" yesterday. Radio this AM mentioned it was ten cents cheaper in some stations ‘round the area. However, they cautioned one and all not to get used to it as this is only temporary "relief." I'm sure those who screw ‘round with the pricing are working overtime to see what can be done to "spike" it once again. There's gotta be a better way!
Nice way to begin the daylight hours with a Post from barndad Doug! Most appreciative for the time you've given us along the way and pleased to see ya this AM!
Expecting a slow day ‘round here, so I've given Ruth the day off (with pay of course!) - I'll handle the chores ‘til Leon pops in tonight. So remember guys, it's the Proprietor behind the bar on this fine day!
To the acknowledgments:
CM3 at 8:49 AM & 2:42 PM yesterday: Thoroughly enjoyed your thoughts regarding those of us with interest in railroading, real ‘n model. I'm in the category of having never lost interest, but went into a period of inactivity with both. Something about it all that jut gets in your blood, eh Youbetcha!
Haven't any recollections of the sounds of steam bouncing ‘round in my aging head, but I do recall the sights ‘n sounds of GG1s. Now those were some imposing beasts on rails and when they let go with the sounds, well that was chilling to say the least. Wouldn't mind listening to it again (and again!).
Here's hoping the Patriots prevail on Sunday. I don't bet against ‘em, in spite of my disdain for the franchise. <sorry> <grin>
DL at 11:25 AM yesterday: Thanx for the continuing info on the DMUs and "sounds" of railroading. Between you, Eric, Pete ‘n CM3, the nostalgia flows freely ‘round here these days! And a great weekend to you too, Sir! Batten down the hatches, Mate. <oooooooh>
James at 12:37 PM yesterday: Nice contribution from you with the "Big Boy" info opening up some dialogue. That's the idea ‘round here. Appreciate the other remarks too! Must say that the Milwaukee Road link provided a most interesting loco. What can you tell us about that observation car Surely something unique to that road, eh
Lars at 4:32 PM yesterday: Glad you made it in for a "quickie" and your comments brightened up the place. With the snow falling outside and the sounds of Boris clearing the porch and parking area, why it was simply a winter wonderland fer sure, fer sure! <grin>
Hope your weekend with your friends is most enjoyable and we look forward to seeing you whenever you can come by. I'm not scheduled for anything the next few days, so I'll handle the "chores" of being "Manager," and of course "Bar Chandler" along with Proprietor ‘n Chief Bottle Washer ‘til we get back to normal.
Pete at 6:34 PM yesterday: Meant to tell ya sometime back that your favorite brew at the TrainWreck Saloon is made by AB here in St. Louis. And of course we stock it AND the Alaska brew as well. The latter was featured aboard the Alaska RR "Denali Star" on our round trip from Anchorage to Fairbanks via Denali this past June. Not bad, not bad at all - and the trip was good too! <grin>
A suggestion is that when you get the basement squared away to your liking, construct some book shelves and storage bins - free from dampness and the like - for the storage of your RR library, tapes and assorted other goodies. Why not It's something you surely enjoy and have earned to "right" to. Life doesn't get longer, so take advantage of the time you've got, Mate!
Really a well done Post from you, as always and you covered all of the bases quite well!
Would love to be able to show you and the guys an operating turn table (aside from the one for my vinyl records!! <grin>) when you come to the Rendezvous, but alas, they're gone-zo, as far as I know.
I too have a "zillion" slides socked away in the basement. "Some day" I'll convert them over. There are "gizmos" out there where one can place slides into a device for conversion to digital formats which then can be stored on discs. Rather expensive stuff though. Whenever I've had to copy "prints" I've just used my scanner and it has done fine. Nothing elaborate nor designed specifically for fotos. But haven't gotten to the slides yet. I see Eric has responded to your inquiry though . . .
Eric at 1:20 AM today: Undoubtedly Juneau would love the far northern latitudes. However, methinks my bride would not. The idea of 6 months of other than daylight doesn't appear to either of us nor do temps down in the minus 40 (F) ranges do much for walks in the snow! <grin> Fairbanks, Alaska is a fine place to visit during the "midnight sun" times. My first visit up that way was way, way back in time - 1960 I believe, and it surely wasn't tourist season! <grin>
That's quite a Pix of the "Big Boy" and when one takes into account the size of the man standing near it, only then do you fully appreciate the size of that monster on the rails.
Doug at 6:56 AM today: An excellent Post from our earstwhile "weekend guy." Hey! I don't recall implying you were ill or otherwise incapacitated. Thought my comments were rather generic with reference to "it" being a time-related matter. Hmmmmm. Wonder what YOU'VE been drinking! <g
Good morning Tom and friends. I'll have a light breakfast please. It's been a long time since I last checked in. Recent changes to my lifestyle are effectively keeping me from the keyboard during the week, so my visits will be confined to weekends. My participation at the Rendezvous is not affected, and I will be there to meet ya'll.
