Expermentation to push the limits is fine. Mandates should be based on good science, engineering, and what is possible at reasonable costs.
Mandates can make things worse. Look up MTBE.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
Aren't the railroads doing that experimentation with NG right now? My gut tells me that had price of oil not cratered, we'd be witnessing the rise of NG locomotives en masse. For financial reasons, but the environmental advantages would certainly grease the skids.
Some form of natural gas would probably work pretty well on those aformentioned trim sets. At a minimum they couldn't possibly be less reliable than the Gensets UP Roseville wishes it didn't have.
RME GERALD L MCFARLANE JR I completely disagree on the problem with particulate matter, it doesn't stay in the air, it descends to the ground or what ever surface it comes across...not an issue in my book ... As for biodiesel...I don't believe it has particulate matter, if you're talking 100% biodiesel and biodiesel made by combining the biofuel and regular diesel. If it's the combination stuff then it wouldn't help with particulate matter, if it's 100% biodiesel then you don't care about the byproducts, they're completely harmless. I think you are dangerously ignorant of the physical characteristics of a substantial percentage of the actual emitted particulates from either light or heavy diesel engines, and by extension of the actual chemical nd physical processes that produce them. I think it would be wise to read some of the reference material on these subjects before claiming that all PM 'descends to the ground' or promptly plates out on contact, or attempting to assert that PM from 100% biodiesel is "completely harmless". While the absence of sulfate nuclei in wholly-synthetic biodiesel does have beneficial influence in a number of respects, the nanoparticulates generated, for example, by characteristics of the injection jets will remain highly similar, if in fact not identical, for biodiesel compositions by comparison with their fossil equivalents. Remember that it is the very small nanoparticles that are the true medical concern in PM, not the large aggregated soot chains that fall out as the exhaust plume cools.
GERALD L MCFARLANE JR I completely disagree on the problem with particulate matter, it doesn't stay in the air, it descends to the ground or what ever surface it comes across...not an issue in my book ... As for biodiesel...I don't believe it has particulate matter, if you're talking 100% biodiesel and biodiesel made by combining the biofuel and regular diesel. If it's the combination stuff then it wouldn't help with particulate matter, if it's 100% biodiesel then you don't care about the byproducts, they're completely harmless.
I think you are dangerously ignorant of the physical characteristics of a substantial percentage of the actual emitted particulates from either light or heavy diesel engines, and by extension of the actual chemical nd physical processes that produce them. I think it would be wise to read some of the reference material on these subjects before claiming that all PM 'descends to the ground' or promptly plates out on contact, or attempting to assert that PM from 100% biodiesel is "completely harmless". While the absence of sulfate nuclei in wholly-synthetic biodiesel does have beneficial influence in a number of respects, the nanoparticulates generated, for example, by characteristics of the injection jets will remain highly similar, if in fact not identical, for biodiesel compositions by comparison with their fossil equivalents. Remember that it is the very small nanoparticles that are the true medical concern in PM, not the large aggregated soot chains that fall out as the exhaust plume cools.
If ultra-fine particulate matter (PM) emissions generated by Diesels are the serious health problem, especially by high injection pressure common-rail engines, is this even solvable? Are these emissions even trapped by particulate filters?
Will we need to bring back steam locomotives? At least grate-fired, because pulverized coal combustion, even with particle filters, has the same problem?
Seriously, are the ever more strict emissions regs making a dent in the real health problem? Will we need to switch to natural-gas engines on trucks and locomotives?
If GM "killed the electric car", what am I doing standing next to an EV-1, a half a block from the WSOR tracks?
schlimm Perhaps those interested in discussing aspects of the truck business unrelated to railroading can take their discussions to a more appropriate forum?
Perhaps those interested in discussing aspects of the truck business unrelated to railroading can take their discussions to a more appropriate forum?
I am a self-appointed gate keeper whereas you are not?
I think I'll just roll my eyes.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
zugmann Paul Milenkovic Yes, please, tell me about your experience down that well bore? If you are going to try a snide comeback, either make it orignal, or at least give out some creative insults. Make it interesting.
Paul Milenkovic Yes, please, tell me about your experience down that well bore?
If you are going to try a snide comeback, either make it orignal, or at least give out some creative insults. Make it interesting.
And I am accused of dictating to people what they can and cannot say?
zugmann Paul Milenkovic And I am somehow regulating or restricting or deciding what is said on this Forum? About that hole...
