zugmann mudchicken If you ever have an outfit re-striping your parking lot, hope you have them stripe the foul zone on the dock (preferably 10 ft from centerline of track) and make sure the bridge plate is stored behind that line (along with anything else) when not in use. Paint the face of the dock yellow inside the foul zone- cheap insurance for the price of some yellow traffic paint with glass beads in it . And for god's sake, don't be grabbing stuff with the forklift on the end of the dock if the train crew is there. Seriously, we won't be here long - go grab a coffee or take a pee break.
mudchicken If you ever have an outfit re-striping your parking lot, hope you have them stripe the foul zone on the dock (preferably 10 ft from centerline of track) and make sure the bridge plate is stored behind that line (along with anything else) when not in use. Paint the face of the dock yellow inside the foul zone- cheap insurance for the price of some yellow traffic paint with glass beads in it .
And for god's sake, don't be grabbing stuff with the forklift on the end of the dock if the train crew is there. Seriously, we won't be here long - go grab a coffee or take a pee break.
Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.
I always stand on the loading dock side so I can keep an eye on the morons. Wouldn't put it past them to drive into the side of the cars as we're pulling out of there, or go off the dock and into the gap where the cars used to be.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
What a thread. A two-fer going on.
Regarding the close clearance on yard tracks. Besides written special instructions, they could attach a small sign to the switch stand, or a stand alone sign, as a reminder that cars can't be ridden on those specific tracks.
I remember discussing grab irons and side ladders years ago with a guy who had retired. He said he thought the requirements for the limits (max and min) between the car body and the grab iron/ladders should be revisited since people in general are bigger than they were years ago.
I think we are going to see a rule making it easier for shippers/receivers to invoke a forced access/reciprocal switching rule. It's been available since 1980, but has been somewhat vague on certain issues. A new rule making it easier to use is kind of what the hearings were for.
If a new regulation is placed in service, it might affect the ultra profibility of railroads. Not enough to bankrupt the class ones, but maybe enough to get the short term, activist, want it all today, types out of the industry.
Jeff
Sounds like good fodder for a tool box safety meeting on the industry's side of the foul zone.
mudchickenIf you ever have an outfit re-striping your parking lot, hope you have them stripe the foul zone on the dock (preferably 10 ft from centerline of track) and make sure the bridge plate is stored behind that line (along with anything else) when not in use. Paint the face of the dock yellow inside the foul zone- cheap insurance for the price of some yellow traffic paint with glass beads in it .
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
Euclid How do the regionals react to PSR?
That's a good question. The only regional I'm aware of with issues perporting to be of PSR origin is one that runs in Maryland and Delaware, either the Delmarva Central or the Maryland & Delaware. One (or both) have had shipment delay problems from N-S, a PSR practitioner. But I haven't read of anything lately. Maybe it's been corrected by now.
If there's others around the country other posters will have to sound off on the subject.
By the way, both the Delmarva Central and the Maryland & Delaware have an excellent reputation for customer service.
Flintlock76 Euclid Well if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon? If that happened I'd predict a devolution to the way things used to be, that is no Big Seven (or is it six now?) but smaller railroads cross-country picking up where the failed giants left off. Which might not be such a bad thing. The regionals seem to be a lot more agressive in soliciting business and a lot more customer-centric when they get it.
Euclid Well if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon?
If that happened I'd predict a devolution to the way things used to be, that is no Big Seven (or is it six now?) but smaller railroads cross-country picking up where the failed giants left off.
Which might not be such a bad thing. The regionals seem to be a lot more agressive in soliciting business and a lot more customer-centric when they get it.
EuclidWell if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon?
I would prefer that my people get off at the sign or ahead of the obstruction. I recently did an accident survey where the industry added a fence to the end of the dock (stupid plant engineer/ maintenance people guessed where to put it) vitually overnight. Poor switchman couldn't climb fast enough and couldn't stop the cut fast enough to avoid coming into contact with the fence after discovering the new addition to the dock when it came into view in the dark.
If you ever have an outfit re-striping your parking lot, hope you have them stripe the foul zone on the dock (preferably 10 ft from centerline of track) and make sure the bridge plate is stored behind that line (along with anything else) when not in use. Paint the face of the dock yellow inside the foul zone- cheap insurance for the price of some yellow traffic paint with glass beads in it .