As usual, the patrons of the bar have been bringing in mighty fine material. Eric had his birthday, and kids across the country had their day off from school. Sure was nifty news to read that his first loco is "alive" after all these years and in a museum. The odds against it must be phenomenal. Speaking of odds, I can't believe how my alma mater (OSU) just completely fell apart. Hope that doesn't happen to my Bears tomorrow. It's going to be another gut-wrencher to watch ... I can feel it. Anyhow, I enjoyed your pix Eric, (especially the one of you on your bike ... before kids got off from school because of your birthday) and you'll find the answer to your question (the probable cause of the wreck) in the final installment of my ENCORE.
That was quite a storm for Tom and Pete to weather. We never got much of anything worth mentioning here, but it did come close. Good thing that Tom has a back-up generator to keep beer from freezing!
Excellent pix from James, and great to see him posting again. I've seen entire presentations of pix that showed former rail operations, and what the area has become since they closed. But it's hard to do in populated areas, and people who try to figure out the old routes find that the old fire department maps are the most useful.
Getting to something that DL said in reference to the train section of the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry, the model railroad section is under maintenance just now. I don't know for how long, but can find out if anyone needs to know. When we have the Rendezvous in Chicago next year, I'm thinking of adding this museum to our list of places to stop, but not to pay the admission. The Zephyr can be viewed at no charge, and aside from the model railroad, there aren't many train-related materials.
Wow! Train trip stories from Lars, and Tom/Pete! Good reading gentlemen, makes me jealous.
Great URLs from Mike as usual, who always finds the most interesting pix to compliment the subjects under discussion. Great to see mining commentary by CM3, who really needs to jump on board the 2007 Rendezvous this May!
Ach! I just read Tom's announcement concerning my not being around during the week. It's not a health or financial problem guys, it's all about available time. I will do my best to catch-up and contribute on weekends.
Welcome to Dave Klepper, which is a name I see all over the Klambach forums.
Somewhat on the same topic .. I received an "invitation" from Klambach for a free copy of "Classic Toy Trains" this last week. Am I lucky, or what?
Wonderful report from CM3! Absolutely hilarious from start to finish (loved the delivery system ... note tied to a brick). On another subject, you wouldn't be hoping for a Bear/Patriot Superbowl rematch this year ... would you? That would be interesting! I just hope my Bears get that far! I see that Lars had the same idea. My opinion that Bears can beat Patriots. Not too sure about the Colts.
Sure don't mean to downplay the many excellent posts by bar-owner Tom, nor the time spent creating, typing, researching and piloting this incredible thread, and keeping it on track. Superlative effort, sir.
And now, for the final installment of the Pickleworks ENCORE:
The Great Pickleworks Wreck by Ron Ziel - Rail Classics May 1979 It took the railroad over five days to clear away the debris and to haul the once-proud speed queens - engines 2 and 214 - to the scrap heap. During the weekend, sightseers had to park as far as a mile and a half away to reach the wreck. Train wrecks had always been an occasion of great social gatherings in Suffolk County, with spectators bringing box lunches and picnicking while they watched the clearing process. Nothing, however, matched the Calverton pile-up. After the dust had settled and the wreckage was cleared, the interest in the pickle works pile-up moved from the Calverton pine barrens to the newspaper editorial pages and the courts. It had taken nearly five hours to get the wrecking train to Calverton, a seemingly long time to travel the 60 miles from Jamaica during an extreme emergency, prompting an official condemnation of the LIRR by the court of inquiry. Despite testimony that revealed that the wreck had been caused by the lead engine splitting the pickle-house switch which was the result of a bolt having worked loose on one of the points, the coroner's inquest exonerated the railroad from blame. Shortly thereafter, it was revealed that Dr. Clarence Miles, the coroner, was an employee of the LIRR and carried a pass. Several other county coroners also had passes and one resigned in the ensuing scandal. A grand jury was convened and the Interstate Commerce Commission Investigation found the railroad at fault. In October, the grand jury roundly condemned the LIRR for laxness, apathy and failure to properly maintain and inspect the switch, but no indictments were handed down. Almost up until World War II, there was a grisly reminder - sort of a monument - of the Great Pickle Works Wreck. The foundation of the Golden building became weed-grown, but arching up out of the middle of it was a long, bent rail from the siding, which Engine No. 2 tore up as she ravaged the right of way. This most famous and celebrated of Long Island Railroad wrecks is still a topic of conversation among old-timers, like the 1938 hurricane. The railroad went on to perform with an incredibly good safety record of 24 years without a single passenger fatality due to negligence, until the Rockville Center disaster in February, 1950. To those who lived on eastern Long Island in the 1920's, however, the Great Pickle Works Wreck will always be remembered as a classic, with all of the melodrama, excitement, and morbid romance associated with the terrible wrecks of the 19th Century. It happened over a half century ago - to the old-timers it was yesterday.
Good morning Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!
Finally Friday night... Hello Leon! No, no pizza. I would like a juicy Filet Mignon! It's Friday only once a week!
It seems like Our place was kind of busy today! That's nice! Took me some time to catch up.
