Hi Tom and all
Time for another winter brew this time I think I,ll try a Batemans Victory please LEON.
I think as you say Tom we were lucky to get snow and not the ice you had.
Great minds think a like and the Bride took this pics this morning
The last one is titled poor duck.
It was a lot more dig dig for me today to get the car out, but it was a lot warmer than they said it would be, it could get tricky tonight as the roads are wet just now.
DOUG I see you got your share of snow as well. Great encore on the bank notes, there is still a lot of good material in the Roundhouse site I have just been reading some.I remember the joke as well.I agree we should have Our Place banknotes no doubt Vito The Hit noes some guys who can print them for us.
ERIC Really hope you can get the forum probs sorted, it is annoying for you but at least we are still able to read your posts..
TOM Really interesting link to the Interstates, that was one under-estimation of the cost and time frame though.
I think we shall have to go on an Amtrak trip they said that the track repairs should have been completed at the end of November.
Unfortunatly I have not gotten your E-Mail.
TOM Although this in the link would not be popular in church do you think it would be popular behind the bar.
http://www.bottledbeer.co.uk/index.html?beerid=383
Actually I had it on tap a while ago and it is quite good.
Enjoyed the Rock Island encore and the Lonnie Donigan lyrics( I believe he also done a song about "The Battle of New Orleans" which was one of the first 45s I had.) I always think of the Rock Island when we head down Highway 54 as is passes along side the RI Kansas City to St Louis line near Eldon. The track is still there in places but it must have been many many years since it was used.
For a encore I will do a post of mine from the same time as the Rock Island one which was on the 26th of September 2005, it is about the locos that ran on the Scottish Highland steam run of that year
ENCORE
I have managed to get in touch with my pal in England and I have more info on the locos on the MALLIAG runs this year. For most of the season it was worked by ex L.N.E.R. locos 2-6-0 K1 class #62005 and 4-6-0 B1 class #61264. In September he went on a trip with LMS Black 5 # 45407 from Glasgow to Fort William where it was exchanged with 61264 which is doing a 3 days steam tours in its native East Anglia. I believe the class 5 #44767 as in the photo has had a season on the Malliag runs . The Valve gear you asked about NICK is STEPHENSON' S on this loco. There were no LMS class 5's saved with CAPROTTI valve gear althogh a B.R. Standard 5 with Caprotti gear has been restored this year and is running at the Midland Railway Centre at Butterley Derbyshire. As to THE GREAT MARQUESS, I have been told it is a 3-Cylinder K4 2-6-0 a small class of loco built special for working the West Highland line. It was owned by LORD GARNOCH. (not too sure about the spelling). Some time ago the elderly Lord became ill and the engine was made up to main line standard. It left its home on the Severn Valley Railway working a railtour part of the way to get the loco up to Fort William. As his Lordship had always wanted to see the engine working in the Highlands, I believe the loco stayed at Fort William only for a few weeks. I was fortunate enough to travel behind the loco as it made its way home. We travelled over the Settle-Carlisle where a stop was made at Garside where minute of silence was held signaled by the loco whistle for his Lordship who had passed away shortly after the engine arrived in the Highlands. His wish had been granted.
Well I'll have another ale and get ready for the Steak, LEON.
Hi Tom and everyone, a round for the house.
Well they ran through the briars and they ran through the brambles and they ran through the bushes where a rabbit wouldn't go. -- Johnny Horton
English locomotive at Columbian Exposition 1893
http://columbus.iit.edu/dreamcity/1500/00024075.JPG
John Bull
http://columbus.iit.edu/dreamcity/1500/00024074.JPG
Buster Keaton encore
http://www.nfb.ca/cinerobot/cinerobotheque/IMG428x321_WEB/65/65062/1.jpg
http://www.nfb.ca/cinerobot/cinerobotheque/IMG428x321_WEB/65/65062/3.jpg
The General
http://www.legrandaction.com/le-mecano-dela-general/img/mecano-genral04.jpg
http://www.legrandaction.com/le-mecano-dela-general/img/mecano-genral02.jpg
http://www.legrandaction.com/le-mecano-dela-general/img/mecano-genral03.jpg
Northern Pacific's great big locomotive
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvnjpeg_img_rec.php?objno=RVN11503
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvnjpeg_img_rec.php?objno=RVN01369
http://photoswest.org/photos/00014126/00014144.jpg
Truck stop
http://content.lib.washington.edu/imlswrvm/image/75.jpg
Mike
Good morning Tom and gang! I'll have a light breakfast, and get right to work here. Sorry you are having so many computer forum problems Eric. Have you tried ...
Mighty nifty Rock Island ENCORE from our captain yesterday, I must say. Been thinking about the OP notes, currency and bar chips. I find myself thinking ... why stop there? There should be OP tokens for riding the Can Am, S Capades, Polar Express, and the dumbwaiter up to your kitchen. But again, why stop there? You already have a good base of ice outside. Why not build a bobsled run from your house to the street? Think about it.
Enjoyed your beer link Pete. Perhaps "Old Fart" should become the official beer of "Who Darted?" Seems appropriate somehow. Nice snow pix, and I ran into Vito's car the other day ... oops.
Nice URLs from Mike, as usual. Glad you liked the banknote ENCORE, and you too Eric.
Now here's something interesting that showed-up in the diesel barn at IRM. The Penn Central 4715, built in 1906 by Alco/GE. It's 38 feet 7 inches long, 10 feet wide and 14 feet 4 inches high. Weight is 228,000 pounds. It's a double end / 2-D-2 / S motor (Ex 115NYC)
Here's a sneak-peek of the inside
Not sure what this is all about ....
Here's a diesel/electric getting some attention in the barn. The 1944, GE built United States Army 8537.
380 HP, 28 feet 5 inches long, 90,000 lbs
Pretty clever ... missile balloons!
The bar is CLOSED on Sundays!
G’day Gents!
Sunday and it’s time for breakfast – brunch – lunch ‘til 2 PM here at the Saloon by the Siding! Of couse the coffee’s fresh ‘n hot – bakery goods just arrived from the Mentor Village Bakery, so check out our Menu Board and get going!
Some acknowledgments, then I’ve gotta get crackin’ on a few things ‘round here, including the Emporium Theatre’s bill o’ fare for the week!
Doug at 12:34 PM yesterday: Nice Pix, but where are the trees Guess that’s the way these developers are nowadays, knock ‘em all down and go for the subdivisions. Either that or the land was formerly farm land or pasture. Hmmmmm, think I’ve answered my own question! Winter Pix are great no matter where taken, just as long as snow is involved.
Eric at 2:06 PM yesterday: So, my suspicions were correct, eh Thought it had to be something like that – the “one size fits all” notion just doesn’t work all of the time. Wonder if anyone sells socks by exact size these days or you just have to purchase a sack o’ socks “fitted” for children through the starting center on the LA Lakers
Anyway, we’re more than pleased that you are keeping your place at the bar and would hate to lose you due to the seemingly unsolvable Forum problems caused when Kalmbach “improved” things. <geesh>
Pete at 5:56 PM yesterday: Nice Pix and love the duck!
I’ll put together another Email and see what develops! Presuming things are still “on” for the 16th
I’m working on an idea for our “official” bank notes for the bar . . . . may take a bit of time as things like these are time consuming (for Moi) and I wanna get it right before springing it on youse guyz! (Hanging around Vito the Hit! makes one taWk like dat!)
Old Fart’s beer, hmmmm, we can stock that!
The only recollection I have for the song, “Battle of New Orleans” was the Johnny Horton version. However, you are correct, in the UK, Lonnie Donegan and his Skiffle Group did have a #2 hit with it in 1959.
Well, in eighteen and fourteen we took a little trip along with Colonel Jackson down the mighty Mississip. We took a little bacon and we took a little beans, And we caught the bloody British near the town of New Orleans. We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin. There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago. We fired once more and they began to runnin' down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico. Well, I see'd Mars Jackson walkin down the street talkin' to a pirate by the name of Jean Lafayette [pronounced La-feet] He gave Jean a drink that he brung from Tennessee and the pirate said he'd help us drive the British in the sea. The French said Andrew, you'd better run, for Packingham's a comin' with a bullet in his gun. Old Hickory said he didn't give a dang, he's gonna whip the britches off of Colonel Packingham. We fired our guns and the British kept a'comin. There wasn't nigh as many as there was a while ago. We fired once more and they began to runnin' down the Mississippi to the Gulf of Mexico. Well, we looked down the river and we see'd the British come, and there must have been a hundred of 'em beatin' on the drum. They stepped so high and they made their bugles ring while we stood by our cotton bales and didn't say a thing. Old Hickory said we could take 'em by surprise if we didn't fire a musket til we looked 'em in the eyes. We held our fire til we see'd their faces well, then we opened up with squirrel guns and really gave a yell. W
CLOSED on SUNDAYs -
We do observe Sunday Photo Posting Day!
Now playing at the Mentor Village Emporium Theatre!
. . . Sunday, December 3rd thru 9th: Monty Python’s The Meaning of Life (1983) Starring: Graham Chapman, John Cleese, Eric Idle, Terry Gilliam, Michael Palin & Terry Jones – and – Monty Python’s And Now For Something Completely Different (1972) Starring: Graham Chapman, John Cleese, Eric Idle, Terry Gilliam, Michael Palin & Terry Jones. Short: The Three Stooges – Tassels in the Air (1938).
Monty Python’s The Meaning of Life (1983)
PLOT SUMMARY:
The comedy groups last full length movie returns to the feel of the hugely popular BBC TV show. It features small comedy sketches dealing with all of the stages and trials of life. Expect the un-expected. Plenty of religious, vulgar, and sexual humor may offend some groups. There are even musical numbers, but with that same unmistakable brand of Python humor.
from: amazon.com
Monty Python’s And Now For Something Completely Different (1972) PLOT SUMMARY:
An anthology of Monty Python's best sketches from their 1st & 2nd seasons of their original TV show. A collection of re-filmed sketches from the first and second series of the cult TV comedy show "Monty Python's Flying Circus". Includes such classics as "Nudge, Nudge", "Hell's Grannies", "Killer Cars", "Dead Parrot", "Lumberjack Song", "Blackmail" and "Upper Class Twit of the Year".
