SFbrkmnExtra boards under union agreements are guarantee boards. If an employee stays marked up on a 24 hr day midnight-midnight by being available for work and doesn't layoff, even if that worker does not get can on duty call, he/she will still get paid by drawing day of guarantee. This is a lower pay than if one would have worked but it still generates revenue. There are clauses built in on preventing abuse of the system. Only two layoffs are allowed in a pay half. Anything over that, the guarantee will be voided. Extra boards are pretty good jobs to work ,as depending on the type of board one may be marked up on, you could go several days in a row without working and yet still get paid--just by being available to work.
Thanks for the explanation. I appreciate it.
Rio Grande Valley, CFI,CFII
Electroliner 1935:
The answer to your question is "no". Amtrak has created their own operating crew districts and those operating employees are Amtrak empolyees. Former railroad employees had to resign from their respective railroads in order to continue with Amtrak. Each crew district is unique and is created by negotions. An example is the Milwaukee crew district handles the Empire Builder from Chicago to Winona, MN. A St. Cloud, MN crew handles that train from Winona to St. Cloud and another St. Cloud crew handles the train from St. Cloud to Minot. The next crew is from Shelby, Montana to either Minot or Spokane. I do not know if the Seattle or Portland crew bases handle the EB from Spokane to Seattle or Spokane to Portland. The crews' at St. Cloud make two east trips (St. Cloud to Winona) and one west trip from St. Cloud to Minot then have two days off and resume the cycle of trips.
Ed Burns
Did Amtrak inherit the host roads contracts or did they create their own districts since many trains use multiple RR.?
JPS1 BaltACD Given the times you are quoting there would be two sides to the assignment. One to go on duty Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday; the other going on duty Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday and the following Monday. There is insuffient rest time after arrival back at the home terminal to protect On Time operation the following day. The San Antonio based engineer does not work continuous days. You are correct; he or she is off the next day. I am not sure how many days a week they work San Antonio to Austin and return. Two reasons led me to argue that it is not as easy a gig as supposed. It is a very long day. And it includes at least seven hours of sitting around. When I was working, it drove me crazy to have to sit around with nothing to do for long periods. I have asked several of the San Antonio conductors that I know reasonably well why the San Antonio based engineers only go as far as Austin, when the conductors and assistant conductors go all the way to Fort Worth, but I have never gotten a good answer from them.
BaltACD Given the times you are quoting there would be two sides to the assignment. One to go on duty Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday; the other going on duty Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday and the following Monday. There is insuffient rest time after arrival back at the home terminal to protect On Time operation the following day.
The San Antonio based engineer does not work continuous days. You are correct; he or she is off the next day. I am not sure how many days a week they work San Antonio to Austin and return.
Two reasons led me to argue that it is not as easy a gig as supposed. It is a very long day. And it includes at least seven hours of sitting around. When I was working, it drove me crazy to have to sit around with nothing to do for long periods.
I have asked several of the San Antonio conductors that I know reasonably well why the San Antonio based engineers only go as far as Austin, when the conductors and assistant conductors go all the way to Fort Worth, but I have never gotten a good answer from them.
Different crafts with different contracts. In many locations, Engineers and Conductors do not work between the same points on various runs. Each contract, and it's side letters, take into account both the physical characteristics encountered as well as the preferences of people covered by the contract or side letter.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
Two perspectives lead me to believe that it is not an easy a gig. It is a very long day. And it includes at least seven hours of sitting around. When I was working, it drove me crazy to have to sit around with nothing to do for long periods.
JPS1 longhorn1969 When did the TE get a woman engineer? Is she new? Yes, they change crews in Austin. I believe the San Antonio crew brings it up in the morning and just chill in Austin to take 21 back home to San Antonio. Where they rest up at I do not know. Pretty easy gig if you ask me. I have seen female engineers on the Texas Eagle for at least ten years. I don't know whether the engineer I referenced above is new, but she clearly had command of the men around her as she waited to take control of the train. The San Antonio based engineer that brings No. 22 from San Antonio to Austin probably has to get up around 4:30 a.m. to get to the station in time for any prep work prior to the Eagle's 7:00 a.m. departure for Austin. If the train is on-time, he arrives in Austin at 9:31 a.m. I am told that the San Antonio engineer goes to a hotel until it is time to go back to the station to take Number 21 back to San Antonio. What she does in the interim is her choice. If Number 21 is on time, it departs San Antonio at 6:30 p.m. It is scheduled to arrive in San Antonio at 9:55 p.m. Frequently it arrives in an hour or more ahead of schedule. But on some occasions it does not get to the Alamo City until after midnight. Even if the engineer gets home by 11 p.m. or midnight, it is a pretty long day. Moreover, hanging around an Austin hotel for nearly seven or more hours every couple of days has to be a bit boring. I would not call this assignment an easy gig.
longhorn1969 When did the TE get a woman engineer? Is she new? Yes, they change crews in Austin. I believe the San Antonio crew brings it up in the morning and just chill in Austin to take 21 back home to San Antonio. Where they rest up at I do not know. Pretty easy gig if you ask me.