DL – Kiruna is pretty far from Uppsala, where you stayed. 733 miles to be more exact. There are several iron ore mines in and around Kiruna. Tom – I love the northern part of Sweden in the summer time, when there is 24 hrs of daylight, but it is way too cold and too dark in the winter time for me. But I bet Juneau would love the life north of the Arctic Circle!CM3 – My memories of train whistles/horns are dominated of the steam engines that were still in use when I grow up in the old country. Swedish steam locos had often a very “lonely” sound and when I heard the whistle from a train far away a cold winter night in the middle of nowhere, wow, that was chilling!! I can still hear it when I think about it. I have a Long Playing record with the sounds of Swedish steam locomotives including one where you hear and get that lonely feeling!James – I don’t know that there are any electric locomotives in the Chicago area, only electric MU’s. So I am afraid I can’t help you. The only electric lines I know of are Metra Electric Line and Chicago, South Shore & South Bend Railroad and they run on 1,500 V DC. AEM-7 runs on 11 kV - 25 kV AC. I checked my books but couldn’t find anything about any electric locomotives in Chicago. Big Boy is/was really something else! To bad there is no one operational today. I can’t help showing a picture of a Big Boy . I have shown it before but it is worth a second look.
Lars – Snow in Mentor Village? Here we have had rain all day, but I am not complaining, we are in desperate need of all the percipitation we can get! Rain always remind me of a strange fact. Today people can fly to the moon, dock with the space station and come back, but it seems impossible to make windshield wipers that don’t make all kinda of noise. It drives me nuts!They are quiet for a few weeks when they are brand new, but then... Talking about London, I saw on the news this morning a jetliner taking off from one of the airpots in or around London under heavy crosswind. The same second the landing gear lost contact with the ground the plane turned to the left with its nose and flew with the body at a 45° angle to the course! Amazing!Pete – I will post more roundhouse pictures on Sunday! I would say the best way to transfer your pictures/slides to a digital format is to scan them yourself. Then you can adjust and clean them and get them exactly the way you want them. I have a film scanner and a flatbed scanner that can also scan negatives and slides. You can get a decent scanner for prints for about $100. If you need to scan negs and slides you have to pay more, depending on the quality you want. I have never used a photo shop for scanning so I don’t know how much they charge.
Eric
I will have a Kimberley Mild to start please RUTH and a round for the fine posts today.
ERIC Thanks for the pic of the roundhouse, it looks one of the half circle type. Looking forward to see some more pics and it is good to know the example shown is still being used although not for railway locos.
I have now got my slides dating from the mid to late 1970s over from England, perhaps you can help me, what is the best way to get them on to the computer, I guess you can take them to a photo shop and it sounds you have got a scanner. How much does a scanner cost and have you any idea what the charge is to get them transferred in a shop. Thanks.
I remember those audits at work.
DL Thanks for the link to the bad weather there as been in the UK. It seems as though the railways are at least getting some trains running. I had a phone conversation with a friend from my home town and they still have power although a lady in a car was injured when a tree fell on her car about 1/2 mile from my old house.
Those Gresley Quad-Art coaches look to be coming on very well, they will look superb when they are back on the North Norfolk Railway especially when being hauled by the N2 or N7 0-6-2 tank loco..
That is a good web-site on the Barrow Hill Roundhouse. I have not been there since it as become a preservation centre, but I did visit there in BR days when they held an Open Day . If I recall right they were giving rides behind an 03 0-6-0 diesel shunter and at that time there was a good number of the class 20s stabled near the depot.. Last year they had a Real Ale Festival in the depot and a couple of friends went up to it and had a great time, on the way back they called in the Brunswick in Derby. Wish I had been there,.
One of the great things about Our Place is it stirs up the memory. Your mention of the photo in Trains Illustrated reminded me of a pic in Railway Magazine from the 50s I looked for and found it in in the 1956 volume. It shows a GWR railcar on fire at Bridgnorth station on the Severn Valley Railway. All the passengers got off safely and although the driver had the good presence of mind to put the railcar under the water column, for filling the steam locos tenders, the railcar could not be saved .
I would think that the coaches built to the pre MK1 designs would have had the second letter I do not know for sure. One interesting thing I found out was, on the LNER EMUs which were built for the Manchester to Hadfield passenger service on the Manchester to Sheffield 1,500Volt DC line they were numbered E 59401 etc, in a book from 1959 when this EX Great Central line was taken over by the Midland Region the units were numbered M59401E. But in the picture in the link the car is M59403M, perhaps the works where the units were worked on had closed or been taken under Midland Region control. One thing about this hobby of ours it is never dull.
http://www.anteater.freeuk.com/MUgallery/emumisc/506.htm
The first generation DMUs also had the letter before the number donating the region the unit worked on when they first came out. I believe this lasted until the late 1970s early 80s.
CM3 I had not heard that expression about beer but how true it is. There is an old English folk song called "John Barleycorn" about beer.
Wonderful post on the sounds of the steam and diesel locos another thing that can bring back the memories is the smell as well, being at a preserved railway or on a main line steam special a whiff of the coal burning, steam and hot oil and 40 odd years disappears. As you say once an interest in railways gets in your blood I think you are hooked for life..
Reading your first post I dug out some tapes that were given free with the Steam Railway magazine many years ago, I found them while going through stuff in England. They were by Peter Handford who was Britains premier railway sound recorder. Unfortunaly I have lost the mags which gave the description of the tapes.I also have a CD of LMS steam locos somewhere Great Stuff. These were originally released on vynal records. Those recordings by O. Winston Link must be wonderful.
