MidlandMike blue streak 1 Colonial reports pipeline has started up BUT: Speed of the pipeline is reported to be 3 - 5 MPH at that rate will take ~~ 50 Hours. But there are too many unknowns. 1. How much gasoline is left in the pipeline at low spots that will help get gas here in Atlanta sooner ? ... Not enough info. With a slow leak, pipeline would remain full. However, there are pumping stations beyond the leak, and did they continue to pump?
blue streak 1 Colonial reports pipeline has started up BUT: Speed of the pipeline is reported to be 3 - 5 MPH at that rate will take ~~ 50 Hours. But there are too many unknowns. 1. How much gasoline is left in the pipeline at low spots that will help get gas here in Atlanta sooner ? ...
Colonial reports pipeline has started up
BUT:
Speed of the pipeline is reported to be 3 - 5 MPH at that rate will take ~~ 50 Hours. But there are too many unknowns.
1. How much gasoline is left in the pipeline at low spots that will help get gas here in Atlanta sooner ?
...
Not enough info. With a slow leak, pipeline would remain full. However, there are pumping stations beyond the leak, and did they continue to pump?
They also showed some joints of larger diameter pipe (it looked to be in the neighborhood of 30/36" diameter (?). The comment made then, by the narrator, that the pipeline company was going to 'bypass' the leaking area (?).
I Have seen little else, except of information about gas stations running out of product in the Southeast. As well as a couple of comments recently, the repairs had been made, and 'deliveries' would begin soon.(?) The only effects we have seen around here is about a nickle spike in gas prices....The price seems to be able to react to 'delivery crises' within hours, and it takes a lot longer to settle back down.
The 2016 ERG (Orange Book) is available for download: http://www.phmsa.dot.gov/staticfiles/PHMSA/DownloadableFiles/Files/Hazmat/ERG2016.pdf. You can also download it to your smartphone - check your app store. The app features a search function, so you don't have to thumb through, looking for the methyl ethyl badstuff you just spotted.
UN1307 is, indeed, listed as "xylenes," with a guide number of 130. That guide is headed "Flammable Liquids (Water Immiscible/Noxious)."
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
1307 is "Xylenes" but it does not specify whether solid or liquid (those are other nunmbers).
You can download the list from:
http://r.duckduckgo.com/l/?kh=-1&uddg=http%3A%2F%2Fbhs.econ.census.gov%2Fbhs%2Fcfs%2FHazmat%2520Code%2520List.pdf
Semper Vaporo
Pkgs.
Tree: Need some help here. Could not locate my Haz Mat book. A northbound CSX manifest just came by here with dot 112 cars 4 - ~ 45 plackarded 1307 then mixed cars. Is that a gasoline number ?
rdamonAnd they are much faster to raise the price than they are to normalize it after the “event”
After the BP Gulf incident, I found out that what you pay at the pump reflects not what the dealer paid for the last load, but what they will be paying for the next load.
Of course, that doesn't address flat out price gouging....
My observation of the 'fuel' industry - they will use any excuse they can manufacture to raise prices - no matter if the excuse they are using is real or imaginary. Last year it was refinerys shut down for maintenance, next year it will be some other 'reason'.
Never too old to have a happy childhood!
2. Along with that question all of you on down the pipeline from ATL - NJ will there be residual shortages ?
3. More stations here out of gas with prices up 20 - 30 cents. Exception is our Loves which has kept price at $2.05.9 for regular.
blue streak 1 Colonial claims they may start pipeline tomorrow but will take few days to get supply chain working ?
Colonial claims they may start pipeline tomorrow but will take few days to get supply chain working ?
Pipelines are like mainline railroads, in that the both need to get a shut-down line working again as soon as possible.
blue streak 1 ... 2. Guess the bypass valves need capability for pigs to pass thru the diversion ? ...
2. Guess the bypass valves need capability for pigs to pass thru the diversion ?
The valve pictured looks like a gate type valve made to pass a pig. If not, they could inatall pig launcher and catcher to get around it.
blue streak 1PIG ? Pipeline inspection gadget ?
No, German "Pipeline-Inspektionsgerät"
Random thoughts
1. PIG ? Pipeline inspection gadget ?
3. The completion date seems to be getting further into the future.
4. Various unreliable sources seem to think that this pipeline is close to capacity ? If so shortages may take some time to mitigate.
5. Wonder if petroleum refineries and tank farms have standby rail or truck alternate receiving station ?
6. If you get gas at station near empty will you need to change fuel filter sometime soon ? Maybe a fuel filter shortage in future ?
We actually had an Intertek commercial running here awhile back. Now I know part of what they do. Interesting...
She who has no signature! cinscocom-tmw
MookieSomething in the back of my memory sez a smart-pig is something you send thru pipes to check them from the inside? Or a dumb cat?
Or a dumb cat?
Well, close. A CAT with urinary-tract incompetence?