SHORT: Tassels in the Air (1938) PLOT SUMMARY: Featuring Moe, Larry & Curly
The Stooges are employed as maintenance men in an office building. Curly has a phobia about tassels, and goes crazy whenever he sees one; the only thing that calms him down is to tickle his chin with a brush. After trying to teach Curly how to speak pig Latin, Moe is mistaken for one of the building's tenants (a decorator named Omay), and the Stooges are hired to redecorate Mrs. Smirch's home.
from: threestooges.net Enjoy! Tom
Good morning again Tom. You're certainly right about this house being located on a former farmers' field. The only trees here are the scrub-type that grow along the fencelines. Got some nice rock piles in them too. I know, because I cleaned-up the trash, and chopped everything that wasn't huge behind our yard a few weeks ago. One of my pictures is of that fenceline, which I have also decorated with an electric deer and lights. Speaking of which, here's a shot of Woodstock square during the "lighting of the square" celebration last weekend.
The temperature was about 50 degrees, which made it possible for this layout to be running outside!
Nice touch with your lyrics today! #2 hit in 1959? I could swear it was popular in the mid to late 60's.
G'day Cap'n Tom and fellow travelers waiting for the bar to open!
A CLOSED bar on a Sunday - well, I suppose that's a good sign. However, these days most everything else is open and going at full tilt. Oh do I recall the days when this truly was a day of rest and for families at that. Still pretty much that way in our clan, but we're diminishing and changing as the decades wear on. <groan>
So, my guess is the once frequent "regular" Bar Chandler Rob is probably experiencing one of those "infrequent" power outages he talked about up there in Ontario. Read where an ice storm took it's toll on southern Ontario. When WAS the last time we saw him And Nick is gone too. What is going on
My Jints have a slim chance to do something for themselves today as they square off against hated Dallas. Two teams loaded with superstar loudmouths, two teams of "used to be's" but only one will emerge on top. Kick off is later this afternoon and like it or not, I'll be parked in front of the tube for a Sunday of elation or frustration. To think we refer to this as entertainment is beyond my comprehension. <grin>
The ice out your way, Tom, is still in the news as I just saw where the Missouri and Illinois National Guard units have arrived to do what they can for the people without power and heat. Didn't parts of your area suffer a massive power outage during the summer Seem to recall that happening . . . Anyway, glad you and yours are ok and that life goes on for our 'steamed Properietor!
Pete, the white stuff looks fine and is that the Aflec duck Seems to be up to his lower beak in it. Also noted that Doug has picked up on the "home" theme with some winter weather shots! So maybe I should dig out my Brownie Hawkeye - take some snaps - wait a week for development - get them digitized - figure out how to load 'em - ahhhhhhh, the heck with it! <grin>
Eric, I'm with you, mate! Feel exactly the way you do about this forum. I would NOT be frequenting ANY of the threads if not for this bar 'n grill. Should Tom decide to pack it in, I'm gone from the ether. I'm finding it less 'n less enjoyable to wander away from here and I surely do not enjoy the nonsense many of us are experiencing with the formatting. Then there's the ongoing crap with the ratings system - which I note has attracted a couple of guys who have NEVER visited this site or Tom's other thread - yet they've rated it. How ridiculous is that Way to go Kalmbach.
Been thinking about the spring and hopefully my trip to St. Looooooo. I'll be flying in as the drive is too blasted long and coming by train is more hassle than pleasure. I'd have to connect in Chicago and IF everything operated on time, I still wouldn't get down to you until late night. That stinks. I'll just fly and come in at a time most convenient to you - just let me know by email and I'll begin to look into what's available. Really looking forward to this as it's been a long time since I've done anything even close to this - a get together with the boys! Sounds fine to me.
Sorry I couldn't get in yesterday, one of those Saturdays where there was too much to do and not enough time to do it in. Had quite a bit on my plate, as they say, and by the time I came up for air, it was nearly time to sack out. One of those days! I did take in the few posts and enjoyed what was provided. That Rock Island song brought back some memories, seems like only yesterday . . . And the mention of "The Battle of New Orleans" also brings back some thoughts as well. That song, by Johnny Horton, seemed to stick around for a long time, so it wouldn't surprise me to learn that it did indeed hit the charts in the mid 60's. Some tunes have been know to lead more than one life. When and if Rob ever gets back to us and should he read any of this, my guess is he'll provide the Canadian version of history for us regarding it!
Looking forward to going to the movies this week as I see we've got another set of Monty Python flicks to enjoy. Nice going, Tom! Nothing wrong with some laughs, huh
Found these books that I thought you in particular would enjoy!
Until the next time!
Lars
Being as the bar is closed, I'll just slip this through the slot ..... which appears to be frozen shut by ice, but that's what a maddux is for, right? )Great books Lars!
Here's an interesting car ... the Chicago and North Western #8784., built in 1915 by Pullman Car. Co. as a steel horse-express car (AAR class BH). This unique car has an 8'6" end door that permitted the loading of horses and carriages at a ramp. Swinging gate partitions allowed the creation of as many stalls as needed. A portion of the car could also be used for LCL freight. Later used as a maintenance-of-way car, it was donated to IRM in 1982 by the Chicago and Northwestern.
This has turned out to be a mystery car for me. It hides inside barn #10, which is not open to the public.
These picnic tables and benches are bolted or nailed to the floor
Here's another car hiding in barn 10 that's in need of a lot of help
Indianapolis, Crawfordsville & Western 102 1906 Passenger/Baggage Combine
A combination car (combine) provides both passenger seating and a separate space for baggage or express cargo. The Indianapolis,, Crawfordsville and Western interurban line was known as the "Ben Hur Route," honoring Crawfordsville author Lew Wallace. In 1912, ICW was acquired by the Terre Haute, Indianapolis and Eastern. The THI&E was one of the largest systems in the state, with street railways in Richmond, Terre Haute and Indianapolis, and interurban lines connecting those towns with Lafayette, Crawfordsville, Danville, and Paris, Illinois. This wooden combine (later THI&E 53) was retired in 1939, and was used as a cottage near Lake Shafer, Indiana. IRM purchased the car in 1996, and trucked it to Union for restoration. It is the only surviving car from the ICW.
Hi Tom and all.
I'll pop this through the mail slot. My oh my the puter is slow today. Just got back from trying to take some pics of some trains in the snow, only trouble no trains just a stationary coal train.
Mike great links liked the pic of Lord of the Isles it must have looked very old fashioned to Americans in 1893 the car behind it looks like a Caledonian Rly Saloon.Enjoyed the pics of the General and the large Northern Pacific Loco..
ERIC I bet it will be a fine house for the dog, you will have to post a pic when this annoying forum problem is sorted out. As Tom says thanks for hanging in there with us.
DOUG Glad you and Eric liked the beer link. I will have to look into some weird and wonderful beer names.
Yes VITO's car is best avoided.
Thanks for the pics. Another two gems at the IRM. It looks as though someone was not too keen on the Penn Central by the sign above 4715's number and it is good to see the U.S. Army 8537 under renovation.Looks like a great night at Woodstock last weekend it was good that is was warm enough to have those fine models running.
LARS The bride took the photos with her digital camera,I am using a 35mm at the moment as I bought some film last time I came over, and if this camera had been wrecked in transit it would be better that than the digital. I really hope you are able to come in May.
Thy are some great Pennsy book covers.
In the Battle of New Orleans the British were only running because someone shouted last orders at the bar.
TOM Many thanks for the lyrics to Battle of New Orleans. I would have been 8 when it came out and can still remember the tune, while singing the words I recalled that on the 'B' side of the 45 was song called Tom Dooley, who was in trouble withthe Revenue Officers, if memory serves.
So "Old Fart"is the official brew of Our Place only hope the track gang doesn't have too much of it on a Friday night.
Looking forward to the Our Place bank notes. It is true the ones from VITO's bank says"Pay the Bearer or Else".
More good laughs at the Emprorium in the run up to Chrismas.It is amazing how much good stuff there was in those first two seasons of the Pythons.
Now for something completely different, my pics.
At the Bluebell Railway in October.
A LMS Sleeping Car and a Southern Luggage Van
An E4. designed by R.J.Billington for the London Brighton & South Coast Railway in1897. this 0-6-2 tank loco was allocated to Bricklayers Arms loco shed in South London in1959.
Two pics of class 156 diesel multiple units at Dumfries station Scotland. This station is on the former Glasgow & South Western railway main line which ran from Glasgow St Enochs to Carlisle.
They should enlarge.
Pete.
DOUG Just seen your pics of the three very interesting cars at the IRM.What is LCL frieght? Do you think the mystery car in Barn10 could have been modified after its use as a passenger car and the last car being the only surviving car of the ICW. Although these cars, as you say,will need a lot of work they are in a good home now
I'm afraid I can't find the notes on Alans pics this week so I will have to guess.
The first two are of European tank locomotives the first one is in Germany the second is on the Welshpool & Llanfair Railway in Wales,perhaps NICK knows about this loco?
The next two are of the two locos that were originally on the line.
# 822 The Earl
# 823 The Countess
These 0-6-0 tank locos were a 1902 Beyer Peacock design the locos weigh 19 tons 18 cwt.
G-day Tom and all present.
X-mas is in Full swing here in Duluth just.. Not in with the snow. I think we have half an inch on the ground. If that. It's a bit sad.
Eric- Thanks for taking the time to look for the Yellowstones. I'm surprised three servived out of the 12 made. Quite surprising actually. Thanks again.
DL- The loaded coal trains are able to run 50 miles per hour. So there moving along pretty good for being so heavy. Some of the lines a know here in the Minnesota state are maintained every minute. The Fargo to Minneapolis line sees easily 70 trains a-day. And half of those are Coal trains. So the Ties are always new. I haven't seen any ties on that line that are older than two years.
Tom- Why couldn't I think of Grand Central Station!! I knew it, but couldn't think of it.. Just one of those days. Thanks.
Pete- As long as the Kansas Union Station stills see activity it will stand. Not like most stations that just stop being used and then there fate rests against a wrecking ball. I have seen a couple of good stations come down like that. The inside of the Station is great looking. Looks well maintained.
Also, the pics you posted today are really cool. The Earl #822 was a cool little steamer. Neat pics. Thanks.
Barndad- A 1910 model railroad magazine!!!! Wow. Now that is one really old magazin. I hadn't realized they went back that far. Very interesting.
That reminded me. Your article on the railroads on bank notes. I have a couple of them. One is a 100 dollar bill with a 4-4-0 on it. The other is 1 dollar bill with what looks like the same locomotive. Neat article by the way.