Paul Milenkovic And I am somehow regulating or restricting or deciding what is said on this Forum?
About that hole...
And what is this "hole" you speak of? That people who find me disagreeable for defending opinions on this Forum that they don't want to hear about will continue regarding me as disagreeable?
Are you threatening me that I am in some form of "trouble" for defending the position that regulatory agencies may indeed engage in "overreach" that does not achieve an optimum tradeoff between environmental benefits and economic cost?
Are you going to report me to the Governor that I sympathise with an anti-regulation platform? Are you going to report me to Rex Tillerson's state department regarding remarks I made to someone from Germany?
Paul MilenkovicYes, please, tell me about your experience down that well bore?
Yes, please, tell me about your experience down that well bore?
Paul MilenkovicAnd I am somehow regulating or restricting or deciding what is said on this Forum?
zugmann Paul Milenkovic Observations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out. You can have opinions. So does our friend from Germany. This is not your forum, (nor is it some USA Amercan only forum), so you don't get to decide who should get to express their opinions on any topic here, period. Try and backspin and justify it all you want, but you dug yourself into a hole. Just put down the shovel already, Professor.
Paul Milenkovic Observations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out.
You can have opinions. So does our friend from Germany. This is not your forum, (nor is it some USA Amercan only forum), so you don't get to decide who should get to express their opinions on any topic here, period. Try and backspin and justify it all you want, but you dug yourself into a hole. Just put down the shovel already, Professor.
Our friend in Germany has expressed an opinion that an opinion expressed by a fellow Forum participant is "inappropriate." Our friend does not have the power to control Forum content and neither do I, but our friend as much as said that opinions expressed criticizing U.S. and California regulatory agencies do not belong here.
I have expressed the opinion that the opinion that another opinion is inappropriate is indeed inappropriate. Opinions have been expressed that my opinion that the opinion calling another opinion inappropriate is inappropriate is itself inappropriate.
And I am somehow regulating or restricting or deciding what is said on this Forum?
schlimm Paul Milenkovic Observations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out. That kind of social pressure and social conformity is familiar to me from cultures outside the United States. After their forcible eviction from their homeland, relatives who didn't come to the U.S. settled in Germany. Sorry, but you really do not understand the concept of freedom of speech under the US Constitution. Nor do you have a clue about civil liberties in Germany, no matter what your relatives say.
Paul Milenkovic Observations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out. That kind of social pressure and social conformity is familiar to me from cultures outside the United States. After their forcible eviction from their homeland, relatives who didn't come to the U.S. settled in Germany.
Sorry, but you really do not understand the concept of freedom of speech under the US Constitution. Nor do you have a clue about civil liberties in Germany, no matter what your relatives say.
A stand-up comic in Germany was brought up on charges, recently in Germany, for saying that the President of Turkey has relations with farm animals. I suppose one could argue that this claim is a metaphor; a NATO ally using their F-16 jets to shoot down Russian jets, almost dragging the U.S. and all of Western Europe into WW-III, could be said to be taking indecent liberties with a farm animal, but the German Chancelor intervened on behalf of the President Turkey to put someone in jail.
A stand-up comic or anyone in the U.S. can say that the President of Turkey has relations with farm animals because however much this endangers U.S. relations with Turkey, this is protected by the First Amendment.
I am told "you don't know what you are talking about" and when I say, "Oh, yeah, explain to me how I don't know what I am talking about", then the subject is changed to some other personal criticism. I very much understand these concepts, only some people don't want to hear me expressing them.
Paul MilenkovicObservations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out.
"You haven't understood have you? Each trucker can complain about EPA and CARB as much as he likes. That was not my point. I just found the contempt for people who can't defend themselves here inappropriate."
Maybe this is a mistranslation? I have found criticism of EPA and CARB, perhaps harsh criticism. Contempt may have a different meaning.
Inappropriate? I am accused of being a "gatekeeper", but deeming something to be inappropriate is serving as a "gatekeeper."
It is inappropriate to offer anecdotes criticizing EPA or CARB when representatives from those bodies are not here to defend themselves? Perhaps there is a social-cultural-traditional difference on Free Speech, the First Amendment, lawful protest, and expression of grievances? There are certainly people here willing to defend EPA or CARB, although the experience and knowledge found here appears to be thin in offering factual rather than opinion-based counterarguments.
