MiningmanMidland Mike-- Thanks for that reminder. How on earth did we lose these things. Well thankfully at least we still have the Great Lakes ferries Badger in the US and the Chi-Cheemaun in Ontario, both of whom have a fine railroad heritage.
I did not realize the Chi-Cheemaun had a railroad heritage. I see it belonged to Ontario Northland Marine. It seems far away from the ONR.
Thanks, Peter. Did high-price doctors also express their fees in guineas?
Johnny
OvermodKlaatu barada nikto
Good Halloween reference!
Trains, trains, wonderful trains. The more you get, the more you toot!
Deggesty Peter, did you also have a five shilling coin, called a "crown" and was the 2 & 6 coin called a "half crown?" And, did you also use guineas or just pounds?
Peter, did you also have a five shilling coin, called a "crown" and was the 2 & 6 coin called a "half crown?" And, did you also use guineas or just pounds?
I have never seen a five shilling coin. However a "50 cent" coin was introduced in 1966, made of silver and it was withdrawn and replaced by a cupro-nickel version with twelve sides in 1970, the silver version being circular with milled edges.
2/6 was always called "half a crown" but had to be made up from a Florin (2/-) and a sixpence. As a result we now have 20c coins but no quarters.
Yes, guineas were used. Tradtionally racehorses were sold with prices in guineas because prices in Guineas had some sort of 'upper class" appeal. So were expensive automobiles. For those who really don't know what Johnny and I are talking about, it was a tradition in England to quote prices of costly items in guineas where One Guinea = One Pound One Shilling = 1 and 1/20 Pounds, so 5% more than the same number in pounds.
This was extensively used in advertising of home electronics (mainly television sets) where 50 pounds was a sort of break point between cheap and expensive sets. So a TV set was advertised as 49 guineas = 51 pounds 9 shillings.
One of my happy memories is of a TV quiz show, about the time the change in the 50 cent coin was announced. This was the first night of a TV show hosted by a man with a long running and successful radio show. It had an unnecessarily complex procedure where a question was answered, then if correct, a key was drawn from a barrel which unlocked (or not) a padlock on a new Ford sedan.
Anyway, the first contestant was asked "how many sides has the new...." at which she interrupted with "twelve". Prior to this, they had opened the padlock to show that one key worked, and dropped it in the barrel. The woman reached into the barrel, pulled out a key and opened the padlock.
At this, the host stormed off throwing his program notes away. They went to an advertising break, after which he returned, saying "Ford have said they will give us a new car for tomorrow night...."
The program didn't last the season.....
When Australia converted to decimal currency they used one dollar = ten shillings = 1/2 pound. Only the copper coins were replaced since one cent =1+1/5 pennies but sixpence became 5 cents, one shilling became ten cents.
When the UK changed some years later, they kept the pound, so one new penny = 2.4 old pennies, so a shilling became five new pence and so on.
So an Australian visiting the UK had to get used to familiar coins which had half the numerical value they had at home. This was even harder shortly after the change when they still said "shilling" or "florin" rather than 5p or 10p....
Peter
Now Wayne, me lad, that fine film "Damn the Defiant" was written jointly by the guy who wrote the Quatermass Experiment and the guy who invented Klaatu barada nikto'. Neither of them having any Navy experience whatsoever (the one being the British equivalent of 4F for photophobia, and the other spending WWII in the Signal Corps making training films).
The screenplay was an adaptation of a bestselling novel from 1958, Frank Tilsley's "Mutiny". Tilsley, alas! was not a Navy man either; he was a war reporter for the RAF and wound up with what may be a suspicious rank of 'Squadron Commander' -- well, it's reminiscent of a sort of naval role, the Gilbert & Sullivan ruler of the Queen's nay-vee, but not a terribly compelling indication of intimate familiarity with the semantic nomenclature of tall ships... a survey of his works includes titles like "I'd Hate to be Dead", "The Jungle of Your Heart","The Boys of Coastal", "Pleasure Beach", and "The Lady in the Fur Coat" which would indicate to me that his research for the one novel might well be tainted by, er, Air Force terminology...
