A couple more of West Virginia's biggest shots...
N&W A 2-6-6-4 12??...
N&W A 2-6-6-4 1218 before it was famous...
C&O H-8 2-6-6-6 16??...
C&O H-8 2-6-6-6 1629...
Biggest to tidewater for the West Virginia coal-hauling competitors...
Western Maryland M-2 4-6-6-4 1211...
B&O EM-1 2-8-8-4 7605...
C&O H-8 2-6-6-6 1623...
N&W A 2-6-6-4 1221...
Virginian AG 2-6-6-6 902...
WM 2-8-0 837 - one of the ubuquitous 2-8-0 units on WM - 734 does a close impersonation...
WM M-1 2-6-6-2 954...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 1207(?)...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 12?? on time freight...
WM 2-8-0 780...
WM J-1 4-8-4 14?? on time freight...
WM I-2 2-10-0 1125 with 66 cars at 35 MPH on a well-labelled slide...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 12?? at north portal of Big Savage Tunnel...
WM I-2 2-10-0 1129...
WM 2-8-0 785...good comparison to WMSR 2-8-0 734...
WM 4-6-2 202 in good working order and making good time...
WM I-2 2-10-0 11??...
WM 4-6-2 205 at Cumberland Station...
WM K-2 4-6-2 209...
WM unidentified steam locomotive downgrade on Hemstetter's Curve...
WM (M-3?) (M-1b) 2-6-6-2 1309 doubleheaded on original owner's railroad...
WM 800 class 2-8-0...
WM K-2 4-6-2 204 from the varnish end...
WM Maryland Junction - steam tenders visible at the roundhouse...
WM L-1 2-8-8-2 902...
WM Port Covington...
WM L-1 2-8-8-2 906 at Port Covington...
Port Covington...
What a Western Maryland "M-3" looked like in operation for its original owner...
2-6-6-2 caboose hop to pick up a loaded train at a coal mine...notice some of the class had Vanderbilt tenders as opposed to rectangular tenders...
1352...
1404 on the turntable...
1342...
1408 with large vanderbilt tender...
2-6-6-2 in pusher service pushing in reverse...
1529...
1445 and 1479 on the Piney Creek branch in WV...
H-6 specifications sheet...
H-6 2-6-6-2 at Tams WV...
Double-headed 2-6-6-2 units at Stanaford WV...
Double-headed 2-6-6-2 units at an undetermined location...
1301 on a coal train at an undetermined location...
Western Maryland articulated locomotive classes...
M-1 2-6-6-2 957...
M-1 2-6-6-2 952...
M-1a 0-6-6-0 956...converted from 2-6-6-2 configuration...
M-1a 0-6-6-0 959...converted from 2-6-6-2 configuration...
L-1 2-8-8-2 903...
L-1a 2-8-8-2 914...
M-2 4-6-6-4 1201...
M-2 4-6-6-4 1206...
(M-3?) (M-1b?) 2-6-6-2 1309...
And here is a New Year's Wish for 1309 and the WSMR organization:
Long May You Run
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gttIc5avsZw
daveklepperMay the Eternal bless you and 1309 with long and healthy and productive lives along with all your members and crew.
Amen
May the Eternal bless you and 1309 with long and healthy and productive lives along with all your members and crew. Thanks for all the hard work!
Mr. Hankey, it sounds like WMSR has an M-3 on the roster!
Thank you so much for the excellent update!
And God bless you and the WMSR team for preserving and demonstrating to the country the marvelous machines that built a nation and put the arsenal of democracy on the drawbar to help keep freedom ringing.
I would liker to join Firelock in thanking Mr. Hankey for his comments and, much more importantly, his contributions to Railway Preservation and historical interpretation over many years. He may have much better information than I about the circumstances surrounding WM 202's preservation and current condition. If so, I hope he will add to that part of the conversation.
Much of my information is based on what I have heard, and could be nothing more than urban legend. I would not hesitate to defer to Mr. Hankey on any points of disagreement.
Tom
PS: Unless I am mistaken, the WM skipped from the 1200 series to the 1400 series and never used the 1300 series. So there is no conflict with historic WM loco numbers.
Thanks so much for that well-written report Mr. Hankey! It's a genuine pleasure and surprise to have someone so well-connected to a scenic railroad/museum look in on this Forum to give us a first-hand account of "what's goin' on."
And you know what? since WMSR flat out owns 1309 as far as I'm concerned paint it in any scheme you want. You folks are putting the money, sweat, love, and more than likely a little blood into that machine and have earned the right.
Just watch out for any possible C&O "Andrews Raiders" sneaking off with her, as postulated by a previous poster!
PS: Don't be a stranger!
PPS: the B&O museum sold 1309 for only $50,000? Wow, what a good deal! Maybe I'll check the couch and other furniture around the house for any loose change or bills and check with those folks to see if there's anything else they want to "fire sale!"
WM 202 is in very good condition. She was kept that way for many years by an individual who took special pride in her. Since his passing, she seems to have deteriorated a little, but not much. There are still local volunteers who are active in her care. I would rather see her in an indoor location.