"What that has to do with me being German and our less strict regulations is beyond me."
Seriously? Grandma-from-Voijvodina had some German-language expressions for this because that is what she spoke. You brought up being German and how everyone in Germany "accepts Climate Change" whereas not everyone in the U.S. does, with a whole chain of implications and insinuations that follows from that, although a person from a higher social caste than me will claim I am making this up.
Being German and the fact that Germany has less strict regulations has everthing to do that you have "no skin in this game" regarding the problems that a truck driver in the U.S. has to stay in business.
Being German has to do with the strict regulations in the U.S. leading to billions of dollars being transfered from your fellow citizens to the U.S. Treasury, collective punishment against German stock holders and German workers. You certainly have "skin" in that "game."
Do you think that the German engineers (someone will criticize me for engaging in an ethnic slur, OK then, those engineers were Auslanders from Voijvodina, Republic of Serbia because No True German would do such a thing), do you think that those engineers devised a scheme to cheat on the emission regulations for sport? To impress their friends from the University?
They did this because the U.S. EPA regulations had their backs against the wall. One of your guys went to jail when he set foot in Florida, but I guess there are people in Germany who think this is a good thing, and there are may be people in France who laugh at you for this as Voltaire once laughed at the British "Pour encourager les autres?"
Do you think there are people who believe that there are engineering tradeoffs between strictness of emission controls, the diminishing health returns from wringing out the last gram of NOx, and the economic costs? Do you suppose there are people in Germany who think that way because they don't have the super-strict EPA regulations and in Germany, unlike the U.S., the engineers, labor union leaders, corporate CEOs, health experts, and government officials can actually work together to craft sensible tradeoffs? Does it offend you that someone in the U.S. is complaining that the U.S. doesn't have such a thing, maybe because you believe that what is happening in Germany is wrong?
If that is what you believe, than say that, that indeed the German system of regulations is close to what me and our truck driver Forum participant would want, but that you personally disagree, that stricter regulations are needed in both the U.S as well as in Europe. To say such a thing would be very . . . American!
Paul MilenkovicObservations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out. That kind of social pressure and social conformity is familiar to me from cultures outside the United States. After their forcible eviction from their homeland, relatives who didn't come to the U.S. settled in Germany.
C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan
schlimm Paul Milenkovic VOLKER LANDWEHR It would be easier to discuss these matters if you left your contempt for EPA out of this discussion. What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? The quoted sentence is a patronizing thing to say about an American complaining about a state of affairs in America, especially for persons outside America who are spared this in their home country? Just my opinion (but others may share it): since when are observations by a non-American (with considerable knowledge) deemed off limits? I guess they are for you, which says a great deal. This is especially true when Herr Landwehr merely suggested that the person who some feel is Mrs. Ed Benton continues to vent often contrafactual grudges against any regulatory body.
Paul Milenkovic VOLKER LANDWEHR It would be easier to discuss these matters if you left your contempt for EPA out of this discussion. What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? The quoted sentence is a patronizing thing to say about an American complaining about a state of affairs in America, especially for persons outside America who are spared this in their home country?
VOLKER LANDWEHR It would be easier to discuss these matters if you left your contempt for EPA out of this discussion.
It would be easier to discuss these matters if you left your contempt for EPA out of this discussion.
What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany?
The quoted sentence is a patronizing thing to say about an American complaining about a state of affairs in America, especially for persons outside America who are spared this in their home country?
Just my opinion (but others may share it): since when are observations by a non-American (with considerable knowledge) deemed off limits? I guess they are for you, which says a great deal. This is especially true when Herr Landwehr merely suggested that the person who some feel is Mrs. Ed Benton continues to vent often contrafactual grudges against any regulatory body.
Observations by someone outside the U.S. are one matter. When someone outside the U.S. complains about a person in the U.S. expressing their experiences with a U.S. governmental body, I have opinions about this rooted in our deepest U.S. social traditions, and I shall speak out.
That kind of social pressure and social conformity is familiar to me from cultures outside the United States. After their forcible eviction from their homeland, relatives who didn't come to the U.S. settled in Germany. Don't protest, you could get in trouble with the authorities. Follow the law, it is for everyone's benefit. But this Forum is not hosted in Germany, it is not hosted in Croatia, it is not hosted in Voijvodina, and it is not hosted in Cook County where I grew up, either.
