It's been a while since I've heard of problems with looting of railcars. Has the problem been resolved or is it simply of no interest to the media?
If it's been resolved, how did they stop it?
Hardly resolved. Just relocated.
It seems like the insurance companies that are covering the losses would force them to do something about it.
If nothing else, have independent drone owners cover the areas and pay them a bounty when they see someone tampering with a railcar... when the police arrest them. Pay a bit less when the police simply stop them from opening the car.
Perry BabinIf nothing else, have independent drone owners cover the areas and pay them a bounty when they see someone tampering with a railcar... when the police arrest them.
Part of the issue, according to the police, was that the looters would be arrested, but the District Attorney or the judges would release them. Some were arrested in the morning, and were back looting in the evening. The police were very frustrated.
York1 John
I asked my doctor if I gave up delicious food and all alcohol, would I live longer? He said, "No, but it will seem longer."
I don't know how much crime video you watch but that's the norm nowadays. In california, you have to exceed $900 shoplifting to get arrested. Virtually every case (for anything, except for murder and such) is plead down to nothing and the criminals are released with little or no punishment. They are so bold that they will sometimes even tell the arresting offer that they will beat the charges, and they do.
Perry BabinI don't know how much crime video you watch but that's the norm nowadays. In california, you have to exceed $900 shoplifting to get arrested. Virtually every case (for anything, except for murder and such) is plead down to nothing and the criminals are released with little or no punishment. They are so bold that they will sometimes even tell the arresting offer that they will beat the charges, and they do.
Except when real jail time is the result of the prosecution.
Unless one is a part of the criminal justice system, no one knows the truth and even then the 'truth' from any particular participant in the system will be colored by their own preceptions. We are in a world today where protestations about the criminal justice system are being made more for political reasons than they are for criminal justice reasons.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
YT has a lot of videos that show the results of prosecutions using public records that are available through FOI. You can get dash and body cam video as well as court records. Too many are plead down to nothing.
Perry BabinYT has a lot of videos that show the results of prosecutions using public records that are available through FOI. You can get dash and body cam video as well as court records. Too many are plead down to nothing.
Run for DA and stop the pleadings.
Perry BabinToo many are plead down to nothing.
There's no place to put them, and they don't have money for fines (or else they'll just steal something else to cover the cost).
It doesn't help that some states are closing prisons (excuse me - correctional facilities) left and right...
Besides, it's gotten so that such facilities are simply colleges for criminals. If they didn't know how before they went in, they'll certainly know how when they get out...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
I could go on for many posts with the criminal justice system but it's getting political and I may have offended some so I'll quit here.
Thanks for the replies on the original topic, however.
While California gets the most attention, it's happening elsewhere, too. There's a spot in Omaha where trains coming up from Kansas City get stopped and some containers have been broken into. Westbound stack trains also occasionally have some open container doors. It's not to the level of California, but it happens.
I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain.
Jeff
jeffhergertI bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain.
While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit.
tree68 jeffhergert I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain. While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit.
jeffhergert I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain.
There is a lot of truth in your statement tree! However, most lading hauled in railroad intermodal does not specify the exact commodity being shipped in the trailers/containers. Most list the commodity as 'FAK' Freight All Kinds, and the freight charges are not assessed on a commodity/weight basis, but in per box charges.
tree68While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit.
Conrail Boyz.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
zugmannConrail Boyz.
And for those who've never heard of them:
https://www.dailypress.com/2003/07/20/robbing-trains-goes-high-tech/
And there was the COPS episode from 1991 (complete with the old box caprices), where the Jersey City PD + Conrail PD set up the sting with the CR Trailvan trailer.
Easily found on youtube if you're so inclined.
The link was behind a paywall. Here's another story:
https://www.nj.com/hudson/2016/10/conrail_boyz_theft_ring_leader_sentenced_to_8_year.html
And another:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBMeNzhPbkY
And one more:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/conrail-boyz-gang-accused-of-robbing-new-jersey-freight-trains/
There have been more than a few stories about stopping trains mid-desert and other secluded locations by shooting out or otherwise damaging brake lines. By the time a crew member gets to the intended target container, it's empty and the perps are long gone...
BaltACD tree68 jeffhergert I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain. While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit. There is a lot of truth in your statement tree! However, most lading hauled in railroad intermodal does not specify the exact commodity being shipped in the trailers/containers. Most list the commodity as 'FAK' Freight All Kinds, and the freight charges are not assessed on a commodity/weight basis, but in per box charges.
Absolutely, organized crime is heavily involved in cargo theft. I had a 45k load of steel stolen last year..truck and load driven out of the Exxon Fuel Maxx in Houston in broad daylight..empty truck found abandoned but undamaged in Humble, TX a day later. No way some kids with time on their hands did that.
BaltACDThere is a lot of truth in your statement tree! However, most lading hauled in railroad intermodal does not specify the exact commodity being shipped in the trailers/containers. Most list the commodity as 'FAK' Freight All Kinds, and the freight charges are not assessed on a commodity/weight basis, but in per box charges.
Somebody, somewhere, knows what's in a given container. Somebody, somewhere, knows where that container is. Get those people in your camp and watch the wonders unfold.
I don't doubt that there is organized crime involved with much of the looting. However, I also think there is a lot of disorganized crime doing it too. The scenes of boxes and items discarded along tracks would seem to indicate a kind of exploratory opening of containers.
It depends on the container. There are a lot of containers loaded with only one commodity and the train list will reflect that. For example, there is a lot of shelving moving around. And one of them was broken into because some of the remenants were along the right of way. (I guess the container was opened, the person(s) saw it wasn't anything they wanted and moved on to the next target. Leaving the container open.)
I also wonder if some shipping company containers are targeted more than others. Being those in the know or with experience know which ones are more likely to have a load with street value.