When did the TE get a woman engineer? Is she new?
Yes, they change crews in Austin. I believe the San Antonio crew brings it up in the morning and just chill in Austin to take 21 back home to San Antonio. Where they rest up at I do not know. Pretty easy gig if you ask me.
I have seen female engineers on the Texas Eagle for at least ten years. I don't know whether the engineer I referenced above is new, but she clearly had command of the men around her as she waited to take control of the train.
The San Antonio based engineer that brings No. 22 from San Antonio to Austin probably has to get up around 4:30 a.m. to get to the station in time for any prep work prior to the Eagle's 7:00 a.m. departure for Austin. If the train is on-time, he arrives in Austin at 9:31 a.m.
I am told that the San Antonio engineer goes to a hotel until it is time to go back to the station to take Number 21 back to San Antonio. What she does in the interim is her choice. If Number 21 is on time, it departs San Antonio at 6:30 p.m. It is scheduled to arrive in San Antonio at 9:55 p.m. Frequently it arrives in an hour or more ahead of schedule. But on some occasions it does not get to the Alamo City until after midnight.
Even if the engineer gets home by 11 p.m. or midnight, it is a pretty long day. Moreover, hanging around an Austin hotel for nearly seven or more hours every couple of days has to be a bit boring. I would not call this assignment an easy gig.
Given the times you are quoting there would be two sides to the assignment. One to go on duty Monday, Wednesday, Friday and Sunday; the other going on duty Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday and the following Monday. There is insuffient rest time after arrival back at the home terminal to protect On Time operation the following day.
Dakguy201 BaltACD My experiences with Amtrak Crew Managment indicate they DO NOT keep track of where their trains are in relation to their scheduled crew change times and they don't alter the On Duty times of their crews to agree with reality. While I believe you, I find that situation nearly incredible. Is Amtrak's management really that incompetent? For example, I can sit out here in the wilds of South Dakota and know that this morning's eastbound Zephyr is going to be nearly 3 hours late into the Omaha crew change point, but that information escapes those responsible for crew management? I'd be very interested in knowing any reason why that situation exists.
BaltACD My experiences with Amtrak Crew Managment indicate they DO NOT keep track of where their trains are in relation to their scheduled crew change times and they don't alter the On Duty times of their crews to agree with reality.
My experiences with Amtrak Crew Managment indicate they DO NOT keep track of where their trains are in relation to their scheduled crew change times and they don't alter the On Duty times of their crews to agree with reality.
It's not only Amtrak. Sometimes a crew gets called and something happens to delay the train it's called for. If possible, they will switch the crew to a different train and re-call another crew. Sometimes that doesn't happen. The other day a Long Pool crew departed their away from home terminal after being 7hrs on duty. That left them 5 hours to go 300+ miles. I'm sure they were recrewed at a crew change point by a short pool crew. That way it doesn't show up as a recrew on the books.
As far as Amtrak extra boards, I believe they are guaranteed boards. I was reading on another site a link to the conductor's contract and their extra boards have a guarantee. I would guess the engineer's are too. At some of their smaller crew bases where only two trains (one each way) are run, someone might sit on the extra board for days at a time.
Jeff
I cannot count the number of times that my sleeper attendant has been a woman on both VIA and Amtrak. They have all been as capable as the men who have looked after my berths. On one trip back from Chicago, I had a roomette in the crew dorm car, and the attendant also had to look after coach passengers, but she did take care of the berth in the mornings (I spent two nights from Chiago to here that trip).