The problem is CARB if they get their way and are able to force these standards upon the industry then they will do what they've done in the past. They'll declare anything built before such and such date illegal to run in California. Then they'll do it again and again until they've banned all internal combustion engines from the state. They could give 2 craps about what it actually costs. All they care about is getting rid of the engines they consider evil.
California was the first state to pass anti idle laws first in the nation to have mandated emission requirements greater than the federal government's own standard first to require usld 2 years before the rest of the nation. I can go on with how they have regulated industry after industry to death. Yet still they are never happy with how much they are now punishing you. They operate almost above the law out there. They've been sued lost in court and told both state and federal judges they are above their jurisdiction. That's how extremely belligerent they act.
VOLKER LANDWEHR Paul Milenkovic Who is a self-appointed gatekeeper when a person working in the trucking industry, and yes, complaining about the difficulties of complying with the regs inside their own country, is scolded by a person self-identified as living in a different country? It started with patronizing now it is scolding. What is next? You haven't understood have you? Each trucker can complain about EPA and CARB as much as he likes. That was not my point. I just found the contempt for people who can't defend themselves here inappropriate. Others see this differently as I learned. What that has to do with me being German and our less strict regulations is beyond me. Refutations were caused mostly by incorrect and incomplete claims. But yes I have a different opinion in some points and find strict regulations necessary. When others differ that is the foundation for discussions. I wrote somewhere on this thread that the last 10% can be as expensive as the first 90%. So it can get unecconomical.Regards, Volker
Paul Milenkovic Who is a self-appointed gatekeeper when a person working in the trucking industry, and yes, complaining about the difficulties of complying with the regs inside their own country, is scolded by a person self-identified as living in a different country?
It started with patronizing now it is scolding. What is next?
You haven't understood have you? Each trucker can complain about EPA and CARB as much as he likes. That was not my point. I just found the contempt for people who can't defend themselves here inappropriate. Others see this differently as I learned. What that has to do with me being German and our less strict regulations is beyond me. Refutations were caused mostly by incorrect and incomplete claims. But yes I have a different opinion in some points and find strict regulations necessary. When others differ that is the foundation for discussions.
I wrote somewhere on this thread that the last 10% can be as expensive as the first 90%. So it can get unecconomical.Regards, Volker
This was the gist of my problem as well. The EPA and CARB deserve their share of critism, what they don't deserve is to be villified and treated as if they are a no nothing enemy of all that's good and right.
Do they have an agenda. Sure, so do the people working OTR posting here. People tend to have agendas when it comes to their livelihood.
To be sure lots of good info here don't want to discount anyone, I just hate the dismissal of good smart hard working people.
Some pie in the sky things can never happen, but I'm not sure $75000 and half a ton less cargo constitutes impossible... Sounds like a challenge to beat. It also depends on whether CARB bans older tracktors doesn't it? Presumably you'd see an uptick in sales of Tier4 complient units just as happened with Locos.
Does the EPA allow rebuilds of pre-Tier trucks similar to how they do with the railroads? If not, what could such a program produce if anyone knows?
Perhaps the big trucking companies can do something voluntary as BNSF and UP did to reduce emissions fleet wideand make their lives easier. This is the reason both Railroads restrict which units can enter Ca.
Maybe something like restricting to only the newest tractors in the fleet (problem for independent contractors yes) Or some other tweaks either in equipment or usage.
For the railroads. If UP just strung up lines in Colton and Roseville and ran the trim sets off the grid, what would that mean especially for localized air quality? What if just the I5 Cooridor was electrified. Portland to LA? That's already where UP devotes their T4 units.
As for energy production. I've actually not heard of rolling brownout problems in years. The natural gas leak in SoCal caused problems, but that's unrelated to the issues we're discussing. And CA's electricity rates are problematic for a number of reasons not all related to a lack of production.
California's explosion in Rooftop solar has actually caused a new problem, energy surplus during peak sun. What is now needed is a storage solution...or perhaps more users.
Miningman Shadow- Holy Smokes! How on God's green earth is that remotely acceptable. Come on up here and become an ice road trucker. No traffic too! None.
Shadow- Holy Smokes! How on God's green earth is that remotely acceptable.
Come on up here and become an ice road trucker. No traffic too! None.