Now Overmod me old son, in that fine film "Damn The Defiant" Sir Alec Guinness (as Captain Crawford) gives a command "Give her the mainsail!" so I have it on Sir Alec's authority it's a proper command.
AND Sir Alec was a Royal Navy veteran to boot!
I'm from New Jersey all right, that means I can drive anything!
Overmod M636C Also in the movie, Churchill is seen suggesting to Albert that the name George would be more acceptable than Albert which was seen as too German. (strange given the number of Kings named George that never learnt English). More than usually sucky, as Victoria's Albert was one of the best of the lot ... I have often thought (as have other alternative-historian SF aficionados) that the world would have been much better had he lived longer.
M636C Also in the movie, Churchill is seen suggesting to Albert that the name George would be more acceptable than Albert which was seen as too German. (strange given the number of Kings named George that never learnt English).
More than usually sucky, as Victoria's Albert was one of the best of the lot ... I have often thought (as have other alternative-historian SF aficionados) that the world would have been much better had he lived longer.
M636C-- Both you and I have to stare at Monarchy on the reverse side of our coinage every day. Maybe an unkept beard on the Duke of Sussex ( ahem, not Windsor) might pop up someday on the dime, who knows!
Unless the Prince of Wales and the Duke of Cambridge take their whole families on the same Lionair flight, it isn't likely. Harry is now sixth in line...
Given the role that Harry has been given, I think the intention was to give him the title Duke of Edinburgh but nobody expected Philip to last that long. With all the awards and similar carrying the title of "Edinburgh", someone like Harry who could keep the title going (and not become King) is needed.
The names "nickel" and "dime" are not used in Australia, just "five cent" and "ten cent". The decimal currency was only introduced on 14 February 1966 and I guess it hasn't been long enough for nicknames. The shilling that preceded the ten cent was abbreviated to "bob" the two shilling coin being "two bob" but only for round numbers, two shillings and sixpence being "two and six".
The Queen's image only appears on the smallest banknote, but on all coins.
Good thread.
Midland Mike-- Thanks for that reminder. How on earth did we lose these things. Well thankfully at least we still have the Great Lakes ferries Badger in the US and the Chi-Cheemaun in Ontario, both of whom have a fine railroad heritage.
Firelock-- Wow to the broadsides from the HMS Victory. I understand the real thing pushed and lifted the ship back. How the heck does anyone survive that onslaught. By the way my high school was Admiral Lord Nelson and our yearbook is The Victory. A big school, very middle and upper middle class. Which leads me to....
Penny--- We shot off a cannon as well during football games but no Minute Men, we had Redcoats and striped sailors and Admiral Lord Nelson himself with a sword and his Admiralty feathered hat. Now how about getting those two football teams together!!!! Wholly Cow! ... which brings me to Firelock again...
Firelock-- staged re-enactment with 15 tall ships out on Lake Erie, now I know anything is possible, because they did it, but I think it best we do this BEFORE Penny's High School vs. my High School football game or maybe someone will get too serious.
Overmod-- Ok I'm lost.. can you expand a bit on the Fortunately comment? I think I get the gist but only peripherally. Also what about Victoria's eldest grandson, the somewhat lunatic Kaiser Wilhelm II, without him it's quite possible there is no WWI and II. Just gotta have a bigger Navy than the Brits didn't you?
...and to our American cousins and dear friends don't feel left out because the O'Bushtons came close to perpetual family rule and may still yet, but the Sex Pistols came along and shook it up. So much fun.
Ok late edit--- Overmod.. it all came together, I get it.
M636CAlso in the movie, Churchill is seen suggesting to Albert that the name George would be more acceptable than Albert which was seen as too German. (strange given the number of Kings named George that never learnt English).
Miningman Definitely in Darkest Hour. There are several scenes with the two of them in private and they did seem friendly and showed concern for each other and the country, but this one scene was quite formal. Churchill had just been elected and the King was required to summon him and ask Churchill to form the new government. It was all very proper and stuffy.
