Sunnyland Just like St. Louis-San Francisco Railway, never made it to San Francisco, I think they planned to do it, but money ran out and the name stayed.
Just like St. Louis-San Francisco Railway, never made it to San Francisco, I think they planned to do it, but money ran out and the name stayed.
Johnny
I figured you'd know Randy, since thats the railroad you've worked for. Mary Stahl
jeffhergert tree68 STEPHEN J KESSLER Correction, Pease AFB was in NH, not Maine. But it's not far from Maine... Maybe he was thinking about Loring AFB. Jeff
tree68 STEPHEN J KESSLER Correction, Pease AFB was in NH, not Maine. But it's not far from Maine...
STEPHEN J KESSLER Correction, Pease AFB was in NH, not Maine.
But it's not far from Maine...
Maybe he was thinking about Loring AFB.
Jeff
My friend lived in Portland Maine. I guess he commuted to Pease. But it was Pease, not Loring.
STEPHEN J KESSLERCorrection, Pease AFB was in NH, not Maine.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
The story is pretty complicated but that guy Mellon bought a rinky-dink New England airline too and picked up the Pan-Am name to make his puddle jumper airline look like the real deal. Once he got hold of that trademark he ran with it and painted his ugly flat black Guilford railroad equipment his own shade of Pan-Am blue. As far as the railrod itself goes who can say if he saved it or destroyed it.
I actually looked up Pan Am on Wikipedia.
The words "Pan American" are usually used for something that involves both North and South America. Pan American's routes pre WWII were largely from North to South America. Post WWII the South American service was split off to "Panagra" a joint operation between Pan Am and the Grace shipping line that serviced South America, which had the same badge as Pan Am but in green rather than blue.
An interesting point that I hadn't realised but noted after reading the the M10000 thread in the Classic Trains forum and watching the amazing videos linked there, that one of the backers of Pan Am was no other than Averell Harriman, head of Union Pacific (interviewed in the M10000 videos) the other money coming from the Vanderbilts, associated with the New York Central.
With the original airline having such close links to the railroads both east and west, maybe it isn't as big a jump to use the name for a railroad (although one that ran into Mexico at least would be more appropriate).
Peter
The idea was to create a new Pan Am, with hubs at the old Pease AFB in Maine, and Sanford FL outside Orlando. I have a Navy buddy who was in on the ground floor, with putting together an operations dept. But like most post-dereg start-ups, it was not to be. Lasted 1999 to 2002 I believe.
Larry Flynt did have Hustler Airlines.
jeffhergert IslandMan I suppose the difference between 'Rock Island Line' and 'Pan Am' is that the former incorporates the full name of a real place whereas the latter does not. There must be many businesses in Rock Island IL that use 'Rock Island' as part of their brand name. The people pushing the transmission line that are using the name "Rock Island Clean Line" has nothing to do with the city of Rock Island, IL or Rock Islands in other locations. They are capitalizing on the song referencing the railroad*. I bet many have heard of the song, even if they've never actually heard the song itself. It's a part of Americana and they're using that to push their project. Along the lines that the original song was about a railroad, an industry in the past that helped build America. Now the transmission line will help to provide clean (wind produced) energy to an America who's future will depend on clean, fossil-free electricity for it's power needs. (Note, this is their idea, not mine. I am not adverse to coal or oil based energy.) They need to play up this connection because many of the people who don't want oil pipelines under their feet also don't want high voltage transmission lines over their heads. *Rock Island Line is the name of a song. The name of the railroad was Chicago, Rock Island and Pacific Railroad. "Rock Island Lines" did appear at the top of most company stationary until the late 70s when the entire name started to replace it. Along with that change, the traditional Rock Island herald was replaced by the stylized R and The Rock logo. Jeff
IslandMan I suppose the difference between 'Rock Island Line' and 'Pan Am' is that the former incorporates the full name of a real place whereas the latter does not. There must be many businesses in Rock Island IL that use 'Rock Island' as part of their brand name.
I suppose the difference between 'Rock Island Line' and 'Pan Am' is that the former incorporates the full name of a real place whereas the latter does not. There must be many businesses in Rock Island IL that use 'Rock Island' as part of their brand name.