All of your IRM pics are really cool. To see that interesting locomotive with the BN marked on the side was something I have never seen. Is it a center cab of some type? Also, The MOW (Maintanence of way) car is really cool. There has been a passenger car on a MOW train for quite some time now. Nice catch there. The Balloon Missle was really funny
Mike- Another nice set of pics from you sir. I see you found pics of the NP's Z-5 locomotive. Now what did you think of that? In the model form that steamer doesn't seem so big but, look at it in real life and then you know how big it is. The guy hanging off the side of the one, gives you the idea.
Lars- Thanks for the book covers. Some of them look interesting. May have to look in to them. Thanks
That time of week again!!
Happy railroading
Jamees
G-day Tom and all present! Issue 5
Milwaukee Road News
The Milwaukee road class EP-3
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MILW_Quill.jpg
One of the Westinghouse locomotives with a Passenger train.
The Milwaukee Road's class EP-3 comprised ten electric locomotives built in 1919 by Baldwin and Westinghouse. They were nicknamed Quills because of their use of a quill drive. Although they were good haulers and well liked by engineers, poor design and constant mechanical problems plagued them for their entire lives and they were the first of the Milwaukee Road's electric locomotives to be retired.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MILW_Quill_drawing.jpg
This is the drawing of the locomotive and how it was going to look.
When the Milwaukee Road decided to electrify the Coast Division in 1917, it attempted to re-equip with equipment bought from General Electric. The United States Railroad Administration, however, dictated that the order for electrical equipment be split between GE and Westinghouse. This meant that of the 15 electric locomotives needed, five (the EP-2s, or bi-polars) came from GE and 10 - the EP-3s - came from Westinghouse.
The EP-3s, while designed to meet the same specifications as the bi-polars, were a completely different design from their GE counterparts. Their appearance was sleeker, ableit less distinctive, with a single long boxcab-style carbody containing all of the electric equipment. Their wheel arrangement was the same as a back-to-back pair of 4-6-2 "Pacific" steam engines, complete with high 68" drivers. They were double-ended and designed for high-speed passenger service.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:MILW_Quill_half_with_motors.jpg
Here one of the Quills is assembled.
The most noteworthy aspect of their design was the motor mounting system. The locomotive's six 566hp traction motors were mounted directly to the frame, one above each driving axle. They were geared to a "quill," a steel tube 15 inches in diameter that was mounted around the axle. At each end of the quill, seven-armed "spiders" stuck out between the spokes of the driving wheels, and were connected to the drivers by coil springs. This system, which was later used very effectively on the famous GG1 locomotive, minimized weight suspended directly from the axles, as the traction motors were bolted directly to the locomotive frame.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:President_Harding_Electric_Locomotive_Cab.jpg
A brand new Westinghouse EP-3 on it's first inagural run.
The "Quills" never really met the standards set by their GE-designed counterparts. They were constant headaches for the Milwaukee Road engineering department and were rebuilt five times during their service lives. They were very heavy and the large drivers were suspected of contributing to frame breakage. They were prone to derailing and their weight tended to increase the severity of such derailments. Locomotive E13 (the "Quills" were renumbered from to E10-E19 in 1939) was destroyed in a derailment at Soudan, Montana in 1947.
In the late 1940s, with the Little Joes entering service and the older electric locomotives worn out from heavy use during World War II, the Electrification Department initiated a program to rebuild the Milwaukee Road's electric locomotives for continued service. The "Quills" were not included in the program. Instead, the seven remaining locomotives (three had already been retired due to wrecks) were gradually retired and scrapped between 1952 and 1957.
Wikipedia is good at explaining this stuff. Information from www.wikipedia.com They do a good job of finding this info.
Good morning Tom and all. I'll have two light breakfasts and wait for the Emporium to open its' doors for "The Meaning of Life". Great movie, and all so true! Really liked your pix yesterday Pete, and thanks for another installment of the "Milwaukee News" James. Surley appreciate all you two do here. Where would we be without you?
I found a little time to geat back to my CGW article, and here it is!
The Amazing Great Western Sept 1953 Railroad Magazine
Head end business at St. Paul. K2a Pacific type was built by Alco in 1903. Look at the GW roster nowadays and you'll find diesel-electrics and a couple of gas jobs
There was still one item of unfinished business on Stickney's mind, and that was to put his mighty Maple Leaf Route, as it was then called, into Omaha. Some years earlier the Stickney interests had acquired control of the Mason City Fort Dodge Railway, connecting the two Iowa cities in its name. Extensions were pushed to the north, completing the Mason City-Manly Junction link in 1901: and two years afterward the 133-mile route from Fort Dodge to Council Bluffs was opened with trackage rights into Omaha. Building this line entailed crossing the Des Moines River on a lofty bridge at Fort Dodge. The 2588-foot structure is said to the second largest railway bridge in Iowa.
The CGW was now competed as we see it today with the exception of the south side of the triangle in the center of the system, so conspicuous on the map. The Clarion-Oelwein segment was built by peacmeal and finally completed in 1904. A few years afterward the road's Oelwein shops had a new boss, a young man by the name of Walter P. Chrysler: "They were the biggest shops I had ever seen!" He also commented on the huge cranes and modern transfer tables. The gifted machinist soon rose to be superintendent f motive power on the CGW and, incidentally, the owner of Oelwein's first horseless carriage - a Locomobile, Later Chrysler left the Maple Leaf Route to become works manager of the American Locomotive Company's Pittsburgh plant.
The "strong face" of Stickney, as Chrysler put it, was not seen on the Great Western much longer. The panic of 1907 put the road into receivership, with Stickney as a co-receiver. In 1909, however, he was out of control; and with the formation of a new company, the Chicago Great Western Railroad, Samuel M. Fenton became president. Under Felton's sixteen-year regime as president the road secured fresh capital and underwent a complete rehabilitation.
The Felton administration was responsible for overhauling motive power and acquiring many new locomotives. During Stickney's regime, the Prairie type (2-6-2) engine was the most popular on the system. Although Prairies are generally thought of as freight locomotives, many were used in passenger service. But Sam Felton changed this: he rebuilt some 2-6-2s into Pacifics, and many that remained were converted from compound to simple expansion and superheated. Some forty Consolidations were purchased shortly after he assumed control. The real eye-openers, however, were the Mallet compounds employed to wheel heavy freights over the one percent grades between Stockton, Ill. And Oelwein, Ia. They were a 2-6-6- wheel arrangement, with a tractive force of 81,175 pounds.
To emphasize fast freight service, two pages of the October 1, 1901 timetable were devoted to "schedules of Through Freight Trains." This novel feature, after a lapse of four decades, was re-introduced in the road's passenger timecard effective April 27, 1952. In the same 1910 folder much emphasis was placed on the "New Wharton Switch," which featured a so-called "hump" rail opposite the point rail. At a certain point the hump rail inclined sufficiently to gradually raise he car wheel so that the flange would pass over the main track onto the side track as guided by the point rail. Another feature of the Wharton Switch was the use of a semaphore signal. To quote the advertisement:
"The position of the switch is clearly indicated by the dwarf semaphore switch signal which takes the place of the commonly used target signal, this being in line with the best signal practice, as it furnishes a postion signal rather than a target for daylight service."
Although the hump rails have long since been discarded, many switches stll have the semaphore signal, giving the Great Western an appearance unlike that of its neighboring roads.
Felton saw to it that millions went into improving the right-of-way. He block-signaled the line between Chicago and Oelwein, and built a new bridge across the Mississippi at St. Paul. Much more noticeable than these improvements was the widespread use of rail motorcars. The annual report, ended June 30, 1911, shows three 200-hp McKeen gasoline motor units on the roster. That was just a start; many more were in use in subsequent years. In 1924 the pioneering CGW took delivery of Electro-Motive's first gas-electric car, the M-300. It was initiated into service by hauling General Manager C.L. Hinkle's 85-ton business car from Chicago to Oelwein. The EMD people held their breath while the M-300 roared up the long Farley grade west of Dubuque, Iowa. But the doodlebug pulled the big car over the crest and up and down sawtooth hills into Oelwein. After that CGW was sold on gas-electrics.
Experimentals. With not too many hidebound traditions, CGW has always been noted for willingness to try out new ideas, some of which are shown in these pictures. Ungainly White rail motor car was snapped at Marshalltown, Iowa about 1924.
McKeen Motor Cars, were quite a success for a while. This one was pictured at Fort Dodge, Iowa
The Blue Bird, 3-unit motor train built on old McKeen Car underframes at Oelwein Shops
Meanwhile, more new developments were in the offing. On a trip abroad Sam Felton took a liking to the trim lines of English locomotives. Could it have been the clean coaching stock ad well-groomed engines of John Bull's Great Western? We have no way of knowing. We do know that the Old Man came back to the states and had Oelwein streamline one of his Pacifics. More than that he had it painted red and gold, with cars to match. When engine No. 916 hit the road with its polished driving rods and burnished cylinder heads, concealed pipes and glistening red cars, it created a sensation. The semi-streamliner was put into service on a non-stop run between the Twin Cities and Rochester, Minnesota. Appropriately called the Red Bird, it pleased Felton to no end.
Famed Red Bird was the result of CGW president Sam Felton's trip to British Isles.
A husband and wife are traveling by car from Atlanta to New York. After almost twenty-four hours on the road, they decide to stop at a nice hotel and take a room. They only plan to sleep for four hours and then get back on the road. When they check out four hours later, the desk clerk hands them a bill for $350. The man explodes and demands to know why the charge is so high. He tells the clerk although it's a nice hotel, the rooms certai
Well whaddyano It’s Monday again, time to grab a cuppa, a few pastries from the Mentor Village Bakery case, a selection from our Menu Board of <light> ‘n <traditional> breakfasts and enjoy the company of a few like minded individuals! Classic Trains is the topic ‘round here, with just a bit of adult humor thrown in. Of course, the NFL results will most likely enter the conversation. <groan>
So, let me begin with our St. Louis Lambs (aka: Rams) rolled over for the Arizona Buzzards (aka: former St. Louis Cardinals) and embarrassed the fan base big time. The team that made it to two Super Bowls in recent years is no more and the organization seems to have morphed back to the state they were in while located in SoCal (Anaheim). Awful display, so I viewed on the sports news, simply awful. I am proud to say that I did not view one live down – no one – as other things were far more important to enjoy yesterday than parking my aging butt in front of the TV. In fact, didn’t watch TV at all ‘til rather late at night.
We were treated to a great concert downtown at our local venue (ScottTrade Center – formerly Savvis Center; formerly the Kiel Center). Anyway, it’s where the NHL Blues play a game loosely resembling hockey (‘nother story!). Mannheim Steamroller put on another great show as they passed through on their once-every-three-years tour. Well worth the bucks and really put us in the Christmas frame of mind – until we got out into the traffic leaving the exorbitantly priced parking lot that is!