Definitely in Darkest Hour. There are several scenes with the two of them in private and they did seem friendly and showed concern for each other and the country, but this one scene was quite formal. Churchill had just been elected and the King was required to summon him and ask Churchill to form the new government. It was all very proper and stuffy.
CNR had another steamship line, if you consider the GTW carferry across Lake Michigan, between Muskegon, MI and Milwaukee, WI. It ran until 1978. Its last ferry, the City of Milwaukee, is preserved in Manistee, MI. I toured it a few years ago. I might also have ridden it when it operated for the Ann Arbor, but I did not keep track of ships names.
MiningmanIt was all very proper and stuffy.
Musta been too many of the wrong kinds of Poms watching. British pomp and circumstance can be almost unmatched at times. Fortunately* when the actual time comes to do the do, they get things done most of the time.
*This is a loaded word for some, the al-Fayeds and divers Argentines among them...
MiningmanI'm reminded of the scene in the latest Churchill movie where Sir Winston has to kiss the Kings hand and walk backwards, not turning his back on the Monarch as he exits the room.
This is VERY strange, considering the relationship between Churchill and the Rex Imp. as described in a number of places in the former's history of the Second World War. Is that scene in "Churchill" or is it in "Darkest Hour"?
Firelock76Give 'er the mainsail, topsails and t'gallants! Stun'sls too! Every rag she'll carry!"
You're from New Jersey, aren't you?
If you're going to say 't'gallants' then it would be t's'ls, NOT pronounced "top-sayles", and it's 'stuns'ls' (an abbreviation of 'studding sails' that needs no contraction in the first word, note where the apostrophe goes, just as 'rarin' to go' is NOT an abbreviation of 'raring to go). And you do not 'give her' the mains'l the way the Army Air Corps gives her the gun.
And 'let fly' applied to sails means to LOOSEN so they stop driving... dogs will go faster if you let them slip, and cannonballs if you let them fly, but there's a difference with tall ships.
It's all right, though. Just don't think you can move to Somalia just yet...
Sounds like fun, but a re-enactment only, mind you.
No more "Cousins Wars," not in this dangerous age we live in.
See, I can be serious!
Well ok... on the USS Niagara video they held a reenactment of the Battle of Lake Erie with 9 American and 6 British tall ships. So I suppose you are quite sane.
Man your cannon Firelock, think I have little choice but to be on the Canadian, err, British side. What a hoot that would be.
Miningman Now they are going to get you a shrink.
Now they are going to get you a shrink.
Maybe they better, if I'm going to start having flashbacks to wars I was never in!
Hey Becky, I can imagine how even a small charge of black powder can scare you, especially if you don't know it's coming. Sometimes even if you DO know it's coming.
Here's a video of Lord Nelson's old flagship HMS Victory "firing a broadside." They're not actually shooting the great guns, what you see are pyrotechnic charges with about three ounces of black powder, and look at the bang they make!
Now, imagine what Victory's 24 pounders with their usual charge of eight pounds of powder must have been like!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnomDilySlA
"Come cheer up m'lads, 'tis to glory we steer,
And add something more to this wonderful year..."
Firelock76If I only got to load and fire the carronade
In my freshman year of high school they still dragged the cannon out on the field and fired it during the national anthem. Being in the marching band, (the Valley Forge Patriots our mascot was a minuteman) we were always smack down range of the thing and even with a small charge it usually scared the bejesus out of at least 10 percent of us musicians!
They'd have to catch me first!
"Let fly the fore-courses! Give 'er the mainsail, topsails and t'gallants! Stun'sls too! Every rag she'll carry!"
Now you're going to get thrown in the klink.
I'll only bombard any diesel locomotives in sight, I promise!
Well let me try this again.
Firelock--- No way they let you have the wheel or touch anything to do with the cannon. Now you and me will both be keel hauled.
If I only got to load and fire the carronade I'd be a happy man indeed.
Maybe handle the wheel for bit as well. "A tall ship and a star to steer her by..."
Since it exists I assume that perhaps you can. What an unforgettable experience that would be.
At my age I couldn't do much but could go as far as a person could on the bow and do the 'King of the world' thing. Then they probably keel haul me.
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