There have been discussions about returning 202 to steam, but they have never gone very far. I could be wrong on some details, but I understand she was donated to the Children of Hagerstown, with the City as custodian. I have been told the donation included some limitations that prevent the removal of the engine from the City. Could she operate on excursions, returning to Hagerstown afterwards? Who looks after the ownership interests of the Children of Hagerstown? Is any of this enforceable, considering the fact that the WM hasn't existed in years and CSX shows no interest in steam?
What I say here is based on things I have heard said around Hagerstown for years, so maybe the most important question is whether any of my info is correct.
I'd like to add a bit to the discussion. It is my pleasure to serve as WMSR's Curator, and to the best of knowledge the following is accurate.
First, the Western Maryland Scenic Railroad Development Corporation (the quasi-public 501(c)3 entity that operates the Western Maryland Scenic Railroad) purchased the 1309 from the B&O Railroad Museum in Spring of 2014. The purchase price was $50,000 and it was a straightforward sale. It is not a "loaner."
By the time the rehabilitation is complete in April or May of 2017, WMSR will have spent close to $1 million on the project, typical for a locomotive of that size. There have been no major surprises and few unexpected issues. But it is almost like restoring two locomotives. Also, the locomotive sat with an asbestos "sponge" holding water against the boiler and firebox for roughly 30 years, which caused a great deal of damage to studs and flexible staybolts. Correcting those issues has taken somewhat longer than expected.
WMSR staff and governance carefully considered what identity the locomotive should have. It is important to bear in mind that C&O 1308 is preserved and well-cared for in Huntington, WV. It is complete, well-interpreted, and in excellent condition as a "museum locomotive."
The 1309 was something of an orphan in the B&O Museum collection. It will be ideally suited as one of WMSR's workhorse locomotives and fulfills a longtime goal of having two large steam locomotives available for service. WMSR 734 will undergo the same thorough rehabilitation as the 1309 over the next few years as resources permit.
1309 will retain its original C&O number and will be lettered "Western Maryland." It was a C&O locomotive for 7 years, and in all likelihood will be a WMSR locomotive for at least 50 years. The railroad envisions at least three 15 year/1472 day inspection/rebuild cycles for the locomotive. WMSR has been in service for nearly 30 years and bases its long-term planning on a 50-year horizon. That is both standard railroad practice and good cultural resource management practice.
WMSR briefly gave some thought to renumbering the locomotive 760. It was a consensus decision that the 1309 had sufficient "identity" to continue to be 1309 on the Western Maryland Scenic Railroad. But WMSR is an operating railroad and certainly has the right to paint and letter its locomotives accordingly--in the same way that the C&O repainted locomotives it acquired into its own paint schemes.
Absolutely nothing would preclude occasionally repainting the 1309 in a C&O scheme or in some other style. WMSR may paint it differently over the years in the same manner that railroads generally evolved their "look."
Most importantly, WMSR is committed to being a good steward of the locomotive and to making it available to the greatest number of people in the most engaging and interesting ways.
John Hankey
202 looks like it's in gooooood shape.
Hmmm, makes me wonder about possibilities, and I'm not even a "Wild Mary" fan.
Since Western Maryland K-2 4-6-2 202 was mentioned earlier in this thread, here are a few more shots of WM 202 at Hagerstown. The unit is one of 9 purchased by Western Maryland in 1912 in series 201-209. WM 202 has 69 inch drivers, 200 psi, and a tractive effort of 39,736 lbs with a factor of adhesion of 4.04.
WM K-2 4-6-2 202 under its shed in Hagerstown from a traditional wedge angle...
WM K-2 4-6-2 202 broadside with a panoramic view (notice two cabooses tied to the tank)...
WM K-2 4-6-2 202 in an earlier photo prior to construction of the protective roof...
WM K-2 4-6-2 209 arriving in Hagerstown MD...
WM K-2 4-6-2 209 roster shot...
Shifting back to the I-2 2-10-0 units, 2-10-0 "Four Aces" 1111 on a manifest freight...
WM I-2 2-10-0 1116 roster shot...
WM I-2 2-10-0 11?? on a manifest freight...
WM K-2 4-6-2 205 pulling the Centennial Special to Cumberland...
WM K-2 4-6-2 204 broadside shot...
Here are a few shots of the later Potomacs and Challengers because they are great shots...
WM J-1 4-8-4 1401 on a manifest freight...
WM J-1 4-8-4 1407 on a coal drag...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 1204 on a manifest freight...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 1211 on a coal drag...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 1210 on a reefer block...
WM M-2 4-6-6-4 1208 on manifest west out of Cumberland near deal...
Meanwhile, across town in Cumberland and along Willis Creek, the Western Maryland's chief competitor B&O used a fleet of beefy articulateds to push tonnage over Sand Patch grade to Pittsburgh PA and points west...
B&O 2-8-8-0 7212...
B&0 2-8-8-0 7214...
B&O 2-8-8-0 7105...
B&O 2-8-8-0 7154...
