zugmann Sunnyland I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right. Conductor is going to look mighty funny trying to pull cars with a rope. May be his train - but they're *my* engines. Tongue-in-cheek, of course...
Sunnyland I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right.
Conductor is going to look mighty funny trying to pull cars with a rope.
May be his train - but they're *my* engines.
Tongue-in-cheek, of course...
BaltACD tree68 mudchicken Yuppie Trash Terms created by those coming out of business & finance schools that refused to learn the business from the ground-up. Probably fifteen or sixteen years ago, the Army decided that instead of "directorates" the various activities would be know as "business centers." When I left a few years later, most of the activities had gotten away from the "business center" moniker... Titles are a merry-go-round item. Everytime the board room changes hands so do the titles of those of the organization's various positions; with each new board saying the change of titles will make the overall organization more efficient and profitable.
tree68 mudchicken Yuppie Trash Terms created by those coming out of business & finance schools that refused to learn the business from the ground-up. Probably fifteen or sixteen years ago, the Army decided that instead of "directorates" the various activities would be know as "business centers." When I left a few years later, most of the activities had gotten away from the "business center" moniker...
mudchicken Yuppie Trash Terms created by those coming out of business & finance schools that refused to learn the business from the ground-up.
Probably fifteen or sixteen years ago, the Army decided that instead of "directorates" the various activities would be know as "business centers." When I left a few years later, most of the activities had gotten away from the "business center" moniker...
Titles are a merry-go-round item. Everytime the board room changes hands so do the titles of those of the organization's various positions; with each new board saying the change of titles will make the overall organization more efficient and profitable.
Electroliner 1935 Sunnyland I was on excursion RR a few years ago and when I came up to engineer I said you must be the hogger. He laughed and said I must have had a railroad background and I explained that I did. I sometimes tell Amtrak conductors that I talk to that they used to be called the "brains", they always get a kick out of that teasing each other. They are in charge, one guy told me it is nice to ride with someone who knows what is going on. I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right. But let it jump the track, watch who gets the blame.
Sunnyland I was on excursion RR a few years ago and when I came up to engineer I said you must be the hogger. He laughed and said I must have had a railroad background and I explained that I did. I sometimes tell Amtrak conductors that I talk to that they used to be called the "brains", they always get a kick out of that teasing each other. They are in charge, one guy told me it is nice to ride with someone who knows what is going on. I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right.
I was on excursion RR a few years ago and when I came up to engineer I said you must be the hogger. He laughed and said I must have had a railroad background and I explained that I did. I sometimes tell Amtrak conductors that I talk to that they used to be called the "brains", they always get a kick out of that teasing each other. They are in charge, one guy told me it is nice to ride with someone who knows what is going on. I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right.
But let it jump the track, watch who gets the blame.
Everyone in a radius of 25 miles, until proven otherwise.
Jeff
tree68 Sunnyland I said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right. I've had the same basic conversation with our passengers.
I've had the same basic conversation with our passengers.
SunnylandI said I have had to tell many people who comment about engineer being in charge and I say no, the conductor is, the engineer does not move until the conductor gives him the OK. They say you got that right.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
It's been fun. But it isn't much fun anymore. Signing off for now.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
adkrr64I, for one, would like know how "gandy dancer" came about. If it takes two to tango, how many does it take to gandy?
The Wiki article on this in worth reading, but "gandy" refers to the five-foot iron bar each man on the crew would use to nudge the rail perfectly into place. If you've ever seen old videos of those section crews at work you'd have seen the little dance-type step they use as part of their aligning work. So it's a term that has dance connotations. No wonder they sang and worked to cadences.
This definition is new to me. I always thought a gandy dancer was the man who held the chisel for another man (such as John Henry) who struck it repeatedly with his sledge hammer in tunnel construction. Or the man who held the spike as it was driven into a crosstie.
In the video a retired worker repeats the urban legend that there was a Chicago tool or shovel company named Gandy, but the Chicago Historical Society says no such company existed.
Either way, it was obviously a back-breaking and dangerous job which I'll wager no one ever retired from.
BaltACDOld time track crews consisted of somewhere between 8 and 12 men - men that manually handled rails and ties. Jobs the required the synchronized efforts of all the men in the gang. To harness the power of the men, 'songs' were developed so that each man could exert himself at the same time.
All working under the guidance of the foreman, who had a calibrated eyeball...
adkrr64 If it takes two to tango, how many does it take to gandy?
If it takes two to tango, how many does it take to gandy?
All the live long day....
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
adkrr64 tree68 There's a book to write (maybe already written) - "Railroad Monikers and How They Came to Be..." I, for one, would like know how "gandy dancer" came about. If it takes two to tango, how many does it take to gandy?
tree68 There's a book to write (maybe already written) - "Railroad Monikers and How They Came to Be..."
