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Effects of the pandemic on the rail industry?

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Effects of the pandemic on the rail industry?
Posted by steve-in-kville on Wednesday, April 15, 2020 7:09 AM

I don't log every train I see/hear, but I live near the NS mainline. I can honestly say that typically Sundays are a slower day on the tracks and Mondays I hear mostly local customers being serviced. 

The past few Sundays appeared to be a typical busy day, there really wasn't much of a slow down. I'm seeing more container trains than anything else, a few mixed trains and its been a while that I've seen tanker trains... but that is my personal observations.

I'd imagine if the trucking industry is working overtime, the railroads have to keep pace as well. Thoughts on this? Perhaps my imagination is getting the best of me?

Regards - Steve

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Posted by greyhounds on Thursday, April 16, 2020 6:57 PM

The trucking industry is not working overtime.  They're in deep decline in terms of volume and prices.

I hope this link works for you.

https://www.dat.com/blog/post/van-freight-volume-and-rates-slide-as-economy-stalls?utm_source=sfmc&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=NL_Carrier&utm_term=4852039&utm_content=NL_Carrier_2020_04_16

There is no way the truckers are clearing costs at many of the rates cited.  They're running for cash, trying to keep their equipment from being repo'd and their insurance good.

The truck freight market approaches perfect competition.  When demand craters, as it has, the supply of trucks doesn't go down much.  That forces prices down.  How long they can stand that is unknown.

Note: A "Van" or "Dry Van" is a box trailer with no refrigeration system.

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by Convicted One on Thursday, April 16, 2020 7:21 PM

steve-in-kville
Thoughts on this? Perhaps my imagination is getting the best of me?

I'd guess that the extra boards are turning pretty slow right now.  But surely some rail customers are "essential" businesses. 

I'm going to stick my neck out and guess the country will start to ramp back up May 15, assuming some form of order comes out of the chaos.

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Thursday, April 16, 2020 7:35 PM

In another thread on this Forum, a couple days ago Randy Vos - an owner-operator trucker - said he was glad he signed up for a contract with one of the paper mills (yes, hauling TP and the the paper for the rolls it gets wound on), because of the low rates other truckers are getting.  

Back to rails, today I saw an article from Railway Age about an AAR report that rail volumes are down 20 - 25% compared to the same week a year ago, pretty much for railcars, intermodal, and combined.  Most commodity groups were down by wildly varying percentages (autos was -87.7% !) except grain, which had a modest increase of 2.7%.  Here's the link to it - has a heckuva graph at the top of the article:

https://www.railwayage.com/freight/class-i/rail-traffic-down-but-aar-remains-optimistic/?utm_source=&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=14375   

- PDN. 

"This Fascinating Railroad Business" (title of 1943 book by Robert Selph Henry of the AAR)
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Posted by tree68 on Thursday, April 16, 2020 7:48 PM

Convicted One
I'm going to stick my neck out and guess the country will start to ramp back up May 15, assuming some form of order comes out of the chaos.

I'm afraid all the efforts to "flatten the curve" are simply going to extend the event.  Unless a vaccine is found (one estimate has that not happening until 2022), or the virus dies out, everyone is eventually going to get infected, whether they get sick or not.  

As long as people continue to test positive, the powers that be will enjoy their power trip and keep things locked down.

New York's governor just extended the lockdown from the end of April to the middle of May.  I foresee another extension after that.

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Posted by zugmann on Thursday, April 16, 2020 8:10 PM

tree68
I'm afraid all the efforts to "flatten the curve" are simply going to extend the event.

Isn't the the point?  So the medical system isn't completely overloaded?

 

You have a terminal of 50 people.  Would you rather have 3 off at a time for 2-3 weeks each throughout the next several months, or have 48 off all at once?

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by tree68 on Thursday, April 16, 2020 8:32 PM

zugmann
Isn't the the point?  So the medical system isn't completely overloaded?

It is, but many people seem to believe it means that they won't catch it themselves at all...

On the other hand, wouldn't you prefer to have your business completely shut down for a couple of weeks, then be back running full force after that, as opposed to limping along with few customers, etc for months more?  

Many small businesses here are hurting - dairy farmers are dumping milk, with some afraid they will go under.  