As to loco whistles the best for me has to be the A4s chime whistle as nearly all the UK whistles were very bland. On one A4, No 60010 Dominion Of Canada she was fitted with a chime whistle donated by a Canadian railway as was very destinctive as I can tell as she is featured on the tape along with some other
G'day Cap'n Tom & fellow travelers at the bar!
<huff> <puff> <stomp> <stomp> Geesh! Cold out there and the snow is beginning to pile up here in Mentor Village. Looks like Vito's street gang has a late start because things are getting rough on the roads. Ahhhhhhhhh, nice in here though. Ruth my deAH, you are as radiant as evAH. I think today a JD on the rocks will do - make it a double if you please. A round for the house, snacks for the critters and of course a small jar of pickled pig's feet for "our man," Boris!! <grin>
Well, for a place that supposedly is on death's door step, I'd say we're doing quite well with the quality material. Some really great reading today and very good to see two posts each from DL in Merry Olde and CM3 I'm NOT Shane! in God's Country, otherwise known as West Virginia! <grin> Nice one from James as well. All around decent day INSIDE. Here in Can-Am County and in particular the Village of Mentor, it's winter with all that goes with it. May as well get stranded here as anywhere else I could think of. Next to being in the obs dome of a Budd streamliner, well this place will do just fine!
Been one of those days for me as we've had quite a few things to get squared away before the weekend rolls around. Have some out of town folks popping in, so the Larsman may be a bit scarce ‘til Monday. We'll see. Also, NFL playoffs will be on the agenda for Sunday. I'm figuring the Super Bowl will be the Bears & Patriots. Since I'm an NFC guy, GO BEARS!
Hey Tom! Good to see you out ‘n about the decks this AM. Still keeping things ship-shape for us and moving steadily along. Received your Email and I must say, there's some interesting approaches for us to consider.
Winds in Europe have been something else, huh Been watching the tube and the scenes from London and the airports told the story. Amazing that any "birds" got in or out during all of that. Hope our friend DL and all associated with him are safe ‘n sound. Hunker down in a neighborhood pub, that's always a wise choice. Heck, you guys could care less if the power goes out, since you prefer the brew on the warm side! <grin>
Steam whistles, diesel horns and of course the "blasts" emitted from ships are indeed interesting to read about. Nothing like being fogbound in a busy shipping channel only to have the wits frightened out of you by the sound of something like the Queen Mary "sneaking" up on ya! Could ruin a guys day! <grin>
Would love to stick around a bit longer, but I've really gotta skedaddle. Promised the Mrs. we'd take the boys and their wives to dinner. So figuring out which Pizza Joint to go to is where I'm at right now. Only kidding. We do have a favorite place that we've frequented over the years as a family, so off we'll go in a bit.
Remember guys, tonight is Pizza ‘n Beer Night at the Tavern by the Tracks. The place should start rocking in about a half hour or so. I see the CN & CP track gangs are in the pool room with the Can-Am crew due in shortly. Should be another amazing Friday Night at the fights!
Should I not be back ‘til Monday - have a great weekend one and all.
Until the next time!
Lars
Good Afternoon Barkeep and all Present; coffee, please; round for the house and $ for the jukebox. Also, give me a couple of sinkers form the round glass container on the counter (Lord knows when I'll be getting dinner this evening)
The snow has held off so far, but I just got off the phone with a buddy in Pittsburgh and it's coming down pretty well up there.
DL - Re the OWL (O. Winston Link) recordings, they are pricy, but my, my. Three of them are especially worthwhile. These include: "Thunder on Blue Ridge," "Second Pigeon and the Mocking Bird," and, IIRC, "West of Panther." I am not sure of the title of the last one, but I have been to beautiful downtown Panther and know that the town name was in the recording title. Great stuff to frighten the neighbors; especially the whistles on the Y6s.
BTW, the town of Davy, WV, (also on the Pokey,) has a public library (in a mobile home) which sits just beside the N&W main line. Lots of fun to call there as all phone conversation stops when the trains go by which is quite often.
Also about recordings, back in the day, Mobile Fidelity did one called "Mr. D's Machine." I have no idea whether it is available in any form now - excellent SP diesel material (including a Baldwin switcher - gets points from me just for that), as well as F units and Cadillacs. Last (but not least) YEARS ago there was one out titled "Railroad - Sounds of a Vanishing Era." This was all Illinois Central material including a steam runby that was beautiful. The Chesapeake and Ohio Historical Society produced a vinyl recording of C&O steam back in the 70's. Much of this was recorded on the James River Sub.
James - The C&O H8 gave the Big Boy a run for its money. I understand, different locomotives for different purposes and the H8, by all accounts was misused, but it was one @#$% of a machine. For those not familiar with it, an H8 was a Lima-built 2-6-6-6.
Well, I'd better get back to it - good weekend to all and Go, Patriots!
Work safe
G-day Tom and all present.
