Randy Stahl....What in the world is a GP38M-4?

[dharmon]

There was a picture of one leased by MMA. Caption says it was rebuilt from a GP35.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=80410

Inquiring minds (very small one mind you) want to know.

Dan

[Sterling1]

What a strange and long history of this particular GP38M-4 that might contain after the long, hard years of service to a king . . .

[M636C]

Dan,

This was never a GP35. It has one too many hand rail stanchions. Also, the fans are a long way apart even for a GP35 with the 36" fan missing.

This started life as a GP40 or GP40-2!

Whoever did the conversion knew what they were doing. The dynamic brake hatch has been reversed relative to the GP40 arrangement to provide space for the paper air filters on top of the roots blowers, just like a real GP38-2!

Why it is alled a "Dash 4" I don't know. EMD has been calling microprocessor rebuilds "Dash 3"s for some time. Perhaps this is a recent rebuild and the rebuilder thinks it's so much better than a Dash 3 it needs a new Dash number!

Maybe its an ex Conrail unit, they had plenty from NYC alone.

Peter

[ajmiller]

NS has some GP38-3's that were rebuilt from GP50's.

[Mookie]

You people just lose me in this area, but that won't slow me down. We have several GP38's here in Lincoln. Would those possibly be the same as Dan's? I can't tell you what they look like, because I still haven't learned how to tell a 40 from a 38 from a 39. And they have all made an appearance on my list of sightings.

Mookie

[rrnut282]

La Mook
The easiest, but not always accurate, (see the posts above) way to tell a GP38 from a GP40 is to count the fan shrouds on the roof at the rear. The 38's have 2 and the 40's have 3. If you get a closer look at the roof you will notice that the 38's have 2 exhaust stacks, one on either side of the fan in the middle (if that unit has dynamic brakes). The GP40 is turbocharged and has only one exhaust stack and you will hear the whine from the turbo when they accelerate.

[Mookie]

Got the printer running - will take this with me in Millie!

Thanx Mike!

[rrnut282]

Like I said, it's simple, but not always correct. Also keep in mind other models like GP50, GP59, GP60 also have 1 exhaust and 3 rear fans. The differences between these and a GP40 are harder to spot as they roll by at track speed. Generally, I look up the road number on a roster to keep them straight.

[Randy Stahl]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dharmon

There was a picture of one leased by MMA. Caption says it was rebuilt from a GP35.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=80410

Inquiring minds (very small one mind you) want to know.

Dan

I don't know a whole lot about the 2001, I can tell you what I do know.
2001 is equipped with a 645e prime mover, it has a D32 , D14 main generator. This engine has dash 2 high voltage electrical cabinets. 2001 is equipped with a Q-Tron exitation system that replaced a Vapor system. I can't tell you if this engine was a gp-35 to begin with, could have been a GP-38 DC
Randy

[dharmon]

The more I look at the picture, the more I tend to agree that it started as a plain old GP38, upgraded to dash and beyond.

.....Thanks Randy...and Peter

[Anonymous]

GP38M-4 2001 was, in fact, rebuilt from a GP35. It was former Southern Pacific GP35E 6312. Here she is in all her glory on SP: http://tomfassett.railspot.com/proto/SP6312_rightside_80d_1986.JPG

GP35's have 9 handrail stanchions and GP38/40's have 10. Also another way to distinguish a GP35 from a GP38/40 is that the GP35 has an angular panel around the fuel fillers. Although, later GP35's built after April 1965 had straight frames, like those found on GP38/40/50/60.

[Randy Stahl]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller

NS has some GP38-3's that were rebuilt from GP50's.

If you have the $$$$ ... Thats the best thing you could do with the 50 series
Randy

[M636C]

OK,

I can't count. I must have counted the last shadow as well as the posts!
The remaining one headlight on 2001, horizontal, does suggest SP.
They still had to reverse the dynamic brake hatch!
But it was once a GP35!

We still don't know what qualifies it as a Dash 4?

Some GP40 and GP40-2 rebuilt as GP38-3 retain the three fans, I think.

Peter

[Anonymous]

Maybe it was the rebuilder's choice to give it a higher number than Dash-3, so they came up with Dash-4 instead.

I have seen some photos of UP GP38-3's which were rebuilt from GP40's and still retain their three fans.

[dwil89]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ajmiller

NS has some GP38-3's that were rebuilt from GP50's.

These are Ex- Southern High-hood GP-50's that are being de-turboed and are having their shorthoods chopped...they are being numbered into the NS-5800 series....after the success of the GP38 high-hood rebuild program that numbered 80 units, and included a handful of Ex-Conrail GP38-2's..they are now in the NS 5500 series.. Rebuilding is being done at the Juniata Shops in Altoona, Pa. Dave Williams http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nsaltoonajohnstown

[broncoman]

Does GM offer the 710 with a roots blower, making the GP-60 a non-turbo unit. What would that be around 3000 horsepower?

[Anonymous]

Randy-

So, What's in a number?

LC

[M636C]

Dave,

There has never been a blower 710 offered by EMD.

Assuming you could build one by changing the gear ratio on 645 blowers to feed the extra air required by the extra inch of stroke, it should produce 66% of the base rating as a turbo engine, I guess. Say a 16-710G3 produces 4000 net HP, 4400 gross HP, that should be 2933 gross HP say 2750 net HP for a blower 16-710 G.

Your fuel economy will not be as good as a 16-645E3 turbo engine, because the "bonus" power available in notch 8 with the turbo running on exhaust gases rather than driven by the crankshaft won't be there. It shouldn't use more fuel than a GP38 relative to its power, however, say 37% more!

Peter

[Randy Stahl]

I'm told that this engine is a second generation micro processor locomotive, in other words the latest Q-Tron equipment replaced an earlier system. This engine was a dash 3 prior to rebuilding, some evidence of the earlier installation.
Randy

[dharmon]

Thanks for the info...another mystery solved.