The people pushing the transmission line that are using the name "Rock Island Clean Line" has nothing to do with the city of Rock Island, IL or Rock Islands in other locations. They are capitalizing on the song referencing the railroad*.
I bet many have heard of the song, even if they've never actually heard the song itself. It's a part of Americana and they're using that to push their project. Along the lines that the original song was about a railroad, an industry in the past that helped build America. Now the transmission line will help to provide clean (wind produced) energy to an America who's future will depend on clean, fossil-free electricity for it's power needs. (Note, this is their idea, not mine. I am not adverse to coal or oil based energy.) They need to play up this connection because many of the people who don't want oil pipelines under their feet also don't want high voltage transmission lines over their heads.
*Rock Island Line is the name of a song. The name of the railroad was Chicago, Rock Island and Pacific Railroad. "Rock Island Lines" did appear at the top of most company stationary until the late 70s when the entire name started to replace it. Along with that change, the traditional Rock Island herald was replaced by the stylized R and The Rock logo.
Thanks for the info. I didn't know about the transmission line. I knew about the song. Have the transmission line people attempted to use the song itelf in their publicity material, rather than just vaguely referencing it?
Incidentally, the 'Rock' name and logo used shortly before the line closed down would make a good brand for e.g. a range of clothing. Have the owner(s) of this piece of intellectual property done anything with it?
And regarding telephones, I for the longest time got calls for some collection agency tryign to get car payments for a . "James Sullenger" (Sp?) I was fifteen at the time and it became a bit of a problem. One day while I was in the car with my Dad, they called. He pulled the phone from my hands and told them "This phone belongs to a minor; if you call again I will take legal action."The number of times they have called me since (ten years) can be counted on one hand Some times you just got to be harsh with them, I guess.I like mispronumciations, because that way you can say "you have the wrong number" without lying. If ythey are lookign for Mrs. Johnson and they say "Mrs. Janson" they do indeed have the wrong number
The Beaverton, Fanno Creek & Bull Mountain Railroad
"Ruby Line Service"
I guess my concern would be that the Pan Am name would never be able to be reapplied to an airline if Guilford did that. SOunds to me like a PanAm exists in the air so... never mind that. It''s important to remember that PanAm's PR wasn't spotless either (Lockerbie).
On a sidenote, what would BNSF be named? My votes:Braniff Railways (I'm not done wiht that, I think it's funny. They could even do that wierd pain think that Braniff did on its airraft.) Atlantic & Pacific (Already owns the trademark from the ATSF and it seems almost fittingBerkshire Railways (obvious reasons, although i hear that Mr. Buffett has very little to do wiht the railroad's day to day)
I want to know who the heck named luggage after Amelia Earhart?
samfp1943 Southern Pacific operated their airline 'Daylight Service' between LAX and SFO - The plaines were decorated similarly to the trains - . Santa Fe RR operated their 'Skyway' , It was originally[late 1940's(?) ], to be part of their cross country service for rail passengers... Ride the trains at night, and sleep; fly in the daytime. Sort of a 'Fly Chico' service(?). It utilized some surplus ex- military C-54's . At one point Wichita was a 'base' for its operations. The CAA stopped it early on...They could be a railroad, OR an Airline; but not both-was the Governmemt's position. Those are just some from memory.. And then there was the Burlington Northern Air Freight (BNAF),[ about early 1980's(?) ]...Base was in Ft. Wayne, and they utilized Boeing 707 type aircraft service their original network of about 10 cities.
Southern Pacific operated their airline 'Daylight Service' between LAX and SFO - The plaines were decorated similarly to the trains - .
Santa Fe RR operated their 'Skyway' , It was originally[late 1940's(?) ], to be part of their cross country service for rail passengers... Ride the trains at night, and sleep; fly in the daytime. Sort of a 'Fly Chico' service(?). It utilized some surplus ex- military C-54's . At one point Wichita was a 'base' for its operations.
The CAA stopped it early on...They could be a railroad, OR an Airline; but not both-was the Governmemt's position.