Back to feetsball: looks like my favorite AFC team also got knocked off – in overtime – the KCity Chiefs. <ugh> Mustn’t be my year for the NFL. Also, my guess is Lars is having a “bad hair day” reading through the New York papers with what has to be blistering accounts of yet another Giants loss – this time to the Cowboys. So when does spring training for baseball begin <grin>
To the acknowledgments!
The Sunday Photo Posting Day! turned out to be another extravaganza for Doug, with much appreciated support from Lars - Pete ‘n James. Nice going guys – all well done and worth the time to read up on or simply enjoy the visuals!
From yesterday: Doug at 10:23 AM – Lars at 12:03 PM – Doug (again) at 6:07 PM – Pete at 6:12 PM & 7:01 PM and James at 8:42 PM & 8:57 PM.
From this morning: Doug at 5:47 AM.
It’s gratifying to see that when things get really low ‘n slow ‘round the Saloon by the Siding, that we still have a few guys who take the time and make the effort to keep ‘er going!
Just a reminder: Tuesday’s Theme for the Day will be “Boat Trains” and we are expecting some interesting material from our Brits!
Can’t say when we’ll see our Canadian connection, Rob, again – haven’t heard from him and perhaps he’s offline due to the Ontario power outages. Don’t know. Insofar as Nick is concerned – well, we’ve been down that road before, eh Perhaps that “image” struck by Lars some days ago is precisely what happened. Do you suppose the guitar man is adrift somewhere in the stormy seas between Wales and the Emerald Isle <grin>
Ruth comes in at 9 AM and stays behind the bar ‘til 5 PM when Leon the Night Man takes over ‘til closing.
Boris, serve ‘em all of the “spiked” OJ they can handle!
Tom
Hello Tom and all in
Message coding symbols etc look all in order today
Light breakfast for me please, even though it is quite late in the day.
James - enjoyed your post on Chicago Union Station - one of the great stations in the world no doubt about it. Sad to hear the seats have been removed from the main hall though, according to Doug - does not seem that long ago when I sat on them waiting for The International to Toronto back in 2002!
Pete, you'd certainly enjoy a trip to Chicago - what with Metra, Amtrak and the CTA it is one city with a great deal to see and do - easy to get about too, (without a car) in my experience. The ‘el' is a great way tot see the city sights.
Eric - I don't blame you for the mix up on the postings given the hassle you had with the forums - no problem my friend, glad you liked the links.
Tom - films - yes a good night - but it is done in a traditional film theatre with no options for audience participation or volunteering for anything - just a low key commentary by the organiser over the films that are silents. As I've said before, hopefully Pete's Rugby based friends can take in one some time.
Mike - thanks for the Buster Keaton stills - that was the one with the CN loco I thought might be an ALCO.
Lars - appreciate your comments on the high speed - and thanks for your feedback. Where I can I try to use US language for items where I know it, but admit no doubt default to Brit when I'm uncertain - this kind of helps the exchange of knowledge, which reminds me of 2 pretty basic questions I can ask you (or others) to explain to me - 1) what does ‘highball' mean - I sort of understand it when I read it in context but what does it actually mean? And 2) when in the dome car on the VIA train I saw the signals have 2 red lights showing one above the other (when not showing green of course) - why is this? Is it standard North American Practice to have the 2 lights?
Pete - Victoria Station north tunnel entrance is indeed still visible from the streets above, and the other obvious remnant is the clock tower from the frontage, which stands at the front of the station (as well as the Victoria Hotel, which must surely have been built by the GCR but does not appear in the list of BTC hotels in the front of any of my 1950s timetables so may have been sold by then) - it must have been retained for sentimental reasons. Inside the shopping centre is a water clock designed by Roland Emmett - who I understand designed the ‘railway' that ran within the Festival of Britain site. It is rather good in a way. To the south the tram runs over Weekday Cross viaduct (or a replacement viaduct, it is still a mystery to me why it (the old GCR viaduct) had to be replaced). At one point there was an idea to route the tram through the basement of the Victoria Shopping centre on the GCR alignment, but I believe the concrete piles supporting the residential properties above prevented the re-use of the alignment in this way.
I wonder if Railway Roundabout films were a mix of colour and B&W - certainly this was colour and in brilliant condition, clearly filmed on a high summer day, the depths of greens and maroons was clear to see (was the world really that colour back I n 1960 - I like to think it was!!!)
Colour TV - I guess by mid 1970s most people would have had colour TV but many did not - remember the differential licence fee was an issue - B&W licenses being cheaper (yes, trans Atlantic friends, you have to have a licence here for a TV - that is what funds the BBC which has no adverts, you see).
Mind you, my best friend at Sixth Form did not have a ‘phone at home when I first knew him, only as recent as 1985. You rang a call box near his house and any kid playing out would go and fetch the person you wanted if they were in (if you were lucky). Rather different now every fool has a cell phone!! Did the world function OK - seemed to cope well enough to me!
Thanks for giving your personal recollections of the 15 Guinea Special - kind of hoped you would have a take on it. Nice one.
Regards
DL
Railroad Stations - Terminals & Depots
Number Five - Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
Former Canadian Pacific Railway Station - and -
Pacific Central Station
Used with permission from: Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Formatting differences made necessary due to Forums requirements.
Former CPR Station, Vancouver, BC
Originally opened: 1915 as Canadian Pacific Railway Station
Re-opened:
1977 as Waterfront Station
Line(s):
Expo Line, Millennium Line, Canada Line
Connections
West Coast Express SeaBus 44 UBC 50 False Creek South 98 B-Line Richmond Centre
Waterfront Station is a major intermodal public transportation facility in downtown Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada.
Location
Waterfront Station is located on the south shore of Burrard Inlet, just east of the north foot of Granville Street at 601 West Cordova Street. The station is within walking distance of Vancouver's historical Gastown district, the Canada Place cruise ship terminal, the Helijet International helipad, and Vancouver Harbour Water Aerodrome, the downtown float plane terminals for Baxter Aviation, Harbour Air and West Coast Air.
Other nearby facilities include the downtown campuses for Simon Fraser University and the British Columbia Institute of Technology, federal government services in Sinclair Centre, the Vancouver Convention & Exhibition Centre, and the Harbour Centre revolving restaurant and observation deck. Underground passages connect to the Fairmont Waterfront Hotel and Canada Place, while a second street-level entrance opens onto Howe Street.
Services
Waterfront Station is the downtown Vancouver terminus for the following TransLink services:
· The Expo SkyTrain line to Burnaby, New Westminster and Surrey;
· The Millennium SkyTrain line to Burnaby and New Westminster (via the Expo line), circling back to VCC-Clark Station in east Vancouver;
· The Canada Line
G’day Cap’n Tom and fellow travelers at the bar!
Ruth my deAH, I’d like something warm today – an Irish coffee sounds just about right. A round for the house, treats for the mascots and slide the snack tray down my way, wudja
Interesting bit of material got posted yesterday for the Sunday Pix Posting Event. Took me a bit of time, between gnashing of teeth over my Jints loss, to get through it all. <groan, moan, groan> But, many thanks to those who made the best of our somewhat reduced number of participants. As Tom says, it’s always quality over quantity!
Nice piece on the Vancouver rail stations, Tom – like ‘em both! I know we’ve seen your pix of these places somewhere B4, but to have it all put into one source makes for some fine reading!
Good to see ya on this fine day, DL and lemme see what I can help with regarding your two inquiries. My caveat is: expert, I’m not!
High ball or hi-ball – either one first conjures up an image of a mixed drink! Figgers, huh But here’s some info from web browsing that may enlighten us all a bit:
Highball was the codename of early versions of the bouncing bomb designed by Barnes Wallis during World War II. Highball is a railroad signal that took the form of a raised ball on a post, meaning "go". Today, few physical highball signals remain, but the term is used as a command by US train crews, synonymously with the original meaning. Highball - (v.) trucker slang for making good time, speeding, or moving fast in general. Comes from the gearshift grip (usually a ball) being in the top gear position. Hence High-Ball. to highball, highballing Highball is a bouldering term describing an unroped bouldering problem high enough to present the threat of death or serious injury should the climber fall.
Highball is a railroad signal that took the form of a raised ball on a post, meaning "go". Today, few physical highball signals remain, but the term is used as a command by US train crews, synonymously with the original meaning.
Highball - (v.) trucker slang for making good time, speeding, or moving fast in general. Comes from the gearshift grip (usually a ball) being in the top gear position. Hence High-Ball. to highball, highballing
Highball is a bouldering term describing an unroped bouldering problem high enough to present the threat of death or serious injury should the climber fall.
As to the subject of railroad signals, well that’s quite a bit for just one session. You see, here in North America, all of the major roads had their own particular signal schemes. Yes, no standards per se. Through time, as the railroads merged, disappeared or otherwise changed hands, a bit of a standard emerged. Pretty much the same in Canada as in the U.S. So, here’s a couple of Urls to help sort it all out:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_railway_signaling
http://technology.niagarac.on.ca/staff/mcsele/railroad.htm
Take your time! <grin>
Enjoy the day one and all . . . .
As it is still a bit chilly I'll try a Wem Ales Treacleminer please RUTH.
JAMES Another great Milwaukee Road news. It seems the EP3 were not the success the BI-Polars were, it seems reading the post they would have preferred not to have had the EP3s at all.
As to the Union Station in Kansas City.It closed in the 1980s and was deteriating until it was renovated in the late 1990s to its former splendor. Today part of it houses a railroad Museum.They are doing a real good job at the present to have a good railroad interest, and I dare say at the moment there is a model rail layout in the entrance hall as they usually have one for the Christmas period. Here is a link to it.
http://www.unionstation.org/intro.cfm
On the front wall by the main entrance there are still marks in the stone, it is said made, when there was a gun fight with gangsters trying to free a convicted mobster Frank Nash.
DOUG Glad you liked the pics.Enjoyed the CGW post, good pics of some of the Exprimentals on the line. That is a great pic of the Red Bird. I wonder if there is a color pic or painting of her, with a smaller cab the loco would look very British.
DL It does seem strange why they demolished the GC Weekday Cross viaduct. The Great Central structures were very well made. As you say surely the Victoria Hotel must have been owned by the GC at one time. There is a Great Central hotel, just down from Loughborough Central station althoughI have not been there for a few years.Talking of hotels it reminded that in my home town of Rugby there was not a hotel adjacent to either station,in fact there wasn't a pub within a 1/4 mile of them either. this must be strange if not unique for a town of Rugby's size.