Some government "leaders" are so taken with their current ability to rule by fiat that they really don't want to give up that control.  Banning golf - the original social distancing game.  Setting curfews, so you can't take a walk around the block by yourself after 9PM.  Closing parks and beaches.  It's like they're testing us to see how much we'll take before we push back.  A whole bunch of folks in Michigan did push back.  

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Posted by zugmann on Thursday, April 16, 2020 8:49 PM

tree68
It is, but many people seem to believe it means that they won't catch it themselves at all...

A lot of people have a 4th grade understanding of science.

tree68
On the other hand, wouldn't you prefer to have your business completely shut down for a couple of weeks, then be back running full force after that, as opposed to limping along with few customers, etc for months more?  

Depends on the business.  But nobody wants to shut down.  I mean several people ( I believe Bill Gates) have pretty much said that we should completely shut down for a month and then reopen.   Right now, we are half-doing everything.  

And there's only so many hospitals, so many ICUs, so many ventiators, so many medical people.  The goal is to not need all of them.  But if everyone gets sick at once...

tree68
A whole bunch of folks in Michigan did push back.  

A group of people that gathered in a big mass.  Becuase that makes sense. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

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Posted by Convicted One on Thursday, April 16, 2020 9:12 PM

tree68
As long as people continue to test positive, the powers that be will enjoy their power trip and keep things locked down.

There is talk in Michigan of mass protests against the shut down,  advancing the argument   that  " people who venture out in public aren't vectors for infection but rather freedom fighters standing up to oppression."

I'm more inclined to see the people who refuse to be forced back to the yolk just to satisfy Wall Street fat cats as the true freedom fighters

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Posted by MidlandMike on Thursday, April 16, 2020 9:24 PM

People who venture out into public and then congregate in groups like they did on the Michigan capitol lawn, are vectors for infection, no matter their cause.  The virus has no political affiliation.

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Posted by tree68 on Thursday, April 16, 2020 9:36 PM

zugmann
A group of people that gathered in a big mass.  Becuase that makes sense. 

The proof will be in the pudding, as they say, in a couple of weeks.

I understand the no mass gatherings and social distancing.  What I don't get is why certain activities (like a walk around the block, or on the beach - especially if there's no one else in sight) need to be banned.  

Meanwhile, the parking lot at your local big box is full of cars.

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Posted by MidlandMike on Thursday, April 16, 2020 9:42 PM

Where I live beachs and trails were open, but then some people were congregating, so they were closed.

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Posted by charlie hebdo on Thursday, April 16, 2020 9:56 PM

tree68

 

 
zugmann
A group of people that gathered in a big mass.  Becuase that makes sense. 

 

The proof will be in the pudding, as they say, in a couple of weeks.

I understand the no mass gatherings and social distancing.  What I don't get is why certain activities (like a walk around the block, or on the beach - especially if there's no one else in sight) need to be banned.  

Meanwhile, the parking lot at your local big box is full of cars.

 

In Illinois walking in groups of two are fine,  larger if families who reside together.  Are you saying it's not allowed in NY State?

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 17, 2020 1:37 PM

charlie hebdo
In Illinois walking in groups of two are fine,  larger if families who reside together.  Are you saying it's not allowed in NY State?

Groups of five are allowable (but discouraged if not in the same family).

It was another state that had the curfew.  I can't remember which.  There's also an image circulating of two police officers arresting a solitary fellow for walking alone on the beach in Florida.  They were much closer than six feet to him.

After 8PM tonight, you'll need to wear a mask if you are in public in a situation where social distancing is not possible (ie, grocery stores, etc.).  

I went to Lowes today to get stuff to fix my garage door (it wasn't quite all the way open when I started backing in).

All of the staff and maybe half of the customers were in masks of various types.  If the behaviors I saw there were any indication of how people are going to wear masks, they may as well not bother.  The same goes for gloves.

NY's governor has extended the "pause" for another two weeks.  

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Posted by abdkl on Friday, April 17, 2020 2:49 PM
Remember that symptoms do not appear until days after the person IS a carrier, spreading droplets on many things that everyone else touches. And it's not just old folks who are dying. STAY apart to stop the spread.
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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 17, 2020 4:38 PM

abdkl
Remember that symptoms do not appear until days after the person IS a carrier, spreading droplets on many things that everyone else touches. And it's not just old folks who are dying. STAY apart to stop the spread.

The death rate is under 2%, and will continue to drop as more testing is available, revealing more infected people.  Antibody testing is in the works, which will further increase the number of people who have been exposed and are now likely immune, whether they had symptoms or not.

