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Senate committee hearing zeroed in on rail service shortcomings

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  • Member since
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Posted by greyhounds on Sunday, September 14, 2014 11:14 PM

BaltACD

Murphy Siding

     The problem is, the farmers want more cars, track and capacity to haul their grain, not to haul the other traffic.

And they expect it yesterday, not tomorrow.

 

In as much as the carriers appear 'surprised' at their current traffic levels, I suspect they used one political party's economic projections, not the other.  What ever they were basing their projections for 2014 traffic levels, they were using the wrong model.  Who knows what their projections for 2015 are.

I don't think so.  The railroads do their own projections.  And that's just what it is, a projection, AKA an economic forecast.  It isn't easy.

I've done it.  I provided forecasts of intermodal traffic for the ICG.  Again, it isn't easy.  If you miss very high your A$$ is grass.

And a projection/forecast will not generally get money committed.   To do that you need hard evidence and often a forecast is on the order of "There's a 50% chance of rain Tuesday".  

For capacity expansion you need hundreds of millions of dollars and better than a 50% chance.

OR...

You need someone such as Robert Krebs who had the vision and guts to double track the Transcon when the business was years in the future.  You're betting other peoples' money.  Careful is the word.  The honchos have a fiduciary responsibility and they do need to handle that money carefully. 

Things will work out.  Things will get fixed.  But the problem has to be carefully worked over time.  There is no certainty.  Only reason and experience to guide us.  If things go wrong from time to time that's just the nature of progress.  It's far better to make little mistakes, and this is a little mistake, than to make some big mistakes.

No one in the government could do any better.  All the government can possibly constructively do is reduce the taxes and get out of the way.  

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, September 14, 2014 10:14 PM

Murphy Siding

     The problem is, the farmers want more cars, track and capacity to haul their grain, not to haul the other traffic.

And they expect it yesterday, not tomorrow.

 

In as much as the carriers appear 'surprised' at their current traffic levels, I suspect they used one political party's economic projections, not the other.  What ever they were basing their projections for 2014 traffic levels, they were using the wrong model.  Who knows what their projections for 2015 are.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by Murphy Siding on Sunday, September 14, 2014 9:45 PM

     The problem is, the farmers want more cars, track and capacity to haul their grain, not to haul the other traffic.

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Posted by SALfan on Sunday, September 14, 2014 9:40 PM
Congress could screw up a steel ball using rubber mallet. Have seen it happen too many times over the years.
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Posted by BaltACD on Sunday, September 14, 2014 5:52 PM

greyhounds

NorthWest

Hamberger asked for a streamlined environmental review and permitting process for new infrastructure, in order to reduce delays and cost overruns.

Yes, I think that one's a key.  Along with an investment tax credit for capacity expansion.

As it is now, it's a fight to get anything built.  Look at the CN's acquisition of the EJ&E.  The CN was willing to put $400 million (US) of its own money into improving movement through Chicago.   And they had to fight to get it done.  The good people of Barrington, IL (and others) just could not abide more freight trains through their town.  

Well folks, if you're gonna' have more rail capacity you're gonna' have more freight trains.  And they just might go through the town where you live.  

Same with the BNSF in Abo Canyon.  They had a real fight on their hands to build five miles of second main next to a track that had been there for over 100 years.  The same railroad is in a tussle in La Crosse, WI.   There are about four miles of single track on an otherwise two track line.  The BNSF wants to build 2nd track on those four miles.

And here we go.  Some people in La Crosse are fighting the new track.  Why?  It goes through a golf course?   A golf course!  Come on.  That rail line is an important part of the nation's economy.  

Common sense has left the building.  It is impossible to increase rail capacity without more trains and building track.  But shrill voices complain about both.

Don't get me started on the fight CSX has been fighting for 3 years or more to rebuild the Virginia Avenue Tunnel ( a facility that is over 100 years old) in DC to be double track and double stack capable.

Heaven forbid Amtrak gets ready to take action on their alignment and tunnels through Baltimore.

Never too old to have a happy childhood!

              

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Posted by greyhounds on Sunday, September 14, 2014 5:11 PM

NorthWest

Hamberger asked for a streamlined environmental review and permitting process for new infrastructure, in order to reduce delays and cost overruns.

Yes, I think that one's a key.  Along with an investment tax credit for capacity expansion.

As it is now, it's a fight to get anything built.  Look at the CN's acquisition of the EJ&E.  The CN was willing to put $400 million (US) of its own money into improving movement through Chicago.   And they had to fight to get it done.  The good people of Barrington, IL (and others) just could not abide more freight trains through their town.  