I see LARS as answered the Highball question. I was looking through some old magazines and I noticed there was a feature in the Fall 2003 issue of Classic Trains on the Highball signals in Vermont. some was on the Boston & Maine and some on the Central Vermont Railroads. It said some CV highballs lasted until 1958 at St Albans, Perhaps MIKE or CM3 can add more to this.
LARS Very informative links to the North American signalling systems, I have read the Wikipedia one and will get to the Canadian one, the signalling systems are a different design to the UK ones.
Just to cheer us up after the Giants and The Chiefs results yesterday
Why is a GIRAFFE popular when he goes in to a bar? Because he says " The highballs are on me". Sorry about that. As Bertie Wooster said to Jeeves" That was a joke , Jeeves". Jeeves replied" Very nearly, sir".
TOM Well my railway books should arrive from England tomorrow hopefully amongst other stuff.
Glad you like the pics I should get some more photos off Alan soon.I'm lucky mine turn out so well as they did as I could only get a cheap 400 ASA film when I ran out in England, as I was short of time.
Thanks for the Vancouver station post. Two very fine buildings, Of the two the CPR one has the edge for me.It is great that they are both still in use, and surely must have a secure future.
Mention of Starbucks reminds me on an earlier trip to England we went to see Canterbury Cathedral and the bride has a picture, right next to this grand centuries old main gate to the Cathedral is a Starbucks, I will have to post the picture.
Well Leon let me get a round and get ready for the Boat Trains.
Good evening Captain Tom and Gentlemen!!
After being in touch with the Forum manager a few times today I was asked to try Firefox again after last Friday's update of the forum. I did so and it doesn't work at all. Instead I found another browser, Camino, and so far it seems to work. This will be a very brief visit, I'll be back later tonight.
Just now I just want to see if this works.
I am trying bold text, and colored text, and different size.
The color fuction does not work, but bold and different size seems to be okay, at least in preview.
Lets see if the picture posting works.
Eric
PS It works!!!!!!
Leon- Could I get a sandwich with the works on it, with a coffee please. Thanks.
Barndad- The CGW saga continues and it keeps getting better. Good to see that it was somewhat local for me. I can visit some of the old sites now. Keep it coming!
BTW: your joke is a 4 on the Groan-o-meter.
Tom- Some good info on the two stations. Like the look of the older Canadian Pacific station. But I have to say that the Neon signs on the Pacific Central Station are quite the look. I like it. You could see it from a mile away. Of course I think thats the idea.
I can't wait for the boat trains. That should be fun to post!
DL- Glad you enjoyed the Chicago Union article. I am quite sad myself to hear that the seats were taken out. That adds charm to the whole Station. When you step into almost any station thats the first thing you see. But, What can you do.
Pete- Glad you liked the Milwaukee road bit. That Kansas City union station is quite the master piece. I'm glad some guys found the time to restore that thing. That had to be quite the project. I have tosay, she looks good. I will have to take a visit someday. Especially if there is a museum and a layout to look at and of course the whole station it's self. Thanks!
Eric- Well.. I'm glad to see that the sizes, and fonts work for you. And pictues! I'm glad you got those to work. We can see some of your pics now.
BTW: I think I'm going to try a joke out here. Lets see what Barndad thinks of this one.
Three Football players come across a magic lamp.
One is a Vikings player, another is a Packers player, and the last is a Bears player.
All three rub the lamp together and "poof" out comes the Genii. Thje Genii tells them that he grant them one wish each.
The Bears player asks the Genii if, he could be at home with his wife and kids for the rest of the year without another game. "Poof" The Genii grants the wish.
The Packers player asks the Genii if he could put a wall around the state of Wisconsin so that the Viking players, and fans can't get in anymore. "Poof" The Genii grants the wish.
Last the Vikings player... He thinks for a minute and then says.... "Genii!.. Fill that wall with water!"
"Poooof"
Hows that one?
James
I think the NP 5000 was the biggest locomotive in the world for 15 years or so, until UP's Big Boy. Speaking of Nixon photos, pardon me while I go off on a tangent.
Vancouver
http://216.94.16.48/_images/common/photos/original/CN002785.jpg
The 5000
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvnjpeg_img_rec.php?objno=RVN01374
Milwaukee Road EP-3 without Warren G. Harding
http://muse.museum.montana.edu/rvndb/rvnjpeg_img_rec.php?objno=RVN29267
Warren G. Harding
http://www.ctaa.org/rail/rail14/gallery/images/Historic_Ties_Harding.jpg
Calvin Coolidge
http://memory.loc.gov/service/pnp/cph/3c10000/3c13000/3c13600/3c13667v.jpg
Herbert Hoover
http://photoswest.org/photos/00185126/00185195.jpg
Franklin D. Roosevelt
http://photoswest.org/photos/00185001/00185125.jpg
Harry S. Truman
http://www.democraticpartyfresnocounty.org/Dems%20Fresno%20County/Images/truman_train.gif
Dwight D. Eisenhower
http://imagescn.technomuses.ca/_images/common/photos/original/CN000595.jpg
Woodrow Wilson without a train
http://photoswest.org/photos/00190751/00190795.jpg
William Howard Taft
http://photoswest.org/photos/00185751/00185864.jpg
Theodore Roosevelt
http://photoswest.org/photos/00185126/00185243.jpg
http://photoswest.org/photos/20031001/20031071.jpg
St. Albans Highball
http://216.94.16.48/railways/index_view.cfm?photoid=16212187&id=49
http://www.durand.k12.wi.us/hs/history/McKinley/train.jpg
A Boat Train?
http://content.lib.washington.edu/transportation/image/220.jpg
Leon, tonight I would like to have that Filet Mignon again! I know, I know, but I am not going to tell.
It feels good that my trouble here finally seems to be a memory. At least I hope they are. I never made it yesterday (Sunday) so it took some time to read everything tonight.
Doug – I never tried that trick with my computer, but it was close. But now I found the solution (!?) with this new browser. Be careful next time you see Vito’s car! Nice pictures of very interesting locomotives at IRM! And also the pictures of the old cars. My wife took some pictures of an old Santa Fe Horse Express car in Pomona 1 1/2 years ago. Note the toilet!
I think The Battle of New Orleans was a hit 1959. I remember listening to it during my high school years.You have nice trains running outside your house!More info about CGW! Intersting about those dwarf semaphore signals!Tom – I have been in touch with the Forum manager a few times today (via email) and following his advise (didn’t work) I found this new (?) browser, Camino. And that made all the difference in the world. I still can’t use colored text, but that is okay. At least I can post pictures again, use smilies, and bold text, etc. Even the paragraphs stay as I typed them. Thanks for the “Battle of New Orleans” lyrics! I have that song with Johnny Horton on tape and CD and love it. Yes, I am a poor Swede. Never liked snow, not even as a kid. Arizona is the right place for me. Everything below 75° F is too cold! Good Sundy movies. I saw The Meaning of Life years and years ago. Very funny!!! Sorry about the Rams loss. Or am I? Yeah, a little bit. My favorite team is actually Green Bay and they are not doing well this season.Lars – Thanks for your support. Now it finally seems like I can use this forum the way it is intended to. I agrre with you about the rating system!More nice book covers! I have quite a few RR books, but none of those.Pete – The dog house is almost completed. Some minor work remains to be done on Sunday.Nice pictures from the Bluebell Railway and Dumfries station. That German narrow gauge locomotive is a 2-10-2! Small drivers but probably capable of pretty good traction force. James – Thanks for the very interesting info on the EP-3! Too bad no one was saved. How could that Viking player do that to Green Bay? Huh? Not nice.DL – I’ll try to keep things straight from now on! It will be easier now when I can post whatever I want. Mike – A lot of presidents traveling by train, but I like the picture of the EP-3 best!
That is all for tonight! Time to get some sleep.
Hello Tom and all in, I'll have a hot chocolate, French style to get into the sprit of a boat train narrative.
Theme for the day - Boat Trains
I'll try and limit this to my understanding of the true Boat Train - a train service (often limited or non stop but not necessarily so) timetabled to connect with boat sailings, and whereby the train pulls up right to the quayside (or a station built at the quayside) so passengers can get right on or off the boat very quickly and simply. Usually these services linked the nearest big city (often London but not always), to the port.
Here is a good painting from the classic era showing a British Ferry having pulled up at the quayside in France and French express trains waiting to depart for onward destinations:
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10324657&wwwflag=3&imagepos=10
I've excluded Train Ferries from this (where the train gets put on the boat) as I think we agreed this would be another theme on another occasion.
What with the UK being an island nation ports and ferries have been an important part of the transport system, both to other islands in the British Isles (eg Ireland) and to the continent. Having been brought up on the channel coast I'll limit my contribution to Boat Trains on the former Southern Railway (SR) of England territory. Hopefully my fellow nationals will cover some of the other routes.
The railways developed the shipping lines and often built ports to serve their interests, usually in towns that were already established coastal communities, but not in very case - sometimes they built new ports that massively developed the harbour facilities at these locations (just another way in which the railroad changed the world we live in). They owned the boats too, and with nationalisation of the railway system these boats also became state owned. Eventually all the BR ships (including the lake pleasure steamers in the Lake District) were run under the brand ‘Sealink' - but were sold in the early 1980s when the government started privatising state assets (I think they were sold to US company Sea Containers actually).
Here's a picture of the BR ship fleet in the classic era:
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10174130&wwwflag=2&imagepos=4
For the Southern Railway, proximity of the south coast to the continent of Europe meant that they had the lions share of the continental business, esp. to France and Belgium. Boat train routes were developed via Dover - Calais/Boulogne/Ostende (Ostende is especially convenient for trains onto Germany via Brussels and thence to Poland, Switzerland, Austria etc),
Folkestone - Boulogne in France - as pictured here
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10173400&wwwflag=2&imagepos=28
Newhaven - Dieppe in France, Portsmouth - Isle of Wight / Cherbourg, Southampton (for ocean liners to many worldwide locations), Weymouth for the Chanel Islands are most of the key routes.
Whist the ocean liner specials from Southampton are rather different (some pictures here), the principle is the same:
http://www.semg.org.uk/misc/named_10.html
The other routes would (weather permitting) tend to work to a timetabled schedule with usually more than one sailing a day (including overnight sailings), and scheduled connecting trains at the destination ports on the other side of the channel - through to destinations like Paris or Brussels.