This is equivalent to, or less than the death rate of the common flu, which we took almost no precautions for.  In fact, I'd bet we all know someone who went to granny's house for Thanksgiving even though they had 'a touch of the flu.'    

Everyone likes to post the number of positive tests - but that's since day one.  98% of those people have recovered, or are recovering.  Many people have been put in quarantine, or isolation because of exposure, not because they actually contracted the virus.  They're coming out of isolation as well, most symptom-free.

The big question is how long are we going to hide?  How long can we afford to hide?  

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Posted by Juniata Man on Friday, April 17, 2020 6:55 PM

Larry:

You've touched on one of my pet peeves with the stats that are being thrown around; i.e. the number of cases being reported is cumulative - not current or active. 

Curt

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 17, 2020 8:02 PM

Juniata Man

Larry:

You've touched on one of my pet peeves with the stats that are being thrown around; i.e. the number of cases being reported is cumulative - not current or active. 

Curt

SoapBoxAt the risk of being briefly political - this whole exercise has been political.  Previous outbreaks have not brought out this level of "scare."  And the petit tyrants are having a field day, ruling by fiat.  

Despite constant denials by those feeding on the hype, this is turning out little worse for most of the country than the annual flu.  In fact, some areas probably have more deaths from the flu than from this virus.  

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Posted by BaltACD on Friday, April 17, 2020 9:00 PM

Juniata Man
Larry:

You've touched on one of my pet peeves with the stats that are being thrown around; i.e. the number of cases being reported is cumulative - not current or active. 

Curt

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/us-map

You can manipulate the map to hone in on the counties that interest you.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by MidlandMike on Friday, April 17, 2020 9:00 PM

tree68
he death rate is under 2%, and will continue to drop as more testing is available, revealing more infected people.  Antibody testing is in the works, which will further increase the number of people who have been exposed and are now likely immune, whether they had symptoms or not. This is equivalent to, or less than the death rate of the common flu, which we took almost no precautions for. ...

The death rate may be 2% but that is still a guess.  The death rate in Italy was 12%, partly attributed to their elder population.  The death rate for flu is 0.1%.  It should be obvious to anyone whose has seen the evening news from New York that COVID is much worse than the flu.  No need to consult a politician.

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Posted by Convicted One on Friday, April 17, 2020 10:28 PM

MidlandMike
It should be obvious to anyone whose has seen the evening news from New York that COVID is much worse than the flu.  No need to consult a politician.

Based upon numbers at the CDC website, there is not one state where the number of influenza related deaths exceeds the number of Covid-19 deaths...while in many states the number of Covid-19 deaths is double that from influenza.

And that includes  influenza related deaths compiled over the previous several months spanning back to last year, compared to the current Covid-19 numbers.

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Posted by tree68 on Friday, April 17, 2020 10:34 PM

MidlandMike
It should be obvious to anyone whose has seen the evening news from New York

City.  New York City.  Once you get north of Westchester County, it's a whole different world.  Outside of the metro areas of Albany, Syracuse, Rochester, and Buffalo, you have entire counties with well under 100 total confirmed cases - and few of them are in the hospital.  They are all isolating at home.  My county has exactly two people in the hospital.  And only 42 confirmed cases since the whole shebang started.  The media rarely reports the thousands of confirmed cases that have recovered, either.

I think we've had either two or four deaths in a four county area.

Ninety percent of the cases in New York state are in the NYC metro area.

With the advent of antibody testing and more universal virus testing, the death rate will continue to drop.  At one point, millions were going to die.  Then it was hundreds of thousands.  Now it's tens of thousands. Not insignificant, but no where near what the original doomsayers were predicting.

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Posted by azrail on Friday, April 17, 2020 10:42 PM

We fought wars and ran businesses while waves of polio and measles hit the country. How did we survive?

