Remaing First Generation Diesels

[Anonymous]

After having felt lucky to spot an old Alco RS-11
in New Castle, PA a few weeks ago (I think it was dead), I was wondering, is there a web site that keeps track of the remaining active (non-museum) first generation diesels out there? Is Extra 2200 South still published? I've been out of the hobby for many years and am just now getting back into it.

[Anonymous]

Haven't seen an X2200S in a while. They do still seem to get published sporadically...

Diesel Era seems to be the newest and regular magazine about locomotives, although it doesn't keep track of all units the same way X2200S does...

Don't know of anything focussed specifically at first generation power.

LC

[Mookie]

Ah! Another question from this corner! Define first generation diesel? As opposed to ....2nd generation??

I am going to offer that these would be the first diesels to come out right after steam. But I may be way off on that! So I know you will tell me!

Mook

[Anonymous]

As I understand the term you are correct. The First Generation diesel units replaced steam. Examples would include everything from boxcabs to F units and most of the odd power like FM Trainmasters, Alco RS units and S series switchers, Baldwins and even GP7s and GP9s.

LC

[enr2099]

There are 4 SW1200RS's being used by Canadian Forest Products on their logging line out of Woss, BC on northern Vancouver Island.

[CShaveRR]

I think that in the days of second-generation units, we considered the GP30 the first of EMD's second-generation units. Alco's Century series were their second-generation models, and everything GE ever built for road service (from the U25B on) was second-generation.

When did the third generation start? I'll suggest the 60-series EMD units, and the Dash 8 GE units (with on-board computer diagnostics, etc.).

One book I have here suggests that evrybody else's second generation is really the third generation, with his second generation being the early hood units (there's some logic to that...in real life three or four generations can be around at once). His "third generation" was new when the book was written...we're probably on the fifth or sixth by now, with that line of reasoning.

[Anonymous]

There are numerous First Generation units in service all over the short line and industrial world. Many have been rebuilt, but not all. Genesee Valley Transportation runs 2 ALCO RS-3s Vermont Railway an RS-1, New Hampshire Northcoast has several GP9s and GP10s, there are ALCO RS-11s in the midwest at the KB&S, numerous former CPR MLW RS-18s and RS-23s in Canada and the US and many, many EMC and EMD switchers from the First Generation all over. Anyone esle have more to add?

LC

[Anonymous]

CN and CP still operate numerous Gp 9's, ONR still uses F7's, Gp 9's, etc...

[Anonymous]

I cannot understand why a good Company would want to hang on to inefficent,old overhead like a GP-9. It must be very expencive to get parts for them plus they have to drink lots of fuel. In business class in College we were taught,after 20 years of service you should have made your money from that piece of equipment. Time to look at new.
TIM A

[JoeKoh]

I would check area short lines tourist lines and grain elevators.Off hand I know 3 places around defiance.
stay safe
joe

[Anonymous]

Wv Central has a fine ABA set of Alco FA's

[Anonymous]

For Targubright-A good company has history, roots, morale and goodwill-all things that are promoted by keeping old engines visible. Besides, an old GP that still runs has had most of its parts replaced at one time or another. It's not going to be factory original by a long shot. Some old power is state of the art internally. If it does the job, why replace it with something that costs 5 times as much??

[zardoz]

Tim-
Depending on the reliability of an old GP7 or 9, it makes good sense to keep it. The unit is probably paid for (no interest payments), all concerned are familiar with how it operates (and how to fix it), and how much fuel does it need to waste before you even begin to make up for the cost (capital + interest) of a newer item? Granted, at some point the repair costs will exceed the purchasing price; then it is time for new.

Remember the someday-famous quote...

[Anonymous]

As far as "expensive" replacement parts--less$ than for any other newer model. If the air compressor goes down, they don't need an original to replace it with. Any comp. that will do the job can be installed-cut /patch/weld is how RR shops fix things. Unlike modern cars, where there is no way to mount just anything, old locos are like '57 Chevys--Plenty of room to work with and if still running -full of all sorts of non-original parts. As long as the frame is structurally sound, GPs, Fs, and the rest can work for another 50 years. Progress=Overrated

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TARGUBRIGHT

I cannot understand why a good Company would want to hang on to inefficent,old overhead like a GP-9. It must be very expencive to get parts for them plus they have to drink lots of fuel. In business class in College we were taught,after 20 years of service you should have made your money from that piece of equipment. Time to look at new.
TIM A

Buisness classes in college are overrated and teach you nothing good.

If it works, dont fix it, ever heard that?

Why spend MILLIONS when you have a perfectly good locomotive that is the best for the job, on a new HUGE loco that is way to powerful and heavy for what it would be used for?

You aint gonna use a 90MAC-H on a half mile hop with 3 cars now are you?

[Anonymous]

OK Point taken, the light is now on. When does a engine become a canidate for scrapping? Are there railroad junkyards were one can go and buy used parts for a 45 year old engine?
TIM A

[Anonymous]

Candidacy for scrap is a decision based upon many factors. Larger railroads may wait until after a lease expires or after a new generation of locomotives comes along making unit reductions or units failure rates get unacceptably high or a unit with a major failure may be scrapped and of course there's the questions of availability of funds to buy or lease newer power. A lot of factors for the railroad to consider. And every railroad has their own polices. Of course a Class 1s trash can well be treasure for smaller roads. There are a LOT of parts still out there for GP9s. Look for them and the newer rebuilds to be around for a LONG time.

LC

[enr2099]

Canadian Pacific still has most of it's fleet of GP9's. They are still active, yes CP rebuilt them over 10 years ago, but they are still going after almost 50 years. The GP9's are great for yard and light road work, hell, you can still find a GP9 in a mainline consist. CP still has GP7's on the roster too.

[aussiesteve]

Rail America's aussie subsiduary Freight Australia has many Clyde/EMD first gen units still in service

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by TARGUBRIGHT

I cannot understand why a good Company would want to hang on to inefficent,old overhead like a GP-9. It must be very expencive to get parts for them plus they have to drink lots of fuel. In business class in College we were taught,after 20 years of service you should have made your money from that piece of equipment. Time to look at new.
TIM A

The Trains mag had an article years ago (with a chart I believe) that talked about fuel consumption. The best (if memory served me correctly) were the GP7s followed by GP9s.


Stay safe, and Look, Listen, and LIVE

Support our Troops

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by thisisbull

After having felt lucky to spot an old Alco RS-11
in New Castle, PA a few weeks ago (I think it was dead), I was wondering, is there a web site that keeps track of the remaining active (non-museum) first generation diesels out there? Is Extra 2200 South still published? I've been out of the hobby for many years and am just now getting back into it.

Try hppt://www.tamr.org/Andy_Inserra?

This site isn't always up to date but it is a good starting point. And you can email Andy with a question , he is good to reply.

Stay Safe and Look, Listen, and Live

Don't Forget the Troops

[Anonymous]

GO DOWN STATE IN NEW YORK ON METRO NORTH AND YOU STILL CAN SEE THE FL-9 STILL PLUGGING AWAY FOR A LITTLE WHILE LONGER