... When doing ALTA/Mortgage insurance surveys around tracks in commercial areas we will note any measured clearance violation found. Title companies hate this and try to get those notes removed. (We won't do it - perceived loss in value is no reason to overide a safety liability or ignore it. We report improvements and conditions found.)
mudchicken Murphy Siding It seems like it would be real simple to put up something equivilent to a tell-tale type thing on the side of the tracks that matches the width of the clearance. If the rider bonked into a lightweight sign instead of something solid, the outcome would be way better. As an aside, the BNSF had us replace signs that said "No clearance" at the sides of our ramp because they were faded, so someone at BNSF checks things like that in our area. If the sign was missing or removed, would that person have seen the issue that caused placement of the sign? (I assume in your case the issue is a dock or a gate with a wrong sized opening - Top two clearance issues)
Murphy Siding It seems like it would be real simple to put up something equivilent to a tell-tale type thing on the side of the tracks that matches the width of the clearance. If the rider bonked into a lightweight sign instead of something solid, the outcome would be way better. As an aside, the BNSF had us replace signs that said "No clearance" at the sides of our ramp because they were faded, so someone at BNSF checks things like that in our area.
It seems like it would be real simple to put up something equivilent to a tell-tale type thing on the side of the tracks that matches the width of the clearance. If the rider bonked into a lightweight sign instead of something solid, the outcome would be way better. As an aside, the BNSF had us replace signs that said "No clearance" at the sides of our ramp because they were faded, so someone at BNSF checks things like that in our area.
If the sign was missing or removed, would that person have seen the issue that caused placement of the sign? (I assume in your case the issue is a dock or a gate with a wrong sized opening - Top two clearance issues)
Overmod They've had vertical warnings, in the form of telltales, for nearly two centuries. The problem with the equivalent for many 'zero clearance' areas is putting the warning close enough to the actual obstruction to matter. Just having the equivalent of a painted line or barrier 'you must be at least this tall to ride this ride' as you're going into the plant or facility, or a loading-gage bar or breakaway somewhere on the track approaching the area, won't replace the sign or warning paint right at the hazard itself.
They've had vertical warnings, in the form of telltales, for nearly two centuries.
The problem with the equivalent for many 'zero clearance' areas is putting the warning close enough to the actual obstruction to matter. Just having the equivalent of a painted line or barrier 'you must be at least this tall to ride this ride' as you're going into the plant or facility, or a loading-gage bar or breakaway somewhere on the track approaching the area, won't replace the sign or warning paint right at the hazard itself.
Balt: No disagreement on the issue of "Signs in many cases CREATE clearance issues themselves" .....been there, seen that - far too many industry track owners are clueless. (and certain railroad employees are not much better) ....failures like the one on NS are so preventable. Obvious/preventable rules violations are so rediculously frustrating. Hate that.
As to the installation of tell-tales, that's an accident looking for a place to happen. Tell-tales in theory are supposed to come in contact with inanimate objects.
Psychot Euclid BaltACD Euclid tree68 BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows. Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow. So how does a railroad get more of those ideal stockholders instead of those that just want a quick buck? The quick buckers are endemic to the 21st Century World. Bean counters think they control the world; they only care about extracting the last penny out of their victims before rigor mortise sets in on the financial corpse they leave behind. Well if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon? Please stop with the interrogative argumentation. If you have a point to make, make it.
Euclid BaltACD Euclid tree68 BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows. Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow. So how does a railroad get more of those ideal stockholders instead of those that just want a quick buck? The quick buckers are endemic to the 21st Century World. Bean counters think they control the world; they only care about extracting the last penny out of their victims before rigor mortise sets in on the financial corpse they leave behind. Well if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon?
BaltACD Euclid tree68 BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows. Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow. So how does a railroad get more of those ideal stockholders instead of those that just want a quick buck? The quick buckers are endemic to the 21st Century World. Bean counters think they control the world; they only care about extracting the last penny out of their victims before rigor mortise sets in on the financial corpse they leave behind.
Euclid tree68 BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows. Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow. So how does a railroad get more of those ideal stockholders instead of those that just want a quick buck?
tree68 BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows. Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow.