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Posted by Paul_D_North_Jr on Saturday, April 18, 2020 10:05 AM

"One death is a tragedy, and a million is a statistic." - Iosef Vissarionovich Stalin, as quoted by President Jack Ryan on page 750 of Executive Orders (Tom Clancy, 1996).  The context there was an Ebola epidemic in the U.S. [only].  Worth reading: " . . . personal interactions are minimized, and that's how you stop one of these things." (same page, but by an infectious disesases expert)

Two reasonably short articles with a common author - neither behind a 'paywall' as far as I can tell - from almost 3 weeks ago advocating group testing to return to normal quickly.  What they don't address is where those tests are going to come from.  One of the authors of the first - likely the son of the other author - has some decent credentials.

https://thehill.com/opinion/healthcare/490300-how-to-get-the-economy-safely-back-to-work-in-just-2-weeks#bottom-story-socials A quote: "If after a month the infection and death rates are down, which they surely will be, and we release everyone back into the wild, the rates will go right back up."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kotlikoff/2020/03/29/group-testing-is-our-secret-weapon-against-coronavirus/#5449911936a6 

I'll leave it to someone else to comment on some of the implications of these articles.  One that struck me is it would require essentially mandatory testing by the government to get some of our freedom of movement back.  Difficult tradeoffs.

- PDN. 

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Posted by Euclid on Saturday, April 18, 2020 10:07 AM

One thing we don’t know is whether the apparent slowing of virus spread is due to the lockdowns or whether it is just a natural response of the virus.  And if it is a response of the virus, we don’t know why that is.  We also don’t know if the virus will resurge, and if it does, we don’t know why it would. 

When I look at what is being done to protect people in stores, for instance, I get the impression that the distancing and sanitizing is doing very little good.  Going grocery shopping involves so many ways for the virus to spread.  You have to touch cart handles, cooler handles, and product on the shelves.  If the virus can get on your hands, it can also get on your arms, face, and clothing.  

If you come out of a store with virus on your hands, it gets on the door handle of your car.  If you sanitize your hands when you are back in your car, you have to sanitize the outside door handle when you get back out at home.  Then you carry in several bags of groceries, all of which can have virus.  Your clothes can have virus.  You bring all of this into your house.  They warn us to never shake clothing inside of the house because virus particles will fly out and land everywhere including your hands and face. 

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Posted by Convicted One on Saturday, April 18, 2020 10:13 AM

OTOH, the stay-at-home practices are likely keeping the influenza related death count artificially low, as well.

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Posted by Overmod on Saturday, April 18, 2020 11:28 AM

Euclid
One thing we don’t know is whether the apparent slowing of virus spread is due to the lockdowns or whether it is just a natural response of the virus.  And if it is a response of the virus, we don’t know why that is.  We also don’t know if the virus will resurge, and if it does, we don’t know why it would.

This is more or less just silly.  It would be like attributing free will to the virus, or consciousness.

If you look at a graph of new-case incidence above 100 confirmed cases, you can see a characteristic upward exponential increase (as for epidemic spread) followed by a rightward inflection past the 45% line (which is usually posted on these graphs as a parallel for reference) into a curve toward stability.  In properly-plotted graphs, you can even see the transient influence of 'outbreaks' (which occur when, despite separative measures, the virus gets into a susceptible population and replicates as far as circumstances permit).  

This particular virus has been sequenced, and the differences between it and the usual sort of common-cold virus have been very well characterized (as we know just where it is different).  It is more than usually contagious because it 'just happens' to have an affinity for a surface enzyme complex on mammalian cells that are exposed to 'the outside world'.  What has not yet quite been worked out (although I think the result will be interesting when the research is published and becomes more common knowledge) is what provokes the progression to severe autoimmune reaction, especially in the elderly -- I personally am expecting conserved triggers somewhere in the angiotensin-conversion pathway.  Certainly my opinion at this point is that the actual deaths are vastly the result of specific autoimmune reaction, not 'virus induced disease' as other than semantics, and that directed therapy not only exists for this but has been demonstrated in other contexts.  (However, imnsho, just evoking 'autoimmune modulation' and then looking for the quarter under the streetlight by testing, say, agents effective in AIDS is little better than cargo-cult voodoo by people who haven't looked at enough immunology...)

Remember also that presence of virus does not imply infection by virus -- and there are other safeguards in the body against viral infection, including mucus and the conserved leukotriene cascade.  In a sense at least some of the reactions leading to ARDS are conserved reactions, as well, just as those inducing apoptosis are for variously-induced forms of cancer.

When I look at what is being done to protect people in stores, for instance, I get the impression that the distancing and sanitizing is doing very little good.  Going grocery shopping involves so many ways for the virus to spread.  You have to touch cart handles, cooler handles, and product on the shelves.  If the virus can get on your hands, it can also get on your arms, face, and clothing.