Miningman, are you replying to my $8-10/hour on icy roads comment?
If so, even at 50 cents/mile, if you're moving 20MPH or less on icy roads that is $10/hour or less.
I have considered driving the ice roads, I thought it would be an interesting challenge, and look good on the resume, but the leave of absence from my year round job would have cost my seniority, benefits and not impressed my boss, when he needed my experience in the Blue Mtns of Eastern Oregon. Had I been laid off during that season, I would consider it, but not at the cost to a long term job.
Doug
p.s. Sorry all again for the topic stray.
May your flanges always stay BETWEEN the rails
[quote user="schlimm"]
challenger3980 schlimm Perhaps those interested in discussing aspects of the truck business unrelated to railroading can take their discussions to a more appropriate forum? I apologise for being partly responsible for the topic straying further off topic than I intended, but trucking and rairoads are very inter-related, what affects one often affects the other, and many technologies, such as the discussed emissions topics are "inter-modal" as both industries are subject to them. Even HOS issues of one of the industries can have down stream effects on the other. Doug Understood. n.b., I said "aspects unrelated to railroading" not trucking in totality. And my comment related more to the posts of SCO, not yours.
schlimm Perhaps those interested in discussing aspects of the truck business unrelated to railroading can take their discussions to a more appropriate forum? I apologise for being partly responsible for the topic straying further off topic than I intended, but trucking and rairoads are very inter-related, what affects one often affects the other, and many technologies, such as the discussed emissions topics are "inter-modal" as both industries are subject to them. Even HOS issues of one of the industries can have down stream effects on the other. Doug
Understood. n.b., I said "aspects unrelated to railroading" not trucking in totality. And my comment related more to the posts of SCO, not yours.
Schlimm, while I refuse to Kiss and Make Up, maybe we could Shake Hands and still be Friends?
[quote user="challenger3980"]
Paul Milenkovic schlimm Paul Milenkovic zugmann Paul Milenkovic What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? One could ask what concern is it to a university professor as well. I am enjoying this thread. But your above comments are out of line and should be beneath you. It is my concern because I don't want to eat spoiled food. I don't want to have to throw food I just purchased into the garbage, and I don't want to get sick eating spoiled food that I had failed to throw away. It is my concern because someone who comes from a country that has "reasonable" environmental regulations is complaining that a person in my country is too critical of environmental regs from our own government, regs that are much more strict than other countries. If I didn't hear from a person in the trucking industry about their complaints, I would have had no idea why I was bringing home spoiled food from the store. Now that I have heard what the problem is, I look the fresh eggs over more carefully, and I am also much more careful with purchases of fresh meat. This is an upside down world Nice ducking both the question and the apology you should give for acting as the self-appointed gatekeeper concerning who can post what on here, especially if they reside abroad. Enjoy your eggs! Who is a self-appointed gatekeeper when a person working in the trucking industry, and yes, complaining about the difficulties of complying with the regs inside their own country, is scolded by a person self-identified as living in a different country? That they are scolded by a person living in a country with less strict regs that they should change their tone? Hey you over there in the U.S. complaining about the U.S. EPA, even though we have much less strict regs on Diesels where I am from, I don't like what I am hearing from you! What does "Enjoy your eggs" supposed to mean? That information regarding the effects of pollution regs on Diesel reefer units affecting food safety should not be discussed here? And that I don't have a right to hear from someone with a pavement-eye view of food transportation has to say? And I should just shut up and eat spoiled food? I am ducking a question asked of me? I was asked why it was my business that person working for a trucking company wants to express their perspective on regulations of their industry. I explained why it is my business -- I breathe the air from the Diesel engines, but I also risk eating spoiled food when the regulations on these Diesel engines lead to them breaking down. I indeed have "skin in this game", I explain this, and I am a "gatekeeper"? "Oh no, there you go again Mr. Milenkovic, you are completely misinterpreting what I am saying?" Emissions control regs affect the reliability of machines used to refrigerate and transport refrigerated food. What do you say "Enjoy your eggs!" means? I am a "gatekeeper"? I have defended unpopular opinions expressed here. Nothing I say slows you down from speaking your mind?
