Something I've been seeing a lot of on NS's former Wabash line, is power sets made up of one NS unit on the point for eastbound runs, with two trailing UP units. When trains come back headed for the west, no big surprise but the two UP units are still pointed west, with the NS unit trailing.
Got me to wondering if this is part of some effort to balance hours in real time. (example) if the total haul for both railroads is 3000 miles, with 2000 of those being on UP, and the eastern one third on NS, such an arrangement would balance the hours, with no further need of adjustment. is this possible, or am I just seeing shapes in the clouds?
I'm guessing you're pretty close to the mark.
Larry Resident Microferroequinologist (at least at my house) Everyone goes home; Safety begins with you My Opinion. Standard Disclaimers Apply. No Expiration Date Come ride the rails with me! There's one thing about humility - the moment you think you've got it, you've lost it...
Yes, that's very possible for long-haul 'run-through' trains. It would also explain why in some photos from out west (such as railpictures.net), I sometimes see a single NS unit 2 or 3 deep in a UP (or BNSF) consist - on the 'flip side' of the run.
This could also occur on more local runs, simply to repay for NS power that's been used by UP. But with this time of recent locomotive surpluses, that's kind of surprising.
Actually, it may be NS is 'renting' UP power. I believe that all of NS' stored units have been back 'on-line' for about a year now, and the new SD70ACe's are just now arriving. With recent increases in coal, automotive, and intermodal traffic, NS may be power-short - and if UP has a surplus, why not do the obvious ?
One thing that's surprising: I would expect to see the NS unit leading each way, because of cab signal compatibility. But maybe that's not an issue on your line. Further east from here it is - all leading locos on Amtrak's routes have to be equipped with "Locomotive Speed Limiter" equipment, which means the NS units have to lead.
- Paul North.
Are they coal trains?
Mostly auto rack unit trains, and covered hoppers (chemical, i think).
I'm not sure where you post from, but these could be run-through trains between Proviso or North Platte and Elkhart, or Conway. Or it could be payback...quite often the ZEMCH and ZCHEM pair of Roadrailer trains run with pairs of NS units between Proviso and East Minneapolis.
Carl
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See this photo (not mine) and the caption for one explanation, although I doubt it gets anywhere near former Wabash tracks: http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=354452
See also (none are mine): http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=356474&nseq=1
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=341029&nseq=4
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=340184&nseq=5
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=329822&nseq=6
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=329486&nseq=7
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=327700&nseq=8
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=324455&nseq=10
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=321607&nseq=11
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=317657&nseq=12
http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=317152&nseq=13
My first guess is that this is a power set being used in run-through service....coming from a yard on the UP to a yard on the NS....so long as the power is OK on their inspection dates and mechanical condition they will tend to shuttle back and forth for several round trips. While HP hours are always counted, they are not the reason for this engine consist.
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I'm sorry, Con (Mr. One); I didn't read your original post clearly enough. If you're on the old Wabash, the run-throughs I mentioned wouldn't be applicable. There might still be something from St. Louis or even KC that would fit, but I don't know what Up had along those routes. Still, equalizing for the Roadrailer or similar runs remains a good possibility.
Convicted one,
If I may ask, I'm curious about which former Wabash line you are watching, and where.
I've fanned the line from central Indiana to Detroit many times, and have seen run-through power going both ways. I've moved to Durand, MI which is CN territory, but it is not uncommon to see foreign power on the main.
Norm
Norm48327 Convicted one, If I may ask, I'm curious about which former Wabash line you are watching, and where.
NS main between Logansport and Butler.
yeah, I've been seeing foreign power for years (on this line) but started to notice a pattern, and just got to wondering if the pattern might be intentional to balance power, ALL IN ONE RUN. rather than having to assign "payback" units and keep track of them.
It made just enough sense that I had to ask.
NS routinely runs westbound autoracks out to KC ...and hands them off to the western roads.
i just got to thinking how some of those go all the way to the west coast, in which case the scenario i outline, might be a plausible strategy.
I'm sure that run through saves both roads the time of pumping the brakes up, etc ( compared to if alternately they switched locos when handing off the train)...so anything to make that work as smoothly as possible makes sense.
Another possibility is the signaling. Do the NS rails have different signaling and rules than UP? If so you would expect the trains to be run by engineers from the home area with their loco.
Kind of like having a pilot board a foreign ship when entering a port area.
Springfield PA
I'm fairly confident that the engine crews are all NS in this particular location, probably out of Peru, In.
Run through agreements allow for quicker delivery since you don't have the power changes and all that stuff - but there's usually standing orders (written or implied/tradition) to "turn" the foreign power* and get it back to the host railroad as quickly as possible. There are people in the glass towers that keep track of these matters (and all appropriate billing/HP hours). Keeping the sets together just makes the process quicker and easier.
*- same thing applies to foreign EOTDs.
The opinions expressed here represent my own and not those of my employer, any other railroad, company, or person.
Thanks!1 (I hadn't even thought about EOTD's, but that makes sense too)
Convicted One I'm fairly confident that the engine crews are all NS in this particular location, probably out of Peru, In.
AFAIK, only NS crews and NS trains run on this segment. (CP has trackage rights North/East of Butler) All NS trains change crews in Peru. It is the division point between the Illinois Division and Lake Division. Eastbound, Peru crews run to Detroit, Toledo, or Elkhart. Obviously, the Detroit crews stay on the former Wabash all the way. The Toledo crews can swing off the Wabash at either Fort Wayne or Butler, mostly, the latter. The Elkhart bound crews switch lines at Wabash.
rrnut282 . The Toledo crews can swing off the Wabash at either Fort Wayne or Butler
. The Toledo crews can swing off the Wabash at either Fort Wayne or Butler
Really? If the (some) Toledo bound trains leave the wabash at Fort Wayne, what route do they take?
Also,... Triple crown trains made up in Ft Wayne, and heading north, do they bus crews from Peru to Fort Wayne just for that trip?
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