BEAUSABRE If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad
If it weren't for the "Wall Street Trash" (aka the owners), you wouldn't have a railroad
You're right. The issue is the "investors" who are in it for the quick buck and not for growth over time. Ideally, a stockholder in the railroad should be interested in seeing their money put to best use to generate more money, so their portfolio grows.
Those investors looking for the quick buck only care about what shows up in their checkbook tomorrow.
So how does a railroad get more of those ideal stockholders instead of those that just want a quick buck?
The quick buckers are endemic to the 21st Century World. Bean counters think they control the world; they only care about extracting the last penny out of their victims before rigor mortise sets in on the financial corpse they leave behind.
Well if there is no solution to the problem, and it leaves railroads as a financial corpse, will the railroad business simply come to an end soon?
Please stop with the interrogative argumentation. If you have a point to make, make it.
I just did.
Signs in many cases CREATE clearance issues themselves.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
blhanel tree68 I've hung off the sides of our passenger cars, but in doing so it's very apparent that your average railroad worker of the 1950's was a tad shorter than me. One more grab iron higher would be nice... Um, Larry, the average worker TODAY is a tad shorter than you (and me)...
tree68 I've hung off the sides of our passenger cars, but in doing so it's very apparent that your average railroad worker of the 1950's was a tad shorter than me. One more grab iron higher would be nice...
I've hung off the sides of our passenger cars, but in doing so it's very apparent that your average railroad worker of the 1950's was a tad shorter than me. One more grab iron higher would be nice...
Um, Larry, the average worker TODAY is a tad shorter than you (and me)...
I don't see railroading coming to a end.
With the carriers (bean counters) pursuing PSR to the extent they are and PO'ing customers to the extent they are - Nationalization is not that far outside the realm of possibility. Bean Counters are the killers of geese that lay golden eggs...once they have killed one species of golden geese, they just move on to some other species.
tree68 blhanel Um, Larry, the average worker TODAY is a tad shorter than you (and me)... True that, but... Just one more rung...
blhanel Um, Larry, the average worker TODAY is a tad shorter than you (and me)...
True that, but... Just one more rung...
One more rung = 16 or 18 inches of 3/4 or 1 inch round steel with bolt/rivet holes - 4 corners 100K cars.
blhanelUm, Larry, the average worker TODAY is a tad shorter than you (and me)...
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
CSSHEGEWISCH I'm not sure that there is a solution. Henry Ford kept Ford Motor Company privately held because there was no way that he could keep shares out of the hands of speculators. David LeVan had to deal with arbitrageurs who forced his hand in the sale of Conrail to NS and CSX. You can't control who owns the shares.
I'm not sure that there is a solution. Henry Ford kept Ford Motor Company privately held because there was no way that he could keep shares out of the hands of speculators. David LeVan had to deal with arbitrageurs who forced his hand in the sale of Conrail to NS and CSX. You can't control who owns the shares.
Brian (IA) http://blhanel.rrpicturearchives.net.
There are some people who show up at the lottery counter with a fist full of "successful" scraatch off tickets. Watch them and you'll note that they usually spend their winnings on buying more lottery tickets. Not that much different from the "activist" investors. Looking for a quick buck. Retirement? Who's worried about that?
Others of us buy a ticket now and then, mostly on a lark. Maybe we'll win big, maybe we'll win two bucks, but it's just a game. It's no big deal if we don't win.
Back to riding cars - we usually have a vestibule to stand in, or at least an end door. I've hung off the sides of our passenger cars, but in doing so it's very apparent that your average railroad worker of the 1950's was a tad shorter than me. One more grab iron higher would be nice...
It sounds dire. What is the solution to the problem?
tree68... CSX was successful a few years in beating back The Children's Fund. But their intentions were kind of obvious. Now we've got PSR, an invenstment scheme masqurading as an operations plan.
CSX was successful a few years in beating back The Children's Fund. But their intentions were kind of obvious. Now we've got PSR, an invenstment scheme masqurading as an operations plan.
CSX really wasn't successful in its proxy fight against The Childrens Fund - they did manage to get control of CSX, however, with their financial losses TCF was experiencing with their other holdings during the 2008/09 financial downturn they had to sell most of their CSX shares, and thus control, to cover the losses in their other holdings. The very short period of time that TCF had control they weren't able to do any material damage to CSX's financial standing or operating plan.
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