Johnny
Electroliner 1935I have been on a number of Amtrak trains that had female Engineers and wonder what the percentages are currently. Also, note that some BNSF dispatchers come over the radio sounding very much like females and presume they are so wonder what percent of dispatchers are female. I will never forget when on one of my rail trips before Southern RR joined Amtrak, I had gone East to Washington DC and then south on Southern's Piedmont to go to Ashville to ride the dome car down to Salibury. To enhance the Piedmonts revenue, it had piggyback cars added at Alexandria to take south. Train had four F units and we would drag up the hills and accelerate to track speed downhill. My return was to take the NB Piedmont to Charlottesville and thence a sleeper on Amtraks James Whitcomb Riley (now Cardinal) to Chicago. Piedmont was late and I was concerned we might miss the connection but the conductor assured me that I would be fine. That they might put me in a taxi from Lynchburg to Clifton Forge or they might drop the pigs. Which is what they did. And then we ran at track speed to Charlotesville where I made my connection. But when I was ready to board the sleeper, I found that Amtrak had a LADY porter. As I started to pick up my bag, she forcefully said, "I'm your porter and took it from me. She was a petite cute young lady, but well trained. I watched as she struggled with an upper bunk in a bedroom (10-6 car) standing tippy toed to insert the key to release the bunk. I wasn't about to offer assistance unless asked. She got it done. I have had a number of lady car attendents since then on Amtrak and no problems. Again, wonder the percentage.
I will never forget when on one of my rail trips before Southern RR joined Amtrak, I had gone East to Washington DC and then south on Southern's Piedmont to go to Ashville to ride the dome car down to Salibury. To enhance the Piedmonts revenue, it had piggyback cars added at Alexandria to take south. Train had four F units and we would drag up the hills and accelerate to track speed downhill. My return was to take the NB Piedmont to Charlottesville and thence a sleeper on Amtraks James Whitcomb Riley (now Cardinal) to Chicago. Piedmont was late and I was concerned we might miss the connection but the conductor assured me that I would be fine. That they might put me in a taxi from Lynchburg to Clifton Forge or they might drop the pigs. Which is what they did. And then we ran at track speed to Charlotesville where I made my connection.
But when I was ready to board the sleeper, I found that Amtrak had a LADY porter. As I started to pick up my bag, she forcefully said, "I'm your porter and took it from me. She was a petite cute young lady, but well trained. I watched as she struggled with an upper bunk in a bedroom (10-6 car) standing tippy toed to insert the key to release the bunk. I wasn't about to offer assistance unless asked. She got it done. I have had a number of lady car attendents since then on Amtrak and no problems. Again, wonder the percentage.
CSX Baltimore Division dispatching office consisted of 6 trick dispatcher desks plus the Chief Dispatcher's desk. All manned 24/7/365, which equates to 27 regular contract positions plus a non-contract Chief Dispatcher. There were 11 positions on the Extra Board. Out of these 38 positions there are 8 females. The other CSX Dispatching offices have a similar M/F ratio - some offices have more desks, some don't.
When I relinquished roster spot #1, it was taken over by a woman with 31 years less seniority than I had.
I have been on a number of Amtrak trains that had female Engineers and wonder what the percentages are currently. Also, note that some BNSF dispatchers come over the radio sounding very much like females and presume they are so wonder what percent of dispatchers are female.
zugmannOk, I'll say it. Whenever the discussion of "female engineer or train crew" comes up, there's also this sort of creepy vibe in the railfan community. I can't be the only one sensing it.
Whenever the discussion of "female engineer or train crew" comes up, there's also this sort of creepy vibe in the railfan community. I can't be the only one sensing it.
Considering that 80-90% of the people I had to talk to on the telephone or radio were male - it was very easy to use the wrong pronouns when a female was on the other end. Our minds crave 'routine' and sometimes 'routine' is wrong.
Ok, I'll say it.
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
longhorn1969When did the TE get a woman engineer? Is she new? Yes, they change crews in Austin. I believe the San Antonio crew brings it up in the morning and just chill in Austin to take 21 back home to San Antonio. Where they rest up at I do not know. Pretty easy gig if you ask me.
What may appear 'easy' on the outside, is rarely that easy on the inside.
I have only rode the Eagle going north to Chicago and many times it used to be late, but it has been doing much better. I may be riding it into TX since my cousin had to move from FL to Longview, TX due to health reasons and needing to be closer to family members.
ALL:
I remember calling St. Paul Amtrak and ordering blank forms for BNSF conductors and engineers deadheading to Fargo via Amtrak. As stated above, the BNSF was billed for transportation.
Retired Terml Supt's Clerk at Northtown.
BaltACD Is cross carrier airline deadheading done on a gratis or full fare basis? The CSX crews deadheading between Richmond & Philadelphia on Amtrak were on a ticketed basis with CSX being billed.
Is cross carrier airline deadheading done on a gratis or full fare basis?
