The Montrealer is correct. It was the idea of the Pres. of the CN, but was a CV (CN subsidiary), B&M, NYNH&H, PRR train. In the reverse direction it was the Washingtonian. But when Amtrak revived it after its absence after 1 May 1971, it was the Montrealer in both directions.
Originally K4, Washington - Manhattan Transfer, DD1 MT-Harold Tower, Queens, NH I4 Pacific HTQ-Springfield, then B&M to White River Jc., then CV power to Montreal. After 1931 New Haven EP-2 or EP-3, Harold Tower to New Haven for the 5 changes. Then came PRR P5 or GG1, Wilmington to Penn Station instead of DD1 Man Trans to Harold Tower. Completion of the Washington electrficiaiton reduced changes to 4. In the McGinnis and immediate post-McGinnis era, after the excellent EP-2, EP-3, EP-4, and EF-3 locomotives were scrapped, only the EP-5 "Jets" remianed, with change to FL-9's at New Haven. But if was not an EP-5 available, the FL-9's could run into Penn on LIRR third rail power, given their double-sprung dual-purpose shoes. The Penn Central - New Haven absorption made it 3 by GG1's running to New Haven, and so it remained until Amtrak. When Amtrak revived the train, its diesels ran through Montreal - New Haven and GG1's, E60's, and then AEM7's ran NH-Washington DC.
Give us a good question, Henry.
Unless I git m'chores done quick, I'll haf ta wait til tomorra ta git one to ya!
I'm thinking, I'm thinking....
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The Blue Comet was CNJ's most famous train...but it ran at least two other trains which were "named" trains in conjunction with other roads.....name the trains and the railroads involved. Hint: B&O trains on CNJ were B&O trains not CNJ trains nor was RDG's Crusader a CNJ train.
henry6 The Blue Comet was CNJ's most famous train...but it ran at least two other trains which were "named" trains in conjunction with other roads.....name the trains and the railroads involved. Hint: B&O trains on CNJ were B&O trains not CNJ trains nor was RDG's Crusader a CNJ train.
Queen of the Valley, Harrisburger, Harrisburg-New Yorker - Jersey City-Harrisburg
CNJ Jersey City-Allentown, RDG Allentown-Harrisburg
Williamsporter - Jersey City-Williamsport - CNJ Jersey City-Tamaqua, RDG Tamaqua-Williamsport
Phailadelphia Flyer - Scranton-Philadelphia, CNJ Scranton-Bethlehem, RDG Bethlehem-Philadelphia
Queen of the Valley, JC - Harrisburg, partly via Reading but still a CofNJ train.
Also, the Blue Comet had a companion on the JC-AC run, and I think it was called the Boardwalk, but I am not sure.
JC-AC Cof NJ trains ran over the PRSL for the final miles into AC. For that matter so did the PRR trains, such as the Nelly Bly.
There is another "name" train I am thinking about, handled by CNJ power on CNJ exculusively...I believe the Williamsporter and Philadelphia Flyer were Reading trains not so named on the CNJ even though handled by them.
Checked my June 1958 Guide and can confrm tha Williamsporter and Philadelphia Flyer were not CNJ trains. However, found four names I didn't know existed...well, three anyway, one I did know and forgot! Now for hints and confusion: the train I am thinking of was not in the 1958 guide but was still running, and the new names I learned makes the Queen of the Valley only 1/4 of the names I should be looking for but actually 1/8 ot the total named trains on CNJ at that time and not 1/2 as I thought.
.
The Raritan Clocker and the New York Clocker haven't been mentioned yet. There were also the Interstate Express, Scranton Flyer and Philadelphia Flyer which I believe were jointly operated by the CNJ and RDG but are listed in pre-WW2 OG's as CNJ trains.
Mark
Ok, the Queen of the Valley and Interstate Express were the two I was looking for. The Clockers were off my radar. BUT, in looking at the 1958 Guide, in addition to the Clockers was another train that made the Queen of the Valley only one third of the answer...just for kicks, since two of you have each gotten half the answer, fill in the other train I am referring to and you will be the winner....
Doesn't anyone want to lock in the last named train and win? Either break the tie or take it away!
I don't think it was on the schedules in 1958, but the 1937 OG lists a CNJ train named the Harrisburg-New Yorker.
Mark, by 1958 it was called just The Harrisburger....the odd thing is that it was only eastbound and the Queen of the Valley was only westbound...
....and speaking of bound, you are bound to have a good question for us as the winner here!