The main SR departure stations in London were Victoria and Charing Cross stations and the services would often run non stop to the ports. Special Stations adjacent to the boats (and only serving the harbours) included Dover Marine - where the size and importance of the station is illustrated on the pictures here:
http://www.dover-kent.co.uk/transport/marine_station.htm
Folkestone Harbour (where heavy trains had to be pushed by tiny locomotives in days of steam due to weight restrictions on the line - pictured here)
http://www.semg.org.uk/location/folkes_hbr1.html
Newhaven Marine (Just closed very recently)
and Portsmouth Harbour (still serves foot passenger ferries to the Isle of Wight which is juts across from Portsmouth and Southampton, 2 of the south coast of England's most important ports).
Sadly the rather superb art deco Ocean Liner terminal at Southampton was demolished after the great days of the ocean liners - rather a pity since cruises are now big business and Southampton is a cruise port, as well as still being the departure point for the New York scheduled service.
A picture of the Southampton Terminal is here
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10316388&wwwflag=2&imagepos=1
Some of the Boat trains ran to impressive schedules, including The Golden Arrow (probably the most famous service) which for a time was an all Pullman Train with the fastest London to Paris connecting schedule, as described here.
http://www.semg.org.uk/misc/named_12.html
and pictured here leaving London in steam days:
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10321304&wwwflag=2&imagepos=3
Here is a picture of the dedicated Boat for the Golden Arrow Boat train, leaving Dover, next to one of the early purpose built car ferries owned by the SR.
http://www.scienceandsociety.co.uk/results.asp?image=10173969&wwwflag=2&imagepos=18
Living near the coast I rarely used boat trains as I could get to the ports by local service train. However, on a number of occasions I did have to use the boat train and I'll relate the following story by way of illustration of the service in the late 1980s
As a family we quite often visited friends in France who lived in Paris, I think the year in question was about 1987, just before Christmas. The rest of the family had already gone to France but due to some commitment with my college I had to be in north west England when they departed and had to join them later. Travelling from North West England in the afternoon meant I arrived in London early evening, by the time I got to the south coast I would have to catch the night boat, so I left London Victoria Station on the boat train to Newhaven, which arrived at the port in time to catch the departing boat about midnight. Now this route was never a busy one for passengers, so a midweek night sailing in mid December was a pretty quiet time. The train arrived at the port and you could walk straight through to the area where tickets and paperwork was checked - it was all deserted more or less (most of the business for the night ferry this time of year being truck bound freight traffic).
I recall getting my papers checked in the dead of night (very atmospheric) and then being accosted by one of the passport control officers who cross questioned me to the third degree! I guess in retrospect he just thought it odd that a person in their late teens would be travelling alone overnight to Europe at that time of year. Eventually he let me board and I recall trying to catch some sleep on the bench seats in the passenger lounge on the boat during the 4 hour crossing - all I can remember was it was rather uncomfortable and hard to get to sleep (I think the crossing was not deemed long enough for the boats to be fitted with cabins).
Arrival in Dieppe was about 4 am time, and the boat drew up alongside a rather nice small art deco terminal building right on the quayside, which is lined with very French style cafes, restaurants and bars (all closed of course at this hour). This ferry terminal seemed right in the heart of the town. The train was parked on the quayside right beside this building, waiting to take us direct to Paris as soon as we cleared the official inspections. I can't find a picture of this building (although I know there is a rather famous painting of a steam train on the quayside here but I can't find a reference to it). Dieppe is much closer to Paris than Calais so the train journey is not a long one.
Here is a picture of the sort of train operating around that time, a large SNCF diesel locomotive:
http://www.buriton.demon.co.uk/france5.html
This took me to Paris where I arrived about 6am - in time for my host to meet me at Gare St Lazarre in time for an early whirlwind tour of the sights of Paris by car before morning traffic got busy!
Another boat train I took was about 1990 when I joined the Liverpool to Harwich boat train to connect with the boat to Holland. This boat train was what remained of a very famous boat train route across the country, but by that time it had been reduced to a two car diesel train. A rather longer service from London also arrived at the same time for the same boat, the London service still exists but the Liverpool to Harwich one seems to have been withdrawn back in the 1990s.
Of course the construction of the Chanel Tunnel in the mid 1990s meant British Rail ceased most of its boat train operation, stations like Dover Marine and Folkestone Harbour were closed and although it is still possible to use trains and boats and trains to cross the channel, services are not held to connect in the way they once were, and booking through tickets is now rarely possible.
However, in other parts of the country Boat Trains still exist in the timetables - eg serving Ireland, the islands off the Scottish mainland and across the north sea for Holland. Hopefully some of these services will be mentioned by other contributors
Hope this is of interest to people
Good morning Tom and friends! I'll have two and a half light breakfasts please. The NFL talk in Chicago is to get Rex Grossman off the field. Even though the team is 10-2, we have serious doubts that we can win playoff games with just the defense and special teams scoring points, and not the offense. Bears have got troubles. DL, your comments about every fool owning a cell phone hit one of my buttons. I've got a real problem with the people who use them while driving. When the heck will this practice be outlawed? Does it make too much sense? Nice addition to your RR station series Tom. When I am King, I will visit all these places, and ban the use of cell phones while driving. Oh yeah ... there won't be any more public smoking either, but that's a different law (which also includes my hope-to-be-patented "personal smoke chamber", which is the only place a smoker can smoke). Nice little blurb on highball definitions and links to the meanings of signals Lars. Where's the no-smoking and no-celling while driving signals? Interesting bit of info on your Union station gun battle, Peter. We prefer to shoot our gangsters in front of movie theaters in Chicago. I'll have to stick a post-it on my forehead to be on the lookout for color Red Bird pix for you. Nice attempted jokes too. Were those official submissions to the groan-o-meter, or are you going to let me break the thing all on my own? Good luck with your new editor Eric. Hope it works for you. James, any joke that makes fun of Packers ... is a good joke, and therefore will not damage the groan-o-meter. We need more of them! Great URLS as usual Mike. Enjoyed the Presidential train pix. I remember seeing a picture of our current presidential train in Trains magazine about a year ago, but don't remember if Bush was in the pic or not. Can I get an official ruling on the early boat-train picture being a tweetable offense, Tom? If it's an actual offense, I say he should be sentenced to finding out everything there is to know about that particular steam ship. Eric, that's the biggest Breyer model of a horse I have ever seen! I think it's funny how the shield in front of the toilet shields the human user from the view of the horse. Horses sure don't mind doing their business in front of humans!
Great start on our theme today DL! I'm going to need some coffee now, and take some time to read it. Is it too early for a splash of vanilla?
The Railroad Navy by David Marshall, Aug. 1959 Railroad Magazine
It's in the news again, the railroad navy, and the news is mostly good. True, the fleets are dwindling numerically. In ten years the number of vessels owned and operated by railroads of the United States and Canada has dropped 16 percent. As compaired with a round-figure total of 1,900 afloat in 1949, you will find only about 1,600 today.
This includes 200 steamships, carferries, and tugboats, and 1,400 passenger ferries, carfloats, barges, and lighters, plus a large variety of special-purpose craft such as floating grain elevators, derricks, and pile-drivers, and the latest thing of all, floating, earth-movers.
The shrinkage began thirty years ago and, until recently, was taken for granted. In the second half of 1958, however, it was dramatized abruptly by two events occurring in quick succession on opposite sides of the continent. San Francisco Bay lost its Southern Pacific passenger ferryboats and then, a little later, New York Harbor was swept bare of Erie Railroad passenger boats.
The last ferry of each road made a ceremonial farewell run, with newspaper publicity, and afterward each one quietly slipped her hawser and shoved off for the haven of unwanted things - where the water, we hope, is deep and smooth and the wearied wind is still.
Passenger ferries are only one of the many railroad fleets. Among the others, almost without exception, the numerical shrinkage has been accompanied by an unmistakable gain in total power and capability.
With tugboats and carferries especially, the gain in power has more than offset numerical loss. Tugboats and Lake Michigan carferries today have greater work capacity than ever before. So, too, the carfloats are fewer but bigger and towed by faster tugs, can handle more freight then their predecessors handled. The same situation holds, with few exceptions, all up and down the line.
Just a few years back, the last of the great Southern Pacific ferries that carried entire trains, including steam locomotives, disappeared from the sparkling waters of North America. Since then, four of the finest, swiftest, and most powerful carferries (the Chesapeake & Ohio calls them trainferries) have been launched, three on Lake Michigan and one on San Francisco Bay, while three spanking new steamships have entered the Canadian National Railways' Newfoundland service.
Thus, with all its gains and losses, the railroad navy is changing constantly. It stands today at the peak of its importance. Its vast and complicated maneuvers herald a new phase in transportation history.
The railroad navy, working 24 hours a day, is indispensable to rail operation. Though heavily massed in the East and on the Great Lakes, its scope extends from the Atlantic coast to the blue Pacific and covers a dozen "water links" in between.
It's a gigantic enterprise, an investment of probably $150 million which is money enough to buy 116 of the biggest diesel-electric locomotives plus 116 modern trains of 100 freight cars each, including metal cabooses.
In Canada, the railway water links are many. One steamship line provides a bridge for rail traffic across the Bay of Fundy, giving the Canadian Pacific entry into Nova Scotia and connection with Dominion Atlantic and Canadian National lines. Another steamship route takes the CNR into Newfoundland, which has 811,8 miles of narrow-gage track. The freight and passenger traffic of these great systems, the biggest railroads on our continent, also is carried by churning steamship to Vancouver Island off the western coast.
Still another Canadian example of the railroad navy at work is the Lake Michigan carferry service connecting Muskegon with Milwaukee, which, though operated wholly within the United States, is part of the Canadian National's Grand Trunk Division.
The railroad was born to a kinship with the sea and so we are not surprised to learn that its navy is almost as old as the railroad itself. The Baltimore & Ohio was founded to drain the wealth of the Ohio Valley into the seaport of Baltimore, Md., while the Erie was established to siphon, among other things, the wealth of that same valley into the port of New York City. The B&O was the first road to lay rails, but the Erie was the first to operate steamboats.
When the Erie was new its tracks ended at Piermont, N.Y., on the west bank of the Hudson, 26 miles north of the island city of New York. To reach the metropolis it had to cross water. And because it could have no rail terminal inside the city, the Erie created for itself, down through the years, a variety of harborside freight terminals and passenger ferryhouses, all around the watery edges of Manhatten - and many an admiring railroader was impressed by the grand job he Erie had done for itself.
New York is basically a seaport. The bulk of its freight traffic is moved by ships into and out of the harbor and up and down the harbor. In order to claim a share of that traffic all railroads in the area had to acquire harborside facilities and fleets of steamboats and barges, just as the Erie had done. But the Erie had already beaten them to it.