The CSX crews deadheading between Richmond & Philadelphia on Amtrak were on a ticketed basis with CSX being billed.
blue streak 1 Dead heading on airlines is really complicated. Have D/H on almost all US air carriers, CR, Amtrak, bus (ugh ), limos, ferry boat etc. Ground transportation for air crews usually disliked on due to the long on duty pay times. Why so different for various airlines ? Usually amounts to route network. Also usually airlines with fewer different model planes that require different qualifications can recover quicker. SW as far as I remember now qualifies all crews on all different models of 737s. SW did have several years when the new cockpit cinfigurations did have 2 or 3 different qualifications However special airport qualifications ( Aspen, Gunnison for example ) or certain international airport and routes can gum up the works. Operating crews now on the north Atlantic had to be specifically qualified and route checked and that is rapidly going world wide. Takes time to qualify everyone. As well there are various experience requirements before some special qualification locations can be entered. Another restrictions is new crews are limited to higher weather minimums than others. Sometimes Captains have to fly as co-pilot for certain restricted locations or maybe even have the feds ( FAA ) go for a new for airline locations. along.
Dead heading on airlines is really complicated. Have D/H on almost all US air carriers, CR, Amtrak, bus (ugh ), limos, ferry boat etc. Ground transportation for air crews usually disliked on due to the long on duty pay times. Why so different for various airlines ? Usually amounts to route network. Also usually airlines with fewer different model planes that require different qualifications can recover quicker. SW as far as I remember now qualifies all crews on all different models of 737s. SW did have several years when the new cockpit cinfigurations did have 2 or 3 different qualifications However special airport qualifications ( Aspen, Gunnison for example ) or certain international airport and routes can gum up the works.
Operating crews now on the north Atlantic had to be specifically qualified and route checked and that is rapidly going world wide. Takes time to qualify everyone. As well there are various experience requirements before some special qualification locations can be entered. Another restrictions is new crews are limited to higher weather minimums than others. Sometimes Captains have to fly as co-pilot for certain restricted locations or maybe even have the feds ( FAA ) go for a new for airline locations. along.
Is it likely AA, Delta or UA would use SW to deadhead? Someone with AA once (about 10 years ago) gave me the impression they did not cooperate much with SW on routes where they competed.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
BaltACDI seem to recall in recent memory, United getting unholy hell for the way they secured seats for a deadhead crew movement.
Mostly from people that have no clue what deadheading was before then, and never worked a job where it was required. But they sure pretend to be experts.
longhorn1969 schlimm Deggesty schlimm CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait. How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews? Send the crews on Southwest flights. I know what he meant. My question was politely casting doubts on AA doing that. Terrible for image: "When American Airlines crews need to get to Dallas, they fly Southwest!" Happens all the time with airlines flying the competition. Its called dead heading, and many times the pilots ride up in the cockpit since they are two extra chairs up there. FA's will deadhead up front sometimes too. It's usually open to any airline employee in the profession. I remember reading about freight RRs using Amtrak to move their crews around.
schlimm Deggesty schlimm CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait. How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews? Send the crews on Southwest flights. I know what he meant. My question was politely casting doubts on AA doing that. Terrible for image: "When American Airlines crews need to get to Dallas, they fly Southwest!"
Deggesty schlimm CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait. How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews? Send the crews on Southwest flights. I know what he meant. My question was politely casting doubts on AA doing that. Terrible for image: "When American Airlines crews need to get to Dallas, they fly Southwest!"
schlimm CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait. How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews?
CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait.
How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews?
Send the crews on Southwest flights.
I know what he meant. My question was politely casting doubts on AA doing that. Terrible for image: "When American Airlines crews need to get to Dallas, they fly Southwest!"
Happens all the time with airlines flying the competition. Its called dead heading, and many times the pilots ride up in the cockpit since they are two extra chairs up there. FA's will deadhead up front sometimes too. It's usually open to any airline employee in the profession.
I remember reading about freight RRs using Amtrak to move their crews around.
I seem to recall in recent memory, United getting unholy hell for the way they secured seats for a deadhead crew movement.
Air carriers pride themselves on having full flights these days. Trying to find last second seats on a competing carrier will be a whole lot of fun.
On my working territory we did deadhead crews between Richmond and Philadelphia on Amtrak - both ways when necessary. Division Manager didn't want Contract carriers operating through the traffic on the I-95 corridor between those points, both from a safety stand point and from a repeatable time in transit stand point.
With the "legacy" airlines, of course. Not so sure about Southwest. JBS1 would know, as would bluestreak or n012944.
Deggesty schlimm CMStPnP You would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait. How could they possibly use Southwest to dispatch AA crews? Send the crews on Southwest flights.
CMStPnPYou would think at a min the Managers at American would notice Southwest flights are up and running and use Southwest to dispatch crews to speed up network recovery instead of waiting on American flights but they would rather sit around and wait.
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