Though they operated at different times, one railroad ran three trains whose names had a regal flair that served a common end-point city. What were the names of these three, the railroad which operated them and their common terminal city.
Serving Washington, DC, the B&O carded the Royal Blue, the National Limited, and the Capitol Limited. At one time, all three ran through to Jersey City, running over the Jersey Central, which also carded its own Queen of the Valley and hosted the Reading's Crusader (and the Crusades were, of course, led by Christian Kings). I have some doubts that this is what you are looking for, however. Is the Southern's Royal Palm one of the trains you are looking for?
I was looking for Queen of the Valley and The Interstate Express. Other names were brought in. One said Interstate Express but not Queen, another Queen but not Interstate Express. But I also found inthe June 1958 Guide that the Queen rand only westbound and the Harrisburger ran eastbound. In a jump ball whoever came in with the H'brger would be winner and Mark did thus won!
B&O trains and RDG Crusader were ruled out because they were not CNJ trains but rather of the respective tenants.
KCSfan Though they operated at different times, one railroad ran three trains whose names had a regal flair that served a common end-point city. What were the names of these three, the railroad which operated them and their common terminal city. Mark
Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati
Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati
Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati
ZephyrOverland KCSfan: Though they operated at different times, one railroad ran three trains whose names had a regal flair that served a common end-point city. What were the names of these three, the railroad which operated them and their common terminal city. Mark Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati
KCSfan: Though they operated at different times, one railroad ran three trains whose names had a regal flair that served a common end-point city. What were the names of these three, the railroad which operated them and their common terminal city. Mark
Good try ZO. You have the right idea but these are not the trains I had in mind. With respect to the Royal Palm, there were no through coaches just a single Chicago - Jacksonville sleeper that was carried in Big Four (NYC) trains between Chi and Cincy. AFAIK the Royal Palm name applied only to SR No.s 3 & 4 running between Cincy and Jax.
Was the Royal Blue one of the trains?
daveklepper Was the Royal Blue one of the trains?
Nope - Mark
KCSfan ZephyrOverland: Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati Good try ZO. You have the right idea but these are not the trains I had in mind. With respect to the Royal Palm, there were no through coaches just a single Chicago - Jacksonville sleeper that was carried in Big Four (NYC) trains between Chi and Cincy. AFAIK the Royal Palm name applied only to SR No.s 3 & 4 running between Cincy and Jax. Mark
ZephyrOverland: Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati
The Royal Palm was originally a Chicago-Jacksonville through train beginning in 1913, but the Big4/NYC Chicago-Cincinnati portion became a separate train a few years later. The Big4/NYC Royal Palm always operated on an Chicago-Cincinnati overnight schedule connecting with the SR Cincinnati-Jacksonville Royal Palm and the former occasionally carried through Florida Pullmans.
To add to the mix there was also a Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm in the 1930's.
Mount Royal, Empire State Express, one other escapes me, but there was a NYC train with a geographical name (river of city) followed by "King."
If we are still waving our palms about, I will add that the Southern operated at least three trains with "Royal Palm" in the name between Cincinnati and Jacksonville: the Royal Palm was the year-round coach and Pullman train which carried some through Pullmans to Miami; the Royal Palm Deluxe was an all-Pullman winter season train which ran at least in the 1930 winter season, and the New Royal Palm was also a winter season train which carried coaches as well as Pullmans from the 1950 winter season until it was abolished altogether in the early fifties. FEC carried the Miami cars, SAL carried the west Florida cars, and NYC carried the Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, Cleveland, and Buffalo cars.
Johnny
ZephyrOverland KCSfan: ZephyrOverland: Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati Good try ZO. You have the right idea but these are not the trains I had in mind. With respect to the Royal Palm, there were no through coaches just a single Chicago - Jacksonville sleeper that was carried in Big Four (NYC) trains between Chi and Cincy. AFAIK the Royal Palm name applied only to SR No.s 3 & 4 running between Cincy and Jax. Mark The Royal Palm was originally a Chicago-Jacksonville through train beginning in 1913, but the Big4/NYC Chicago-Cincinnati portion became a separate train a few years later. The Big4/NYC Royal Palm always operated on an Chicago-Cincinnati overnight schedule connecting with the SR Cincinnati-Jacksonville Royal Palm and the former occasionally carried through Florida Pullmans. To add to the mix there was also a Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm in the 1930's.