Ruth- could you get me a coffee with a sandwich. Thanks
Eric- So if it wasn't the AEM-7, then what was it? It must have been really similar to it. I walked right over the electrics. They were all humming with electricity ready to leave. Can you give me an idea of what locomotive I might have been looking at?
DL- Those B17 streamlined steamers are really quite nice looking. They reminded me of the Milwaukee roads streamlined passenger train back in 1935. The Baltics and there passenger train looked similar to that B17. They really didn't have much of a nose on them. Just a flat rounded front.
Here's a link to the picture of one of the baltics. http://www.lionel.com/products/ProductNavigator/_ProductImages_590/6-38094_3379.jpg
I also liked the Oliver Cromwell steamer. That is one of the nicest looking steam engines I have seen. It shines in the sunlight.
Tom- Well I am certainly sad to here that Doug can't be with us much anymore.
He had a lot of interesting topics and many pictures. But I am glad to here that he can still come on once in awhile.
Anyway. I got a kick out of the Train horn link you had posted. I saw some of my favorite horns there. The Nathan P5 air horn and the Nathan K3LA air horn. Some pretty nice horns.
I also liked the article on the Railways with Europe- Eurostar. Some good reading there. I have learned quite a bit about all the different railways. It's pretty cool.
Pete- I believe that the Up Big Boy weighs in at a little over 600 tons. I believe the locomotive on the steamer weighs about 400 tons and the tender wieghs about 200 tons. So the tender would out weigh most diesel locomotives and most steam. It was one big locomotive.
Also liked the Old round house link. I have a round house as a model and it's pretty cool, but I don't have one thats from the 1800s. That was cool.
Here's a little passage on the Union Pacific Big Boy.
They are often proclaimed as the largest steam locomotives ever built, but that title is quite controversial - there were heavier locomotives, and possibly more powerful locomotives. However, without tender, the Big Boy's locomotive body was the longest of all of them and fully loaded with water and fuel the Big Boy was the heaviest of all of them, even though the locomotive without tender was lighter than some.
The Big Boys were the only locomotives to have the 4-8-8-4 wheel arrangement in the Whyte notation - in other words, combining two sets of eight driving wheels with both a four-wheel leading truck for stability at speed and a four-wheel trailing truck to support a large firebox. The locomotive's wheel arrangement makes it clear that it was designed for power at speed.
The Big Boy locomotives were created by the Union Pacific's need for a locomotive that could pull a 3600 short ton (3300 metric ton) freight train over the long 1.14% grade of the Wasatch. Helpers were needed for this grade at the time. Adding and removing helpers from a train, crewing them, etc. slowed down the movement of trains. For such a locomotive to be worthwhile, it had to be more than just a slow mountain lugger; to avoid locomotive changes, the new class would have to be able to pull that long train at speed - 60 mph (100 km/h) - once past the mountain grades.
In fact, the Big Boys were designed to be stable at 80 mph (130 km/h), so they were built with a heavy margin of safety. Few previous articulated locomotives were capable of such speed; UP's earlier Challenger 4-6-6-4s were, however, and in many respects the Big Boy could be regarded as a longer, heavier and more powerful Challenger.
Twenty-five of them were built, split into two groups of 20 and 5 locomotives. All were coal burning, with large grates to burn the Union Pacific's low quality Wyoming coal. One locomotive, #4005, was converted to oil burning, but unlike the experiences on the smaller Challengers, oil burning was not successful. The locomotive soon reverted to the standard (coal burning) configuration. The often cited reason for the unsuccessful oil-fired test was the use of a single burner which, with the Big Boy's larger firebox, created a very unsatisfactory and uneven heating. It remains unexplained why multiple burners were not used.
The Big Boys did sterling service in the Second World War, especially since they proved so easy to fire that even a novice could do a fair job. Since many men who were unsuited to combat service were instead drafted into the railroads to replace crewmen who had joined up, this proved highly advantageous. During the war, after German agents filed reports that the Americans had giant steam engines that were moving huge trains full of vital war material over steep mountain grades at high speed, their reports were dismissed as "imposs
Hello Tom
I'll just have a beer please, but firstly thanks to CM3 for that superb answer to my query about the North American air horn. Much appreciated, and 'evocative'!
Tom, just to pick up on your point about the Theme days, I agree with your line of thinking, lets see what people think, if there is enthusiasm we could do the RDC/DMU idea of mine, if not, well - I'll just post the stuff I was going to outline anyway, but in the meantime I'll hold off to see what the consensus is.
However, I can still say that I can now see your line of thinking with the DMU paint scheme and how that might lead one to think it was an artic - in fact you are on the right lines, the cars are 'semi-permantly coupled' , but not articulated, so that paint scheme can work reasonably well enough - and there is a driving cab at each outer end, so even if you have a broken down car, you can switch the one needing repair out, put another in and the paint scheme still works - intermediate cars (none were pictured on that page I don't think) don't have the 'up' bit of the paint design so longer units could have those inserted without the paint scheme looking too foolish.
I'll place a food order for later, and CM3, if you're still in what are you drinking? It's on me.
Incidentally, and on the subject of whistles / horns, I've been wondering about buying a copy of the O Winston Link sound recordings available from the museum that celebrates his stuff. I've always enjoyed his photos and figure the sound recordings (originally on vinyl but now on CD), must be pretty good too - does anyone have them?, are they as good as they look? - they are not cheap. Presumably the sound is all N&W steam?