The Erie was the first American railroad to boast a navy and to run what the law defines as a "railroad-on-water." And that's no fanciful phrase. It means that the railroad navy is legally part and parcel of the railroad itself. The over-water mileage, the water link, is part of the main line.
It means, too, that the Erie's eastern terminal today is not Jersey City, where the tracks end, but New York City. It means that the Ann Arbor's western terminal is not Frankfort, Michigan, on the eastern shore of Lake Michigan, but Kewaunee, Wisconsin, 60 miles away, across the deep lake. And it means that the Western Pacific's main line reaches San Francisco although its track terminates at Oakland.
Since the railroad navy is included in the main line, it follows that all of the main line, it follows that all of its officers and crews - the railroad marines - are sailors as well as railroaders. In the United States they are protected by the Railroad Labor Act, while in Canada the railroad marines have a similar status. The superintendent in charge of marine operations is, in most cases, an assistant trainmaster as well as a licensed ship's officer, a master mariner.
It's an astonishing fact that railroad marines, taken as a class, rank high among the world's most expert handlers of freight cars. To be sure of this, you have only to visit, for example, the Grand Trunk System's boatyard at Muskegon on the eastern rim of Lake Michigan.
There the ships and the freight trains come and go in slick unison, responding to the orders of a train dispatcher who ties their movements together in a single, integrated operation.
An arriving ship discharger her four cuts of cars. They roll directly to the yard, and twenty minutes later they're trailing a locomotive down the rails that leads to Canada. An arriving train is taken over by the marines, who classify it by weight and swiftly reshuffle it, for the load must be balanced carefully aboard ship. The reloading of a ship is begun the minute that east bound cars are down the apron and out of the way.
Day after day, and more than once a day, as three ships move in and out in orderly procession, the four neatly-balanced cuts of cars roll across the apron to the car deck, through the vessel's stern, and are spotted on the four stub tracks at surprising speed. This is done with the smoothness of railroading raised to a fine art.
Now and then, on rare occasions, there's a slipup. It happens on all kinds of jobs. Last January, for instance, a Lackawanna carfloat dumped half a dozen perfectly good boxcars into New York City's East River. Nobody was hurt, but the newspapers played it up. Someone had forgotten to place the chocks under the car wheels, and a swell had started them rolling.
Reminds us of the old joke they tell about a boomer switchman who was lining up a freight train in a yard at night. The boomer calmly signaled for two more cars. The first two had gone into the river!
The Pennsy tug Amboy, with a crew of salt-water railroaders, hauls barges loaded with coal from pier at South Amboy, N.J., into New York City
Tuesday morning, time for some freshly ground ‘n brewed Joe, pastries from the Mentor Village Bakery, and a <light> or <traditional> breaskfast from our Menu Board!
Temps made it to 40 (F) yesterday and expected to flirt with it again today as the ice shield has this part of mid-continent USA firmly in its grip. Blue skies and hardly any winds at all make it tolerable out there, but the footing is terrible for 2 legged creatures. Juneau loves it! <grin>
Some interesting and long awaited activity from late afternoon into the late hours! So, let me get to the acknowledgments from my last narrative on . . . .
DL at 11:20 AM yesterday: Got a kick out of your comments regarding TV and phones in GB some decades past. I think my first color set arrived in the late 60s as I struggled to make ends meet living in the Boston area. I’ll never forget the purchase from Sears.
For some reason, still not totally clear to me, we had shopped for a “deal” and found one in a console model that was to be discontinued. Nothing wrong with it, just that the newer version supposedly had more bells ‘n whistles than the old. Anyway, the sales guy said he’d sell us the floor model for an appreciably lower price than we could find anywhere else. I balked in that any experiences with floor models of any kind had not been good. So we settled on what he said was “the last in stock.” But in order to take it home, we’d have to go to the catalog desk for pick up. So, off we went. Arriving at the totally empty catalog area, there was a young lady behind the desk, a clock, a “take a number” system and all sorts of catalogs to browse through. The woman called out a number, something like “37” . . . . of course, there was no one there. I looked at her with an incredulous stare, but she continued, “38 – 39 – 40, etc.” So, I played the game and took a number from the dispenser it was about 25 numbers away from where she was, “41 – 42 – 43 – 44, etc.” So, we stood there until she reached our number – BINGO – we won! Got the TV loaded into the station wagon and headed on home. Never forget the purchase! I think that woman got elected to Congress and perhaps will be running for the Senate one day!<grin>
TV Caught fire shortly after, darned near caused a calamity if not for the quick thinking of my oldest son (about 8 at the time) who knew enough to pull the plug from the wall. Sears stood by the product – replaced the set with a new model (WITH the bells ‘n whistles), replaced the burned draperies, arranged to have our home cleansed of the smoke smell and so forth. Could’ve been worse – we might have had to go back to the catalog desk for help and of course, take a number – 271 – 272 – 273, etc.! <laff>
Glad to see that Lars addressed your questions – both good ones! Signaling on the rails is really an involved topic, one that I must admit boggles my mind from time to time. I’m just a simple sailor and understand things like the “rules of the road” when at sea. Pretty basic stuff and it all works, unless one isn’t paying attention to business of course, then one may experience a bad day. <grin> I pretty much figured out the Canadian system now in place from all of my experiences sitting in the observation domes of VIA Rail and can’t understand why any degree of complexity is permitted to reside in the system. I’m sure “real” railroaders will beg to differ and I’m hardly in a situation to dispute or be contentious about this, but again – I’ve navigated some pretty “hairy” stretches of water at night using the simple “rules of the road” and have lived to tell the tale (Florida Straits, English Channel, New York ‘n Boston harbors, etc.).
Lars at 2:44 PM yesterday: Hope your week turns out better than your expectations! We’ll miss having you aboard in your PM time slot, which has really helped keep the flow moving forward . . . thanx for the Email!
Looks like your Post is missing a paragraph – Forum Gremlins, perhaps
Good stuff on the RR signals, always helps – but as mentioned above, I still have a degree of difficulty with it all. Guess I’m more of a “see ‘n do” kinda guy – so I’ve got to find a way to get into the cabs of ALL the operating RRs in the U.S. ‘n Canada to make an assessment of my own! <grin>
Hi-ball Pretty much an old-fashioned term for mixed drinks that my guess has faded away. Kinda like people who still refer to “hi-test” or “premium” gasoline as “Ethyl.” Been a long time since I’ve heard that, but once upon a time . . . . I know when I was behind the bar in Alaska way back when – the guys who frequented the joint hardly asked for one! “Gimme a shot ‘n a beer!” Or, “Gimme a bottle of . . . and a glass!” Yeah, those guys KNEW what it was all about! <grin>
Pete at 5:38 PM yesterday: Nice shot of KCity’s Union Station and good link to check out! One thing though – pretty much for James – is that the station was without passenger service for decades and the return of Amtrak had nothing to do with the renovation of the place. That was all set into motion though a massive private and civic effort to restore the edifice to respectability of days gone by. It was intended to be used mo
I'll have a coffee and a bacon roll please Ruth
The truck with the stuff from England is due any minute so I will post my Boat Train. and I will catch up on the posts a bit later.
BOAT TRAINS TO IRELAND ON THE LONDON MIDLAND REGION OF B.R. PART ONE
With the advent of the opening of a rail line connecting London with Liverpool the Irish Mail and passenger travel was transferred to Liverpool in 1839, from Holyhead although Holyhead was a much shorter sea crossing the fastest journey time was22 1/2 hours London to Dublin through Liverpool.
The North Wales Coast Line was open in 1848 and the contract for the Irish mails were put out to tender on this route. To service the ships the London & North Western railway put on an express train to carry the Mails. The train was named The Irish Mail. This became the longest continuous Named Train in the world (until fairly recently when Virgin, with a great sense of British tradition, withdrew the remaining named trains on the West Coast. Although the name trains could only be found as a note in the timetables in the last years).
A great link to the early ships used on the Holyhead to Dublin crossing
http://www.anglesey.info/London_and_North_Western_Railways_Shipping_History.htm
When the first Irish Mail ran in 1848 it took 10 hours to get to Holyhead by 1880 the service had been accelerated so that the journey to Dublin took only 20 minutes longer.
The Irish Mail was the principal express to run on the North Wales coast line that ran through the border city of Chester and joined the West Coast Main line at Crewe home of the large locomotive works.
In BR days the Irish Mail was worked by locos of the Royal Scot class allocated to Holyhead shed, later these were joined by 5 Britannia Pacifics. I have just learnt in Summer time there were two trains that ran the morning Irish Mail. I had recollections of there being a relief train when we traveled on it once, I did not know it as a regular train.
In this period the Mail was scheduled to travel the 263-¾ miles in 5 ½ hours with the same loco doing the whole trip.If I recall correctly the train called at Rugby, Stafford, Crewe, Chester, Bangor and Holyhead, probably the only passenger train that did not call at Llandudno Junction on the Northwales Coast. We used to holiday at Rhyl and I can still remember the chime whistle of the Britannia on the Night Irish Mail as it passed the carriage shed there.
After steam the train was worked by diesels first the English Electric 2,000HP type 4s(later class 40) and later on by the Brush 2,750 HP, later derated to 2,550HP type 4s(later class 47). These locos were the main stay of the mail although after the West Coast was electrified south of Crewe an electric loco would work the train between Crewe and London. Until recently the train was worked by a High Speed Train (HST) the entire journey that meant the HST was running under the wires for 158 miles of its journey.In Virgin days a HST power car# 43101 carried the nameThe Irish Mail /Tren Post Gwyddelig( which I believe is Welsh for irish Mail.)
A train runs today at a similar time that the Irish Mail did. It is worked by a Virgin Pendelino. It works under electric power to Crewe, where a Virgin class 57/3 diesel is attached and the Pendilino is hauled to Holyhead, a bit of a waste of its 125 MPH capability.
A bit of a footnote on the Irish Mail. In 1848 a messenger was sent to London Euston From the Royal Observatory in Greenwich carrying a watch that had been set to Greenwich Mean Time (GMT) .He then handed the watch to the guard (conductor) of the train and the station clocks which the train called at were reset to the watch, on arrival at Holyhead the watch was taken to Dublin. The watch then made the return journey.
Remarkably this practice continued until 1939.
A celebration run was made in 1998.
http://www.holyhead.com/page57.html.