I, for one, would like know how "gandy dancer" came about. If it takes two to tango, how many does it take to gandy?
Old time track crews consisted of somewhere between 8 and 12 men - men that manually handled rails and ties. Jobs the required the synchronized efforts of all the men in the gang. To harness the power of the men, 'songs' were developed so that each man could exert himself at the same time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=025QQwTwzdU
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
tree68There's a book to write (maybe already written) - "Railroad Monikers and How They Came to Be..."
There's a book to write (maybe already written) - "Railroad Monikers and How They Came to Be..."
"Hoghead"...A term used by brakemen and conductors because have you ever seen a hog that was able to turn his head around and look behind him?
.
Regards - Steve
In the early 1980's I was a draftsman at British Columbia Railway (later BC Rail). I was riding in the cab of the lead unit on a northbound freight and was following along in the track chart to see what the different curves and grades looked like. One of the crew members said "Oh, you have a piglet book". I was too embarrased at the time to ask what he meant. Later I learned that a piglet is a trainee engineer or "young hogger".
The golden years of hogging.
mudchickenYuppie Trash Terms created by those coming out of business & finance schools that refused to learn the business from the ground-up.
Hogger and hoghead nowadays seems mostly to appear in books and articles related to railroading's past.
Or artistically/stylistically, to impart some flavor of the past.
jeffhergert I've heard hoghead used, but not hogger in my terminal. However, that was by a guy who retired 4 or 5 years ago. He was about the last of the old heads, many of which used a bit more slang terms than current employees. Uncle Pete changed manager titles way before I hired out. Now it's manager of this, supervisor of that, etc. Jeff
I've heard hoghead used, but not hogger in my terminal. However, that was by a guy who retired 4 or 5 years ago. He was about the last of the old heads, many of which used a bit more slang terms than current employees.
Uncle Pete changed manager titles way before I hired out. Now it's manager of this, supervisor of that, etc.
One Division Engineer I worked for labelled the Chief Clerk in the Superintendent's Office as the "Grand Wazzir-Paper Clips" when the new UP titles first appeared in the late 80's.
Lashup is a purely railfan (dare I say foamer?) term. I'd get laughed at if I said it at work. Your/our/the consist, "the power", or units are the proper terms. A single diesel is referred to as a unit (most common), engine, or locomotive (too many letters so that one isn't used much). Do not call it "a power" like some new guys do, that is wrong and makes me cringe.
We have some transfer jobs that are called herders, since they 'herd' units and cars from one yard to another. They may also be called tramps or tramp yards, since they wander around from place to place, though this term along with "trainmaster" has been banned by CN from official usage for fear of offending someone or conjuring up connotations of slavery.
The official new name for a front line supervisor is "transportation manager". A few people now like to call them "plantation managers" instead, this nickname didn't start until trainmaster was banned.
The story I was told is that as locomotives grew fat-boilered on small 'legs' with heavier and heavier augment making them sway, roll, root and occasionally die, with greedy appetite, they got the nickname 'hogs' (and hence the men who ran them then became hoggers instead of, say, throttle artists or ballast scorchers). Think of it as one of those expressions like hotrodding or ballin' the jack that aren't really current any more.
I wonder: if diesel locomotives can be 'honorary steam locomotives' then some of them could surely be honorary hogs. Very clearly the New York Central Gravel Gerties qualify. People are going to say Centipedes do -- but that was a 120mph design that had the wrong nose along with the wrong engines in the carbody: no one would laugh at an A-A set of Essls with 12,000hp and gearing to use every bit of it in under 120' of carbody on much less wheelbase...
"Lashup" of course comes out of an earlier tradition, and had a specific sense of mismatch from there that became lost at some point during its frequent use in the DPM era at Trains. A properly matched group of locomotives in MU is a 'power consist' (or other expression like 'cow and calf' or 'herd'. It becomes a lashup when any old group of engines are tied together, and a dog's breakfast when really wrong somehow.
"Hogger" or "Hoghead" is still used, though not it is not as common as in the past. But pretty much everyone will know what you mean if you use it out on the property around here.
There are multiple origin stories, the one's I've heard include certain locomotives being referred to as "hogs", either due to their round appearance or greedy consumption of fuel and water. Or certain engineers being thought of as pigheads when they tried to overrule the conductor and plan switching moves themselves (those fights still happen today).
I would say it is far more applicable to steam.
In a number of books I own and articles I've read, the term "hoggers" is used as a nickname for locomotive engineers. But I haven't seen this word used in this way for a few years now. Has it fallen out of favor (like "lashup")? Is it more applicable to steam locomotive crews than diesel crews? And what's its origin?
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