Enjoy the weekend all
DL
Good Morning Barkeep and All Present; coffee, please (New England Breakfast Blend if you have it), round for the house, and $ for the jukebox.
Cloudy, cold and windy here this a.m. There is some talk of snow, but we shall see. IOW, five weather forecasts on the local cable system; pick the one you like. The K9s enjoyed it this a.m. All were facing into the wind, noses working overtime. Our ‘Steamed Proprietor can doubtless relate to this when he performs his a.m. tasks. Appreciated your comments re dogs searching for folks - both of mine can remember when food fell on the floor years ago (LOL).
A few comments than onto something else for today.
Dave - Have seat and join in!
Tom - Thanks for rerunning the Eurostar material.
Lars - I think you can see why the Mentor and Southern Narrow Gauge folks were intrigued by the Crush Crash. Remember it's only about 35-36 days until pitchers and catchers report.
Pete - Thanks for the kind words; as my wife says, "You only rent ale or beer."
Eric - It was a FINE time at the theatuh!
DL - On January 17, you mentioned something re horns on American locomotives. You are correct in thinking that certain roads tried to duplicate the sound of steam whistles on their diesels. The New Haven was the prime example of this as they used Hancock chime whistles on their locomotives; very distinctive and quite pretty, especially on a fast-moving train.
All of which brings me to the following.
Many of us got involved with railroading at a very early age. Some of us got away from it for awhile (life has a way of happening), others never left, and still others came to it later on. I fall in the middle area (never lost interest). One of the things which drew us to it probably was sight, and above all, sound.
For example, a lot of people refer to the N&W Class J as having a steamboat whistle. All I know is that the sound of a J was so low and deep that it made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. I was fortunate to be at Christiansburg when their Class A was westbound coming up the hill. Maybe it was the fact that it was raining, but the sound of the "hooter" on 1215 was chilling.
The NKP and PM 2-8-4s that ran in excursion service all had similar sounding whistles; strictly business.
However, the most businesslike sound to me was always that of the horn on a GG1. Those of you who ever spent time around them know what I mean. Stand by a grade crossing when a G went by, and you knew that important things were going on and you'd better get out of the way.
Other roads had so-called chime horns on their diesels. Those on L&N and on Southern E units come to mind here.
We won't even get into all of the different sounds that Alco products had; both on the outside and "under the hood."
Today, I get to hear big GEs on coal trains that pass by the old C&O tracks near the house, and if the wind is right trains on the former Virginian line which is not too far away. It's reassuring.
What do you remember?
Friday at the Bar by the Ballast and the promise for a relaxing weekend to come! Why not begin this final day of the work week (for many) with a hot cuppa freshly ground ‘n brewed Java, some pastries from The Mentor Village Bakery and of course our <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts from the Menu Board
Not a bad day yesterday, eh Some quality offerings and I note the Eurostar piece was well received. Surely the highlight had to be the "report" from our Ace Reporter high atop Majestic Mount Mentor! CM3 from the south of west Virginia outdid himself once again! A gold 5- Salute to the man from the hills!
Appears as if we may just have a budding replacement for the early morning time slot vacated by our friend barnyard Doug. Seems that DL has taken a liking to the early AM (for us) timeframe. That's terrific and I hope it "holds" - we surely can use the support.
Some may have picked up on the absence of a "Theme" for this past Tuesday and the next one up. As our numbers have dwindled, it occurred to me that there's far too much effort expended in putting forth some original works only to languish on these Pages without benefit of the responses deserved. That's not to say those of you who DO participate and DO offer "works" aren't appreciated -for you certainly are. However, I'm going to hold off ‘til we see an upsurge in activity ‘round here. Of course any of you should not hesitate to provide anything you wish, on any day, in support of the overall "theme" of this Forum - Classic Trains!
Now to the acknowledgments:
CM3 at 1:06 PM yesterday: What's to say that hasn't already been said A terrific report on last week's Anniversary bash over at the Emporium. Certainly was a night to remember (where have we seen THAT before ) and they're still cleaning up the place following the "spirited" exit from the balcony. Some even used the stairs! <grin>
Lars at 2:53 PM yesterday: A fine supplement to Shane's report with those URLs! Must admit, I knew zip, zero, zilch about either reference. Thanx! Also, fully concur regarding your remarks about CM3s extensive knowledge of trains and the "things" that surround them - simply amazing.
Your mention of the Battery tunnel and the Narrows bridge surely brought to mind some memories. I recall each of them being constructed! Guess that makes me O-L-D. Many of us on Staten Island weren't thrilled by the linkage to Brooklyn via the Verrazano bridge. We were rather secure in our isolation until that was complete. Then, the Borough took on changes as I've heard and seen during a return for a reunion back in 1981. Didn't like what I saw as "my Island" really appeared so different. But I digress . . .
Pete at 8:32 PM yesterday: Much appreciate your appearance at the bar with a Post chock full o' informative stuff from the Wolfman!