B&O 2-8-8-0 7212 with what appears to be a very long tender with an unusual truck configuration...
Of course, often one or more Big Six 2-10-2 units on the head end would be involved...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6159...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6105...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6144...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6??? pulling merchandise up Sand Patch...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6190 with an oil train at Harpers Ferry...
B&O 2-10-2 6219? with a train of black diamonds...
B&O 2-10-2 Big Six 6121 on merchandise at Shenandoah Junction...
Lehigh & New England 2-10-0 with tender booster for comparison purposes with Western Maryland "Big 1100s"...
Western Maryland Russian Little 1100 with capped stack...
WM hefty 2-8-0...
WM 4-6-2 Pacific 208 at Cumberland, MD...
My mistake: I was thinking WM but wrote RDG
Typical small US 2-10-0's:
RDG "Russian" 183,500# wt.; 51,490# t.e.
AT&N 401(BLW light) 214,300# wt; 49,000# t.e.
And the really big ones:
PRR I1s 386,100# wt.; 90,000# t.e.
PRR I1sa approx. 386,100# wt.; 96,000# t.e.
WM I-2 419,280# wt; 96,300# t.e. (LNE copies similar)
CSSHEGEWISCH: RDG had a small group of relatively short-lived Russians, but never a really big Decapod. I think you were thinking of the class K-1 2-10-2's.
RDG I-2's and PRR I1's are rather atypical 2-10-0's, similar to 2-10-2's in size and service. Most Decapods in North America were built for lighter rail.
Just for the fun of comparing, (not that this unit would ever run on WMSR), I think this might be the only 2-10-0 left that could give the "Big 1100's" a run for their money with 62 inch drivers and 102,027 lbs of tractive effort...
PRR I1 on Horseshoe Curve...
PRR I1 with long distance tender...
PRR I1 with original-sized tender...
PRR I1 topping off the tank...
PRR I1 oiling around...
PRR doubleheaded I1 pushers on Horseshoe Curve...
PRR doubleheaded I1s on the departure track...
PRR I1s in the East Altoona yard...
PRR I1 coaled up in Columbus, OH...
kgbw49:
I guess a WM "Little 1100" would be possible if you could get one of the existing Russians: According to steamlocomotive.com, they are:
SL-SF 1615 Missile Park, Altus, OK
SL-SF 1621 Museum of Transportation, St. Louis, MO
SL-SF 1625 Museum of the Amer. RR, Frisco, TX
SL-SF 1630 IL Ry. Museum, Union, IL
SL-SF 1632 Belton, MO
SAL 544 (GM 206) NC Transportation Museum, Spencer, NC
Good luck getting one!
As for the "Big 1100's", there is nothing in existence that could come close.
PS: I'm guessing that's not a PRR I1sa but a WM H-6 or H-7a 2-8-0 beside 1129. The square valve chest was the first & most evident clue.
BaltACD The only REAL WM engine still in existance is 202 at Hagerstown
The only REAL WM engine still in existance is 202 at Hagerstown
Of course there is Shay no. 6 at Cass, but 202 is the only conventional WM rod engine.
Doesn't Shay #6 count as a "real" WM locomotive? It put in almost 5 years of honest work before the Vindex branch's closing put her in storage. Of course you can still ride behind her at Cass, her home since 1981.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
One wonders if WMSR had not been successful in leasing 1309 if they might have gone the 2-10-0 route instead (PRR 4483 or AT&N 401, perhaps). Here is some Western Maryland 2-10-0 heritage:
I-1 "light" 2-10-0 with 51,490 lbs of tractive effort:
I-2 1129 with 96,315 lbs of tractive effort (in the neighborhood of Pennsy I1 with 102,027 lbs of tractive effort)...
I-2 1116 through Connellsville, PA showing a big barrel of a boiler...
I-2 1125 wedge portrait...
I-2 1113 leading a long string of hoppers down Hemstetter's Curve...
I-2 heading upgrade on Hemstetter's curve...
Probably best to wait for some definite announcement from WM Scenic before making your travel plans. I understand they are making good progress, but these things take as long as they take, and no less. Sometimes longer.
kgbw49 By the way, if you have not had the chance to ride the Black Hills Central, you will not be disappointed if you go.
By the way, if you have not had the chance to ride the Black Hills Central, you will not be disappointed if you go.
Not intending to hijack the thread, but I concur on the Black Hills Central as a great destination. I've seen quite a few steam locomotives, but I was amazed. That is one of the loudest steam locomotives I have ever seen. Everything about it is loud: the exhaust, the whistle, the pop valves. I had a great time visiting there on Memorial Day weekend about 2 years ago. There is also a very friendly and relaxed bar serving their own micro-brew there in town.
Anyone have any update on the progress of the Western Maryland Scenic 2-6-6-2 restoration or an expected service date? That is on my side of the country and would be worth a visit. I went there a number of years ago on what had to be the hottest day of the summer - close to 100 degrees. The benefit for me was that everyone stayed in the air conditioning and I had the side door of the baggage compartment to myself to listen to the 2-8-0 work.
Bill
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