KCSfan: ZephyrOverland: Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati Good try ZO. You have the right idea but these are not the trains I had in mind. With respect to the Royal Palm, there were no through coaches just a single Chicago - Jacksonville sleeper that was carried in Big Four (NYC) trains between Chi and Cincy. AFAIK the Royal Palm name applied only to SR No.s 3 & 4 running between Cincy and Jax. Mark The Royal Palm was originally a Chicago-Jacksonville through train beginning in 1913, but the Big4/NYC Chicago-Cincinnati portion became a separate train a few years later. The Big4/NYC Royal Palm always operated on an Chicago-Cincinnati overnight schedule connecting with the SR Cincinnati-Jacksonville Royal Palm and the former occasionally carried through Florida Pullmans.
ZephyrOverland:
Queen City - NYC - Indianapolis-Cincinnatti and Detroit-Cincinnati Motor Queen - NYC - Detroit-Cincinnati Royal Palm - NYC - Chicago-Cincinnati Good try ZO. You have the right idea but these are not the trains I had in mind. With respect to the Royal Palm, there were no through coaches just a single Chicago - Jacksonville sleeper that was carried in Big Four (NYC) trains between Chi and Cincy. AFAIK the Royal Palm name applied only to SR No.s 3 & 4 running between Cincy and Jax.
ZO, your replies prompted me to check some pre WW2 OG's and I found that the overnight Chi - Cincy Big Four trains were indeed listed as the Royal Palm in NYC schedules of that era. I found that surprising since they carried only one through car (a Chi - Miami sleeper) that ran south of Cincy. The three trains I was looking for were the SR's Royal Palm, winter season only New Royal Palm and the Queen and Crescent which all had Cincinnati as one of their terminals.
Though not the ones I had in mind, the three NYC trains you mentioned correctly answers my question and Cincy was also the terminal city I was looking for. I gladly declare you our winner and look forward to your next question.
Deggesty If we are still waving our palms about, I will add that the Southern operated at least three trains with "Royal Palm" in the name between Cincinnati and Jacksonville: the Royal Palm was the year-round coach and Pullman train which carried some through Pullmans to Miami; the Royal Palm Deluxe was an all-Pullman winter season train which ran at least in the 1930 winter season, and the New Royal Palm was also a winter season train which carried coaches as well as Pullmans from the 1950 winter season until it was abolished altogether in the early fifties. FEC carried the Miami cars, SAL carried the west Florida cars, and NYC carried the Chicago, Indianapolis, Detroit, Cleveland, and Buffalo cars.
To add to our little Royal Palm festival, for a brief time the FEC also operated a Royal Palm when the Southern Railway train was a through Detroit-Miami operation in the 1925-1926 season. Afterwards, through Palm Beach and Miami cars were carried in a composite train, the Dixie-Palm and Palm-Dixie, which handled Florida cars to and from the Royal Palm and Dixie Flyer.
The SAL came to the party later on with a Jacksonville-St. Petersburg Royal Palm around 1931.
KCSfan I gladly declare you our winner and look forward to your next question. Mark
I gladly declare you our winner and look forward to your next question.
For a brief time you could have traveled coast to coast on a pair of trains that referenced the same color. Name the trains, RR and destinations.
I'm not referring to any through car service.
Golden Arrow - PRR - NY - Chicago
Golden State Ltd - RI & SP - Chicago -LA
KCSfan Golden Arrow - PRR - NY - Chicago Golden State Ltd - RI & SP - Chicago -LA Mark
Mark, you got it! The next question is yours.....
Long after it was fought one railroad adopted the name of a famous battle for one its passenger trains. The name of this battle became the nickname of a US president and part of a slogan used in his election campaign. What was the train, it's route and the raillroad that operated it? Extra credit for the name of this president and his campaign slogan.
KCSfan Long after it was fought one railroad adopted the name of a famous battle for one its passenger trains. The name of this battle became the nickname of a US president and part of a slogan used in his election campaign. What was the train, it's route and the raillroad that operated it? Extra credit for the name of this president and his campaign slogan. Mark
Tippecanoe - Chicago-Indianapolis Monon
William Henry Harrison - "Tippecanoe and Tyler Too"
ZephyrOverland KCSfan: Tippecanoe - Chicago-Indianapolis Monon William Henry Harrison - "Tippecanoe and Tyler Too"
KCSfan: Tippecanoe - Chicago-Indianapolis Monon
Than was quick - Looks like you and I are swapping questions and answers before any else gets a chance to post a reply. The Tippecanoe Battlefield is located a short way north of Lafayette, IN. and was not actually on the route of the Monon's Tippecanoe. However their Chicago - Louisville Thoroughbred passed right by it at the town of Battleground.
You're up again ZO.
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