I see you've taken quite a liking to our Winter Ale supply, eh I've notified the distributor to always keep an extra keg on hand in the basement so we'll NEVER run out.
When I first arrived in these parts (1977) there was an operating round table alongside one of the roads that led to my work. Of course back then there were no steam locos, but every now ‘n then I'd see a switcher being turned or another yard loco heading in or out of its shed. Couldn't dilly dally as the traffic was always too heavy. Lord knows if one slowed down, one became road kill! <grim> I guess that table was taken apart about 2 or 3 years later with only the markings on the ground to show where it was. Sad.
As you already know, I have a "thing" for DMUs and particularly am enthralled with the RDCs by Budd. News, eh <grin> Anyway, between you and DL, I'm getting much pleasure from the URLs and links that have been provided for views of some mighty fine cars. Thanx!
I couldn't get that LCR link to load - I'll try later!
With all that time we had here at the house, we didn't get into the S-Capades room, did we I guess Juneau and all of his walks kept us away from the trains and away from the beer! By the by, he's on "your bed" once again this morning. Slept there all night too! Must be the "sniffs" of the room and bedding, as it will all go into the wash this weekend. <grin>
Eric at 11:00 PM yesterday: Any place north of the Arctic Circle is "okay" by me! I'm strange that way. When I came across that Kiruna article, I figured you'd have some additional insights. Thanx!
It wasn't all that long ago when I was considering the pursuit of an advanced degree in Anthropology with an emphasis on the Circumpolar Peoples (
Good morning Tom
I'll have a light breakfast today please, with some Coffee. I need to catch up with the reviews from the Emporium, kindly supplied by CM3, always a nicely written piece, captures the atmosphere I think.
Well, as Pete mentioned, some pretty crazy winds here (although as a country of ‘modest' weather anything out of the ordinary seems to throw things into chaos!) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6277767.stm
Threat of falling structure onto electric wires caused closure of our street car system yesterday, and from what people say the management didn't have a proper contingency plan to move folk - so I hope they learn from that.
Most of the rail system is back to normal today, although services on the east and west coast are running a special timetable - I guess this is due to problems they had with the overhead catenary systems on those routes. Sadly there seem to have been a number of deaths due to tree falls and the line - although I suspect these happen regularly just don't make the news unless there is a major storm - that makes no difference to the victim or their loved ones of course - so it is very sad.
Tom, you asked about that diesel railcar unit, and I'll answer the specific in a mo, but I was going to digress onto related info and then thought - hey, maybe ‘Passenger Diesel Railcars and Multiple Units of the classic era' could be a possible Theme Day topic. What do you think? I'd do some UK stuff (hopefully Pete would be happy to do stuff too), but I'd also be able to learn more about RDCs etc if others were happy to post about that?
Anyway, that unit in the picture would not have been articulated. The paint scheme (red white and blue) was the one adopted for trains in the south east of England circa 1986 and lasted up until BR privatisation in the mid 1990s - although you still see some trains in that paint scheme even now. In fact articulated passenger cars are unusual in the UK - although the Eurostar trains are articulated, and the LNER built wooden bodied articulated carriages to go with the streamlined steam A4 locomotives we have been discussing recently on their prestige trains of the 1930s.
They also had some articulated suburban coaches from the same period - again made of wood. Some are being restored as here:
http://www.mandgn.co.uk/quadart.html
Thanks for the Eurostar run down - the full high speed London - Paris service is due to launch November 2007. I look forward to making an early run. I hope thy do go for a new record run - I expect they will do a record London - Paris run for publicity. I wish they would launch a ‘Golden Arrow' service, using the famous named train name again.
Pete, here's the website for the roundhouse you mentioned, not been there myself although it is not far away:
http://www.barrowhill.org.uk/
Good links to the GW railcar info - I did not know there was one on the K&ESR, despite it being a location I have visited several times over the years, as it is near where I grew up. Very nice line in my view. I recall seeing an old ‘Trains Illustrated' showing one running on the Severn Valley line back before that route was closed by BR! I understood the original 1930s idea was to run them as fast, frequent inter city services on cross country GWR routes with lighter passenegr loads - eg Gloucester to Bristol etc?
Interesting point about carriage numbering. I knew the second Letter indicated pre nationalisation constructed vehicle, and first Letter indicated operating region, but did not realise why. So a carriage numbered M12345E would be operating on the midland region, but built by the lnEr, or a carriage S12345S would be operating on the Southern Region and built by the Southern Railway pre nationalisation, whereas a post nationalisation built carriage would just be numbered M12345 with no suffix letter. The thing is, I did not realise why, so from your explanation it was presumably that the works of the company that built the vehicles knew how to maintain them, so they had to go back to that region? Presumably all works knew how to repair the later BR standard design vehicles? I recall seeing SR design EMUs running on London commuter routes as late as the 1980s with the 'S' Suffix - eg 4 SUB type!
Would a carriage built to a pre nationalisation design, but after 1948 have had the suffix letter too, do you know? Eg before the BR Mk1 was introduced they carried on building carriages to the old private company designs, so would an LMS design carriage built after 1948 still be numbered M98765M for example?