Well folks, if you're gonna' have more rail capacity you're gonna' have more freight trains.  And they just might go through the town where you live.  

Same with the BNSF in Abo Canyon.  They had a real fight on their hands to build five miles of second main next to a track that had been there for over 100 years.  The same railroad is in a tussle in La Crosse, WI.   There are about four miles of single track on an otherwise two track line.  The BNSF wants to build 2nd track on those four miles.

And here we go.  Some people in La Crosse are fighting the new track.  Why?  It goes through a golf course?   A golf course!  Come on.  That rail line is an important part of the nation's economy.  

Common sense has left the building.  It is impossible to increase rail capacity without more trains and building track.  But shrill voices complain about both.

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by zugmann on Sunday, September 14, 2014 3:23 PM

greyhounds
But the reality is more power, people, and track.

greyhounds
Thanks Zug.  Your comments are always insightful and thoughtful.  Not!

  It's your approval that keeps me going.  Thank you.

  Yes, they are buying engines and laying some new track and hiring some  people.  But they are trying to get away with using bubblegum on the leaky dam.

I've worked with guys out here 30 years.  This is nothing new from their experience.  The railroads are trying to get by spending as little as possible (yeah, I know, shareholders and investors), but I think they may have to buy another pack of gum, judging by some of the complaints and allegations I've seen. 

They are always slow to react.  It takes time to lay track, train people and build power (esp. when you are going to only have one company able to provide that new power).  Sure they can go to the used lot, but most of that stuff needs shop time to bring any kind of dependability with it.

Meanwhile the shippers are screaming, and elections are always a few months away. 

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by NorthWest on Sunday, September 14, 2014 2:50 PM

Hamberger asked for a streamlined environmental review and permitting process for new infrastructure, in order to reduce delays and cost overruns.

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Posted by blue streak 1 on Sunday, September 14, 2014 2:33 PM

petitnj

1) How can government intervention create more railroad capacity? 

 IMO the only way  is to provide incentives that  allow the RRs themselves to speed up expansion.  That almost always goes back to tax incentives ? 

a.  Investment tax credits.

b.  property tax abatement. 

c.  No tax on profits that are re invested.

But then the RRs may run into the lack of material to do capacity improvements.  example is new rail production is very near maximum available,.  signal equipment, construction supervision, ROW acquisition, building permits, turnouts, frogs, switch , machines, etc. 

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Posted by petitnj on Sunday, September 14, 2014 2:08 PM

Two points:

1) How can government intervention create more railroad capacity? 

2) Where are the trucks whose subsidized highways put the railroads out of business?

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Posted by greyhounds on Sunday, September 14, 2014 1:54 PM

zugmann

.

Heh.  Thanks for the laugh.

Thanks Zug.  Your comments are always insightful and thoughtful.  Not!

The BNSF, for one, is buying hundreds of locomotives, laying down second main across North Dakota and hiring thousands of people.  I guess that's laughable to you.  Makes me no never mind what you find humorous.  

But the reality is more power, people, and track.

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by zugmann on Sunday, September 14, 2014 3:03 AM

greyhounds
The railroads will get the new track down, hire the needed employees, and acquire the needed equipment.  

Heh.  Thanks for the laugh.

It's been fun.  But it isn't much fun anymore.   Signing off for now. 


  

The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.t fun any

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Posted by greyhounds on Sunday, September 14, 2014 1:06 AM

It's the same old same old.

The railroads are too important to the economy for the politicians to leave them alone.  But every time the government sticks it nose in it generally messes things up.

There is a problem.  The problem has to be worked through.  It is being worked through.  There is nothing the government can do that will help, aside from refraining from taxing away from customers, investors, and employees money that could be used for capacity expansion.   Good luck with that one.

The railroads will get the new track down, hire the needed employees, and acquire the needed equipment.  Unless the government starts issuing damn fool edicts.  

"By many measures, the U.S. freight rail system is the safest, most efficient and cost effective in the world." - Federal Railroad Administration, October, 2009. I'm just your average, everyday, uncivilized howling "anti-government" critic of mass government expenditures for "High Speed Rail" in the US. And I'm gosh darn proud of that.
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Posted by Murphy Siding on Saturday, September 13, 2014 11:52 PM

     This is getting a lot of attention here in grain country.

Thanks to Chris / CopCarSS for my avatar.

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Senate committee hearing zeroed in on rail service shortcomings
Posted by schlimm on Saturday, September 13, 2014 10:07 PM

C&NW, CA&E, MILW, CGW and IC fan

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