On the London to Holyhead route there was also The Emerald Isle Express, but I have little about this train. I do know that train called at Rhyl a seaside resort on the North Wales Coast but not Rugby as the Irish Mail did. Rugby was an important mail center at the time.
Another (rather unfortunate) claim to fame was in the early days the loco hauling the train suffered the most destructive boiler explosion on a British Locomotive. This occured about 5 miles north of Rugby, it was said the boiler plate had become remarkably thin, it was lucky that it happened in the countryside and not when the loco was standing in Rugby station.
Back later Pete.
Good Morning Barkeep and all Present; coffee, please; round for the house and $ for the jukebox. Cold this a.m., but clear and the moon was unbelievable. It was up when I went home from work last evening, and still up this a.m. So bright, you could read outside.
Apologize for my absence yesterday, but work assignments trump everything else.
A few comments and then on to the boats.
Barndad provided some shots of an S motor. I recall we talked about them awhile back when I was commenting on several pictures of the NYC. The CNW horse car was interesting. The PRR had them as well. PRR also had special cars for moving theatre scenery. These last were baggage cars that had both side and end door. Also, thanks for CGW information.
Lars - Giants? Humbug, sir! I will take a highball (or six) before I can talk about them. What really gets me going is that they find such creative ways to blow leads and lose ballgames. BTW, you heard it here first; New England is on the verge of tanking as well. College ball was actually more interesting as the Mountaineers defeated Rutgers in a 3OT game. Onto the Gator Bowl - Lord help us! Enjoyed the PRR books. The Broadway one is excellent. I have most all of the diesel series which you posted (book with the black cover). The photographs in those volumes are excellently reproduced. I recommend the series.
Pete - Thanks for photos and station information.
Also thanks to James for comments and electric information. I assume you have the Steinheimer book, Electric Way Across the Mountains? Pricy, but wonderful pictures and first-hand stories. Santa got me a copy of tit last Christmas.
Eric - Hang in there.
Mike gave us a couple of vintage CV shots. B4 I forget, the most recent issue of Vermont Life has a good story (with pictures) on White River Jct. It also includes some quotations from the present owner of the Coolidge Hotel.
Our ‘steamed proprietor gave us a fine playbill for "moom pitchers" at the Mentor Theatuh. Omay? I went and found my DVD with that one on it; they had to have ad libbed most of the script.
I saw Bulger (ex WV player) and his tirade on Sports Center. He usually is pretty calm, so they must have had a lot of problems. BTW, Bruins defeated the Canadiens last night - how come they can't in the playoffs (like I can't figure that one out - LOL). If your creature is like the K( Korps at my house, you can't get it back in the house in this cold weather. Even the Springer (a.k.a Bony Bob) was outside yesterday a.m. when it was about 13 degrees; had to drag him inside.
Now for today's theme; there's so much here, that I have had to stop myself b4 I overloaded the computer
Probably the best known boat train on U.S. railroads was the New Haven's Fall River Boat train. This ran between Boston's South Station via the trackage of the Old Colony RR, and the Fall River Railroad to Fall River, MA where passengers boarded Fall River Line steamers for the passage down Long Island Sound to New York.
Fall River Line steamers included the "Priscilla, Commonwealth, Bay State, Bristol, and Providence." Priscilla and Commonwealth are the best-remembered today. They were beautiful paddle wheel vessels. A stateroom went for $3 (real money, back then).
The Boat Train was the longest operating named passenger train in the Nation. It ran from 1847 until 1937. Asa Porter, a legendary conductor held this run from 1864 to 1896.
Following is from Vol. 1 of The Trains We Rode. "The Boat Train consist...usually comprised a baggage car, two Pullman parlor cars, and a number of coaches appropriate to the season." Much of this equipment was lettered with the train name. An example of one of these cars is in Staufer's book New Haven Power.
The train departed South Station in the late afternoon. Boats departed Fall River in the early evening with an early morning arrival in New York. The same schedule applied for boats and trains heading from New York to Boston. Two trains, one leaving at 5:30 a.m. carried passengers from Fall River to Boston. This early train was usually two coaches; a later train carried the parlor cars, etc. noted above.
Herewith a piece of ad copy (from before South Station was built).
All the Year Round service
Steamers Leave New York at 5:00 p.m., touching at Newport at 3:15 a.m.; due Fall River at 5:00 a.m. Pullman Vestibuled Express trains leave steamboat wharf, Fall River, at 5:30 and 7:40 a.m., being due at Park Square Station, Boston (New York, New Haven, & Hartford Railroad - Old Colony System), at 6:50 and 9:00 a.m. respectively
Pullman Vestibuled trains leave Park Square Station week-days at 6:00 p.m., connecting with steamers leaving Fall River at 7:40 p.m., touching at Newport and hour later; due in New York at 7:00 a.m.
I should mention here that my father's family was from Newport (not the rich side, believe me). He well recalls as a boy seeing not only the Boat Train, but also watching the Fall River Line steamers departing Newport in the evening. My mom, who was devoted to travel in all forms, was taught how to row and handle a small boat by a Fall River Line captain who lived near a friend of hers house in Tiverton, RI.
Two books that will give you a lot more information are: Splendor Sailed the Sound, and a shorter work titled Priscilla of Fall River.
Here are a couple of sites where you can find out more. I don't know if the forum will let you use the links, if not, type them in; they both work
http://www,americanheritage.com/articles/magazine/ah/1954/1/1954_1_6.shmtl
This next one is really fun.
http://edsitement.neh.gov/Lessons_Flash/Fall_River_Line01.html
work safe
G’day Again Gents!
Just spent the past 45 minutes in total concentration with the fine Theme for the Day! Posts from DL, Doug, Pete ‘n CM3. Well done, Gents, well done! 5- Salutes to the three of you! Goes to show, once again, that on this Thread there is indeed quality over quantity and it certainly reveals itself today!
I think it was good planning to have DL ‘n Pete approach the Boat Trains from different parts of England. Just amazing to me what kind of infrastructure had to go into such operations and of course the investment pounds that went along with it.
Noted in one of the posters on a URL from DL that the ferry seems to be heading in the wrong direction – toward Dover rather than away from it. No biggie, but just caught my eye given that the idea of the ad was to attract Euro-bound passengers. <grin>
Never knew of the extensive network of rail-sea operations that Erie had, although having crossed the upper NY harbor many, many times aboard the Staten Island ferry, the “E” was plainly evident to one and all gawking at the passing sights of vessel traffic. Of course most of those facilities were indeed on Manhattan’s western shore; lotsa “Es” along there. Thanx, Doug!
CM3 - The New Haven and connected railways also had an impressive network to serve the public’s needs. Such a shame that all of this is simply bound for the pages of history and no longer a viable facet in the way we get from place to place. Just makes me more convinced that I was born far too late for the things that flick my switch. Just imagine the “fun” you ‘n Moi would’ve had if only . . . .
DL, you are a comparative youngster at this bar (young James being the lone exception), having revealed your place in years to us – at least in approximate terms. Gratifying to know that there are people far younger than I who still appreciate railroading and all that it has been, is and hopefully will continue to be, no matter which side of the “pond” one resides on.
Your mention of Southampton brought back a memory or two from my one and only visit to the area – 1971. Was given a “tour” of the QE2 by the ship’s Radio Officer upon having met at one of the local watering holes. I think he got a kick out of my complaining about the warm beer! <grin> Anyway, turned out that our “fleet” of 3 vessels were to be honored at a gala that evening by the Admiralty – one of those “you shall attend, and be happy about it” affairs for the ship’s officers. <smile> Anyway, the QE2s officers were also on hand and the RO ‘n I resumed our acquaintanceship which all resulted in the “tour.” Quite fascinating and something I’ll surely not forget. Lost track of the fellow over the years, and quite frankly I think he passed on to Neptune’s Locker. Nice guy who loved his profession.
Found it somewhat odd to think of trains in GB having the “longest routes in the world” for named trains, no matter what the era or circumstances. Just the “north American” in me coming out – after all, we deal in thousands of miles here as if it is a “given.” Now those trains would have truly been in the record books had those ferries linked to the U.S. ‘n Canada!
Again, many thanx to DL – Doug - Pete ‘n CM3 for the fine work. Really means a lot to those of us who take the time and make the effort to keep this Thread moving forward with relevant material on Classic Trains – no matter where in the world they may be found!
Ruth, a round ‘n lunch on me for these four . . . and Boris, be sure to take care of ‘em!
THEME for the DAY! - THEME for the DAY!
RR THEME for the DAY - Number Nine
Boat Trains
Something a bit different to supplement the fine contributions from the guys thus far.
As with most things in life, we find that what used to be has been subject to CHANGE and what has resulted may be far different than we once recalled. For those of us who appreciate Classic Trains, this is all the more evident.
Therefore, why not Boat Trains
I submit that while in the pure regard, the Boat Trains of yesterday are long gone from the railroading scene in the U.S., something else has emerged to not necessarily take its place, but perhaps to add a different twist to it.
While in Alaska in June, we traveled to Fairbanks from Anchorage on a round trip - which was well chronicled on these Pages in print and Pix for several weeks. The train, operated by the Alaska Railroad (ARR) is indeed a regular scheduled train during the "season" and operates as the Denali Star.
The crusie ship industry has found Alaska to be a haven for their passengers and the leading companies have arranged to have their Ultra Dome cars attached to the rear of the Denali Star. This of course provides those who arrive in Alaska by ship to continue on with their travels by train, with as many of the comforts as can be fashioned into those cars.
Ours was a trip booked solely within the ARR cars and we traveled Gold Star class (1st class by any other reference) in an Ultra Dome not associated with the cruise ships. However, there were 10 such cars at the rear of our train - both directions - and perhaps we can rightly refer to them as the 21st Century version of the Boat Train. By the by, we did NOT arrive in Alaska by ship - for whatever that's worth.
Check these out:
Note: all Pix from: http://www.coloradorailcar.com/
Enjoy!
Did you miss any of the previous eight Click on the URL:
#1 – PRR S2 #6200, page 365
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/423/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#2 – NYC 20th Century Limited, page 381
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/381/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#3 – C&NW, page 384
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/384/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#4 – New Haven, page 388
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/388/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#5 – KCS – Southern Belle, page 392
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/392/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#6 – Aerotrain, page 409
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/409/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#7 – Railway Post Office, page 424
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/424/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
#8 - The Pullman Company, page 433
http://www.trains.com/trccs/forums/433/448217/ShowPost.aspx#448217
Login, or register today to interact in our online community, comment on articles, receive our newsletter, manage your account online and more!
Get the Classic Trains twice-monthly newsletter