Our train lists show MIXFRT for the FAK or mixed loads containers that Balt mentioned. I had a conductor one time say we moved a lot of fruit cocktail in those containers. I asked him what he meant, and he showed me the list showing MIXFRT, or as he interpreted it, mixed fruit.
I've also started noticing some containers, 20ft and 40ft or bigger, that have doors along the sides as well as at the end. I wonder if they are actually compartmentalized or just offer better access. The doors are all double doors, just like the end doors.
jeffhergertI don't doubt that there is organized crime involved with much of the looting. However, I also think there is a lot of disorganized crime doing it too. The scenes of boxes and items discarded along tracks would seem to indicate a kind of exploratory opening of containers.
Completely agree.
tree68 jeffhergert I don't doubt that there is organized crime involved with much of the looting. However, I also think there is a lot of disorganized crime doing it too. The scenes of boxes and items discarded along tracks would seem to indicate a kind of exploratory opening of containers. Completely agree.
jeffhergert I don't doubt that there is organized crime involved with much of the looting. However, I also think there is a lot of disorganized crime doing it too. The scenes of boxes and items discarded along tracks would seem to indicate a kind of exploratory opening of containers.
Yes, very true..
Ulrich BaltACD tree68 jeffhergert I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain. While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit. There is a lot of truth in your statement tree! However, most lading hauled in railroad intermodal does not specify the exact commodity being shipped in the trailers/containers. Most list the commodity as 'FAK' Freight All Kinds, and the freight charges are not assessed on a commodity/weight basis, but in per box charges. Absolutely, organized crime is heavily involved in cargo theft. I had a 45k load of steel stolen last year..truck and load driven out of the Exxon Fuel Maxx in Houston in broad daylight..empty truck found abandoned but undamaged in Humble, TX a day later. No way some kids with time on their hands did that.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
Murphy Siding How does one go about selling a truckload of steel without drawing some suspicion from people who should know better?
How does one go about selling a truckload of steel without drawing some suspicion from people who should know better?
Had a subordinate employee that was big into selling things at Flea Markets. After several years the FBI arrested him. The merchandise he was selling was stolen from Intermodal Trains with the assistance of a member of the CSX Police, who was also arrested. After trial and conviction they both spent several years at 'Jimmy Hoffa U', the Federal Prison at Lewisburg, PA.
It was reported that after the bust, the FBI hauled away several 40 foot trailer loads that the individual had been storing at multiple 'Public Storage' type warehouse facilities.
Murphy SidingHow does one go about selling a truckload of steel without drawing some suspicion from people who should know better?
To a scrap processor for below-market value.
Murphy Siding Ulrich BaltACD tree68 jeffhergert I bet whomever opened up the container I once saw on a westbound was surprised. It was bulk grain. While a fair number of those break-ins are likely "games of chance," I tend to believe that sometimes they are fairly organized (ie, have 'inside' information), and the thieves know exactly which container(s) they are going to hit. There is a lot of truth in your statement tree! However, most lading hauled in railroad intermodal does not specify the exact commodity being shipped in the trailers/containers. Most list the commodity as 'FAK' Freight All Kinds, and the freight charges are not assessed on a commodity/weight basis, but in per box charges. Absolutely, organized crime is heavily involved in cargo theft. I had a 45k load of steel stolen last year..truck and load driven out of the Exxon Fuel Maxx in Houston in broad daylight..empty truck found abandoned but undamaged in Humble, TX a day later. No way some kids with time on their hands did that. How does one go about selling a truckload of steel without drawing some suspicion from people who should know better?
That's why they call it organized. These people had a plan.. driver with a class 1 license, access to a crane or lift to unload it.. and of course a buyer, probably arranged ahead of time.
And possibly it did evoke suspicion in someone, but that someone likely didn't care enough to report it.
Sounds a lot like car thefts where the thieves are looking for a specific vehicle make/model/color. In many cases, those cars are in a container and headed overseas before the owner realizes they are gone.
And you know what? I would not be the least surprised if whoever stole that steel sold it to the very person who ordered it in the first place... At a substantial discount from the original price. Stranger things have happened.
tree68 Murphy Siding How does one go about selling a truckload of steel without drawing some suspicion from people who should know better? Sounds a lot like car thefts where the thieves are looking for a specific vehicle make/model/color. In many cases, those cars are in a container and headed overseas before the owner realizes they are gone. And you know what? I would not be the least surprised if whoever stole that steel sold it to the very person who ordered it in the first place... At a substantial discount from the original price. Stranger things have happened.
Was working 3rd trick in downtown Akron. The B&O offices were in a 4 or 5 story office building and the neares parking was about half a block away. Came out from work in the morning and my Triumph TR-250 was no longer in the parking lot. Went through the ordeal of reporting it to the police as stolen - they wanted believe it had been repossessed and not stolen - had to get a ride home and bring the clear title back to the cops before they would consider it stolen. Got a report about a week later that the license plates had been found in a storm drain in Cleveland. Car was never located - don't know if it was parted out or moved somewhere else intact.
A couple of months back two classic cars were stolen in Des Moines. Some time between about the middle of March to the middle of April. One was recovered, the other one's description was given to the public. A 1950 Chevrolet pickup. An Orange, 1950 Chevrolet pickup. 1950 Chevy 3100 Stolen From Des Moines (motorious.com)
At the time it was said it had been seen around Des Moines, but police hadn't located it. I think a few days later I heard it had been recovered.
Cargo theft and looting is far more pervasive than most people realize, whether it's cargo taken off a train or a box stolen from someone's porch. It happens because there's not much of a downside for the perpetrators.. odds of getting caught and prosecuted are slim to none as most jurisdictions are financially strapped and won't even send someone out to take a report.
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