Most of it has a significant component of 'feel-good', just like the masks that can't and don't work much of the time, or have 'valves' that actually increase the jet characteristics of sneezes or coughs without filtering action.  It was highly amusing to watch the battling titans who were Razzle-like trying to get to the one true gum vs. candy Marxist truth of whether it spread aerially or via fomite contamination, all those weeks of deaths and spread, before they finally began to figure out that most of the transmission was technically via fomite surface, but 'gotten there' through droplet fallout.  I'd be tempted to say this was pretty obvious from their own first principles, when you actually look at them, but... well, at least it's understood now.

The big thing that will tell you it's feel-good is that there's no ban on talking in public.  Or in groups in public when the group is otherwise practicing the social-distancing rites.  I have yet to see anyone cleaning off their glass... covered with finger debris... smartphone after yakking into it, sometimes animatedly, for minutes or hours, but I certainly see them put the phone away, handle stuff, then take it out and start punching characters or icons on it.  They'll wait carefully 6' separated in lines, then jaw at the person taking the money from 3' away... cash-handling distance.  If this were truly an infectious virus instead of an unexpected opportunist, there would likely be far more outbreaks than we observe; if the current shelter-in-place or social-distancing approaches were to be suspended, I'd expect to see things crank up a few days thereafter, from the usual sorts of outbreak foci. 

If you come out of a store with virus on your hands, it gets on the door handle of your car.  If you sanitize your hands when you are back in your car, you have to sanitize the outside door handle when you get back out at home.  Then you carry in several bags of groceries, all of which can have virus.  Your clothes can have virus.  You bring all of this into your house.  They warn us to never shake clothing inside of the house because virus particles will fly out and land everywhere including your hands and face.

Welcome to the true new normal.  While it's not quite as nolite-me-tangere as you list it, there is certainly a wealth of potentially fomite-harbor surfaces around you, any of which can become virus-bearing either if contacted or if droplet transfer occurs.  As we have noted (in the case of New York subways, at least) it can be extremely difficult to remove or denature the organic 'fomite' layer on many publicly-exposed surfaces ... and only 'social distancing' that keeps anyone from brushing them would preclude transfer to clothing or other contacted areas, which would then as you note require secondary sanitizing to become 'safed'.

We make a point of having our crews carefully scrub, then sanitize their hands, then don gloves.  Fairly frequently we have them alcohol/quat scrub their gloved hands as they work, precisely to preclude any contact transfer of viral particles to new surfaces on which they can remain transmissibly infectious.  We have them double-mask to ensure (reasonably) that any tendency to expel droplets bearing viral particles -- and these can be quite small -- is (again reasonably) "muffled".  And we have them minimize conversation (and use hand signals) while on client premises, and use handsfree devices for phoning, and keep the vehicle surfaces wiped down with EPA N materials.  They wear shoe covers that are (carefully) taken off and put in plastic when leaving each premise.  When we return to the dispatch office all the vehicle surfaces are wiped down again when leaving, and any work-related cloths and clothing are laundered hot using a 'laundry sterilizer' (it's about 2.4% quat undiluted, with fabric softener to ensure contact) in the appropriate part of the cycle.  We encourage use of the same product whenever employees do their own laundry.  

Not to tempt the gods with hubris, but despite having gone into, by now, thousands of individual premises, none of our employees have shown viral infection despite voluntary testing, and none of our clients (again so far) have shown symptoms of COVID-19 subsequent to our cleaning.

Until we actually do have some means of either inducing or demonstrating both effective immunity and practical non-shedding of SARS-CoV-2, procedures such as this become as sensible as those for 'not getting colds' -- just now extended to both contact and 'close-aerosol' transfer.  Note that once these can be done mindfully by significant groups of people, some of the current scattershot 'social-distancing' ukases could be relaxed ... but the cost of even minor-seeming violations a la McFarlane (not to single him out except he insisted) might then be further outbreaks, any of which might lead to Captain-Trips-style spread back into pandemic epidemiology.

Now, if we didn't already have effective 'therapy' for those cases proceeding through inadequately-protected viral induction to ARDS, this would be more of a 'showstopper' for restarting the economy.  Even a relatively inadequate approach to serological 'prompt testing' in populations 'significantly at risk' will give the necessary lead time (probably no more than 2-3 days) for a combination of 3CLpro inhibition and Avigan to shut down progression to ARDS; adapting even existing dialysis equipment to selective interleukin filtration will shut down morbidity in many established cases of ARDS, perhaps even in those already with multifactor co-morbidity that would not tolerate measures like heroic misventilation.