Here's a dog-and-pony show that gets into some details of smart pigging halfway through:
Note that a considerable number of devices or 'active protrusions' can be combined in one 'pig', and it can be pulled by cable (and trail data cabling rather than use radio or onboard memory storage) rather than require pipeline pressure to push it.
Deggesty This kind of pig has projections on its surface that scrub the inside of the pipe as it goes through the line.
This kind of pig has projections on its surface that scrub the inside of the pipe as it goes through the line.
That's the regular type of pipeline pig. A smart pig, as Mookie remembered, is a pipeline inspection tool.
A little more information: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pigging
Here, Pig Pig Pig Pig....
They gather their own slop. so you do not need to feed them.
Johnny
Now I can sprinkle this in a conversation with der Chicken and impress him. Right?
mudchickenWould love to see when the last time the line was smart-pigged.
Tagging onto PDN:
You do not have the option of responsibly setting up a transfer, rail to truck or tank, overnite. Spill containment, track pans, grounded track, firefighting precautions, tank et al do not appear overnight. You have to permit yourselves to the slow as molasses regulatory system and work within PHMSA rules. by the time you got set-up, crisis over.
Would love to see when the last time the line was smart-pigged.
blue streak 1 upper SC is running short
Russell
The by-pass valves will finish being installed and in operation in one to 2 days ? The by-pass pipe finished about the same time. It would be very interesting how the valve is cut into the current pipeline. Colonial has no idea yet exact location of leak or cause ? Colonial reports 700+ persons working on the problem ?
More stations in Atlanta area are running out but so far motorists can get gas by 10 -20 minute waits at other stations. Our local Loves and its 16 pumps were all completely busy at 1415 today. Those pump positions do handle diesel. Gas prices = or about 5 cents less than diesel whereas usually about 40 cents less.
At a local station across from this poster was observed using a dip stick into its tank showing ~~ 14" of gas left. Reports that upper SC is running short now and wonder if that will proceed north east ward all way to NJ ?
One has to wonder if persons getting the last dregs of gas from a station might get fouled fuel filters or worse ?
The parallel pipeline is carrying some gasoline but appears it is smaller, slower, and needs more separation isolation work between gas and the diesel / jet fuel products.
MidlandMike...it will might be years before the residual in soil/groundwater is cleaned-up.
An underground leak at an airfield near here is still in the clean-up stage - almost ten years hence...
They install blocking valves on both sides of the leak. It appears they also installed small hot tap valves adjacent for monitoring purposes. They have materials to deal with fumes to make it safe to weld. With the leak section blocked off, they then install a parallel bypass line. I would guess the line would be back in service in a few days, long before they could install rail load/unloading facilities. The bulk of the spill will be removed quickly, but it will might be years before the residual in soil/groundwater is cleaned-up.
You're right - don't know why I thought that.
Also right. How long was it going on ?? For a 3 ft. diam pipeline, it wouldn't take long to leak that many gals. from the whole thing - 11 tank cars' worth, say about 9 x that length of pipe for each car x 11 cars ~ 100 x 60' ~ 6,000 ft.; at 1 MPH a little over 1 hr. But a leak that big would have caused a loss of pressure which the system sensors or operators would have noticed and automatically shut down. More likely it was a dribble to a 'garden hose' (as I like to describe moderate leaks or flows that are more than a drip and less than a fire hydrant), and could have taken several days.
- Paul North.
Paul North wrote:
Worse, not detected for 3 days, and then only by chance by a nearby surface mine inspector !
Paul the 3 day reference read to ME, that it was 3 days AFTER the leak was DETECTED, before crews were allowed on site for repairs, due to high levels of gasoline and benzene vapors. I did not see any estimate of how long the leak spewed gasoline before detection, though that had to be quite a while to spill 336,000 gallons. Thank Heavens, there was no ignition source nearby.
Doug
May your flanges always stay BETWEEN the rails
Some partial answers:
1. "There's not much cheap gasoline, but there's lots of expensive gasoline" (from the 1979 oil embargo).
12. Haven't seen that up close, but have watched that done to natural gas lines (from a safe distance). Best is to install 2 other 'tapping' valves just each side to close off the line. If that can't be done, a weld can be made as long as oxygen is excluded by a nitrogen, argon, or similar 'blankets. More likely is to cut a squared-off end and install a 'plug' with mechancial (bolted) joints at each end.
3. (kind of): As soon as I read about this, I thought this would be a good use for some of the idle CBR tank cars, to replace the pipeline's function (although I see they are planning on building a 'bypass' pipeline around the break). Some temporary work-arounds (hoses, etc.) to load/ unload the cars at each end of the trip would be needed, but that might be faster than waiting for the repair, testing, investigations, etc. to be completed.
This lspill also casts doubt on the oft-heard claim that pipelines are safer/ less likely to leak than rairlcars. Estimated 336,000 gallons ~11 railcars. I believe that would a worse wreck than any since Lac Megantic. Worse, not detected for 3 days, and then only by chance by a nearby surface mine inspector !
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