schlimm Paul Milenkovic zugmann Paul Milenkovic What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? One could ask what concern is it to a university professor as well. I am enjoying this thread. But your above comments are out of line and should be beneath you. It is my concern because I don't want to eat spoiled food. I don't want to have to throw food I just purchased into the garbage, and I don't want to get sick eating spoiled food that I had failed to throw away. It is my concern because someone who comes from a country that has "reasonable" environmental regulations is complaining that a person in my country is too critical of environmental regs from our own government, regs that are much more strict than other countries. If I didn't hear from a person in the trucking industry about their complaints, I would have had no idea why I was bringing home spoiled food from the store. Now that I have heard what the problem is, I look the fresh eggs over more carefully, and I am also much more careful with purchases of fresh meat. This is an upside down world Nice ducking both the question and the apology you should give for acting as the self-appointed gatekeeper concerning who can post what on here, especially if they reside abroad. Enjoy your eggs!
Paul Milenkovic zugmann Paul Milenkovic What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? One could ask what concern is it to a university professor as well. I am enjoying this thread. But your above comments are out of line and should be beneath you. It is my concern because I don't want to eat spoiled food. I don't want to have to throw food I just purchased into the garbage, and I don't want to get sick eating spoiled food that I had failed to throw away. It is my concern because someone who comes from a country that has "reasonable" environmental regulations is complaining that a person in my country is too critical of environmental regs from our own government, regs that are much more strict than other countries. If I didn't hear from a person in the trucking industry about their complaints, I would have had no idea why I was bringing home spoiled food from the store. Now that I have heard what the problem is, I look the fresh eggs over more carefully, and I am also much more careful with purchases of fresh meat. This is an upside down world
zugmann Paul Milenkovic What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany? One could ask what concern is it to a university professor as well. I am enjoying this thread. But your above comments are out of line and should be beneath you.
Paul Milenkovic What concern is it, to a person self-identifying as being from Germany, whether an American trucking company worker is expressing frustration that the existing EPA standards are economically burdensome, and that the proposed even stricter standards could put her out of work? When these standards are admitted to be stricter than those in Germany?
One could ask what concern is it to a university professor as well.
I am enjoying this thread. But your above comments are out of line and should be beneath you.
It is my concern because I don't want to eat spoiled food. I don't want to have to throw food I just purchased into the garbage, and I don't want to get sick eating spoiled food that I had failed to throw away.
It is my concern because someone who comes from a country that has "reasonable" environmental regulations is complaining that a person in my country is too critical of environmental regs from our own government, regs that are much more strict than other countries.
If I didn't hear from a person in the trucking industry about their complaints, I would have had no idea why I was bringing home spoiled food from the store. Now that I have heard what the problem is, I look the fresh eggs over more carefully, and I am also much more careful with purchases of fresh meat.
This is an upside down world
Nice ducking both the question and the apology you should give for acting as the self-appointed gatekeeper concerning who can post what on here, especially if they reside abroad. Enjoy your eggs!
Who is a self-appointed gatekeeper when a person working in the trucking industry, and yes, complaining about the difficulties of complying with the regs inside their own country, is scolded by a person self-identified as living in a different country? That they are scolded by a person living in a country with less strict regs that they should change their tone? Hey you over there in the U.S. complaining about the U.S. EPA, even though we have much less strict regs on Diesels where I am from, I don't like what I am hearing from you!
What does "Enjoy your eggs" supposed to mean? That information regarding the effects of pollution regs on Diesel reefer units affecting food safety should not be discussed here? And that I don't have a right to hear from someone with a pavement-eye view of food transportation has to say? And I should just shut up and eat spoiled food?
I am ducking a question asked of me? I was asked why it was my business that person working for a trucking company wants to express their perspective on regulations of their industry. I explained why it is my business -- I breathe the air from the Diesel engines, but I also risk eating spoiled food when the regulations on these Diesel engines lead to them breaking down. I indeed have "skin in this game", I explain this, and I am a "gatekeeper"?
"Oh no, there you go again Mr. Milenkovic, you are completely misinterpreting what I am saying?" Emissions control regs affect the reliability of machines used to refrigerate and transport refrigerated food. What do you say "Enjoy your eggs!" means?
I am a "gatekeeper"? I have defended unpopular opinions expressed here. Nothing I say slows you down from speaking your mind?
Man oh man! You've either got a problem with reading comprehension, a thin skin or both.