I'd be far happier if so many of the practical short-term solutions for 'letting people get back to work' and then, later, 'rebuilding the parts of the economy shut down by SIP/SD' did not implicitly involve more or less fascist control over personal habits and choices.  Even in a world with better common sense, where we segregated people at risk (with better privileges, like early-hours post-sanitization being reserved for over-60s) rather than shoved everyone apart and then casually ignored those with 'more privilege' of one sort or another, there would still be the problem of the 'next outbreak' ... and the collateral deaths it would threaten, and the potential 485-fire-like fun if you were to track down the prime case in such an outbreak.  

Why there are not swaths of deaths running rampant through all the nursing-home death mills in this country has been, and still is, something of a mystery to me.  Certainly nearly everyone I know who has 'died of coronavirus' has been either of advanced age or was immunocompromised in some way ... and was in some kind of managed care.  Perhaps these are carefully excluded from statistical oversight in some kind of black-bottle way...

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: KS
  • 999 posts
Posted by SFbrkmn on Saturday, April 18, 2020 11:54 AM
The one gauge to measure on traffic levels is to see the number of workers on pool boards. Most boards are down, compared to the past. While this is related to much lower traffic levels, which means less trains. An unrelated factor of the decrease of workers is trains being combined into one at a location enroute. This is a job killer, and cuts down on the amount of actual trains one may see out there. In the past, my condr pool board, at the height of business, would hold 45 at the most. With the changes I described above, that number holds down in the early 30s and at the beginning of the yr, when the first post-holiday cut was made after Peak Season, that dropped to a historic scary low of 28. Would not surprise me if that number goes below 30 again and at this time of yr, that is a fright.
  • Member since
    January 2014
  • 8,221 posts
Posted by Euclid on Saturday, April 18, 2020 11:58 AM

Overmod
 
Euclid

 

 
If you come out of a store with virus on your hands, it gets on the door handle of your car.  If you sanitize your hands when you are back in your car, you have to sanitize the outside door handle when you get back out at home.  Then you carry in several bags of groceries, all of which can have virus.  Your clothes can have virus.  You bring all of this into your house.  They warn us to never shake clothing inside of the house because virus particles will fly out and land everywhere including your hands and face.

 

Welcome to the true new normal.  While it's not quite as nolite-me-tangere as you list it, there is certainly a wealth of potentially fomite-harbor surfaces around you, any of which can become virus-bearing either if contacted or if droplet transfer occurs.  As we have noted (in the case of New York subways, at least) it can be extremely difficult to remove or denature the organic 'fomite' layer on many publicly-exposed surfaces ... and only 'social distancing' that keeps anyone from brushing them would preclude transfer to clothing or other contacted areas, which would then as you note require secondary sanitizing to become 'safed'.

 

 

I think I am agreeing with you here, but I am not sure you understood what I meant.  I think the belief that distancing and hand sanitizing is protecting us is absurd.  But to your other point, how is "feel good" flattening the curve?  And if that is not what is reducing the infection rate, what is?  I don't believe we have the answer to that question. 

I also am not convinced that the virus is not living.  It may not comply with a set of characteristics we say are needed to define life, but there is a lot we don't know about life.  Maybe our definition is incomplete.

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: KS
  • 999 posts
Posted by SFbrkmn on Saturday, April 18, 2020 12:08 PM

We have been told that the first two engines, at where the train is made up, the cabs will be sanitized. I have yet to see that or any documenting of that to prove the point. Basically rr workers are on their own. We all have always brought our own wipes to wipe down the interior of the eng cab when climbing on a consist. Many of us out onnthe job wear a mask when needed, me included. One jobs w/a brakman, that worker now rides a trailing unit as only the eng & condr are allowed to ride the same cab. Another factor has been the deadheading of employees an Amtrak trains. This is dome at several locations across the country. I would not step foot into an Amtrak train now. The deadheads ride in the coaches but if this is only two being deadheaded, then they should be able to ride a trailing Amtrak eng in leiu of the train coaches. I am on a non-Amtrak route and thus is nit my monkey, not my circus.

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