Those are just some from memory..
And then there was the Burlington Northern Air Freight (BNAF),[ about early 1980's(?) ]...Base was in Ft. Wayne, and they utilized Boeing 707 type aircraft service their original network of about 10 cities.
Up North we had CP Air and the CN-owned Trans-Canada Airlines.
TCA eventually became Air Canada, and ended up taking over what was left of CP Air, which by then had been sold to Pacific Western, with the combined company renamed Canadian Airlines.
Greetings from Alberta
-an Articulate Malcontent
Is nothing sacred?
IslandMan {Snip} After the downfall of the USSR, the big Western washing powder manufacturers launched a huge multi-million dollar advertising campaign in Russia. One of the advertising slogans used was "You only need half as much [famous washing powder X] as ordinary powder". The owners of a rusty Soviet-era chemical plant had a 'lightbulb moment'. They knew that the stuff they made was indeed about half as effective as the Western brands, but on the other hand it was about ten times cheaper. They quickly started using the brand name 'Ordinary Powder' and thereby effectively obtained millions of dollars worth of free advertising!* *Addendum: In case you thought that this was a piece of BS, here's a link to the website of the manufacturer of 'Ordinary Powder'!: http://www.nevcos.ru/catalog/seriyaobichniyporoshok/
{Snip}
After the downfall of the USSR, the big Western washing powder manufacturers launched a huge multi-million dollar advertising campaign in Russia. One of the advertising slogans used was "You only need half as much [famous washing powder X] as ordinary powder". The owners of a rusty Soviet-era chemical plant had a 'lightbulb moment'. They knew that the stuff they made was indeed about half as effective as the Western brands, but on the other hand it was about ten times cheaper. They quickly started using the brand name 'Ordinary Powder' and thereby effectively obtained millions of dollars worth of free advertising!*
*Addendum: In case you thought that this was a piece of BS, here's a link to the website of the manufacturer of 'Ordinary Powder'!:
http://www.nevcos.ru/catalog/seriyaobichniyporoshok/
In the 1950's there were many advertisments where a product was pitted against 'Brand X'... and it wasn't long before some other manufacturers had products named, 'Brand X' for sale.
And, of course, today I take "Nothing" for a headache, because as all the analgesic companies claim, "Nothing is better!" than their product. I do the same for an upset stomach... "Nothing is better" than any of the stomach remedies for sale today!
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
IslandMan . . . 'Hustler Railways' is a pretty memorable name, don't you think?
http://www.tcawestern.org/images/athearn6.jpg
- PDN.
Then of course there is the Pontiac Firebird Trans-Am, and it's oil pan, the Trans-Am Pan.
He's probably thinking of the movie term. 'Across' of course would be 'trans' as in Pan Am's competitor TWA...
Gramp I wonder what would have happened to railroad names had the government not blocked the railroads from moving further into air travel?
I wonder what would have happened to railroad names had the government not blocked the railroads from moving further into air travel?
And in amongst those operations, railroads operated their own trucking operations, and passenger buses as well...Subjects for another time!
Enzoamps What is wrong with Pan Am? Pan American. Pan means across. So "Across America".
What is wrong with Pan Am? Pan American. Pan means across. So "Across America".
Murphy Siding Randy Stahl I think they do get calls from people that want to buy a vintage stewardess uniform or an ashtray .. Really? I thought the French Maid's outfit was the most popular.
Randy Stahl I think they do get calls from people that want to buy a vintage stewardess uniform or an ashtray ..
I think they do get calls from people that want to buy a vintage stewardess uniform or an ashtray ..
Really? I thought the French Maid's outfit was the most popular.
I wonder if Larry Flynt thought of putting in a bid for the Pan Am intellectual property? The brand would certainly stand out used as the title of a (ahem) 'top shelf' magazine and associated merchandise.
He could have financed the purchase by selling off one of his own brands. No doubt Tim Mellon of Guilford Transportation Industries would have been interested. 'Hustler Railways' is a pretty memorable name, don't you think?
Look how much free advertizing PanAm gets from conversations just like this.
Dave
Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow
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