Eric - nice roundhouse picture. Tom's Kiruna article reminded me that I was en route to Kiruna (to attend a wedding as a guest) when I took the run through to Narvik, stopping off at Kiruna on the way back towards Uppsala, where we were staying. Certainly a big iron ore extracting place!
Lars - all I can say about the Crush collision is - remarkable!
Cheerio
Good evening Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!
An early visit tonight! Leon, Thursday, I'll have my favorite, Rumpsteak Café de Paris!! Yes, black coffee! Thank you!
A long day is coming to its end. We had an ISO audit at work today and that is always creating a lot of activities just before it starts to make sure everything is in order. Last weekend I started to go through some more slides I have and they will start showing up here at the bar soon.
Tom – Looking forward to listen to your layout!Most of the hearing is gone on my left ear, permanent. It is 17 years since it happened and I am used to it now. Yes, I know that city, Kiruna, quite a bit north of the Arctic Circle. The Christmas picture of the X2000 was taken in Kiruna. Hardly any daylight at all this time of the year, 24 hours daylight (midnight sun) in the summer. A lot of interesting facts about the Eurostar trains! If I remember correctly the Channel Tunnel is also called the Chunnel by people. I am sure Pete and DL know.CM3 – Thanks for a first class report from the Mentor Theatre's Anniversary Extravaganza! It must have been an evening to remember!! I regret I didn’t go. Lars – Fired on day and rehired the next! Imagine something like the crash at Crush happening today, killing some people? A lot of lawyers would make a lot of money! Thanks for the link!Pete – There are still quite a few roundhouses in use around the country. But some have been demolished and others are used for other purposes. The small roundhouse you can see in the picture below is still being used. Not for any locomotives though. I’ll find some more roundhouses to show.
The picture quality is not good (scanner problem) but it shows a Class B steam locomotive on the turntable in 1968.
Dave Klepper, I can only say what Lars already said, hope you will come back again soon!
A pint of Winter,s ale please LEON and can you put me down for the Fish N Chips for later please .
ERIC Looking forward to the pic of the roundhouse.Are many of them still in existance or have they been demoished after the locos were removed.
The roundhouses were common in Britain during steam days. As far I am aware there is only one still in railway use and that is now a museum at Barrow Hill near Chesterfield in Derbyshire in the North Midlands of England. There is also a now unique half- roundhouse still in use by EWS( a British railfrieght company) in Cornwall at St Blazey. The roundhouses were great in steam days for spotting as you just had to go in the middle to get the numbers, but it seemed there was always at least one with the tender facing the turntable.
One of the original roundhouses dating from 1846 in London, as been turned into an Arts Venue. I remember seeing rock concerts there in the 70s. Here is a link.
http://www1.roundhouse.org.uk/about/history/
DL Thanks for the link to the Great Western Streamined Railcars. I recall seeing one at Worcester shed in the early to mid 1960s, it was stored and was in the "Blood and Custard" livery of BR in the early 50s. The car was numbered W20W. The first W meant that the car was allocated to the Western region of BR and the second W meant that the car was to be sent to a Western Region works for major attention. The second letter was mainly seen on pre-1948 vehicles.
There are three of the GWR railcars preserved No 4 is in the National Railway Museum collection at Shildon, No 22 at the Didcot Railway Centre and No 20 at the Kent & East Sussex Railway. No 22 formerly W22W was for a time at the Severn Valley Railway in the early 70s and was used in service, I believe it still gives rides on the demonstration track at Didcot, where I have had a ride in it. Here is a link to No 20.
http://www.kesr.org.uk/diesel_locos/20.htm
This shows a pic of the car under, what must be called, a major renovation. I am sure ROB will appriciate the hard work the volunteers will have to do to bring No 20 back to her former glory .
Great link to the BR Single Car DMUs, or Bubble Cars as they were known. Great pics I wonder where the pic of 55023 in green was taken. I remember a trip from Oxford to Banbury in one after being on the ale, with no toilet. I was never so glad to see Banbury station.
If you need some help with Tom's question on 54287 let me know.
I believe Britannia 70013 Oliver Cromwell was used on the 1/4 mile demonstration track in her new home at the museum at Bressingham, Norfolk giving footplate rides soon after her BR service in 1968 how long this was for I am not sure.
CM3 Another wild night in the Mentor Village. What we do without our intrepid reporter relaying the events, although BORIS rising from the pit is a sight I wish I could forget. I always thought those Second Class Saloon guys could not be trusted.
Really great report, many thanks. I had many .
LARS Thanks for the kind words. May I agree with what you said about DOUG and ROB, my sentiments but you have said it better than I could.
The links were most helpful to the references made in CM3's fine post. I have seen a still photo of the crash at Crush I never knew it was the KATY railroad that staged the crash until now.
TOM Running late again. I was tring to get something on the bad weather they have had in Britain including winds of 70 to 80 MPH. Apparently there are over 20 trees down in my home town and heavy snow in Scotland, perhaps DL will give us some more news on it. Anyway while I was doing it I must have overloaded the puter, was I using WP. NO, will I learn, I hope so .
Interesting link to the Kiruna story.
It is good to read the Eurostar post again. It is certainly a modern classic. I
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