Volkner I sent the proposed emissions requirements to our engine shop manager. He forwarded them to Cummins to get an idea on cost compliance. In order to meet those requirements the cost of an engine and it's related after treatment systems will go up 200 percent. That means a new truck will go up in cost over 75 thousand dollars just for the engine and exhaust system alone. Let alone the added weight which was estimated at close to 700 lbs to have the needed equipment to comply. So we are talking about having to give up almost 1/2ton of cargo capacity and who knows what in fuel efficiency and reliability to get these unrealistic goals.
Paul MilenkovicWho is a self-appointed gatekeeper when a person working in the trucking industry, and yes, complaining about the difficulties of complying with the regs inside their own country, is scolded by a person self-identified as living in a different country?
Just remember this my boss is a customer of 2 of the 7 class 1 railroads left in the USA. We also haul parts and supplies for CSX NS UP and the BNSF as needed in broker loads or as direct loads. Yep my drivers have delivered directly to the railroads things like grease wire grit for sandblasting.
Also if you think fatigue and other issues that affect my drivers don't affect train crews your dreaming. Your industry has longer work hours before your allowed to rest and then your required to stay awake even after relief until you get to the hotel or home. At least if one of my drivers gets tired they can park and sleep.
Now to get it back on topic be glad the EPA never did to you what they did to the OTR engine makers when it came to emissions. I can't even fathom the chaos if they made GE or EMD do what our industry had to do in the timeframe they had to. Your timeline never got changed ours was halved. Just imagine EMD and GE having 7 years to go from tier zero to tier 4. Think they could have done it. My side did it.
RME, by California style on ramp traffic lights, I think, that you are refering to what we call Metered on ramps. Those can help, but when the highway traffic slows to stop and go, and the on ramp is backing up too, their usefulness diminishes very quickly. The real problem is that too many drivers (all too often distracted by the cell phone) simply do not look and smoothly merge with existing traffic, but rather ignore that they even have a side mirror and just drive on to the freeway forcing other drivers to hit their brakes in order to avoid a collision. I have heard that in California, the merging vehicle has right of way, and existing traffic is supposed to yield( now THAT is backwards thinking)but I fortunately have managed to avoid that state for years, and don't miss it.
Oregon and Washington have enacted, and ocassionally enforce "Give Trucks more Space" laws regarding cutting trucks off, but enforcement tends to be sporadic, and the Speed Up issue, I don't think has been specifically addressed, other than possibly under Aggressive driving laws, which are also only sporadically enforced.
With distracted driving, I would support the Draconian step of requiring all new cell phones to automatically disable texting and dialing(other than 911, which IS possible to program) when moving at a speed greater than 5 MPH( basically little faster than walking speed) Extreme? Yep, but so is the problem, Texas outlawed open containers(the last state to do so) years ago, if you weren't drunk, you could drink a beer while driving,(no I don't support drinking and driving), but the problem of drunk driving is serious enough that the rights of others not drunk didn't out weigh the problems of those who were drunk behind the wheel, Cell phone use has been shown to be more detrimental to safe driving than alcohol. I see the effects of cell phone use while driving on a daily basis.
With hourly pay for truck drivers, I understand the possibility for abuse, BUT that problem is not a safety issue as are speeding in general, driving too fast for conditions, falsifying log books (harder to do with Electronic logging devices, but don't put it past truckers to find a way around them, many of us are smarter than many give us credit for) and many other issues that hourly pay could help avoid.
The speed too fast for conditions in inclement weather has always been one of the reasons that I wont work for a mileage pay company. There is an outfit near Vancouver, WA, with a couple of Really Nice looking Peterbilts, parked by I-5 with a sign advertising 50 Cents/mile. Across Idaho and Utah in July at 70 & 80 mph respectively, you can make $35-40/hour, BUT in December and January, with Icy roads, where you are lucky to be doing 20mph, if the roads aren't closed(a whole lot of days I-84 in the Blue Mtns of eastern OR, the highway was closed) you are making $8-10/hour, just when your SKILLS as are driver are really coming into play, you are barely making minimum wage or less, no thanks.
The railroads already charge demurrage for rail cars sitting at a shipper/reciever too long, but it would take a government regulation requiring it, and setting the rates, for it to work in the trucking industry.
Simple common sense and comon courtesy, by ALL drivers would do a lot to resolve so many problems, but there are too many people who like to play games on the roads.
BTW, do you know what Common Sense, and Common Courtesy have in common? Neither one is COMMON any more
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